Core Duo Notebook Advice

[JDex]

New Macbooks (not pros) are rumored for May 9th and will likely fit the budget... bootcamp it with a seat of Pro. At worst it's something to check into when they're released.

[alexyork]

hullo m8 :)

yeh i was keeping the macbook in the back of my mind but I can't get over the huge price hike for reasonably basic features (compared to other brands). they look the dog's but I'm not sure... what's supposed to be in these new specs then? got a link?

ta

btw the vaios i was looking at are:

Sony Vaio FE11H
Sony Vaio SZ1HP


I just don't know if I can get past all the warnings from reviewers about sony build and service. Is there anyone here who can convince me Vaios are worth it?

edit: just noticed the FE11H has media center, not pro, and the SZ1HP is specced far lower than the FE11H for a couple hundred quid more. great! :scream:

[alexyork]

just seen this:

http://www.notebookreview.com/default.asp?newsID=2831

looks like it might be worth waiting until these puppies are released and inside some new models. i'm guessing AMD-based notebooks are relatively cheaper than Intel? (that's the case with most PCs anyway)?

[JDex]

hullo m8 :)

yeh i was keeping the macbook in the back of my mind but I can't get over the huge price hike for reasonably basic features (compared to other brands). they look the dog's but I'm not sure... what's supposed to be in these new specs then? got a link?

ta

btw the vaios i was looking at are:

Sony Vaio FE11H
Sony Vaio SZ1HP


I just don't know if I can get past all the warnings from reviewers about sony build and service. Is there anyone here who can convince me Vaios are worth it?


I've helped a few people who owned VAIO's in the past fix their machines. Can't say much beyond I'll never purchase one after those experiences.

I understand balking at the premium on the Apples... been there for a long time myself. It's really the OSX/Win prospect that solves it for me. As for what the new Macbooks will feature, we'll have to wait. My guess, the exact same stuff as the 15" Macbook Pro except:

slower processor
no Firewire800
no ExpressCard/34 slot
no Optical digital and analog audio I/O
no Dual-link DVI, VGA adapter included (external monitor hookup)
no Illuminated keyboard

But that's only my guess... may 9th is right around the corner.

Why May 9th... retailers recieved a promo-pack with Do not open till 5/9 and today on Apples site the webmaster put up some premature info that was promptly taken down.

[alexyork]

ah i see. well seeing as processing power is possibly my main priority that doesn't sound all that attractive really. this would be a handy rendernode, basically, not a desktop replacement or anything like that. also the whole OSX/win bootcamp thing is attractive but I don't see myself ever using osx for anything at all really. i just don't think i'm in the market for an apple tbh.

[maX_Andrews]

the macbook pro is the lightest 15" core duo notebook out there, and if you just make pretend you're in college the academic price for the macbook pro is £1315 inc VAT. But it only has 512MB RAM so it'd be another £65 or so to upgrade that to 1.5GB yourself, and in that case it's more cost effective to go for the 2.0Ghz model which has a GB of RAM (single dimm for easy upgrading) larger hard drive, better graphics etc but then it's £1635 which is quite a bit over your budget. So if you can't see any need for dual booting and don;t need the graphics and hard drive and thinness, then an acer will be much more cost effective for you. (but uglier ahhh!)
:P

[Halford]

How about the Dell Latitude D820?

it's a 15" with WSXGA+ if you want and you can choose among t2400, t2500 and t2600,

it can have 2GB ram....but it depends as well from your budget....

Hal.

[alexyork]

cheers guys thanks for the advice.

i really think apple is not for me, not now anyway. that dell looks interesting but I specced it up and it came to around £1600 which is way out of my budget. And it looks a little bulky too.

I've been looking at this, the Samsung X60:

http://www.laptopsdirect.co.uk/Samsung_X60_NP-X60T000-SUK/version.asp

I've heard it comes with 2 x 512mb sticks of ram, which is irritating, but I'm hoping I can persuade them to quote me for 1 x 1GB or maybe even 2 x 1GB. i'll see how it goes. it seems a very good spec for the price, and I've heard nothing negative about Samsung notebooks. not yet anyway!

I'm thinking the best route to take would be to pick up a second power supply which I can leave at work (another £45) and a slim line covering which I can use to throw this thing into my regular bag for travelling.

http://www.laptopsdirect.co.uk/Targus_Second_Skinz_Notebook_covering_Medium_TSS011EU/version-1.asp

How does that lot look to you guys?

