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jeremybirn
06-16-2006, 04:30 PM
Edit: This is an old challenge now. The thread is archived. If you scroll down to the Challenge #5 section of the downloads page, you'll see that the models can still be downloaded for your tests, and also that a gallery has been made of top entries.

Lighting Challenge #5 is on-line!

http://www.3drender.com/challenges/UnderTheBoardwalk/UnderTheBoardwalkPreview.jpg

The rules are simple: light and render this scene as if it were underwater. Models are available for download here:

http://www.3drender.com/challenges/


Objects will need subdivision (polygon smoothing) before you render. You may need to move, modify, or duplicate models to make the scene as you picture it. All shading and rendering techniques are fine. The rules are to have fun, make a cool underwater rendering, and share how you did it afterwards.

Credits: This scene was modeled by Serguei Kalentchouk (known as ShadowM8 on this forum.) If you put your renders on your webpage or showreel, don't forget to mention who did the modeling!

-jeremy

elvis75k
06-16-2006, 05:24 PM
been waiting for this one!! Iīm in... :)

jeremybirn
06-16-2006, 06:49 PM
In terms of reference pictures, I just went to www.pbase.com (http://www.pbase.com/) and did a search for "diving" and then one for "underwater" - they both revealed a huge number of images and galleries. There are all kinds of ideas there for color schemes, caustic patterns to map onto lights (or transparency map onto the water surface, however you do it), depth/murk effect reference, and looks at water surfaces seen from below!

-jeremy

mbeazley
06-16-2006, 07:19 PM
This is going to be a fun one.

-mark

jorust
06-16-2006, 08:19 PM
Love it!!! Thanks Jeremy... :thumbsup:

Let's hope this one will be as big as #4

ShadowM8
06-16-2006, 09:21 PM
Enjoy!
Note: Also the meshes that make up the dock, basicaly all that is made of wood is not ment to be subdivided!

silvia
06-16-2006, 11:57 PM
Cool! Love it! Do we need to use that same camera angle or can we change it?

jeremybirn
06-17-2006, 12:18 AM
The models you download probably won't include a camera angle. Compose whatever shot you want.

-jeremy

silvia
06-17-2006, 01:01 AM
Note to self: don't ever look at those underwate pictures while at work! It made me so nostalgic of Hawaii that I couldn't get back to my work!!! I want to go diving RIGHT NOW!!!

Geccoka
06-17-2006, 05:55 AM
Excellent one! If i have enough time i would give it a try :thumbsup:

meanlebh
06-17-2006, 03:41 PM
Looks like a fantastic challenge, I hope to be able to participate at least a little bit in this one, it would be a shame not to with such a good topic.

Anyways, thanks again to Jeremy for hosting it, and especially thanks to Serguei for the modeling!! Great job.

Good luck everyone.

-Brian

Sherif.Nagib
06-17-2006, 04:02 PM
I'm animator who sucks @ lighting/rendering, hope the challanges will help.. I guess this one is gonna be a tough start for me (wish I could join the previous challanges but I had no time back then). but anyways.. let me see what I can do :)

Thanks for the efforts jeremy

jorust
06-17-2006, 06:13 PM
I love this challenge, and I'm diving into this with joy. :bounce:

Here's the result of the first hour of setup. I'm trying to find a good angle to commit to, and the basic tone of the scene.

I need to add: Better caustic, volumetric light, particles, better shading and texturing, and well, alot... :D

Kudos to Serguei for the great scene!

http://homepage.mac.com/janoverust/.Pictures/CGTalk/w_01.jpg

slatr
06-17-2006, 08:03 PM
If I take the obj into messiah, save as lwo , it divides the surfaces better IMO.

Link to file

http://www.mysharefile.com/v/1653675/UnderTheBoardwalk.lwo.html

EDIT, still will likely need to subpatch ect... I just wanted the surfaces, grass ect.. separate

slatr
06-17-2006, 08:09 PM
Polymess it has been so hot I could dive right in your render. I like your render a lot. I like the clear water but maybe off in the distance you could do the fog/cloud thing :)




I love this challenge, and I'm diving into this with joy. :bounce:

Here's the result of the first hour of setup. I'm trying to find a good angle to commit to, and the basic tone of the scene.

MasterZap
06-17-2006, 08:13 PM
DER WASSERDRUCK!

I'm all over this one ;)

/Z

jeremybirn
06-17-2006, 08:28 PM
@ Sherif.Nagib - Welcome! You can still do the fruitbowl or kitchen scene if you want. The order you try things is up to you.

@ polymess - Great start! I already have good feeling about this challenge, it could turn into something as big as the bottle collection.

@ slatr - Thanks. So this is a better LWO file to host than the one I have, because it splits up the objects into separate objects? I guess I can switch which file is there then, thanks...

-jeremy

slatr
06-17-2006, 08:58 PM
Hi Jeremey, it seems Messiah retains more of the original material/surface data. I open the object in Messiah and then save as a LWO. This doesn't really divide the model up, but it does divide it so that diffrent areas such as the fish, water ect.. can have surfaces or material applied seperately. (I think I got that right :)

See screen for a division listing of surfaces/materials to see if you agree.

Thanks,

Brian

edit closer up view
http://i5.tinypic.com/14o67bc.png

jorust
06-17-2006, 09:17 PM
Thanks slatr. There is some fog in this one, but not enough I guess...

Thanks Jeremy.
Yes I have a good feeling about this challenge too. It's such a nice scene to work with.

Had no problem with the Lightwave scene. It's not that big or complicated, so it was easy to give the different objects new materials...

:thumbsup:

MT-Cup
06-18-2006, 05:32 AM
Hi, I'm new to this and would like to join, just one quick question. Is there a size limit we want to keep these renders to? Thanks in advance.

Junkoman
06-18-2006, 07:23 AM
Woah...So quickly another challenge is up~!!! kudos:scream:

Hi, I'm new to this and would like to join, just one quick question. Is there a size limit we want to keep these renders to? Thanks in advance.

Limit??? I guess there's no limit to the size of render. You could have a large image and then resize it to be posted here and then have a link to allow others to access the larger image for details. Hope that answers your question.

rkrehe20
06-18-2006, 08:52 AM
hello! i would like to enter these lighting challenges. I recently took a lighting course for maya, and would like to continue defining my techniques!

MasterZap
06-18-2006, 05:56 PM
A quick test.... caustics need more photons....

http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f366/MasterZap/finding-nematodes-2.jpg

/Z

jeremybirn
06-18-2006, 06:06 PM
Nice Start, MZ!

I'm trying to figure out what's going on with the things that push through the water surface, like why does the boat go yellow-gray-yellow? It looks almost as though there's a reflective part of the water surface that suddenly ends at a line starting at the top of the gray part of the boat? (Maybe it's a fresnel effect thing over-responding to a sudden angle change caused by a procedural bump map on the surface?)

-jeremy

MasterZap
06-18-2006, 06:38 PM
Nice Start, MZ!

I'm trying to figure out what's going on with the things that push through the water surface, like why does the boat go yellow-gray-yellow? It looks almost as though there's a reflective part of the water surface that suddenly ends at a line starting at the top of the gray part of the boat? (Maybe it's a fresnel effect thing over-responding to a sudden angle change caused by a procedural bump map on the surface?)


Actually, that is completely correct (well, not 100%, I'll get to that). Do you dive? Or have a pool you can take a hop into and check this kind of stuff out?

I did some empirical studies in my pool, and this effect is completley accurate.

When light goes from a higher IOR to a lower (water to air) there is total internal reflection happening. I.e. for the most part, water seen "from below" is perfectly 100% reflective.

This happens because (as you know, but I'm explaining to our listeners here ;) ) when going from a higher IOR to a lower, rays bends "away" from the normal. At a certain angle, the ray coming from under water would actually bend so much "away" from the normal above the water the resulting ray would actually be below the water again! (What happens quantuum-mechanically is that it is at this angle real-world photons can't tunnle through the water/air interface). It is at this point the surface insteads becomes a perfect reflector. This happens very abruptly, but not quite as abruptly as the fresnel() function in most renderers show it. That is what is not "100%" with this effect here; it would be a liiiiiiiiiiiitle bit gradual. Not much, mind you, but not a visible line, as here.

This also means all rays "above" this point are almost bent so they go below the surface - i.e. they "graze" the surface.

So going from low to high:

- So, yes, you see the boat, coz it's under water.

- Then you see the water surface. The angle is "shallow" enough to cause Total Internal Reflection (TIR). So you are seeing the sea floor, not the boat.

- Then, when the angle becomes large enough to "break" the barrier of TIR, we suddenly see "out" of the water. (Anyone who dives knows you can only see "the outside world" in a fairly narrow "window" above your head).
Now, since the rays at the edge of this "hole of visibility" are near-grazing, they will indeed surf the surface very tightly... and hit our boat just above the water line.

So yes, it looks bizarre. Completely bizarre.

But I spent the afternoon in the pool with my kids w. my diving mask verifying it's correctness - it looks bizzare in real life too. ;)

What is not 100%, as I said, is that real water has much more bumpiness and displacement than this (so what you actualy see "up" through the water is much more distorted) AND the fact that the "border" of this effect isn't as "hard" as shown here. I think it's due to the fact that the effect actually happens at different points for different wavelengths that it appears slighlty more "softened" in real life. Still, it is a pretty abrupt effect.

Thanks for the comment, tho ;)

/Z

silvia
06-18-2006, 06:47 PM
Wow, that's interesting, MasterZap! Can we all come to your pool now? ;)

My question is why in your image you have that effect only for the boat and not for the peer.
I like the fog effect in the distance, very convincing.

MasterZap
06-18-2006, 07:13 PM
Wow, that's interesting, MasterZap! Can we all come to your pool now? ;)

Party at my place, huh? Well, BYOB in that case ;)

Plus you need to fly to Sweden. (And not be too many (it's a tiny pool)).


My question is why in your image you have that effect only for the boat and not for the peer.


I do. But you see the "legs" (hmm, whats the proper english term?) of the pier reflected. If they were textured and not just colored, this would be more evident. I.e. going from below to up, as for the boat, you have

1. The "legs" directly visible, since they are underwater

2. The "legs" reflected in the TIR

3. The "legs" as seen through the water above the surface.

They "sorta" join up, out of largely serendipipipipdity (how do you spell that ;) )


I like the fog effect in the distance, very convincing.

Thanks.

I didn't use parti_volume as I planned, tho, it's a traditional "depth fade" fog.

/Z

jorust
06-18-2006, 07:20 PM
Great start MasterZap.

Looking forward to sea...:D this finish...

MasterZap
06-18-2006, 07:27 PM
Looking forward to sea...:D this finish...

It's gonna be pun.

*ouch*

/Z

jeremybirn
06-18-2006, 08:48 PM
Master Zap's wonderful explaination almost tempted me to go swimming today. But here some are reference shots I just cooked up in my kitchen, using a green spatula handle stuck into the carafe of a Mr. Coffee:

http://www.3drender.com/challenges/UnderTheBoardwalk/RefImage1.jpg
Starting at the bottom, you can see the bottom of the spatula handle, then the transition (what an amazing transition! ohhh...) into a reflection of the handle in the water surface, and then we go back into the view of the spatula looking up through the water surface at the dry part of the spatula.

(Edit: For the sake of clarity, the top edge of the water in the container is at the very top of the image. The line near the center of the image is NOT the top of where the liquid is located, even though it looks a bit similar to that.)

http://www.3drender.com/challenges/UnderTheBoardwalk/RefImage2.jpg
Of course this is much smoother, calmer, cleaner water than you'd find in most ponds (at least speaking for the US), but here's a close-up look at how the two "lines" can appear between the areas.

-jeremy

MT-Cup
06-18-2006, 09:51 PM
I went with the tropical feel for this one.

mayadesigner
06-18-2006, 10:33 PM
Hey Jeremy,

This seems like a great project. Can we add our own props? I had a neat idea for this project that I would like to try out.

BTW if any of you ever have a chance to take a class with Jeremy, DO! He is a great teacher. I was lucky enought to have a class with him two semesters ago. He will make you look at the world around you in a whole new way.....

Hopefully I will post something in the next few days...

Late,

Chris Logan
aka: mayadesigner
http://www.mayadesigner.com
and
http://www.karmicshort.com
Check out Karmic Short, we are currently in full swing with Pre-Production for a 1 Year Student Run Senior Collaborative at the Academy of Arts University San Francisco.

MissViz
06-18-2006, 11:06 PM
I want to render some unhappy fish distracted from his sleep by a diver. Actually, this is not a nice place because people use to throw their waste in here. So god knows what's the diver doing here at this time of the day at that uncanny place.

