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kassun
08-07-2005, 09:32 PM
I curently have a dual AMD 2.4 mp system with a Tyan motherboard s2466n. I am looking at upgrading to a dual 1.8 AMD Athlon opteron system. budget increased from 500.00 to 900.00. thoughts or suggestions for a configuration, I use maya on a daily basis.


Thanks
Kassun

mlmiller1983
08-07-2005, 09:43 PM
I would personally go for AMD X2s. For about $500 you can get the X2 4200 which is like having two 2.2GHz AMD CPUs but only one socket and less heat production. for $400 you can get the 3800+ which is like have two 2.0GHz AMD CPUs. They don't require(or use) registered memory and the motherboards for them are not expensive. I would go with the ASUS A8N SLI Dlx. I think these are the most cost effective cpus for CG at the moment.

Since you use Maya, check out Maya render times from Gamepc for the 4200+:
http://www.gamepc.com/labs/view_content.asp?id=a64x2&page=7

Well I hope this points you in the right direction. But I would go for AMD X2s than 1.8GHz AMD Opterons unless of course they were the AMD Opteron 265 which two of these equal 4 1.8GHz AMD 64s but prepare to pay an arm and a leg for it.

kassun
08-08-2005, 12:19 AM
Thanks for the link I decided to go with the 4200; it had the best overall benchmarks throught out the tests. Now I am down to deciding on a motherboard :).

thanks for your help,
Kassun

mlmiller1983
08-08-2005, 12:38 AM
Thanks for the link I decided to go with the 4200; it had the best overall benchmarks throught out the tests. Now I am down to deciding on a motherboard :).

thanks for your help,
Kassun

Go with this motherboard from ASUS: The ASUS A8N-SLI
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16813131517

This is the one I am going with. You don't need to use the other PCI-E 8x for video card. You can use it for upcoming PCI-E SATA II Raid cards. And it has dual Gigabyte LANs as well as a host of other features.

MadMax
08-08-2005, 12:59 AM
Thanks for the link I decided to go with the 4200; it had the best overall benchmarks throught out the tests. Now I am down to deciding on a motherboard :).

thanks for your help,
Kassun

Suggestion time:

Asus A8N SLI Premium. It is worth the extra dollars.

You will need a new video card, since nForce 4 boards are PCI-E only.

mlmiller1983
08-08-2005, 02:42 AM
Suggestion time:

Asus A8N SLI Premium. It is worth the extra dollars.

You will need a new video card, since nForce 4 boards are PCI-E only.

Can't believe I forgot that part, yeah you will need a new video card. I have never used maya on a GeForce but many people in this forum say they can work on them. I would suggest the 7800 GTX if you can afford it and if not the GeForce 6800 GT( 6800 GT is only $200 less thean the 7800 but the 7800 gives almost twice the performance).

Just curious but what are the extras in the Premium over the Deluxe.

lots
08-08-2005, 03:00 AM
The board MadMax is referring to, I think, is the one with a heatpipe on the North bridge. The other Asus boards of this chipset carry a heatsink fan combo that was fairly weak, and would break on many boards. This new Heatpipe solution is MUCH better, and uses no active cooling, so nothing will break :)

mlmiller1983
08-08-2005, 03:20 AM
The board MadMax is referring to, I think, is the one with a heatpipe on the North bridge. The other Asus boards of this chipset carry a heatsink fan combo that was fairly weak, and would break on many boards. This new Heatpipe solution is MUCH better, and uses no active cooling, so nothing will break :)

Thanks for the info. When I do build my X2 system it will be the Premium board.

kassun
08-08-2005, 03:34 AM
placed my order for the Asus premium board, thanks for all the help. I have an exhisting 3 gigs of pc3200 and a nvidia quadro 750 xgl from my current system to add in so I should be all set. I also ordered a thermaltake 500w power supply and a processor fan to help in the cooling. The power supply I have now shuts off the computer every so often and is a big pain.

