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View Full Version : Dual core, dual processors, with HT!?


theboykidney
08-02-2005, 10:21 AM
So am correct in thinking that if you have a dual core, dual processor machine, with HT, you'll have 6 cpu's rendering?!

Is it possible to get dual dual cores yet? and is HT only associated with older processors?

imashination
08-02-2005, 11:55 AM
dual = 2
dual dual = 4
dual dual ht = 8

iambic
08-02-2005, 01:19 PM
? and is HT only associated with older processors?

HT is very much current technology, and intel are being right bastards with it in their dual cores. The extreme editions are the only dual cores with HT enabled and they are twice the price of the dual cores without HT enabled...lets hope some clever monkey figures out how to enable HT on the other dual cores because physically I think it's all there.

lots
08-02-2005, 02:47 PM
Intel's Dual Core Xeons will have HT I believe. Those are a ways off though. And anyway, why would you go with Intel's dual core solutions, when AMD already offers Dual Core in the single/dual/quad/8way CPU markets?

Vertizor
08-02-2005, 03:07 PM
why would you go with Intel's dual core solutions, when AMD already offers Dual Core in the single/dual/quad/8way CPU markets?
If I lived in a cold climate, say Anartica, I'd need the extra heat to stay warm.

Anyone else hear that bit about dual core AMDs running cooler than a single core P4? Outrageous!

iambic
08-02-2005, 03:13 PM
dual = 2
dual dual = 4
dual dual ht = 8

Hey Mashy this off topic but I read your blurb on your website about things tv (PAL NTSC etc) and decided to give you some thoughts. You touch on colour-framing when discussing fields and frames but don't actually describe the benefits of using field rendering.....which is movement looks much smoother, fast moving objects look less steppy etc etc....What I mean by colour-framing is that field 1 or odd or upper as they call it in the computer world I wish they would just stick to field 1....anyway field 1 must be followed by field 2 in order to complete a correct edit. In Pal a flag denoting usually field 1 is laid down every 4 frames this is called the 8 field sequence... and was used by analogue gear to sync up edits....The point of this is that if you mix this up, the field order that is, you will get flashy edits which when stepped through frame by frame you won't see, but at playback speed you will see!...by flashy I mean field flashs...or colour-framing errors. I see crappy edits like this in a lot of desktop video because people don't understand the importance of field order....The importance of field order could be useful in your guide....anyway just some thoughts upon reading your guide....

lots
08-02-2005, 04:05 PM
If I lived in a cold climate, say Anartica, I'd need the extra heat to stay warm.

Anyone else hear that bit about dual core AMDs running cooler than a single core P4? Outrageous!
Yep. Dual core AMD chips have the same thermal envelope as the single core 130nm chips. Which is much cooler running than Intel's single core P4s.

AMD's 90nm single core chips, are just rediculously cooler than Intel's P4s ;)

deathman20
08-02-2005, 04:45 PM
Intel does have a Dual Core with HT (3.2Ghz Extreme Edition) which essinetally has 4 CPU's shown.

Truely I'm an Intel man, but AMD is definatly looks much better for less power and cool factor. I've been highly considering the X2 chips, but I might just wait til they release there new socket and wait for some new chips to come out. See where that brings them in terms of speed and computing power.

If you need one right now I'd consider the AMD X2 4400 cpu (2.2 Ghz with 1mb cache each CPU) and if you know how to over clock you typical results have been around 2.6-2.8Ghz CPU with stock cooler and within default voltage range. So you can save a few bucks get a great CPU and out preform there high end one.

mushkin
08-02-2005, 05:52 PM
So am correct in thinking that if you have a dual core, dual processor machine, with HT, you'll have 6 cpu's rendering?!

No.

/nerd

yalcinaydin
08-02-2005, 08:22 PM
I'm a linkage boy so for you curious guys:
opteron 275 (dual core Xeon's a** kicker Opteron)
- 100 series up to 2 cores, 200 series up to 4 cores, 800 series up to 16 core
to see its muscles under 3D rendering:
http://www.gamepc.com/labs/view_content.asp?id=opteron275&page=7

AMD's Athlon64 X2 series vs Intel again in 3D rendering:
http://www.gamepc.com/labs/view_content.asp?id=a64x2&page=7

SimonPickard
08-03-2005, 02:49 AM
HT does nothing for rendering anyhow. In fact the tests I've done showed that turning off HT speeds up rendering, this was with mental ray.

Regards,
Si.

lots
08-03-2005, 06:28 AM
Depending on the type of rendering you are doing, yes this will either improve performance or hurt it. Though as far as I have seen, amongs other members posting benchmarks and discussing this, HT will, in most cases, improve your performance. It will not improve everythign, and definately will hurt other types of rendering.

rebo
08-03-2005, 07:01 AM
HT gives a 20% speed performance gain on some mental ray tasks. Wether this 20% performance increase is present in a dual core system is unproven.

SimonPickard
08-03-2005, 07:02 AM
"Though as far as I have seen, amongs other members posting benchmarks and discussing this, HT will, in most cases, improve your performance."

That's cos most people "want" to see an improvement after spending all that money on a cpu ;)

I don't see how HT can improve rendering. If a single process draws 100% from your cpu, like with rendering, having a fake thread working away shouldn't make any difference. It's not like you're trying to run 2 processes at the same time, which is where HT shines.

Regards,
Simon.

rebo
08-03-2005, 11:00 AM
Yeah in theory I agree with you, but I recalled this post on the subject a while back. Was in the middle of a big AMD vs Intel debte.


00:41:75
Dual XEON 3.2GHz, SuperMicro X5DA8 mainboard, 2GB RAM, with Hyper-Thread

00:47:68
Dual Opteron 248, Tyan Thunder mainboard, 2GB RAM

00:50:88
Dual Xeon 3.2GHz, SuperMicro X5DA8 mainboard, 2GB RAM, without Hyper-Thread


http://forums.cgsociety.org/showpost.php?p=2248593&postcount=31

lightwolf
08-03-2005, 11:25 AM
I don't see how HT can improve rendering. If a single process draws 100% from your cpu, like with rendering, having a fake thread working away shouldn't make any difference.
Even if your CPU is running at 100%, hat doesn't mean that all the pipelines etc... within the CPU are actually doing something. HT basically uses the second virtual CPU to use unutilized paths within the CPU that would sit idle waiting otherwise. This is why you get the extra 10%-20%
C4D Cinebench shows this quite clearly.
Cheers,
Mike

imashination
08-03-2005, 01:29 PM
"Though as far as I have seen, amongs other members posting benchmarks and discussing this, HT will, in most cases, improve your performance."

That's cos most people "want" to see an improvement after spending all that money on a cpu ;)

I don't see how HT can improve rendering. If a single process draws 100% from your cpu, like with rendering, having a fake thread working away shouldn't make any difference. It's not like you're trying to run 2 processes at the same time, which is where HT shines.

Regards,
Simon.

HT, with a decent render engine will give a 10-25% render speed improvement.

It gives this speedup because the P4 is an inefficient chip, a significant portion of the chip will sit there waiting fo the next set of instructions while another previous instruction is being finished off. By adding another virtual thread, these unused parts of the cpu can be put to use.

lots
08-03-2005, 02:46 PM
The above 2 posts say exactly what I would have :)

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