Photoshop CS3 ?

[berniebernie]

Grrrr I really wish a good team could come up with a worthy competitor of Photoshop. Though I do look forward to rotating canvas and non-destructive imaging (other apps have been doing it for some time I believe)

[suztv]

I just updated to CS2 - Good Grief! I realize the company is in the business of making money but this is getting a little ridiculous!

Arrrgh! :scream:

[chrisWhite]

Wow, I finally upgrade to CS2 (from 7) today and come over here and Adobe's already talking about 3. Between Maya and Adobe upgrades and school costs a digital animation degree is getting really expensive :sad:

[jeremybirn]

I just updated to CS2 - Good Grief! I realize the company is in the business of making money but this is getting a little ridiculous!

Arrrgh! :scream:

It's a LEAK, not information that the company wanted to see published this year!

Of course next year they will make another version of Photoshop, and of course it will be called CS3, you think they are going to take a year off?

-jeremy

[hentsteph]

It's a LEAK, not information that the company wanted to see published this year!

Of course next year they will make another version of Photoshop, and of course it will be called CS3, you think they are going to take a year off?

-jeremy

No, what I have a problem with is when they start making none pro and pro versions. It's just a way to make us pay more...

[JohnnyRandom]

Man if its true (standard vs. premuim ver.) this company certainly is turning into a real work of art.

Gee I thought the standard version was LE at first then PS Elements, well heck lets justs turn it into the three bears, gimme a break this IS getting ridiculous. Before you know you'll have to send them your first born just to activate the damn thing...

[halo]

whilst a lot of users here may use a lot of PS's abilities, what people may not realise is that out of the 2 million licenses of PS sold each year 50% of buyers are expected to be home hobbyists...and there is getting to be a certain divide between highend workflows and ease of use for the beginner/dabbler.

AE has two versions...its no big deal. I would think that everyone with a PS version already purchased would qualify for a pro upgrade at no deficit to the normal package.

I'll be pleased if PS gets some competition and a UI upgrade.

[JohnnyRandom]

whilst a lot of users here may use a lot of PS's abilities, what people may not realise is that out of the 2 million licenses of PS sold each year 50% of buyers are expected to be home hobbyists...and there is getting to be a certain divide between highend workflows and ease of use for the beginner/dabbler.

AE has two versions...its no big deal. I would think that everyone with a PS version already purchased would qualify for a pro upgrade at no deficit to the normal package.

I'll be pleased if PS gets some competition and a UI upgrade.

Isn't that why they have Photoshop Elements???

[hentsteph]

Isn't that why they have Photoshop Elements???

I agree, Photoshop Elements IS a home hobbyists version, Those that buy Photoshop want pro level software. Look what Macromedia did with Flash MX 2004, a standart and a pro version and now they releise Flash Professional 8. They dropped the standart version, why?... It did not sell well enouf. People who buy Flash are professionals and don't want a cut down versoin. I think the same is true of Photoshop users.

[smoothoperator]

Expect a competitor in a few years. Strickly for film and print.

[JohnnyRandom]

Expect a competitor in a few years. Strickly for film and print.

Feed my curiousity:D

As for Photoshop when they started selling it at places like CompUSA, and OfficeMax, your certainly going to expand your percieved user base that's for sure.
I've got a copy of Photoshop 3.0 for SGI, back then you said "Photoshop" and people asked "Is that where you get your film developed?"

Now every Tom, Dick, and Sally wants a copy but there not willing to sport $700 for the initial upfront costs. So here we go, I can see it now $995 for PS Pro and $695 for the "regular", oh gee great idea and then the BS of uneven upgrades... $195 for the reg & $295 for the pro. Oh Boy, I can't wait, they've already screwed After Effects users once w/ this BS upgrade path now pucker up for the Photoshop version of it...

[halo]

Isn't that why they have Photoshop Elements???

i know what your saying dizzl8r...but that figure comes out of the licenses that are sold for photoshop...these people for one reason or another choose to pay for PS...but they are considered by adobe not to be pro users. Elements is already available, but it seems for some reason they still buy the bigger app. Perhaps this is down to RAW support, cymk support, perhaps they upgraded from LE...whatever...unfortunately adobe are interested in the majority share rather than what makes a good app. This is why PS is festering so much.

