Special REQUEST: Digital Paint - HELP !

[Terro]

Don't be to technical on rocks and stuff. Heres a little list I can gived you, its what works for me.

1. Create a new layer , don't work on your background layer

2. Oppacity = 100%, Brush = (sommethiung ruged and not round), Size = Big ,Color = Black
lay your foundation down, meaning the solid background color for all your rocks.
3. Layer options -> Preserve Transparacy

This means that you will only be able to paint on your foundation and won't be able to paint pass it. Great for people that tend to paint pass the lines (like ME )

4. Oppacity = 30 % Brush = Same as u used for your foundation , Size = Same as you used for your foundation, Color = What ever you want your rocks to be

Start coloring in your lines, go over the areas that you want to have more sunlight on them, also leave the shaddow areas black.

5. Oppacity = 30 % Brush = Same as u used for your foundation , Size = a Few pixels smaller then in step 4. Color = Change it slightly from Step 4, but not by much.

Keep coloring in your rock surfaces same as in step 4.

6. Keep redusing brush sizes and slightly changin the colors as you keep woring in the rock texture, you can also use the Burn tool a little to give your texture a highligh or shaddow.

Hope this makes any sense, lol.

[StylusMonkey]

Hello Everybody !
I didn't know where to post this, but after searching and trying many Digital Paint tutorials (from the great Thread of 2D Tutorials, and Google too) I still stuck in the same problem:

OK, It's not a Skill issue, The problem is more techniqual related, let me explain what I mean:
I can draw anything, but It seems that I never found "The perfect Brush" I did many tries and tests with different Brushes (Photoshop CS2) and I still can't get the result that I want.

That's why I decided to create this thread to REQUEST somebody kind to help me out with a SHORT EXAMPLE, so I will SEE the steps (and brushes used) to create something SIMPLE.

If you have the time, can you please create a SPECIFIC SHORT TUTORIAL for me and for OTHER people who find the same problem, please ?

Specific SHORT TUTORIAL REQ:
Please show how do you Draw and Paint a Realistic ROCK / STONE while you focus on the STEP-BY-STEP Brushes changes (to show what brushes you choose, and the changes while draw it).

* See the ATTACHED Picture, to see what kind of COLORS / STYLE I'm trying to get.


I know that it's very rude to ask such a request but I really apreciate it if you find the time to make this real short (a single simple Stone) tutorial for me and others to SEE the steps.

Thank you very much for your time, and I'm sorry about my Bad English.

I hate to rain on the parade, but if you hone your observation skills more, you can use the default brushes to attain just about any type of texture you need, I use nothing but default brushes and I can attain any surface needed.

Its like drawing with a pencil, between the fingers of a master graphite can be used to create amazing pieces of art, in the hands of a beginner, all they can do is line drawing.

In most cases the lack of ability to re-create reality with the digital program is an extention of lack of technical skill, if your mind can see it, given a burnt stick and enough experience you can still come up with a work of art, in the hands of a novice all they do is make a mess.

My advice, and I have given it time and time again, is to learn the basics, learn to sketch before you attempt digital paint, learn color theory, learn perspective, learn composition, learn proper line work, learn how to actively observe something before you attempt to re-create it, learn patience.

Far too many people think that the computer and programs are a shortcut, I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but its not.

[Terro]

I agree with magic man but at the same time I don't think you should be too technical. At this point you should set yourself free, don't try to re-create but try to create. Whatever form of media, photoshop or Paper and Pen. Don't try to be too perfect, you will only fail. Learn to understan your own style and what work flow works for you. Everyone is different. I did a million tutorials and was NEVER satisfied after finishing them, till one day I just started scribbling with nothing in my head. To my suprize stuff started coming out on its own. I dropped all the boundries and let my self free, and thats what I needed to progress.

I think i's KEY to find your own style and comfort zone before trying to learn the technical aspect. You have to be happy with your work even if it's not up to key with the top dogs.

[StylusMonkey]

I agree with magic man but at the same time I don't think you should be to technical. At this point you should set yourself free, don't try to re-create but try to create. Whatever for of media, photoshop or Paper and Pen. Don't try to be to perfect, you will only fail. Learn to understan your own style and what work flow works for you. Everyone is different. I did a million tutorials and was NEVER satisfied after finishing them, till one day I just started scribbling with nothing in my head. To my suprize stuff started coming out on its own. I dropped all the boundries and let my self free, and thats what I needed to progress.

I think i's KEY to find your own style and comfort zone before trying to learn the technical aspect. You have to be happy with your work even if it's not up to key with the top dogs.

I think that creation without understanding certain rules shouldn't be undertaken, there are some fundamental rules that every artist should learn, what are complementary colors, what is aerial persoective, how do you achieve depth, how to you describe form without lines. These are all seminal and rather than thinking of them as constraints they should be thought of as tools to help you achieve as close to your mental image as possible.

