CGTalk - Still: my 1st head (WIP)

phreaknasty

11-27-2002, 06:27 PM

hey thirdeye,

the form... is coming along nicely as you update it. the new forehead in particular is much better. two minor anatomical suggestions... the edges of the mouth are a bit too "pinchy," there should be a more subtle and meaty transition. the philtrum (little divot between the nose and the mouth) seems too well defined, smooth it out a bit.

the wireframe... as i see it, you have too areas of major concern and one lesser so. i've attached an image below where red marks the areas most in need of reworking, and blue delineates a suggested line but not a necessary one. follow this link for an example of one possible layout... (http://www.cgtalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=26813) also run your real face through some exercises, see where the creases are and sketch them out on a rendered version of your face.

ThirdEye

11-27-2002, 07:54 PM

Thank you for comments, it seems my head is not very correct. Anyway that was the old wire, new one is not so different..

Jhonus

11-28-2002, 11:17 AM

hey.... just drew over your pic :)

just point out a couple of things...... the area next to the eye looks devoid of a certain bone..... that runs down the side of the eye then hoops across to the ear, forming the outline of the temple area.

also the nostril cuts a corner too tight and shows some pinching...... it should flow down the face a little easier and smooth. also there is sometimes a little hump there. that area in general is actually quite smooth and flows nicely...... is usually lighting that makes it look like there are hard edges there.

anyway i love it..... next model, if you focus on the mesh more i think it will be...... even better. keep at it

edit... oh yeah... also it looks like the skin flows straight up into the nostril hole..... need more shift in contour there... little rise up at the opening of the hole and down into the nostril, then straight up to the sinuses :)

AXE

11-28-2002, 11:21 AM

great modelling skills!

I think the ear looks a bit weird. Still an excellent model, tho'.

AXE

rISO

11-28-2002, 11:25 AM

many compliments for the model i like it very mutch, it's a good job and i hope u will texture it and maybe do some facial phonemes

ciau °L°L°

:wavey:

ThirdEye

11-28-2002, 12:45 PM

I fixed what it was possible to fix.

ThirdEye

11-30-2002, 10:49 AM

I hope it's finished, GI illumination.

suffix

11-30-2002, 10:56 AM

HOT DAMN!!!!!!! geez thirdeye!!! i can't belive that's your first head!!! i'm going to have to agree with most people here... it's great to see you rocking C4D with a vengence...

and i'm going to stop modeling cartoony stuff soon and try for realistic people... and i was already dreading it... (i really don't want to do it but feel that i should) and now seeing your 1st head is really depressing... but damn it also gives me hope!!!! looks great! beware guys when i model my first ugly head coming in a month you might be blinded.. by how bad it looks... or maybe how stunning it looks.... or maybe how fraked out cause it looks just like you! now that would be nuts... okay i'm rambling like an old man......

ThirdEye

11-30-2002, 11:08 AM

Thank you man, prepare yourself to spend a lot of time on realistic modeling and to rebuild ears many times :scream:

suffix

11-30-2002, 11:17 AM

yeah lots of time i will spend... man yeah ears... i forgot about those.... can't all my models just have a hat or helmet and headphones on? please?

ThirdEye

11-30-2002, 11:18 AM

If you're able to model a character like this:

http://stuzzi.free.fr/book/wip/wip.htm

then you don't need ears at all ;)

gabdab

11-30-2002, 11:18 AM

Cool
congrats

Non male per un italianoh ))

suffix

11-30-2002, 11:28 AM

Originally posted by ThirdEye_01
If you're able to model a character like this:

http://stuzzi.free.fr/book/wip/wip.htm

then you don't need ears at all ;)

LOL i'll work on that! coming right up!

ThirdEye

11-30-2002, 11:32 AM

Good Luck! :scream:

suffix

11-30-2002, 11:37 AM

thanks! i'll need it and lots of time... damn realistic modeling! why can't eveyone look like a cartoon? :applause: :applause:

ThirdEye

11-30-2002, 11:40 AM

LOL! :thumbsup:

gabdab

11-30-2002, 12:23 PM

..
Show us the real face of...it.

Gab-

ThirdEye

11-30-2002, 12:29 PM

I'll texture him soon :wavey:

ThirdEye

11-30-2002, 03:56 PM

here we go! :thumbsup:

gabdab

11-30-2002, 04:11 PM

Would you use morphs ?
+
Gab-
:bounce:

ThirdEye

11-30-2002, 04:13 PM

I'm not planning animating him, too early ;)

ThirdEye

11-30-2002, 05:54 PM

Added a bit of fresnel reflection ;)

Baldasseroni

11-30-2002, 05:59 PM

Great modelling and nice rendering, actually the material looks like resin ..you just have to find some good reference photographs and texturize it as it earns :)

Keep up the good work

Ale

ThirdEye

11-30-2002, 06:25 PM

new GI settings and a white background, thank you Ale! :thumbsup:

ThirdEye

11-30-2002, 06:27 PM

the image :p

gabdab

12-01-2002, 07:55 AM

When are you going to give him ( her ) the gift of sight ?

eheh

Gab-

Amaan

12-01-2002, 10:45 AM

this is looking very good indeed! you might want to check the outer corners of his eyes... and near the outer edges of teh lips, the skin folds in to the mouth a bit

just me 2 cents :)

great work!

LordEzzat

12-01-2002, 12:28 PM

man thats looking great for your first head better then me by far Keep it up cant wait to see final renders!!:applause: :thumbsup:

ThirdEye

12-01-2002, 01:45 PM

Oh... I can see... :scream:

gabdab

12-01-2002, 02:01 PM

..put a rolling coin on the background and a couple of fantasy cars..

:buttrock:

ThirdEye

12-01-2002, 02:24 PM

:surprised

JulianJohnson

12-01-2002, 11:15 PM

Hi there, very very well done, specially as its your first head :thumbsup:
The first head I ever made was awful, so producing a head like this on your first try shows a good deal of talent, good luck with your texturing I've added a link to Gianluca Mattia's website http://www.studioideabari.it/gianlucamattia/

you being a c4d user you probably would of already seen his site, but I thought I would just let you know their's a good free scene of a head on their which might help you with your texturing work, by looking at his, your see the type of textures your need, as well and lighting and shader.

