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Flog
01-15-2003, 03:45 PM
One day the Collaboratin forum was born. At first it seemed like a great idea, but after looking at replies and seeing how many people actually come here I now feel it was not such a good idea.

A fellow poster, posted his call to arms in the General forum but it was automatically moved here, to the Dungeon of CGtalk.

This is the place lost souls go to find help but are never seen. At least when these collabs or call for help were posted in the General, it was seen by the General and more people would see it increasing your chances.

I mean in the General there is not much of a better response, since you know people are so busy making Gollum models and trying to creat the perfect Stormtrooper and that makes them too busy to work with someone or combine strengths in order to create something unique and original. But at least more people see it and that increases your chances of fnding some buddies to collab with. When posted in this forum its just like putting it in the garbage. We'll see how many posts this generates and votes.

Well just a thought. Lets just go back to posting help wanted in the general and not having it moved

Faraguay
01-15-2003, 05:09 PM
A fellow poster, posted his call to arms in the General forum but it was automatically moved here, to the Dungeon of CGtalk.

Hahaha... Sorry. I think you're right Flog, this is the first time I'm entering to this section... and maybe the last... Btw I've never gone to the General Forum... :rolleyes:

This is not my favourite forum... but maybe someone is very attached to it.

I'm not voting... I just... don't know what I'm doing here... I just saw your nick and clicked to enter... hehe.

Sorry. :wavey:

xzevlin
01-15-2003, 06:06 PM
General is so overloaded with threads about movies and favourite shoe brands and most hated juice makers that I think any collaboration ideas would vanish too fast there. This place just needs some time to grow, or a really mind-blowing idea to come around and get everyone excited.

I think the problem is more that it's buried as the last category under Critiques. It makes it hard to notice.

Flog
01-15-2003, 06:31 PM
good point, it is buried. Why would it even be under Critique. Heheheh There is nothing to critique. LOL. Need a mind blowing idea but also need to get people over here. Shucks the peril

unLevel
01-15-2003, 07:02 PM
I agree, all we need is a large scale project like the RTK Project (which I think died, sadly) or the 20 cyborgs project (which, hasn't died, and probably be put down here if it actually had a purpose, instead of "let's make some cyborgs!")

So, should it be the few, the proud, the collab forum browsers to make a monumental project?

Also, we're not the only forum "down here all alone" have you ever gone to the gaming forum, they, along with a lot of software specific forums, have their OWN challenges, their own leaders, and such....

So, as it so oft happens with a population this large, to accomade the masses, the often brilliant few get squished out (or ignored...)

unLevel
01-15-2003, 07:05 PM
Small idea: have a core group of artists who "live" down here who also are great friends and chose a prospective project to "adopt"

I thought that was one reason that this forum was made, to show what can be done with a little work, and even smaller amount of money, ie collaborative work....


Just a thought.:wavey:

Flog
01-15-2003, 09:47 PM
I posted this same topic in the main and got way more votes. So I think we should be able to post our help wanted adds in the General without them getting moved to here, and when the project is up, show what you got here

Flog
01-15-2003, 10:33 PM
So far the post about the collab forum has gotten 24 votes and barely 7 here. See this place is not really a good place to ask for help.

I hope at least they don't stop letting us in General

Savage_Henry
01-25-2003, 03:38 PM
I'm interested in working on something exciting....wow...that sounded alot less stupid in my head....

unLevel
01-26-2003, 03:08 AM
please see the sticky mascot thread, we need some workers pronto..

UNF2003|Jason
01-27-2003, 05:20 AM
yeah its kinda funny this thread my thread has been online for a few days but not one answer :\

dobermunk
01-28-2003, 09:23 AM
...in the General there is not much of a better response ... But at least more people see it and that increases your chances of fnding some buddies to collab with

Hi Flog,
I work in marketing. Trust me - it doesn't. Its much better to speak to less people with a genuine interest - your target affinity group.

What this section needs is profile. A sucess story, for example. Once a 'home-grown' collaborative project gets pugged on the title of the general site, or maybe even wins a festival somewhere (i.e. 3D festival) - and the members receive credit and its a good, original thing - then you will see the interested masses coming and looking to participate.

unLevel
01-28-2003, 12:53 PM
Well, right now the forum is working on a mascot (see sticky) and an alien short film which I think will be a great success.