It needs some proper competition to give it a good hard kick up the arse, but i do wonder if apple are the ones to do it judging by some of their software efforts.

[jeremybirn]

It needs some proper competition to give it a good hard kick up the arse, but i do wonder if apple are the ones to do it judging by some of their software efforts.

I'd love to see some competition in the market, too, but I'm not holding my breath.

I don't think Apple will make anything that really moves the mainstream windows market away from Photoshop, the worst they are likely to do would be to make some mac-only application that gets adobe to stop supporting the mac the way they did with premiere. I don't think microsoft's paint program will go after the high-end artist market either, I think they will make things that are easy to use for the casual home photographer or occasional business presentation user.

The best end-game I can even picture for moving beyond adobe dominance with Photoshop would be if a compositing program gets serious about growing into the paint sector, and eventually people choose to use that compositing program for single-frame jobs.

-jeremy

[chrisWhite]

I still think Corel could become a player here, but they would have a long ways to go before they could. First they'd have to release a separate app so you don't have to buy the full graphics suite, and then start a new version of PhotoPaint from scratch. Pull heavily from Painter's code base, build some vector tools into it from Draw and look carefully at what Photoshop does and at least match it; with a better paint engine and more powerful vectors.

To bad I don't think Corel would ever do it. :shrug:

[halo]

corel would have so far to go it would be unreal...it would have to be like skoda taking on BMW...even if the product was up to scratch it would still take decades for them to wear off the bargain basement taint.

Unfortunately, all i can see is apple probably stearing towards a semi pro PS replica, like corel, the home market getting the most development $ and the high end languishing still...its the $ that drives adobe, and as the market for PS is saturated there isn't any real impetus for them to give it a kick like they did with Indesign.

It would be nice if Adobe recognised what potential PS has for overhaul and did with the same reasons they entered the market, but their recent efforts dont give me that confidence...certainly there needs to be a logic/strategy shakeup/refit/rethink if they are to make the necessary inroads to bring PS back up to scratch.

[JohnnyRandom]

All valid points. Corel would need a lot of dev. From a certain standpoint their software (graphics suite) is a pretty damn good deal for the dollar, but it isn't PS either and that has alot to do with it I'm sure.

Adobe is getting so big, I'm afraid even if someone did come out with a respectable, usable, competitive piece of software, Adobe would just buy them up and shitcan it or pick it to pieces.

I'm already a little worried about whats going to happen to Macromedia... sure seems to be a case of deja vu ....hmmmm microsoft .... monopoly.......mmmmnn bad....and still no competition.

This niche market is no longer a niche market.

[klingspor]

Ouch. Adobe planning an "interface overhaul" to Photoshop scares me. Not that the current interface is perfect, far from it, but at the rate they are going with CS and then CS2, I somehow expect them to incorporate bright, colorful themes into Photoshop and try to sell that as the next killer feature.

Just like the new tabs and menues in CS2 are just pretty and not one bit more functional than the old ones, quite on the contrary, it actually made the program feel slower! I seriously doubt this is good news for anyone using Photoshop... but I'll let them surprise me.

[Rod Seffen]

Not interested, I couldn't even get CS2 to work, I had the bug where the tool box stopped wroking after a while and I had to continually restart the program.
I mean, if they're so desperate to release a new verison every five minutes, that they can't even be bothered making them work properly, they can go funk themsleves.

[Martin Kay]

Excepting color management you could get by by still using PS3, (where layers were first introduced). I'll grant that CS did introduce some useful tools like the highlight & shadow tool and the panoramic thingy. The problem with PS is that it's long been a mature tool, so Adobe must be real stuck for things to put into it, whilst at the same time having to continually generate cash to support a large company.

[suztv]

I think that a lot of you are right about PS and the need for some stiff competition. Here's the problem: no one wants to use the other program. I used Corel Photopaint for a long time but I always ended up converting my files to PS. Why? Because PS is the program that most of the printers and studios, and art houses use. The only way that people would conceivably even consider switching is if the competition gave full licenses away for free to everyone who uses PS and then after a year start charging. I know GIMP is out there and is a lot like PS but I still hesitate on learning a program that no one uses (at least professionally). I like PS - it is intuitive and has a good following because it is used almost everywhere - which means if I create something in PS chances are someone else who might have to change that file later will have it too. Of course Adobe did kind of shoot themselves in the foot by making the lower level compatability harder to manage (piss users off enough and they will activly search for a different program).

