The sad tale of Disney's Secret Lab

[SheepFactory]

That was a sad story :(

thanks for the link.

[KOBALT_KORE]

Lol. The next villain in a Disney film should be the CEO of the company - it could be an animated documentary :D

Good that the laid-off artists got other jobs though.

[urgaffel]

That sure explains a lot of disneys financial and movie troubles...

Thanks for the link.

[awnold]

Nice find.. thanks for the read. Shouldn’t this be under news?

[Deepray]

Read this too, guys... i can't understand the "Disney philosofy"... :thumbsdow :annoyed: :shame:

http://www.jimhillmedia.com/nav4/index.htm?../articles/09262002.1.htm~contentFrame

[unLevel]

Sorry, but could anyone give me some info on Jim Hill?

Like who he is and what authority he has to write a lot about Disney? Is he connected to Disney, or just obsessed?

[flipnap]

thats messed up... im sorry to say but the Disney i grew up with and the disney that is, are two completely different beings.. i cant wait for the day that freedom bells ring at Pixar and we dont have to see Disney attached.. And the audacity of Disney to threaten that it will make toy story 3 on its own without Pixar - HA!!! what a joke.... I cant beleive that with the huge success of TS2 they wouldnt include it in the contract - what a bunch of hooligans... i actually heard someone saying how wonderful monsters was, and that "those guys at Disney really know what they are doing" - needless to say after i stopped boiling, i had corrected them and to which i got the reply "who is pixar?"

[mark_wilkins]

Hmm.

Back when I started on Dinosaur in 1996, Disney seemed like the place to be, and for a short time, it was.

It doesn't bring me any joy to see them having all these problems, even if it is squarely executive management's fault.

-- Mark

[monotypic]

*sniffle*

[mark_wilkins]

I guess that was a little melodramatic, now, wasn't it? :)

-- Mark

[Gentle Fury]

Originally posted by flipnap
thats messed up... im sorry to say but the Disney i grew up with and the disney that is, are two completely different beings.. i cant wait for the day that freedom bells ring at Pixar and we dont have to see Disney attached.. And the audacity of Disney to threaten that it will make toy story 3 on its own without Pixar - HA!!! what a joke.... I cant beleive that with the huge success of TS2 they wouldnt include it in the contract - what a bunch of hooligans... i actually heard someone saying how wonderful monsters was, and that "those guys at Disney really know what they are doing" - needless to say after i stopped boiling, i had corrected them and to which i got the reply "who is pixar?"

actually disney was never the wonderland everyone thought it was, nor was walt a saint! He was a total biggot and in with some shady dealings back in tha day.

they have always been an evil empire....even back when people thought they were squeeky clean

[Lunatique]

Don't let the Mouse fool ya. A poisonous snake covered with honey and spinkled with pretty glitters is--

still a snake.

A company that's founded on raping other culture's history, literature, and prostituting blatant commercialism by injecting "modern" elements into classic literature is just.... Ugh!

[Celshader]

Originally posted by flipnap
the Disney i grew up with and the disney that is, are two completely different beings..

It sure seems that way. :cry:

All I can do is ignore the Disney $equel$ savor my DVDs of the Disney classics.

Originally posted by Lunatique

A company that's founded on raping other culture's history, literature, and prostituting blatant commercialism by injecting "modern" elements into classic literature is just.... Ugh!

You're forgetting the incredible technical heights to which the classic Disney animations took the art form of animation. :shame: Fantasia alone still holds up today as a marvel of traditional ink-and-paint, special effects and camerawork.

If Disney had never created anything beautiful in its history, and if it didn't still have the potential to create something beautiful today (like the wonderful Lilo & Stitch), its current management problems wouldn't bug me so much. :cry:

[Per-Anders]

yeah judge a man by he way he treats his inferiors not his equals, and disney... well, this story is very sad.

Don't let the Mouse fool ya. A poisonous snake covered with honey and spinkled with pretty glitters is--

still a snake.

