EasyGlass test

[rush123]

Nice example AAAron,

Hope you don’t mind me posting in your thread.

Here is my quick test with EasyGlass from THLPro, the spherical objects in the rear are the objects inside the spheres at the front and there are being bent/magnified by the glass material.

R

[ThomasHelzle]

Ah - Nice! :thumbsup:

Now we should bug Taron a bit if he has ideas how to speed up Glass rendering in messiah - if you tried out the example scenens, you will have noticed how slow it can be...

Keep those images comming! :bounce:

Cheers!

[AAAron]

Nice example AAAron,

Hope you don’t mind me posting in your thread.

Here is my quick test with EasyGlass from THLPro, the spherical objects in the rear are the objects inside the spheres at the front and there are being bent/magnified by the glass material.

R

Not at all, I´m very interested in seeing others results with the TLH pro shaders/nodes :bounce:

[ThomasHelzle]

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[MoodyB]

Simple but very nice :)

I'll need to remember and order TLHPro at some point.

[Gyuru]

:applause:

[Andreseloy]

What is TLHPro, and how it work?

Thanks in advance

Andreseloy

[ThomasHelzle]

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[rush123]

More quick tests from me, these are some glasses that were rendered in Messiah 2.4 using ‘Easy Glass’ and ‘Ray Type’ nodes from Thomas’s great TLHPro shader collections. Thanks go out to AlexK and Thomas for guidance and assistance, and of course pmG for Messiah


http://img79.imageshack.us/img79/5243/glass026dm.th.jpg (http://img79.imageshack.us/my.php?image=glass026dm.jpg)

[stooch]

hmm, is it me or is there something a bit off in these renders? im not seeing the glass thickness at the edges and the bottom as well. there should also be a hard edge caused by the refraction of the back crease of the inside bottom of the glass.

what refraction values are you using?

[ThomasHelzle]

Agreed, those look a bit off. Are the objects doublesided?
It may also help to have some structure on the floor to better be able to identify the problem.

Send me the scene if you want and I will have a look.

Cheers,

[rush123]

Stooch. Thanks for pointing out the anomalies, my refraction values are incoming 1.52 and outgoing 1.00001., I think the problem is more likely geometry, which I will go and look at.

Thomas. I think it time for you to do some technical tutorials, I’d certainly buy. Thanks again and file has been sent.

[ThomasHelzle]

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[Wireframes]

wow !

well done Thomas :thumbsup:

[rush123]

Thanks Thomas,

Yeah, the mesh was thrown together (my bad), couple of spline lines, sweep, and cap, took longer to type the file name than make the mesh :)

I do remember that caustics were odd when I was experimenting all that time ago, got it work, but didn’t know how.

Sorry you can't post that scene because of the hdr files and I didn't get permission from the owner of those files. But if on the other hand you did replaced the hdr files it should be possible, I just need to confirm. In the mean time thanks again for you help and I’m looking forward to the file.

R

[ThomasHelzle]

I have replaced the HDRI and deleted all the ones you used.
I remodeled the glass so there shouldn't be much problem left.
BTW. Those HDRIs are basically public domain by now I think, they are freely available on the web since 99/2000 and also come with Lightwave and other software.

If you are okay with it, I would like to post the file for the public.

Cheers and thanks, I learned a bit more about the wicked ways of the messiah today.

:bowdown:

[rush123]

There's one more caveat, my commission payment on TLHPro sales. :)
That’s fine Thomas, please post, hopefully more people will contribute to the community and post work and tests so we can all learn,

R

[ThomasHelzle]

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[PaulNewman]

phantastischsten!

super geil!

am schönsten!

[Wireframes]

Not so good as Thomas ...

but here is my little test :

http://img126.imageshack.us/img126/4785/glasstest0cu.jpg


Phil

[rush123]

Hey Wireframes,

Thats cool ! thanks for sharing

R

[ThomasHelzle]

Great! :thumbsup:

One suggestion though: Do you have shadows active? The glass could use a bit more contact to the surface...

Keep it coming :bounce:

[Wireframes]

Thanks rush and Thomas :)

Shadows is on, and glasses are in contact with floor. But you're right --> I must improve it a little bit with better lights.

It was just a speed testing with your TLHPro Easyglass (taking about 1H30 to do it) ;)

Question : Have you some tips about caustics ?

Phil

[stooch]

Oh well, you will not get rich with such a commission - neither do I. My normal daily rate is higher than my total sales so far from TLHPro. Don't fool yourself, messiah is a hardly existing market.... ;)

I now rendered the scene with caustics:



This was even slower: 21 minutes.

Download the file here:

drinking_glass03.rar (http://www.screendream.de/stuff/drinking_glass03.rar)
You will need TLHPro to fully use it, but the basic principle may work without it.

And a version with a bit of photoshopping:

Now we just need a corkscrew, a bottle of wine and some baguette :-)

Cheers! :bowdown:

now taht looks much closer to real glass :)

[ThomasHelzle]

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[rush123]

That cool Thomas.

"BTW. I don't think I fully understand the hard black rings in the shadows"

light ->shadow ->soft shadow quality. Will improve shadows. On the first posted it was set to '0'

R

[ThomasHelzle]

I didn't want soft shadows in this scene. Setting Soft Shadow Quality was the only way I found to get hard raytrace shadows. First I tried to set the Disk Size to 0, but then Caustics don't work.

And I still don't understand why a fully transparent object has such sudden, hard, black shadows somewhere, when everything else is working as expected?

Wireframes: I am new to Caustics too, used them the last time ~2 years ago, but here is what I found so far:

- They react very strongly and (IMO) non-logical to the spotlights Disk Size. The bigger the Disk Size, the brighter they become. The logical part is that a bigger Disk Size makes them more diffuse/spread apart.

- Diffuse seems to have no influence on caustics.

- Surface color has - again very illogical for me - a massive influence on them. Even with Diffuse at zero, a white surface color will give you very bright caustics and a dark or colored surface will give you none or colorized caustics, even if you can't see any color in the rendered glass object because of missing diffuse.
This is all upside down and I already talked to Taron about it, so it should become more intuitive in later versions.

- Transparency Tint is a good way to get glass with a slight color and it also colorizes the Caustics (I used it in the blueish images above).

- For crisp Caustics don't use too high Gather Radius and Gather Count, otherwise you may loose some structure. You have to find a balance between every Photon being visible as a dot and a boring but smooth interpolation...

I hope this gets you going.

