PS3 Pricing Revealed! (for Europe)

[ParamountCell]

that would be about £319 and £419, I kind of expected a price like that if this indeed true. I doubt the price would stop people from buying it though.

[DuttyFoot]

hey i saw that article on gamastura.com ....here is the message

A number of French consumer sites are reporting new comments from George Fornay, president of Sony Computer Entertainment France and vice president of Sony Computer Entertainment Europe, regarding the pricing of the PlayStation 3 in Europe.

The comments were made on French radio station Europe 1, and indicated that the PlayStation 3 will be available for “around €500 [$613], in the range of €499 to 599 [$612 to 734]”.

In the same interview, Fornay also confirmed that the PlayStation 3 would be launched in France, and presumably the rest of Europe, in November this year. He also repeated previous assertions that the delay of the console’s release (which in Europe actually saw its release date being brought forwards, thanks to the new policy of a simultaneous worldwide release) was due to last minute changes to the Blu-Ray format’s copy protection.

Although Sony Computer Entertainment head Ken Kutaragi has made previous vague comments about the PlayStation 3 being “expensive”, this is the most specific price speculation yet made by a senior Sony executive. However, thus far, no indication of a North American price has been made, or indeed, any official confirmation that this statement is correct.

[Titan]

They cant use "BLU RAY" as a selling point when nobody asked for it.......gamers just want the next generation of kick ass games....why do we "NEED" a blu-ray player when current formats work fine...seems like they are just trying to justify an over inflated price with some miscellaneous technology.

just my ¢.02

[Ninjas]

More Sony BS. No doubt they will soon start spreading rumors that the PS3 cost $800+ for them to produce and they are selling each unit at a huge loss. That way when it goes on sale for $500 USD you can think you are getting such a great deal. Just another example of Sony's immoral marketing team. Does anyone really believe that the release was pushed back because of changes to Blue-ray? Do they think we are retarded and can't remember five years back when they were pulling this exact same type of crap. I wouldn't believe a thing these liars say.

[tozz]

More Sony BS. No doubt they will soon start spreading rumors that the PS3 cost $800+ for them to produce and they are selling each unit at a huge loss. That way when it goes on sale for $500 USD you can think you are getting such a great deal. Just another example of Sony's immoral marketing team. Does anyone really believe that the release was pushed back because of changes to Blue-ray? Do they think we are retarded and can't remember five years back when they were pulling this exact same type of crap. I wouldn't believe a thing these liars say.
Sony is gonna do huuuuge losses on the PS3 just as they did with the PS2 and PS1, and as Microsoft did with XBOX and XBOX360.
As for the price it's around the initial PS2 price here in Europe. No problem selling it at that price range.
They cant use "BLU RAY" as a selling point when nobody asked for it.......gamers just want the next generation of kick ass games....why do we "NEED" a blu-ray player when current formats work fine...seems like they are just trying to justify an over inflated price with some miscellaneous technology.
They pulled the same stunt with the PS2, selling it as a DVD Player. Time will tell if it will work this time around too.

[havokzprodigy]

More Sony BS. No doubt they will soon start spreading rumors that the PS3 cost $800+ for them to produce and they are selling each unit at a huge loss. That way when it goes on sale for $500 USD you can think you are getting such a great deal. Just another example of Sony's immoral marketing team. Does anyone really believe that the release was pushed back because of changes to Blue-ray? Do they think we are retarded and can't remember five years back when they were pulling this exact same type of crap. I wouldn't believe a thing these liars say.

My favorite hype was the "Emotion Engine" that still cracks me up.

[ParamountCell]

They pulled the same stunt with the PS2, selling it as a DVD Player. Time will tell if it will work this time around too.

I think the reason that may have went well was because dvd players were already in circulation.

[ParamountCell]

My favorite hype was the "Emotion Engine" that still cracks me up.

oh that was hillarious, i remember when they gave us training and they wre trying to hype the emotion engine to us.

[gunslingerblack]

yeaah....if it ends up bein 600 beans i'll just save up for a new computer....

[mister3d]

I think the reason that may have went well was because dvd players were already in circulation.
Yes, but for what price?PS2 was a cheap alternative for a dvd player.The same case here.

[tozz]

I think the reason that may have went well was because dvd players were already in circulation.
Blu-Ray players will be in circulation too. The price on DVD-players was about the same as a PS2 so it was a great deal. Blu-Ray players will cost alot more than the PS3 so the same applies here. Those who say we don't need high definition video can't possibly have seen a 1080p stream (oi 1080i for that matter) running on even a fair screen.

[SpiralFace]

Yes, but for what price?PS2 was a cheap alternative for a dvd player.The same case here.

it was a cheap alternative becuase it was a rediculously cheap DVD player... I guess its better then nothing, or splurging on a reguler DVD player, but still, the quailty sucked and I hated useing the controler as a remote.

At least this Blu-ray DVD player has the cordless remote for the system.

But the reason I liked DVDs was the fact that it made Movies and TV series Cheap, but still crisp.

I'm not willing to spend another 10-20 bucks more per movie and god knows how much more for bundled series to see it on BLU-ray when I don't even have an HD TV.

Once again, time will tell what will happen.

[-Vormav-]

Yes, but for what price?PS2 was a cheap alternative for a dvd player.The same case here.
Right, but what all will you be able to use Blu-Ray for when the PS3 comes out? When the PS2 came out, there was already a pretty well-established market for DVD videos, so people actually had a reason to care about having a DVD drive. There's no guarantee that we'll ever see any major use of Blu Ray beyond PS3 games, especially considering the format battle that's going on between Blu Ray and HD-DVD. You also didn't have to buy a new TV to benefit from DVDs. Unless I can use the PS3 to burn Blu Ray discs (extremely unlikely) or play other burned Blu Ray media (even more unlikely), it's pretty useless as a selling point.
That being said, I don't think Sony is using Blu Ray as their main selling point, nor should they. Personally, I'd like to be seeing the Cell processor getting more attention right now... :shrug:

[pearson]

LOL @ the Emotion Engine.

I think this means US$600 for the base system, but what will that include? Xbox360 had bundles that approached US$1000 and they sold like hotcakes.

The strangest part to me is how they announced it...why do it over the radio, and why now? Are there no Euro trade shows that would have been better for this? (I realize GDC Europe is too late, and ECTS is no more, but is there nothing else?)

[DevilHacker]

I have been saying this for so long it is not even funny.
look forward to the PS3 being $700...
:thumbsup:

Mark my words (like so many times before)! You can also expect an 3rd Xbox 360 version that will have tivo functions, and will be sold at $499, including an internal 200GB Hard Drive and HD-DVD Burner. Also look forward to it being launched at the same time as the PS3. This will greatly benefit Microsoft, as it will already an huge library of games (when the PS3 comes out with around 6) and will have superior "new" hardware that the customers will see as an greatly better value compared to the PS3.

[Szos]

You really can't directly convert prices for goods like electronics or cars from one currency into another, but if SONY tries selling the PS3 in the US for anything above $600, they are done.

There will always be the early adopters that will throw money away on any new technology, but the vast majority of people - the people that account for the biggest chunk of the gaming market - will totaly scoff at that price, and I really don't care what they include with the bundle.

More proof of SONY arrogance.

[CupOWonton]

yeaah....if it ends up bein 600 beans i'll just save up for a new computer....

Yeah, because a new high end comp is so cheap...
Do what most smart people will do on the release date, BUY ONE ASAP, then sell it on E-bay before theyre able to ship more out. Then youll be able to buy another PS3 and afford a PC.