The particles are noise textures on several planes orthographic to the camera but I am not really satisfied with the solution. Does anybody have a better idea to render the dirt particles?

kary
06-19-2006, 04:25 AM
Crazy visual that you guys demonstrated there, thanks for explaining it. Also odd how the viscosity in the liquid seems to pull in the dark reds from the background in that first picture. Lots to learn in this one :)

jeremybirn
06-19-2006, 04:36 AM
Also odd how the viscosity in the liquid seems to pull in the dark reds from the background in that first picture. Lots to learn in this one :)

The ground underneath the water was wood-grain counter-top, and the background above/behind it was a white cabinet, so you can see the warm wood-colored area where the ground below is reflected. There is some optical dispersion (chromatic aberration) in the water refraction too, which gives some glints of different colors around the edges of some things, but the big color shift is just the reflected floor color vs. the background color.

-jeremy

jeremybirn
06-19-2006, 08:06 AM
@ MT-Cup - Great start! It's wonderful what a good color scheme can do for a scene.

@ Coriolat - I guess that could work, although light from the surface filtering through the dirt and illuminating the particle clouds could better call attention to the dirtiness of the water. Maybe you could start with some general clouds of particles for the dirt, then add some "hero" junk that's really textured and has a shape to look like real garbage and floating debris? Sounds like an interesting project!

-jeremy

MasterZap
06-19-2006, 08:17 PM
Master Zap's wonderful explaination almost tempted me to go swimming today. But here some are reference shots I just cooked up in my kitchen, using a green spatula handle stuck into the carafe of a Mr. Coffee:

Cute pics ;)

You could even go one step further and add a small piece of red tape around the spatula just where it breaks the surface... you'll see that it is this very spot you see "above the magial line".


I hope I didn't ruin the layout of your challenge here by pointing out these kind of effects early, and you were perhaps planning on letting people do a bunch of "wrong" renders, then jump in and go "a-hah!"... sorry if I spoiled the suprise :twisted:


Also, I'm all for "artistic" interpretations, so don't let this observation stop anyone from posting. The thread kinda died ;)

/Z

JCAddy
06-19-2006, 09:11 PM
Thank you for posting 3ds files this time :) !!

I'm in.

silvia
06-19-2006, 09:56 PM
You know MasterZap,

I was doing some experiments with Mental Ray, and guess what? I saw that same effect rendered by MR! And, thanks to your explanation, now I even know why.

slatr
06-20-2006, 04:55 AM
THis is a tough one, be gentle :)

Water giving me fits

Need to go back and texture boat, rock, fish ect..

http://i5.tinypic.com/14y4bd2.jpg

oxygencube
06-20-2006, 09:20 AM
Hey all! I am signed up to take a "Digital Lighting" class in the fall so I figured this is the best way to get a jump start. Jeremy, I just got your book in the mail. I am going to give the book a read and then give this a shot. Thanks for posting these challanges!

0xy

silvia
06-20-2006, 05:07 PM
Yes, it is a tough challenge! It seems that I can either get caustics or volumetric effects, but not both. So far I haven't come up with something I feel like showing in public :(

sethwolford
06-20-2006, 07:21 PM
Hi I thought I would hop in with this one. This is the first render. I was going for a lake effect that is a lil murky. The caustic map needs a lil work and I am trying to figure out how to get more of the ray effect with the volume light. This was done with 3dsmax 8 and mental ray.

http://img175.imageshack.us/img175/9988/underwater020jd.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

MasterZap
06-20-2006, 07:27 PM
Silvia, what volumetrics are you using?

Maybe you can get them both using passes, i.e. render caustics in one, volumetrics in one, and comp 'em?

Here's a slightly more tropical variant. I moved some stuff around, because I wanted the worm on the hook in frame, and it was difficult to get it in frame w/o getting an angle that actually showed the "edge" of the water (where the model ended)

I plan to move the "floater" for the fishing rod (whats the enligsh word) a bit and the worm more, such that the floater is smack dab in the center of the "puddle of visibility" and the worm RIGHT by the camera. Squealing. LOL

http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f366/MasterZap/finding-nematodes-B.jpg

/Z

neuromancer1978
06-20-2006, 07:45 PM
Finally I have started to do some serious work on these lighting challenges. This is a WIP of the scene, done in Pixie through Maya. There is a lot of work to be done, mostly shader work, but I think my lighting is almost done. Also I am not going to show the water surface mostly because I cannot seem to figure out how to do ray tracing in Renderman (the Liquid plugin is not very easy to master). Aside from the obvious I think it looks ok.

http://imagehub.geekfury.com/files/6/images/rendertest001.jpg

silvia
06-20-2006, 07:55 PM
MasterZap,

I work in Maya and MR and I am using a parti volume with
- A directional light for caustics only
- A spot light mapped with a MR physical light for volumetric effects.

The problem is that if I play with the caustics light, it either makes extremely bright, all-over caustics, or close to nothing. If I play with the volumetrics, either I set a very high extintion, in which case I see the light rays, but I don't see the caustics anymore, or I set low extintion, so I see the caustics, but I lose the volumetric effect.

I am trying to get an effect similar to this:
http://www.pbase.com/image/58647264
The idea would be to have the light rays shining through the peer boards and into the water. If only I could get it!!!
I am thinking of doing it in passes, but I don't have Maya 7 and I don't know if I can do it with some trick. On this regard, I have a few questions for you gurus:
1) You know how it is possible to have an object's primary visibility off, but still have it cast shadows, be visible in reflections, etc. Is there a way to make an object invisible, but still participate in caustics?
2) I am using a plane with bump map for the water surface. The problem is that if the bump value is low, I don't get too much refraction but the caustics are almost zero, while if the bump value is high, caustics look great, but the refractions are ridicolous. What the... ??? I have the refraction index of the water material down to 1.1 and still...
3) Can caustics be baked?

Thanks y'all!

MasterZap
06-20-2006, 08:24 PM
MasterZap,
The problem is that if I play with the caustics light, it either makes extremely bright, all-over caustics, or close to nothing. If I play with the volumetrics, either I set a very high extintion, in which case I see the light rays, but I don't see the caustics anymore, or I set low extintion, so I see the caustics, but I lose the volumetric effect.


Ah, physics at work. It's hard to get both in a physically correct manner (even in real world photography). What gamma are you rendering at? Any tonemappers involved?



1) You know how it is possible to have an object's primary visibility off, but still have it cast shadows, be visible in reflections, etc. Is there a way to make an object invisible, but still participate in caustics?


Methinks that making it invisible to camera still makes it do all them other things. Worst case you can use a ray switching node like francescas ctrl_rays


2) I am using a plane with bump map for the water surface. The problem is that if the bump value is low, I don't get too much refraction but the caustics are almost zero, while if the bump value is high, caustics look great, but the refractions are ridicolous. What the... ??? I have the refraction index of the water material down to 1.1 and still...


Hmm.


3) Can caustics be baked?


I'm a mr person not a maya person, so I can't answer for maya's baking tools per se. But caustics are considered indirect illumination by mr. If you can bake that, then yes, you have baked the caustics.

/Z

jeremybirn
06-20-2006, 10:28 PM
@ mayadesigner - Thanks, and Welcome! Add whatever you want to the scene (new models, more copies of the models that are there, new paint effects, new particles, etc.) as long as you remember what people care about here is how you render it.

@ slatr - Bubbles could be a good idea. If I had a choice between reflections and transparency for the water surface, I know it should do both, but I'd start with some transparency instead.

@ oxygencube - Welcome!

@ silvia - If it's hard to get caustic effects in combination with other things, I'd say just render the caustics into a texture map, and project the texture map from the light. Caustics on the bottom of the lake are just a general pattern, not something that needs to be specifically registered with parts of the scene...

@ Popeye9 - Nice! It definately looks murky right out of the gate. I agree some beams of light through the water would look nice.

@ MasterZap - Nice! Very interesting render. I wonder if your sky could be brighter, like where you see it at the top of the frame, so it looked like it was brighter above water than underwater?

@ neuromancer1978 - You've definately got that underwater feeling. It would be great if there were a better sense of contact between objects and the ground, like more shadows or occlusion, and maybe a center of attention (even giving the fish a different color and letting some light hit one of them) to add some interest? I don't know if raytracing is always necessary for rendering the bottom of a water surface - maybe look at Finding Nemo for inspiration?

-jeremy

jeremybirn
06-20-2006, 11:04 PM
1) You know how it is possible to have an object's primary visibility off, but still have it cast shadows, be visible in reflections, etc. Is there a way to make an object invisible, but still participate in caustics?
Yes, Mental Ray's Render Flags aren't under the shape nodes like the Maya Render Stats, they are up a level in the transform node, but if you turn off "Derive from Maya" they override them, and have separate switches for Caustic and Globillum. (At least in Maya 7 this works, don't know about which previous versions have which flags there.)

Separate copies with different render flags should solve your #2 problem as well.

3) Can caustics be baked?

Maya 7 can bake caustics and all lighting into texture maps, but that's only for surfaces that have good UV's, so you'd need UV's and maps on all the plants, everything, and to combine baked maps with regular lighting you'd need to put together that as an ambient component of all your shaders. You can also store and re-use photon maps, I haven't done as much with that.

For a generalized pattern like you show in that reference picture, I'd work on rendering it out as a separate image, then project that image from a spotlight. Or else use it as a transparency map that raytraced shadows from the sun shine through just below the water surface.

-jeremy

slatr
06-20-2006, 11:21 PM
Thanks Jeremy, I may have to render 2 and comp them but I am going to try again to do both at once.

Did anyone notice I had shadows turned off ;) I may have to render those in a separate pass/render too and comp them in.



@ slatr - Bubbles could be a good idea. If I had a choice between reflections and transparency for the water surface, I know it should do both, but I'd start with some transparency instead.

Dan Wade
06-20-2006, 11:24 PM
Here is my first wip entry. Alot of texture work to do, and it needs to be more murky etc.

silvia
06-21-2006, 12:17 AM
Cute the idea of putting the bucket underwater to keep company to the tire!!!

Thanks guys for the suggestions for my problems, I'll try them tonight.

Sherif.Nagib
06-21-2006, 02:12 AM
wow ! gr8 stuff here.. well I was kinda reluctant to show what I have now.. but what the heck :)

things to know :
- I'm using XSI
- I didn't use GI/caustics or anything special.. I still need to learn how to work with them first.. so I went faking as much as I can.

things I know I need to do :
- work on a better bump map for the water surface.. now it's just a default fractal.
- there's lots of texturing to do.. you can see a checker on the fish.. hehe
- add some light beams ( should I ? )
- add depris and such .. some particles.
- solve the problem with fog, right now I'm using "volume fog" shader for the pass, and that's why even the air above the surface has fog and it screws up everything out of water , I tried to use "layered volume fog" but I'm still not able to get the fog to stop where I want to. I'll keep searching for a way to trap fog under the surface.. if you know how to do it I'll be thankful.

things I don't know I need to do :
you tell me.. tear apart and don't pull your punches.

and thanks again to you jeremy and everyone involved in preparing the challenges.

kevb3d
06-21-2006, 04:54 AM
Here's my first shot. I'm having trouble compositing volumetrics in a seperate pass, but I'm sure it's just my brain today... I love these challenges.

http://img133.imageshack.us/img133/6872/kevb3dunderwater0pr.jpghttp://img157.imageshack.us/img157/662/kevb3dunderwater9vz.jpg


Kev

kevb3d
06-21-2006, 05:02 AM
wow ! gr8 stuff here.. well I was kinda reluctant to show what I have now.. but what the heck :)

things to know :
- I'm using XSI
- I didn't use GI/caustics or anything special.. I still need to learn how to work with them first.. so I went faking as much as I can.

things I know I need to do :
- work on a better bump map for the water surface.. now it's just a default fractal.
- there's lots of texturing to do.. you can see a checker on the fish.. hehe
- add some light beams ( should I ? )
- add depris and such .. some particles.
- solve the problem with fog, right now I'm using "volume fog" shader for the pass, and that's why even the air above the surface has fog and it screws up everything out of water , I tried to use "layered volume fog" but I'm still not able to get the fog to stop where I want to. I'll keep searching for a way to trap fog under the surface.. if you know how to do it I'll be thankful.

things I don't know I need to do :
you tell me.. tear apart and don't pull your punches.

and thanks again to you jeremy and everyone involved in preparing the challenges.

Sherif.Nagib,

The things you listed are a good direction to go in. You've pretty much nailed the bases there. I used XSI for this one too and I found that I should probably show more above the surface, but I think that depends on the time of day, angle of the sun, incidence angle, etc.

I think that you have a good first shot, but it's really too early to tell anything yet. Keep going with it and taking people's advice as you go. These people here know their stuff and are some of the most helpful people on this board. Keep going and kick some ass. :)

Kev

arcus
06-21-2006, 07:22 AM
Hello,

I don`t know if I could finish this challange but this is what I have so far.
Textures, Volumetrics + Caustics are missing. Render is done in Lightwave (Fprime)
with one light for the sun and montecarlo radiosity with 2 bounces.

