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Julez4001
01-30-2006, 05:37 AM
Is it me or is Luxology's renderer getting more press and attention than Messiah's Render engine.

Curious for a lot of new comers, do you think Messiah's render is easiy enough to use after 3 hours of "feeling" the program out.

What are the initial hangups when using the renderer.

phexitol
01-30-2006, 06:54 AM
Ooh, ooh! Finally a question I can answer ;p

It's actually not so easy to use for a new user, compared to others that I've used (Cinema 4D/Blender/Carrara/Rhino+BMRT). Shader previews are a bit on the unhelpful side, and the render setup is a bit tedious. Couple this with the fact that I tend to spend most of my time modelling (not messiah:studio's fault; I'm just now getting to where I can model photorealistic humans, so I'm devoting a large amount of time to getting the anatomy perfect). Basically, it's an advanced renderer with a non-user-friendly UI. The rest of the program is fairly easy to get into, and the shader network UI is good to work with, but the renderer is in a world of its own. What would take 5 minutes in Cinema4D, I have yet to even be able to do at all in m:s. That and the funky viewport navigation are my only gripes so far.

Layer01
01-30-2006, 08:27 AM
really? i find the UI very intuitive...
compared to say XSI M:S is much easier to see what's going on, what your options are etc..this is at first glance mind you.
is it the shader flow you find hard to understand? or is where stuff is in the UI?

phexitol
01-30-2006, 10:16 AM
Just the renderer. Mostly as a result of the shader thumbnails not accurately representing what the final output will look like. Everything else is quite intuitive, and even the viewport navigation can be gotten around by building a camera rig.

I think it's also partly to do with pMG messing about between versions, since even files downloaded from here do no not resemble the rendered images posted alongside them. The specific files I'm referring to are the ones uploaded by Chikega in this thread:

http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?t=115932

Simply opening the file and hitting render results in an overly bright image.

Wireframes
01-30-2006, 10:23 AM
Is it me or is Luxology's renderer getting more press and attention than Messiah's Render engine.
Curious for a lot of new comers, do you think Messiah's render is easiy enough to use after 3 hours of "feeling" the program out.
What are the initial hangups when using the renderer.

Messiah's Render engine is very easy to use at the first access and fast. However you need to know the limit of each value to have an high end result (GI / Photon ...).

modo is not available at this time and we have to wait a little to compare to messiah. (speed and quality). But i will ;)

Phil

Wegg
01-30-2006, 05:26 PM
There are some really cool things going on with the Luxology renderer. The bucket rendering lends itself to solutions like . . . having all the machines on your network assist you in rendering shaders for models as you design them. VERY cool. If thats the way they go with it.

See thats the thing. So much hype and lots of "ifs".

Messiah's renderer kicks ass right now. I have done quite a few tests comparing speed and quality between the two renderers by re-creating some of their sample scenes and messiah is holding its own. Just as fast. . . Just as good looking. So. . . we will just have to wait and see. My money is still on Messiah but that doesn't negate the fact that Luxology are coming up with some pretty kick ass solutions.

As Fred Tepper once said. . . "Its nice when our plugin devlopers come up with new stuff." ;-)

DMack
01-31-2006, 11:20 AM
[QUOTE=Wegg]There are some really cool things going on with the Luxology renderer. The bucket rendering lends itself to solutions like . . . having all the machines on your network assist you in rendering shaders for models as you design them. VERY cool. If thats the way they go with it..................[QUOTE]

I've got a few machines - being able to get the ALL to render a single frame test render will be awesome! Also, the paint demo, where Brad painted a floor around an object and in real time it updated the radiosity solution - stunning. There are sooo many things that look cool in Modo201 - I've got to say I am VERY excited about its release...BUT....as Wegg says, this is all hands off at the moment - The actual 'worth' of the programme will only be known when it's released (March or before) - How buggy will it be? That's always the cruncher!

