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Shiny
11-27-2002, 07:53 PM
Third post for today... posting some old artwork...

http://hem.passagen.se/shiny1/shark.html

reference pic:
http://www.bprince.com/shark.jpg

Shiny

tariel
11-27-2002, 08:21 PM
That's cool! Pretty realistic in a way !
I like it though i don't like this type of sharks.;)
What software did u use ? Painter ?

niut
11-27-2002, 09:07 PM
Really great work!

Shiny
11-27-2002, 10:55 PM
thanks nuit & tariel! it's helps to hear that..

it's done in photoshop

Totitch
11-27-2002, 11:01 PM
Hey! What happens with sharks !! Everybody is drawing one! :applause:

Very scary one you did! Wooow Scary teeth!
I really like the picture and cold mood! :thumbsup:

Post more!!!

SGT.Squeaks
11-27-2002, 11:02 PM
http://www.bprince.com/shark.jpg


:surprised ....

balistic
11-27-2002, 11:05 PM
Busted.

Totitch
11-27-2002, 11:08 PM
:sad:...

Shiny
11-27-2002, 11:10 PM
fellas, that's the reference picture.. i didn't draw the shark out of my mind....

Biohazard
11-27-2002, 11:15 PM
So give your refs when you submit.

Useless to argue.

balistic
11-28-2002, 12:11 AM
The thing is, Shiny, if you copy someone else's photograph, you haven't created anything. You're using their colors, their composition, their lighting . . . you're being a human copy machine. There's a difference between using a reference, and just copying something outright. Try this the next time you start a piece: get several pieces of reference, from different angles . . . study them and try to understand how the subject works. Break it down into simple shapes and surfaces, and then draw your own unique take on it, with your own lighting and atmosphere.

Don't use the eyedropper tool to match colors either . . . being able to pick the right color by eye is of huge importance in painting.

Shiny
11-28-2002, 12:28 AM
look here....
http://hem.passagen.se/shiny1/shark2.html

balistic
11-28-2002, 12:36 AM
I do believe that you painted it Shiny, but my statement still stands. It's bad to copy other people's photographs because the image has already been made for you. You don't have to think at all when you're doing it, and it can make you artistically lazy. It's also bad to post copies without posting the reference.

Try what I suggested earlier the next time you sit down to paint. Or better yet, set up a still life on your desk. It can be as simple as an apple on a white towel, with a battery-operated flashlight or desk lamp as illumination. That will keep you from cheating yourself on colors, and force you to think about forms and composition. And go easy on the smudge tool . . . it tends to scream "Photoshop".

SGT.Squeaks
11-28-2002, 12:38 AM
you may have painted it, but were just saying that you should use more than one reference and come up with your own pic. Your own lighting, pose, background, etc. It will help you become better as an artist. By looking at a picture and painting your own exactly like it you don't get better, your still copying it. And if you do paint something so similar to your reference be sure to post your reference in your FIRST post. :thumbsup:



Cya,



oh, and please don't leech bandwidth, it cost money. ;)

GRIFFIN
11-28-2002, 08:28 AM
while we're on the topic of sharks, here's a lil' ditty I made a while back. I used the same reference pic (amongst several others) when I built it.

jornkk
11-28-2002, 09:09 AM
This is totally stupid !
it is nothing wrong with copying a photography, or paint from
real life. Art students spend long days studying and copying the old masters. You should off course say that you use a reference, and from what I can see shiny did that. Great work man !!

three
11-28-2002, 10:01 AM
I'm with jornkk on this one, and shiny ofcourse.
Hear hear!

It's a good piece.
:xtreme:

balistic
11-28-2002, 04:38 PM
Originally posted by jornkk
You should off course say that you use a reference, and from what I can see shiny did that.

Only after he was caught.

Shiny
11-29-2002, 01:26 AM
balistic:
i didn't pick the colours from the ref pic... and i've acctually made a tutorial for another site about this shark

shark tutorial (http://www.hemsida.net/sleepwalker/tutorial/)

balistic
11-29-2002, 05:22 AM
Shiny, my opinion that it's shxtty to copy from other people's photographs is a widely held one, but it isn't the only one. Obviously some people are impressed by it, and if it gives you satisfaction, that's fine. But in looking at your website, I can see that you have at least basic drawing skills . . . you've got the potential to be a good creator instead of just a good copier.