Marcus

neuromancer1978
06-21-2006, 10:13 AM
Here again with an update. After MANY attempts at using custom light shaders to get caustic like patterns on the surfaces while using shadow maps.... I decided to say forget it and just went on using the standard Liquid light shadows (sigh).
Also doing any kind of occlusion with Liquid is like pulling teeth, so no go there.
However I did do a lot of shader work for the surfaces, some of the RSL shaders are almost 100 lines of code. There are however a couple of shaders by Rudy Cortes (the ground) and Larry Gritz (the rusty bucket), but for the most part all the shaders are my own (I feel so proud! LOL).
All in all I feel ok with this, but of course I will work on it some more.

http://imagehub.geekfury.com/files/6/images/rendertest002.jpg

elvis75k
06-21-2006, 02:20 PM
Here is my first wip entry. Alot of texture work to do, and it needs to be more murky etc.

This is what i'm looking for..
Great job Dan and the focus is amazing!

Cheers

JeffPatton
06-21-2006, 02:43 PM
Ultra quick mental ray/3dsmax setup here, no textures, GI/FG. volumetrics or caustics (yet). Only a skymap, one light source, a water texture, and the submerge(lume) shader for color...and a lot of Photoshop.

900 pixel image so I'll post a link instead of the image:
http://jeffpatton.net/Gallery2/Water-artsy.jpg

If I get time I will:
Add Caustics
Add particles & bubbles
Maybe comp and AOCC pass for the lighting
Add a volumetric light effect
Add textures

MasterZap
06-21-2006, 03:43 PM
JEFF! That's friggin' gorgous. Physics be damned. It's a painting!

I'm impressed.

/Z

japetus
06-21-2006, 04:58 PM
Hey, I'm new here, I was just curious when this challenge is over. Sorry if I missed a post on it. Looks like a lot of fun! Can't wait to start

royter
06-21-2006, 05:07 PM
hello guys.

I had diificulty acheiving the water surface look ( i wanted to have similar mercury reflection, becose that what you see when you'r underwater ).

I tried dielectric, but it was weird, so turned to DGS (specular).



http://www.aedii.qc.ca/v2/fichiers/uploads/section_4/under_2.jpg

but i wanted it to have that look before adding the objects, and textures.
http://www.aedii.qc.ca/v2/fichiers/uploads/section_4/under_1.jpg

JeffPatton
06-21-2006, 07:50 PM
Thanks Zap! I started not to post it since it was a rather rushed image. Nice work on your examples and thanks for taking the time to explain the physics of it all.

lotaH
06-21-2006, 09:41 PM
I do not obtain the scene… How I make? :shrug:

KurtS
06-22-2006, 01:16 AM
Here is my first wip entry. Alot of texture work to do, and it needs to be more murky etc.


my favorite, so far...! Love the light from somewhere distant behind the scene.

ShadowM8
06-22-2006, 04:57 AM
Wow stunning work guys!
I decided to give this a try tonight before I head of for a weeks vacation. Didn't get too far but kinda set out the look I would like to go for. Any comments and critique is highly appreciated.
Cheers!

jeremybirn
06-22-2006, 05:16 AM
@ jeffpaton - Amazing! That's a great scene! I love the contrast and level of definition, it really gives you something to look at, with a strong figure/ground breakup that keeps your eye busy tracing the key contours. (I really don't like the lower right hand corner, though. Anything else: going to silhouette (worth a try!), dappled light and texture, falling out of focus, even a white area if it really appeared to glow into the murk or be at the base of a beam of light, would seem better than ending such an amazing work of art on a weaker note.)

@ Dan Wade - Great! Like Creature From The Black Lagoon, really murky in a mysterious sense. I wonder if the places where bright light breaks into the water could be broken up more instead of all being in that elongated area beyond the boat?

@ Sherif.Nagib - Nice start! It sounds like you already have a lot to work on. Maybe you can make another copy of the grass so it doesn't stop so suddenly on the right? One way to do the murk would be to render a separate pass just based on the distance from the camera to the nearest surface, such as to the ground or the water surface, then use that pass as a mask for the color shift or distortion that makes your water look.

@ kevb3d - Nice, the textures and the dappled look is starting to work!

@ arcus - Great start! Very sharp, but somehow looks like a clean tropic dive. The foreground is definately too blank though - can you do some texture, another copy of the plants, some irregular light beams or caustics?

@ neuromancer1978 - That's coming out great! In the foreground, it looks like it could use a little environment map and maybe a little fill light. I'm looking at the dark side of the closest fish and also some of the plants, and in places where you'd expect the fish to be a bit reflective or the plants to be a bit translucent or otherwise for there to be some shading variation instead I see a flat uniform tone. In the background, the murk is looking really good. I wonder if the BG could fall a little out of focus, or if there could be some kind of slight distortion based on distance?

@ japetus - There is no deadline, and you can do any challenge at any time and post your work. The next challenge will come on-line right around SIGGRAPH, so this will be the top, most visited thread until then.

@ royterr - Nice! Especially the top one because it has a little variety to it. You might need to copy the grass out to cover more ground with that camera position.

@ lotaH - Models are available for download here: http://www.3drender.com/challenges/

-jeremy

jeremybirn
06-22-2006, 05:36 AM
@ ShadowM8 - Wow, you follow-up your modeling work with some great color and light! The water surface looks like it could use a little displacement or variation right where it hits the edges of the boat and dock. It looks very flat there, it's a high-contrast edge, and the rest of the surface looks like it has some waves on it.

-jeremy

neuromancer1978
06-22-2006, 07:33 AM
@ neuromancer1978 - That's coming out great! In the foreground, it looks like it could use a little environment map and maybe a little fill light. I'm looking at the dark side of the closest fish and also some of the plants, and in places where you'd expect the fish to be a bit reflective or the plants to be a bit translucent or otherwise for there to be some shading variation instead I see a flat uniform tone. In the background, the murk is looking really good. I wonder if the BG could fall a little out of focus, or if there could be some kind of slight distortion based on distance?



Ah yes good call. Right now I am doing some DOF tests, and WOW! Since I really haven't done too much in the way of totally completed scenes, or shots, I kind of sometimes forget that DOF can really bring your image out.
As for the shaders, yeah after looking it at, there isn't too much in the way of variation in the grassy objects. As for the translucent fish, I had to laugh because I was watching the Finding Nemo DVD extras today and they mentioned the look of fish as being "gummy" so seeing you post the exact same idea struck me as funny - but very valid. Yes the fish look too "solid".

Working on it. Thanks for the tips! :D

BarberofCivil
06-22-2006, 01:22 PM
Some good work here so far. This one is tough as it's hard to get quick test renders with the underwater effects.

My first official try at it:
http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i52/barberofcivil/UnderTheBoardwalk-1.jpg

lotaH
06-22-2006, 03:02 PM
@ lotaH - Models are available for download here: http://www.3drender.com/challenges/

-jeremy

It does not open, here!

BarberofCivil
06-22-2006, 06:51 PM
It does not open, here!

I've had thatproblem too. Try: http://3drender.com/challenges/

jorust
06-22-2006, 07:55 PM
Lots of great entrys so far. I see that many of you go for a darker "muddy" look.

Being from Norway, not famous for it's coral-reefs, I think I'm going to do this with a Norwegian mood.
Also moving this project over to XSI...

purpp
06-22-2006, 08:51 PM
hello guys.
This is my first attempt. Trying to fix the aliasing problem on the weeds. Will post the update later this week
Please comment
Thanks
http://www.3donfire.com/underwater.jpg

BarberofCivil
06-22-2006, 08:55 PM
A couple more runs. Changed the colour of the murkiness and tried a different perspective.

http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i52/barberofcivil/UnderTheBoardwalk-2.jpg
http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i52/barberofcivil/UnderTheBoardwalk-3.jpg

lotaH
06-22-2006, 10:41 PM
I've had thatproblem too. Try: http://3drender.com/challenges/

Tanks...

I have take, now!! Tanks!

Surrealix
06-23-2006, 06:48 AM
Some really nice images so far.

My first attempt at one of these challenges, spent about 4 hours on it so far, and could do with more. Done in blender, which I've had expreience at modelling in, but almost no lighting or texturing, so this was a huge learning curve. All the textures are procedural - this is one major thing I want to fix. Also I think it needs volumetric shadows, and some more visible particles in the water.


Underwater Sunrise - Blender / Yafrayhttp://www.surrealix.com/lighting/boardwalk.jpg

JCBug
06-23-2006, 09:17 AM
Surrealix, I love the colors of your lighting.
It's a real atmosphere. One of the best pictures !

T-bat
06-23-2006, 12:20 PM
First testing one from me. No caustics, bad materials, no textures:D

http://img139.imageshack.us/img139/5853/underwatersm3kb.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

T-bat
06-23-2006, 12:21 PM
Edit: Double post:D

JeffPatton, Purpp, Surrealix: Your images are great:)

lotaH
06-23-2006, 12:38 PM
BarberofCivil, purpp, T-bat

Great starts... congratulations!

Surrealix

Great Image... I love... Good luck!

pgraham
06-23-2006, 02:00 PM
http://www.pwgraham.com/temp/challenge5pgraham.jpg
Here's my try at the murkiness...

maya 6, software render, no post work. I projected a 2d fluid texture to make caustics. Not as pretty as a caustics generator but it does render quick. There were a few things I wanted to add, like ripples on the surface, but I don't think I'll get around to them.

MasterZap, I really like that second render with total internal reflection. I thought the edge of refraction should be more blurry but then I found this image with a pretty hard transition http://www.fotosearch.com/comp/DEX/DEX135/PH021_024.jpg. I think Jeremy's right about the sky. Maybe you could add a white gradient in the sky to emphasize where the sun is and brighten it up.

royterr, I think you should stick with a pure reflective surface like your second image. At that camera angle, you'll be seeing only the total internal reflection effect.

IestynRoberts
06-23-2006, 04:08 PM
That image is awsome Surrealix, good work!

Im definatly going to ret this one, my lighting skills is very very poor, and i just got Jeremy's new book through the post on Monday. Thanks for these challenges Jeremy, awsome stuff and tips here. :thumbsup:

-Iest

silvia
06-23-2006, 06:55 PM
Iest,

I liked that book a lot. I already had the 1st edition and was reluctant to buy the new one because so many 2nd editions are basically the 1st with a different cover. This one has tons of new stuff.

Oh no, BarberofCivil beat me at the sun rays shining through the peer boards idea!!:D

I have another question for you all: is there a way to obtain in Mental Ray the fog effect you can set in Maya through the Render Globals? I really would like to get that "mist in the distance" effect. I was hoping to get it in MR without having to set the usual cube full of volume shader trick.

lotaH
06-24-2006, 12:23 AM
This is my start. I still have a lot what to work. I want to show more the " bumps " and the " caustics "... but I begin showing my idea.

This is my COCOON homage... lol:scream:

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i86/lotah/Submarino/Diego-UnderTheBoardwalk-WIP01.jpg


Congratulations the all the participants, the works are very good.

neuromancer1978
06-24-2006, 01:24 AM
I don't mean to bring it up as a fault of anyones renders (which by the way are freaking awesome) just a tip in case .... do not forget about Fresnel reflection / transmission.

pgraham
06-24-2006, 03:36 PM
do not forget about Fresnel reflection / transmission.I wonder if this is an issue in the case of total internal reflection. I think fresnel only matters when there is both transmission (refraction) AND reflection. With TIR there is no transmission, all of the light is reflected and no polarization occurs. That's how it looks on this graph anyway... http://230nsc1.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/phyopt/freseq.html#c3

But yeah, it's always good to keep fresnel in mind when rendering transparent things.

MissViz
06-24-2006, 07:12 PM
Unfortunately, I didn't have the time to work on this project during the week. But now I'm back with an update of my junkyard underwater rendering. I'm still having a fight with the particles but in the meantime I changed my light setup with the light coming now from the top (thanks Jeremy!) and another one from the back to highlight the silhouette of the junk. Now, I'm into adding some moss.

jeremybirn
06-24-2006, 07:20 PM
@ Surrealix - Great! As surreal as your name implies! It would be great if the tire didn't have the polys visible and more grass was copied into the foreground. Water surface is not realistic but still interesting and painterly, the bottom of the dock reminds me of a school of fish.

@ BarberofCivil - Those are great! I like how the water waves around the beams of the dock. For the one with light beams, it would be great if there were more of a sense that it was brighter above the water than below.

@ purpp - Really good one! Looks like a nice illustration! I wish there were a little more difference between above-water and underwater in terms of the lighting on things.

@ T-bat - Keep going!

@ pgraham - Nice! The grass has so much texture and highlights and other things could use more shading, maybe those two could be balanced somewhere between?

@ lotaH - Good start. Objects have a flat look almost like a toon shader?

@ Coriolat - Moss is interesting! Looking forwards to seeing it with particles.

-jeremy

silvia
06-24-2006, 07:40 PM
Coriolat, that is really beautiful! The moss is great. Is that fur effect?

silvia
06-24-2006, 11:25 PM
Ok, here is a wip, still much to do, especially in post. The only texture so far is on the water.

slatr
06-25-2006, 12:35 AM
Silvia, I really like that lighting you have in the back coming down through the water

I am not satisfied with my water right now, but this is what I have for now

2 directions I am deciding on...