[alanmac]

After my lousy experience dealing with Sony Support on a problem I had with a desktop Vaio I'd never buy a Sony product again if I can help it. Shame because they produce stylish electronics, but don't follow that up with a good aftersales support.

In many respects the old saying "you get what you pay for" is true. There are of course, as with all things in life, exceptions to the rule.

When pricing a product the manufacturer doesn't just pluck a figure out the air, they work on the pricing and positioning of a product as much as on the component parts, construction, style and after sales back up.

A item is more than just the sum of its component parts. Just don't buy Sony in my opinion based on my experiences !!

Even Apple has it's fair share of problems, reports of whining noises coming from Macbook Pros for example, but it's more about how you react and solve these issues than how they came about. Maintaining customer confidence. In this respect I found Sony seriously wanting.

Good luck. Happy shopping.

Alan

P.S. As your UK based you may want to grab a copy of PC Pro mag or just look here. Can't recommend any of these from personal experience but may help you in your quest.

http://www.pcpro.co.uk/labs/140/centrino-duo-notebooks/products.html

[alexyork]

thanks mate i think i'm convinced not to go near Sony Vaios now! phew.

i'm very tempted by that Samsung X60. it really looks like a good deal for the price. it doesn't look as nice as some others but if I can get that RAM sorted out it might just be what I'm after. shame I can't get a quote on that until Monday. was hoping to order today!

Here's a pic of it:

http://www.samsung.com/uk/products/mobilecomputing/thinlight/images/x60_lrg2.jpg

[alexyork]

ah thanks for that link! very useful cheers.

[alanmac]

I've not dealt with Evesham but at least they have a few shops dotted about apart from their main factory, so you could see one in the flesh if they had it in stock.

Acer also have recieved good reviews concerning some of their models, but as with all things you can't go on a blanket recommendation of any brand - they are all prone to producing that "Friday afternoon" model at some stage.

I use both platforms, don't own a laptop, but I'd certainly have an Apple on my shortlist, even if it meant pushing up my budget more to do so. with Bootcamp or the new emulation software (can't remember its name for the moment) you'd still have a foot in the Windows camp if you needed it.

In my opinion I've not seen many laptops, if any, that can match the finish and build quality of the Powerbook/MacBook Pro range.

A stroll down Tottenham Court Road maybe, with a detour to Regents Street if you're London way.

Alan

[alexyork]

i bought a laptop (i think it was an HP) for my sister somewhere down Tottenham Crt Road a couple of years ago. not a fun experience. practically all the guys trying to take my cash were kids with less technical knowledge of computers than me. i eventully succumbed to that HP, which promptly fell to bits a year later, and the shop had closed down. Sent it to HP for a repair and they told me the battery was over 3 years old! So I can only assume the shop stocked dodgy gear... don't fancy going down that road again for anything other than speakers and mice thanks! i might be tempted to take a look at some more models at Micro Anvika though. That's one funky store.

Thanks again for the advice. If I can get a decent quote for that Samsung X60 I'll go for that on Monday. If anyone can throw some more models into the bag for me this weekend though I'll be all ears!

Cheers again

[maX_Andrews]

I'd say least wait until may 9th to see what the non-pro macbook is like, it may be just what you need. If it's not, then go with the samsung on wednesday.

[alexyork]

did anyone manage to get 3ds max working on a macbook pro?

[maX_Andrews]

yes there is a thread about it in the news section, called "boot camp windows is fast but won't run 3dsmax," and the thread basically is filled with people saying 3dsmax runs fine on the MBP.
http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?t=345109&highlight=boot+camp

"3dsmax 8 runs fine on the MacBook Pro running Windows SP2. I downloaded the demo of 3dsmax last week and ran a few rendering and modeling sessions...and well...it felt just fine on the machine...aside from 3dsmax's natural 'bloat' feeling we have all come too love and accept."

"With BootCamp, an Intel Mac runs XP just like any other PC would. Which is why I bought this MacBook - developing for Windows and OS X on just one laptop, what more could I want?

So far, everything that runs on my Desktop PC runs also on the MacBook - Shade, Blender, Poser, and that yet-to-be-released application X - no complaints. "

"Well, in the Autodesk support forum, someone has been posting for several days results from benchmarking 3ds max on a Mac Book Pro..."