You know, I just wish they (adobe) gave a crap about the customers. Adobe is your best friend until the next upgrade and then you are just like everyone else. So until there is another vastly used program that can compete with Adobe, everyone may as well grab their ankles and get ready for a nice big.... - well you get the idea.

[halo]

so Adobe must be real stuck for things to put into it, whilst at the same time having to continually generate cash to support a large company.

i've got a list of things that could be stuck into it...but the 'between the lines' comment from adobe sources is the managers have the leash on development time...not the dev teams themselves. :rolleyes:

its a long way from the days when upgrades were met with genuine excitement and leaps of technology...they have fallen behind the curve somewhat.

a new thread?

[jfrancis]

I'd like to see Photoshop go towards more of a node-based layering interface a la Shake.

I'd like to see Photoshop have an "expert mode" with some more serious image arithmetic accessible to the user in it.

I'd like to see Painter go beyond RGB into multi-spectral color mixing calculus along the lines of Maxwell.

[Gimbal Lock King]

I fear we are all at the mercy of Adobe right now-- especially colleges-- required to get the most recent software updates, now abitrarily published with very few new features that justify an upgrade. Plus, like mentioned in posts above, the aquisition of Macromedia and the slightly inferior Correl programs-- is it up to Apple to take them on? To Adobe's After Effects, Apple has Motion, for Premiere there is a Final Cut, so why not a Photoshop alternative that is still compatable?

It's all about interfaces and preferences nowadays, maybe an innovation is way past due?:shrug:

[jeremybirn]

Maybe in two years Microsoft will present some formidable competition. The little start they have now with Acrylic seems promising enough, if they really focus on developing it.

Excepting color management you could get by by still using PS3, (where layers were first introduced).

On one hand, I get your point. On the other hand, that would be painful. Only 1 undo step without history, can't open 16-bit files, can't do layout tasks like text on a curve, no non-descructive layer adjustments, no healing brush or patch tool. painful.

-jeremy

[thomaspecht]

well i stopped upgrading my photoshop years ago and for freelance jobs i usually ask if i can bring my license of 5.5 into the workplace. 3d is changing fast enough to keep one busy in staying current. i see no need to constantly accommodate to new releases of the paint program as well when all it does is the same thing since the days of deluxe paint.

btw. as for possible competitors - how's amazon paint doing these days? i do know the sgi version which had some "lovely" single-step undo back then but aside from that it didn't look bad - 16 bit option, 3d paint, scriptable in tcl, the closest app to photoshop that i remember. have heard that it was incorporated into the piranha hardware compositor as well. and since ifx seems focused on linux these days, maybe they had some progress on amazon as well?
anyone knows about it?

[Segvoia]

I was searching through the archives to find reasons to upgrade to CS from 7. Some of the info in this thread is reminding why I chose not to bother. The upgrade dance is a disgusting exploitation of customers, I agree 100%. Use to be an upgrade came out every 3 or 4 years instead of every few months, and it actually had additional features worth the $$$.

GIJoe - I dropped 5.5 for 7 to get the history pallet and vecter tools, but beyond that 5.5 was a reliable workhorse. I probably won't upgrade again for a few years.

[paintbox]

You would think it would be easy and commercially viable to make a photoshop killer. After all, it's just shifting pixels. But somehow competitors always lack in one aspect or another.

[itsallgoode9]

well i'm gonna be going against the flow of the general opinion here, but I absolutly LOVE CS2. at first I had just thought is was an ok upgrade that might now even be needed, but as the months of using it roll on I find more and more stuff that I use on a daily basis....mostly all very small features, but they are entirely helpfull nonetheless. it just happens that there are alot of new features that fit me well.

[infernoskull]

i think adobe is trying to get more money because nobodys buying thier program, because they just get illegal versions, the stats are like 45% of people who own photoshop havent payed a dime for it, the stats are even worse for windows xp, in china and india only 10% of copies are legit.

[klingspor]

i think adobe is trying to get more money because nobodys buying thier program, because they just get illegal versions, the stats are like 45% of people who own photoshop havent payed a dime for it, the stats are even worse for windows xp, in china and india only 10% of copies are legit.I doubt that Adobe churning out one lacklustre release after another is going to persuade many illegal users to actually buy the software, though.