Kirt
01-28-2003, 08:29 PM
In my opinion, if you spend more time working on an actual project than pursuing these "woe is me" type threads ... then people will see that you're serious about this forum.

As Nike says, "Just Do It!" :wip:

Flog
01-28-2003, 08:45 PM
Actually I've got a rather nice group to work with on the project, but currentyl I'm at my day job and have a little time to Woes Me.
Not really, really I just wish more people would go there and work with the folks there.
Just power in numbers.

uday
02-02-2003, 08:53 PM
guys...remember. the man who created LINUX also went through the same "woe is me" period before it became as powerful as it is today.a free OS that can kick windox/UNIX/MAC and what not is not a joke.
maybe there will be something that will spark off these "woe is me "projects.

Robert rodriguez ran out of everything he had before he made El Mariachi
which in turn became you all know what (YUK!!!)

i sicerely hope you keep this forum as it really might be an opportunity for someone who could be the next Robert rodriguez.

Francis ford coppola said once in his intervew: The next great fil will be made by someone who has no accsess to the technologoes of today .but will have a small handicam and tell a beautiful story." Not his exact words by the way/:p

so please let it go on....the guys who complain about this forum because it doesnt pay are not reading the title of it before they do.
its for free group work...............................................

my 20 cents..;)

Jimzip
02-05-2003, 11:48 AM
Ooooh.. Twenty cents...
I'll just put in two.

My first time in this forum, and I've never seen it before.. How long's it been up for??:shrug:
See I think you're all right, it's at the bottom of the topics, and it's in the wrong place anyway, definetely should be in General Discussions.

billy_badass
02-06-2003, 08:51 PM
i think that this forum is a great idea, it's just a matter of time when a few"serious" people pull together and create something great, it'll come out of the blue and catch every major studio with their pants down,. i look around the online 3d community and i see soooo much talent and potential, but more than that i see a true love of the medium. i work profesionaly in the 3d industry on work that is not entirely mine, sometimes it's great and inspireing, but more often then not i'm left with the"this could be better feeling", with that being said i think that this forum is a step in the right direction, we just have too give it some time, it will happen.......and i will be a part of it.:buttrock:

sketchyjay
02-07-2003, 12:45 PM
keep it.

I replied last night and now it is gone...???


anyway keep it and try moving it to the general catagory.

or run a vote as to which catagory it belongs under.

have each choice as a catagory

jason

Flog
02-07-2003, 03:02 PM
thanks for the support Billy and Sketch. Come around and look at the projects it has to offer


Thanks again

Boone
02-08-2003, 08:10 PM
I belive in Flog's current project. Its great for a team effort but we need a solution to internet access!
Just by being on the team, I've been busy finding ways to improve my skills.
So pitch in with us and turn this forum into a busy hive of activity! The more hands, the quicker the work gets done.

And by the way, Flog - Check your in-box!:annoyed:

Brassfire
03-03-2003, 09:25 PM
This forum is definitely useful, and it is better to post where there are people who want to help out, rather than getting lost in "gollum" posts. This forum is also definitely under the wrong category.

It should be under main forums or employment. Even though projects here are not for pay, free work is fun and has different rewards than paid work.

The best part of collaboration is working together to create something that is real art, and learning from your peers. That is what cgtalk is about, so this forum is important.

I am not ready to post my project's help wanted yet, but have very much enjoyed looking at the work of others here. If anyone needs medieval or ethnic type music composition for a project, let me know.

Petrik
03-12-2003, 06:39 PM
As a someone who is looking to break into the industry this would appear to be the forum to get into. But I have to say if you are talking about getting groups of people together to work on a project, where does critique come into it?

I think this forum should stay but shift it out of critique. This is not the place for it.

