What 3d Software is Best for Game-Makers?

[Diogenes]

I can't really speak for what's best for what (someone else will surely have some help with that), but students get a very nice discount on things like this. Just have to google it and find websites that sell that kind of stuff, or go to your campus store/library. Trial versions of 3d software are very useful if you want to get a feel for the programs before you buy, if you buy.

[SHEPEIRO]

Maya and Max are industry standards, lightwave is used a tiny bit, and some smaller indie firms use blender (wait for adamatomic to chime in =)) as its free!

also zbrush is widely used for high poly organic modelling

[HellBoy]

There are Student version for most of the 3d apps today:

In uk there's this one (https://www.journeyedeurope.com/search.asp?DID=animation&SKW=eanpromo&UID=1468063005274949&GEN0=EN&GEN1=1&GEN2=1072&GEN3=&GEN4=&GEN5=UK03&GEN6=&GEN7=&GEN8=&GEN9=)

and here's a US/Canada I believe (http://www.academicsuperstore.com/market/market.html?category_id=255474) and here too (http://www.academicsuperstore.com/market/market.html?category_id=255475)

You just have to google it really, keywords like "Student Discount 3D" etc

[GLandolina]

3ds max, maya and xsi are the big names with zbrush for high poly sculpting.

3ds max is my choice but its crashes alot, if i could i'd switch to XSI but i dont know it at all.
maya apparently is good with animation if that appeals to you.

[Headless]

What other people said really: Max, Maya and XSI, with ZBrush for normal maps.

If you're asking beause you're looking to get into games art and you want to know which app to learn, it doesn't really matter all that much. If you can prove you're a good artist, animator or whatever with one app then most companies worth their salt will give you the time to switch to a new app.

If I had to choose then i'd suggest you learn Maya, as that's probably going to be the most widely used app by quite a stretch in a few years time.

[ArchangelTalon]

Yeah, Max and Maya are the industry heavyweights at current. XSI and LightWave also have some market share and there are other programs creeping in slowly like my favoured modo :)

As high-poly models aren't ported into the game, I think companies are less worried about them being compatible with their compiling software/engine so there's a bit more freedom there. Though ZBrush is pretty much the standard.

However, most companies will still primarily look for someone well versed in Max or Maya, so I'd suggest you try and pick up one of those and maybe later on start to dabble in some others.

There's trial and educational versions/student pricings of pretty much everything on the market.

[mindrot]

This is like asking which make pencil is best to draw with. They are all great and each have their advantages and disadvantages over one another.

Though I do admit I have been using Max for about 7 years now and really want to move over to XSI. I've just gotten really tired with Max's instabilty and memory problems to name a few. Each version that gets released seems like it should only be a service pack and not an actual upgrade. It's slow as slugs as well when compared to XSI. Try pulling in a 500 000 poly model or higher into MAX and it falls over (well becomes really difficult to use). Do the same with XSI and it seems like you're working with a low poly model- did a test at work importing a head from ZBrush.

My two pennies worth...

~M~

[mindrot]

[QUOTE=Headless]...If you're asking beause you're looking to get into games art and you want to know which app to learn, it doesn't really matter all that much. If you can prove you're a good artist, animator or whatever with one app then most companies worth their salt will give you the time to switch to a new app...QUOTE]

What he said :thumbsup:

~M~

[mindrot]

I really want to know....whether they have educational prices.

There is the free version of Max called GMax. I think it's still around?

~M~

[GLandolina]

Though I do admit I have been using Max for about 7 years now and really want to move over to XSI. I've just gotten really tired with Max's instabilty and memory problems to name a few. Each version that gets released seems like it should only be a service pack and not an actual upgrade. It's slow as slugs as well when compared to XSI. Try pulling in a 500 000 poly model or higher into MAX and it falls over (well becomes really difficult to use). Do the same with XSI and it seems like you're working with a low poly model- did a test at work importing a head from ZBrush.
~M~

^my thoughts exactly, and i know others who also want to jump ship to xsi.

[Psyk0]

"As of October 6, 2005, Autodesk will no longer offer Gmax® software as a stand-alone product."