-Thanks,
Kassun

mlmiller1983
08-08-2005, 03:40 AM
placed my order for the Asus premium board, thanks for all the help. I have an exhisting 3 gigs of pc3200 and a nvidia quadro 750 xgl from my current system to add in so I should be all set. I also ordered a thermaltake 500w power supply and a processor fan to help in the cooling. The power supply I have now shuts off the computer every so often and is a big pain.

-Thanks,
Kassun


That Quadro card is AGP. The Motherboard only takes PCI-E.

kassun
08-08-2005, 03:43 AM
$%$%$%$%$ ... do you have another mb suggestion? I have searched high and low because there are so many to choose from.


-thanks,
kassun

mlmiller1983
08-08-2005, 03:51 AM
$%$%$%$%$ ... do you have another mb suggestion? I have searched high and low because there are so many to choose from.

-thanks,
kassun

There are no AGP boards that support the AMD 64 X2 CPUs. But there is a PCI Express Quadro card you can get off of ebay for cheap.

Heres one:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Nvidia-Quadro-FX-1400-SLI-PCI-Express_W0QQitemZ5227864694QQcategoryZ40161QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Another one:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Nvidia-Quadro-FX-1400-FX1400-PCI-Express-PCIx-SLI_W0QQitemZ5227190569QQcategoryZ40161QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

If you can spare $250 you can purchase a PCI Express Quadro card on ebay. Look for the 1300 or 1400 model. I hope this helps.

kassun
08-08-2005, 03:55 AM
thanks again mike, i really appreciate the help

kassun
08-08-2005, 05:44 AM
found this mb http://usa.asus.com/products4.aspx?modelmenu=2&model=238&l1=3&l2=15&l3=0
Asus A8v with an agp8x slot

mlmiller1983
08-08-2005, 06:14 AM
found this mb http://usa.asus.com/products4.aspx?modelmenu=2&model=238&l1=3&l2=15&l3=0
Asus A8v with an agp8x slot

I don't think that board supports Dual Core AMD 64 X2 CPUs. I could be wrong but you should check and make sure.

kassun
08-08-2005, 02:32 PM
triple checked and it does support x2. Here is a link to the specs.

http://usa.asus.com/products4.aspx?l1=3&l2=15&l3=0&model=238&modelmenu=1

thanks,
Kassun

mlmiller1983
08-08-2005, 03:23 PM
triple checked and it does support x2. Here is a link to the specs.

http://usa.asus.com/products4.aspx?l1=3&l2=15&l3=0&model=238&modelmenu=1

thanks,
Kassun


Okay your right it does!

igami
08-08-2005, 03:41 PM
I think you should get the 4400+ since its a 1mb cache. The 4200+ is not much far of a difference in price compare to the 4400+. That's what i'm getting soon...hehehe....

MadMax
08-08-2005, 04:54 PM
found this mb http://usa.asus.com/products4.aspx?modelmenu=2&model=238&l1=3&l2=15&l3=0
Asus A8v with an agp8x slot


You DO NOT want that board. It's a VIA based chipset and VIA produces mostly garbage. VIA has built up an absolutely horrid reputation with professionals over the years. Do your self a favor and buy a cheap 6600 PCI-E video vard and just get a better one later.

You'll be glad you did.

kassun
08-08-2005, 05:01 PM
i really don't want to give up my quadro card with the dual monitors setup. I can't believe there isn't more motherboards out there that support the x2 with an agp slot.


-kassun

kassun
08-08-2005, 05:04 PM
how about the
http://www.zipzoomfly.com/jsp/ProductDetail.jsp?ProductCode=240140

specs here:
http://www.abit-usa.com/products/mb/products.php?categories=1&model=175

thanks,
kassun

MadMax
08-08-2005, 05:19 PM
how about the
http://www.zipzoomfly.com/jsp/ProductDetail.jsp?ProductCode=240140

specs here:
http://www.abit-usa.com/products/mb/products.php?categories=1&model=175

thanks,
kassun

I wouldn't touch it, it's a VIA based board as well.