Oh and if anyone wants to take me onboard for a project with my fledgling skills.

http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~petrik/

MCGrund
03-12-2003, 10:57 PM
Hi, up to now I haven't been to this part of CGTalk (I don't know why, just haven't seen it I guess.). I just ran in here by accident.
But what I think is that this forum is a really good idea. 'Cause taking part in real projects, working with other people is the best way to learn. From now on I'm definetely going to frequent this forum more often. And when I've got more spare time (A new semester just started.) I might take part in a team project. Looking forward to this.:beer:

JIII
03-13-2003, 04:35 AM
KEEP IT.

realisticly there arent gonna be hunderds and thousands of people who have time to do massive collabs. You cant expect something with no commercial value to have a huge responce. in my opinion this is not a forum for the crowds to gather in, crowds of people are not the reason this exists.

I dont think anyone expected this forum to take off like a rocket. but in a sense it has, for a few dedicated people that are working there tails off, it has been a huge sucess. it is so much nicer to be able to post a forum that is not full of junk.

as i see it there is no reason to get all woeish.

smellovision
03-13-2003, 05:05 PM
You know I've been comming to cgtalk for a while but never joined until I saw this forum.
Give it time, I think people will come around. It's a great way for some of the less experienced people out there trying to break into the industry to meet folks who are already in and might need some spare hands for a small project. That's why I'm here, not that I'm a god or anything like that, but I would've loved something like this to help get some otherwise unacheivable material for my demo reel, When I first started I got a chance to work with some great animators from Pixar and ILM, and they helped me learn my craft, and get some excellent demo reel material, we've all been there so I think this site needs to stay. Criticizm is nice, but someone working with you is nicer.


Coop.

If you build it they will come.......................eventually.

Petrik
03-13-2003, 06:49 PM
I think the first line in the poll needs to be changed to "Keep it. I love it. But move it."

It does not belong under critique.

It really is some form of training and as such I feel the "Employment" forum should be labeled "Employment/Training" and this be shifted under it.

Or start a new heading altogether as "Training"

This forum states "Interested in assembling a team of artists for non-paying projects? Then this is the place." Which makes it unrelated to critique.

Now if it said something along the lines of, "Your critique on completed group projects." Then it would be in the right place.

Kirt
03-14-2003, 02:51 AM
This forum states "Interested in assembling a team of artists for non-paying projects? Then this is the place." Which makes it unrelated to critique.
If your involved in one of the projects, chances are you're recieving critique and feedback on the work you're doing from whoever is the director or in the lead position (and, as I've seen here, from the other members on the team). I think the forum is in the right place and no, it's not going to be moved or closed as long as I'm around to keep things going.

Now, enough of this doom and gloom thread ... everyone get back to work! :wip: :D

{-=Jaxx=-}
03-16-2003, 06:48 PM
Well said Kirt...couldnt of put it better myself!

Kirt
03-18-2003, 09:54 AM
What's up with this thread? It keeps floating to the top, but I'm not seeing any new posts. Wierd. :surprised

dobermunk
03-18-2003, 10:06 AM
:surprised
The ghost of self-doubt lives also in the internet...

Brassfire
03-19-2003, 12:14 AM
Originally posted by Kirt
If your involved in one of the projects, chances are you're recieving critique and feedback on the work you're doing from whoever is the director or in the lead position (and, as I've seen here, from the other members on the team).

Yes, you're receiving critique, however you are probably reciving it privately and not posted directly in the forum. So there is a slight difference in aim - either of the forum and what it says, or of what it says and wich category it's in.

I think that if it were in a more relevant category people would be more likely to find it. People are still posting non-paid job opprtunities in the jobs forum rather than here. Why? Because they didn't see this forum buried in the bottom of critique.

unLevel
03-19-2003, 12:19 AM
true, brassfire, but if you notice, the studios hiring forum is WAY down there...

JIII
03-19-2003, 03:59 AM
I have yet to recieve and crits privately.

its all in the forum if you ask me.

unLevel
03-21-2003, 04:11 PM
I think if you're working on Kirt's project, you recieved quite a bit of critique....

It's just that too many people who post their project down here don't have their project thoroughly thought out, and don't know what they want, so anything you create for them is approved without changes...

Kinda sad, when you think about it, people post "hey, I've got this great project" give you a glimpse, you like it, so you reply with "sounds good, I'm in" and then the thread starter disappears.....