So it should also run on the non-pro macbooks but the graphics may not be all that great, which wouldn't matter much if this was being used as a render node. Here's what's "known" about the non-pro macbook being released on may 9th:
13.3" widscreen
512MB RAM standard (one free slot upgradeable to 1.5GB i'd imagine)
built in wifi and bluetooth
cd burner/dvd player slot-loading on the entry level, cd burner/dvd burner slot-loading on the upgraded model
most likely a 1.66Ghz core solo processor on the entry level, a 1.66ghz coreduo on the upgraded model
no expansion card slot
no illuminated keyboard
no firewire 800
40GB or 60GB hard drive (likely SATA)
under 5 pounds, built like a rock, and white.
Most likely same as current pricing: $999 for the entry level, $1299 for the upgraded model. (£699/£899 according to the UK apple store, which is well under your budget, and if you configure the top-end model without the dvd burner just a reg cd burner it drops to £829, and down to £780 if you get academic pricing through apple's online store for education)

what is unknown:
graphics capabilties? (likely ATI something with 64MB)
isight webcam? (probably not given the price point)

Let's see if I'm right :) If I am, you can get a dual-bootable machine with a decent processor for nearly £500 under your budget. You will need to get a 1GB stick of RAM and put it in yourself, which will be another £70 or so, bringing the machine up to 1.5GB

[alexyork]

hey cheers for all that info! a good read!

it does sound quite attractive now I must admit. the 512mb ram thing isn't too great though, and I'd have liked 2GB, not 1.5 (i could always sell the installed 512 module) but I'm guessing that will shoot the price right up again.

like you said I don't really care too much for the graphics capabilities. just pure CPU grunt and RAM will do me fine!

ok so i'll be checking this out on tuesday then. i hope your predictions turn out to be true.

thanks again!

[maX_Andrews]

Glad you found my post useful.
The RAM in the ibook though, just so you know, is that 512MB comes built onto the motherboard, and there is another slot that is user accessible. So 1.5GB is the max unless you take the whole machine apart, desolder the 512mb onboard module and replace it with a gig :-)

But Personally I have 2.5GB of RAM in my machine and I've barely gotten over 1.5GB actively used even with 75 browser windows and five photoshop documents open, not to mention about ten apps, so 1.5GB is most likely fine for everything but the most intense photo editing.

Here's a video I recorded of my dual 2.0Ghz G5 multitasking like crazy, and I was using about 1300MB of RAM: http://www.unfinis.com/multitask2.mov

[JDex]

Alex, you seem to want two very different things... light-weight inexpensive notebook, and a render node. You would probably be best served to get an inexpensive notebook with everything but the render power, and a barebones rendering machine.

You should be able to get a decent notebook for dragging around and a desktop w/ AMD X2 and integrated graphics in your price range.

You should be able to get a basic X2 system w/ 2GB of ram and a 100GB Hard drive w/ WinXP Pro for around £600 and a decent mobile for using on-the-go for around £700... VAT will be the tough spot, it's so bizarre to me.

Just a thought.

[alexyork]

aye I'm a demanding sod :D

seriously though, yeh i'm after a lightweight render node. that samsung X60 looks like it will be just that. 2.48kg, 2Gb ram possible, core duo 1.6, decent screen and 80GB HDD or 100GB option for another £60 or so. total around £1100 i should think. that's a good value notebook I would say? i found many better-specced notebooks out there but they're all in the 2.7kb or above bracket and I can see that being a real problem dragging to work every day.

I bought a shuttle dual core barebones a few months back and it's a beast of a machine. I use it purely as a render node and that's working out great but i'm now after something I can shlep to work and use there hence my difficult demands :)

if I can spec up one of these new macbooks to DVD writer with at least 1GB for less than £1000 then I will probably go with that instead.

right now it's the X60 v's the potentially good new macbook then. let battle commence!

thanks again for the tips guys

[fxgogo]

That Samsung looks interesting, but I would look at the Acer 5652. You will get all you are getting on the Samsung and more. I think the only minus for you would be no Windows Xp Pro, but XP Home. I don't see that as a major problem though. I am in the same situation as you with budget for a Laptop. I would love one of the bigger speced machines, but paying £400-£600 extra for maybe 10%-20% speed increase does not make sense. For me I ahve been wanting a Nvidia card as I want to run Linux as well as XP.

The macs are nice, but still too much money for what you get.

