Bat Render - feedback?

[[UP]]

Hi Kev

Nice man, very Cool !!

About the eyes, I don't think Bats are albino... Check this pic as a reference maybe
http://www.eyedesignbook.com/ch3/fig3-53BG.jpg
They seem too small as well, depending on the species of course.

Just curious, what did you use for the fur, FF or Hair mod ?
And will it animated ?

Please keep us posted, I'd like to see the endresult, even if it's only a second !

[UP]

[cmyk]

Hey [UP]

Yeh, you're right... I put the eyes back to black (as it is in the real animal).

And I used the Hair module. I think I'll add some reflectivity inside the mouth... get that saliva look going.

thanks!

[AdamT]

That looks excellent! I'm not familiar with bat anatomy, so...no crits from me.

[LucentDreams]

ALMOST one of the best Hair renders I seen todate with cinema's module.

The almost is simply because of the lack of desnsity, too mcuh flesh is visible.

My suggestion woudl be to use fill hairs set to a heigh of 50-75% to help fill in the gap without killing your memory. also cheet out the root of the hairs even wider to help fill in the flesh.

[dkohler]

I agree with Lucent. The hair looks *really* good, but you still need to fill in the fleshy areas.. There is a bald verticle line that goes down his chest that is especially distracting. The modeling on the lips & mouth is amazing.

[[UP]]

Yeah that's it !
Looks way more realistic now, the red eyes made it look a little B-movie-ish, as if it was added to make it look 'more scary' then it is.

And saliva is a very good idea...
I also wonder about the teeth, if they should be more translucent, maybe add some SS.
At least in the pic I showed the teeth look more transparent.

And.. maybe this one doesn't eat it's veggies's every day like it should but, the fur doesn't seem dense enough.. Could be a little longer as well..


Keep it up, good job!

[UP]

[cmyk]

okay, I got rid of the line of baldness that runs down it's chest, and I'm adding some fill hairs to make him look more covered. I wasn't sure how much flesh to show thru tho, cuz I did want him to look a little malnourished and creepy.

I'll post something shortly.

You guys have been a great help! Thanks all!
-kev

[Per-Anders]

Looks great, I've no real idea about bat anatomy, however you might want to play with the color and specular (or wetness) around the eyes and snout/slips a bit more, right now the skin looks a little rubberish and flat.

[maikukai]

Ditto, what Per-Anders said...

[JoelOtron]

Could be front page material if you give it some context--or probably fine as is!
I see you have some nice translucency on the upper tips of the ears---but I'd like to see some translucency through the middle of the ears where the membrane would be the thinnest. Its great as is though. Maybe a wet rocky wall surface behind him? Looks like you are taking a flash snapshot point-blank in a dark cave. -Very nice!

[ooo]

Very cool!! :thumbsup:
Only crit from me would be that a bat is actually some kind of flying mouse and I think the hairs on some parts of the body should be a little bit thinner and more dense. So a little more fur-like. At least from what I have seen from bats, but I'm no biologist so maybe you checked other references?

odo

[robotbob]

wow - super nice !

my favourite bits are the kind of flakey fleshy nose tissue - one of the things that really interested me about reading about shelob ( big spider ) in LOTR was the kind of tumour tissues that she had on her body as she was old and creepy. just a thought but perhaps your bat could have some of the same things. like some sort of skin growths/cancers or skin imperfections. but as you say its only a second long and its a brilliant product for that sort of timeframe.

BTW when you say 6-8 hours work - is that modeling + texturing because that is blimmin speedy bro !

crikey

[cmyk]

context: Since it's for a movie, I'm under orders to keep the bkg neutral. They'll probably composite into a bkg plate that they have.

fur: Yeh, I've been experimenting with different fur types for a while, but at some point I'm just gonna move on and render this thing... runnin' outta time!

If the shot was gonna be longer, I'd probably spend much more time on those sorts of details. Especially getting the wet snout and some snotty stuff around the eyes and fangs.

And, thanks robotbob... I too was VERY intrigued by all the thought WETA put into their creature designs, and it's funny, because I thought of shelob when i was adding the displacement around his eyes. As far as the timing, yes... what you see in that render is around 6-8 hrs worth. But, now I've sunk another 6-8 just rigging and animating and tweaking from this point. (I also screwed up in how I set up the hair... so I had to redo that... but don't tell anyone, it makes me look bad!)

thanks again everyone for your comments!
I'll try and post the final shot soon...

[bobzilla]

Great job! I especially like all the little lumps and bumps around the nose and mouth edge. That was all painted in BP? Did you use SPD for the displacement?

It's a shame the shot couldn't be longer. Your details would definitely hold up in a longer shot.

[cmyk]

Great job! I especially like all the little lumps and bumps around the nose and mouth edge. That was all painted in BP? Did you use SPD for the displacement?

It's a shame the shot couldn't be longer. Your details would definitely hold up in a longer shot.

It was all painted in BP. I tried SPD at first, but it hiked up my render times too far, and for some reason, in this case, SPD barely made a difference. Go figure!

And I too wish the shot was longer! But it's for a cheap scare in the movie: Hero turns on the hanging incandescent light, and SCREEECH! Bat in your face.

These frames are talking about an hour & a half each to render (1920x1080)... I have SSS, GI and Hair, plus a 5 frame scene motion blur going on. But I only need 10 frames... so the wait isn't so bad.