Or, the above happens, and they tell you, I need *this* and you make it, they totally like it, and their project is changed thusly...

If the thread starter stayed true to his/her "vision" I think the projects would turn out a lot better..

Take Kirt's project for example, he's constantly telling people how to minorly change their models to fit his drawings, he knows exactly what he's looking for, and it's his constant search for perfection and definite work ethic that has draws such talented modelers and animators to work with him.

To have a successful project, you must know what you want, not just "hey, let's make a movie!!"

Lack of planning will, too, kill many projects, just look down this forum at the number of threads that have under 10 replies...

It is my opinion that the most valuable asset to any of the project down here if the thread-starter's commitment to his/her idea from the start, and the amount of work that they are going to put into their project. They must be willing to work on their project even if there's no one at cgtalk interested in working with them.

I apologize for ranting awhile, but when I finally sit down and increase my skills, I'd like to be able to work on long term projects, not offer to help and have the thread starter disappear and say that they aren't doing the project any more. ONLY post projects in this forum that you are willing to immediately get started on. Because if you aren't dedicated to your own project, how can other artists help??!!!

Again, it seems my apology lead to another rant, and I apologize for that, too, as I have no authority to be telling peopel what they should and shouldn't be doing.....

Kirt, I apologize for my rudeness....

JIII
03-21-2003, 05:45 PM
actually I agree with you unlevel the more planning we have in this forum the more sucess everyone will have.

Kirt
03-22-2003, 10:58 AM
I think you've made some very valid points there, unlevel. There's no need to apologize. I've noticed that there are a lot of postings in here where they are nothing more than someone looking for an artist to do a job for them.

Well, I suppose that fits in this forum "technically". But as a matter of principal and respect for the artists who visit this forum ... if you're not putting in the work and making it seem like a collaborative effort, then you're not going to have any success convincing others to follow your lead.

I think that's what makes the difference between 'working together as a team' and 'having someone work for you' on your project.

The prior statement is what makes this forum work, the later will kill it.

Brassfire - I can't speak for the other projects here in this forum, but I've made it a point to add all of my critiques in the forum and I've actively discouraged members on my team from using PMs (unless it's something not for the public - like passwords). Not only does this keep everyone informed of latest changes, but it also helps other members of CgTalk who come here to learn what does and doesn't work on our project, which they might use on their own later on.

I know this forum seems like it's the basement of CgTalk and it's probably is one of the least frequented, but give it time and I'm sure it'll catch on and more members will come here to learn and accomplish something together as a team. Like I said before ... all we need is one great success and we'll have everyone here trying to duplicate it.

:wip:

unLevel
03-22-2003, 12:21 PM
Ya know, Kirt, while all these people whine about how this forum is the "basement" "down here" and "not in the right spot"

I wonder how the photoshop forum and the cgtalk support forum feels?

If you don't know what I'm talking about, there's like 20 forums BELOW where we are....

Ya know, a few adjustments with sub-forums (I do believe that vbulletin supports them) would clean up thing nicely...

lildragon
03-23-2003, 08:45 AM
Hmm I'm surprised this is still going, but anyhoo I'll let you all know something, maybe it'll stop all the bickering ;). This forum isn't going anywhere anytime soon. Simply put its needed to help cut down on the non-paying jobs being posted in the Studios Hiring forum. This was one of the main reasons I opened it. Kirt then took the forum by the hand and really tried to make it work in another way, and due to the dedication from Kirt and unlevel for example, I will not close this forum in the near future. It will eventually grow, but like someone said earlier, many artists simply don't have the free time to spend of non-paying collab projects.

k? now back to work :)

salud

unLevel
03-23-2003, 02:46 PM
Wise words lildragon, especially the "salud"

hehe...

I know that it might have been somewhat disturbing that this thread is still going, even moreso to me by the actual start of such a thread, but I think we changed subjects somewhere, and I was kinda glad I was able to get some stuff off my chest (look above to my "rant")...

I really appreciate the opportunity that you've given us here, lildragon...

I wonder, given time, if this forum will be frequented by game and movie publishers one day...

Somehow I feel that this is inevitable, with the amount of talent here, and the compellilng projects such as Kirt's and a few others down here...

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