If you think I'm full of crap, ignore me, I don't mind. But if you're interested in becoming a more well-rounded artist, try what I said . . . set up a little still life on your desk and paint it. You'll probably be extremely frustrated at first, but once you get the hang of it, you can paint anything.

Think about lighting, composition, 3D forms . . . I mean, how much time do you want to spend working on stuff that'll never really be yours?

Shiny
11-29-2002, 08:51 AM
i agree with you... paint things from real life is the next step... but i think a great first step for an artist is to be able to draw from a photograph, it's only natural....

i'm not mad or anything, absolutely not.

frye
11-29-2002, 09:19 AM
I think its a nice painting and a good tutorial piece.

And balistic should practice what he preaches. Where on his site does he tell the viewer that he used reference for some of his paintings (because he obviously did on some of the prints). Off with his head!!!

balistic
11-29-2002, 04:22 PM
Originally posted by frye
I think its a nice painting and a good tutorial piece.

And balistic should practice what he preaches. Where on his site does he tell the viewer that he used reference for some of his paintings (because he obviously did on some of the prints). Off with his head!!!

None of the work on my site is from done from photographic reference. That's why I don't mention any.

But you're welcome to search Google for photographs of naked women riding wooly rhinos ;)

CHRiTTeR
11-30-2002, 02:06 AM
How did u make an animatable jpg???:eek:

balistic
11-30-2002, 02:28 AM
Originally posted by CHRiTTeR
How did u make an animatable jpg???:eek:

For six long years I have employed, at great expense, a cadre of reknowned Russian scientists laboring deep in my mountain stronghold . . .

Actually it's just a GIF file. Apparently IE doesn't care what file extension you use as long as it's a legit image.

Gentle Fury
11-30-2002, 03:06 AM
Originally posted by balistic
None of the work on my site is from done from photographic reference. That's why I don't mention any.

But you're welcome to search Google for photographs of naked women riding wooly rhinos ;)

and this makes you better then everyone else right??????

give me a break, lets be a little self-righteous!!!!!! How are you supposed to properly grasp the way light reacts to things without first using a photo or real life setup still as reference?????? Photos are great though cuz you can always come back to the same pose/lighting.

Maybe you were born with perfect light theory engrained in your fingertips, but the rest of us had to learn and practice.

i cant stand it when people think they are so far above everyone else because some method they use must be the only way to get something done.

Please do us all a favor......if your comment has nothing at all to do with the piece displayed or the thread topic.....shut the hell up.......and get over yourself!!!!!


that being said, i think this piece really does a great job of re-creating the lighting and mood of the original photo! Great Work!

SGT.Squeaks
11-30-2002, 04:44 AM
Dude, go back to renderosity. Because we don't need crap attitudes like that here.

This is suppose to be a serious forum for professionals or those who strive to be, Hence the title (Cg Talk- Digital Visual Effects Professionals)

Shiny posted a pic and didn't give credit for the pic he copied. He righted his wrong and things are good again, and he handled it very well. Balistic was only helping him to go the next level as an artist. Shiny has talent and can do a lot better than copying pictures. And the subject was dropped. but You had to start things up again and make an ass of yourself while doing so. :shame:

CHRiTTeR
11-30-2002, 06:05 AM
Originally posted by SGT.Squeaks
Dude, go back to renderosity. Because we don't need crap attitudes like that here.

This is suppose to be a serious forum for professionals or those who strive to be, Hence the title (Cg Talk- Digital Visual Effects Professionals)

Shiny posted a pic and didn't give credit for the pic he copied. He righted his wrong and things are good again, and he handled it very well. Balistic was only helping him to go the next level as an artist. Shiny has talent and can do a lot better than copying pictures. And the subject was dropped. but You had to start things up again and make an ass of yourself while doing so. :shame:

Gogogooooo!! :D

balistic
11-30-2002, 08:38 AM
Originally posted by Gentle Fury

Please do us all a favor......if your comment has nothing at all to do with the piece displayed or the thread topic.....shut the hell up.......and get over yourself!!!!!