[maX_Andrews]

On the pro end yes, the macs do have a premium, but the ibook non-pro line have always been quite a steal.
Even the current G4 ibooks are great for the $$$, and the newer models will be intel based and thus windows is dual bootable, not to mention they will have aster processors. For $999 you can get a fully capable multimedia laptop that weighs less than five pounds, is built like a rock, and comes with OSX out of the box. I helped a friend buy one at the camp where I work over the summer, and before she came to pick it up we played with it. Since we were in the middle of nowhere and I obviously didn't have my software with me, we were limited to the built in OSX iLife apps. In the evening we hooked it up to the camp's PA system and used it with garageband to record live music and to mess around making some remixes with the included samples. The other counselors, many with inspiron laptops, would give me their digital cameras and I would use iphoto to play slideshows for everyone and then to burn CD's, and eventually slideshow dvd's showcasing the wild side of camp over the summer. And it was just so easy and worked so well. And usually the less you pay the chunkier and worse built laptops are, but not so with the macs. These are meant for a student market and as such are small, light, and can take a serious beating. The lack of ANY latches or odd shapes mean they are a cinch to slip in and out of a book bag, and you'll never think twice about how to pick it up off the table...you just do it. And the feature which is by far the best and has not come close to being emulated by windows yet is simply sleeping and waking the computer. To make it go to sleep, you just close the lid. That's it. No menu item, no power button, just whatever you are doing you close the lid and it's asleep. Next time, just open it up and in three seconds it's all back up just as it was before you closed it. None of this silly resuming windows black screen weirdness. My roommates all have PC laptops and they look at me like I'm completely nuts when they ask me how to turn of my old 1999 powerbook and I just tell them to shut the lid. But this doesn't matter to this thread because it doesn't seem that Mr. York will be using OSX much. But if it's an OS where I can sit here totally mashed and somehow manage to write what I hope to be a somewhat coherent response into this thread without really realizing it then that says something about its usability and user experience, but I digress! Haha.

So in short: premium for ibook/macbook line=not much if any, premium for powerbook/macbook pro line=yup, indeed (hey, it's metal)

We'll see what tuesday has in store! I've never bought a laptop before and only have this old powerbook cuz it was given to me by my dad (although I do bring it to class every day), but if the specs and price are what I think, then I might just be pursauded to upgrade, as I am getting to the point where my day to day experience would really benefit from a really useable laptop.

[alexyork]

that Acer 5652 does look good but the lack of XP Pro means another £90 on top, which makes it less attractive. It's also almost 3kg. The built in TV tuner does look good though. hmmm decisions, decisions!

[alanmac]

Sorry, been off line since yesterday.

Yes, I should have said Tottenham Court Road is for browsing purposes only really. I even saw so called bargains at more expensive prices than my local retailer.
Micro Anvika does seem one of the better ones with a mixture of brands icluding Apple and Acer. It's been a while since up that way, couple of years maybe, god how time flies.

When I was freelancing I'd use a appointment/briefing in London as an excuse to browse the electronics in TC Road, the design/computer books down the road at Foyles and I think its called Zemmers (if its still going).

Whatever you choose it sounds like you'll be lugging it about a bit so it needs to be well made and not too heavy.

Oh, and I'd budget in a good protective bag but not one thats screams look everybody I've got a lovely shiny laptop in here, or you may find others deciding to choose the same laptop for themselves literally !!

Alan

[alexyork]

yeh i'm going to get one of these I think:

http://www.laptopsdirect.co.uk/Targus_Second_Skinz_Notebook_covering_Medium_TSS011EU/version-1.asp

Then I'll slug that inside my regular bag, so nobody will know i've got a laptop at all. Hope it'll fit!

[maX_Andrews]

yeah that's a good idea, just get one that fits tight or else it will snag on stuff.

[fxgogo]

that Acer 5652 does look good but the lack of XP Pro means another £90 on top, which makes it less attractive. It's also almost 3kg. The built in TV tuner does look good though. hmmm decisions, decisions!

Can I ask why you want XP Pro over XP Home? From my point of view, it won't limit my graphic creation process at all, and the XP Pro additions seem to be aimed at server admin people.

Yeah the TV tuner did make me take a second glance. I don't need it at all, but it does make the purchase decision so much easier.

[alexyork]

sure, I need XP Pro rather than Home because at work when I patch into the network I don't want all the headaches of working around domains and all that nonsense, which you get with Home. With Pro you just plug in and go. I also use some software at home which doesn't run properly with Home due to some strange network limitations.

Tomorrow I hope I'm gonna get a quote from that site for the X60. If it works out less than £1150 with 2GB ram then I'm pretty certain I'll go with that. I will hold out an extra day to see what these new macbooks are like though, I promise :)

[Larzker]

I bought an Acer Travelmate with Intel Core Duo processor 2.0 GHz. Works great, no problems.

The laptop store where I got it from also repairs laptops. They only sell Acer because they said they wanted to sell the laptop that would be the least likely to need repairs. Since they've repaired laptops for years they knew which laptops had the most problems. Acer had the least.