[tozz]

Remember, taxes and stuff in Europe are alot higher, stuff that costs $100 in the US costs $200 here (a litte exaduration, but the price differences are extreme).

Let me refresh your memories. PS2 sold out, and kept selling at $580 when it was introduced. The original XBOX sold out at $640. Both were less value then, than PS3 will be when it launches. Also, the economics today are far more forgiving today than they were then, people just seem to have more cash.
There's over 10milion people in Europe alone that will buy the PS3 @ $500-600. And after those 10m, we can probably expect a price reduction.

Dollars in this post are based on today's currency, including exchange rates. Selling Swedish kronor for USD.
Those of you who live in the US probably remember the XBOX launch price, here it was 5000sek (~640usd).

[heavyness]

Yes, but for what price?PS2 was a cheap alternative for a dvd player.The same case here.

if you really think Blu Ray disc are going to have the same impact as DVDs over VHS tapes, your mistaken. on ANY tv back then, you can see the difference between DVD and VHS. the fact only a small fraction of people have 1080 hdtv might also be a problem.

i have no dought that the DVD format will be replaced, but i don't think the general public is ready for it right now.

--> people liked the PS2 because it was a great system for the price and as a bonus, played DVD movies. i don't think people will like the fact their spending a lot for a Sony Blu-Ray player and as a bonus, its plays video games.

[PhilOsirus]

The guy did NOT even mention a price. He said it would be between the price of a video game console and a Blu-Ray player. So even if that does put it at an avarage of 600 euros, he didn't state any actual PS3 price at all. And the US doesn't end up with the equivalent of what it cost for Europe, it's cheaper in America than Europe.

And yes, the PS3 will sell well even at that price. Even more of us former teens now have jobs and are major gamers. We'll buy the console anyway. As for anyone who thinks it's better to invest in a game-oriented PC, you have to be kidding. It's now possible to use any type of controller (keyboard and mouse for example) on your next-gen console (PS3 or 360). Expect more games than ever on consoles rather than PCs, especially thanks to downloadable content and the likes. WoW on PS3 is even likely.

E3 will answer everything anyway.

[pearson]

The guy did NOT even mention a price. He said it would be between the price of a video game console and a Blu-Ray player. So even if that does put it at an avarage of 600 euros, he didn't state any actual PS3 price at all. And the US doesn't end up with the equivalent of what it cost for Europe, it's cheaper in America than Europe.

E3 will answer everything anyway.Ah, thanks for the info. I thought it was a weird way to release the price, and then to put it in a range... You listened to the audio stream, I guess?

[PhilOsirus]

Ah, thanks for the info. I thought it was a weird way to release the price, and then to put it in a range... You listened to the audio stream, I guess?

I read the transcription on Jeux-France (http://www.jeux-france.com/news15148_la-playstation-3-autour-de-500-euros.html). Basically he does say it will be more expensive than the current consoles but a great deal because of what the PS3 actually is.

There will soon be a digital media distribution boom, the PS3 sits right in the middle of it as far as Sony is concerned. Even Phil Harrison said Blu-Ray was not all there was to the PS3 (http://www.next-gen.biz/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=2609&Itemid=36), that online distribution will have a major role (since the hard drive is included in all PS3s anyway). Also, marketing teams want more space on the game disk to include demos and trailers (HD trailers that is) of any game their publishers are working on. Blu-Ray is important to the game industry.

[Sonk]

I have been saying this for so long it is not even funny.
look forward to the PS3 being $700...


ROFL, you must a one of the same so call analyst that said the PSP would cost 500 USD...

Assuming the HDD is included in the standard SKU, i would expect the PS3 to cost 350-399 USD before tax.

700? bucks? your smoking some serious green stuff... or drinking alot of Sony hater-aide.



It's not possible to use any type of controller (keyboard and mouse for example) on your next-gen console (PS3 or 360).

Actually, i remember them saying its supported on the PS3, so you can use a keyboard and mouse. Its one of the appealing features of the PS3, for a FPS i would not use a gamepad, keyboard/mouse is just superior.

I hope they show a new trailer of MGS4 @ E3, thats the only game im looking forward to so far.

I think the price of the PS3 for the US market well be annouce at this year TGS, skipping E3. I could be wrong. They dont have much in the way of launch titles though..nothing appealing( for me at least).

[rootdown]

I think what's happening here is Sony and Microsoft have noticed that people are spending $5-600 on multiple consoles and have bumped up the price points of their systems so that folks pick one or the other, rather than both. If the Revolution is cheap enough, it's going to be the default second system in every multiple console household.

[PhilOsirus]

Actually, i remember them saying its supported on the PS3, so you can use a keyboard and mouse. Its one of the appealing features of the PS3, for a FPS i would not use a gamepad, keyboard/mouse is just superior.

This is a bad habit of mine, if I type too fast I often end up typing the opposite of what I meant. It should have read " It's now possible to use any type of controller":)

Regardless, I think it will be 499$US, not a dollar under, but I also think it will sell just as well if it was 699$.

[PhilOsirus]

I have been saying this for so long it is not even funny.
look forward to the PS3 being $700...
:thumbsup:

Mark my words (like so many times before)! You can also expect an 3rd Xbox 360 version that will have tivo functions, and will be sold at $499, including an internal 200GB Hard Drive and HD-DVD Burner. Also look forward to it being launched at the same time as the PS3. This will greatly benefit Microsoft, as it will already an huge library of games (when the PS3 comes out with around 6) and will have superior "new" hardware that the customers will see as an greatly better value compared to the PS3.

I don't know why you would give a thumbs up to a high price. Also, I'll mark your words so when that version you speak of is released, I'll say "Microsoft has now released another non-standard version of their own console for the 3rd time in a year while the PS3 established the standard for the developpers from day one (HD included with ALL PS3s and upgradable, online gaming available to all from the start, and a high capacity disk format).

[Rezonance]

I think the difference between DVD and BluRay is gonna be lost on the general public. I am not willing to rebuy most of my DVD collection and a HD TV for the pleasure of watching it on a better screen and I doubt many other people will be. VHS was quite naturally coming to the end of its life whilst DVDs are just reaching their peak. The difficulty for the PS3 is that this 'killer' feature only really appeals to the techinically savy with money to burn, of which make up a small fraction of the consumer base.

The difference between BluRay and DVD is much less then DVD to VHS. When DVDs were released they for the first time offered the ability to store films on disc and have instant seek times, compact storage of films, drastically improved picture quality, more robust storage that is not subject to degradation over time (not actually true!), high quality digital sound, portable players, extra features on discs to name a few.

BluRay only offers a better picture quality, but I am sure that a majority of people are satisfied with what they have already. Agreed HD looks great but not great enough to convince most people to spend the significant extra money. I personally would have loved to see them double the framerate of HDTV. 24fps often looks terrible expecially when the whole screen is moving.

The greatest leverage that HDTV sellers have is that people who are buying new TVs are going to go for flat panel displays, and if for a bit more money they can get a better HDTV why not?. Since a new TV has been bought they might as well get a new player... Then a majority of them will go and plug them together using RF!:D

Ps3 will do well simply because it is Playstation but I expect them to have a reduced share of the market compared to the Ps2 because Sony are really pricing it out of the market.:rolleyes:

[onlooker]

Sony will again take a loss on this system like they did the PS2, and sell it for the same price the 360 launched at. They always loose money on the hardware for the first 2 years, but they make it back in games, and in 2 years the hardware will turn a profit.

