Practice- "Back to the Future"

[dalmanna]

yeah man thats cool, does get a little hard too see when he's right at the back though. i'll have to watch it a few more times before i can give a decent crit as nothing stood out as being really wrong. i'll look it over and get back to you.

[wtoddk]

thanks for looking. I uploaded a larger version of the clip making it easier to see...



yeah man thats cool, does get a little hard too see when he's right at the back though. i'll have to watch it a few more times before i can give a decent crit as nothing stood out as being really wrong. i'll look it over and get back to you.

[dalmanna]

cheers for the bigger version thats cool. i noticed when he says 'harness' his right hand gets stuck still in the air for a while. also in that same bit i think his left foot should go up more on tiptoe so that you can really push that stretch on 'harness'. i'll keep going through it to see if theres any more little bits. keep at it though its very cool, everyone loves the doc :D

[adam-crockett]

I hate this forum sometimes. I had this whole post written out, and then, I dont know what button I hit, but for some reason it went back a page, and I lost it all! Now Im typing this in Word and copying and pasting :sad: back soon

[adam-crockett]

Nice dialogue selection. I love the doc character!



I don’t have comments on specific parts of the animation as much as I have comments about the overall approach. I think that’s ok since its not super polished yet right?



Generally I think that its way over-acted. I’ll explain:



The dialogue has two parts, there’s the first part where Doc is brainstorming out loud, and then the second part, where he actually addresses Marty.



In the first part, doc isn’t addressing us, he’s not even in the room with us, he’s in his mind, lost in thought, maniacally hatching his genius plan. He’s only talking to himself, and isn’t “performing” for anyone. To this end, I think that his gestures should be more subdued, and centered around his head and chest. (Sort of like you have him when he says “it just might work”. I love the little head twitch at the end when he looks left, by the way) They should be the kind of gestures and poses people (especially mad scientists) do when they are trying to wrench an idea out of their head: wringing hands, rubbing chin, scratching head, pacing … unconscious, jerky movements, and they should build in excitement as his plan comes together. I think he should never look at the camera, he should be focused on his gesturing hands, or staring off into space, like he’s visualizing the stuff that he’s talking about, and its right there in front of him.



Then he snaps out of it!



When he says “Next Saturday night…”, he’s made his mind up, and is now excitedly addressing Marty directly. (or us, the camera, the viewer, whatever) NOW, he’s performing, talking straight at us. I think he should go from distractedly talking to himself, to whipping around and directing his lines AT the camera. Now you can unleash wildly animated dramatic gestures. IMO His final pose should be pointing “back, to the future” which I think would be off to the right, since we read left to right, the future would be that way, right? Or would it be the DOC’s right, so to us he’d be pointing left….hmmm, something to think about.



I think that this will all make the animation more interesting by showing a character transitioning between two very different emotional states (internal/external). Building up his excitement inside himself until he releases it at the camera at the end (you can hear the music doing the same thing.)



Love seeing your work again! Keep us posted.

[dalmanna]

thats quite interesting idea with the future being to the right i was thinking that he would point forward towards the future instead of leaning back. like he would say 'back' and lean back then say 'to the future' with a short snappy point to the camera. but now you say it maybe left to right would read more clearly.

i think the 'over acting' as you said is ok though being as the doc does kinda do that in the film.
but saying that i'm not sure what its a practice in so it might be over acted:shrug: depending on what the intent was.

i suppose sky could always do two :D

[adam-crockett]

thats quite interesting idea with the future being to the right i was thinking that he would point forward towards the future instead of leaning back. like he would say 'back' and lean back then say 'to the future' with a short snappy point to the camera. but now you say it maybe left to right would read more clearly.

i think the 'over acting' as you said is ok though being as the doc does kinda do that in the film.
but saying that i'm not sure what its a practice in so it might be over acted:shrug: depending on what the intent was.

i suppose sky could always do two :D

Yes, Doc is quite an animated character in the film. I just think that this particular segment (that is, the first half of the dialogue clip) calls for more subdued motion. Then he could do wild gesticulations for the second part.

[SOE digital]

Now Im typing this in Word and copying and pasting

I do it EVERYTIME I post on any forum.

[mustan9]

I loved it, and thought it was just fine. Maybe just the part where he holds up his hands and it looks like they are locked for a second.

When he steps forward towards the camera. That was great.

I just wish I could actually see this done with a real character, and not a simple bones rig.

[dalmanna]

Yes, Doc is quite an animated character in the film. I just think that this particular segment (that is, the first half of the dialogue clip) calls for more subdued motion. Then he could do wild gesticulations for the second part.

yeah what your saying would greatly improve the ending too ('sending you back to the future' bit)
calm before the storm kinda thing :beer:

[wtoddk]

Wow...How great to see this post has been so busy while I was sleeping...

Before anything else I should explain a little how envisioned the scene before beginning to animate. I chose the clip because I wanted to do something very dramatic, with lots of movement and a variety of poses. Something dramatic...even over-acted. I think Doc, in the movie, is overacting the whole time. It was just his character to act that way. That's why I felt it might be justified to overact my character SO much. Besides, it's just an animation practice.

Adam, I considered a lot how I should animate him...addressing the camera, or more internal, in his own little world, or maybe like a bad actor in a play: even though he's addressing another actor, he (over)acts as though he's alone on the stage. But I totally agree with you that I should animate it in 2 parts...the first with more jerky movements, inward, like the mad scientist he is. And the second, more dramatic, external, more exaggerated movements...and perhaps addressing the camera. Honestly, I just had trouble visualizing the poses if he addressed the camera. I think I avoided it because I wanted to do some more exciting and visible poses...more profiles than frontal views.