Acer started out just making parts but then realized they should be making the whole computer.

[alexyork]

Interesting Larzker. I hadn't considered the place I'm buying from really, only the brand. I figured any problems and I would go to the manufacturer rather than the shop (from bad personal experience with rip-off shops charging both arms and both legs for a tiny repair). I'm pretty sure laptopsdirect.co.uk are good enough though.

I didn't get a quote from them today which is irritating... so back to looking at other models I think. Particularly Acer.

Cheers all

[fxgogo]

Alex, I would also try giving Kellkoo a go to find the cheapest price. I did that with the 5652 and found it for £950, and the retailer did not look bad at all.

[alexyork]

i've never gotten along with Kelkoo... i always use pricerunner and a few others. that's how i found laptopsdirect. was the cheapest price I could find it :)

[maX_Andrews]

24 hours to macbook :)

[alexyork]

haha alright alright! I'll hold off for one more day!.... these specs better be damned good :D

[JDex]

24 hours to macbook :)


Apple Insider thinks it's actually next Tuesday... we'll see tomorrow.
http://www.appleinsider.com/article.php?id=1729

[maX_Andrews]

gahhh i hope they're wrong...

[fxgogo]

i've never gotten along with Kelkoo... i always use pricerunner and a few others. that's how i found laptopsdirect. was the cheapest price I could find it :)

Yeah, I forgot about them. I have used them aswell. Between the two along with some looking you will be well served. Any news on the price for the Samsung?

[alexyork]

there's news on the samsung but it's not great...

laptopsdirect refuse to swap out the two 512mb ram sticks for a single or double 1GB stick, so basically if I wanted 2GB i would have to pay an extra £170-odd on top of the existing 2 512 sticks, and have to sell those somehow in order to make some cash back. the total price with the double RAM (and leftover sticks) will be around £1200, or around £1150 if I sell the existing sticks. doesn't sound great to me!

looks like I'll be searching for a spec which includes 2GB out of the box :(

[alanmac]

Have you checked out Evesham. They look like you can configure a machine to your requirements. Plenty of options and reviews etc on their site. At least worth looking at.

http://www.evesham.com/Index.asp?e=5E7B7B62-B336-4AB0-96AA-31849717F911

Alan

[maX_Andrews]

well no macbooks today, looks like next tuesday. You could wait depending on your needs but that's up to you.

"As recently as yesterday, the rumor mill was turning with discussions of the MacBook, Apple's Core Duo-based successor to the iBook, which was said to be coming today. However, yesterday also brought us the first inklings of a "delay" (can an unconfirmed, rumored event actually be delayed?), via AppleInsider. Today, ThinkSecret joined the delay party, and reported that due to "supply issues," the launch was postponed at the "last minute," and the new laptop won't show up until next Tuesday."
-engadget

http://www.engadget.com/media/2006/02/macbook_1.jpg
macbook mockup

[evanfotis]

I would second the Dell D820.
Also, while in London check out ADVENT laptops, they're well specked and reasonably priced. There is also RockDirect with some good gear.

[fxgogo]

... i would have to pay an extra £170-odd on top of the existing 2 512 sticks, and have to sell those somehow in order to make some cash back.

Well when I went to crucials website to see if I could buy the ram myself, and the price for a 2gig kit of 533mhz ram was £183.29 inc. VAT, and a single gig of 667mhz ram was £113.96 inc. VAT (£227.92 for 2 gigsfor those of you who don't want to add). SO the price is not bad, and I am sure you could make £20-£50 on ebay for the other ram. But like you I would love to get it swapped out at no charge or added to for a reduced charge.

Maybe some of the other retailers will do it for you.

[alexyork]

just had an e-mail back from digi-uk and they can't swap it out for free or even a discount either! so whatever happens I'm stuck with the base 2x512 sticks unless I stretch and grab a 2GB model at a hugely higher price.

I think I've resigned myself to sticking with 1GB for now and seing if I need the upgrade at some point in the future.

So it's a tossup between the X60 and X11 now.

[alanmac]

That's coz they are just box shifters. Many laptops are sold as a "package", sealed boxes, that the retailer just sells on, and have no way of doing as you ask. Its not a physical restriction on their part, or even a lack of technical expertise in some cases, but one of business model/type.