My 2¢

[RobertoOrtiz]

The difference between BluRay and DVD is much less then DVD to VHS. When DVDs were released they for the first time offered the ability to store films on disc and have instant seek times, compact storage of films, drastically improved picture quality, more robust storage that is not subject to degradation over time (not actually true!), high quality digital sound, portable players, extra features on discs to name a few.


Quoted for agreement.
And here is the joke, a lot of studios will start TAKING OUT functionality of DVD to force people to buy hd formats.

-R

[eliment]

€599 it's fine for SONY Playstation 3.
Im waiting for some devil may cry action.
and also kill zone 3, I've watch video, and it's seem to be one big Action,
I like how they make dynamics FX of fire in Kill zone 3.

[albedo4800hp]

LOL @ the Emotion Engine.

The strangest part to me is how they announced it...why do it over the radio, and why now? Are there no Euro trade shows that would have been better for this? (I realize GDC Europe is too late, and ECTS is no more, but is there nothing else?)

Come on everyone knows that Trade shows are so last millenium!

[PyRoT]

Sony will again take a loss on this system like they did the PS2, and sell it for the same price the 360 launched at. They always loose money on the hardware for the first 2 years, but they make it back in games, and in 2 years the hardware will turn a profit.

My 2¢

Yes, it took two years to make up for the loss of the PS2 consoles. However, I think that PS3 will not seel as much this time around.
Firstly, XBOX360 seems to be more respected compared to the original XBOX and is selling quite well.
Secondly, the cost of the PS3 will surely have an impact on how many units are sold.
Finally, the new Gamecube is but a shadow of the glory that the Revolution looks to be so this third competitor looks to sell a lot better this time aswell.

All in all, I doubt PS3 will match the popularity of the PS2.

Throw in the fact that if Blu-Ray fails to win the new format war, all the R&D would be wasted too. The holographic technology coming out soon seems to me a much better way to store data.

Basically, Sony cannot afford to lose much money while MS can.

Tomek

[Kai01W]

The difference between BluRay and DVD is much less then DVD to VHS.

Picture quality wise this is not true. The difference between having 5x the res and VHS vs DVD is massive.

-k

[PhilOsirus]

Quoted for agreement.
And here is the joke, a lot of studios will start TAKING OUT functionality of DVD to force people to buy hd formats.

-R

False, any DVD will be playable on PS3, not just Blu-Ray. If new movies are only released on Blu-Ray format it wouldn't sell. Here is reality: VHS movies are only now starting to disappear, years after the introduction of DVDs. Don't expect DVDs to disappear tomorrow, and especially not the ability to read them.

[PhilOsirus]

The holographic technology coming out soon seems to me a much better way to store data.

Except it won't be featured in any console until years from now if ever, and won't makes its way into the households either. Regardless of what movie studios want, games need much more space than what you can get on a regular DVD, in part because of the marketing departments' demands. And MS can't afford to lose more money than Sony, they both have investors to answer to.

[Jo-Ashley]

€599 it's fine for SONY Playstation 3.
Im waiting for some devil may cry action.
and also kill zone 3, I've watch video, and it's seem to be one big Action,
I like how they make dynamics FX of fire in Kill zone 3.
The price been denied by SCEA.

[richcz3]

They cant use "BLU RAY" as a selling point when nobody asked for it.......gamers just want the next generation of kick ass games....why do we "NEED" a blu-ray player when current formats work fine...seems like they are just trying to justify an over inflated price with some miscellaneous technology.
just my ¢.02Because Blue-Ray DVD is Sony's flag ship DVD hardware. By putting it in the PS3 they know they will get adoption much faster for the standard. Sony is willing to take a price hit to do this. Considering how many gamers are considering buying the PS3, that's a pretty significant stake in market share.

[aaraaf]

I'm with the Revolution being the default second system post. Nintendo's been talking about an affordable ready to go console that plays all of their old games when you order them online. That's just smart. They're also talking about gameplay, which is nice.

Since the XBox is basically a Media Center PC I'd be surprised if all of them couldn't Tivo without a simple update.

AND if Sony would let go of their dang Altrec format and let their audio devices hook up to the PS3 and transfer so you can listen on the go they could help 2 of their markets. I love their little bean designs, but the thing's not an mp3 player, it's an altrec player. It can't even see mp3s! I hope that they don't follow this through on their console. I guess that this is where them being a record company and software company ties them up a bit.

AND if you see a DVD on a large TV it looks like crap. The mpg compression of a DVD was always noisier and less clean than even the old ginormous laser discs. I can't wait to get a nice big TV and a good HDDVD / BluRay player. The difference IS as profound as the difference between DVD and VHS, especially on a large TV. This might really help Sony on this one.
Dang these long posts! :argh:

[onlooker]

AND if you see a DVD on a large TV it looks like crap. The mpg compression of a DVD was always noisier and less clean than even the old ginormous laser discs. I can't wait to get a nice big TV and a good HDDVD / BluRay player. The difference IS as profound as the difference between DVD and VHS, especially on a large TV. This might really help Sony on this one.
Dang these long posts! :argh:


Where do you get that information? It's so false. I have 4 versions of all 3 of the original starwars movies on laserdic and it looks like your watching it at the drive in if not worse.

Yes, it took two years to make up for the loss of the PS2 consoles. However, I think that PS3 will not seel as much this time around.
Firstly, XBOX360 seems to be more respected compared to the original XBOX and is selling quite well.
Secondly, the cost of the PS3 will surely have an impact on how many units are sold.
Finally, the new Gamecube is but a shadow of the glory that the Revolution looks to be so this third competitor looks to sell a lot better this time aswell.

All in all, I doubt PS3 will match the popularity of the PS2.

Throw in the fact that if Blu-Ray fails to win the new format war, all the R&D would be wasted too. The holographic technology coming out soon seems to me a much better way to store data.

Basically, Sony cannot afford to lose much money while MS can.

Tomek

Your obviously not a big gamer. The PS3 is what every gamer is waiting for because the specs, and the quality practically triple++ the 360's, and it also includes the one thing that set the first XBOX apart. Sony's PS3 has it's own version of XBOX live, and it's totally free. Plus sony also has the advantage of looking at the XBOX 360 for over a year so they have all the advantages here. Don't forget Sony started, and ownz console gaming. MS is just trespassing in their house. I have no doubts that Sony is planning on putting the Samurai smack down on their ass because this is their dream. MS just tried to hijack it.

[SHEPEIRO]

OMG "sony sarted console gaming" so what was Sega, Nintendo, Atari, 3do et al doing for nearly two decades befor sony waded in

and "specs, and the quality practically triple++ the 360's" another misdomeeaner. talking to alot of Dev team members that have experience with both consoles, they predict only slight improvemnet of graphical quality over the 360, and apparently its harder to code.

[onlooker]

OMG "sony sarted console gaming" so what was Sega, Nintendo, Atari, 3do et al doing for nearly two decades befor sony waded in

and "specs, and the quality practically triple++ the 360's" another misdomeeaner. talking to alot of Dev team members that have experience with both consoles, they predict only slight improvemnet of graphical quality over the 360, and apparently its harder to code.

Figuratively speaking. I meant the console revolution, and evolution. I should have been more clear with my thoughts. What I should have said was the original PS, and the PS2 drove the console gaming craze to the heights of what it is today. The original PS broke down barriers, and the PS2 shattered them.