Cheers,

[Wireframes]

Thanks Thomas for your tips :bowdown:

[ThomasHelzle]

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[chikega]

Hi Thomas,
It's been a while for me ... I'm just getting a chance to take a look at the state of messiah after a year-and-half break and I noticed your new shaders ... very nice! I remember playing with caustics a while back and it seemed to me to be very counter intuitive. I vaguely remember the Environment determining the color of the transparent shadow. :shrug: I remember bringing that point up when beta-testing - but no one ever commented on it .. oh well.
I have modo 103 and I'm looking forward to the eminent release of 201 ... I have to say the examples (http://forums.luxology.com/discussion/forum.aspx?id=2) being posted by the beta testers are some of the best in the industry. The SSS and glass examples simply are off-the-charts photoreal!!!

http://content.luxology.com/modo/201/img/modo201_BrederockGlass.jpg

I'm looking forward to playing with it. Although I'm not too crazy about the Layer philosophy Luxology has adopted. I had gotten so used to the brilliant simplicity and power of nodes in messiah.

[ThomasHelzle]

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[chikega]

Glad to be back! I just downloaded messiah 2.4d and I can see many improvements but I'm a bit dissapointed that some problems remain (i.e. not being able to move the camera in local mode from within the viewport itself) I also just tried moving a spot light along Z in "O" mode within the view port and it just rotates. So, I'm relegated to having a split view to move the camera and lights on their local axes in the Perspective viewport. :shrug:

I was just looking at your TLHPro manual and was just thinking that your Thickness shader would be the ticket to getting the density of the glass that modo 201 is showing. Good to see we're on the same wavelength. I'd have to agree with you on XSI - very convoluted to get results but a nice all-one-app for sure. I believe we're both in the same camp of being mostly illustrators - so, modo looks very promising. It'll be interesting when they release their SDK to see what you think of it.

As an aside, I was just checking out a glass shader by Nitisara for LW in the NT thread (http://www.newtek.com/forums/showthread.php?t=50596). Some nice results.

[Labuzz]

AoN for modo!:bounce:
Can t wait to try the renderer too!:)

[ThomasHelzle]

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[chikega]

My weapon of choice ... hmmm... uhhhh... don't really have one favorite as of yet. But I do need to choose a couple and stick with them. I feel sometimes as though I've spread myself too thin ... knowing a little about every app but the master of none. There are some things I like about app X, but love in app Y and then app Z has a killer this or that. In an ideal world I would just mix and match what I loved about each, blend them together, and then things would be lovely. I use LW/Fprime the most for rendering b/c of familiarity and I have Sasquatch and a zillion other plugins. So, I feel compelled to hang on to it a bit longer. We'll see what the 9.x cycle brings to the table.

But if I had to choose just one ... right now, and money was not an obstacle ... it would be XSI Advance. But modo 201 is really coming on strong. :)

[ThomasHelzle]

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[stooch]

yeah i still havent put my finger on it but i do agree that the refraction is not quite what i expected. Although for liquid sim its pretty hard to tell. ill give it a shot tomorrow as well.

[chikega]

I feel your pain, Thomas. I'm looking over the preview render and the glass that seems the most convincing of the lot are the light green glass bottles. It seems that with the red and green ones, where there is overlapping geometry, the colors are being added addtively and becoming brighter - making it appear more stylized than realistic. By the way, how do you get colored shadows?

I've been fooling around with my stomach model again - trying to refamiliarize myself with messiah - it's been a while. Here's a mottled dark chrome stomach with HDRI. :)

http://www.3ddmd.com/images/Messiah/stomach_chrome01.jpg

[chikega]

How does this glass look?
http://www.3ddmd.com/images/Messiah/stomach_chrome02.jpg

[Geco]

How does this glass look?
much better. ;)
render time/cpu?
are you using TLHpro?
do you can get the same result without TLHpro?

[ThomasHelzle]

Normal Glass isn't the problem as I showed above in the drinking glass examples. But colored Glass is quite complicated.
chikega, you are right, the overbright areas are me playing with translucency a bit, since otherwise it looked all so dull and caustics took ages while looking bad either. :-)

The best function in the new versions is the surface tinting, which allows for halfways decent full transparent glass that is still colorized - and throws colorized shadows if you enable transmissive shadows in the object.
I think I will code a "thickness in refraction direction" into TLHPro Thickness to make the absorption looking better. The Thickness shader could also use some more options like calculating thickness only for front polys (which I did in the above scene by using a DoubleSider node)...

My glass doesn't look that much different from yours, just that tiny image doesn't show much of the goodness. I really had it yesterday...
Will do a new start later on...

Cheers,

[chikega]

The above image was rendered with stock messiah. It took me hours to figure out how to have the glass react correctly. I essentially used the old Lightwave way (http://www.happy-digital.com/freebies/tip_glass.html) of doing glass. For whatever reason, the air polygons, within messiah has to be set to .99999 instead of 1. I came up with that number after hours of experimentation. I think Thomas and I must be masochists :). I purchased TLHPro today and I'm looking forward to putting it to good use.

I rendered one image at 640 X 480, AA Level 3, Monte Carlo -GI Samples 3, Depth 2 with with a Pentium IV 3Ghz ( I can't believe it's almost 3yrs old now). It took 15min14sec.

I rendered another at 1240 X 1024, AA Level 4, but with a little bit of soft reflection and soft trasparency ... at it took 1hr13min!

Something else I learned, I had to have the Ray depth set to 5 to be able to see the texture of the stomach through the glass - otherwise, the stomach object appears black. I'm guessing that this may have something to do with the extra geometry (two objects occupying the same space).

http://www.3ddmd.com/images/Messiah/stomach_bottle4ray.jpg

[ThomasHelzle]

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[ThomasHelzle]

chikega:
welcome back aboard ;)

yes, that bit about ray depth 5 needed sounds logical: there are four surfaces for the ray to go through in a bottle, so there is no ray left for the reflection on that stomach. And if the raycount is hit, the background/environment color becomes visible (or the color without reflection).

I also found that 0.9999 or 1.00001 for air-refraction is needed since a value of 1.0 disables refraction calculations... :-(

Best regards!

[chikega]

Thanks Thomas, glad to be back - but it'll be even better when you send me my TLHPro license!!! The "thickness in refraction-ray-direction" mode looks wonderful!

:bounce:

[rush123]

Thomas,

I’m reminded of that line from one of the Godfathers movies where Al Pacino says something like this “..every time I try and leave, I keep getting sucked right back in” or something like that.