Alan

[alexyork]

right after all that debate with Samsung in mind i'm now pretty much settled on the Acer Aspire 5672WLMi (http://www.laptopsdirect.co.uk/Aspire_5672WLMi_Intel_Core_Duo_LX.A8505.026/version-1.asp) (.026 version). it has all the spec going for it and I can put up with XP home and the 3kg weight (hell, it might even be able to call dragging this thing to work 'exercise'!). it's just too good a spec for the price to miss really and it looks to be solid and well-built which is really good to hear.

£1003. £160 less than the Samsung X60 and twice as much RAM, widescreen aspect and a far better graphics card.

Any last-minute warnings away from Acer or this particular model?

And actually there is one last favour to ask... :) can anyone recommend a good online store for picking up AC adapters and other spares for Acer notebooks? I need to order a spare AC adapter for this thing ASAP so any recommendations for shops would be great.

Once again guys cheers for the advice.

[maX_Andrews]

Case you hadn't heard the macbook is out now, £749 for the following:
13.3" 1280x800 widescreen display
1.83ghz intel core duo
512MB RAM (upgradeable to 2GB)
60GB hard drive
CD burner/dvdplayer
integrated graphics intelgma 950 (bummer!)
wireless and bluetooth
magentic latch
magsafe power connector
isight webcam
appleremote
the best damn keyboard ever
2.36KG
1.08 inches thick

The £899 version bumps it up to:
13.3" 1280x800 widescreen display
2.0ghz intel core duo
512MB RAM (upgradeable to 2GB)
60GB hard drive
CD burner/dvd burner slot-loading combo
integrated graphics intelgma 950 (bummer!)
wireless and bluetooth
magentic latch
magsafe power connector
isight webcam
appleremote
the best damn keyboard ever
2.36KG
1.08 inches thick

you can get a 1GB stick of pc2-5300 RAM from offtek.com for £90, bringing the price total for the 2.0Ghz model to £990 and the RAM to 1.25GB

The intel graphics may be a big bummer tho.

Academic pricing is £705 for the basic model, £845 for theupgraded model.

[alexyork]

yeh i did look at that but really the spec of those new macbooks is rubbish for the price, compared to a regular PC-based laptop. for the same price i get 2GB ram, slot-loading DVD writer, 120GB HDD and I don't need to do any funny business to get XP installed.

they do look nice though :) (sadly, all too often I find myself saying that about apple products)

[imashination]

The macbook would be an excellent portable cg machine had it not been for the fact that it has a completely crud gfx card.

[alexyork]

and only 512mb ram :shrug: which is spread over two 256mb sticks.

[maX_Andrews]

You guys get kinda screwed by pricing because of VAT and international markup.
Here the entry-level macbook is $1099 or £600, but you have to shell out £749 for it.

Still it's very cheap for a 2.0ghz core duo notebook, but alas to keep the cost down we get the gma950 graphics and two 256MB dimms, which are basically free lol. So two 1GB sticks would run about £180 to do it yourself, so add that to the £899 dvd burnin' 2.0ghz model and you've got £1080. Granted the hard drive is half the size of the acer, and the graphics kind of suck, but it's a lot faster and a lot better put together, not to mention thinner and lighter with twice the battery life. You can also dual boot. OSX is, in my opinion, the best OS for laptops due to it's instantaneous sleep-wake modes and effective tools like expose, dashboard, spotlight, and gestures on the trackpad; all of which make simple tasks remain easy by requiring the least amount of navigation possible. You also get the ilife apps which actually make laptop's useful, like being able to compose music and edit movies from the couch, and the apple remote and frontrow, so you can change the song and remain on the couch ;-). XP is great for when you're at a desk and have time to think and focus, but I've used a lot of apple and non-apple laptops on the go, and it's two totally different experiences. It's those little things like the magsafe power connector, which eliminates paranoia about plugging in your computer in a public space, and the motions sensor that parks the HD head if you drop the computer. With the macbook you get these little things and the ability to run OSX and windows at the same time, with the acer you do not. I would like that option, but I'm not you ;-) The acer is still a hell of a deal from a hardware component perspective.

I read a review of the acer, and it seems that the big issues with it are the keyboard and battery life. Laptop Review said the keyboard was "mushy," which is never a good thing, but they also didn't say it was terrible. The big,big downside was the battery life, which was a paltry 2 hours, 15 minutes on medium screen brightness doing typical tasks. And that's really bad, especially when you take into account that in two years, that number will be down to about 1 hour, 20 minutes as the battery has "faded" due to many charge/discharge cycles which slowly degrade the cells,and you'll be doing a lotof that cause you'll have to constantly charge the thing ;) Three years from now you may get an hour if lucky. Most laptops as a baseline need more than three hours to be useful as a portable machine. The 15" macbook pro gets about 3.5. The macbook gets about 4.5,and this is with a significantly faster processor. If this is going to be used on the go a lot then this might be something to consider, and you may want to carry an extra battery, which is added weight and £.