[molynext]

If Blu-Ray doesn't take off it'll be a complete waste. I don't know what's wrong with dvds - I'm perfectly happy with their quality. Owning a PS3 is gonna cost me big time because I'll need a high definition tv as well. Thats why I don't have a XBOX 360 - I'm waiting for the ps3 to come out so I can compare them. At least the revolution will be cheaper. I might actually be more excited for nintendo's new controller than anything else I've seen on the horizon for ps3 and xbox 360. All the games for the 360 so far have had the same gameplay of games in the previous generation. Hopefully the revolution controller will spark some creativity.

[rootdown]

Don't forget Sony started, and ownz console gaming. MS is just trespassing in their house. I have no doubts that Sony is planning on putting the Samurai smack down on their ass because this is their dream. MS just tried to hijack it.

I think the appropriate response here is "lol."

[Sakester]

not anymore as sony have issued offical statement
http://www.gamesindustry.biz/content_page.php?aid=15937

[Romero]

They cant use "BLU RAY" as a selling point when nobody asked for it.......gamers just want the next generation of kick ass games....why do we "NEED" a blu-ray player when current formats work fine...seems like they are just trying to justify an over inflated price with some miscellaneous technology.

just my ¢.02

I totally agree its defintly a lame excuse to justify the price. After taxes in CAN Im lookin at like 7 or 8 hundred, thats dogshit!


Sony's PS3 has it's own version of XBOX live, and it's totally free.

That possibly could be a valued justification for the price. Cross the fingers its true

[pearson]

False, any DVD will be playable on PS3, not just Blu-Ray. If new movies are only released on Blu-Ray format it wouldn't sell. Here is reality: VHS movies are only now starting to disappear, years after the introduction of DVDs. Don't expect DVDs to disappear tomorrow, and especially not the ability to read them.What Roberto meant is that there will be a DVD release of a movie, but the studio won't include any extras. Then they'll release the Blu-Ray version and it'll have all these extra features, behind the scenes, deleted scenes, etc, and they'll claim it's because the disc can hold so much more data. Or only the fullscreen version will be released on DVD and the widescreen will be Blu-Ray only. That way they pressure people to move to Blu-ray.

Picture quality wise this is not true. The difference between having 5x the res and VHS vs DVD is massive.The improvement is only visible if you have the right TV. The specification calls for the signal to be sabataged to worse than DVD resolution if you don't have the right connectors, and while most studios have said they won't do that at first, at any time the studios could change their minds. It could even be per title.

This complete uncertainty will definately keep many out of the market, plus who wants to buy a bunch of movies and then have the format die (if HD-DVD wins the format war)?

[nofosu]

As Epensive as the PS3 sounds i don't for one second doubt it will sell well, i don't think it will have as much market share as the PS2 did, but it will do very well! There are a lot o people holding off to buy a x360 to get a ps3 like me, but every day that goes pass draws me closer to a X360, but i will wait till E3, see what they both have to offer me. The Only console i am for sure going to get if it comes out this year is the revolution. But i need a Big,Shiny, Powerfull, HD console to accompany it :buttrock:.

[tozz]

What Roberto meant is that there will be a DVD release of a movie, but the studio won't include any extras. Then they'll release the Blu-Ray version and it'll have all these extra features, behind the scenes, deleted scenes, etc, and they'll claim it's because the disc can hold so much more data. Or only the fullscreen version will be released on DVD and the widescreen will be Blu-Ray only. That way they pressure people to move to Blu-ray.

The improvement is only visible if you have the right TV. The specification calls for the signal to be sabataged to worse than DVD resolution if you don't have the right connectors, and while most studios have said they won't do that at first, at any time the studios could change their minds. It could even be per title.

This complete uncertainty will definately keep many out of the market, plus who wants to buy a bunch of movies and then have the format die (if HD-DVD wins the format war)?
How is 960 x 540 worse than 720*480 ?
You do lose out if you're used to PAL (720*576), you do however get more pixels.

[PhilOsirus]

What Roberto meant is that there will be a DVD release of a movie, but the studio won't include any extras. Then they'll release the Blu-Ray version and it'll have all these extra features, behind the scenes, deleted scenes, etc, and they'll claim it's because the disc can hold so much more data. Or only the fullscreen version will be released on DVD and the widescreen will be Blu-Ray only. That way they pressure people to move to Blu-ray.

Actually companies are already doing that with the current DVD format. They release the same movies twice, once with crap content and another time with all the behind the scenes stuff and all. I see no difference really, anyone who is really into watching extras and behind the scene stuff will get the new tech anyway.

Am I the only one who never watches the extras?

Also about the actual PS2/PS3 market, I go to a game-related school and almost everyone there bought a PS2 at some point or had a brother or sister that did, very few bought Xboxes. Currently I know of 1 person out of 60 that bought a 360, everyone else is anxiously waiting for the PS3 (of course all are concerned about the price but most are either saying they'll buy it anyway or just wait a bit). A lot of Nintendo DS and a few have PSPs. Those who did not buy a PS2 are saying they are waiting for the PS3 so they can get a chance to play all the PS2 titles they missed on like Resident Evil 4, God of War, or Shadow of the Colossus.

Now why I mention this is because those gamers are unknown to us, they don't post on forums, they are not PC gamers converted to Xbox gaming, they are casual gamers. The Xbox brand has made its market with the first Xbox and its not growing. The Playstation brand actually grew the market big time, it didn't just ask a bunch of PC gamers to play the same games on a console or have to wait for ports. Ask yourself, if the Xbox didn't exist, would those Xbox owners actually be Sony or Nintendo console owners? I think not. They would be playing WoW or Counterstrike.

[P_T]

Now why I mention this is because those gamers are unknown to us, they don't post on forums, they are not PC gamers converted to Xbox gaming, they are casual gamers. The Xbox brand has made its market with the first Xbox and its not growing. The Playstation brand actually grew the market big time, it didn't just ask a bunch of PC gamers to play the same games on a console or have to wait for ports. Ask yourself, if the Xbox didn't exist, would those Xbox owners actually be Sony or Nintendo console owners? I think not. They would be playing WoW or Counterstrike.

Good point Phil. I can say I'm one of those gamers too.

I didn't buy Xbox because I figured most of the games on Xbox are available on PC anyway. Even Oblivion and Ghost Recon:AWF which is supposed to be two best games for 360, are available for the PC. I also found Xbox games to be in a genre more suitable for the PC like FPS and RTS. Because of that I feel Xbox is just a simplified PC for the computer illiterate to play PC games without breaking their computers.

I also prefer to play with mates in the same room, yelling and screaming at each other, instead of over the net which I find to be a bit annoying specially for a team based game.

That's why Revo is gonna be my first console with PS3 come second. I want to play games from PS2 and GC that I never got the chance to play but if PS3 is gonna cost $500+ I think I'll wait for the price to come down. Revo on the other hand, I'll get it as soon as it's available.

[onlooker]

In case anybody missed it. Sony said that was not the price point of a PS3 in europe, and they were totally misinterpreted.

Here is the link to the story again.

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/content_page.php?aid=15937

Thanks for clearing that up Sake_

[pearson]

In case anybody missed it. Sony said that was not the price point of a PS3 in europe, and they were totally misinterpreted.

Here is the link to the story again.

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/content_page.php?aid=15937
Translation: "Oops!"