You might want to read and comprehend the full thread before replying. If you had done so, you would've seen me give advice on painting from life at least twice, and you also would've read a fair bit of perfectly reasonable information explaining why working from photographs is usually bad. I only mentioned that I work without reference when some jackass presumed me a hypocrite.

You know why I can work without reference? It's not a genetic gift, as you seem oddly eager to declare. Rather, it's a whole assload of drawing and painting from observation . . . practicing from life. The more you work from direct observation, the greater your visual vocabulary will become, and the less you'll be hobbled by a need for photographic reference.

Why is working from life always better than working from a photograph? Go back and read what I wrote on page one. With a photograph in front of you, many key artistic decisions have already been made by the person who took the picture . . . composition, lighting, color . . . worse still, your subject is completely flat and devoid of volume.

Copying a photograph is usually like eating food that's already been chewed to a bland paste. There ain't no flavor, and it'll eventually deaden your sense of taste.

This is something you're taught in just about any basic painting class, and has nothing to do with my ego.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with using a photo as reference . . . to figure out what something looks like . . . but once you start taking the lighting from that photo, and the color from that photo, and the composition from the photo . . . I mean, what are you really doing aside from smearing paint around?

Shiny, keep at it. Your line drawings are quite solid. If you still feel like doing photo copies, maybe try taking some pictures of your own . . . that way the whole piece would really be yours, and you wouldn't even need to post the reference :)

Shiny
11-30-2002, 02:59 PM
good idea :)

PhilOsirus
11-30-2002, 03:22 PM
Me I like it, and thanks for making a tutorial too:) And hey I opened a post on the WIP forum recently and always forgot to mention that it was based on a concept art until maybe the 4th post (and nobody told me about it either, I just kept forgeting to mention it).

Gamma_Bomb
12-20-2002, 07:47 PM
Heh, my dad took me to see JAWS at the movies when I was 3. Been scarred for life ever since. Looks good, enough to give me the chills.

As for using photo-reference, nothing wrong with that. Nothing is ever original, ideas are chain reactions.

Remi
12-20-2002, 08:12 PM
If you go here....Anticz (www.anticz.com/images/Illustrate/Images/Wetandreflect.jpg), there's a painting of a girl in some water in the illustration section....that was copied from a picture and if you tell me that guy isn't talented you're an idiot....when you paint from real life that's kinda like copying isn't it....you didn't create the tree in field originally did you..:shrug:

Good work Shiny...I think i'll try this for my first digi painting...just got 12x12 Wacom tablet so I might as well....:thumbsup:

chudofsinister
12-27-2002, 10:05 PM
You guys are schmucks if you think painting from real life is the same as painting from a photo. In a photo all the hardstuff is worked out for you. enough said.
Still nice work on the shark piece. It would be cool to see in three dimensions. I am still waiting for Jaws 5, someday.

balistic, I dig your Quake Piece, I downloaded that image a year or two ago as a desktop and never new who the artist was, good to finally know.Schweet.

MrPunkin
12-28-2002, 12:30 PM
painting from photos is a great way to learn composition, and lighting ,and such before you go out to real life. A lot of times in art schools and classes you are required to paint from a picture because you can actually learn a lot from it. I have done it numerous times. Its no easy task to re-create someone elses photogrpah, and its even harder to copy someone elses painting. we did a Brush lesson in my PS class that had us copy an impressionists painting. The closer we got, the better the score we got. This was to teach brush strokes, color choice and matching, all that. No matter what you paint or draw from, its still a learning experience and such. Good job, I really like it.

MrPunkin
12-28-2002, 12:34 PM
BTW ballistic, no way, your Brian prince. I have your pic of your tree on my wall. I used to be huge into Animation master on on their mailing list. I have always ALWAYS followed your work and just now did I realize that your on this forum too. Anyways, keep up the work!!!!

wille
12-28-2002, 02:50 PM
you guys are such dicks, he made a great effort in painting the shark and its good practice, so stop being so god damn self righteous and judging.

no0ne
12-29-2002, 03:05 PM
thx for the tut, it's great help
& your shark looks evil, nevertheless
great work

thx brian for your advice, love your work 2

thx 2 all the bloopershloopers that have nuffin better 2 do (;

"you guys are such dix...so stop being so god damn self righteous and judging."
((; that one's the weirdest so far, gotta write it down for reference

happy new year's eve 2 every1

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