Here's the conclusion part of the review:

I have to say I am very impressed with the performance of the Acer 5670 with its Core Duo processor. The performance boost from the dual core is anywhere from negligible to a full twofold increase, something that does not come often in the computing world. Acer puts together a nice notebook that's full of features and a pleasure to use thanks to a crisp screen and full connectivity. I would have liked to see a slightly sturdier build, but that is usual for me. The only big negative is the battery life. I've come to expect at least three hours from modern notebooks, and 4-5 is always a big plus. Running for only just over two hours under most use, the 5670 falls somewhat short. If performance is most important, however, shorter battery life is a small compromise. As a powerful desktop replacement with significant portability, the Acer 5670 excels wonderfully.

Pros:

Very fast under some circumstances
EXTREMELY fast under other circumstances
Bright, sharp, saturated screen
Good video performance
Ports are well placed
Great connectivity and built in webcam
Cons:

Short battery life
Somewhat mushy keyboard
Build quality is not top-notch.


Here's the cnet video "review" of the macbook, which isn't really a review: http://reviews.cnet.com/Apple_MacBook_13_inch_2_0GHz_Intel_Core_Duo/4505-3121_7-31884384.html?tag=cnetfd.ld3

and the editor's take:
http://reviews.cnet.com/Apple_MacBook_13_inch_2_0GHz_Intel_Core_Duo/4505-3121_7-31884384-2.html?tag=nav

[alexyork]

too late. ordered it this morning :)

battery life isn't an issue for me. in fact, I won't be using a battery at all, since I'll be using it only at work and at home, where I can use one of two power supplies. If I want to use it on the train I can without much of an issue (two hours is fine for a bit of light photoshop work on the way to work).

I've read a lot of reviews for this notebook and the general feeling was that the keyboard is fine. As I won't be doing much typing with it that's not as issue either. it's practically a render node and nothing more, which for that price suites me very well.

I just can't get excited or impressed by the macbook. I tried, really, but I can't see any real reason to own one unless you use OSX and windows together regularly, in which case it's certainly an excellent choice. for windows users on a budget after power rather than style, any notebook other than apple is probably the wiser choice buck-for-buck.

£1050 including a second power supply. should be with me tomorrow! :)

[JDex]

I hope you enjoy it Alex... give us a one week and a one month review on your experience with it if you can. We don't get enough CG-focused, non-biased hardware reviews around here. :D

[alexyork]

i know what you mean... ;)

i'll be happy to. i'll get one done next week some time and again in a month (might need to remind me to do that second one though!).

it's going to get ragged to hell this week with some very heavy renderjobs, so a baptism of fire, if you will. should put it through its paces nicely!

cheers :)

[alexyork]

well what can I say... I'm really, really happy with this notebook! i know it's only been a few days but I've used it enough to be able to write some form of short review for it already.

positives first:

for the price, the spec is simply outstanding. I spent a long time looking for dual core notebooks with a decent amount of (fast) RAM, decent HDD, good screen and a full selection of ports and features. for the price (total came to £1020 from digiuk.com includng VAT and delivery) it's just excellent.

there are more ports on this thing than Greece's coastline. DVI and VGA outputs mean multiple monitors are a doddle if you'd ever need that functionality. it comes with all the usual ports as well, so in general this thing is kitted out. the slot-loading DVD drive i thought might be a bit of a gimmick, but it's fantastic! i've known people to break their drive trays so this won't happen here.

the screen is sharp, bright and saturated. out of the box the colours are pretty screwed (I was comparing an image on my work machine, my home machine and this notebook and the notebook displayed the image far unsaturated (this is all after photoshop colour management and calibration) but tweaking the graphics card settings fixed this in minutes, so I can confidently say that the picture quality is excellent. watching movies on this is pretty good too (16ms is fine).

perhaps one of the best things about this notebook is Acer's software tools included with it. there are about 15 small packages which are all very useful indeed. the best being acer power management. you can set up profiles so when you're using the battery you can load up a quick profile for "minimum performance", saving a huge amount of battery power, or when you're on the AC you can set it to maximum. you can tweak these as you see fit, dimming the monitor, slowing the CPU down, turning off bluetooth and wireless etc etc. it's fantastic. there is a suite of other acer tools for backing up your HDDs and general system tuning, all of which are very easy to use and surprisingly useful (i usually wipe all this stuff from my systems when I buy them, assuming they're junk. not in this case!).