But you can still find it on the web:
Gmax 1.2 (http://downloads.vnunet.com/download/2d+3d+animation/gmax/_33022.html)

To add to the subject, you should find a software that YOU like, once you get past learning the software, then you can have real fun. What you learn can be applied to other 3D software.

[Auctane]

If you're asking beause you're looking to get into games art and you want to know which app to learn, it doesn't really matter all that much. If you can prove you're a good artist, animator or whatever with one app then most companies worth their salt will give you the time to switch to a new app.

However, emphasize a few of those words. 'It doesn't REALLY matter all THAT much. IF you can... MOST companies...' So reading it the other way: it sort of does matter, you have to prove to be a GREAT artist, and even with that a considerable amount of companies still wont consider you. I am definitely not saying any app is better than the other, but if you don't learn Max or Maya you are unfortunately creating an extra hurdle for yourself to 'get your foot in the door'.

[randoMinion]

What you learn in most 3D packages is virtually interchangeable between products. All you lose is the familiarity with the interface and possibly some tools.

Regardless, most dev studios are going to expect you to have experience in a major package such as Max/Maya. Max is pretty much the frontrunner everywhere and dominates most of Asia so it would be my recommendation.

[Deadalus]

like almost everyone said Prove you can do Game art first. artistically AND thecnically.
Software doesnt really matter. simply because in game dev it only a tool. No Game engine use .Max or .MB file so you'll need to exporter them. basically the game doesnt care is it was a max or maya file because it only need a .something only. anyways since autodesk absorb maya recently i except some tool of may deploy to maya and so on. You can already see it with max 8 . Cloth system REALLY look like maya's one.
So anyway on a personnal note i go with max Simply because the community is larger. i may be wrong it juste my impression. if you need an exporter from max to DOOM, Unreal etc you can easily find it. but there more and more tool for maya wich is a good thing.
lets just the narrow thinking of max is for game while maya is only for movie/fx will fall soon.
so the choice of a 3d package will only be a matter of taste for artistic tool/pipeline.
so Get you copy of Gmax / Maya learning ed. and try it. its the better way to now wich pipeline you prefer.

[requiem2d]

I've been using Max but I'm considering using Maya now because of all the learning support available as well as easier UV tools (so I heard anyway, that uv'ing is easier). Any impressions from users who have used both?

[eMPeck]

I use XSI for both low and high poly work. Main problem with XSI is lack of exporters for main engines (if You want to make mods) except Unreal (which is not supported by Epic) and HL2. AFAIK there is no way to export md3 or md5 files.

Softimage supports Collada file format, and their own dotXSI, so if You have a programmer that can create export/import tools for Your engine - it is really a great piece of software. I love XSI's modelling and UVmapping tools (I even feel pity for 3dsMAX users ;) they don't have tweak tool).

There is no native automatic UV mapping tools like pelt, or LSCM, but I use Wings3d LSCM system, my pipeline looks like this: XSI -> .obj ->Wings3d -> .obj -> XSI, and it works for me.

I don't like normalmap rendering in XSI too, but it is my preference, since it work (well, mostly)

[tin-tin]

I guess your a student so I went trough all the trouble to find the info for you.

Education prices

Softimage XSI link
(http://www.softimage.com/education/educational_pricing/default.aspx)Autodesk Maya link (http://autodesk.de/adsk/servlet/item?siteID=123112&id=6911137&linkID=6761454)
Luxology Modo link (http://www.luxology.com/store/store_education.aspx)

Trials

Softimage XSI link (http://www.softimage.com/downloads/default.aspx?downloadid=1)
Autodesk Maya link (http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/index?siteID=123112&id=6902573)
Autodesk 3ds Max link (http://nct.digitalriver.com/fulfill/0049.034)
Luxology Modo link (http://www.luxology.com/trymodo/)

I hope you find them helpful.

[HellBoy]

I too heard pretty damn good things about maya but as I tried to watch a VTM of it, I almost blacked out due to the complexity of it, the user interferance is yayks. Anyways lets not turn this thread into a app war

[blacker]

It's intimidating (Maya), to say the least, and not extremely intuitive. But you can adjust to it fairly quickly if you've got previous experience (especially MAX) with modeling. I'd say MAX is easier to use, but MAYA seems to have a bit more depth.

