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pimeto
11-05-2005, 09:23 PM
Hi, i post my first game model here, i need advice on the topology of the mesh ?!
is it ok, whats wrong, advices how to fix it and whats good for rigging...
as you can see, in the pelvis area, knee and the arm, the mesh is strange its because i do some rigging tests to see whats the best way of modeling...
the mesh is 2710 tris, it was 3600... i try not to go over 3000 tris, theare will be gun, and packs of ammo... etc... ;)
it will be nice to get some advices from people from the indystry :)

19x
p.s. if you cant see the image please say i will upload it elsewheare. ;)
and if you need more views, say so ;)
http://img383.imageshack.us/img383/2658/mariner9pq.th.jpg (http://img383.imageshack.us/my.php?image=mariner9pq.jpg)

the_podman
11-06-2005, 07:46 AM
I think you need to resize your image file. It's taking me about 15minutes to load the first quarter of it and it just stalled from there(I'm on 1.5MB cable modem). Check the file size(right-click properties) and if it's over 300Kb, take it into photoshop and reduce it to around 100KB.

-pod :)

pimeto
11-06-2005, 12:17 PM
is it okay now ?
nobody saw the image, thats the reason i get no replys :(

the_podman
11-06-2005, 06:33 PM
Yeah, I can see it now. It looks good from what I can tell. Nice shaping. It's hard to check proportions at this angle though. Could you post "orthographic" view.. Front...side..etc.

pimeto
11-06-2005, 08:38 PM
ok. the proportions are ok, i work on a referens!
i realy spend a lot of time searching the best way to make the mesh nice for rigging... :)

here views...

http://img21.imageshack.us/img21/1194/back0fz.th.jpg (http://img21.imageshack.us/my.php?image=back0fz.jpg) http://img21.imageshack.us/img21/3193/front8ud.th.jpg (http://img21.imageshack.us/my.php?image=front8ud.jpg) http://img21.imageshack.us/img21/417/left8mf.th.jpg (http://img21.imageshack.us/my.php?image=left8mf.jpg)

10x for comennting on my work, i dont understant why nobody doesnt want to coment :( is it so bad ?

pimeto
11-07-2005, 05:09 PM
well i got 300 views, and no comment ?! 8) im so baaad!
my model is so perfect, that nobody dares to comment it 8) nice and thank you very much!

DrakeX
11-07-2005, 05:15 PM
well i got 300 views, and no comment ?!

Hey, the same thing happened to me. Don't feel like you're alone ;)

I really like the topography of the mesh, and it looks like it'll animate well. The only things that stand out to me are the weird bumps on the back of his head and on his back. Is he some kind of cyborg? Also, the odd triangles around the waist look more like compensation for the program incorrectly triangulating the mesh, so I can understand that if that's what they're for. The stomach area also looks a bit strange; perhaps the abs need to be a little narrower. But overall, good job :)

pimeto
11-07-2005, 05:34 PM
The stomach area also looks a bit strange; perhaps the abs need to be a little narrower. But overall, good job :)can you please explain that ? i cant understand you :D

http://img495.imageshack.us/img495/9494/mariner7ww.th.jpg (http://img495.imageshack.us/my.php?image=mariner7ww.jpg)
for the yellow, yes its a part of the styff he will have on him :)

the red, its no compensation, theare is no problem to make that tris right... but as i said i try to make bether bending in animation...

for example, the game Chronicles of riddick, when riddick crouches hes ass is becoming a big edge!!!
it was bad bending that i noticet... i dont have screenshot to show... :cry:

10x for commenting, :)

DrakeX
11-08-2005, 06:53 AM
A picture works well, no matter what language ;)

I don't mean his entire body needs to be narrower, just the edge of the ab muscles. The lines on the image show what I mean.

the_podman
11-08-2005, 09:08 AM
for example, the game Chronicles of riddick, when riddick crouches hes ass is becoming a big edge!!!
it was bad bending that i noticet... i dont have screenshot to show... :cry:



The noticable stretching face/edge in the game is due to the fact that it's got a high res shadow normal map on a low-res model. It's one of my personal gripes with normal mapped characters. They look all pretty on a plinth but ugly when you animate them. You don't notice this so much with simple faked shadow textures.
This can't really be avoided in normal mapped games unless you place more than a 3 edge influence on the ass bend area. Typically, you'd have 3 edges to maintain volume. 1 edge with a skin weight value of 1 to the root joint and 0 on the leg, another edge with a value of .5 on the root and .5 on the leg, and the 3rd edge with a value of 1 on the leg and 0 on the root.... give or take a few .2 or .3 values in there.

Take a look at what the edges in the ass are doing in this video:
ASSDEFORMTEST (http://rodbrett.com/BoboImp/asstest.swf)

Now if you were to slap on a high res light map info on there, you would notice the stretch more. The high res normal map is completely at the mercy of a couple of verts underneath it. The best use of normal maps in games is when they use it to enhance certain rigid areas(googles, helmets). I never liked normal maps on deformable muscles. They look too awkward imo.


The mesh is looking fine right now. Only thing I could crit would be the legs. They could be slighly more cylindrical, it's a little boxy right now. Also, you don't need to be too literal with the reference. I would make sure that the character has a nice sillouette. Turn off all the lights in the viewport and look at an ortho front and side. Does the character have nice defined "shapes"? Make sure the basic shapes are interesting before adding detail.

One other thing.. Try and not worry about triangles and terminating the 5 sided edges too much when initially shaping the model in the beginning. I have found that if I start putting in too many triangles right away, I can no longer "feel" where the loops and shaping of the mesh should be.

Hope it helps. I'm no pro so take my advice with a grain of salt as they say. :)

-pod

pimeto
11-08-2005, 10:09 AM
http://img366.imageshack.us/img366/9349/silho8fy.th.jpg (http://img366.imageshack.us/my.php?image=silho8fy.jpg)
yes, i've looked the sillouette its okey i think ?
abouth the legs... i still think on them, i thouth to be with boots.. some kind, but ill think of something more apropriate :) (like a part of the suit).

i was wondering, abouth the edge influenc in games...rigs...
does this make it heavy to calculate ?
like, if i put a lot of edges, for smooth bending it might get worse performans ? like bad FPS or something ?

p.s. LOL i hope you understand me :) :thumbsup:

the_podman
11-08-2005, 07:27 PM
I suppose it depends greatly on the actual game engine itself. The only game engine I've got experience playing around with in UnrealEngine 2. Performance starts to slow down a little if I've got a character over 4000 poly in there on a moderate PC. However, it also depends on how many "entities" are on screen at the same time. Bone count sometimes plays a factor too. But I wouldn't worry too much about it. Just get the peice to look good and add edges when you need them. As long as the polys are not wasted I don't see any problem adding a poly or two for better deformation. I've never skinned a character in XSI, so I don't know how much control that app gives you with vert weights. If I had the time to learn another app, I would tackle XSI or MAX, however, Maya and Motionbuilder are already a handful for me. :)


-pod

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