As for AGP vs. PCI-E, AGP is legacy. It is soon going to be dead technology. Both AMD and Intel are rushing headlong into PCI-E. It's better performance for the system.

why not sell the Quadro and get a new card?

mlmiller1983
08-08-2005, 06:17 PM
Hes right VIA sucks and the NForce 4 chipset slaughters anything VIA makes. You can find Quadro cards on Ebay for cheap. There is really no way around it. The best chipset for AMD Athlons is the NForce 4. You could try saving up some extra money to purchase a quadro card on ebay or something but thats the best I can think of. AGP is eventually going to phased out.

mlmiller1983
08-08-2005, 06:19 PM
I think you should get the 4400+ since its a 1mb cache. The 4200+ is not much far of a difference in price compare to the 4400+. That's what i'm getting soon...hehehe....

The extra 1MB of cache doesn't really help that much. For dual core AMD processors speed makes the difference, not the cache. The only thing I see the 2 x 1MB cache helps in is video games.

igami
08-08-2005, 08:38 PM
The extra 1MB of cache doesn't really help that much. For dual core AMD processors speed makes the difference, not the cache. The only thing I see the 2 x 1MB cache helps in is video games.

I don't think the cache its only for video games, I think its also for like special effects, dynamics, and particle stuff. Speed is also important of course.

mlmiller1983
08-08-2005, 09:14 PM
I don't think the cache its only for video games, I think its also for like special effects, dynamics, and particle stuff. Speed is also important of course.

check out these benchmarks:
http://www.gamepc.com/labs/view_content.asp?id=a64x2&page=6

Throughout the entire review the 1MB was barely even better than the 512KB cache.

Fishbiproduct
08-09-2005, 10:15 AM
check out these benchmarks:
http://www.gamepc.com/labs/view_content.asp?id=a64x2&page=6

Throughout the entire review the 1MB was barely even better than the 512KB cache.

Saw that and I really wonder about it: when/ in which
circumstances does a larger cache help?
I don't remember seeing a definite answer...And looking
at these tests, it doesn't seem to help render times (Max &
Maya), doesn't help with either with PhotoShop or Flash, doesn't
seem to help with encoding either...
What am I missing?

Edit: sorry, I hadn't seen your previous post on this subject,
above..But yes, it only seem to help with games/ frame-rates.
Meaning, it wouldn't help me at all.

igami
08-09-2005, 02:51 PM
Those are very close numbers. I guess it all depends what you will be doing with your machine and it seems 1mb cache helps on gaming. But I do remember a teacher told me that particles and all the dynamics stuff are store in the cache, so when you replay back and forth, it will load the particles a lot faster. I also think it is good for animation when you baked them.

alesmav
08-09-2005, 03:25 PM
Igami...

Cached particles means that during a particle simulation each particle position for each frame is saved in the file on the disk, so once the simulation calculation is over, you can scrub through the animation a lot faster since the program reads cached data, that is, data stored in a cache file. You can also cache it in your RAM. It has nothing to do with CPU cache... Same goes for dynamics, fur, hair, etc...

ALES

mlmiller1983
08-10-2005, 02:44 AM
I believe this proves just how good the dual core AMD processors are and howl well the two cores are integrated together as well as communicating with each other. It also shows that the extra 512KB Cache per core is utterly useless in most applications, except gaming but not by alot. There is really no point to getting the 1MB cache X2s at the moment.

kassun
08-10-2005, 03:58 AM
Thanks for the help guys. I appreciated the advice. In the end I decided to go with the via chipset and keep my quadro card. I don't game and I wanted to keep my quadro 750 because it's certified for maya. It has always worked great with Maya. When I can afford the upgrade i'll get a new pci express quadro card and motherboard. I use Maya right now primarily for freelance modeling and using Pshop for texture work. I went with the asus board and I RMA'd my tyan board and amd chip, I am going to use the old tyan board and 2 mp's for a small network render'er with maya.