Best Wishes

Julian_J

ThirdEye

12-08-2002, 04:30 PM

Since the system crashed I post my pic again :bounce:

leigh

12-08-2002, 05:28 PM

Looking great so far :thumbsup:

For a first head, this is really great. The strong features are particularly cool because most peoples first heads are very generic looking, whereas this one has a very definite character.

Suggestions:

- The model is just a little too symmetrical. Human faces are never perfectly symmetrical ;) Just make slight changes to each side to differentiate them a little.

- the specularity needs more variation. Especially between the lips and the rest of the face. Lips should be a lot shinier than the surrounding skin. Also, take a look at a human face, and you'll see that the tip of the nose, and the forehead, the areas just below the eyes and sometimes also the cheeks, tend to be a bit shinier than the other skin as well.
Another spec/reflection thing you might want to consider adding is to make the areas around the eyes appear wet. I'm referring to the actual edges of the flesh around the eyes, like the area where the eyelashes are.

- Your colour map is very slightly blotchy, maybe a little too much. Skin is a bit blotchy, but not quite like this. Did you use a photograph as the base for it? Perhaps the photo was a little low res.

- A slight anomaly in the colour map is, if you look very closely, you will see that there are two straight lines running vertically just above the nose :surprised
It looks like they may be supposed to be wrinkles, because they look a little like the wrinkles you've put in the forehead.

- Add a bump map! Make some cool crows feet around the eyes, and add some grain to the skin. Also add some bump detail to the lips.

- On the eyes, make the corners a little pink. Eyeballs are usually rather pink in the corners. Also, adding some faint veins might look nice. Apart from that, the eyes are really awesome.

- You might want to add a very slight "nine o'clock shadow" to his face. Also, in the bump map, make the skin in the beard areas rougher.

These are the best tips I can offer at the moment :)
So far, as I said, it's looking really cool, so I'm sure that in no time you'll have it looking totally bloody ace!

Oh, and I'd just like to compliment you on the fact that you added spots and skin blemishes to the face - that kind of detail is so important, and sadly, all too often overlooked. Great job!

ThirdEye

12-09-2002, 12:41 AM

Thank you really much Leigh, some of the best constructive comments i've received so far. :thumbsup:

ThirdEye

12-09-2002, 01:17 AM

all remaining maps added, now i have to fix the eyes and add a sweater and a bit DOF ;)

PS Special thanks to Leigh and Eklettica for their support and suggestions!

BiTMAP

12-09-2002, 01:38 AM

Its amazing :) I like how clean it looks, and your cage looks very lowpoly which prolly is good.

ThirdEye

12-09-2002, 01:47 AM

Circa 24000 polys if i freeze the subdee cage with 2 subdivisions (I use 2 subdivisions in editor and 3 in rendering). Rene Morel models are circa 20000 polys, maybe my mesh is even too dense. :shrug:

rISO

12-09-2002, 11:59 AM

i really think u got to make less the prominence of the lip..

make the eye's shape bigger...same for the ears.. because it seems too "female" IMHO

:love: :wavey:

jamihn

12-09-2002, 03:12 PM

The spec and bump maps really helped bring up the realism of the face. great stuff. boy, leigh knows her stuff!:bounce:

ThirdEye

12-09-2002, 05:49 PM

Added a sweater and veins on the eye. (I erased that unwanted eyeliner fx")

Baldasseroni

12-09-2002, 07:20 PM

Groovy ... :P

Ahem....this is a big improvement compared to the first versions.

The looking of the face seems well defined now and pretty good, although i would prefer a more photorealistic approach, but actually just one thing really bugs me....the eyebrows.
They really seem to be "hand drawn", too much regular, too much squared, this is very noticeable especially to the sides close to the nose.Check some photo references and look how they are irregular and less dense...probably i would even make their colour more saturated.

Keep up the good work ....it`s getting better at every update :thumbsup:

Ale

Remi

12-09-2002, 07:32 PM

I have to agree to a previous post...his lips are a bit much...looks like he's saying mmmmhmmmm...sweet thang...you know ala Birdcage.......and the texture of the sweater could definitly use some work.....I like the eyes now...big improvment there....Keep up the good work...:surprised :buttrock:

Jango

12-09-2002, 08:26 PM

Thirdyyyyyyyy, this rules.
Very nice.. keep on.
but i think the start of his hairroots is too clean line

SPIDER2544

12-09-2002, 09:51 PM

great job dude fantasic stuff really beutiful

but the one thing that i noticed was that his shaved head is just to perfect go out and shave your head or find some one witha shaved head one thing you will notice when you get close is that there are scars on there head and bumps no ones head is that erfectly shaped and unmared when there head is shaved fix that and maybe the eyelashes (they look kind of girly to me) and this thing will rock

great work dude i love to see the way on how a roject comes along youve come so far dont quit now hehehe

koinu

12-09-2002, 10:15 PM

Excellent model and it isn't your first!!!! Kinda wouldn't want to cross this guy in the pool hall....

BiTMAP

12-09-2002, 10:37 PM

btw I just noticed your nose is well done and I noticed things bout mine just the other day that yours has :)

ThirdEye

12-09-2002, 10:41 PM

Originally posted by koinu
Excellent model and it isn't your first!!!! Kinda wouldn't want to cross this guy in the pool hall....

It is my 1st, look at the entire wip, every time i look at the first post of this thread with that funny grey head i lough :scream:

ThirdEye

12-09-2002, 10:41 PM

lAugh :p

koinu

12-10-2002, 01:20 AM

Well come on over and show me your technique!!!! Excellent texturingg.....

ThirdEye

12-10-2002, 05:01 PM

Better lighting (it was sufficient to look at the Giorgio Armani website and trying to reproduce a good lighting), I removed the sweater, i have to work a lot on it, i slightly modified the nose too. Eyebrows still suck, i know it. I'm definitely satisfied with eyes now :)

AXE

12-10-2002, 05:07 PM

hey Third, it's getting really interesting now! I would try to concentrate on the eyes, to give 'em a better look (I'm talking about materials, shading, lighting). You should give'em a more "liquid-like" look, they're too dry at the moment :)

AXE

LordGolem

12-10-2002, 10:05 PM

Wow Third! I think he's getting ever more realistic :D You're on the right way!!