[sumpm1]

I for one will love having a Blu-Ray drive for the occasion when BD Burners arrive at the current burner prices. With tons of processing power, and tons of compression, you could fit tons of video files on a single 26 or 50 gig disc.

[pearson]

I for one will love having a Blu-Ray drive for the occasion when BD Burners arrive at the current burner prices. With tons of processing power, and tons of compression, you could fit tons of video files on a single 26 or 50 gig disc.That's the point. By the time the Blu-Ray burners arrive and get down to current DVD burner prices, HD-DVD may have won the format war. Or that holographic disc technology that is launching this winter may have rendered both HD-DVD and Blu-Ray obsolete by offering 1TB on a single disc.

Either way, if you are just backing up clips off your computer, it's much cheaper to get a 300GB external USB2 hard drive for $100 and just dump stuff on that.

[EpShot]

Either way, if you are just backing up clips off your computer, it's much cheaper to get a 300GB external USB2 hard drive for $100 and just dump stuff on that.

quoted for absolute agreement.

[CENOBITE]

Yes... I just knew this was a little premature and was misconstrued. However, I wouldn't be surprised if that would be a likely price. Now with them confirming a 60gig HD for it standard?! On top of BlueRay... this sucker is going to be pricey, unless they decide to go for a big hit on price and bite the bullet. However, I think not, they have already invested too much.

[PhilOsirus]

Yes... I just knew this was a little premature and was misconstrued. However, I wouldn't be surprised if that would be a likely price. Now with them confirming a 60gig HD for it standard?! On top of BlueRay... this sucker is going to be pricey, unless they decide to go for a big hit on price and bite the bullet. However, I think not, they have already invested too much.

A 60gb HD costs Sony at most 30$.

[quyeno]

Like it or not, Blu-Ray is going to be awesome. Much improved picture and sound quality and better still....MASSIVE amounts of data storage for games dev. The size and content of PS3 games is going to be awesome. MS definately shot themselves in the foot by releasing the 360 with standard DVD and will prob have to release a very pricey HDDVD add-on, which means the 360 will eventually be manufactured with HDDVD as standard, which means games will prob be published on HDDVD format, which of course means those who own a DVD 360 will have to buy the pricey upgrade or loose out on alot of games. So in a way those owners are forced to upgrade their 360 drives. This kinda sucks (glad i didn't buy a 360). PS3 is going to sell by the millions and they prob wont be in short supply either, i wouldn't be surprised if production starts soon. They (Sony, IBM and Toshiba) have a alot of fabs to produce CELL and PS3's and with over 7 months till launch, i doubt Sony are going to have a launch decible like MS did. I think the £400-£500 mark is most likely and i for one will be getting for sure (along with a high def tv). Those that moan about speculative prices.....stop moaning and dont buy one....who cares? but you will be missing out on the most evolutionary console ever. Roll on november :)

[OneSharpMarble]

I love sony :)

I had no idea John Titor was a member on this site! :rolleyes:

Hey since you have been to the future tell me the winning lotto 649 numbers. :deal:

[Jadetiger]

You think they do student discounts? hehe.... i have no money

[PhilOsirus]

the 360 with standard DVD and will prob have to release a very pricey HDDVD add-on, which means the 360 will eventually be manufactured with HDDVD as standard, which means games will prob be published on HDDVD format, which of course means those who own a DVD 360 will have to buy the pricey upgrade or loose out on alot of games.

Actually no one will be forced to upgrade their 360 because publishers are not stupid enough to invest millions to make a game that will sell based on the hopes that people will upgrade their 360 just to play their game while the competition prefers to keep on making 360 titles for the one that was released back in November. And it's almost impossible that any publishers would bother to even release the games in two formats. The 360 will stay the way it shipped in november 2005 for developers.

[EpShot]

OMG, they'll have to print two dvd's if they want more space! plasphemy! I mean sure, its nice to have it on one, but when was the last time you thought, what!? it comes on more than 1 cd, **** it, i ain't buying it!

I think MS was smart and not picking any format and investing unnessecary money. MS is planning on having all the games downloadable in future anyways. they have no stack in the media storage.

[CENOBITE]

I have to agree with EPshot.

In the long run, the price for the 360's parts will go down and they will be able to drop the price to eventually the "sweet spot" of $199 quickly without expensive nextgen data storage, when a regular DVD and DVD player costs quite a lot less and you recoup more $$ per disc. Remember... the money is made by the GAMES not the MACHINE.

[PhilOsirus]

MS is planning on having all the games downloadable in future anyways. they have no stack in the media storage.

Impossible, unless the future to you is 6 years from now, in which case that will be around the time of the PS4. The standard Xbox 360 package has no hard drive, don't expect any developpers to make games exclusively for non-standard components. If what you say is true then games would be released on multiple discs, which can be a complication for certain types of games (anything except RPGs really), and it would not be possible to load one of the two DVDs on the HD since the HD is a non-standard component with limited space (especially if all games use this method!). I have no PS2 game that was sold on multiple discs, I don't see why we should see a return of this bothersome aspect. The 360 is not your 120gb PC, it's an hard-drive-less console that can only read DVDs as far as developers are concerned.

[EpShot]

sorry, i didn't mean to imply for the 360. I just ment that thats where they see the future of media distribution. They don't care who wins the media format war, so why pick one? particuraly considering the investment.

[heavyness]

A 60gb HD costs Sony at most 30$.

times 3,000,000 units...

sure, $30 isn't bad for an HDD, but its another cost that is being added onto an already rumor expensive system. i have no reason to believe Sony would release a system over $500, but if it comes in under $500, they will be taking a big hit.

[quyeno]

One of the biggest concerns that developers had with the 360 was the DVD format (especially japanses developers, they felt DVD will limit their development potential especially with RPGs and if MS wants a bigger share in the asia market, this isn't good). Games are getting bigger in terms of data wise with next gen technology. DVD maybe adequate now but when games get too big for a single disc, sure they may print several DVDs but the cost of HDDVD will drop to the point that printing on HDDVD is more cost effective (even if HDDVD is still a bit more expensive, there is still the extra cost of having to print multiple dvds), when that happens, i'm sure publishers will opt for HDDVD. Sure they may loose out on some sales but generally if the game is good, people will go out and buy the HDDVD upgrade. Didn't nintendo bring out a 4mb upgrade for the N64? the games which required that still sold extremely well.

Yeah, all this downloadable games buisness, dont count on it. Besides what Phil_Osirus said, if you haven't got a way to back up a downloaded game and when you have ran out of HD space, you will either have to buy another hard drive or delete a game or two in order to download another, wasting a fair bit of money. If i spend £50 on a 360 game, i would want to keep it or at least trade it in for some return. This will be an even bigger problem when games start hitting the 10 gig + mark, then you won't be able to store as many games. I think downloable content is more realistic, ie buy the game on disc and download extras for it. Anyway you look at it, Sony has made the right decision to use Blu-Ray, it omits any doubt about data storage. I think Blu-Ray will be supported by film studios cos several million PS3 sold means several Blu-Ray movie players in the home, not including the Blu-Ray players from Toshiba, Panasonic, Pioneer, etc...and the Blu-Ray Viao pc range and media centres. The storage potential of Blu-Ray offers so much potential for film companies to add extra content (which admittedly i dont watch either!), you never know they may even include cr@p games to play on the PS3! BTW, i'm not a super Sony supporter, i just think Sony has made all the right decisions and the PS3 will deliver in quality and quantity, and yes, i do own an iPod and a XBOX!

