Wip Bockade/low Poly Car

[SHEPEIRO]

heres an update,
ive butcheered the model down to bout 550 polys, so i can have more cars.
will probably add some over stuff around when cars are finished to make full model up to 2000 polys. working on high poly car now to create my first set of normal maps. woo hoo.

[SHEPEIRO]

wow no crits


well i didnt ask for them but i am now.

will update soon

[blackwood]

Hi mate.

Its kinda hard to see whats going on. The burnt out car looks very dark and the wireframes are on a very dark material too. It all looks like it will work but I cant see the smoothing, I'm waiting to see your details... and then the texturing will make or break the model(s).

[SHEPEIRO]

ok better image on the way.
im going to use fairly simple texs, mainly rendered out procedural noise texs (blended in photoshop), so no seams.
the normal map should provide the detail. i hope!

[SHEPEIRO]

ok heres new image showing highpoly on left and low(500) poly on right ready for normal mapping.

theres also a 3000 poly model to map the normals onto befor butchering to 500 but no point in showing this as well.

mmm too many attachments mmmmm

any ideas on where too add more detail on high poly?

and is it ok to blend normal maps rendered from 3d and normal maps made from bump maps in photoshop?

[blackwood]

'tis lookin good.

I dont know much about normal mapping as I've never done it. I'd imagine the smoothing of the low poly mesh will be re-written by the normal map information. If thats the case I'd imagine your 500 poly version should work.

IMO, this would suit a stylised game, near future kinda thing.

[SHEPEIRO]

yeah im hoping thats the case wid the normals.

its for apoccapalyctipicpick(huh) alternative future doom 3 mod.
kind of 50 futuristic thingameding

[SHEPEIRO]

have been playing around with normal mapping the two cars above this morning befor i came to work. possibly not the best time to do it, but every spare minute eh.

so far ive just used an automatic flatten uvws on both models (will make propper uvws later) for purpose of playing around. created the normal map from one and exported to other. obviusly didnt match up but needed to figure out how to use them in max. it works but i have a few questions. i was using a dll called normalrender.dll and it worked perfectly when i used the test sphere object, i got a pink/blue normal map. but when i used my car model i got a rainbow coloured one.

i thought i had read somewhere that rainbow colours are used for global normals, not object specific, and that you cant rotate these.

[SHEPEIRO]

ok heres what i mean.

first image just fiddlin with normal mapin with reflection map to show norms

second on left normalmap from torus, normal map from car.

hmmmm

[SHEPEIRO]

any ideas on this one

[qrt]

model from fallout ? ^^

[SHEPEIRO]

its for a fallout based doom mod. yes

[SHEPEIRO]

heres what i done so far. using ati's max script for generating and its NMFviewer to view.

got a few probs

1 need to reflatten as having way too many probs with seams. got tooo many.

2 the norms seem inside out. when viewd in max the lighting comes from opposit direction of light!?. when viewd in NMFviewr then i have to press C then its corrected. something to do with tangent world space. i think

How do i fix this. is it a prob

[wille]

well..the normals arent inside out, but upside down. Ati uses inverse y-channels and max uses normal y-channels so what you need to do is to get into photoshop, select the green color channel of the normalmap and press ctrl+i to invert it ! and then you should be fine.

[SHEPEIRO]

briilliant so quick.

will tthis muck up the rendering in doom3 engine? as this is the intended destination.

[SHEPEIRO]

any crits on the actual texture.

ive been thinking about the seams. i had to fix alot of erroors because i made too many seperate parts to my uvw mesh, i corrected these but it has meant that the edges are a wee bit soft. does any one think this is a prob?

been thinking i can re-pack/stitch some of the uvws together to sot this out.

[ScudzAlmighty]

the texture was way back in post #2 there right? it looks good, but it also looks a little like the car has been lying at the bottom of the sea for a while... never having played Fallout i'm not sure if it's supposed to. maybe break up the rust with bits of the original paint job? or leave a little chrome in the trim? it's all very brown...

[SHEPEIRO]

srry mate that was just a temp texture, i was talking aboot the normal texture. have done a diffuse tex but it aint looking good yet so no postys.

[wille]

im not sure wether doom 3 uses inverted y-channels or not...but if it doesnt work in the engine , just flip the green channel back and you will be all fine and dandy.

its kinda hard to judge the normalmap from that screenshot.

Id like to see the flat normalmap, the lowpoly(so I can see the smoothing groups) and the lowpoly with the normalmap applied to make a better judgement. making normalmaps are easy.making great ones can be tricky.

[SHEPEIRO]

weeelll i went home last night and tried flipping the green channel but to no avail, see small screenshot in top left of image, where light is in opposite possition to light on model.
aaaargh.

well i re fattened the uvws with alot less seams and now im much more pleased. the current map is 2048sq because i had probs with anti aliasing, plus its easier/quicker to mend like this. still need to mend some mistakes in the normal map.

will half in future im getting there.

as with above prob. when in ATI's viewer if you press the C button it changes normals from world space to tangent space, then the normals look good is there a way of doing this in max. and will it be prob in doom 3. havnt managed to export it yet

[SHEPEIRO]

ive also added some sharpen to the corners by the wheels and stuff to simulate rust. i think this works well will get back to you with propper break down of images.

[wille]

I kindof assumed you were using tangent space maps? arent you?

[SHEPEIRO]

yes i am but im thinking max is using world space?

i am getting colours other than blue/pink in my normal map i.e green and yellows. which i thought was more like world space normals.

but its ticked for tangent in ATIs exporter?