ThirdEye

12-11-2002, 07:31 PM

Now i'm gonna work on those damned eyebrows... :rolleyes:

jamihn

12-11-2002, 07:38 PM

:beer: looking better and better!

gabdab

12-12-2002, 07:20 AM

I almost can smell the skin odour..nice..

MeshedP

12-12-2002, 06:12 PM

:)

Nice improvement, Third! U r on the right way: take care about the bump.

ThirdEye

12-16-2002, 12:45 PM

Another update (i came back to the mesh since i didn't like the way it turned...) :rolleyes:

JulianJohnson

12-16-2002, 01:31 PM

looking good ThirdEye well done :thumbsup:

ThirdEye

12-16-2002, 04:50 PM

still trying to find a good lighting setup...

squidinc

12-16-2002, 05:29 PM

this kicks ass :bounce:, you've inspired me to give head modelling a go, nice one third eye :thumbsup: :applause: :beer:

Baldasseroni

12-16-2002, 07:46 PM

I think that the new refinements to give a more hard and though look to the head need some smoothing.

Here in detail the areas which need a bit of smoothing in my opinion

http://www.eklettica.com/head.jpg

The lips are very well shaped, but i think that the bump map to simulate small wrinkles in the upper lip is quite inappropriate, better to remove it.

Still waiting for a great pair of eyebrows !;)

Ciao, Ale

raden

12-16-2002, 08:18 PM

Hi ThirdEye_01

Excellent modelling:applause:
The texture is welldone (altho need bit of specularity, most face skin are a bit oily except if this guy is using some powder ;) ).

Anyway I really like some imperfections you gave him, like that scar on his hair area:thumbsup:. However I agree with Eklettica abot the bump on his upper lip. And if you look at his left lower lip the texture is a bit bigger than the lip area as if he wears lipstick. The texture on his chin area looks abit distorted. And this is one thing from my personal taste..I think his head would be better if you tone it down (looks like a cone there:p ) but like I said it's only my personal preference:) .
All in all this is a great job actually:applause: Looking forward for the eyelashes. Keep up thhe goodwork ThirdEye_01. You are talented:thumbsup:

Ciaoo:wavey:

ThirdEye

12-16-2002, 08:43 PM

Thank you really much guys, here's another point of view, i'll work on it soon :thumbsup:

MeshedP

12-16-2002, 10:11 PM

Nice... but you should spend more time on eyelids. The Texturing is GREAT, boy!!!:bounce:

ThirdEye

12-16-2002, 11:31 PM

Hehehehe grazie mille Seba! :thumbsup:

BlindFish

12-17-2002, 12:36 AM

i like the head. it has a personality to it.
And when i see you first post and the last .. you've improve a lot :)

maybe you could use a less flat lightning.
voila !

LordEzzat

12-17-2002, 08:10 AM

Wow unbelievable texturing so far great job man!!!!!!!!!!!11:applause: :bounce: :thumbsup:

ThirdEye

12-17-2002, 01:01 PM

Thank you very much guys, any suggestion about lighting? :shrug:

ThirdEye

12-17-2002, 04:58 PM

Some slight fixes (especially eye and forehead regions), new illumination.

ThirdEye

12-17-2002, 05:13 PM

Another angle...

stuzzi

12-17-2002, 11:23 PM

what to say :hmm: ,each artist have his own taste.But many things aren't anatomically impossible.The boundaries of Eyelid are not deep enough.I can't imagine the flesh.To me the nose is too sharpe,try too smooth the shape then it might be better.Here is some Uv's probleme,for instance on the chin and at the top of the upper lips :shame:

but it's a good job,nice:beer:

ThirdEye

12-18-2002, 02:00 AM

Thank you Seb, your advices will be really helpful ;)

ThirdEye

12-19-2002, 01:31 PM

Worked on skull and eyebrows...

leigh

12-19-2002, 01:31 PM

Hey, that's coming along nicely :thumbsup:

The only thing that concerns me a bit is the bump map. You've put in lines here and there that are a little too harsh. For instance, that little wrinkle at the top of his nose, next to his eyebrow - it's too harsh, and therefore doesn't really look natural.

Those lines along the top of his lip are also too string. It looks like his mouth is all wrinkled above the lips, and I don't think that is the right look. Look at a young persons lips, and you'll notice that the transition between the lip and the upper lip skin is extremely smooth.

The actual skin grain in the bump map is stretching on the chin. You may need to adjust your UV map/ projection to fix that.

You also need to add a roughness to the beard and moustache areas, since the skin there tend to become rough after years of shaving ;)

On another note, those eyelids are begging for a gloss map :D

Great progress though, you are very talented :thumbsup:

ThirdEye

12-19-2002, 05:05 PM

Thank you very much Leigh, that little wrinkle at the top of the nose should be a scar... :shrug: I'll correct all the other things you put a light on, thank you again :thumbsup:

levin

12-19-2002, 05:21 PM

better and better Thirdeye_01!

can wee see some 3/4 views? mesh and texmaps?

reaperman

12-19-2002, 05:27 PM

bloody hell!!! i've just finish my first head too. i will die a happy man tomorrow if it was half as good as yours. nice work man...

ThirdEye

12-19-2002, 06:47 PM

i added a bit of 3s :shrug:

flamedevil

12-19-2002, 06:56 PM

Now it looks great, personally i prefer the last version with sss.
The map is really good, if only i could done one like that for my head :buttrock: i still have to work again...

That's great man :thumbsup:

rochus

12-19-2002, 07:01 PM

i don't like where the eyes are looking to..

ThirdEye

12-19-2002, 07:33 PM

Ok I'll put the focal point more far than how is now ;)

ThirdEye

12-20-2002, 09:27 PM

Originally posted by levin
better and better Thirdeye_01!

can wee see some 3/4 views? mesh and texmaps?