1. More Tropical

http://i4.tinypic.com/15i17c4.jpg

2. Pondlike

http://i3.tinypic.com/15i18g7.jpg

lotaH
06-25-2006, 03:24 AM
@ lotaH - Good start. Objects have a flat look almost like a toon shader?


It is not my gol. But I wanted to have an initial idea. It is a scratch only... :twisted:

I will look for the reality, just with a mystery touch. I Like of images that tell histories.

Thank you for commenting. :thumbsup:

MissViz
06-25-2006, 07:22 AM
Hi silvia, for the moss I used paint effects (grass) and converted it to polygons. (The paint effects didn't render correctly in the environment fog).

-Coriolat

jeremybirn
06-26-2006, 04:10 AM
slatr -

The pond one is a good start. I was going to say the water wouldn't be that blue, but I realize that blue is probably the sky just because you don't have reflections in the scene yet, so nevermind. :)

-jeremy

DenizCoker
06-26-2006, 09:06 AM
wow these are really beautiful! do you guys texture before you light? cause that's what I'm doing and I've been taking my sweet time. I should really pick up my pace here!!!

T-bat
06-26-2006, 11:14 AM
Few questions..
1. What are you using as IOR for that ocean surface? 1,33 or 0,752?(0,752)
2. What about fresnel reflections? Should I use them?(yes)

What I think is in brackets, but I'm not sure..

silvia
06-26-2006, 06:44 PM
DenizCoker,
I used to texture before lighting, then I went to a seminar organized by Alias and there was a guy who worked on "The Polar Express" that showed how he lights before texturing, so I tried it and haven't gone back since. For this image I broke this habit only for what concerns the water but only because it is so integral to the lighting of the scene.

T-bat,
I used IOR of 1.33.

JCBug
06-26-2006, 08:28 PM
Hello,

This light challenge is not easy.
When I have try to do the subaquatic atmosphere, I have understand...
This is my work, no caustic; no GI, but a lot of lights.
To render perfectly, I suppose that it is necessary to work 3 days...
and I don't speak about textures.
The rendering is quick : 8 minutes (the challenge bottles : 4 hours) ;-)
I've added a little blur in postprod.

http://www.arctique.fr/production/Under-04.jpg

mapko
06-26-2006, 10:55 PM
http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j272/mapko_2006/Underwater2.jpgThis is my first time posting on the Lighting Challenges forum.
There is alot of great work that I've seen so far, very eclectic.
I used XSI and spit out only one render pass. I pulled textures from a royalty free site I use.
I would appreciate feedback on my work.
You can view more of my work on www.marcstanyk.com (http://www.marcstanyk.com)
Thanks, it was really alot of fun lighting this scene. Can't wait for the next one!
marc

JCBug
06-27-2006, 10:28 AM
@JeffPatton, It's a very aesthetic scene, very design.
We could put it on the wall in a frame...

@Jeremy, this challenge is great and technical, thanks !

purpp
06-27-2006, 03:09 PM
@ purpp - Really good one! Looks like a nice illustration! I wish there were a little more difference between above-water and underwater in terms of the lighting on things.

Thanks for ur inputs jeremy!
Posting my first update. Managed to fix the aliasing problem with the weeds. Have tried to create some difference in lighting in above and underwater areas. Though i am not sure if i have succeded.
Please comment and suggest
Thanks
http://www.3donfire.com/underwater2.jpg

BarberofCivil
06-27-2006, 05:08 PM
Surrealix- nice colours. However, you need to smooth the tire a bit.

Coriolat - Nice scattering effects and good idea with the fuzzy mossiness

Silvia - Pretty good so far. You might want to smooth the water a bit so you don't get that meshy look near the bright area.

JCBug - I like your lighting.

mapko - Good caustics. Your waves are too big and rolling for such shallow water it think.

purpp - Good underwater feel and texturing.

-----
So far the results have been nice here for such a difficult (IMO) challenge.

FYI: A lot of images are missing the refraction/total internal reflection effect seen in real-life. It does make a nice artistic effect to avoid it, if that's what you are looking for. However, in reality, for water-to-air, any viewing angle greater than about 49 degrees from perpendicular to the water surface will completely reflect underwater.

A couple more renders from me. Playing with viewing angles and colours, and going overboard on the atmospheric effects:

http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i52/barberofcivil/UnderTheBoardwalk-5.jpg
http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i52/barberofcivil/UnderTheBoardwalk-6.jpg

silvia
06-27-2006, 06:40 PM
Thank you for your comment, and you are absolutely right about my jagged edges. I have been rendering at the lowest quality because it is starting to take some time to render. I hope to be able to post my next wip sometime tonight (or, more likely, sometime tomorrow morning, since the small hours of the morning seem to be the only free time I have... sleep? Who needs it! :shrug: )

I agree with everybody, this is a really challenging challenge (yeah, really original choice of words...) but I personally like to be pushed out of my comfort zone, plus this one is really going to force me to do a lot of comp and post work, which is always good practice. Thanks Jeremy!

DigitalOmega
06-27-2006, 11:18 PM
Hello!
phew, it was a loong time since i posted here in cgtalk hehe, but i checked this challenge and wanted to spend an afternoon with it, this is done in 3dmax, mental ray (and that weird submerger camera shader..) replaced the water with a dreamscape water surface. the caustics are photon mapped and the rendering time on my laptop (p4 2.4 512) at around one hour. it has some heavy editing in photosop (next challege try to get that without post hehehe) but i hope you like it..

http://www.3db2.com/lchallenge.jpg

japetus
06-28-2006, 12:21 AM
Here's my wip...still messing with surfaces and lights...but i'm liking it...are we allowed to use displacement mapping?

http://www.japetusproductions.com/images/renders/boardwalktest2.jpg

jeremybirn
06-28-2006, 12:31 AM
FYI: A lot of images are missing the refraction/total internal reflection effect seen in real-life. It does make a nice artistic effect to avoid it, if that's what you are looking for. However, in reality, for water-to-air, any viewing angle greater than about 49 degrees from perpendicular to the water surface will completely reflect underwater.

Just wanted to agree with what BarberofCivil wrote: making the water surface clear and transparent all the way back into the distance doesn't look very convincing. Especially in the nice renders JCBug, mapko, and purpp posted, with other aspects of the render starting to look believable, the totally clear water surface is disorienting and somewhat breaks the "underwater" look.

If you don't want true raytraced reflections of the underwater world, then mapping the water surface darker, with a murky texture and maybe some highlights, could also be used in the non-clear parts of the water.

Another really key area to watch out for is the edge of the water surface, like where it hits the shore or disappears into the distance. Often the depth-fading color of the water will converge with the water color where you reach that line.

-jeremy

japetus
06-28-2006, 12:44 AM
A book that helped me out with this was Pete Draper's "Deconstructing the Elements with 3ds Max 6" from Focal Press. It helps you create extremely good looking natural effects without any plugins. he creates especially convincing water. I've found it's a great book to have in the library.

jeremybirn
06-28-2006, 12:55 AM
japetus -

Welcome! The ground surface is already looking very organic and convincing, if you keep going with a look like the ground I look forwards to seeing the full scene textured!

-jeremy

silvia
06-28-2006, 01:34 AM
3db2 I love your image!!! I especially like the camera half in the water and half out. And you got a wonderfully crispy look, like an illustration. Great job!

jeremybirn
06-28-2006, 02:28 AM
Hello!
phew, it was a loong time since i posted here in cgtalk hehe, but i checked this challenge and wanted to spend an afternoon with it, this is done in 3dmax, mental ray (and that weird submerger camera shader..) replaced the water with a dreamscape water surface. the caustics are photon mapped and the rendering time on my laptop (p4 2.4 512) at around one hour. it has some heavy editing in photosop (next challege try to get that without post hehehe) but i hope you like it..

http://www.3db2.com/lchallenge.jpg

3db2 -

That's wonderful!

The split look is working really well, great camera angle.

If there were any things to suggest that might make it even better, it would be softening the shadow of the back of the boat, and lighting the foreground plants more smoothy so the light falls off gently in a gradient on them and they look translucent.

-jeremy

lotaH
06-28-2006, 02:29 AM
@ silvia - Good Start!

@ JCBug - Great Start, perhaps need to populate the bottom of the sea, it is very empty. :scream:

@ mapko - Very Great, but the water seem to be very dense, not? :shrug:

@ purpp - Very good. That that I call populate.

@ BarberofCivil - Great Tests. Good explanation on reflection. Tanks. :thumbsup:

@ 3db2 - I also use MAX with Mental Ray, but your scene is very better :sad:. lol Good beginning.

@ japetus - Greate Scene! Good luck!

---
jeremy and more,

Very good that contest am learning a lot in how to organize the light, and noticing like her can modify the created scene completely. :bounce:

ShadowM8
06-28-2006, 05:51 AM
Amazing work guys, I'm enjoying every bit of this challenge, almost sorry to be on vacation away from my pc right now. (but then again maybe not :) )

@3db2 - Simply stunning!
The only things that strike my eye as weird is that the lily pads are submerged completely.
Also some shadows under the dock are a bit too strong. Otherwise just lovely image.

DigitalOmega
06-28-2006, 09:36 AM
Hello!
thank you for the comments, and well i am posting here the image i got straight from the renderer, i think is quite bad, but so good we have photoshop and this is not an animation hehe.

http://www.3db2.com/lchallengenopost.jpg

silvia: thank you for the comments, i used the lanczos antialisaing thing to get that look, it gives an interesting look to the render, but you have to use a lot of samples to avoid jagged edges...

jeremy: yes, it needs a little more control (i only have one light) i should add a little of a fill light to get a little better (and not so contrasting result...)

lotaH: thanks! mental ray can be very good, but it is soo tricky sometimes.. it is just matter of playing with it until you get something similar to what you want..

ShadowM8: hehe, those lily pads are weird hehe, i might have sometime later to add some textures to them and put them in the right place.. i was just too lazy hehe.

i might use this setup for antoher scene i have in mind with the same effect.. this is the good thing about 3d -recycle recycle hehe

good luck to everybody!

purpp
06-28-2006, 10:10 AM
@jeremy: Just wanted to agree with what BarberofCivil wrote: making the water surface clear and transparent all the way back into the distance doesn't look very convincing. Especially in the nice renders JCBug, mapko, and purpp posted, with other aspects of the render starting to look believable, the totally clear water surface is disorienting and somewhat breaks the "underwater" look.

Thanks for the input guys..
i ve added internal reflection, depth fading is much more prominent now.

http://www.3donfire.com/underwater3.jpg

nico13
06-28-2006, 11:03 AM
jeremy: yes, it needs a little more control (i only have one light) i should add a little of a fill light to get a little better (and not so contrasting result...)



Hi,
3db2: Personally I prefer the contrasting result you got first. Wonderful work :thumbsup:

purpp: Great job ! May be some lack of reflection on the surface...

gent_k
06-28-2006, 11:15 AM
Very nice water surface purpp! Some good entries here.

I'm going to try this scene today or tomorrow.

Shankar
06-28-2006, 01:00 PM
Hello Friends,
Iam Intrested in this challenge. Here is my Work in progress. Any commnets?...
-Sankar

JCBug
06-28-2006, 01:06 PM
Jeremy, you're right about the water surface wich cannot be transparent in all distance.
I just wanted to light the horizon to do a positive atmosphere.
As you propose, I've tried to make the depth-fading color of the water to converge with the water color.
I've changed water, lights, textures and added fog and little caustics.
It's more "underwater" than the first one, but less surreal.

@BarberofCivil, thanks for your comment. Great fog atmosphere and reflections !
It's a little monochromatic.

@mapko, nice job ! Wow, what a lot of caustics !

@purpp, Very realist, especially the dust. Maybe a little dark ?

@3db2; It's amazing ! Great picture, very design. I prefer the first sky and glow,
and the second water, but a little darker (between the 1 and 2).
When the camera is half in the water and half out, the transition should be blur, no ?

@lotaH, thanks for your comments. I like the empty scenes, but I populate more a little.

This is my second picture, very different. Sorry for my bad English...

http://www.arctique.fr/production/Under-10.jpg

purpp
06-28-2006, 01:35 PM
@JCBug: looking nice.. i think it needs some fill lights ar the pillars and rocks are black on one side.

@3db2: very refreshing and inviting. Feel like taking a dip in the water

jeremybirn
06-28-2006, 03:23 PM
I just wanted to start something here about making things look wet.

Some things, like unpainted wood, can get darker. Look at the water-line in these pictures and the appearance of the parts that are underwater:
http://www.pbase.com/pnevlud/image/50537190
http://www.pbase.com/gazzajagman/image/38139546
http://www.pbase.com/fafaleung/image/60233636
http://www.pbase.com/image/38834652
http://www.pbase.com/aryamarante/saltpier (underwater)
Coriolat tried adding some moss to things (post 88 in this thread) which looked cool, too.