Thanks again,
-Kassun

mlmiller1983
08-10-2005, 06:59 AM
Saw that and I really wonder about it: when/ in which
circumstances does a larger cache help?
I don't remember seeing a definite answer...And looking
at these tests, it doesn't seem to help render times (Max &
Maya), doesn't help with either with PhotoShop or Flash, doesn't
seem to help with encoding either...
What am I missing?

Edit: sorry, I hadn't seen your previous post on this subject,
above..But yes, it only seem to help with games/ frame-rates.
Meaning, it wouldn't help me at all.

There almost really no point to getting the X2 with 2 x 1MB cache unless need the extra frame rate in games but thats not what most owners of X2 bough it for. I am amazed at the rendering speeds and sheer number crunching power these processors have. The AMD 64 X2s even outperform Intel Xeons wich have 4 times the cache per core.

X2 benchmark
http://www.gamepc.com/labs/view_content.asp?id=a64x2&page=7

Opteron Dual Core and Intel Xeon
http://www.gamepc.com/labs/view_content.asp?id=opteron275&page=7

I know not all benchmarks are created equal but its interesting to read.
Quite amazing if you ask me. Kudos to AMD.

alesmav
08-10-2005, 07:29 AM
heya!

Just found this motherboard from a company i never heard of before - ULI. It supports PCI-e, AGP and PCI. The reviews seem pretty good. Anyone tested it. The model is called ULi M1695. I found some data here: http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&ct=res&cd=3&url=http%3A//www.anandtech.com/mb/showdoc.aspx%3Fi%3D2471&ei=4qf5Qp7AF6LOwQHch7DsAw


ALES

t.fadrus
08-10-2005, 07:42 AM
Sorry for getting a little bit off topic, but I have a question about the ASUS A8N and as a lot of you seem to have one maybe you can help me.

Here goes: Does the SATA raid controller of the A8N support the use of a single hdd + raid array. Because I tried that with an intel ich6r and it failed. You can only use the sata ports for raid or in single mode. No mixing of modes. Since I read that the A8N seems to have something like 2 seperate SATA controllers I tought it might be able to do it. Anyone tried something like that?

cheers,
t.fadrus

igami
08-10-2005, 10:26 AM
Igami...

Cached particles means that during a particle simulation each particle position for each frame is saved in the file on the disk, so once the simulation calculation is over, you can scrub through the animation a lot faster since the program reads cached data, that is, data stored in a cache file. You can also cache it in your RAM. It has nothing to do with CPU cache... Same goes for dynamics, fur, hair, etc...

ALES

Oh ok, Thanks for clearing that out. CoOoL!

Fishbiproduct
08-10-2005, 11:52 AM
There almost really no point to getting the X2 with 2 x 1MB cache unless need the extra frame rate in games but thats not what most owners of X2 bough it for. I am amazed at the rendering speeds and sheer number crunching power these processors have. The AMD 64 X2s even outperform Intel Xeons wich have 4 times the cache per core.



Oh I know. My only hesitation at this point was wether I'd pay
the extra money for a larger cache or not on these X2's.
And I guess I won't...;)

That's a good review of the "lil' " 3800 X2:
http://techreport.com/reviews/2005q3/athlon64-x2-3800/index.x?pg=1

mlmiller1983
08-10-2005, 01:33 PM
Oh I know. My only hesitation at this point was wether I'd pay
the extra money for a larger cache or not on these X2's.
And I guess I won't...;)

That's a good review of the "lil' " 3800 X2:
http://techreport.com/reviews/2005q3/athlon64-x2-3800/index.x?pg=1


I think the X2 3800 would make excellent render farm processors once they fall to around $350 in price which shouldn't be that long. I could only imagine rendering across two or three say AMD 64 4200+ cpus.

mlmiller1983
08-10-2005, 01:39 PM
Sorry for getting a little bit off topic, but I have a question about the ASUS A8N and as a lot of you seem to have one maybe you can help me.