Be patient, i'll post all these things once I've finished everything ;)

kellambrown

12-22-2002, 02:05 AM

Actually it's just his left eye that is out of alignment - or maybe he is looking at something nearby that is on his right side?

In general, looking great. As far as anatomy - the shallow "v" in his brow ridge above the bridge of his nose should not be part of the skull as it is now - sometimes this shape will be seen but it is usually the result of muscle action and usually then it is formed as two small bunches that cause more of a "w" shape in that region.

Now that I've started criting I guess I have to start posting. Well, loading up max 5 over Christmas so no more excuses.

Keep up the attention to detail.

Yes, and I'm waiting for eyebrows too - I need a tut for that.

Ariel

12-22-2002, 02:13 AM

Good work. I do agree with Stuzzi that the eyelids should follow a 3d surface (the eye) and wrap around it. If you look at the the model from below, the eyelid should be a little less planar and more "spherical" for lack of a better term.

Keep it up it's improving fast! :thumbsup:

ThirdEye

12-22-2002, 10:32 AM

@kellambrown:
"In general, looking great. As far as anatomy - the shallow "v" in his brow ridge above the bridge of his nose should not be part of the skull as it is now - sometimes this shape will be seen but it is usually the result of muscle action and usually then it is formed as two small bunches that cause more of a "w" shape in that region." mmm can you be more precise? I don't think I fully understood what you mean... :shrug:

@Ariel: I'm working right now on it, thank you ;)

ThirdEye

12-22-2002, 10:53 AM

Oh kellambrown I forgot, both eyes have are targeted to a null object, they can't be out of alignment ;)

ThirdEye

12-22-2002, 01:07 PM

A couple renders before moving for holidays.. ;)

ThirdEye

12-22-2002, 01:08 PM

Another view...

ThirdEye

12-22-2002, 01:09 PM

A couple experiments with Ps (herb ritts docet) ;)

ThirdEye

12-22-2002, 01:10 PM

last one, cya'll next week, happy new year everybody :beer:

o-phile

12-22-2002, 02:39 PM

@ one point (for some reason) he reminded me of the main character of HITMAN (you know... the actual hitman... lol)

but I WUV IT! lol, this is groovylicious oO

Beechdbum

12-23-2002, 09:14 PM

It such a great texture, what did you do to create it?

leigh

12-23-2002, 11:48 PM

Those PS enhanced ones are cool :thumbsup:

Those squinty eyes are a bit creepy though :sad:

Have a great xmas and new year!

zandernice

12-24-2002, 07:09 AM

I would suggest adjusting the eyebrows (if that hasn't been mentioned yet) and also take some notes from that cool stalhburg tutorial on skin.

Its looking so real.

gnarlycranium

12-24-2002, 09:23 AM

Holy toledo, batman!!! http://pages.prodigy.net/rogerlori1/emoticons/oogle.gif Okay... what the heck do you REALLY do? You said this is your first head-- what HAVE you been modeling and texturing for the past ten years?! I mean... gack... the first post was fine... and then at the end it's all just.... whoa... and I don't know how the heck you got between the two, that's just crazy!!

Umm... only crit I can think of, is stuzzi is right about the eyes. The eyelids are too thin against the surface of the eyeballs, if you look close at eyelids they've got some fun roundness and edges to them...

and how is your mesh laid out now? are you going to animate him much?

ThirdEye

12-30-2002, 02:03 PM

I'm back guys, i will post some updates as soon as I can work on this head. Thank you all :D

leigh

01-01-2003, 04:45 PM

Looking forward to seeing some updates :)
Hope you had a great new year :beer:

ThirdEye

01-01-2003, 08:10 PM

o-phile: thank you for your comments, i really appreciate 'em :)

Beechdbum: the texture needs a lot of work but it's 80-90% hand painted. The only parts cloned from photos are spots, eyebrows and some pore here and there... photoshop can do miracles ;)

zandernice: the stahlberg tut is really good but he has a completely different approach, he uses the toon shader instead of a real 3S simulator, he uses many lights and simple scanline-raytrace (i prefer a GI skydome and 3 lights, the render takes 10 mins circa, not very much)

Gnarly Cranium: i'm "seriously" into 3D since 2001, I'm a simple architecture student at university, 3D for me is only an expensive hobby ;) ... And believe me, my head isn't anything special, go on stuzzi.free.fr, www.amazonsoul.com or http://www.cg-art.i12.com/ if you wanna see some real masters ;)

Leigh: updates will come soon, thank you for staying tuned on this thread, i really appreciate it :) :bounce:

PS I think i'll give him the name of "Alexandre", what do y'all think about it? :p

Stahlberg

01-02-2003, 08:31 AM

Hi Thirdeye, you asked me for comments so even though I'm very late in this thread :) - here goes:
Wow! Excellent!
Crits: The eyelids seem too thin, and I think there are not enough lashes; the bump map on the mouth is too regular.

both eyes have are targeted to a null object, they can't be out of alignment

I think they can...
or at least look like it, even though we think they can't be... I had this problem for years... until I realized that the human eye is probably not geometrically perfectly centered when looking at infintiy, but roughly 5 degrees outward, if you see what I mean. Maybe I'm wrong, there's no way I can test my theory, in any case it sure seems to work in practise. The reason is obvious - our outer corners are further back on the eyeball than the inner corners, so 'centering' the eye will expose more of the eyeball on the outsides, always making the character look cross-eyed.

Another thing, you can still use the translucency-fake part of my skin shading method. I think you should, since the darker parts of your skin are a bit greenish, and the lit parts a bit orangy, which is making your skin look a bit metallic. Just layer the effect on top of the whole thing, very subtly. Or maybe you have another way of making the shadows redder, if so then try that. Maybe simply making the highlights more bluish will be enough.

But let me repeat, excellent, especially for the first head! :)

ThirdEye

01-02-2003, 12:41 PM

Thank you really much Steven, this is the result of a morning on your tutorial...