[GoranNF]

My biggest dream is that ps3 will be able to get an OS running on it,like linux,windows,mac etc...Just like they managed to run Linux on the xbox.That would be just totally frickin awesome,that would be a ultimate pc that costs only 500-600 euro.:bounce:

[tozz]

My biggest dream is that ps3 will be able to get an OS running on it,like linux,windows,mac etc...Just like they managed to run Linux on the xbox.That would be just totally frickin awesome,that would be a ultimate pc that costs only 500-600 euro.:bounce:
The PS3 is running Linux off the shelf.

[GoranNF]

The PS3 is running Linux off the shelf.
What does that mean?Does that mean that you can use linux apps on it,like firefox etc?

[Nichod]

Figuratively speaking. I meant the console revolution, and evolution. I should have been more clear with my thoughts. What I should have said was the original PS, and the PS2 drove the console gaming craze to the heights of what it is today. The original PS broke down barriers, and the PS2 shattered them.



You obviously are younger. The original Nintendo is what broke down barriers. A massive collection of games were produced, full color, game play was much more advanced and dynamic and then once again Nintendo did it with the Super Nintendo. All Sony did was introduce the use of games on Discs as opposed to cartridges. That may have allowed more data storage, but thats about it. It didn't improve gaming or make the games better.
And I really can think of only a handful of PS games that I think are really groundbreaking. The PS2 was great in that it was a nice package with DVD player, etc. And currently Sony is not doing so well financially right now. They have a lot banking on the PS3. I hope its got all the bang they are expecting it to have. Because its not about pure power anymore. I think that the PS3 and the XBOX are slowly backing themselves into a corner, they are focusing so much on giving their systems the ability to play powerful games, but not focusing as much on what they can do to improve playability and gameplay. I don't feel that ultrarealistic fog and lighting effects are going to improve the playability and replayability of the Sony games. Oddly enough the one taking the risks is Nintendo once again.

[Nichod]

Like it or not, Blu-Ray is going to be awesome. Much improved picture and sound quality and better still....MASSIVE amounts of data storage for games dev. The size and content of PS3 games is going to be awesome. MS definately shot themselves in the foot by releasing the 360 with standard DVD and will prob have to release a very pricey HDDVD add-on, which means the 360 will eventually be manufactured with HDDVD as standard, which means games will prob be published on HDDVD format, which of course means those who own a DVD 360 will have to buy the pricey upgrade or loose out on alot of games. So in a way those owners are forced to upgrade their 360 drives. This kinda sucks (glad i didn't buy a 360). PS3 is going to sell by the millions and they prob wont be in short supply either, i wouldn't be surprised if production starts soon. They (Sony, IBM and Toshiba) have a alot of fabs to produce CELL and PS3's and with over 7 months till launch, i doubt Sony are going to have a launch decible like MS did. I think the £400-£500 mark is most likely and i for one will be getting for sure (along with a high def tv). Those that moan about speculative prices.....stop moaning and dont buy one....who cares? but you will be missing out on the most evolutionary console ever. Roll on november :)


This is a good point.

[tozz]

What does that mean?Does that mean that you can use linux apps on it,like firefox etc?
I don't think there's any info on that yet. There will of course be security aspects etc when running a OS like linux, but I do think it's very clever by Sony if they're going to let people run linux software and/or produce own applications. Remember, think what you will of Sony, the Cell is an amazing piece of hardware, nobody in their right mind can really argue that.

Remember this is all speculative, the only official thing from Sony is that the PS3 will run a Linux based OS. Linux allready has Cell support so it's not anything major to get it running. Sony did a similar thing with the PS2, offering a Linux addon and developer tools.
http://playstation2-linux.com/

[rakmaya]

The whole reason for Blu-Ray is the from the size restriction of the DVD. Some games where already on 2 DVDs. And now, if the developers want to put promotional contents, movies and demos, they had to put it on 2 different DVDs. If you were ever in the game development business, you probably heard about all these. Publishers love one image than 2 different image and cost of publishing 2 DVDs is quite bigger than most of you think. It is not the price of a DVD that the publishers factor. Manifacturing lines are meant for 1 DVD packaging and 2 in a set adds extra cost than the price of an extra DVD.

On the top of that, RPG games are a big thing in Japan (quite big in US as well) and most have known to push the limits of the DVD size. The in-game movies and camios and all fills up more an 11 Gig already on some games that I know of in the current gen. With HD res, these are likely to go up.

Unlike other parts, the price of a media disk goes down faster. The price point on a media is not the biggest factor in the long run for Sony. The initial price of the overal system is a bigger factor for Sony than anything else. That is also the reason, Sony is looking to get more well known games in the initial release.

[Szos]

Do some of you people not understand that a DVD or HD-DVD or even Blu-Ray is just a STORAGE MEDIUM when talking about games?!?

There is essentially NOTHING within the technology that would make a game released on 1 or 2 or 20 DVD game discs to be any different than a game released on a 1/2-used Blue-Ray disc. Stop drinking the Sony fanboi CoolAid for a second, and realize that the graphics would be just as high-rez, the music just as rich and the game play just as deep between the formats.

If you want to say that you want a $500+ PS3 because you have a HDTV and want to watch HD movies, that is one thing, but don't wrongly say that the gaming experience is going to be any better because SONY went with the much more expensive disc technology. For those of us that won't really care about HD movies at this point in time, being 'forced' to pay a $200+ premium to have a new-fangled Blu-ray drive is going to offer up no advantages while playing games.

The PS3 is possibly/potentially more powerful than a XB360 (and the amount is QUITE debateable), but using the fact that the PS3 will be using a Blu-Ray disc as one of those advantages is NOT valid in the slightest bit when talking about gaming.

[quyeno]

Szos..i think you are semi-wrong there mate. Yes..having a larger storage medium is not going to make a game great BUT having a storage medium which far exceeds storage needs for many years to come will give developers ALOT of potential and will not restrict the size of the game, the visuals, etc....so in fact, the storage media is very important. Larger games, more detailed environments, more realistic physics, richer graphics, more complex shaders, high res in-game movies and richer sound will mean more data and more storage requirements. Blu-Ray will provide more storage than any game developer will need for probably the entire PS3 cycle.

[ParamountCell]

Szos..i think you are semi-wrong there mate. Yes..having a larger storage medium is not going to make a game great BUT having a storage medium which far exceeds storage needs for many years to come will give developers ALOT of potential and will not restrict the size of the game, the visuals, etc....so in fact, the storage media is very important. Larger games, more detailed environments, more realistic physics, richer graphics, more complex shaders, high res in-game movies and richer sound will mean more data and more storage requirements. Blu-Ray will provide more storage than any game developer will need for probably the entire PS3 cycle.
hi, u both have some good points here the thing is Larger games, more detailed environments, more realistic physics, richer graphics, more complex shaders, high res in-game movies and richer sound, will not make the gameplay better although they all add to the overall game experience. These days there seems to be more of a focus on power graphical features and additional media than there is on gameplay elements, this is why we need a change.

[Szos]

Szos..i think you are semi-wrong there mate. Yes..having a larger storage medium is not going to make a game great BUT having a storage medium which far exceeds storage needs for many years to come will give developers ALOT of potential and will not restrict the size of the game, the visuals, etc....so in fact, the storage media is very important. Larger games, more detailed environments, more realistic physics, richer graphics, more complex shaders, high res in-game movies and richer sound will mean more data and more storage requirements. Blu-Ray will provide more storage than any game developer will need for probably the entire PS3 cycle.