Thank goodness you keep getting sucked back in on Messiah development. All I can say it wow :thumbsup: , great work, lets hope you have a relapse on your back problems so you can keep on working on TLHPro (not really)

R

[ThomasHelzle]

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[stooch]

hey, here is a cleaned up scene from LW for the reflection challenge, i made sure to put all the pivots on the bottles to make it easer to select stuff.

http://www.stooch.net/misc/ReflectionChallengeLW.zip

[ThomasHelzle]

Yeah, selecting stuff is a real pain in messiah. In scenes from external sources like this, there is virtually no way to see what is selected in the viewport and selecting in the world view is more or less a game of luck.
I think at least in wireframe mode there should be some kind of color hint on what is the current object.

Thank you for your effort, Stooch.

Cheers, :bowdown:

[svintaj]

Yeah, selecting stuff is a real pain in messiah.
I have found that AnimateImmediate is good for ordinary selection, just middle-click when the object you want to select is highlighted! :thumbsup:

/ Svante

[chikega]

Svante: Thomas is referring to scenes imported from external sources - there is no immediate highlighting, one cannot even change the draw mode of an object from wire to smooth - it remains a wireframe. Download Thomas' scene to see what we mean.

Dmitri: Thanks for you efforts, it makes it a much more pleasant experience.

Thomas: I agree with selecting things in World view, it's hit or miss when selecting. I find that I have to resort to the object list just to select lights, especially lights - it doesn't work with immediate highlighting, animate ... nada. I guess one can get rather spoiled when working in apps like XSI with very intuitive, fast and accurate manipulation of objects. modo is very nice as well ... they've even included an object (item) mode to select with. No more relegating objects to layers, or select connect.

The black shadow is something I've come across as well in my experiments - hopefully Taron/pmG is on it. The Thickness shader looks very nice ... and approximates modo's built-in Beer's Law of Absorption when rendering glass.

I've been playing with a modo 201 sample scene. It's purportedly very quick due to it's irradiance caching abilities. The below render took 46min at 640 X 480 on a Pentium IV 3.0Ghz - it shows a lil' bit of everything from depth of field, transparency, caustics, etc...

http://www.3ddmd.com/images/Messiah/8balls_modo.jpg

[ThomasHelzle]

I don't know, in this scene, the Immediate mode didn't seem to work - is it possible that objects with zero diffuse aren't highlighted or did I something wrong?
I tried several things to get Immediate working, since it was my first idea too, but no way - the meshes stayed always black.

BTW. That transparent OpenGL View is a pain as well - you just can't see anything usefull for fully transparent objects in shaded mode - I found a workaround in the meantime (setting the transparency with a separate Color node instead of in the material) but it would be cool to have an option to not use transparent GL - or an improved way of showing it over that dotted clouds of nothing ;)

Basically I would still prefer to have shortcuts for select/rotate/scale/translate that work as long as I hold them down (supra mode in XSI). I seem to be incompatible with the navigation etc. in messiah from day one - I always press the wrong buttons or drag in the wrong direction ... ;)

Well, back to coding and thanks for the reply!

Cheers

[chikega]

In one of the modo vids, Brad was addressing the very same issue concerning transparent OpenGL by placing the object's shader tree (or entire scene) underneath a solid shader that can be turned on and off when the need to to rework the geometry is in order - essentially over riding the individual objects OpenGL modes.

I thought that the Render Group in messiah could do something similar, but it's effect is only on rendering and not on the OpenGL display of individual objects. :(

The Smooth Wire mode through the Viewport looks pretty decent though and is applied globally to the scene - it will work for the time being.

[ThomasHelzle]

Ah - synchronous posts :-)

Thanks chikega for the conformation of the problems - I thought I go crazy once more...

So you're a modo-betatester?

46 minutes doesn't sound completely out of reach for other renderers. So at least they didn't find the holy grail of speed yet :)
Do you happen to have it rendered without DOF too? The blurry look makes seeing the features a bit hard, but it sure looks great.
I don't know if you are allowed to talk about it, but what do you think so far?
I too found the material layer idea from the online video weird for everything but rather simple scenes - I can't imagine how you are supposed to work with 500 surfaces... ;) Is it manageable?
Any good ideas that I should include in TLHPro until modo comes out >LOL<

EDIT: Be all carefull with RenderGroups. They can really slow renderings down. I thought they would overwrite underlying materials completely without noticeable overhead, but lately I had a scene which rendered very slow without reason until I assigned the material to each object individually instead of putting it onto a rendergrop on top of the original materials. And it was all 100% opaque so it shouldn't have been bothered with the underlying textures... :shrug:

Cheers and thank you! :wavey:

[chikega]

modo 201 was released yesterday - so, I've only been playing with it for less than a day. So, far from what I can tell, the rendering time seems well within reach of other renderers. Other users have been expressing how much quicker it is than LW and/or Fprime.

As far as layers goes, I haven't played with it enough to have an opinion. I'm a bit disoriented. But, I did notice one situation where it may be quicker than plugin nodes. For instance, if I wanted one procedural texture node to drive four materials in modo, I would just place the proc. texture node above the four materials - instead of clicking dragging and dropping four times in messiah.

The interactive render preview is very very nice ... it's like having VIPER, G2 and Fprime, combined in LW.

The layers can be organized, labelled and collapsed, so it feels like working with Explorer in Windows - There are tons of vids showing off it's virtues on the Luxology forum - so, if it intriques you, check it out.

P.S. Thanks for the heads up with Render Groups

[stooch]

you know that modo 201 is out right?

[ThomasHelzle]

I did completely miss that release... LOL :rolleyes:

I don't own modo anyway and don't plan to buy it, but I sure will have a look at those vids. Always nice to see something new...
Sometimes I can extract ideas for my own tools for messiah and XSI from such inspiration :)

Well, keep us posted about what you find!

Cheers,

[stooch]

oh i will keep you posted too, getting my copy asap!

[chikega]

You've got the right idea, Thomas, by sticking with one or two apps and being done with it. I'm all over the friggin' place ... when will the madness end!?:eek:

[Mike RB]

Gary, I made that sample scene. :) I believe it dosent use irradiance caching. Try leaving DOF on, and just unchecking blurry reflections from the gold metal ball, and try turning ON IC with 2 bounces, 1024 rays, 5 rate, and 6 interp values. The render wont be quite as accurate, but you'll see a difference in rendertimes for sure. Post your results.