Here goes: Does the SATA raid controller of the A8N support the use of a single hdd + raid array. Because I tried that with an intel ich6r and it failed. You can only use the sata ports for raid or in single mode. No mixing of modes. Since I read that the A8N seems to have something like 2 seperate SATA controllers I tought it might be able to do it. Anyone tried something like that?

cheers,
t.fadrus

If your talking about the ASUS A8N SLI Dlx or Premium then yes. It does have two SATA controllers and each supports Raid 0/1/0+1. One also supports Raid 5 but to my knowledge its not WHQL approved so use it at your own risk.

t.fadrus
08-10-2005, 05:50 PM
If your talking about the ASUS A8N SLI Dlx or Premium then yes. It does have two SATA controllers and each supports Raid 0/1/0+1. One also supports Raid 5 but to my knowledge its not WHQL approved so use it at your own risk.

Great, that makes me want to upgrade my system this very instant. But I'm waiting for the 4200+ X2 price to drop a little, when availability here in Austria gets a little better.

thanks for the info mlmiller1983

evanfotis
08-11-2005, 04:12 PM
How 'bout this MSI board?:
MSI K8N Neo2 Platinum (http://www.msi.com.tw/program/products/mainboard/mbd/pro_mbd_detail.php?UID=607)?

It supports X2 (939 socket)
Chipset nVIDIAŽ nForce3 Ultra
Is AGP for your quadro xgl video card

Monarch Price: $135.00

mlmiller1983
08-11-2005, 05:42 PM
How 'bout this MSI board?:
MSI K8N Neo2 Platinum (http://www.msi.com.tw/program/products/mainboard/mbd/pro_mbd_detail.php?UID=607)?

It supports X2 (939 socket)
Chipset nVIDIAŽ nForce3 Ultra
Is AGP for your quadro xgl video card

Monarch Price: $135.00

I forgot all about the NForce 3 Ultra chipset. Silly me. Yeah that would have worked.Now I feel stupid. LOL

kassun
08-11-2005, 06:43 PM
So the MSI K8N Neo2 Platinum would (http://www.msi.com.tw/program/products/mainboard/mbd/pro_mbd_detail.php?UID=607) be a much better choice than the asus I purchased? If so I'll return the asus and purchase the msi board. Is There going to be a huge difference between the two boards, I know you'd mentioned previously that the via chipset is crappy. I guess the real question is is it worth my time to order another mbo and have it delivered?


thanks,
Kassun

MadMax
08-11-2005, 06:59 PM
So the MSI K8N Neo2 Platinum would (http://www.msi.com.tw/program/products/mainboard/mbd/pro_mbd_detail.php?UID=607) be a much better choice than the asus I purchased? If so I'll return the asus and purchase the msi board. Is There going to be a huge difference between the two boards, I know you'd mentioned previously that the via chipset is crappy. I guess the real question is is it worth my time to order another mbo and have it delivered?


thanks,
Kassun

Kassun,

repeat after me.........

VIA SUCKS.

repeat until burned into your very being. :)

The nForce3 250 would be a much better chipset/board to get.

evanfotis
08-11-2005, 07:02 PM
Is There going to be a huge difference between the two boards?

The MSI nforce 3 is an older board.
But it has plenty of goodies, AND you get to keep your AGP Quadro card!
No need to by a new PCI-X video card...

MadMax
08-11-2005, 07:17 PM
The MSI nforce 3 is an older board.
But it has plenty of goodies, AND you get to keep your AGP Quadro card!
No need to by a new PCI-X video card...

Okay, lets avoid future confusion......

There is NO SUCH THING AS PCI-X VIDEO CARDS.

It is PCI-E

PCI-X is something completely different. PCI-X is basically a 64 bit PCI slot used for things like network controllers, SCSI cards etc.

evanfotis
08-11-2005, 07:27 PM
-runs and hides-
sorry for that, I guess I was typing in a hurry:shrug: .
So what's your opinion on this board the MSI K8N Neo2 Platinum (http://www.msi.com.tw/program/products/mainboard/mbd/pro_mbd_detail.php?UID=607)?
Any other suggestion for AGP boards?