We think of things like rocks getting shiny and reflective when they are wet, but mostly that's when they are wet and above water, so the layer of water around them is reflective; are they still shiny when seen underwater? I don't see that in the pictures I've found:
http://www.pbase.com/image/23096062
http://www.pbase.com/image/20772188
http://www.pbase.com/image/23836065
Some of these are nice examples of how there isn't always a sharp line between the rocks and the ground around them. The sand and silt flows over everything, and there's occlusion darkening the area between the bottom of the rock and the ground, so it looks almost like one continuous surface from rock to lakebed.

-jeremy

lotaH
06-28-2006, 04:18 PM
http://www.pbase.com/image/23096062

I believe that the objective of the contest is the light, not the textures, but I am concentrated in doing the "dust" effect on the stones under the water. As in this picture. I believe that that changes the illumination a lot. Don't you believe? :rolleyes:

Thank you for the images. :love:

[]'s
Diego

silvia
06-28-2006, 05:11 PM
I think the threads in this section are in the category of "lighting and shading" so I think Jeremy's observations are very pertinent. After all, the 2 go hand in hand. The level of specularity, reflectivity and diffusion of the shader is going to change the way your light setup will look in the scene.

gent_k
06-28-2006, 06:05 PM
Here's my first try in XSI. No textures yet, except for a free sky HDRI. The default volume shaders aren't helping much to get the underwater feel. I guess I'll have to find other ways.
http://img207.imageshack.us/img207/3063/firsttry12mg.jpg

purpp
06-28-2006, 06:23 PM
@jeremy: Some of these are nice examples of how there isn't always a sharp line between the rocks and the ground around them. The sand and silt flows over everything, and there's occlusion darkening the area between the bottom of the rock and the ground, so it looks almost like one continuous surface from rock to lakebed.


Tried out a few tricks to blend the rocks and the floor. here is what i have got
http://www.3donfire.com/rocks1.jpg
(image A: with blending ) havent fixed the material on rock yet..


http://www.3donfire.com/rocks2.jpg
(image B: without blending)

A incidence / sampler info utility node can be used to mix the material of the rock and the bed. In the incidence utility the blending mode can be the surface vector. The limitation is that the objects will have to be rotated to make them horizontal..
Try out a few more things.. will post it here

japetus
06-28-2006, 06:29 PM
Hey Purp that's pretty cool...what program you using? Houdini? I'm gonna find out the equivalent in max

jeremybirn
06-28-2006, 06:35 PM
Tried out a few tricks to blend the rocks and the floor. here is what i have got
http://www.3donfire.com/rocks1.jpg
(image A: with blending ) havent fixed the material on rock yet..

Neat!

-jeremy

Luc-fr
06-28-2006, 06:41 PM
Hi, there 're lot of beautyful renders here, I tested too the lighting challenge bottle and i don't post my render but i post my 2 renders tests, made with C4D 9.6 and AR2, for this challenge.

50 mns to render by pictures on G5 Quad, 4.5Go ram.


The first:

http://www.lc-3d.com/mes_wips/light_challenge5/test1.jpg



and the second:

http://www.lc-3d.com/mes_wips/light_challenge5/test2.jpg


See you for a next one:)

Sorry for my english, yes i'm french :D

purpp
06-28-2006, 06:56 PM
japetus: i am using xsi. but i guess u can achieve similar result in maya with sampler info , i am not sure about max but i thin u can try the mix map and controll the mix amount by the fall off map or gradient ramp.. not sure though

Houdini is beyond me lol..

akwavox
06-28-2006, 11:03 PM
Hi all, great challenge... but vicious in a way !
Not easy to feel the density of the water in a 3D soft i think.

Here is my first try, made with Cinema4D 9.
http://www.akwavox.com/fc4d/underwater/underwater1.jpg

silvia
06-28-2006, 11:16 PM
Nice image akwavox, but I get the impression that the composition is a little unbalanced to the left. Is it just my impression? The fish texture is perfect.

sphere
06-29-2006, 04:04 AM
Here's one from me. 3D Studio Max, no textures and a bit of post in Photoshop.

http://img215.imageshack.us/img215/8044/boardwalk0fw.jpg

mcu202
06-29-2006, 04:34 AM
Wow, there are so many great renders here! Here is my wip, I'm planning on making it a little murkier in the distance, I would appreciate any other suggestions.

http://www.mirelle3d.com/underWater.jpg

Shankar
06-29-2006, 09:31 AM
Hello Friends,
Here is my work in progress. Comments Plz..
-Sankar
http://static.flickr.com/68/177577778_fe12dff8ab_o.jpg

BarberofCivil
06-29-2006, 02:24 PM
Yet another take on this from me. Not particularly spectacular, but it shows a nice division between the underwater and above water worlds I think.

http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i52/barberofcivil/UnderTheBoardwalk-7.jpg

FrizzleFry0
06-29-2006, 03:05 PM
Hey guys, just stopping in to say I really like all the different lighting styles that are coming out from this challenge. It's real interesting to see different takes and experiments to try and fake all the reflections, refractions, and depth from water. :thumbsup:

slatr
06-29-2006, 04:32 PM
Luc, I really like your second pic.

The person reaching in towards the mermaid is a nice touch. However, I really like the lighting and shading of the water best. Good job!

Tell us some of your techniques man! :)

japetus
06-29-2006, 05:51 PM
mcu2- those are some great light patterns on the ground...is that just a caustic effect or something else? I'm trying to simulate it cuz my computer will die with the render time

pgraham
06-29-2006, 06:38 PM
Just for fun I thought I'd make a stereoscopic version of mine. Bring out your red/blue glasses if you got 'em. I also brightened it up in post.

http://www.pwgraham.com/temp/challenge5pgraham2.jpg

purpp
06-29-2006, 07:02 PM
mcu2- those are some great light patterns on the ground...is that just a caustic effect or something else? I'm trying to simulate it cuz my computer will die with the render time
japetus.. u can try fakin caustics effecs.. i mean the pattern on the floor. by mapping the intensity of light with a vein or marble map.

japetus
06-29-2006, 07:08 PM
Oh yeah, duh...a few years ago i'd also found a program that made caustic maps. I've been messing with that too.

pgraham- stereoscopic version is awesome! now i gotta find my 3d glasses! :)

mcu202
06-30-2006, 01:47 AM
japetus - yeah, that is a caustic effect, it was done with just one spotlight and it was a pretty quick render

pgraham - that's awesome! how did you create that?

MT-Cup
06-30-2006, 02:17 AM
oops sorry.

MT-Cup
06-30-2006, 02:21 AM
When I go fishing it's usually early in the morning. So that's what I tried to recreate here, that early morning light. Lots of reflection off the meniscus. And of course, I had to put myself in the picture. ;) Sorry had to link to it.

I'd love some feedback.

http://www.villageidiot.org/graphics/fishing.jpg

MrBobble
06-30-2006, 02:50 AM
Loving the stereoscopic idea! Nice one!

MrBobble
06-30-2006, 04:05 AM
I was going for a dark, night scene in a murky swamp, although on reflection (no pun intended) I think this was a bad move! Have ended up desaturating it completely and making it sepia. 1, dodgy boring camera angle; 2, No point of interest and 3, Dark murky ponds just aren't pleasant or interesting to look at... Oh well live and learn

Am going to attempt a brighter scene.

Failed Attempt A Sepia.jpg (http://attachment.php?attachmentid=97754&stc=1)

Shankar
06-30-2006, 04:53 AM
Hello, WIP. Comments Plz
-Sankar http://static.flickr.com/52/178129186_c0af84cc9a_o.jpg

jeremybirn
06-30-2006, 05:40 AM
Wow, great variety of renders! There are some problems that this challenge seems to cause for almost everyone, though, and I think everyone (including me) should spend more time comparing their renders to pictures taken underwater, in terms of colors, brightness, saturation, focus, and what causes the sense of depth in underwater scenes.


Shankar - Good start. The color scheme is going all over the place: bright yellow bucket and ropes above water, dull yellow sand, white, blue, green, different colors and saturations all over the place. Take a look through some of the photographs taken underwater and see if you can't find a more consistent (and probably more restrained) color scheme.

MrBobble - That's a pretty good start! If there's that much sunlight streaking through the water, maybe some of it could hit the dock above water too, and you could see some really brightness through the water surface?

MT-Cup - Putting your feet in there is a nice idea, it gives the image a center of interest. A few things are problematic: the color scheme isn't working yet to look like an underwater scene, the boat doesn't look like a boat, and I don't know what those lines are in the water surface radiating out from around the feet.

pgraham - I got out the old red/blue glasses and the 3D effect works pretty well! There are some strange things: the square shadow on the rock, the way a lot of the grass seems broken as if it breaks off then starts again, but overall the scene is working well!

BarberofCivil - Nice test of internal reflections, I don't know why it made the bottom of the boat look brown but it's starting to work.

Shankar - That's nice, with the god rays (fog beams.) They make the image look a bit 2D though, the way they only appear in the foreground. Also, to have the radiating outwards (not all parallel like sunlight) would only really look convincing if they were radiating out from a bright opening in the water surface or clear spot. Maybe you could unify the color scheme a little, to reduce all the contrast between the different tones underwater?

mcu202 - Yeah, murk would be good, maybe some sky visible through the water, and see my post earlier about wet looks...

sphere - That's looking good! I wonder if the farther off parts of the water surface could become reflective instead of just clear?

akwavox - Nice! The colors being so varied looks OK in a tropical scene. It would be good if you could do something more to convey that it's under water through: depth of field, more murk, fog?

Luc-fr - Nice, the bottom one really looks like the poser figure is trying to grab you. I like the shading on that one gray leaf with the special shader, maybe more of the plants could look like that!

gent_k - Good start! Those dark tones you're using for the plants could probably be used for more of the rocks and ground and distance underwater, to help build up some contrast.

purpp - That's coming out nice, more constrained color scheme, some reflection in the water, add alot. I still wonder if it wouldn't be more apparent where the wooden posts of the dock cut through the water?

-jeremy

sphere
06-30-2006, 07:35 AM
Thanks a lot for the feedback Jeremy! Here's an update to my scene.

http://img254.imageshack.us/img254/4899/boardwalk55mk.jpg

Sherif.Nagib
06-30-2006, 08:39 AM
kevb3d and Jeremy : Thanks for the crits guys :thumbsup:
I'm hitting the wall here :banghead: ..guess it's about time to ask for advice :deal:
please fee free to tear it apart :wavey:
(it's xsi with default mental ray renderer)

http://sherifnagib.com/files/temp/sherif_underwater-2.JPG

http://sherifnagib.com/files/temp/sherif_underwater-3.JPG

JCBug
06-30-2006, 08:56 AM
Hi guys, what a production !

Sphere - I like your lights and the atmosphere, the blur is nice. Maybe you can add
littles differents colors ?

MrBobble - Your picture is great, it seems an oil painting. Very mysterious.

Pgraham - Amazing ! It works, the relief is hard and I squint...

Shankar
06-30-2006, 09:09 AM
Thanks for the comments. I will try to follow the sugesstions given by you. Now iam going to look some under water photograph. ThankYou jeremy
-Shankar

akwavox
06-30-2006, 10:09 AM
Thanks for comments.
Here is an update, always with C4D.
http://www.akwavox.com/fc4d/underwater/underwater2.jpg

JCBug
06-30-2006, 10:27 AM
JC Akwavox, good fish textures ! All is clear and light (too much clear?)...

For this picture, I've added caustics on the sand, changed textures
and added littles waves at the top of the pillars.
The bubbles and the floater need to be changed.
It's a Caribbean atmosphere... (said Luc)

http://www.arctique.fr/production/Under-12.jpg

MasterZap
06-30-2006, 12:15 PM
New render, this time w. a bucket of post work.

http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f366/MasterZap/finding-nematodes-C-lots-of-post.jpg

(Yes, the sun "rays" are trapcode's "Shine". So sue me ;) )

/Z

BarberofCivil
06-30-2006, 01:48 PM
Thanks for the comments Jeremy. The boat turns brown basically because it has slight reflective properties and it is reflecting the lake floor. I've only been using one light source with no ambient or fill lighting, so the bottom of the boat has no direct light, and is completely in shadow, which seems to amplify the reflective appearance.

Here is a similar render, but with radiostiy effects added, which reclaims some of the redness of the boat.

http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i52/barberofcivil/UnderTheBoardwalk-8.jpg

I finally came acrossa pretty good underwater photo showing the refraction/total internal reflection division. http://physics.itsbaxter.com/images/refraction.jpg (There are no discernible objects however, which would be really helpful... still looking)

And another render (more to come maybe):
http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i52/barberofcivil/UnderTheBoardwalk-9.jpg

JCBug
06-30-2006, 02:48 PM
MasterZap - Very nice render ! It seems like through a real photographic lens,
very good refraction and nice light. Maybe a lot of fog ?