ThirdEye

01-02-2003, 12:43 PM

some "artistic" postprocessing as usual... ;)

Jango

01-02-2003, 12:54 PM

WOHOOO °L°L°

I am VERY impressed :beer:
you did very good job here.
nice!
inspireing

ThirdEye

01-02-2003, 01:50 PM

Oren-nayar instead of blinn... what's the best? :shrug:

LordGolem

01-02-2003, 05:43 PM

I think oren-nayar is better! Even if the difference is not so strong!

leigh

01-02-2003, 07:29 PM

I also prefer the Oren-Nayar :)
Looking great! :thumbsup:
Although I still think those scars are just a little too deep.

ThirdEye

01-02-2003, 08:03 PM

I will work on them soon, I'm a bit busy with the mouth ;)

leigh

01-02-2003, 08:08 PM

Excellent ;)

ThirdEye

01-02-2003, 11:49 PM

worked on forehead, mouth and specular, i'll definitely use oren nayar :thumbsup:

gnarlycranium

01-03-2003, 02:19 AM

Originally posted by ThirdEye_01
Gnarly Cranium: i'm "seriously" into 3D since 2001, I'm a simple architecture student at university, 3D for me is only an expensive hobby ;) ... And believe me, my head isn't anything special, go on stuzzi.free.fr, www.amazonsoul.com or http://www.cg-art.i12.com/ if you wanna see some real masters ;)
Ohh sure, make me feel even more pathetically outclassed! http://pages.prodigy.net/rogerlori1/emoticons/crazy3.gif ...Yet I can't stop looking... heheh... damn you all!

RiVeN

01-03-2003, 07:01 AM

dun worry about it, those are actually pictures of real people and they pretend like they modelled them... lies! all lies!

lol that first site... that one guy in the top left corner of the gallery... no way that's CG... I DONT BELIEVE!!! :shame:

ThirdEye

01-03-2003, 08:29 AM

I hope this thread will not transform into an AmazonSoul forum :D
Anyway it's not a mistery that Renè Morel is my favorite digital artist ;)

ThirdEye

01-03-2003, 10:20 AM

New update... a bit more 3S on ears and new specular settings... criticize please ;)

augustus

01-03-2003, 10:32 AM

Great job. :applause:

But i think skin seems too, uhm, painted. You need some color variations on face parts, such as more red on ears and cheekbones. Also need work on specularity

------
Sorry for my terrible English.

Hexodam

01-03-2003, 11:04 AM

first head my ass :applause: :applause:

ThirdEye

01-03-2003, 11:09 AM

Watch my 1st post on this thread, i laugh everytime i see that grey bunch of polygons ;)

ThirdEye

01-03-2003, 04:34 PM

Originally posted by augustus
Great job. :applause:

But i think skin seems too, uhm, painted. You need some color variations on face parts, such as more red on ears and cheekbones. Also need work on specularity

------
Sorry for my terrible English.

The fact is the maps are 90% hand made, so they're a bit too uniform perhaps... anyway this is my last update ;)

leigh

01-03-2003, 04:38 PM

Last update?? :cry:
Well, I think it turned out really well :thumbsup:
Looking forward to seeing this one all nicely lit up and beautfully rendered in the gallery section ;)

Remi

01-03-2003, 04:39 PM

good work....all around....very good work:thumbsup:

Looking forward to your next wip:surprised

ThirdEye

01-03-2003, 04:43 PM

Originally posted by Leigh
Last update?? :cry:
Well, I think it turned out really well :thumbsup:
Looking forward to seeing this one all nicely lit up and beautfully rendered in the gallery section ;)

Leigh maybe i expressed myself badly... last for today, not forever, it's far to be perfect yet ;)

Thank you Remi :)

lerpiedood

01-03-2003, 08:45 PM

That's pretty good for your first head, amazing even. Great modeling, great texturing, can't really find any problems except for that the corners of mouth are too sharp, and he looks sad.

ThirdEye

01-03-2003, 11:28 PM

10.000 views, wow! :bounce: let's celebrate it with another update, i changed the forehead :D

ThirdEye

01-04-2003, 12:10 PM

Some slight change on the mesh structure and beard added, i hope you like it :wavey:

FLOw

01-04-2003, 01:07 PM

you just made the list.....

:thumbsup:

ThirdEye

01-04-2003, 01:13 PM

The list?? :surprised

Claudio72

01-04-2003, 01:15 PM

ti stai veramente avvicinando considerevolmente a una foto porca miseria puttana!!!!

Complimenti!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

keep update us with your progress!!!!

ThirdEye

01-04-2003, 01:17 PM

hahahaha grazie mille :scream:

FLOw

01-04-2003, 01:49 PM

thats right...the list :D

ThirdEye

01-04-2003, 01:51 PM

which list? the list for shopping at the market? :D

FLOw

01-04-2003, 03:44 PM

I will say no more...one day I will come for you...and then the game will begin...

how's it goin?

ThirdEye

01-04-2003, 04:10 PM

it's going well, i'm going to change something again ;) In the meanwhile i can entertain you with this :D

soundwav_

01-04-2003, 04:23 PM

looking amazing...!!! :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
how about different angles? ;)

ThirdEye

01-04-2003, 04:43 PM

what about this one? :wavey:

santiago

01-04-2003, 04:57 PM

I haven't followed the whole thread...
the texture appears to begin to show some of its mapping direction as it gets closer to the top of his head.
I use MAX 4 and texporter, so I usually use the mesh wireframe as reference for the density of the texture, and tend to make it less dense near the top, so that it doesn't seem to stream to the tip. Works ok for me so far, there's probably a better way.

It's minimally noticeable anyhow, great job!

KotsVlok

01-04-2003, 05:04 PM

Woooowwww :eek: ...Really cool work!!!

//I really like the green eyes and the scar on his nose/between the eyes :D

ThirdEye

01-04-2003, 06:39 PM

Originally posted by santiago
I haven't followed the whole thread...
the texture appears to begin to show some of its mapping direction as it gets closer to the top of his head.
I use MAX 4 and texporter, so I usually use the mesh wireframe as reference for the density of the texture, and tend to make it less dense near the top, so that it doesn't seem to stream to the tip. Works ok for me so far, there's probably a better way.

It's minimally noticeable anyhow, great job!