MadMax
08-11-2005, 07:35 PM
-runs and hides-
sorry for that, I guess I was typing in a hurry:shrug: .
So what's your opinion on this board the MSI K8N Neo2 Platinum (http://www.msi.com.tw/program/products/mainboard/mbd/pro_mbd_detail.php?UID=607)?
Any other suggestion for AGP boards?

No biggie, I see a lot of people make that mistake and it can cause all kinds of confusion for those who don;t know what it really is or the difference between them.

That MSI isn't bad. I'm not a huge fan of MSI boards because of past Quality control problems that MSI seemed unable to get a grip on. but you will find just as many people complain about Gigabyte, Asus, Abit and any number of other vendors.

Personally I usually use Tyan, Gigabyte or Asus.

Sp1ice
08-11-2005, 07:47 PM
There are no AGP boards that support the AMD 64 X2 CPUs. But there is a PCI Express Quadro card you can get off of ebay for cheap.

Heres one:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Nvidia-Quadro-FX-1400-SLI-PCI-Express_W0QQitemZ5227864694QQcategoryZ40161QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Another one:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Nvidia-Quadro-FX-1400-FX1400-PCI-Express-PCIx-SLI_W0QQitemZ5227190569QQcategoryZ40161QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

If you can spare $250 you can purchase a PCI Express Quadro card on ebay. Look for the 1300 or 1400 model. I hope this helps.

Actually if you look at the Biostar motherboards for the Dual Cores they have the XGP slots (I have seen them called XGA slots too) That work with most of the top line AGP cards but allow you to upgrade to PCIE when you want to.

evanfotis
08-11-2005, 07:49 PM
I've always wanted to try Supermicro on Intel, Tyan on AMD.
Asus? a bit confused about them...
Have always stuck with Gigabyte!
(although I did get a via board of them once for a dual PIII:D )
Don't know why, the fill the board with lots of goodies, ports 'n stuff, just seem to like them...

lots
08-11-2005, 09:20 PM
First let me start by saying something about cache sizes with the K8 architecutre (Athlon64/Opteron). Cache size does not help these cpus as much as it does the P4 architecture. Why? The K8 has a very effiicent design. Each core has its own direct connection to the RAM. On top of this, the memory controller is ON the die along with the rest of the core. This provides extreamly low latencies, and very fast access to memory. Something that the NetBurst (P4) architecture cannot proivide. Thus since in practice, the K8 does not hit cache nearly as often as the P4, since most of its data is supplied fairly quickly by the onboard memory controller. To top it off the K8 is very efficient, when compared to the P4, so there is less down time between instructions, thus reducing the need for a large cache.

Actually if you look at the Biostar motherboards for the Dual Cores they have the XGP slots (I have seen them called XGA slots too) That work with most of the top line AGP cards but allow you to upgrade to PCIE when you want to.
I wouldnt touch those "AGP Xpress" slots with a 10 foot pole. For one, the slot is just two old school PCI slots joined together with an AGP connector. This only works for a few cards, and it does not provide very fast connection. So far the best suggestion was the ULI chipset. It sports a true AGP slot and the ability for PCIe 16x, but in I have not seen many ULI designs in large productions. So, thier reliability may not be up to par with Nvidia.

I'd highly recommend an Nforce3 based motherboard. It has all the same features as the NF4, only slightly out dated. The NF3 also should be compatable with the X2s (So should ANY socket 939 board, if it was built right) However, you may need to flash the bios for the CPU to be recognized. Which could put you in a bit of a bind if you dont have a single core s939 CPU :)

igami
08-12-2005, 03:38 PM
Hey guys, I was just wondering, Do they have a motherboard that supports Dual Athlon X2's? I know the Opterons, but just wondering if they have it for the X2's. Thanks guys.

motoxpress
08-12-2005, 04:31 PM
Hey guys, I was just wondering, Do they have a motherboard that supports Dual Athlon X2's? I know the Opterons, but just wondering if they have it for the X2's. Thanks guys.