BarberofCivil - Very instructive tests, you're a scientist.
I notice there is very little reflections on the boat.

MasterZap
06-30-2006, 04:20 PM
Thanks.

Here's a slight variant on the post work... same render...

http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f366/MasterZap/finding-nematodes-C-even-more-post.jpg

/Z

slatr
06-30-2006, 04:49 PM
Those light rays shining down look very good.

You say you did those in post? Can you share?

lotaH
06-30-2006, 05:00 PM
Hi Shankar, very good the image. But does only have vegetation under the port?

Hi sphere, great image, try to place more bumps!

Hi Sherif.Nagib, Liked your image, but I think the water is little dense, it is more similar to a glass roof! Perhaps it is better to place more light volume?

Hi akwavox, I loved your tropical family...lol

Hi JCBug, very Caribbean...

Hi MasterZap, very good the images, but doesn't it think the water is very dense? We are dipped in gel... lol... Continue in the road.

Hi BarberofCivi, loved the transparency... it is one of the best.

Good work, friends. I am learning a lot sells your progresses. Very interesting that contest. Today I will order my wip... Good luck to all.

mbeazley
06-30-2006, 05:24 PM
Well Here is my WIP so far. I was out of town on shows, so I did not get a chance to work on it early on. My only complaint is that I can't get any caustics from the water even though I have caustics on. ??? Using LW 8.5 if anyone cares to divulge some secret ingredient. My only light is a point light and some slight GI. I may try and do a fog free render and blend the two with photoshop. Using Skytracer2 for the sky.

-mark

silvia
06-30-2006, 05:34 PM
MasterZap I really like your image, and I don't agree with who said it looks more like gel than water. I think it works well. One little thing if you allow me, is that you have such a nice image and then you look down to the rocks in the foreground and the texture looks nothing like rocks. Same for the wood. You can just download a photographic texture for the web and slap it on the geometry and you'll see what a difference it is going to make.

Shankar, wow those light rays are awsome!!! Really well done. the only thing I can say is that I never saw rays get all the way to the bottom, they usually stop somewhere in between, unless the water is very shallow. Also I am not sure I have ever seen so many so evenly distributed throughout the water surface, usually I see them radiating from a smaller area, but that is just me.

I am curious to know what kind of render times you guys are getting, because mine is rendering at snail pace, which is so annoying because I don't have much time to dedicate to it in the first place.

slatr
06-30-2006, 06:49 PM
Hi Beazly,

You can use an image projection on a spotlight to fake the caustics.

GiarcNamwob
06-30-2006, 07:05 PM
Thought this might be of interests for you guys on this one....

http://www.seafriends.org.nz/phgraph/


Enjoy...

Craig

silvia
06-30-2006, 07:16 PM
Craig, that is an amazing web site, thank you so much for posting it!!! All those technical details make me want to try my hands at shader programming.

mbeazley
06-30-2006, 08:47 PM
I may try the texture pattern with a spotlight later tonight.

That was a very interesting read about underwater photography, lots of physics in there.

I think I might try and get my water better and maybe lose the fog and use particles.

-mark

lotaH
06-30-2006, 09:40 PM
Hi GiarcNamwob, great sit... tanks!

Here is an update... hope a comments... tanks

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i86/lotah/Submarino/Diego-UnderTheBoardwalk-WIP02.jpg

[]'s
Diego

BarberofCivil
06-30-2006, 09:51 PM
Thanks for the comments.

JCBug - Yes, I tend to be scientific and try to create scenes realistically first rather than using artistic license. For the boat, it is abit reflective, but it has a bumpy surface which gives blurred reflections rather than smooth ones.

One more render before the weekend. I got a nice angle looking almost directly at the lightsource, but having it obscured by the dock. I may try to set a long render on this one with higher quality settings at some time (I'm still looking at ~1.5hr renders for these 'test' scenes...)

http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i52/barberofcivil/UnderTheBoardwalkt-10.jpg

BarberofCivil
06-30-2006, 09:57 PM
BTW, found a couple more nice total internal reflection photos I found. (Watch for the bikini'd swimmer in the second...)

http://www.courtneyplatt.com/underwater/underwimages/11%20Turtle%20Refraction.JPG
http://www.reefpix.org/albums/album125/KN0X3485.jpg

jeremybirn
06-30-2006, 10:42 PM
Anyone have good reference images for what shadows on the water surface look like, seen from below? All the shadows on the water surface that I see here look strange - too focused and contrasty, too much like the water were diffusely illuminated right along the top - but it would be great to have some ref images.

-jeremy

BarberofCivil
07-01-2006, 12:16 AM
Anyone have good reference images for what shadows on the water surface look like, seen from below? All the shadows on the water surface that I see here look strange - too focused and contrasty, too much like the water were diffusely illuminated right along the top - but it would be great to have some ref images.

-jeremy

Can't find any images yet, but there really wouldn't be shadows on the water surface. Any shadows come as a result of interaction with solids in the water. For miniscule objects, like murky water, this is in the form of atmosheric effects. The 'shadow' would be visible 3-dimensionally down through the water. Any shadow cast from above would not allow light to pass into the water to create the atmospheric effects. In my latest image, some of the shadow edges appear a bit harder mainly due to the viewing angle relative to the light source. I.e. along the front edge of the dock, we are almost looking directly along the 3-d shadow as it passes through the water towrd the camera, whereas along the side of the dock, you can see more the shadow edge passing down into the water.

MasterZap
07-01-2006, 03:19 AM
Anyone have good reference images for what shadows on the water surface look like, seen from below? All the shadows on the water surface that I see here look strange - too focused and contrasty, too much like the water were diffusely illuminated right along the top - but it would be great to have some ref images.


You really only see shadow "on" water if the water is really murky and muddy, and then you wouldn't see ANYTHING from below in such water ;)

Shadows are "in" water, i.e. volumetric, if you see them at all.

None of my renders have a shadow on the surface, the shadow you DO see is the reflection of the piers shadow on the sand.

That "physics of underwater photo" site was way cool. And some of those images look remarkably like some of the renders I've gotten and almost thought "nah, that can't be right" and changed things! LOL. Like I had this render w. a HUGE over-water/under-water difference, inside "Snells window" and outside.... but the photos clearly show that's nothing strange at all.

It's apparently really difficult to "intuit" this stuff w. underwater things.

/Z

jeremybirn
07-01-2006, 08:37 AM
This is probably just a question for Master Zap -

What are the limits to internal reflections when rendering with DOF in MR? Are there any MR shaders you can recommend that do internal reflections in shots with DOF?

Here's a simple comparison of the difference that turning on DOF on the camera makes to the appearance of a water surface (Maya PhongE shader, IOR of .75):
http://www.3drender.com/challenges/UnderTheBoardwalk/breakdown/DOF_comparison.jpg

-jeremy

pgraham
07-02-2006, 03:40 AM
Here's a simple comparison of the difference that turning on DOF on the camera makesThat's really interesting. It looks like a bug in the renderer. The dock should stay completely hidden by total internal reflection. It appears like the water surface is a mix between an IOR .75 and an IOR 1.33 surface. The second image has the TIR from the first image mixed with an image that clearly shows the dock. Maybe it thinks some samples are from the front of the water surface, and some samples are from the back, so the IOR is reversed.

mbeazley
07-02-2006, 06:03 PM
Here are two more renders. Did some work on the water to get the Snell's Circle. I decided to bag the underwater caustics for now. The look I was after is a small dirty pond look.

-mark

lotaH
07-02-2006, 08:05 PM
Hi mbeazley, i loved... the second is the best... great!

The water texture is very good! :thumbsup:

[]'s
Diego

lotaH
07-02-2006, 11:43 PM
More work...More tests...

#1
http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i86/lotah/Submarino/Diego-UnderTheBoardwalk-WIP03.jpg

#2
http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i86/lotah/Submarino/Diego-UnderTheBoardwalk-WIP04.jpg

[]'s
Diego

Shankar
07-03-2006, 06:59 AM
Hi Silvia,
The Light Rays are done in Compositing. I rendered the Zdepth pass and Geo Matte pass. Then I did radial blur with random Image to cast the rays. Finally I subracted wiht the combination of Zdepth Pass and Geo matte pass. The software that I used is Maya and Shake. Thanks for your comment
-Sankar

Shankar
07-03-2006, 07:51 AM
Hello Friends,
Here is my work in progress. Comments Plz..
Thanks
Shankar

http://static.flickr.com/73/180471876_64edaeaefe_o.jpg

silvia
07-03-2006, 09:33 AM
Hi all,

I really tried to get a wip posted before the 4th of July week, since I will be on holiday:bounce:
The final image will have to be rendered in layers, because there are several things that need work with this render. Comments would be great!
Have a happy 4th eveybody!

karimD
07-03-2006, 11:41 AM
hi,

here I'm walking into this thread with 2 propositions, both made with max and Vray.
For the first scene I wanted a dark-Time environement with one light projector, carryed
by something or someone over the boat. The scene was rendered with Caustics and GI.
The main light (http://www.yboo.net/karimd/spotlight.gif), from the boat, is a spot light with Decay and volume light... also the BG used is a quite dark pricedural (Gradiant Ramp).
I also used a Home maide Dome light (http://www.yboo.net/karimd/domelight.gif) to manage the embiant light.



http://www.yboo.net/karimd/subaqua1.jpg

In the seconde scene I started to transform the fish and weel maps, turned off the main spot light and added a Directional light (http://www.yboo.net/karimd/directlight.gif) in order to change into a day-time rendering scene.
Here I kept the same Fug used in the first scene, but used no GI, Caustics or Volume light. The "Fug Background", checked in the first scene has been unchecked and the procedural Background was tweeked with light-blue and white colors.

http://www.yboo.net/karimd/subaqua2.jpg

That's it... I hope you'll enjoy and forgive all my myssings in English.

regards,
karim

White Boy
07-03-2006, 12:39 PM
Here's my shot at it. This certainly was a challenge! Never before have I spent this much effort on lighting a scene.

I know it's not perfect, but it's a start! I think I'm stuck though, and I'd like some points for improvement. Sorry the image isn't very large. I needed to render it in less than an hour.

LightWave 8.5 & 9.0 (BETA)
Photoshop

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v487/whiteboywithsideburns/lighting_final.jpg

jigu
07-03-2006, 02:26 PM
Hello everyone,

this one is inspired from jeff's work.I got little time out of my work.so i thought to do this. No textures yet. Done with max and mentalray.
I used Submerge as volume camera shader. and added little much fog.Well i m thinking to make animation of this.Can i allow to make animation(kinda short of animation?)
I m trying to make it dirty and supposed to be in murky water..
Next i will texture it.

C&C r welcome.

http://img106.imageshack.us/img106/917/jiguunderwater3xh.jpg

hyst
07-03-2006, 03:09 PM
hello everybody~

first shot, done with Max and Vray, not completely mapped yet~ C&C welcome

http://perso.wanadoo.fr/hys/vray02s.jpg

thank you~

jeremybirn
07-03-2006, 05:58 PM
hyst -

For the caustic patterns, it looks like you're projecting a proceedural texture that isn't working too well. Maybe try one of the bitmaps from this site instead:

http://www.dgp.toronto.edu/%7Estam/reality/Research/PeriodicCaustics/pics/small_caustic6.jpg http://www.dgp.toronto.edu/%7Estam/reality/Research/PeriodicCaustics/pics/small_caustic8.jpg

http://www.dgp.toronto.edu/~stam/reality/Research/PeriodicCaustics/index.html (http://www.dgp.toronto.edu/%7Estam/reality/Research/PeriodicCaustics/index.html)

It has several zip files full of animated, tiling .tif sequences that can make good "fake caustics."

-jeremy

jeremybirn
07-03-2006, 06:19 PM
jigu - Nice! I like the distortion/DOF effects. Maybe it could use a few more dark tones, other than just the inside of the tire, but since you said you were going to try adding murk that might do the trick.

whiteboywithsideburns - The perspective makes it look like a painting or illustration; actually it reminds me of those diaramas you see in museums sometimes. I like how everything's textured. Maybe that sense of directionality you've got with the light beams under the water could be carried more into the lighting above water, and the cylinders could use more shaping with light coming from screen right, the shadows could be cast from the same direction?

karimD - There are things to like about both of your renders, but maybe the 1st one is a more promising start in the lighting, the 2nd one has some better textures.

silvia - That's a good start! I like the tropical colors and the way you are staging the fish to add some interest and story value! That light looks almost as if the sun were coming right through the dock, and I can't tell what the diagonal line shadow is, if it's a shadow of the rope or what?

-jeremy

jeremybirn
07-03-2006, 06:29 PM
Shankar - That's nice! I like the little particles floating in the water; the murk under the dock is really starting to work.

lotaH - Nice, the fake caustics on the ground are coming out well but maybe that cellular texture looks too procedural when you look up and see it on the surface. What's with that rock (that looks like a human brain leaking yellow onto the ground?)

mbeazley - Nice circle, the clear part is really working, and so is the wavey edge. Maybe the parts of the water that aren't transparent could use some raytraced reflections (or an environment map or specular highlights or texture or something...) right now it looks kindof blank out there.