i can't stress how glad i am that I went for a 2GB RAM notebook. a mate of mine at work is using a very similar specced notebook but his has 1GB RAM. we loaded the same scene and mine had gotten half way to finishing rendering before his had even loaded the scene into RAM. 2GB ram really is necessary for serious work and I can't recommend it enough.

the graphics card (radeon X1400) seems fairly good for most 3D work. it's good enough for basic realtime viewport work and seems average in games for the range (read: not great, but what do you expect?).

build quality seems fine to me. some people have found the keyboard a little 'mushy' but I like it. matter of taste I guess. it looks fairly cool (when open) but the outer case isn't all that amazing to look at. the silver plastic looks a litle cheap. but who cares, really?

networking was outstandingly easy to set up. plug in and go! dead impressed. I'm able use this at work, access everyone's machines on the network and take it home and everything still works there too. XP home seems fine and my initial concerns about Home's networking limitations were quickly expelled. That's a saving of £100 for an OEM copy of XP pro right there.

wireless signal is better than my rather expensive gigabyte USB adapter I'm using on my main workstations, and the bluetooth is fine too.

for rendering (which is what this machine is for, natch) is really up to par. It faired well against my dual xeon 2.2 machine at work can you imagine... a quick test found that this notebook rendered a scene in 15 mins and the xeon box rendered it in about 10. that's 4.4ghz against a dual core 1.66. not bad at all! again, the 2GB ram will play a large part in this. i wouldn't consider anything less than 2GB really.

it's quiet! the fan buzzes away nicely (more on this later) and the CPU is running pretty cool.

now for a few cons:

this thing really is a little too heavy. at 3kg, lugging it to work (inside a neoprene skin) isn't too funny. I'll get used to it but if you have back troubles you might want to consider one of the lighter notebooks (samsung offer very light notebooks). it's not a major issue but it's something to think about...

it runs quite hot. not too hot to use on your lap by any means but it is pretty warm under heavy use. you can always use the acer tools to slow down the CPU, thus cooling the whole machine.

battery life isn't amazing. i got about 2 hours out of it on medium settings (medium CPU, wireless on, everything else off, monitor dimmed to 40%) which isn't great, but again this is a render node and therefore you'll be using it on AC almost all of the time probably, so this isn't an issue at all.

as mentioned earlier, it doesn't look amazing. if you're one of these "everything I own needs to look the daddy" people then you'll be disappointed. if you want power at a damned good price, this is a very good choice indeed.

acer's website (for drivers) is pretty poor. all the drivers for this model are listed and downloadable through their FTP which is great, but the filenames don't include version numbers so finding updates for things can be a challange. but I found that nothing needed to be upgraded at all. everything works and that's fine by me!

overall I'm chuffed to bits with this machine and I can strongly recommend it for a portable render node/workstation at a budget.

[L.Rawlins]

That was a good read. Thanks for sharing.

[mike0006]

"everything I own needs to look the daddy"

That gave me a good chuckle.

[JDex]

Great review Alex. :thumbsup:

Glad it's working out for you so well.
"everything I own needs to look the daddy"

That gave me a good chuckle.

LOL, me too!

[cooperunionstud]

dunno how much you paid but i think you could have done better with the t2500 core duo cpu.
would have improved your rendering times

[JDex]

So it's been about a month... how's it going Alex?

As an aside I spent a few hours recently looking over new Core Duo notebooks for a co-worker, and he was sold on the Acer you were looking at... it's a commendable system as well.

[705]

gee...thx for the share, really helped

I'm considering buying the MBP but afraid of the fact that Dual Core is not a 64 bit.
Is it matter?
Will it worth for another 2 or 3 year?

thx for any reply
sorry for bad english

[imashination]

gee...thx for the share, really helped

I'm considering buying the MBP but afraid of the fact that Dual Core is not a 64 bit.
Is it matter?

Can you fit more than 2 gigs in your laptop? When you only have 2 ram slots, no it doesnt matter in the slightest.

[alexyork]

this machine is still kicking ass, for sure! I've been rendering on it very heavily over the last month or so and it's as fast and stable as I'd hoped. i stand by everything i wrote in my 1-week review. i've also just discovered that i can output at full HD res (1920x1200) to my dell 24", which is a real bonus. and i bought a little HD-capable TV tuner (MSI mega sky 580), so this notebook is totally kitted out. very pleased with it, so i can definitely recommend it.

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