I'm checking out Blender right now as I was actually able to load it up at work! Finally, a break from monotonous filing..

[BadSpleen]

Didn't have time to read them all, but according to my lecturer, Maya is used mostly for character creation, and 3DSMAX for environment. You can use literally any programme you want to model, providing you end up with a polygonal mesh, although I hear NURBS character are round the corner... although sceptical

Chilli x

[AndrewRaZ]

good god. what is it about this topic that makes everyone think they are the only one to ever ask it? most of the time, these topics get locked, and for good reason. please try doing a search in the forums first, before you ask questions that have been asked a billion and a half times already (http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?t=19315).

sorry if that sounds rude.

[Nersea]

Sorry! I just wanted to find a good educational price on a good game-making software. It's slightly more specific than "Which 3d app should I use", I think. Thanks all of you, I'd like to hear more suggestions, but I have enough information to squeeze into my head at the moment. Thanks for your opinions and I owe SOOOOO much to those who gave links! Merci Beaucoup!

[Nersea]

One more thing, is Cinema 4d a good software for this kind of thing? It has a great edu price and looks pretty easy to use. I dont want an over complicated one. I've studied their site and they dont seem to mention game-making. Is it even possible on all apps?

Oh, and does Max have an edu price? Cant find one. Thank you all for your time!

[dpizzle]

maya is very simple to learn, in my opinion , and it has great reference and support sites on the internet.

when i got a contract to work on some sports models for a sim, i had to learn as much about Max as i could, & really quick. I found max to be far more complex than maya, as far as modeling is concerned , but that's just me. I don't like having to apply all kinds of modifiers if i want something done, just doesn't appeal to me. The character studio plugin is alright, but i would rather use maya's bones and joints - extremely easy to figure out.

Maya 7 does have excellent unwrapping tools, and rigging is extremely easy with the paint weights and component editor, and animation is fairly simple as well, if you know the basics, but i hear max's animation program, i forget the name of it - is better.

that's just my thoughts on the matter

[JesseMoody]

Ok well this fight can go on and on about the better program. Mainly studios use Max or Maya. Some both. I know Rockstar Games uses Maya as well as Sony Online here in San Diego. High Moon Studios, the Collective, Bottle Rocket, Concrete games will allow the artist to use whichever one they feel better in. Bungie I belive still uses both.

I have been using both max and maya for a few years now. Each one has it's ups and downs. Maya is a fast program to move around in and get stuff going but for poly modeling I believe it lacks the features max has and I feel the uv editor in max is a lot easier. But Rigging and animation I found is much easier in maya and I usually rig all my characters in maya because it feels much quicker.

It really comes down to personal preference and which one you customize more. I have a ton of plug ins for max but also a ton for maya. You really need to establish yourself in 1 or the other before you try to learn 2 at the same time. Cause then you will just get confused.

As far as bringing models out of max and into maya and back into max. It is really easy with FBX format and OBJ. Keep in mind that Autodesk owns both Max and Maya now and when I was at the Game Developers Conference I got a chance to go to the Autodesk party and talked with some of their lead guys. They told me to be on the lookout this year for (Max 9) and how the two would have really close interoperability. (They will work good together)

Anyways thats my input on this. There are tutorials all over the place. Max and maya. Just download the trials and see which one you want to learn first....

[peter86]

might be a bit offtopic but i'm looking to get into the industry and i'm using Cinema 4D as a modeler. I know its not used very much in the industry but its my faforite to model with and i can export everything i make in there to 3D Studio Max and other programms so there wouldn't be any problems.
My question is, do you think, a studio would let me use c4d for my work if i would also get my own licence to work with it there? There wouldn't be any differences to the work done in max by others.

Thx

[GLandolina]

Bungie I belive still uses both.
Right now Bungie are using Max for modelling the levels, chars and props and (at least up until halo2, i cant confirm halo3 does but its likely it does) Maya for animation

[Headless]

might be a bit offtopic but i'm looking to get into the industry and i'm using Cinema 4D as a modeler. I know its not used very much in the industry but its my faforite to model with and i can export everything i make in there to 3D Studio Max and other programms so there wouldn't be any problems.
My question is, do you think, a studio would let me use c4d for my work if i would also get my own licence to work with it there? There wouldn't be any differences to the work done in max by others.