[chikega]

Hey Mike,
You've done some beautiful beta test renderings with modo 201! I'll try out those settings - I'm currently rendering the same scene without Depth of Field. It's interesing how the camera works like a real world camera - I locked down the F-Stop to 11 to increase the depth of field. It's rendering now ... and appears to be about the same 46 minutes. But the details are much sharper now ... for Thomas' viewing pleasure. :D

OK, it actually took a little longer:

http://www.3ddmd.com/images/Messiah/8balls_modo1.jpg

[ThomasHelzle]

Hehehe - Well, I learned that the hard way over the years - that's the good part of growing older, although I could do without the back ache right now... :)

I am very easily distracted since I am interested in almost everything ;)
So I had to establish an input-reduction-policy to be at least halfways productive.
The second part grew over the years with added frustration over software and what it promises. I've been through like 15 3D Tools alone and just had it after some time. I accepted that there simply is no Tool that is good in every area.
Lightwave/messiah was for a long time the cheapest workhorse available (it never made sense to me to spent thousands on something that you already know it will be only hundreds some years later, like the first DVD authoring tools) that I now replaced with XSI Foundation mostly. It can't become much cheaper than that.
Since I also do coding, writing, compositing, design, websites and many other things, 3D isn't even the only area I have to know (and pay for), but for most other stuff I rely on Adobe and that makes it easier since they have rather logical workflows - and their stuff is very good in most areas.

But somehow, the XSI/MentalRay SDK isn't inspiring at all to me. While AoN|XSI is basically working for my inhouse needs and I wrote a almost complete base material to replace their dead boring idea of surfaces, there are things like copyprotection and other issues that would need a massive effort to work across company networks with mixed win/linux and 32/64bits machines. I am simply gunshy since I don't want to spend my life with finding solutions to obscure software problems of that magnitude.
And it is funny, but nobody seems to really love Mental Ray at Softimage, it feels orphaned in a way, it works very reliable, but it isn't really sexy. messiah has that sexy-bit set IMO and with the latest development, I really look forward to using it more again.

So please, take my occasional rants with a grain of salt. I know I can be rather grumpy at times :) :banghead: :rolleyes: :shrug:

[ThomasHelzle]

Hey mike!

Nice to see you around here! I was extremely impressed by your glass examples and they were very inspiring for my tool development. :thumbsup:
I hope you didn't mind me posting your image here as an example and goal for messiah?

Since you have more practice with modo 201: where do you personally see strengths and weaknesses?

Chikega: nice, but still a bit blurry? Or am I overcritical?
We would have to create the same thing in messiah to really compare it...
Seems rather slow to me in this configuration? What does take the most time here?

Cheers!

[chikega]

Simplicity, simplicity, simplicity ... - Henry David Thoreau

I think you and Henry may have something there. It's funny, I worked with Softimage:3d back in 1995 when Mental Ray was still an "alternate" render engine. How things have changed and XSI is now sooo totally dependent on MentalRay. I guess Softimage thought it was a good move at the time - hehe. But since then, rendering engines have popped up left and right - some very nice ones and some that are even free. The results with Blender's Elephant Dreams comes to mind. Interesting times ...

I believe the blurriest aspect of the rendering may be the image map which may not be of high enough resolution to stand up to more scrutiny.

[Mike RB]

I'll write a longer reply later, but Gary, try dropping your AA samples to 8 instead of 32, without DOF you don't need as many. Should help the rendertimes significantly.

[chikega]

Thanks Mike - I've been going through the video tutorials - unbelievable I show 2.16GB worth of documentation. Luxology and the beta testers, you being one of them, have really worked hard and deserve a lot of credit. :applause:

Mike is right, it's all about tweaking the settings. I rendered this whiskey glass scene and it rendered very quickly at 1min 21sec!!! And the results ... well ... just .. speak ... for ... themselves. OMFG. I feel like I'm cheating, it's so easy to make nice glass in modo. Shouldn't this be harder?

I tried to replicate this scene in stock messiah ... and it was a flat out no-go. Two polygons occupying the same space is OK (glass and air polys), but having a third (the liquid) caused artifacts. So, to be able to even attempt glass with liquid in messiah would require TLHPro.

http://www.3ddmd.com/images/Messiah/WhiskeyGlassModo.jpg

[chikega]

Thomas, since this is what we're trying to shoot for... :thumbsup:

The whiskey liquid shows some of the same characteristics as your twisty-glass thingy. The color fades as the object grows thinner or where the rays are penetrating less inner-object distance. I can see your plugin being very useful for this effect. You also may be able to derive some information from these settings for the glass. Modo has a built-in Absorption Distance setting based on Beer's Law of Absorption. Is this something that's possible with TLHPro? Similar perhaps already?

http://www.3ddmd.com/images/Messiah/modoglass.jpghttp://www.3ddmd.com/images/Messiah/modoglasstrans.jpg

And for the liquid:

http://www.3ddmd.com/images/Messiah/modoliquid.jpghttp://www.3ddmd.com/images/Messiah/modoliquidtrans.jpg

[chikega]

Thomas: Here's the whiskey project (http://www.3ddmd.com/download/Whiskey_glass.mpj) file, if you get a chance, try out your shaders on the liquid/glass combination - I'll be going on vacation to New Mexico and Arizona for a week ... so, I won't be able to play with all these new toys. :( I have to spend some time with my girl friend. I think she want's to strangle me or my computer ... maybe both.:eek:

"OK... OK... I'm getting off the computer ... sheeze..."

[Mike RB]

Blurry reflection off on the dull metal ball
AA samples set to 4
DOF off
GI bounces reduced to 1
IC on
128 ICrays
5 ICrate

you lose the caustics that come from having more rays (more accurate sampling), but as you can see the rendertime is pretty good....

http://www.elementvfx.com/WebDemo/fast.jpg

[stooch]

You've got the right idea, Thomas, by sticking with one or two apps and being done with it. I'm all over the friggin' place ... when will the madness end!?:eek:

hopefully with modo 301 ;)

[Wegg]

Wow.

http://www.eggington.net/%7Ewegg/RenderTests/Balls.png

That was sure a humbling experience. I thought this would be a very
easy scene to replicate. . .

Where to begin. . .

I guess the most obvious would be to ask. . . what the !@#$#$ are all
those little white dots!!?! Especially on the top ball! Man thats
ugly. Is it the ball that is emitting light? Is it the HDRI image I'm
using to light the scene!?!

I'm not getting the Glass thing. Thomas? What am I doing wrong?
Besides not using your shaders. :-)

Blurry reflections. . . yea I could have cranked that up.

Caustics. . . just didn't work. Everything would just turn out white.
Caustics and HDRI lighting don't like each other or something.

Frustrating.

If anyone else wants to have a try. . .

Link (http://www.eggington.net/%7Ewegg/RenderTests/Balls.mpj)

[Mike RB]

Ouch. I'm not familiar with the messiah renderer, but can you just crank up some rays, or sompling, or somthing to lose the white dots?