-jeremy

jeremybirn
07-03-2006, 06:37 PM
Hi MasterZap -

Wow, that last render you posted is looking really good!

I like the "jelly fish" (is the fish made out of jelly a visual pun?) :)

None of my renders have a shadow on the surface, the shadow you DO see is the reflection of the piers shadow on the sand.
Maybe that reflection isn't getting some of the murk or fill light or color correction that the ground itself is getting, and that's why there's more contrast in that reflection than on the ground itself? Also, maybe the ground shadow itself would be filled in more by diffused light underwater, and that's a part of it?

-jeremy

jeremybirn
07-03-2006, 10:20 PM
I'm running some tests on this project myself, and I think the best approach to this project is the opposite of the last challenge.

In the bottle collection, it seemed as if the best way to develop the look was to isolate and rendering 1 bottle by itself, until the glass shader and its illumination, shadows, reflections, and refraction were all worked out.

In this challenge, it seems as if the main thing is to render small, quick images, even if they are just thumbnail-sized, until you have the color scheme and depth-fading looking right. No matter how detailed your scene is, if you don't get the colors and tones right, it won't look like we're underwater. I think I can tell which scenes are working as underwater scenes, and which aren't, even while squinting or looking from a distance, mostly at how all the colors work together and how they shift with distance through the water.

-jeremy

lotaH
07-04-2006, 12:34 AM
that looks like a human brain leaking yellow onto the ground?


lol....hahahahaha...maybe! ;)

Tanks for comment... :thumbsup:

Shankar
07-04-2006, 04:51 AM
Thanks for comments Jermy.

Shankar
07-04-2006, 08:27 AM
Hello Friends,
Here is my Work in progess. Comments plz..
Thanks
-Shankarhttp://static.flickr.com/74/181375908_1add6955f4_o.jpg

kevb3d
07-04-2006, 10:35 AM
I took a break for a while, came back and was blown away by some of these posts, so I wanted to give it another shot. This is less "glassy" looking than the first, and I dirtied it up a bit.

http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/2075/kevb3dunderwater23al.jpg

kevb3d
07-04-2006, 10:38 AM
Shankar,

I like the blurry feel and the detail in the boat that you were able to keep. I also like the translucency on the fish. Looking at yours against mine I think I just might like blue better than green :shrug: oh well...

Kev

akwavox
07-04-2006, 11:18 AM
Here is a new render, this time with post work on the deep mask.

http://www.akwavox.com/fc4d/underwater/underwater3.jpg

Shankar
07-04-2006, 11:23 AM
Hi Kev,
Thanks for your Comments. I like the way you dirtied it up in the bottom.
-Shankar

kepler1571
07-04-2006, 12:03 PM
Hi

I've not used caustics before so this was a good test for me.

http://www.gfx.demon.co.uk/under_the_boardwalk.jpg

The scene uses an IBL environment node with final gather for the fill light and various rim/bounce lights for the tyre, fish etc. A key spotlight casts light fog and ray-traced shadows.

I used a simple textured volume fog for the environment fog, and a version with the granite texture for the water particles.

The water uses maya's ocean shader.

All of the above were rendered with mental ray/maya using render layers and comped in after effects (beauty, caustics, light fog, water particles, luminence depth (for DOF etc).

http://www.gfx.demon.co.uk/after_FX_comp.png

I had a lot of trouble trying to bring these renders into after effects with a zdepth channel, it seems after effects doesn't like mental rays output but has no problem with maya.

cheers

Stuart.

White Boy
07-04-2006, 12:51 PM
kepler1571, I'm really digging the Firestone logo on the tire. :thumbsup:

mbeazley
07-04-2006, 04:26 PM
Thanks for the input Jeremy. The issue with the reflections is the fog is basically stealing all the reflections; so all I am getting is the fog reflecting on the water.

Do any Lightwave users have any ideas to get around this?

-mark

MasterZap
07-04-2006, 08:10 PM
I took a break for a while, came back and was blown away by some of these posts, so I wanted to give it another shot. This is less "glassy" looking than the first, and I dirtied it up a bit.

http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/2075/kevb3dunderwater23al.jpg



Oooo I like this one!

/Z

BarberofCivil
07-04-2006, 08:52 PM
Here are two more renders. Did some work on the water to get the Snell's Circle. I decided to bag the underwater caustics for now. The look I was after is a small dirty pond look.

-mark

mbeazley - Starting to get a good Snell's circle TIR effect there. One thing that you may want to try to get is the distorted, fish-eye look for the part that is visible outside the water. For the Snell's circle, the view outside the water may only encompass about 95deg of the camera's actual field of vision under the water, but through the physics of refraction, this 95deg contains the whole 180deg FOV from the water surface. Have a look at these 2 renders,the first with the water off, and the second with the water and refraction on (I tried to recreate your viewing angle as best I could).

http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i52/barberofcivil/UnderTheBoardwalk-A.jpghttp://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i52/barberofcivil/UnderTheBoardwalk-B.jpg

mbeazley
07-04-2006, 09:18 PM
BarberofCivil,

Thanks for the input. It is awesome that you have shared a lot of the physics behind this stuff. My next question though is, how do you make the renderer do that? Should plugging in the IOR of 1.33 for the water be enough to get the refracted 180 degrees? Another quick question about your water, are using a real displacement map or are you just using a bump map? It also looks like your Snell's Circle is very distinct, I am assuming you are using your own modifiers for transparency and reflection for the Snell's circle effect? LW uses gradient maps for that type of stuff.

-mark

BarberofCivil
07-04-2006, 11:15 PM
BarberofCivil,

Thanks for the input. It is awesome that you have shared a lot of the physics behind this stuff. My next question though is, how do you make the renderer do that? Should plugging in the IOR of 1.33 for the water be enough to get the refracted 180 degrees? Another quick question about your water, are using a real displacement map or are you just using a bump map? It also looks like your Snell's Circle is very distinct, I am assuming you are using your own modifiers for transparency and reflection for the Snell's circle effect? LW uses gradient maps for that type of stuff.

-mark

Thanks. I'm using POV-Ray which is a ray tracer. The camera is inside the water object and the water has an ior of 1.33. Raytracing does the rest. I'm not sure how other programs work with respect to handling refraction and ior, especially when it comes to total internal reflection, so I can't really help you there, however, if it is implemented correctly, it should be just a natural occurence when viewing from and object with higher ior to lower ior.

The surface of the water is actually just a flat plane with normal modifiers on it. The circle is distinct for a few reasons. If a mesh surface was used, the high/lows of the mesh would interfere a bit with the edge of the Snell's circle, blurring it somewhat. Also, the switch from seeing outside to total internal reflection should be relatively abrupt. There will be some slight abberrations at theedge as the different wavelengths of light have slightly differing ior values. However, the raytracer treats all light colours as equal, giving a distinct seperation from refraction to TIR. Inside the Snell's circle, there should also be some slight reflection from below as well based on fresnel reflection, but I don't have this turned on at the moment.

kevb3d
07-04-2006, 11:58 PM
Here is a new render, this time with post work on the deep mask.

http://www.akwavox.com/fc4d/underwater/underwater3.jpg

I love the texturing on the fish here.

MasterZap, thanks! I'm still working on it, but my confidence is higher now. :)

Kev

jeremybirn
07-05-2006, 12:16 AM
I'm running "murk" tests on the water's atmosphere. This is with Maya particles, "cloud" rendering type, emitted from the ground surface.

http://www.3drender.com/challenges/UnderTheBoardwalk/breakdown/WebTest1.jpg

-jeremy

mbeazley
07-05-2006, 12:24 AM
Thanks. I'm using POV-Ray which is a ray tracer. The camera is inside the water object and the water has an ior of 1.33. Raytracing does the rest. I'm not sure how other programs work with respect to handling refraction and ior, especially when it comes to total internal reflection, so I can't really help you there, however, if it is implemented correctly, it should be just a natural occurence when viewing from and object with higher ior to lower ior.

The surface of the water is actually just a flat plane with normal modifiers on it. The circle is distinct for a few reasons. If a mesh surface was used, the high/lows of the mesh would interfere a bit with the edge of the Snell's circle, blurring it somewhat. Also, the switch from seeing outside to total internal reflection should be relatively abrupt. There will be some slight abberrations at theedge as the different wavelengths of light have slightly differing ior values. However, the raytracer treats all light colours as equal, giving a distinct seperation from refraction to TIR. Inside the Snell's circle, there should also be some slight reflection from below as well based on fresnel reflection, but I don't have this turned on at the moment.

Cool stuff. I have re-made my water surface as a flat plane and have implemented normal modifiers on it like you have been doing and I like it much better. I will add the fresnel reflection in and see what it does.

Nice image Jeremy!

Kevb3d; that is looking great. I really like the caustics and the light rays.

-mark

karimD
07-05-2006, 03:43 AM
This is my last result, even if personaly I'm not convinced...



http://www.yboo.net/karimd/subaqua3.jpg

jigu
07-05-2006, 03:58 AM
Thanks jeremy for the comments!! this is wip so i will finish when i get the time.

MrBobble
07-05-2006, 04:02 AM
Went for a sunset type scene this time... errr... yeah....

jeremybirn
07-05-2006, 04:57 AM
Wow! This thread is getting amazing! Especially with images like the ones MrBobble and kevb3d just posted, I'm thinking we could hit the front page again!

-jeremy

xoranimation
07-05-2006, 10:44 AM
Hello everyone,

my name is andy, iīm from germany and itīs my first challenge here.
this is was i have so far, itīs not finished coz i need to add more details / textures.
my goal is to archive a positive "place i wanna be" look.

http://img152.imageshack.us/img152/552/waterpreview8qk.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

hope you see the image, never used imageshack ;.)

meanlebh
07-05-2006, 01:27 PM
Went for a sunset type scene this time... errr... yeah....


Wow!, Great image MrBobble. The transition of light from above water to underwater is just perfect. I love the warm colors, and the surface of the water is amazing. My only comment might be that it doesn't appear that the boat is casting much, if any shadow/blocking any light from the ground under the water. Other than that I would say that you nailed it. Great work.

-Brian

wisedog
07-05-2006, 01:34 PM
Hi all...
great challenge and great result.
this is my first attemp, this is somewhere under the water at 6-7 am in the morning. sun is only at horizon, the world is still cold from a peaceful night.
critiques and suggestions are welcome.
btw... i use 3dsmax and photoshop

JCBug
07-05-2006, 03:36 PM
Jeremy - Thanks for the caustic texture. I'm going to try it.
Your last picture : what an incredible atmosphere...
What about my "Carribean light" ?

Shankar - Very amazing picture, it's strange and dark. Caustics maybe smaller ?

whiteboywithsideburns - Aesthetic picture ! Nice work, I like the grey weather,
we can imagine the power of the wind on the waves.

jigu - Good light. With textures, it will be great.

hyst - Nice picture, the caustics are very present and neat...

karimD - Very good rock, sand and alga textures !

kevb3d - Great picture ! Very blur and amazing. Nice particles.

xoranimation - What colors ! It seems an impresionnist painting !

MrBobble - Great picture, good colors. I am very impressed.

This is 2 tests with particles, circular waves and prism refraction.
But the caustics on the pillars are strange.

http://www.arctique.fr/production/Under-17B.jpg
http://www.arctique.fr/production/Under-16B.jpg

jeremybirn
07-05-2006, 07:15 PM
JCBug - Those are nice images. I guess it still somehow feels a little dry under the water surface, maybe because the ground texture looks like dry sand? Maybe it's the crisp focus and color contrast between things and the hard lines, but somehow it seems as if it could go farther in looking as if we're underwater.

wisedog - Good start, foggy weather can lead to a nice color scheme. It looks as if somehow not much light is making it under the water through, things are going very dark right away and maybe some light on the bottom of the boat and pier would help even things up?

xoranimation - Welcome! That's certainly an interesting image; bright, almost surreal colors. I'm trying to figure out if that box is full of wavey water, or if it contains bent file folders or what?

MrBobble - Congratulations, that's a truly great image! I can see lots of departures from reality in it, but I don't know if you want to "fix" any of them, or just be proud of a great image. I hope you can post some info about what techniques or approaches you used, and I look forwards to seeing more images from you, whether they are for this or other lighting challenge scenes!

karimD - I like the moss or lichen or whatever, parts of the scene are starting to look watery even if not the whole image. It's hard to tell exactly where the pier cuts through the water surface, and it seems strange that all the caustics are on the bottom of the dock while the light refracting through the water seems univorm and focused into hard, crisp shadows. Maybe some soft shadows or occlusion would help where the grass hits the ground as well?

kepler1571 - Nice image, why not try Lightyear brand tires? (Just Kidding.) I like the look of the water surface and wave patterns, it looks very wind-blown in places. I don't know what that shadow is to the left of the boat. Underwater nice bright colors are appealing, I wonder if in some places it wouldn't be quite as bright and clear though.

akwavox - I love all those textures, lots of rich detail and color. Right now everything looks so crisp though that it doesn't seem to be underwater, maybe letting some part of the fish go a little darker, more murk in the water, some softer shadows or occlusion, could all help build the underwater feeling?

kevb3d - Love it! You've got a great murkiness there. If you wanted to plus it up any more, I'd try adding some occlusion (like darkness in the transition between the screen-left rock and the ground) and bounce light (in the two hot spots in the foreground, they should light nearby surfaces and cast a hint of a glow into the water as well.)