Could not disagree with you more - if something doesn't fit on one DVD game disc, you can always put it on another. WOW - maybe a whole 50-cents added to the cost of ONE game (and the number of games that "need" 2 discs is few and far between), versus $200+ added to the cost of ALL PS3 consoles.

This is totaly a non-issue.

[tozz]

It's a non-issue today, but some people tend to think a little further down the road. Will it be a non-issue in three years? It's the same consoles that will be in the stores then as it's this year. Games are filling two discs now, double the resolution on textures and cinematics and it will be quite alot more.
Hopefully we'll see larger games coming too and that will require som space too. (I'm for one is quite sick of the restricted areas of games nowadays, I like to explore).

[EpShot]

these better be good games because their are going to be damn expensive, any game that requires more than one dvd of content.

[PhilOsirus]

Could not disagree with you more - if something doesn't fit on one DVD game disc, you can always put it on another. WOW - maybe a whole 50-cents added to the cost of ONE game (and the number of games that "need" 2 discs is few and far between), versus $200+ added to the cost of ALL PS3 consoles.

This is totaly a non-issue.

Comepletely false. First of all it's much more than the price of another DVD, it's the whole manufacturing method that changes. The standard production and packaging method for console games is one disc in one DVD case. Having to include a second disc (something I have never seen since I bought a PS2) ends up costing more, it also takes longer to produce the final package because two DVDs must be made for each game instead of one. Schedules nowadays are very thight, a company could end up having to delay the release of a game just because they need to produce two DVDs instead of one. Now what if your game was supposed to be released before the end of the fiscal year, on march 31st, only to be delayed by 6 days because it ended up taking two DVDs? Expect your shareholders to be very dissapointed.

And that's without mentioning the problems it brings to the player as well. You don't install games on a PS3 or a 360, that hard drive you paid for is made to make the gaming experience better, to enable you to download content and such, not be filled up because your game comes on two DVDs and it's the type of game where swapping disc is not possible. On top of that not all 360s have hard drives, so what about those who don't have one?

I could go on, but basically Blu-Ray means none of that hassle for us and especially non of that hassle for publishers and developers.

[quyeno]

Comepletely false. First of all it's much more than the price of another DVD, it's the whole manufacturing method that changes. The standard production and packaging method for console games is one disc in one DVD case. Having to include a second disc (something I have never seen since I bought a PS2) ends up costing more, it also takes longer to produce the final package because two DVDs must be made for each game instead of one. Schedules nowadays are very thight, a company could end up having to delay the release of a game just because they need to produce two DVDs instead of one. Now what if your game was supposed to be released before the end of the fiscal year, on march 31st, only to be delayed by 6 days because it ended up taking two DVDs? Expect your shareholders to be very dissapointed.

And that's without mentioning the problems it brings to the player as well. You don't install games on a PS3 or a 360, that hard drive you paid for is made to make the gaming experience better, to enable you to download content and such, not be filled up because your game comes on two DVDs and it's the type of game where swapping disc is not possible. On top of that not all 360s have hard drives, so what about those who don't have one?

I could go on, but basically Blu-Ray means none of that hassle for us and especially non of that hassle for publishers and developers.

For sure. Having multiple discs is not just the cost of the disc, as Phil_Osirus put it, there are alot more cost involved which isn't so obvious.

[rakmaya]

Could not disagree with you more - if something doesn't fit on one DVD game disc, you can always put it on another. WOW - maybe a whole 50-cents added to the cost of ONE game (and the number of games that "need" 2 discs is few and far between), versus $200+ added to the cost of ALL PS3 consoles.

This is totaly a non-issue.

I think you forgot to read the post above yours where I told you it doesn't work like that. The manufacturing lines doesn't just a add a 50c to the production. Once it went up almost 1/3rd of the original price point given to our company if we were to add extra DVD for bonus contents. On the other hand, if you not a big time developer or are a new studio, the price is even higher.

Please, if you do not know the details, it is better you read up. I am not insulting you or anything, just to let you know what goes on. On the top of all these the single price of a medium goes down faster. So proce of a DVD, HD-DVD or Blu-Ray is not the main price factor for publishers and developers. It is the projected sale of the game. Ask Take2 how they differenciate between TopSpin and Outlaw Tennis when it comes to publishing. I know for fact b/c I worked in the industry.

The publishers are just too greedy to base things on a 50c DVD (sorry to the nice people who work in that aspect of the production :rolleyes: )

[CupOWonton]

OK, Im sure someones mentioned this before, but to make it simple.

With a PS3, youre paying for an HD capable BlueRay Drive that also plays CD's and DVD's
*and is also compatable with PS2 and PS1 games- yay*

With a 360, youre paying for a standard DVD player, the HD-DVD isnt included, and will most likely cost quite a bit. *360 uses a software emulator for each individual game -Approximately 200 games- so dont expect to play the vast majoraty of X1 games on your 360*

Overall, if the PS3's price is nearly what we can assume it will be in the range of then the PS3 and Xbox 360 pretty much cost the same freakin ammount.

[DevilHacker]

Comepletely false. First of all it's much more than the price of another DVD, it's the whole manufacturing method that changes. The standard production and packaging method for console games is one disc in one DVD case. Having to include a second disc (something I have never seen since I bought a PS2) ends up costing more, it also takes longer to produce the final package because two DVDs must be made for each game instead of one.Completely wrong.
Many games for the original Xbox and Gamecube shipped with 2+ disks. Both disks were in one case, and only added a small fee to the total cost of the game (all of which came in under $50)… The first two games that come to mind is Shamue (sp?) for the xbox, and the Resident Evil re-releases for the gamecube. Both games worked flawlessly, and having to switch games did not distract from the flow or enjoyability of the games. He has an point, don’t discredit it because of your belief that Blu-Ray is better for everyone.

[Womball]

I knew it would be pricy. I will wait till it drops to about 300 bucks or less. By that time it should have a few good games. I have a DS, Xbox 360 and hopefully soon the Revolution to play. Plus a big back log of retro games I need to finish.

[Szos]

don’t discredit it because of your belief that Blu-Ray is better for everyone.[/color]

That is ALL I am concerned about. If you want Blu-Ray to watch HD movies on... FINE, the PS3 might actually be considered "reasonably" priced. But don't hype up Blu-Ray for GAMING purposes and even ellude to the XB360 having lower rez or other BS like that just because it doesn't run Blu-Ray. That is total and complete nonsense.

SONY tied it's next-gen hardware on a format that was just too cutting edge, and potentially prices like $500+ for the console is it's end result.

I am SURE MS will come out with it's own HD drive to play movies, but it isn't forcing you to pay for that priviledge just to play games.

The vast majority of people now still don't have an HDTV set - so any of these next-gen consoles are kind of "iffy" as to if they are worth it. But with the PS3 running Blu-Ray, not only are you paying a premium for graphics that you might never really see (if you run a SDTV), but you are also paying a huge premium for a Blu-Ray HD-drive that you definitly won't be seeing the benefit of.

It is a risky move by SONY and it can very well burn them.
We will see in about 6 months (unless it gets postponed again) if this pans out for SONY.