I'll pay attention to that, thank you santiago :)

leigh

01-04-2003, 09:41 PM

Wow, that's fantastic!! :D
The beard is an excellent addition :thumbsup: Wonderful work :applause:

Hexodam

01-04-2003, 10:45 PM

someone give this man a gold thing!:buttrock:

ThirdEye

01-04-2003, 11:47 PM

Originally posted by Hexodam
someone give this man a gold thing!:buttrock:

Wow, thank you hexodam, i said it to my mum, she said she would give me a golden chocolate coin, yum! :wavey: :drool: :thumbsup:

leigh

01-04-2003, 11:55 PM

Wait a few minutes, I have a surprise for you... ;)

leigh

01-04-2003, 11:58 PM

Check out the front page of CG Talk!!!

That's something you can show your mom!! :D:D:D

Xilica

01-05-2003, 12:00 AM

w00h00

this head rocks

ThirdEye

01-05-2003, 12:03 AM

/me doesn't believe to his eyes :surprised

THANK YOU!!!!!

gmask

01-05-2003, 12:04 AM

Sure has come along way... good job!

ThirdEye

01-05-2003, 12:08 AM

Let's celebrate with a new logo (i took inspiration to my favorite artist ever, Michelangelo) and new environment maps for the eyes :wavey:

IDownupI

01-05-2003, 12:19 AM

i like the scar on the nose;)

IDownupI

01-05-2003, 12:20 AM

CAn he do this :scream:

little5points

01-05-2003, 12:26 AM

That's really incredible:thumbsup:

Does it seem like it should be less white in the outside corner of his right eye?

gmask

01-05-2003, 12:30 AM

Originally posted by little5points
That's really incredible:thumbsup:

Does it seem like it should be less white in the outside corner of his right eye?

Couldn't help but to give you a shout out..little5points.. I haven't been there in awhile :beer:

little5points

01-05-2003, 12:34 AM

:beer:

that's what I'll be doing there tonight :)

BLuEFroG

01-05-2003, 12:36 AM

Great Job my friend! I think that you have done an amazing job so far im just working on the whole "Learning" thing w/ Maya 4.5 unlimited.... just cant seem to figure out how to get the right shapes

ThirdEye

01-05-2003, 12:38 AM

Bluefrog: take some good reference and stare at many renaissance marble statues, they're so inspiring ;)

Jason-Kane

01-05-2003, 12:43 AM

I appreciate the simplicity of the forms and subtle use of underlying anatomy. Being sublte really helps make things look realistic.

The "Node", or the intersection of all the facial muscles at the corners of the mouth, is generally more medial and forms more of a lump. He could also use a slight vertical impression where the Masseter muscle starts. The ears also have some tight and unnatural creases. His upper lip still looks full for a male. And he could use even some more asymmetry to look natural. The eyes are also very iconic in their perimeter shape.

Overall, it is a huge improvement from your first post and the final product would be a great asset to any animation.

:)

HieSpike

01-05-2003, 12:53 AM

Well it looks like a guy I knew back in high School....don't know if thats a good thing though.

Either way..it looks great.
Only comment is that he looks like he got punched in the lip.

peace,
Kane
:buttrock:

BLuEFroG

01-05-2003, 12:53 AM

Third Eye... Thank you for the info! The Many statues by the great masters were inspired by cutting up carcasses, I know that I will have to take Anatomy in Colege if I Choose my current path of cg, but I hate blood, I REALLY HATE blood and cutting stuff up. I am already acomplished locally in the use of Photoshop and I really want to learn the 3D stuff. Anatomy is a hard thing to master and I think that if I study the right things I can learn outer anatomy without too much of a problem... sry if I sound like a rabeling moron but im 15 and my grammer and writing skills arnt exactly the greatest...

Joril

01-05-2003, 12:56 AM

This is the kind of work the cinema 4D gallery could use!!
:thumbsup:
great stuff!

ThirdEye

01-05-2003, 01:12 AM

Joril, HieSpike: thank you for your kind comments :)
bluefrog: work hard, it's the best advice i can give you, you're still young and time is so preciuos ;)
Jason Kane: great contstructive criticz, Alexandre (my character) thanks you, he will be even more beautiful :wavey:

iratethemad

01-05-2003, 01:30 AM

SWEET LORDY THAT KICKS BOOTY GREAT JOB :buttrock:

mushroomgod

01-05-2003, 01:36 AM

realy top stuff, from youre first post (which was already good) the head has improved an incredible amount

top stuff:applause:

WarAngel

01-05-2003, 01:42 AM

wow :eek: My first... and last head looks like a cube compared to that! Wow... :D

DeathCarrot

01-05-2003, 01:52 AM

Thirdeye man this is incredible, just shows what you can do with some time and effort. :thumbsup:
I still cant believe this is your first head! :p

The Magic Pen

01-05-2003, 02:24 AM

Damn thats good shtuff son :airguitar ..............:buttrock:

wrosado

01-05-2003, 02:30 AM

Hey! that's a really cool progression on your head Model! Nice. I would like to see a side view or maybe a more extreme 3/4 view....maybe an upshot as well.

great work!

WR

Waters

01-05-2003, 03:48 AM

Great work, odd that your such a fan of the amazon soul stuff, when i first took a look at your thread it reminded me of that male character on the amazon soul site.

Haven't used cinema 4d yet, but looks like it has become quite a powerful tool.

Your a great artist, I would be interested in seeing the texture unwrapped, and I was wondering if you used a photo as reference while modeling/texturing.

Jason-Kane

01-05-2003, 03:54 AM

I agree it looks like Amazon Soul stuff. Or at least some of it looks as though you used the Amazon Soul work for reference.

mohh

01-05-2003, 04:43 AM

Awesome work man!

I think that if you were to add a bit of bump detail under the eyes, it would look even more photorealistic. Right now that area is too smooth.

arjun

01-05-2003, 05:12 AM

I'm sorry but I cannot believe that that's your first head model (sorry if in an earlier page you revealed it wasn't ;))
That's just way too good, maybe it was answered before, then sorry again, but did you do a lot of modelling before this head? Thanks! :D

Spliff_Richards

01-05-2003, 06:44 AM

WOW, I think if I was making my first head he would look more like Postman Pat or something:) This is amazing, really inspirering. Where is my new graphics card, I want to model something.

rayz

01-05-2003, 07:26 AM

soooo good........ its really cool to see c4d user, what version are you using anyways, just curious. really good job the texture and modeling :applause:

id love too see more renders. :wavey:

Cube6

01-05-2003, 07:49 AM

LOL the white actor from Money Train and a lot of other movies. Oh yeah, White Men Can't Jump. Hehe good and funny movie.