Thx
This is almost certainly a no. Developers write alot of their own tools, exporters, etc, and these have to be app specific and have to fit into the company pipelines, so doing the same type of job with more than one app means twice as much work for the tools programmers. Also, files tend not to convert quite as they should when you use file converters or export to more generic formats, especially once you start getting to more complex stuff like rigging or face targets.

Besides that, it's just par for the course that you're expected to use whatever software everyone else uses, so that people can pool their knowledge to solve any issues. If you start asking if you can use your own app rather than what the company uses, then people might think you're unwilling to learn and that you're a bit of a prima-donna.

To be honest it's surprising how quickly you can learn a new app when you're at work using it 8 hours a day. Once you've learnt the fundamentals in one app then it doesn't take long at all to apply those skills to another app.

[peter86]

@Headless:
yeah i see your point. but it's also a bit stupid to force people to work with only this tool because this is a negative aspect to an artists creativity if he has to learn a new programm each time he gets a new job. (as alot of new tools like xsi, modo and such are used by different studios)

I was just talking about the Model, not the animations and such. i'm doing alot of export/import from c4d to max and it works all fine. if you work as a modeler you also have to export your work to zbrush to add details and then import your work to max. there would be exactly the same problems if there where any with exporting from c4d to max.
After importing my work from c4d into max, i would be able to do all the rigging stuff, use the exporters that the programmers made etc. etc. i just see no point, why it shouldn't work because this would be only a bit more work for me but not for anyone else.

Its not that i'm not motivated to learn (i'm learning max and maya at the moment) but i see that c4d just has the better modeling-tools for me. To work as fast as i can in c4d in another programm would take longer than just 1-2 weeks.

[kaylon]

A lot of people here are just posting modelling solutions...which is not actually really answering his question about "game Making" Software..

I'd just like to add that you may want to look into...

www.FreeWorld3d.org (http://www.FreeWorld3d.org) A superb Terrain solution that is evolving fast...

www.leadwerks.com (http://www.leadwerks.com) 3D World Studio. A very impressive and flexible BSP (Half-Life Hammer, UnrealED) style level and world creation application...it's very good indeed and has support for mesh instancing etc.

www.garagegames.com (http://www.garagegames.com) The Torque engine suit...It's getting old and starting to show it..but at $100 still is worth a look sometimes.

www.ogre3d.org (http://www.ogre3d.org) a Very powerful engine...but no artist support as such...need coders to make it work.

www.thegamecreators.com (http://www.thegamecreators.com) An impressive cataloge of well priced software for games creation..includeing some of the items above.

Have a look around these...if your wanting to make budget based development a reality these will help.

I swear by them as they have allowed me to start work on my own personal projects without selling my soul.

K

[GLandolina]

well no he asked for "3d software" which most would take as modelling software,
but actually yeah we should post any engines and stuff we know too. :)

[FreakyDude]

I switched from max to blender. because blender is free I made the switch, but I like it a lot better than max now that I am "used" to it. I can make stuff for levels for hl2 and unreal and doom3 engine games in it and several more games too if I wanted.
Maybe it's not what studios work with but i don't give a toss about that.

[GLandolina]

I can make stuff for levels for hl2 and unreal and doom3 engine games in it and several more games too if I wanted.
erm don't they all use BSP based modellers to do the levels?


Maybe it's not what studios work with but i don't give a toss about that.
are you planning on getting a job? its better to learn the standards because if you do get a job they'll likely give you time to learn max or maya etc but not stay with blender

[ojko]

erm don't they all use BSP based modellers to do the levels?
They do use BSP for the majority of the levels. However there's no reason you can't construct a level entirely from staticmeshes, should you feel so inclined.

[ArchangelTalon]

Read the post ;) Make stuff for levels for HL2, etc...

He just means props.

[CGTalk Moderation]

This thread has been automatically closed as it remained inactive for 12 months. If you wish to continue the discussion, please create a new thread in the appropriate forum.