[Tama]

Wow.

http://www.eggington.net/%7Ewegg/RenderTests/Balls.png

That was sure a humbling experience. I thought this would be a very
easy scene to replicate. . .

Where to begin. . .

I guess the most obvious would be to ask. . . what the !@#$#$ are all
those little white dots!!?! Especially on the top ball! Man thats
ugly. Is it the ball that is emitting light? Is it the HDRI image I'm
using to light the scene!?!

I'm not getting the Glass thing. Thomas? What am I doing wrong?
Besides not using your shaders. :-)

Blurry reflections. . . yea I could have cranked that up.

Caustics. . . just didn't work. Everything would just turn out white.
Caustics and HDRI lighting don't like each other or something.

Frustrating.

If anyone else wants to have a try. . .

Link (http://www.eggington.net/%7Ewegg/RenderTests/Balls.mpj)

I thought the latest rev was supposed to fix the white dots. Not looking very good esp compared to Modo's fantastic looking renders.

[chikega]

Wegg: After running a few tests on your scene, it appears the white spots are due to the particular HDRI map you've chosen, I noticed that you have it set to .15, a very low setting - this is a very hot map if there's such a thing.

I turned off the Blurry reflection on the Gold sphere to save on render times. For colored glass, you may try using Tint to Surface Color next to the Transparency setting instead of lowering the transparency setting to capture the diffuse color. But even in this case, the white dots are tinted red.

http://www.3ddmd.com/images/Messiah/Spheres1.jpg

The white dots are not from the Glowing Sphere as shown below:

http://www.3ddmd.com/images/Messiah/Spheres0.jpg

Note how the white dots remain even after lowering the HDRI map to 0.0 setting:

http://www.3ddmd.com/images/Messiah/Spheres2.jpg

Below, the HDRI map has been turned off and a constant color is being used instead - no more white dots:

http://www.3ddmd.com/images/Messiah/Spheres3.jpg

I used the alternate HDRI map in your list and it shows no white dots either even at 1.0 setting:

http://www.3ddmd.com/images/Messiah/Spheres4.jpg

I also noticed that the GI Noise Reduction does get rid of the white dots - but the downside is that the objects no longer appear grounded but floating. I would like to have made some additional changes like tweak the reflectivity using a Fresnel gradient, but I've run out of time. Gotta catch a flight this morning!!! I'll be out of commission for a week. Here's the minimally adjusted project file (http://www.3ddmd.com/download/GarysBalls.mpj).

[AlexK]

Here's the minimally adjusted project file (http://www.3ddmd.com/download/GarysBalls.mpj).
Not a very forgiving name for a scene file. But thanks for letting us play with Gary's balls while Gary is on vacation. :twisted:

[Wegg]

Tama: I'm sorry but "Not looking very good esp compared to Modo's fantastic looking renders." is a pretty bloody lame comment to make. Modo costs a buttload more than Messiah . . . and cant' even animate.

chikega: Removing the blurry reflections and changing the .hdr makes this a different scene. The point was to try and see if Messiah is capable of creating this image. . . so I can't very well go removing things for speed or changing the images used. . .

I found out what was causing the white dots. It was the transparent balls. Removing them removed the dots.

http://www.eggington.net/~wegg/RenderTests/BallsNoTransparent.png

After some more fiddling around I was able to get an image that I think is pretty close to what you can get out of Modo minus Modo's very cool/sexy glass.

http://www.eggington.net/~wegg/RenderTests/Close.png

Thomas mentioned to me he might load up this scene and have a go at fixing the glass using techniques he has come up with. That should be cool.

There are still a lot of things I'm not happy with. . . but I think this illustrates that Messiah's renderer is still very capable.

Oh yea. . . and I can animate mine. :D

And render that animation on my network. :twisted:

[stooch]

HAHAHAAHAH, the thunderous bitch slap from Wegg thundered through the halls of Moria. Dont you ever question the one app to rule them all...his prrreeeecious.

anywhoo, im about to go into the office to work, i have TLHPRO on there so ill throw them on those balls of yours.

wegg wanna share your project file?

[maks]

Just something that I noticed by doing a quick test render with Gary's scene: the white dots are much more prominent in 2.4d than in 2.4c...

[AAAron]

One thing I notice with your new more perfect render, Wegg, is the loss of the contact shadows under the balls if you compare it to the one without the transparent balls. Any ways big thanks to you and Gary for attacking the scene. Just as Stooch I´ll be happy to play with THL pro and test so a project file would be super nice :thumbsup:

[ThomasHelzle]

Hi, just some infos:

I tried out implementing real absorption and it is supercool - looks even better than the first approach with just linear thickness. That should get rid of many restrictions in messiah! :bounce:

Instead of putting it into the TLHPro:Thickness shader, I decided to include it in EasyGlass directly, since even fully transparent glass has some kind of absorption - you see it most clearly on the outer edges where even normal glass is deep green.

Slowly Easy Glass goes away now from being really easy, since there are some settings needed for it to stay as flexible as I want it to be.
You need to be able to decide if you want thickness measured only for the Front Polygons or for the back also, you may want to use different Ior for the Absorption in Refraction Direction etc.
I personally prefer flexibility and power over one-click solutions, since I often not only want to simulate reality, but also to be able to create effects that reality can't offer ;)

This thread also brought me to other new ideas and revealed some problems in messiah that a special material may be able to overcome.... Very interesting times indeed.

But first I will concentrate on Glass since this is the most pressing thing IMO.

Sadly, my back hasn't gone better yet so I can't do "around the clock" shifts, so please bear with me - finishing this stuff my take a bit of time but I will keep you posted on the progress.

Cheers!

[stooch]

sounds very cool man. this is a good reason to buy the TLHPRO shaders due to the continued work on tweaking it. I feel like its money well spent and looking forward to trying your AON shaders as well :)

BTW i rendered a sequence from realflow and the render looks MUCH better then anything out of LW, especially since my shading doesnt get randomly reset and the integration is WAY better. Ill try to get it to a more reasonable file size since right now its 60 megs!

also, i wish there was a way to render motion blur with realflow mesh sequences, there is speak of vectors embedded into the sequences for blur, is that hard to get at? that would complete the connection to render realflow meshes...

[ThomasHelzle]

Great to hear that you like the tools!

