Point Oven, Maya and Shave

[bloodboy]

Dude... you have broken the golden rule of CG.. First you model it, rig it, animate it light and render it.... fur and hair comes in the rendering and lighting stage.. you don't have to worry about animating the fur since is will use secondary motion/dynamics for its animation.... after you animate it is Messiah and take it back into maya, then you do your fur... depending on what the panther is doing you could have the first 5-10 frames of the animation where the panter is not doing anything, just standing in its base pose.. then the rest of your animation.. those 5-10 frames you will use in maya to setup you fur... in these frames you could have the panter standing, and not in any pose from you animation. do the fru then when its time to render you simply take off the the frames where the panter is standing and render from start of the action....

NOTE: i have never used point oven, but this question is a workflow question...¨

[AlexK]

Dude... you have broken the golden rule of CG.. First you model it, rig it, animate it light and render it.... fur and hair comes in the rendering and lighting stage.. you don't have to worry about animating the fur since is will use secondary motion/dynamics for its animation.... after you animate it is Messiah and take it back into maya, then you do your fur... depending on what the panther is doing you could have the first 5-10 frames of the animation where the panter is not doing anything, just standing in its base pose.. then the rest of your animation.. those 5-10 frames you will use in maya to setup you fur... in these frames you could have the panter standing, and not in any pose from you animation. do the fru then when its time to render you simply take off the the frames where the panter is standing and render from start of the action....

NOTE: i have never used point oven, but this question is a workflow question...¨
You didn't get my point bloodboy. The question is not how to animate and fur a panther in ONE scene. The question is how to do it for several scenes. The thing is, I am preparing the fur while the animation is done. If that is possible. I have a similar post running at the shave group to figure that out.

[bloodboy]

no i think you did not get my point... i understand what you are doing but that will only get you into trouble... you can only style the fur after the animation because when you export you only export models, lights and cameras... if you do it before you still have the problem of getting the fur back unto the model.... just follow the rule and you cannot go wrong. you are usuing 2 different programs to get the job done, work in wone then go on to the next....try not to switch back and fort every five sec. that could get you in trouble... trust me i know Maya it will give you problems....
if you style the fur first maya you can save preset file ant them reapply the preset after animation to you model...

[AlexK]

Ok, we are talking of two different things here. My PointOven/Shave question was, if it is possible to say "ok, now you are my object. you have shave fur (which is completely different from maya fur) attached. and you shall be displaced from now on by my mdd files (which are displaced mesh information of my original geometry)."

Now that approach is in no way breaking the rules, just a way the bend them a little. And because of that it is a quite plugin specific question. ;)

Thanks to Thomas Helzle I found a workflow that might work by the way.

[bloodboy]

ok you seem to think that i don't know what i am thaking about, and i don't know what shave is... well you are wrong... i know what it is and i like working with it. now it seems like you know what you are doing wrong and don't want to do it the any other way... i love bending and braking it is the best way learn... but you also have to use your brain sometimes....you have to be able to understand limitation of yourself. "Accoms Razor" this means the simplest solution is often the right one. you want to bend the rules go ahead and good luck getting you work done on time.

sorry i tried to help, but you alredy know what you are going to do, you just wanted to see if anyone else would do the samething as you... which would make it ok for you to travel the road less travled.

Once again i'm sorry, and have fun....

[ThomasHelzle]

Come on Greig, allow for things you don't know yet :)
Messiah/PO throw a very different approach into the equation.
Maya may be that strict, but messiah and PO allow for any kind of freedom.

That's what people love about it.

Cheers :bowdown:

[Spin99]

bloodboy
Thanks for sharing, I now know how to do hair using Messiah + Maya :D

AlexK
Man people lose jobs with an attitude like that.
Why don't you listen to people that make sense and do it over again?
Sheesh :p

Nah really if you have a deadline and are as ambitious as using Messiah/ Maya
I really doubt there's much to experiment with?

Thomas_Helzle
The AoN shaders look incredible imo.
They seem absolutely top notch.

Now I have something else to save for :D

[ThomasHelzle]

Spin 99: You are welcome ;) Thanks for the kind words. :bowdown:

I think I start to apprechiate your humor more and more >LOL< :thumbsup:

Cheers,

[bloodboy]

yeah.... i think i have made enought trouble for this month.... i will go back in to my cave CG things...