Anyway this is a great head. Don't listen to those other guys, the head is just fine! I encourage you to give him that personality that you want ;)

Baldasseroni

01-05-2003, 08:28 AM

Really an excellent work :thumbsup: it really deserves the first page`s tumbs.
Hope to see it completed soon and shown into the gallery !

Ale

dark_lotus

01-05-2003, 08:38 AM

Thats coming along really nicely, although I have one small crit about the skin,

at the moment the actuall colouring of the skin is looking a bit plastic, to show you what I mean, I took your last render into photoshop and increase the amount of red, as the skin got darker (away from the light)

while the colouring is crude ( i spent 5 minutes on it) you'll see that the skin appears to be warmer and more realistic.

See I'm not such a bad guy after all.:beer:

Keep up the great work!

Edit: Actually the colour is a bit strong in places, bear in mind also that I'm using a laptop screen, so my colours are all much lighter. so yeah

ThirdEye

01-05-2003, 09:02 AM

thank you very much guys, it's such a pleasure to see you like my head too :)

wrosado: you have to wait when i'll post it to the gallery, it's still a wip ;)

waters, jason kane: i'm a great fan of that wonderful project that is AmazonSoul, i look for new images in that website every month, they're really inspiring. The Dick AmazonSoul model is my favorite cg character ever, probably my one has something of Dick because i often check Renè Morel models to compare my head with and see what i can improve in mine. I didn't use any photo as a back picture, probably the modeling took so long because of this. I modeled all by eye and with a lot of pictures from cg sites (i own a personal gallery of 1500 cg photorealistic images taken from all the cg websites i know, i started collecting them 2 years ago), and expecially A LOT of pics taken from advertising on magazines... The texture is 90% hand painted, I used photos for eyebrows, moles and some pore here and there.

mohh: i'll try that, good suggestion :wavey:

arjun: this IS my 1st head but it's not so important... what's really important is the final result. A lot of modeling? Naah look at my personal gallery http://www.renderosity.com/gallery.ez?ByArtist=Y&Artist=ThirdEye_ the most modeling work i've done so far is cad modeling (i'm an architecture student at uni)

rayz: R7

Eklettica (aka Ale): extrathank you for your compliments and your strenous support, this head couldn't be possible without all your advices and hours spent on #cgtalk talking with you about cg, music and art stuff.

dark_lotus: no, you're not a bad guy after all even if you said me my english grammar made you lol (i'm italian, not dumb) sometime ago. your test is interesting, but i think your laptop needs some tweaking, the pic you posted shows an incandescent color, it's like he stared at the sun for 10 hours, thank you anyway too :beer:

ThirdEye

01-05-2003, 09:13 AM

Oh and i forgot... obviously i thank Leigh for putting it ont he front page :buttrock: :airguitar

tvtuna

01-05-2003, 10:02 AM

yeh its waaay too strong around his stubble, too orange.

Could also try the vein that runs down the forehead at a
slight angle, no idea what it's called. If you don't see it in
yourself try standing upright then bending over until you
feel yourself getting out of breath then look in the mirror.
Or watch a film with Guy Pearce in, his is quite prominent, especially Memento. Not suggesting you make it that big
though

I think the skin color/tone lets this down a little bit, otherwise
it's excellent. Good to see you're not trying to hide the face
behind hair, are his sideburns the same length as his hair
on the top, not sure if you'd notice any difference from the
angle of your render, but worth a go if not.

XerC

01-05-2003, 12:00 PM

Wow ThirdEye!
This thread really rocks!!! :airguitar
Damn fine modeling and great texturing! I'm really impressed!!!:eek:

Straordinario! :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

Greetings,
XerC

Raul-Reznek

01-05-2003, 12:24 PM

Third eye, i think u should thank Equinoxx not Leigh :D
He was the one who plugged you :D

ThirdEye

01-05-2003, 12:26 PM

I can thank both :scream: :wavey: :thumbsup:

Gotham

01-05-2003, 01:02 PM

:thumbsup: And olso: :thumbsup:

ThirdEye

01-05-2003, 01:41 PM

I worked on the mouth region (the worst one probably..), i hope you like Alexandre's new lips :wavey:

wesware

01-05-2003, 03:21 PM

congratulations for being on the first page!

ThirdEye

01-05-2003, 03:28 PM

Thank you very much wes ;)

Harrad

01-05-2003, 05:01 PM

wow... thats amazing for a first head. the only problem i can see with it is it all looks a bit to desaturated. don't know if its the lighting or the textures. i had a little fiddle in PS and made it a bit more visually intresting (hope you don't mind). keep up the good work.

-Matt :surprised

http://www.members.aol.com/~mattharrad/head_edit.jpg

ThirdEye

01-05-2003, 05:06 PM

It's really nice Harrad, really, but my head is not a finished piece, it's still a wip, i'll do all that kind of work in postwork once it's finished, it lacks even DOF now ;)

Harrad

01-05-2003, 05:11 PM

are you planning to do anything with it? pics (i know you said not animation at this stage) or is it just making it of makings sake? i think it'll look so much better if you (when its finnished) put it in to a picture. even if its just a blured background. but just to put it in to contexts. as the neck just stopping and the pure white back ground take something away from the impact.

Can't wait to see the finnished thing.

-Matt :surprised

LionHeartX2

01-05-2003, 07:36 PM

Hey Third Eye nice work man, but I was wondering something. Would you mind sharing with us some of your techniques and methods so you can give guys like me a hand in Lighting and texturing.