Speaking of new releases - How are we doing PMG? A regular update like Lux are doing would cheer up the forum no-end! I've noticed a significant increae in activity on the Luc forum since the weekly Friday updates.....That's got to be good for business....

nvvm
02-10-2006, 11:42 PM
This is something that I have been wondering myself, it would be nice if both messiah and modo allowed for other renders to be plugged in. Seeing how modo has no animation a lot of people are looking at messiah for animation for obvious reasons. It would be great if they played nice together, that way when it comes to using the strengths of either render for a particular project you'd have a choice. It would be nice :D


but I really was snooping around for that progress update thread, was it deleted ?

Wegg
02-11-2006, 12:02 AM
I'll bet the luxology guys will make an .mdd importer.

AAAron
02-11-2006, 01:35 AM
That would kick!! :thumbsup:

Panikos
02-11-2006, 07:29 AM
Yeah, I asked for this a few times, here, there. DMack made a duo :)
I predict that its a matter of time that we will know.
I cant live without messiah CA abilities and expressions.
I've also wished if pmG and Lux go together.

Oh well. I'm praying

DMack
02-11-2006, 05:14 PM
...........I cant live without messiah CA abilities and expressions.
I've also wished if pmG and Lux go together.

Oh well. I'm praying

I am sooo in agreement! I just wish it was Luxology that PMG were 'in discussions' with....but I doubt it. It'd be great to get these two teams working together - Get all the cool messiah:animate stuff integrated into Modo - and get Modo301 out MUCH earlier than expected - But alas, I am now dreaming....Shame.

Layer01
02-12-2006, 02:20 AM
well modo is going to get animation. probably around this time next year...maybe.
but i doubt it would be by integrating messiah. seeing as how modo uses their funky development software (whose name escapes me for now) where all their code is some how streamlined and everything is/can be affected by everything etc..i dunno there's more to it than that..but it doesnt sound like they plan on integrating other software into their soft just yet.
that said i think messiah and modo should be able to compliment each other nicely. no doubt they will both have strengths and weaknesses, hopefully they will both counter act each other weaknesses? one can hope.
anyway as for modo's renderer. it looks very nice, but i'd say messiah's will be far more advanced in its next release than modo's..but then modo's will have only just come out so it is to be expected.
i have both so when they do come out it'll be interesting to comepare..maybe even write a little review...who knows ;)

stooch
02-14-2006, 01:29 PM
Ooh, ooh! Finally a question I can answer ;p

It's actually not so easy to use for a new user, compared to others that I've used (Cinema 4D/Blender/Carrara/Rhino+BMRT). Shader previews are a bit on the unhelpful side, and the render setup is a bit tedious. Couple this with the fact that I tend to spend most of my time modelling (not messiah:studio's fault; I'm just now getting to where I can model photorealistic humans, so I'm devoting a large amount of time to getting the anatomy perfect). Basically, it's an advanced renderer with a non-user-friendly UI. The rest of the program is fairly easy to get into, and the shader network UI is good to work with, but the renderer is in a world of its own. What would take 5 minutes in Cinema4D, I have yet to even be able to do at all in m:s. That and the funky viewport navigation are my only gripes so far.

I totally agree with this. For all its power, its just too much of a pain in the ass to deal with so I resort to what works. Huge contrast to the animation workflow.

Wegg
02-14-2006, 02:44 PM
You know whats funny? When people pop into IRC and start complaining about how slow Messiah's renderer is. . . it doesn't take me long to match any test they throw at me. And then. . . when they try it. . . the FIRST thing they want is more features making it even more complex. :argh:

bradenbickle
02-17-2006, 04:42 AM
I think the comparison is kind of mute right now. Luxology can't seem to get the product launched so until then, it doesn't really exist you know?

Also, from the videos I have watched, etc. it only works on stills and you're not really getting a lot of choices in terms of cameras, etc. It's mainly a renderer to show off your model.

From the stuff I have seen, it is faster than hell though. Way faster than anything I've ever seen.

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