[Spin99]

LMAO :D

OK maybe this was a comment from the peanut gallery.
Sorry I couldn't resist it *throws peanuts*
This is what I saw in this thread..

* Someone stuck at a point of hopelessness?
* Is there really a lot of workflows when trying to render animated hair
with TWO major CG applications? Maybe?

And then bloodboy..

Seems to be desperately trying to help!
But OK I'll stop spamming :D
I'm so glad Thomas_Helzle thinks I'm funny :bowdown:
I will not spam in this forum I will not spam in this forum I will not spam..

[AlexK]

Come on boys. Be nice.
If you knew me (and read some of my other posts), you would know that I am listening to advice.
But if you read my first post again, you might notice that I didn't ask for help. I asked how PointOven works in Maya. And I did that while I delivered a bit of background info.

Nobody said I won't start over in the right order if need be. But I also never said that I have a finished fur. So don't answer for apples, when I asked for bananas and then be angry I wasn't responsive to things I wasn't asking for.

Could someone close this thread, as I already have my answer and this thread is going nowhere anyway.

[ThomasHelzle]

No, keep it open!
This is too much fun to miss :bounce:
Humans doing what they are best at: misunderstanding each other, taking themselves too serious and trying to help each other to death while everyone knows exactly what the other did mean (but the other)... :applause:

"Life is simple - for everything else we have humans." :thumbsup:

Carpe Diem :)

[dobermunk]

Thomas ahs a good point in mentioning that pipeline is tool-dependent.
I took over a job which had been somewhat botched, and when I did my calculations found that in order to make a landmark appointment, we'd have to start animating before our meshes were finished. At once, Maya and XSI were out of the equation.

Messiah allowed us to work this way. We did tests for level-of-detail on temp meshes and knowing how the messiah bones work trusted blindly that the final meshes would hold up the same way. Once the meshes were finished we replaced them with a click (including morph targets) and continued from there on.

My immediate reaction to the above was: well, why shuldn't that work? But I'm a Mayacile - so I kept my mouth shut. But if a solution refuses to allow for tweaks and even massive changes, well - bring on the revolution. What I love about messiah is that its taken my fear of trying out that wierd sounding expression, or just checking out what this approach might do.

[bloodboy]

dobermunk... you have a good point and i should have done that from the start, Kept my mouth closed... as i usually do.. with things that has nothing to do with me..... not my project, not my problem, not my A&& is on the line if there is one... no deed for the human behaviour...

i have seen AlexK's work (Babylon Dreams (http://www.babylondreams.de/) ) must be the best i have ever seen... really..

[ThomasHelzle]

Hm - Greig, I think the point is a bit different. You may have a lot of experience in Maya but you are new to messiah and you stated that you never used PointOvenPro yet, therefore, your preaching about the "golden rule of CG" (something I never heard or cared about) was not really helpful to the question asked.

I try to shut up if I don't really know the answer or I try to use words that make that clear. You basically were shouting at someone who is quite smart himself that he doesn't have the slightest idea about how to do CG.
That makes you look.... well, not the best :)

But that doesn't mean that you shouldn't help people IF you know something about a topic. Using a forum like this is never about your ass or your project anyway, but if you say something, make sure you have a clue or keep at least a bit more humble.

Cheers :bowdown:

[bloodboy]

like i said not my problem... and since i don't know what i am talking about... My deepest and most heart felt... I am sorry to the Messiah Pro's here.... and since i did not get he point of the Question i should not have tried to help, in any way...

Blood_boy :)

[Spin99]

bloodboy

Hey! Stop apologising!
I just learnt the golden rule of CG! Stop it!
Nooooooooo..

[AlexK]

No, keep it open!
This is too much fun to miss
Hihi, you were right. Now it really starts to take off. :twisted:
...You basically were shouting at someone who is quite smart himself...
Now I feel honored. :D
You too my man, you too! :bowdown:
i have seen AlexK's work (Babylon Dreams ) must be the best i have ever seen... really..
Thanks bloodboy. These words from you mean a lot to me. :deal:

[bloodboy]

you are welcome.... irony is fun...

[Spin99]

You got it wrong.
Just joking and spamming around (I promise I'll stop)
No irony here I really feel I learnt something from your post ;)

[bloodboy]

hey, i don't care man, spam is fun... i love spam.... spam away man...

[CGTalk Moderation]

This thread has been automatically closed as it remained inactive for 12 months. If you wish to continue the discussion, please create a new thread in the appropriate forum.