[PhilOsirus]

Completely wrong.
Many games for the original Xbox and Gamecube shipped with 2+ disks. Both disks were in one case, and only added a small fee to the total cost of the game (all of which came in under $50)… The first two games that come to mind is Shamue (sp?) for the xbox, and the Resident Evil re-releases for the gamecube. Both games worked flawlessly, and having to switch games did not distract from the flow or enjoyability of the games. He has an point, don’t discredit it because of your belief that Blu-Ray is better for everyone.[/color]

First it's not many games, it's a very few games, and none that I know of on PS2. The point is:

1- It cost more to produce (of course the publisher will end up taking a hit on profit and won't sell the game at a high price because of competition) and also complicates the testing/beta phase (especially in the later phase of development).
2- It forces developers to either reduce the amount of content to fit the game on one DVD or force player to buy a hard drive to install the game onto.
2.1- This is bothersome for the players because they must remove content from their HD for the sake of one game.
2.2- The game's sales are limited only to those that have the hard drive.
3- If they go for the DVD swapping method then it will only apply to linear offline games, don't expect anyone to switch DVD to play Shonghua Stalemate map in Battlefield and then swap DVD again to play Strike at Karkand. Hence it's back to Hard-Drive only if the game does not make this possible.
4- It can lead to delays for the release of the game as the developper attempts to find solutions to reduce the game's size of 50mb just so it can fit on one DVD, as the publisher pressure them to do so.

All of this is avoided with a higher capacity format, and the PS3's hard drive can therefore be used for additional content instead of essential content, preventing the player from having to constently erase and reupload data to it. And I'm not discrediting anything because of my belief that the Blu-Ray format can make you a happy wife, I'm justing stating my opinion on what makes the PS3 a better game console on its own, in part thanks to the higher capacity format (which could have been HD-DVD, it would have been better than regular DVD).

[rakmaya]

Completely wrong.
Many games for the original Xbox and Gamecube shipped with 2+ disks. Both disks were in one case, and only added a small fee to the total cost of the game (all of which came in under $50)… The first two games that come to mind is Shamue (sp?) for the xbox, and the Resident Evil re-releases for the gamecube. Both games worked flawlessly, and having to switch games did not distract from the flow or enjoyability of the games. He has an point, don’t discredit it because of your belief that Blu-Ray is better for everyone.[/color]

I was not talking about the usefullness of the Blu-Ray or HD-DVD to the players. The capacity as in whole makes is better for the developers. ALL of the 2 DVD+ games that were published took more than a "small fee" from the developers. It is not the price that we players see. All of the money doesn't just go to the developers and most in fact goes to the publishers. Adding to that is the cost of 2 DVD set.

He has an point, don’t discredit it because of your belief that Blu-Ray is better for everyone.[/color]

Noone is saying that. At least I am not. It is that when he said it just adds "50c" that is what is wrong. The higher capacity whether it is Blu-Ray or HD-DVD does have a better hand when it comes to developers. Obviously it doesn't mean it is good for everyone.

[Sonk]

Completely wrong.
Many games for the original Xbox and Gamecube shipped with 2+ disks. Both disks were in one case, and only added a small fee to the total cost of the game (all of which came in under $50)… The first two games that come to mind is Shamue (sp?) for the xbox, and the Resident Evil re-releases for the gamecube. Both games worked flawlessly, and having to switch games did not distract from the flow or enjoyability of the games. He has an point, don’t discredit it because of your belief that Blu-Ray is better for everyone.[/color]

Your not a gamer, if you havent played ShenMue or spell it for that matter :P

ShenMue 2 is a huge game that has alot of content, so it needed multiple disc..had they the option for a single disc, they would of gone that route. ShenMue 1 on the DC was like 4 disc, i believe.

I think BluRay is great, heck even HD-DVD would be fine. I dont really care about watching any Blu-Ray movies on the PS3..but i think its needed for more game content in the future. the PS3 is supposed to have a 5-6 year life cycle afterall. After that who knows what we'll be using...

Theres definitely a difference between HD content, even on a normal TV, i was watching a show in HD on my normal TV..and i noticed it was alot better. Its kinda silly when Nintendo fanboys say you need a HDTV to play the 360 or PS3..thats false. If you have a problem with paying for Blu-Ray or HD-DVD base console, just dont buy one..its that simple. Most people wont mind, and we still buy a PS3.

[Szos]

i was watching a show in HD on my normal TV..and i noticed it was alot better.

LOL

Wow. Just wow.

[DevilHacker]

Your not a gamer, if you havent played ShenMue or spell it for that matter :pI dont know if you were joking... but... ya. I play video games.

Also, you will not see HD graphics on an non-HD TV. so... there goes your argument.

[tozz]

HD content downsized will be better than low res content. I don't know why you have such a hard time understanding the most simple things when it comes to image quality.

A HD show scaled to SDTV will probably look a hell of alot better than a normal stream, I don't see how this is suprising for anyone. Your tv will ofcourse be limited to the native resolution but the source isn't a problem any more.

As for games they won't be downscaled but rather run in the resolution you can handle, there's however the benefit of texture quality. One will have to assume textures are made for at least 720p and then scaled to fit lower resolution, so there's benefits even if you don't have a hdtv. This alone isn't something worth paying extra for in my book (even though I hate crap textures) but then again, this isn't the only thing you get.

[Sonk]

LOL

Wow. Just wow.

I have a analogy TV and it isnt even a flat screen, its a old CRT. Plus i dont have 20/20 vision! Yet, i notice a difference between normal TV show and a HD one being shown. Yeah, you think about that for aminute...

You dont need a HDTV to play PS3 games, its just better if you have one. Im not going to buy a HDTV soon ,yet i plan on buying a PS3(not at launch).


I dont know if you were joking... but... ya. I play video games.

Also, you will not see HD graphics on an non-HD TV. so... there goes your argument.

I was joking in the first sentence, but all gamers should give ShenMue1 a try..its a great game. I never said you'll see HD content on your normal analogy TV(thats technically impossible), learn to read? :P


At least tozz understands!

Another myth, is that MS has alot more money than Sony. Between MS gaming division and SCEI, Sony gaming division has more money.

[quyeno]

i read somewhere that scei turned over about $1.5 bil last year, not including royalities. trying to find the link. :) but their electronics division isn't doing too good i think, mainly due to their expensive crt fabs loosing money becuase of tv technology transitioning over to LCD, plus they have been sourcing in LCD panels, but now have the capacity to manfacture their own. i just hope they recover, i want some ps3 goodness :)

[pearson]

Like it or not, Blu-Ray is going to be awesome.
[snipped lots of hype]
I for one will be getting for sure (along with a high def tv).I, for one, am very grateful for all those who adopt new tech as soon as it comes out, no matter the price. $1000 for a PS3 bundle? No prob! I need a new $3000 TV to see the games? No sweat!

I know it sounds like a joke, but seriously, tech needs these people. I wish I had the $$$ to help out too. Instead I will wait (years?) until the format war is over... sigh.

[quyeno]

Pearson...hehe...you make it sound like i am super rich! i wish i was,but yes i am definately getting a PS3 on release and a high def tv, but i'm saving like a mad man! :) besides gaming is my job....thats the excuse i tell the other half ;)

[Szos]

Yet, i notice a difference between normal TV show and a HD one being shown. Yeah, you think about that for aminute...

:banghead::banghead::banghead:

Stop. Just stop. You need an HD receiever to get an HD signal (and ofcourse an HDTV to actually SEE that signal). The HD and SD signals are broadcast simultaniously - you are NOT seeing an HD signal - downscaled or otherwise.

[CGTalk Moderation]

This thread has been automatically closed as it remained inactive for 12 months. If you wish to continue the discussion, please create a new thread in the appropriate forum.