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pap87
04-24-2006, 04:14 PM
Hello all :wavey:
I decided I've have enough with 3D for the time being and thought I might get back in touch with 2D to get some good practise :arteest:and for a bit of variety. Anyway I drew a woman (omg! how original!) in the hope i could improve my weakness, which is proportions. I gererally don't have this problem when drawing males, ...nope, the opposite sex is the difficult one. So here she is

http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f177/pap87/day1.jpg

Any crits would be greatly appreciated most notably any concerning the proportions of the girl. Right now the only thing i can spot out is that the neck may be a bit too long but then she is kind of lifting her head up high,.. sort of... So what do you think? Am i onto a good start or should i just go back to the drawing board? I'm sort of a noob with Photoshop (oh, yeah i forgot to mention i use PS CS2), but there's no need to be gentle with me. :twisted:

offbeatworlds
04-24-2006, 05:09 PM
Ok, I like the girl's expression it's really cute. However, the skintones are WAY too saturated. Too orange. Try to tone that down, and instead of highlighing with yellow or orange try with cyan or blue, something cooler. It will really, really help out.

As far as proportions go...well, I'd say that you're doing pretty good as far as that. Her shoulder is perhaps a bit too squarish. And I don't think it's that the neck is too long, rather than it's a tad too thin. Maybe thickening it up might help.

Other than that I like what you have so far!

slickgreekgeo
04-24-2006, 07:26 PM
I agree about the skintones, I suggest Enyala's tutorial found on her website, it really helped me with skin tones, makes a huge difference. Hope this helps, it's lookin great.

pap87
04-25-2006, 08:52 AM
Thanks very much for the help people. :)

After several more hours of touch up and additions (I am sloooow) here is what I have come up with.
http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f177/pap87/girl2.jpg

Like you suggested Sylanya I used some light blue in the over-saturated orange areas to neutralise them and it works quite nice. I will at the end further desaturate all the skin but i still want that natural orange/brown tone. I like the eyes better blue to contrast with the skin colour. The hair will be black. And by the way I am not using any reference whatsoever so I'm surprised the proportions came out acceptable. Oh, I thickened the neck up a bit, although in the end it is going to mostly get covered by a thick strand of hair. I forgot about the shoulder though, it will be fixed in my next post. In my last work the nose was incredibly small, is it OK in this one?
slickgreekgeo- Thanks. Hristos anesti and hronia polla for your name day too. Your WIPs are crazy! :thumbsup:

pap87
04-26-2006, 02:46 PM
After a couple of hours I came up with this.

http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f177/pap87/day3.jpg

Sorry about picture size, I just had to find a way to show the details. Yes, after a couple of hours drawing microscopic lines (with the mouse too) my hand may someday recuperate from it's shock.
So what do you people think?

PS. when I convert to jpeg the picture becomes much more orange, just wanted to make that clear before you comment on it...

frostblade
04-26-2006, 03:32 PM
Damn nice for work with a mouse. *throws tablet in the bin

It doesn't look too orange to me, looks better than the before version.

The colours are pretty nice and the blending is good :)

Nehym
04-26-2006, 03:50 PM
I totally agree with frostblade; she's gorgeous right now. I really do like her expression and the color variation she has on her skin right now, looking very lovely and fresh. But i guess now it's the turn of the hair eh? :)

For now, i think it might be a little stiff, you should try to make it more supple and try to also had variation in it's color. Black hair do have variation too. :) You could use a dark purplish-blue or even a very, very dark burgundy in some places.

She's gorgeous so far though. Keep it up!

Bohh
04-26-2006, 04:29 PM
Everything is coming along great! Only issue I see is her hand. It looks kind of manly, (forgive me!) and it also looks kind of contorted.

Everything else is great though!

Irate-Velociraptor
04-27-2006, 07:34 AM
I love the eyes and the hair:thumbsup:

The expression on the face looks a little weird though and she has a fingernail that looks like its about to fall off.

pap87
04-27-2006, 12:05 PM
Thanks so much for the feedback people. I'll do what i can to fix up those gangly fingers. I was contemplating whether i should actually keep them or crop the image and not even worry about them. As for the hair, it's a shame if it looks stiff. But i'll definitely go about getting some variation though i'm not entirely sure on how i would go about that. Ah well, that's the fun of experimenting isn't it? If it looks bad just do it again. That fabric is gonna kill me though... no reference :sad:. Well here goes....

slickgreekgeo
04-27-2006, 12:22 PM
That's a huge improvement, keep it up!

pap87
04-27-2006, 02:26 PM
Here's what I've done since my last reply.

http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f177/pap87/day4.jpg

The skin looks better from about 50% size. The bottom left pic is 100% and you can see how poorly done it is.
However, I did make some adjustmens according to your judgements. I put some colour variation in the hair. I must say it looks better, so thanks for the tip Lilie. About the stifness of the hair, hmm... that would be kind of difficult to correct. I'm assuming you mean the back bit where it looks kind of frizzy, or perhaps the whole thing? In that case ... :sad: GULP.
Bohh- Please do not feel afraid to tell me whatever you think, that's the best way for me to improve.
Irate Velociraptor- Glad you like the hair. As for the face, weird or not I'm too afraid to touch it now, so I'm sorry :shrug: but it's gonna stay that way.
slickgreekgeo- Thanks alot dude.
As for the comments on the fingers, thanks to you all, I did what i could to correct them. I guess i could still do more to fix them. The first thing to do would be to make them darker because where they are they wouldn't receive much light. The nails will get coloured properly as well. Oh and i darkened some of the lip area because it was practically glowing.
Well, am i getting anywhere? :hmm:

Lman
04-27-2006, 03:35 PM
nice work so far, but for the hair over the face looks like its very dry and week. you chould clump more strands together with more define hair lines and a few stray strand the hair should look better.
mabe add some blue/cold tones to shaded skin this will make her less orange looking.


good work well done.

pap87
05-06-2006, 09:19 AM
Finally got around to working on this some more.

http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f177/pap87/day12.jpg

I didn't like the skin at all, so I worked some more on it. I also clumped the strand of hair on the face together a bit. And I worked on the fabric. The first time it was terrible so I got rid of it and tried a second time. I must say I'm happy with it.
I would also like to put a background. Does anyone have suggestions, because i have absolutely no idea what to put. Feel free to crit on anything you see here. Surely I've been harsh enough to some of you on more than one occasion that you'd be more than eager for some payback ... :)
So what do you think?

Runecaster
05-06-2006, 12:29 PM
Hey Pap :) You haven't been harsh to me, indeed you helped me a lot!

I like watching the progress here, the skintones came out amazing I must say, really well done there, I'd like to know how you did :)

The fabric too, wow!

Only thing is, her nose/upperlip are so small in comparison to the rest of her face, she looks a little comic-like, or unrealistic... but that's totally OK if that was intentional... it doesn't bother me as much in the finished piece as it did when that was all you could see. She must be kinda young right? No boobs anywhere... but that's ok, she looks young...

I think for not doing this a lot you really have a knack. Good work!

pap87
05-06-2006, 01:32 PM
LM, thanks very much for the reply, and I'm glad I was of some assistance to you.
I should have saved in more regular intervals so i could show you how i do my skin.
I tend to have that problem of drawing noses too small, but up till now no one mentioned it so i assumed it was ok, I'll see what i can do to fix it.
I am trying to get her realistic so i guess i'll be fixing the upper lip too. But I'm surprised that as a woman you would suggest i make the boobs bigger. I just assumed that from this view you wouldn't see much of them. I was thinking the cloth covering them was overly bulged as it was, I guess i was very wrong! I don't know if i'll actually change anything there though. Maybe next time, haha.
Thanks very much for your comments, they are most useful! :)

pap87
05-07-2006, 05:48 AM
LabyrinthineMind - you asked how i did the skin. I find this approach quick and easy.

http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f177/pap87/allsteps.jpg

The colours on the sides are all i use. Brush is just the smooth round one. Since i work with 3D i try to emulate the same principles in 2D. The colours i used here and the way i layered them is similar to the way skin materials work in 3D.

1- Flat colour, second in the colour swatch i have.

2,3 & 4- With a soft brush and 1% flow i added the darker tones choosing the next colour down each time.

5 & 6- Used blue to desaturate the oranges and make highlights. Made really strong small highlight with white.

7- Same brush, using the two darker colours, turned on scattering and opacity and flow jitter, some colour jitter, brush mode set to multiply drew in some freckly thingies to get some blemishes.

8- Same as 7 only much smaller brush size.

9- Manually drew in some moles.

10- New layer. Same brush as in 7 & 8 but white colour drew all over the highlighted spot.

11- Duplicated that layer and with a big soft edgedbrush ( no scattering or anything ), mode set to clear, cleared away the edges to soften them up and have only the centre of the highlight left untouched.

I tried to show you in a way that you might be able to use it for any part of the body. If there's anything you don't understand don't hesitate to ask. I rushed when i drew this up so, I may have missed something. I'm sorry if it's crap and doesn't look like skin, but this is the approach i took with the girl. It's unorthodox when compared to other people's approaches with black and white first then colour. I just hope it helps you, or anyone else.

pap87
05-07-2006, 06:33 AM
And i altered the face like you suggested LM. Thanks again for your comments because they really helped, the face looks much better now i believe.

http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f177/pap87/day13b.jpg

Another thing i did, i also darkened the hair. It looks much more thick and black now, because i put a background colour behind everything to test something and it turns out the hair was partly transparent, because the background was showing through.
What do you think now?

Runecaster
05-07-2006, 01:55 PM
Wow the way you do skin really looks good - and I don't know if there is anything considered unorthodox in art - I mean it's the result that counts, right? Thanks so much for taking the time for showing me that, it helped a lot - I really love the texture you achieve, it looks really good!

Haha! All women aren't prejudice to the fact that some male artist's make huge boobs on girls. It doesn't particularly affect me in any way, so I don't care one way or the other - I just noticed that she didn't have hardly any or none, so thought she was young.

Good change on the nose and hair too! I suggest (as I've been told myself) to perhaps never work on a white canvas, because it messes with our perception of color something fierce.

This is looking really good :thumbsup:

jabrawle
05-08-2006, 02:55 AM
the sense of light seems to be right, keep working on it and it should be a nice piece

pap87
05-12-2006, 12:16 PM
Well, nice or not, it's finished. I refuse to work on it any longer as it will just chew up my time. It's been about 18 hours of work for this, can't say for sure, but something like that.

http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f177/pap87/girlfinished.jpg

There's always that problem of the colours changing when I upload it, it gets much darker. So if the blacks don't look rich enough it's because i had to increase the brightness of the pic. To comepensate i also upped the contrast but that makes the highlights a but too harsh. Anyway it was driving me crazy so I'm leaving it at that. It was thouroughly enjoyable working on it and thanks to everyone that had a look and helped. :thumbsup: You're the best!
Till next time.

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