Thanks a bunch

BTW what software are you using.

sebek27

01-05-2003, 07:52 PM

wow awesome !! I am learning C4D and always wonder how to design a head... can you tell me a bit how you started doing this head ? was it from a box or point by point then bridge tool ?
thx

aor

01-05-2003, 08:13 PM

wow.. amazing.. can't belive it.. great... i really like the eyes.. do you think you can make some mini tutorials or sometihing? wow.. kickass.. thanks for sharing! and keep us posted!

:bounce: :bounce: :bounce:

ThirdEye

01-05-2003, 08:13 PM

20.000 views... wow! :bounce:

sebek27: box modeling ;)
lionheartX2, aor: i used Cinema4D and A LOT of references, observation is the key ;) wait for the final renders, i will show you the mesh and maps. :wavey:

RiVeN

01-05-2003, 08:26 PM

i dunno if someone asked this, i skipped a couple pages after the first 9... is he going to have hair? or are you keeping him baldish? j/w, i think he looks great, nicely modeled

ThirdEye

01-05-2003, 08:28 PM

If i had 300 bucks to buy Shave&Haircut i'd give him the longest hair ever, but it's too expensive for me, I'm a poor student :shrug:

gmask

01-05-2003, 09:26 PM

Originally posted by ThirdEye_01
If i had 300 bucks to buy Shave&Haircut i'd give him the longest hair ever, but it's too expensive for me, I'm a poor student :shrug:

In the meantime if you wanted to you could try using geomtery and textur emaps to make hair. It's particularily good for "animesque" hair .. take a look at the links below.

http://www.newriders.com/articles/article.asp?product_id={0BFF74D1-DE92-4405-9C33-3E985FF68368}

http://www.menithings.com/How/Tilt/Hair/Tilt_Hair_01.html

windarr

01-05-2003, 09:29 PM

Hey ThirdEye, fantastic looking head, but I think you need to move on now. It looks about as fantastic as it's going to look, maybe you can start working on some hair? I've seen great results just using geometry before. And have you textured the ears and the back of the head? Maybe you can show us your progress on that now.

:thumbsup:

ThirdEye

01-06-2003, 12:53 AM

I don't think geometrical hair will produce great results... i think that only a procedural plugin can make the difference... i have too many great heads ruined by crappy hair... anyway i like the way the shaved hair looked ;)

psumo

01-06-2003, 02:50 AM

wow
first head?
I'd like to see what you can do when you are experienced

Watch out for pinching in the corners of the mouth
it is the only thing I see weird about this guy

mohh

01-06-2003, 03:09 AM

i have too many great heads ruined by crappy hair

I thought this was your first head. Or did you mean to say that you've seen too many heads ruined by a bad hair day...? :curious:

ThirdEye

01-06-2003, 08:35 AM

Sorry, I meant that I've seen so many great heads ruined by hair, my english sucks since i'm italian :shrug: here's an example of what i mean, i PERFECT head made by Julian_J that's imho ruined by the geometrical hair http://www.cg-art.i12.com/boypic3.jpg

windarr

01-06-2003, 08:35 AM

Considering the fantastic job you have done on the head I'm sure you could figure out a way to make geometric hair work. But anyways, I just want to see you move beyond the face area. You have what I feel is basically perfection there. Anything else done in that area would just be basically nitpicking. So how about it, can we see you start to texture the ear and the back of the head?

:applause:

ThirdEye

01-06-2003, 02:16 PM

This head is only meant for a couple stills, I don't want to animate it, i want to start soon another one to see how fast i have become :wip: here i added wet to the eyes, a simple solid spline :wavey:

Claudio72

01-06-2003, 05:44 PM

Hey thirdeye, don't forget to put a whole view of the model before starting a new one, maybe a screen shoot of the UVW texture should help a lot............also a low res one.
If it's possible, try to put it under some HDRI light, this let us know how the texture look like under a real light.........

thank's
Claudio

ray

01-06-2003, 06:06 PM

Wow you got big talent- please post your 10th head right now;-)!

One crit and that is, the eyelids are a little thin.

Could you post a 3/4 view?

:thumbsup:

Claudio72

01-06-2003, 06:14 PM

my crit is:

if I look at the face it seems a photo, but the ear need a bit of translucency or SSscattering............I'm sure you know some tricks to get it in cinema 4D...................maybe a bit of banji in transparency channel..............but I don't know wich shader are you using....so..............it's up to you!!!!!!

ThirdEye

01-06-2003, 11:12 PM

ray: the eyelids are maybe too thin, but i like them as they are now, i'll try focusing on other aspects of the compositions now, like a background and some dof ;)

Claudio72: the ears will be blurred by dof, anyway i will put some 3S there too ;)

Thanks guys :wip:

Baldasseroni

01-07-2003, 12:42 AM

Those thin lines of water in the eyes look really nice :thumbsup:

The eyes gained even more depth and realism.

Ale

gnarlycranium

01-07-2003, 12:53 AM

Interesting... with the wetness in his eyes, he suddenly looks a whole lot less grouchy for some reason. Subtle change, big difference.

windarr

01-07-2003, 06:12 AM

So you're not going to build more of this character? He is incredibly well done I was hoping I would get to see you develop an entire character out of him. Well if you're just going to use a photo of his face then I commend you on an excellent job and look forward to seeing your future work.

ThirdEye

01-07-2003, 01:23 PM

I've probably finished (if there are no crits), now i can relax for a couple weeks :scream:

JulianJohnson

01-07-2003, 05:42 PM

well done it's nice to see it finished:thumbsup: i'll look forward to see what you come up with next

Baldasseroni

01-07-2003, 06:05 PM

THERE`S NO TIME TO RELAX ! :p

My crits :

The blurred background is too much blurred in my opinion, personally i would prefer something with more dark tones, and with less variety in colours, to focus the attention on the bright tones of the face, making the face in much more contrast and evidence, but it`s a choice of yours, anyway i think u should lower a bit the blur.

The sweater is nice...as i told you i would have preferred a white cotton shirt, but it`s nice the same.
My crit goes to the texture, it should have a bigger resolution and probably you would have to model a bit of subtle wrinkles on the shoulders`es profile ...
The other problem is the stretching of the texture on the neck, it should follow the goemetry in a more accurate way.

Go on, you are on the right way! ;)

Ale