Shankar - I really like the volumetric light coming underwater with the little dots in it on the right, the overall light atmosphere looks really good. Maybe the patterns on the ground in the foreground don't look very natural; the caustics or the ground texture probably both could be changed. And it seems as if the big rock near the foreground is the darkest part of the scene, darker than anything in the shadows, but then smaller rocks near it don't cast much shadows or occlusion, maybe that could even out?

hyst - That's a good start, maybe you could find the places with hard edges like the square on the tire and soften those parts of the lighting?

-jeremy

RO
07-05-2006, 08:08 PM
I like how everyone has got a diff idea of who it should look like. Very nice renders I liked the last sunset one that one is hot but so many cool works here.

xoranimation
07-05-2006, 08:15 PM
jeremy:
thanxx for those kind words, iīm still working on the picture ...

the box is full of nice windows-xp packages ;-)
someone must thrown it into the water, maybe the fisher

JCBug:
thanxx alot :-)


andy

MasterZap
07-05-2006, 08:21 PM
Wow! This thread is getting amazing! Especially with images like the ones MrBobble and kevb3d just posted, I'm thinking we could hit the front page again!

-jeremy

We just did....

I also like mrBobbles, although something makes it look a bit like a minature... but a DARNED NICE MINATURE!

/Z

slatr
07-05-2006, 10:18 PM
It looks like a painting you might see in a book IMO.

karimD
07-05-2006, 10:43 PM
ok, finaly I developed around my first "dark time idea", by finishing textures and adding Particles for more vegetation.

karim
web presentation : http://www.yboo.net/freelance (http://www.yboo.net/freelance)


http://www.yboo.net/karimd/subaqua4.jpg

RobertoOrtiz
07-05-2006, 11:01 PM
Great work guys,

Plugged!
-R

Sercox
07-06-2006, 12:55 AM
Some great images here... Really stunned about your image MrBobble. Said "WoW" to myself :)

-Robert

xoranimation
07-06-2006, 02:44 AM
hello again :-)

i made a new image, this time "over and under" the sea.
MrBobbleīs great image inspired me to "pimp" my scene a bit.
please let me know what you think !

greetings from germany


edit: itīs still not completed, need some time for texture and detail work, but itīs late
and i need some sleep ;-)

http://img57.imageshack.us/img57/5067/overandunder0ub.th.jpg (http://img57.imageshack.us/my.php?image=overandunder0ub.jpg)


ups, i did something wrong in the first image - it should simulate a divers pov but i added water drops over AND under the water surface ...

http://img72.imageshack.us/img72/5453/oafix9qn.th.jpg (http://img72.imageshack.us/my.php?image=oafix9qn.jpg)


bye

andy

MrBobble
07-06-2006, 03:18 AM
Thanks for the kind words all! And thanks for the critique Jeremy!

The further I went the more stylised it became, but I don't mind that too much. Oh, and yes, the boat isn't affecting the volumetrics properly... Oops :\



Err... In response to "techniques used", I did it in 3 layers. The scene is done in 3DS Max 7. The main render is with Vray, then two more passes for volumetrics and caustics ( which were faked by using a noise map projected through a light... if you squint you can almost see them! :P ). A little post work combining the layers and adding some glow.

WOW Front page! Thanks a bunch! :D

ShadowM8
07-06-2006, 03:33 AM
Congrats on the front page guys, we did it again, well deserved!

Kabab
07-06-2006, 05:52 AM
I'm running "murk" tests on the water's atmosphere. This is with Maya particles, "cloud" rendering type, emitted from the ground surface.



-jeremy
Something you may want to try for that effect is a simply Maya Fluids container it can be reasonably low res and just texture the oppacity..

It should also reasonably quick and give you heaps of control!

xoranimation
07-06-2006, 09:29 AM
Kabab: fluidcontainers are great for the water athmosphere,
with low settings the rendertimes are short and itīs easy to setup.
i used fluids in my images too :-)

andy

JCBug
07-06-2006, 09:43 AM
Jeremy - You're right ! Infortunatly, my scene seems dry... I have to work.
Maybe too much grain ? So, I succeeded to go farther in underwater.

xoranimation - Your picture is very wet ! I like the water drops, it's fun !

xoranimation
07-06-2006, 09:49 AM
JCBug: thanxx ! was fun to do :-)

andy

GennadiyKorol
07-06-2006, 09:58 AM
MrBobble: Can we ask for a hi-res image? It'd look ace as a wallpaper :)

mindless
07-06-2006, 10:00 AM
Nice challenge, I'll try to hop in! My lighting techniques need a little brushing though =)

Shankar
07-06-2006, 10:19 AM
Hello Friends and Jermy. Thanks for your Comments. This is my latest work in progress.

Jermy - You are right. I changed the caustics and texture patten on the sand.

more Comments plz..
-Shankar

http://static.flickr.com/64/183204674_59660b4d40_o.jpg

karimD
07-06-2006, 12:45 PM
adding a new camera is the main change I made since my last post.

karim


http://www.yboo.net/karimd/subaqua5.jpg

meanlebh
07-06-2006, 01:47 PM
ooooh, nice ones shankar and karimd! Some really great renders have been posted here, great job everyone! Hopefully I'll be able to play around with the scene a little bit this weekend once I get caught up a little more at work.

Shankar-- I really like the lighting that you have going on here. I really like the particles and the light beams coming through the water, but something about the caustic pattern on the ground just still doesn't look quite right to me...it could be that the pattern is quite large compared to the ripples on the water's surface...they also look a bit strong in my opinion. But really great job, with a few more tweaks I think you'd have a great render there!

Karimd-- Again, great looking render, I love the fog above the water, and the water drops on the lens of the camera, they both really add to the overall mood of the scene. The only thing that bothers me though is that under the water looks just as clear as above the water, maybe even more so....I'm not saying that it should be completely murky, because you would lose a lot the appeal of the scene, but I would expect it to be at least a little bit harder to see through than above the water, or perhaps all that it needs is a sense of some fine particles floating around to help add a sense of depth to it. anyways, really great job, it looks just about perfect.

danchez
07-06-2006, 02:42 PM
here is my attempt.. all textures procedural, except sky
tried to get good mood and all the effect within lightwave
light beams done with help object "water face" because lightwave understands cammera as just one point in space (so you are under water, or over, never between) so i needed help object to get wet/dry type of look..
"water face" helped also to get light beams without volumetric lights (just tinted and stretched procedural texture on luminosity channel
i used also refraction blurring (1%) to get slightly blurred underwater part, and also surface thickness helped to get underwater fog (all also on "water face" object)
..
scene contains 3 lights
one main light on top right for sun .. shadows on
one light from left to get "sky" light .. shadows of
and one light directly from bottom to get reflected light on bottom of the boat and pier
the bottom light projects the sky texture to get variations in lighting
..
image is also slightly photoshoped to get right exposure and monochromatic image
also light haze is done in photoshop (duplicated image, blurred, slight levels to get rid of lightening dark arease, and set to screen)
..
and finaly, here is the image:)
http://roof44.zizkov.net/3d/lighting_underwater.gif
i am quite satisfied with result..
working time around 3 hours

karimD
07-06-2006, 04:10 PM
... I think like you Brian. I shyly tryed to accentuate the "water density aspect" but haven't
found the right thing for that. As I don't want to switch fast into a post-effects solution for handelling this, I'll be checking some other ways for a while ...

karim

MissViz
07-06-2006, 04:58 PM
Particles suck! I decided to fake the dirt particles issue with a fractal 3D texture in the color channel of my lightfog. It's thousand times easier than to fool around with Dynamics. I admit that I was too lazy texturing because I wanted to focus on lighting. Also, I added some noise and blur in Photoshop.

http://theimagehosting.info/images.php/i835_myUnderwater13.jpg

berniebernie
07-06-2006, 05:13 PM
I really like xoranimation's render ! 5 stars from me if i could rate your image =)

Has anyone tried a moonlit scene yet ? I'd do it if I had time.

tharrell
07-06-2006, 05:13 PM
Great stuff guys!

I just went to get started on the challenge myself this morning and was baffled by the fact that whatever I did I couldn't get reflections or refractions working in Maya.

I had a bit of a "duh" moment.... Turns out that every shape node in the Maya file has visible in reflections and refractions disabled.

Instead of going through and manually setting reflect/refract on for each of the tons of geometry in the scene, I wrote a quick MEL script that will select all geometry in any scene and either enable or disable reflect/refract on the shape node to save a little bit of time and a lot of clicking :)

(be gentle, I'm just getting started with MEL)

// Scripts to turn on or off shape node reflection and refraction globally
//
// Trey Harrell -- www.treyharrell.com (http://www.treyharrell.com/)
//
// source the script and enter either:
//
// thRemoveReflectRefract;
// -or-
// thMakeReflectRefract;
//
// at the command line

global proc thMakeReflectRefract ()
{

SelectAllGeometry;
string $objects[];
string $item;
$objects = `ls -sl`;
if (`size $objects` == 0) error "Nothing is selected. Please select one or more pieces of geometry.";
for ($item in $objects) {
$itemshape = ($item + "Shape");
setAttr ($itemshape + ".visibleInReflections") 1;
setAttr ($itemshape + ".visibleInRefractions") 1;

}
;
}
global proc thRemoveReflectRefract ()
{

SelectAllGeometry;
string $objects[];
string $item;
$objects = `ls -sl`;
if (`size $objects` == 0) error "Nothing is selected. Please select one or more pieces of geometry.";
for ($item in $objects) {
$itemshape = ($item + "Shape");
setAttr ($itemshape + ".visibleInReflections") 0;
setAttr ($itemshape + ".visibleInRefractions") 0;

}
;
}

Hope to have a WIP up soon!

--T

karimD
07-06-2006, 05:46 PM
I added some water density, so the under water in less cleare and bight.

karim

http://www.yboo.net/karimd/subaqua6.jpg

jeremybirn
07-06-2006, 06:17 PM
tharrell -

Thanks for the script. Maya's "Attribute Spreadsheet" window also works for setting all those flags at once, but your post should at least be a good reminder to check settings when dealing with imported geometry!

-jeremy

jeremybirn
07-06-2006, 06:20 PM
Something you may want to try for that effect is a simply Maya Fluids container it can be reasonably low res and just texture the oppacity..

It should also reasonably quick and give you heaps of control!

I had to set this work aside this week, but I'll try Maya Fluids as you and Andy suggest over the weekend and post my results.

Thanks,

-jeremy

JCBug
07-06-2006, 06:52 PM
Danchez, your picture is GREAT !
Good textures and lights,
I would be curious to see the same render in true colors...

JCB

xoranimation
07-06-2006, 07:20 PM
mlkdesign: thanks alot :-)


andy

Maven
07-06-2006, 07:22 PM
I'm still working on this and I really haven't dealt with the textures too much but here is what I'm up to. I'm still trying to get that "underwater" feeling.

http://www.pbase.com/brows33/image/63058772/original.jpg

paladin6303
07-06-2006, 07:25 PM
Just playing around with Edge Transparency and got this for a test render. One area light above the pier and a point light below. thought the shadows were interesting so I thought I'd post this

tharrell
07-06-2006, 08:07 PM
tharrell -

Thanks for the script. Maya's "Attribute Spreadsheet" window also works for setting all those flags at once, but your post should at least be a good reminder to check settings when dealing with imported geometry!

-jeremy

Heheh, that's indeed a much better approach than my little script. I always seem to forget the attribute spreadsheet and component editors are there because I normally make global attribute changes like this through the channel box.

Thanks!

--T

MissViz
07-06-2006, 08:32 PM
Oh no! My imagehosting sucks, too! And I've got the file at work ..! I will post my image once again next week.

xoranimation
07-06-2006, 08:40 PM
paladin6303 (member.php?u=41172): i like the shadows, nice !

andy

SanderWit
07-06-2006, 10:30 PM
Wow guys, I am truly amazed with some of the entrees here! There are so many! I would like to give it a try and perhaps I will, but I'm really buzzy with other things at the moment.

I want to wish everybody here good luck with this project!

Oh and one thing, I find it a bit funny (though I could be very well wrong with this) that in some renders there are little round waves going from the poles of the pier, though I believe the pier stands still. See the image below to see what I mean. It's just a thought and could be wrong.
http://img218.imageshack.us/img218/6415/waves4nm.jpg
The best of luck! I hope to see some beautifull things here. I wounder how cool the winner will be!