A company that's founded on raping other culture's history, literature, and prostituting blatant commercialism by injecting "modern" elements into classic literature is just.... Ugh!

unfortunately that also describes squaresoft products, most recent japanese cartoons, any of the matrix films, or any recent films of either independent or mainstream studios, most modern literature, anything in popular culture, trip hop, hip hop, breakbeat, retro, punk, all of postmodernism, any second person historical tome, autobiographies.

it's not the product that bothers me, it's the company work ethic and hegemony.

[WhiteRabbitObj]

Oh Disney. The stories about that company never end. I highly recommend catching the English documentary "The Secret Life of Walt Disney," which has not, nor likely will ever be, aired in the States because it would be like burning a cross on the front lawn of the White House.

Regardless, I still enjoy Disney films and would not be likely to turn down a job offer from them, but I think the mega-corporation status is suffering from lack of a unity of vision! Where is "Uncle Walt" when you need him huh?

[Lunatique]

Actually, I quite liked Lilo and Stitch. I wish they'd make more original stuff like that. If that film is any indication of Disney's future, then I'm all for it.

Yes, Disney animations are fluid and pretty to look at. It's just the philosophy of the giant evil corporate machine that I don't like. Sure, all corporations need to make money, and it's their priority. But Disney crosses the line of what I think is good taste.

[RobertoOrtiz]

Disney is a weird company for me. It seems that every time they leave alone their animation department they produce cool stuff like "Lilo and Stitch" or "The Emperor's New Groove." (And the last one was a nightmare production that the studio expected to fail badly)

I think that they just need to let loose their animators.

Tell their most creative directors:

"Here is a limited budget, some simple guidelines, go and make a good modern family movey.
We will leave you alone."

Sounds like a flight of fancy, but hey it worked with Lilo and Stitch!
(The studio bet heavily on "Tresure Planet")
-R

[The Cross]

Most interesting articles.

I'm not taking any sides in the gossips i'v read here. Disney has always been a sucessful 2D animation maker, and has been known to prouduce amazing works, either it be creative or a remake of some other theme.

Yes what happened to that secret lab is sad. We should look at that as a sign of how much craftmanship we have to put into our works, cause it seems to me as though Disney's 3D competetors must have blew them away.

Pixar i believe is prouduced by Disney. It costs alot of money to have a team of guy's weild together a masterpeice. So i see why Pixar deals with Disney. Disney gives Pixar money, Pixar gives Disney a "much need" modern image. Was this secret lab something to demolish pixar as well as others ?...Maybe......This is cold as it is with every other business.

Animators do this for the passion of the art, And the sad part to this story i'd say would have to go to the workers in the lab. From what i can recall is, When you work for Disney, they own even your doodles on a napkin. So thy can't even use whatever project they were currently working on,in a demo reel. Don't take my word for it though.

Disney failed, so let's rejoyce. I have nothing against them, But i'm glad they are a step further from running the Digital Animation feild.

[mark_wilkins]

From what i can recall is, When you work for Disney, they own even your doodles on a napkin. So thy can't even use whatever project they were currently working on,in a demo reel.

Well, yes and no. All of the majors have rather strict contract terms claiming ownership of what you do on the job. At the same time, California state law prohibits them from claiming ownership of projects you put together on your own time. They CAN prevent you from creating works for hire for others though.

As for the demo reel issue, there's good precedent (check with your lawyer about this) that demo reel use of released images is considered fair use under the copyright laws. However, if the project hasn't been released to the public, you'd also be breaking a confidentiality agreement if you use images without permission, and that's something you're not allowed to do.

All of these issues are the same among all the big entertainment companies, and I've worked for a couple that all had the same hang-ups. I think Disney just got particularly noted for this because their contracts had stricter (in some cases unenforceable) language on the matter.

Incidentally, since I worked at Disney, the law in California has changed in one regard -- now the employer is required to give you at contract time a written statement that regardless of the contract terms you do not give up your rights to projects undertaken on your own outside of work hours and without your employer's help.

-- Mark

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