[SHEPEIRO]

heres some new images

1 wire and shading of low poly model(676polys)
2 single car in max viewport. still getting some normal artifacts that i dont get in atis viewer. but figured i needed to invert both red and green channels in normal to make work propperly.
3 blockade with new diffuse map. not pleased with it as very tired when making. needs total overhaul.

[SHEPEIRO]

crits/ideas/refs for diffuse texture would be really welcome, at the mo its making me have kittens, its not pleasant

[SHEPEIRO]

man i wish i had done a propper search for ref images earlier. ive found loads of stuff on brittish county council sites.
heres some samples.

[SHEPEIRO]

some more feedback would be nice.

the pole above is a bit dull. what about the idea that with greater proccessor power to memory, normals will be out dated by good lods.

[SHEPEIRO]

nada nothing boo hoo.

[ScudzAlmighty]

it's not a bad theroy, but it's more likely that some new method will come along intsead and that will be the most amazing thing ever for a week and then something else will come along

[jlambvo]

http://students.mcad.edu/%7Ejlamb/groundzero/images/car/shot00012.jpgHello everyone,

Shepeiro asked me to show some images of the car model from within the Doom 3 engine. Please excuse the crudeness of the environment at this point, this is basically a lighting test map with placeholder geometry. Also note that the car diffuse and specular maps are temporary.

http://students.mcad.edu/%7Ejlamb/groundzero/images/car/shot00006.jpghttp://students.mcad.edu/%7Ejlamb/groundzero/images/car/shot00011.jpghttp://students.mcad.edu/%7Ejlamb/groundzero/images/car/shot00005.jpg

[SHEPEIRO]

yo that looks cool. even if i do say so myself.

those triangles in back of rtoof need sorting, i think its something to do witgh the shading groups on low res model.

ok heres some new stuff.

converting car into working, i.e player controlled. so i need plenty more furniture, last nigh i started on the wheel. here goes nothing.

first the high def model.

[SHEPEIRO]

next for the low poly version.

managed to get it down to 450 polys. so that will be1800, per car, may need to sacrifice some mor later on. the maps are all 512x512,, this also could be reduced possibly.

heres shot with full normals, spec, and diffuse map.

getting the hang of this normal mapping, the only thing i need to sort is the seam on the treads, dont think you can see them in this shot.

will post some wirefarmes tommorrow.

ps managed to loose nuts somehow, will look behind sofa and add to normal later.

[SHEPEIRO]

ok, whoops forgot to bring new wire to work.

but heres the fixed version of the burnt out car, and a new working, methane power(adapted) car.

crits and tips would be really welcome, i havent had any for ages.

please

[SHEPEIRO]

Heres the link to the Mod web site, please take a look.
http://groundzero.jconserv.net/

[SnakeCobra]

i am not fine with the fuel line, i think it would look better to let it start on the right side of the blower....

[SHEPEIRO]

any reason, i dont get?

[SnakeCobra]

i dont know i think it would look better, or didnt u understand what i mean?

[blastzone]

wow cool im a HUGE fallout fan. and by the way (i live in london get to see plenty of burned out cars) burnouts dont sine.. i mean atall they look like mettalic lumps of coal. sometimes you can see the red basecoat in places and some reminents of the orgional colour of the fire hasnt caused that much damage. also generally speaking they look melted. the intirior pars have melted and fused along with some of the extirior and melted the car to the road alot of the time. i cant really think of what else.
just trying to help. if i can think of anything else or find some refs ill post em for you.

[SHEPEIRO]

yeah ive found some good refs but if you find some better ones post them( i run out of space and had to get rid)

someone else is going to do the diffuse map, (dedicated texture artist~) to keep a sense strong visual consistency.

but im sure help would be great.

[SHEPEIRO]

ok another little update. just had to watch Extras last night.

heres the car updated some more, getting pleased with fuel system now. added some chairs.

just need some inside furniture, and thinking about some roll bars.

do the pipes need to be held on to the body by anything, or can i leave it as it is?
just thinking aboot texture space for normals.

C&Cs welcome and appreciated.:scream:

[Prs-Phil]

looks a bit weird ingame, very shiney, for an rusty old broken car.
Still not bad.

I don't understand your Question though

"will normal maps become more or less important in next generations of hardware?"

Yes normalmaps will become more or less important in next generations of hardware

or

No normalmaps will become more or less important in next generations of hardware

or is it just my english ?

[SHEPEIRO]

aargh wheres my reply gone sure i did one aboot an hour ago.


oh well here it is again.

as it says below pics diffuse/material is temp, as someone else is texturing now, as we decided it would be a better way to achieve a consistency throughout if one person painted textures

[Prs-Phil]

ah ok, sry I should at least take the time to read through the texts posted with pics.

I guess your project is not going to be that big or that poor texturing guy will have alot to texture ;).

Still, I don't get the pollquestion :)

[SHEPEIRO]

well im just crap at phasin stuff.

just think more rather than more or less then you should get it. but my fault.

as for texturing guy, yeah i sympathis with him, or her, still dont know who it is.
but i think as the project gets bigger then more will have to be used.

but iam going to make a better diff map and post it as i need to do this for my portfolio,
im really close to getting a paid job so we'll havve to see aboot time....

if i can give up my day job with, for contract work then hey who knows

[SHEPEIRO]

any one with any ideas about details i could add.

[SHEPEIRO]

ok havnt had much time for this recently, but heres the fiished high poly, with a few flat tyres for good measure.

[SHEPEIRO]

almost finished with this model set, heres waht i got so far, its 8'000 polys and has 2x 1024x1024 maps + a 512x512 for the wheel.

still need some fixes to the bonnet, but everything else is looking good. me thinks

point out any thing that looks crap please.

(most of the diffuse is temp/not finished)

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