[LoopCorp]

Well FWIW I disagree with both of you, I like the skankier thinning hair look. I'd agree that a bit of SSS in the teeth and gloss in the mouth would help but this is one of the best Cinema renders I've seen, well done. Could have sworn you'd added all that detail with ZBrush.

[JoelOtron]

I bet they post it if you submit it.

[cmyk]

ok, the frames are done rendering, and if you've got QT7, you can see the results here:

SCREEEEEEEETCH! (http://goodcomics.com/end/bat_small.mov)


Thanks again everyone, you've all been very helpful on this. And LoopCorp, i did add some SSS to the teeth, but in that previous render, I guess I just didn't have it tweaked enough yet. I think it looks good now. JoelD, I do plan on submitting it... just wanted to make sure I submitted it after I worked in the valid crits!

[[UP]]

Hey CMYK,

I'm totally curious to see the result but I can't view the QT7 movie you posted from where I am atm, would it be possible to post a QT6 version... ?

And YEAH this is totally front page worthy, so SUBMIT !!

[UP]

[JoelOtron]

Fantastic! Great job

[ooo]

ok, the frames are done rendering, and if you've got QT7, you can see the results here:

SCREEEEEEEETCH! (http://goodcomics.com/end/bat_small.mov)


Thanks again everyone, you've all been very helpful on this. And LoopCorp, i did add some SSS to the teeth, but in that previous render, I guess I just didn't have it tweaked enough yet. I think it looks good now. JoelD, I do plan on submitting it... just wanted to make sure I submitted it after I worked in the valid crits!

Wow this is totally wicked!!! Page one :thumbsup:

odo

[cmyk]

']Hey CMYK,

I'm totally curious to see the result but I can't view the QT7 movie you posted from where I am atm, would it be possible to post a QT6 version... ?

And YEAH this is totally front page worthy, so SUBMIT !!

[UP]

sorry bout dat. Here's a link for all y'alls with QT6 (it's sorenson 3). Hopefully it'll work?

SCREEEEEEETCH 6.0 (http://goodcomics.com/end/bat_small_sorenson.mov)

[[UP]]

WOWW ! !
MAN that's freakin' awesome !

That looks insanely great CMYK !
Congratulations, quick get it published the front page, NOW ! ! !

[UP]

[bobzilla]

Very cool! Very realistic. Good luck with the project.

[robotbob]

bravo ! thanks for showing it off !

pedro

[seco7]

Fantastic! I love it.

[interactiveBoy]

Great job!

Not much else to say.

[manlio]

Really great. Congratulations.

[shakes]

brilliant work! the high res still is awesome, and I love the little movie. very effective.

[jsls]

The animation/model/texture is top-notch, brilliant!!! :eek:

[bobtronic]

great work man, especially the little clip is awesome :thumbsup:

Bob

[govinda]

My god! That's amazing!

[pwallin]

Front page material indeed!

You mentioned using SSS, but did you use cinemas own sss or some plugin for that?

What radiosity method was used?

-Pasi-

[FranOnTheEdge]

Oh - My - Gawd!

(jaw drops)

Er... well I was doing a bat... but now... (goes and sobs in a corner)

That is just amazing work.

Could have done with the animation being a bit longer - it looks jerky as it's so short.

[cmyk]

wow, thanks everyone! Very encouraging.

and yes, everything was done using Cinema's own toolset. So the SSS was C4D's. As for radiosity, I set it to Stochastic (got away with using a low setting), and used an HDRI image to provide the ambient illumination (and reflection). Then I used a Spot light on his face, and an omni light in the distance for the hot rim light.

[ernia]

Very impressive! Just amazing work here. I almost find myself instictively pulling up my collar.

The only thing I wonder about is that the image/movie is too warm for a cool, dark, damp, oogie cave. Maybe more use of cooler, pale colors?

ernia

[wesware]

Just awesome
Extremely well done.
Way too short for the quality, but I'm sure it will serve it's creepy purpose :)

[dann_stubbs]

Very impressive! Just amazing work here. I almost find myself instictively pulling up my collar.

The only thing I wonder about is that the image/movie is too warm for a cool, dark, damp, oogie cave. Maybe more use of cooler, pale colors?

ernia

they usually do color correction for films anyway - i think it is excellent. not that it would show in such a short clip but maybe a bit more gloss on teeth and inner mouth - or do bats have no saliva?

dann

[cmyk]

they usually do color correction for films anyway - i think it is excellent. not that it would show in such a short clip but maybe a bit more gloss on teeth and inner mouth - or do bats have no saliva?

dann

Yes, they will be color timing this film. Although, I did try and come close to the tones of the scene it's going it. The reason it's so lit up, is because it's hanging out next to an incandescent light bulb.

I had thought about spending some more time adding in some saliva (even if not for the shot)... just to make him rabies-tastic!

[ernia]

The reason it's so lit up, is because it's hanging out next to an incandescent light bulb.

Ahh. Nevermind then.

Boy I can't wait to get that Hair module :)

ernia

[prayas]

wonderfull piece of work here. The first real good use of hair. Looks almost photoreal in the mov clip. A bit more work on the hair/fill hair as Kai posted earlier and you're done.

The clip is a bit short for me. Want to see more moving images with this nice blur and lighting.

P..:

[Shilts]

Really great work!! Hope it becomes a front page item - it deserves to.

[Damsel]

Really awesome and outstanding work on this! I'm getting chills just looking at him. ;-) Do you have any tips that you learned and would like to share with us for setting up that great hair? It's wonderful!

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