I fear the motionblur is a tricky one: In a replace-object-sequence the objects aren't actually moving so you will not get normal motionblur.
Realflow therefore embeds motion vectors in the object that basically are morphs between the original state at frame start to the state at frame end.
You can try superblender on the sequence and - like you were told on the LW forum already - animate the morph per frame from 0 to 100 percent.
In messiah that can't be done in the graph editor AFAIK, but it is easy to do as an expression.
But I doubt that superblender will support that situation, since the mesh changes per frame - and mark no longer actively develops superblender :cry:

So the only secure workaround I can think of would be, to do the sequence with something like 10 times the framerate, simulate and render 250 instead of 25 fps and then do the motionblur afterwards by frameblending the sequence back to 25fps in AE.
Not really practical I fear.

But at least it would overcome the other problem with RF motionblur: Those embedded motion vectors can only be linear, so you can't get curved motionblur - with those high-fps simulations you would get perfect curved blur but with a high cost for simulation as well as rendering...

But if everything is moving in the frame, you may be able to get away without or with very little antialiasing...

Cheers

[Wegg]

http://www.eggington.net/%7Ewegg/RenderTests/Closer.png

Better contact shadows.

[Gyuru]

It may be off by Modo Standards... Still nice render Wegg...ever closer still.

[Wegg]

http://www.eggington.net/%7Ewegg/RenderTests/DOF.png

Just showing what Messiah's DOF looks like. . . since that was in Mike's first render.

I'm done.

[svintaj]

Great, still a bit noice in the blurred reflections and the displacement ball feels blurred.
How long took that frame to render?

/ Svante

[AAAron]

Better contact shadows.

A big difference, what did you do?

And a big thanks to Thomas for tweaking the glass shader even further!

[ThomasHelzle]

Removed ...

[stooch]

very nice. IT would be a great example scene to add to TLHPro ;)

[ThomasHelzle]

It will be part of the next release.

Cheers :bowdown:

[ThomasHelzle]

Removed ...

[Tama]

Those whiskey glass renders are excellent! Congrats high fives and kudos!:thumbsup:

As nice as Modo's renderings look, without the ability to render animations I'm taking a pass
until Lux and Co. get the animation feature set bolted on.

[stooch]

that render looks incredible thomas,

although im seeing a weird shape that doesnt look like it should be there on the bottom of the glass, looks like a sharp bat wing or something.

[ThomasHelzle]

Thanks.

The shape should be there actually I think. It is a magnified and deformed crossing of the gridlike wood texture. I was iritated at first too, but unless messiahs refraction is completely off (I don't compute that myself, I just set the values with EasyGlass) it should be correct.

But there are wrong things in the image, like the hard black messiah shadow bug, slightly visible to the left of the glass' bottom.

Have you done anything lately you can show? Any real realflow scenes?

Cheers,

[stooch]

here is a test render. its 9 megs though

http://www.stooch.net/video/33.mov

not perfect but better then LW (much faster too)

[ThomasHelzle]

Everything up to 20 Gig is fine with me... :)

Well, other than the flickering mesh from RF it looks great. I just love such simulations. :thumbsup: :bounce:

Would be cool to see a RealFlow render where the fluid doesn't hang in the air but interacts with something so there is more interesting reflections etc. going on.
If you happen to have a sequence lying around that I could test the new absorption with, I would be happy to do so. ;)

Edit: I just remembered that I already have that partial test sequence from the 33 in my download folder - will give that a try.

Cheers! :bowdown:

[stooch]

yeah im going to do more sims, i really dont like the density and viscousity of the current one. i will share them with you.

i actually wouldnt mind making a sim of that whisky glass :) how about dropping some ice cubes in there?

[ThomasHelzle]

Well that would be cool (Pun intended :) ) :thumbsup:

I just don't know how such a mesh will interact with the glass. In the image above, I modeled the liquid surface directly into the glass, it is no separate mesh to avoid the usual interpenetration that most of the time creates problems.
Have you tried something like that already?

It is possible that a rendertime-boolean shader is needed for such a scenario. You could then simulate the liquid with a slightly negative-bloated glass and then create a perfect collision surface at rendertime...

Well, the stream of ideas for new shaders seems never ending... >LOL<

Cheers!

Edit: Wow, this was my 1,111 posting on CGtalk. Unbelievable.
Let's have a beer :beer:

[ThomasHelzle]

Removed ...

[Mike RB]

Thought I'd give the modo glass another try, the caustics and shading at the base of the glass is due to irradiance caching issues, needed more rays, but the liquid looks nice.

http://www.elementvfx.com/WebDemo/niceglass.jpg

[ThomasHelzle]

Very nice! :thumbsup:

What kind of environment do you use? From the image it is hard to guess, but it looks like a black environment with just the floor and the lighting pane?
But then inside the liquid it looks a bit like an HDRI or something?

I think I'm still irritated by the supersoft shadow in this specific scene.
How does it look if you scale down the lighting pane to be rather tiny?

Is there an actual light in the scene or just the white polygon?

Cool stuff. :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

[Mike RB]

No environment, those are refractions in the bottom of the glass. And yeah, just the white poly right now, as direct lighting does not yet produce caustics- only indirect. Ill render one with a smaller poly.

[ThomasHelzle]

No environment, those are refractions in the bottom of the glass. And yeah, just the white poly right now, as direct lighting does not yet produce caustics- only indirect. Ill render one with a smaller poly.

Funny, in messiah it is the other way around - only direct light produces caustics.
Although I managed to get caustic like effects too with MonteCarloGI, but you need raydepths way above what is useable to see anything... For the glass it is something like 6-8...

So the green hues are from the glass absorption only?

Cheers,

[Mike RB]

yep, very slight green color on the glass. I used 60 reflections and 60 refractions in that one.... 2h rendertime. :) The other renders of this scene used 10/10.

[ThomasHelzle]

Well, I'm more and more suspicious if messiah handles Refraction correctly at all.
This is something very hard to test. But there is something about the renderings that just doesn't feel right IMO.
Anybody has an idea on how to test this?

modos refraction looks definitely more natural by default. :sad:

Speaking of reflection/refraction depth: Be warned that the Reflection and Transparency Thresholds in messiah cut of your calculations if their contribution to the output falls below those values. Makes rendering much faster, but is also a possible cause of errors.
(And it was my own request - something like a hundred years ago in the Pliocene of messiah)

Cheers!

[Mike RB]

get a glass, put water in it and photograph it on graph paper, then recreate the scene in messiah and see...

[ThomasHelzle]

hehehe - I thought of something a bit more scientifically advanced ;-)

I think I have to look up the math a bit more...

Cheers!

[Mike RB]

modo seems pretty close, you do see a lot of the bottom of the glass in the surface...

http://static.flickr.com/30/48659277_c644f2f610_o.jpg

[stooch]

Stooch: I rendered that test sequence of yours with Absorption:

I animated the color as well as the absorption. First the main color is greenish blue with a very low absorption (= a high absorption distance) and then it becomes red with high absorption (= tiny absorption distance).
The HDRI used is good old Kitchen Probe.