No. The architecture doesn't include the needed links between the procs. That's why they have Opterons.


-gl

alesmav
08-15-2005, 09:09 PM
Hey MadMax!

You have so much to say against VIA based motherboards, but what is ACTUALLY wrong with AGP board such as Asus A8V. On www.pcstats.com it even got editor's choice award. They only had a few problems with overclocking. You made it sound like my system is going to crash like every 2 hours if I buy VIA based board...

ALES

MadMax
08-15-2005, 09:30 PM
Hey MadMax!

You have so much to say against VIA based motherboards, but what is ACTUALLY wrong with AGP board such as Asus A8V. On www.pcstats.com (http://www.pcstats.com) it even got editor's choice award. They only had a few problems with overclocking. You made it sound like my system is going to crash like every 2 hours if I buy VIA based board...

ALES

VIA has had a VERY long history of problems. A big issues that is directly attributable to VIA are problems where vendors have stated their products were not compatible with AMD based systems. These included a number of controller cards like SCSI controllers, Data capture cards, NLE boards etc. Unfortunately the issue wasn't compatibility with AMD products, the compatibility issues were with VIA chipsets. This has been proven in countless instances where something Like a DPS NLE board didn't work on a perfectly functional VIA based system, but if you swapped the motherboard for an nForce based, or even AMD chipset and using all the same components, it would work fine.

And that doesn't take into account the kludges and hacks that VIA uses to work around having to pay licensing fees to patent owners.

Hell even their USB chips were buggy as hell.

these are all matters of fact. When I make a recommendation, it is because it is a solid recommendation. VIA is a half assed product, and should be avoided. Last I checked, there are no VIA based boards in any BoXX products. Why do you think that is?

Coliba
08-16-2005, 08:25 AM
A bit off topic but does anyone have an idea how a 4200 compares to dual 244 Opterons?

I'm trying to decide which is a better buy:
- Get 940 socket mb now with 2x244, then later upgrade to dual dualcores
- get single 4200 now which means cheaper mb and cheaper ram, and perhaps get a second machine later.

MadMax
08-16-2005, 08:42 AM
A bit off topic but does anyone have an idea how a 4200 compares to dual 244 Opterons?

I'm trying to decide which is a better buy:
- Get 940 socket mb now with 2x244, then later upgrade to dual dualcores
- get single 4200 now which means cheaper mb and cheaper ram, and perhaps get a second machine later.

go for the 4200 now. It's going to be cheaper overall, and faster.

kassun
08-19-2005, 02:54 PM
I should have done things right the first time, but I tried to save a buck (kicking myself now :) I bought and returned the ASUS with the via chipset, bought the MSI board but the bios chip was old and had to be replaced to accommodate the AMD 4200+ x2 so that went back. I blew my budget and bought the ASUS A8N-SLI Premium (http://usa.asus.com/products/mb/socket939/a8nsli-p/overview.htm) and bought a PNY Quadro FX 1400 and will sell my Quadro 750 XGL AGP card. Now I'll be happy when everything works :)

I purchased a copy of xp pro and have an copy of windows 2000 pro that won't be used. Any ideas if I can re selll the os?

-Kassun

imashination
08-19-2005, 03:45 PM
I should have done things right the first time, but I tried to save a buck (kicking myself now :) I bought and returned the ASUS with the via chipset, bought the MSI board but the bios chip was old and had to be replaced to accommodate the AMD 4200+ x2 so that went back.

Umm, you just had to flash the bio, not buy a new chip.

kassun
08-19-2005, 03:49 PM
i tried with alt-f2 but it didn't work, the new board is a better chipset so no worries.


-kassun

lots
08-19-2005, 04:05 PM
Well if you had an X2, and a board that did not have support for Rev E Athlons, it would be impossible to flash the bios to support the X2 if you do not have an older Athlon64 (single core).

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