[halo]

something like over a million sales per year doesnt leave them poor ;)

[KiboOst]

All I need in photoshop is non destructive filters, or filter layers just like adjustements layers. In Combustion for example, you take a footage, and put a colorcorrection node, or a blur node, or whatever node you want, and you can reset each node, remove then an so, without having touch the original footage. I want this in Toshop ! Dunno how to iplement it in the UI with 100 or more layers in a psd, but I want it ! For the rest, I love it as it is (well, editing levels/hue etc on multiple layers would be cool and so many little things here and there, but that's it)
It happens very often that you make something blurry (just an example), and your customer just ask you "can I get this sharper" ? bam ! hopefully you saved your layers somewhere before apllying blur !!

[mangolass]

If there's a team of full~time developers, people who do nothing but add to Photoshop for a living, then I'd expect a new release every year. I mean, if they've added and updated some things, or even just fixed some bugs, there's no reason not to release it to the public.

Sure, some people who were happy with the last version will keep using the last version and won't upgrade, that's fine ~ but if someone is buying the software new you want them to get the latest version, not last year's version, right?

LT

[klingspor]

If there's a team of full~time developers, people who do nothing but add to Photoshop for a living, then I'd expect a new release every year. I mean, if they've added and updated some things, or even just fixed some bugs, there's no reason not to release it to the public.

Sure, some people who were happy with the last version will keep using the last version and won't upgrade, that's fine ~ but if someone is buying the software new you want them to get the latest version, not last year's version, right?

LTThat's very true! However, look at other industries and the way they handle small updates... they usually do it without even speaking about it, or perhaps they call it a "facelift", if anything.

When a new Mercedes comes out, you can generally expect to get a car that's more than merely a little different from the last version with a few issues fixed. Sure, it does the same thing the old one did, but it's usually expected to be more comfortable, functional and efficient. With Adobe, it actually gets less efficient (many people are having speed issues with CS2) with all the bloat! One could argue it's more functional, but that functionality comes from tacking on new features instead of properly integrating them - as if a new car was to be sold with a great new MP3-player, but it's only accessible through the trunk.

And if car makers find issues before it's time to release another new version, they'll just go ahead and fix the darn problems without self-righteously changing the name from Mercedes C to Mercedes CS...

[michelengeltje]

i wouldn't be to surprised if they release CS3 sooner rather than later, there still quite a few people experiencing huge problems with the CS2 version, very, very slow :sad: (i had the same with the trail version - unworkable full stop!) - which is a bit of a pain if you like your customers to upgrade about every year.
Have a look at some of the threads on the Adobe forum - the adobe people - 'are working on it' - i bet the solution will be called CS3 :twisted:

M.

[Martin Kay]

I cant see a good alternative app to Photohop that anyone would want to use... Just think of the copyright problems that occured between Adobe and Macromedia with Illustrator and Freehand. An alternative to Photoshop would need to find different ways of doing all the actions we are used to, different style menus and tools etc- very frustrating for the user. As an Illustrator user and only occaisonal user of Freehand I know how intensely irritating this can be. In Free hand I find everything is in the most stupid place, (for someone who learnt in Illustrator). Basically we'd all want an app as good as or better than Photoshop. Remember that app that Macromedia had a few years ago, where you worked on a virtual image and up sized it to the final res at the end of the retouch. It died very quickly.
Apps like Bodypaint that are specifically for 3D painting could go a long way more though.

[JohnnyRandom]

i wouldn't be to surprised if they release CS3 sooner rather than later, there still quite a few people experiencing huge problems with the CS2 version, very, very slow :sad: (i had the same with the trail version - unworkable full stop!) - which is a bit of a pain if you like your customers to upgrade about every year.
Have a look at some of the threads on the Adobe forum - the adobe people - 'are working on it' - i bet the solution will be called CS3 :twisted:

M.

See that's the thing, right there, you said it, Adobe loves people to upgrade every year, this is something that Adobe should be fixing for free. Argh:banghead:

[pushav]

I agree. Ps should do a free upgrade patch like 7 to cs or cs2. Nothing changes that much in photoshop. I have 5,7,and going to get cs2 maybe. I love my 7.

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