I think you will find EasyGlass still easy to use. The material setup took about a minute including tweaks. :bounce:

Cheers!

WOW that looks sick! I must say, messiah is my favorite liquid/transparency renderer at this time, so much faster! its so smart about how it renders only when the difference is actually worth the work! Brilliant.
Of course the TLHPRO shaders make the task of setting it up so much easier :) good stuff, i will make some liquid sims with "foreign matter" just for you thomas, lol.

[stooch]

Well, I'm more and more suspicious if messiah handles Refraction correctly at all.
This is something very hard to test. But there is something about the renderings that just doesn't feel right IMO.
Anybody has an idea on how to test this?

modos refraction looks definitely more natural by default. :sad:

Speaking of reflection/refraction depth: Be warned that the Reflection and Transparency Thresholds in messiah cut of your calculations if their contribution to the output falls below those values. Makes rendering much faster, but is also a possible cause of errors.
(And it was my own request - something like a hundred years ago in the Pliocene of messiah)

Cheers!

I agree, im not so sure that messiah gives me perfect refraction, but i digress. Honestly, if im not sure about the output, most people wont even notice :) it just feels odd, thats all i can say...

[ThomasHelzle]

Well, for me it is very important to be sure that the tools I develop depend on something that actually works correctly. Normally you take that for a given, but with the latest tests, I'm no longer that sure about the refraction.
I already thought about coding a full glass material myself, but that would possibly take quite long and may be even slower than the original messiah glass, because of overhead in the SDK...

Well, I have to work on some other jobs now but I'll try to find a testing method for the internal refraction. I want to make sure we rely on something trustworthy.

Cheers!

[ThomasHelzle]

Chikega: Did you receive my emails and your license? I didn't hear back from you so I wonder if some kind your spamfilter ate them?
I hope all went well!
Let me know...

Cheers,

[ThomasHelzle]

Removed ...

[chikega]

I've been gone a week on vacation and look at all the trouble you all have been getting into! ;)

This is looking very very promising Thomas. I've checked my email and haven't received any licensing information. :(

[ThomasHelzle]

Hi Gary,

so there is something wrong with your spamfilter I guess?
I've sent you three emails in reply to yours...
Do you have a different mail account or what can we do?

Background: Well we all knew that Microsoft is not the most highly gifted company when it comes to security or intelligence, but the latest findings gave me a rare thrill:

For a long time I wasn't able to send people who use Microsoft Messenger URLs pointing to my domain www.screendream.de. First I didn't even notice that, since neither me nor the receiver got any notification, but the messages containing that URL simply vanished.
I had some weird conversations where the other party simply didn't understand what I'm talking about, because he didn't receive the link and message...
When I realized what's going on, I asked microsoft support about it. They told me that they "don't ever filter any instant messages..."

Reality told me differently so I looked for other reasons like firewalls, webfilters etc.

At one point I told Paul Newmann from this forum about it, and after he first couldn't believe it, he started digging into it. Again, Microsoft Support denied everything. Extremely polite they mostly didn't even understand the problem. After some time the standard support realized that they can't help and forwarded the case to the technical staff. Finally I have a workaround (Thanks again Paul), but the most ludicrous result is why my domain is filtered:

It starts with .scr

Since this is the filetype of a possibly insecure screensaver, it is filtered out (without telling anybody).

I simply wasn't prepared for this amount of stupidity. If a company like MS, that half the world is relying on with their computers isn't able to differentiate between .scr and .screendream, I see a very dark middleage of communication coming our way, if Windows Vista is as "secure" as that. All the discussions about the hardware security chips etc. are getting a whole new dimension if you imagine implementations like the above.

OMG.

Btw: The workaround is to type the URL like: http://screendream.de, so no dot before the scr...

[AlexK]

It starts with .scr
...
Btw: The workaround is to type the URL like: http://screendream.de, so no dot before the scr...
:banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

[PaulNewman]

Finally I have a workaround...
Thomas left out that this whole issue took 2 months to resolve, with me getting acquainted with 1/2 MSN's support staff in the process and normally clued up people on MSN forums also clueless. The rest happened exactly as Thomas already mentioned.

If you ever wondered if all those supposed nasty ingredients in food are really such a big deal, wonder no more . . . this is the digital equivalent. You have no idea what these guys put inside the software we commonly use and take for granted as being safe, secure and sensible. :eek:

Makes you wonder what's inside messiah :twisted:

Just kidding. :)

[ThomasHelzle]

Removed ...

[AAAron]

http://img47.imageshack.us/img47/8856/imagenz5.png (http://imageshack.us)

Got some time to play with Easyglass, raydepht 8 no TIR no absortion

[ThomasHelzle]

Wow, that looks fantastic! :thumbsup:

Did everything work out for you? Any problems with the shaders?

Cheers!

[AAAron]

Thanks :)
No problems at all so far, they are really great! I´m impressed with the results my self, just made a quick shape in silo added some procedural spheres with luminosity an a point light, and POF, I got this :D I never been able to render this good looking glass before. It´s your shaders, they are magic. Love the occlution one BTW.

[ThomasHelzle]

Now that makes me very happy :-)

Are you also using the Silo 2 Beta? That is one fantastic update - really cool.

Cheers,

[AAAron]

Yep it´s really amazing, can´t wait to the next beta :love:. Never thought sculpting would be so quick. My favorite so far, is to use the move brush on a pretty low subdiv level 1 or 2, like using the tweek function on multiselect mode but even quicker.

Playing with realflow and easy glass, the results are like WOOW! I will put something up soon :D

[AAAron]

http://img242.imageshack.us/img242/1144/image3rk7.png (http://imageshack.us)

Not 100% happy with the pouring, but look at the water at the bottom, amazing:D

[ThomasHelzle]

Cooler and cooler! :thumbsup: :bounce:

Do you plan to make an animation from that? That should look amazing...

I am so excited - really... There's nothing like seeing such beautiful images and knowing that one was able to help with that. Wow. :)

Thanks a lot for sharing!

Cheers!

[Wegg]

yea that is REALLY slick. Good job dude.

[chikega]

Very very nice!!! :thumbsup::thumbsup: Two thumbs up!!!

[svintaj]

It looks realy nice! I like to see its animated!
Snyggt!:thumbsup:

/ Svante

[AAAron]

doublepost

[AAAron]

Thanks guys:D It feels like I cheeted, I was so quick to setup and the render quality are amazing. Big up to Thomas, pmG and you guys at the forum and all your render tests (cornell boxes, SSS etc.) Now I only have to do an animation..