Also, I agree that "Back...to the Future!" could be a lot more interesting if I did a left-to-right sorta thing...but I didn't want to replicate the earlier pose when he says "Channel it...INTO the..." But then, as I think about it, if I apply Adam's suggestion of making the first part more "internal" animation, then I'd have re-do the "Channel it..." part. But that should be easy.

Truth is...I'm not really sure WHAT to do with the final poses... I'm not very happy with it currently the way it is. Although I did want to do some kind of walk up to the camera for dramatic effect.

i noticed when he says 'harness' his right hand gets stuck still in the air for a while. also in that same bit i think his left foot should go up more on tiptoe so that you can really push that stretch on 'harness'.
Thanks Dalmanna. Points taken. The tiptoe suggestion is great... Thanks!

I'll try to find time in the next couple of days to make some changes and pop out another render. Check back on me later in the week!

Thanks again for all the great suggestions!!

[thedigitalmonkey]

Haha, another BTF quote, also quite nice looking. Other than whats been said, (which I think is about clean-up all in all, because all your "key poses"/layouts whatever are tight) you may benefit from a little arc in the arm when he swings it out for "back to the future!" not necessarily an arc in its extended shape, but an arc in the motion of the elbow.

good luck!

[wtoddk]

Phew! I finally found some time to clean this animation up a little.

I had trouble deciding if I should go back and change the first part of the animation like Adam suggested...more calculating and brooding in the beginning, and later more exagerrated animation. I actually started changing it, then I thought...'heck, this is just a 'practice' anyway.' So I left the poses and animation the way they were originally...just touching up the timing, curves, etc...

Well anyway...here is the new version. This is a preview render....later I'll do a higher quality version.

Thanks for looking everyone!

Quicktime movie here (http://www.toddkelley.com/share_public/back/BTTFpre.mov) (6MB)
http://www.toddkelley.com/share_public/back/render.jpg

[dalmanna]

hey skyboy,

looking much better, the point 'to the future' came out awesome. i still find that 'harness' hand a bit weird though i think it's because it pauses a bit too long or maybe doesn't stretch enough. i was thinking perhaps he could grasp at the air when he says harness like he's caught a fly and then punch his other hand so that it grabs his fist. just an idea :shrug: anyway i like it a lot makes a good contrast to the other guy that did it (the blue guy) coz you've got the fruit cake ramblings down fine :thumbsup:

whats the software your using, incase i find any more rigs

[dalmanna]

where's everyone getting that clip from coz i think i might have a go if i get time looks like a load of fun (good practice too).

[biochemist]

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[dalmanna]

dalmanna, it can be found here:

http://www.animationmeat.com/practice/practice.html

They have some more interesting dialogue files. I might pick one more from them to practice.

Kahye (biochemist)

cheers dude i'll work my way through the lot (time willing):thumbsup:

[adam-crockett]

Fine! See if I care! : )


"if we could somehow" - sort of floaty.
"harness this lightning "- wierd couple of poses. Is he hitting his hand? I think they should stick together if he is. Both hands float and stick wierd in this part, use better moving holds
"channel it" - elbow in the air is wierd, no aniticipation or follow through in the hips, right ankle is at a painful looking angle.
"next" - hand in the air is at a painful angle on the first pose, probably just the camera angle, but still...
Also, just before "next" check your arc on his arm thats swinging up into the air, Theres a pop in the middle.
"night" - his hand sticks in the air, IK style, pull it down some more with his body
I think theres more, but I gotta run.

[dalmanna]

lol adam strikes again. muhahahahaha...... who said that? :D


but yeah he's right now i look at it again.

[wtoddk]

:argh: Drat! Leave it to Adam to come and ruin my satisfaction at having finished another animation. LOL
...........mmmmmmmmmOK!!! You're right though, Adam! Now that I look at it again, I see all the stuff you mentioned. I'll see if I can find the time and the umph to go back and hit it again.

Thanks though.... :banghead:

[adam-crockett]

It usually takes an eye that hasn't been looking at it for hours to find those little things. I know it sucks to go back to something that you thought was done though.

[biochemist]

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[wtoddk]

It usually takes an eye that hasn't been looking at it for hours to find those little things. I know it sucks to go back to something that you thought was done though.

Nono...but don't get me wrong!! You're absolutely right about everything you said....and the animation will only get better with more critques! Thanks Adam (and everyone) :love:

[dalmanna]

now the question is are you gonna have an update in time for tomorrow night? as it'll be saturday......see what i did there?.........no, me neither.:rolleyes:

[wtoddk]

now the question is are you gonna have an update in time for tomorrow night? as it'll be saturday......see what i did there?.........no, me neither.:rolleyes:

haha...nope, no update coming until maybe next week. I started a different animation already....I just needed a break from the BTTF one for awhile. :eek:

[dalmanna]

haha...nope, no update coming until maybe next week. I started a different animation already....I just needed a break from the BTTF one for awhile. :eek:

lol i can imagine, i think i need a break from it, and i haven't done one .......yet

[wtoddk]

lol i can imagine, i think i need a break from it, and i haven't done one .......yet

LOL....hey...Dan, have you posted any of your work on CG Talk?

[dalmanna]

nope not yet. soon very soon......... i hope. i got a bunch of deadlines so hopfully things will be ready to go up soon....

i'm finding myself strangely drawn to the back to the future quote so you might end up seeing another one. :D

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