[PaulNewman]

2 thumbs up from me too :thumbsup::thumbsup:

Really superb!

[Wireframes]

Great Job

Can't wait to see more :thumbsup:

[rush123]

Found some time to play with Easyglass myself, and was trying to achieve decent looking glass lettering against a high contrast background. I add the rendering details & times later.

http://img328.imageshack.us/img328/7048/glasstest01bp2.th.jpg (http://img328.imageshack.us/my.php?image=glasstest01bp2.jpg)

R

[Wireframes]

wow
Well done :thumbsup:

[chikega]

Very cool Ray ... it really looks like glass. :thumbsup:

[rush123]

Thanks, Wireframes and Gary.

Here is my glass and volumetric particles smoke test, using Easy glass and messiah volumetric particles. Not sure where the colour is coming from though, a question for Thomas.

http://img399.imageshack.us/img399/2559/glasssmoketest01vc5.th.jpg (http://img399.imageshack.us/my.php?image=glasssmoketest01vc5.jpg)

R

[ThomasHelzle]

Well, that color is the oily smear from your old-diesel-smoke which is simulated physically correct by EasyGlass ... :wavey:

Seriously, I have no idea. :shrug:
Without seeing your scene I can't say what's going on.
Did you try rendering particles inside something like a big glass sphere so they are fully surrounded by glass? Does that work?
Taron once mentioned that they use some special tricks to render them, so it may be something outside my reach, like blobs not having a backside at all etc.

Cool tests, keep them coming! :thumbsup:

Cheers,

[numberEleven]

Sorry, realize this is a Easyglass thread, couldn't find the original thread where I found this lightbulb, thought it might be ok here though.

Still learning lots about studio and wanted to put a render up somewhere.

[ThomasHelzle]

You are welcome to post here too, but the original thread is here:
http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?t=397313&page=1&pp=20

I think a clearer reflection would help you most - your's is very soft. The most striking glass look is often created by rather hard and contrasted reflections (see AAArons work above) since glass has a very slick surface and doesn't diffuse the incoming light much.
I would recommend a good HDRI map for your environment for starters.
That would also help your metal (BTW. Metal has colored highlights, unlike almost every other material).

It is hard to create realistic glass in messiah without EasyGlass and sometimes impossible even. To make it work, you have to make your glass surface single sided, copy the geometry and invert the normals (in your modeler). Then set the first glass surface' (normals pointing outwards) refraction to something like 1.5 (glass) and the second one's to 1.00001 (Air is mostly valued at 1.0, but messiah switches off refraction calculation when you use this value, therefore the very small offset).

EasyGlass allows you to do it right without fumbling with the geometry, since the above setup leads to problems with GI etc. (black spots for instance). It also has some other options to create realistic glass, that aren't available in plain messiah (Total Internal Reflection and Absorption).

Best regards, :thumbsup:

[rago]

Just bought TLH pro myself,
and whille using the beta 1.1 version I encountered problems with the license on my system running with an Athlon xp 3000 + processor.
well anyway I informed Thomas of the problem and though I'm certainly not the best in understanding and explaining what was going wrong, I'm a computer dummie, he was so kind in supporting me and getting to resolve the problem!

The man rocks!!!

Here is a test render, done with default settings!

[AAAron]

Here is a test render, done with default settings!

Very nice, are there any lights or a HDRI alone?

[rago]

Three lights:
two sphere simmetrical in the back that give the shadows, and a panel in front/left without shadows.
HDRI only for reflecting and just direct lightning!
Pretty fast rendering this way!

[ThomasHelzle]

rago: sorry to be so late in here, but I wanted to thank you again for your patience until I had it sorted out. So if everybody else has a problem with the beta 1.1, please let me know.

Cool rendering, especially since you did it all without the TLHPro interface since the license wasn't found ... :thumbsup:

Any new renderings anyone? :)

Cheers,

[rush123]

Funny you should ask about new renderings. The shadows are via TLHPro Occlusion node, the glass, well Easyglass node, but with layered textures in the sphere and the cube. About 14 mins to render. The shapes are one of the test files from THLpro.

http://img166.imageshack.us/img166/8432/occlusion04zu7.th.png (http://img166.imageshack.us/my.php?image=occlusion04zu7.png)

R

[rush123]

Added some caustics to the scene above.

http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/4483/caustics06tp8.th.png (http://img141.imageshack.us/my.php?image=caustics06tp8.png)

R

[ThomasHelzle]

The clear glass and the caustics look nice :thumbsup: (the colors look a bit weird on my monitor) ;)

What settings did you use for caustics?

Cheers,

[rush123]

Thanks Thomas,

the settings for caustics were as follows;

CP = 600000
CGR = 70
CGC = 200
CI = 0.5
DF= 0.3

I used one spot and HDR for reflection.

R

[ThomasHelzle]

Thanks! :thumbsup:

[rush123]

still needs some work, but i'd thought I'll post it anyway.

http://img154.imageshack.us/img154/2637/wineglasses02ab7.th.png (http://img154.imageshack.us/my.php?image=wineglasses02ab7.png)

R

[ThomasHelzle]

:thumbsup: Now that is cool!
Nice caustics and overall feeling of the scene.
Great.

Cheers,

[PaulNewman]

still needs some work, but i'd thought I'll post it anyway.

http://img154.imageshack.us/img154/2637/wineglasses02ab7.th.png (http://img154.imageshack.us/my.php?image=wineglasses02ab7.png)

RNow that is one amazing render! :thumbsup: I love it :love:

[chikega]

Nice glass and caustic effects. With a little less faceting on the wine glasses ... it'll be perfecto. :)

[rush123]

Thanks :)

R

[rago]

Yet another easyglass test!
One of those little christmas trees mini lights.http://http://img213.imageshack.us/img213/8488/miniledzw7.jpg (http://imageshack.us/)

[ThomasHelzle]

:thumbsup: Very nice - it has a great illustrative touch to it.
Did you do the glow with particles or in post?

BTW. I have a lot of work ahead of me, some really nice projects... :bounce:
So: If anyone has problems or questions regarding AoN or TLHPro, better send me a mail or a link to the thread, otherwise I may not catch it.

Cheers and keep up the great work!

[AAAron]

Nice! HDRI?

[rago]

Thanx guys,
No post, the light is actually a sphere light that bouncing inside the glass gives this effect.
The rest of the illumination is HDRI.
This is a test for a major illustration that I'll be showing as soon as I get there!

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