Far too often novice artists take the "free form" route, which imo amounts to laziness and unwillingness to engage the activity in a dedicated manner. Rules are there for a reason, the only time you should break the rules are after you have gained efficiency and proficiency with them, only then, do you truly have the ability to really decide what is best for your style.

I've seen many artists who produce simply bad work and brush off critiques with "this is MY style!!!1 so f*ck off".

I'd never give a beginner the "take your own path" spiel, it leads to technically bad artwork and lots of unnessesary frustration down the line when the artist doesnt understand why they are going nowhere. I've seen it time and time again, this frustration can be completely avoided if they just hone their skills on a set of rules with which to guide the aspiring artist.

Its like telling a child who is learning to ride a bike to take off the training wheels and learn without training wheels from the get go, pretty soon the bike is rusting in the shed and the child is inside playing computer games because they tried to learn without training wheels and fell of one too many times.

- m

[Terro]

Very true and I think I'm stating things the wrong way. You got me with the damn bike theory. lol. What I mean is that he should get used to the media hes working in. My biggest issue was the tablet and photoshop. I came from Vectors and Flash to using Photoshop with a tablet. Getting used to the tablet was a horrific experiance but I just could not stand using the mouse in photoshop. SO before I could even practice the rules, I needed to get used to the software on hardware. It took a month but I can see the improvements. So in conclusion what I was trying to say is that he sould learn and get sued to what hes using. Get a comfor level for it before he goes further. He's obviously new to Ps since hes having brushes issues. It's like trying to draw with your left hand if your right handed. It get better over time, just don't give up and keep working at it.

[StylusMonkey]

Very true and I think I'm stating things the wrong way. You got me with the damn bike theory. lol. What I mean is that he should get used to the media hes working in. My biggest issue was the tablet and photoshop. I came from Vectors and Flash to using Photoshop with a tablet. Getting used to the tablet was a horrific experiance but I just could not stand using the mouse in photoshop. SO before I could even practice the rules, I needed to get used to the software on hardware. It took a month but I can see the improvements. So in conclusion what I was trying to say is that he sould learn and get sued to what hes using. Get a comfor level for it before he goes further. He's obviously new to Ps since hes having brushes issues. It's like trying to draw with your left hand if your right handed. It get better over time, just don't give up and keep working at it.

oh right, I see what you're getting at, yeah there was a little bit of an issue when I swapped pencil for the stylus, everyone gets that, it took me about a week or so to get used it, it felt pretty strange but after the initial week of wanting to kill everyone because your work looked newbie-ish again it comes just like anything new.

[kayoto]

Terro I agree with you and understand what do you mean because I also came from "VECTORS LAND" into... Pixels.. or be more specific Photoshop.

And it's a matter of training, but that wasn't and still not the issue (well it is but only half of the problem) I know the basics of photoshop (used photoshop earlier versions).

but the thing with the brushes, is that I never get the correct edges, I tried even now using "default" brushes as magic man suggested, and got real nice draw. but it looks BAD when I looked at it for the GOAL (Background for Animation) ...the edges got softer in some points (I used 100% opacity and of course play with size / flow to whatever fits... but it didn't fit even when change a lot of brushes from the default, the edges were soft in some casses so I of course changed to rough brush, mess with it... still.. I think the problem is that I can't find the RIGHT brush, I used to shaded with (Burn/Dodge tool, but I got batter results with just changing the color to Lighter / Darker.

anyway... I'm still in the exact same spot... maybe I should try Painter IX ...I just love photoshop and don't really like the idea to flip into other program if it can be done in photoshop.... if you know a Tutorial for something like I'm looking for (Short Example of Painting Enveroment, or simple Rock like in the Original Message) Please direct me.

Thanks everybody

[Terro]

Question - . Are you using a tablet Kayoto? Because a Tablet with Shape Dymaics turned on can make a hell lot of difference.

[Leonardo Vega]

Every artist can benefit from other's techniques. If not, then why do we have this forum, just to show off? I get inspired by seeing other's art. And it's NOT all about raw skill, because I draw and color very well with actual media. Now on Photoshop or Painter... it's a different story. For example, people have many ways of shading. Some use a blend tool (like the knife in painter), some actually paint all the different tones on. EVENTUALLY after trying many techniques, you develop your own style because you begin to use or throw out different techniques you pick up.

When dealing with a software... it's KEY to learn it well. Because there are many tools. My advice is to pick up a decent book and mess around with the program you have. Experiment and look at other's work. Don't try to create something super off the bat... you will only get frustrated.

And picking the correct brush is also important. Some brushes will go from thin to thick with pressure applied, some are thick all the way through. The brush you use can make a difference.

If we were to take the theory that it's all about one's own talent, and knowledge of software is not really important... then I invite anyone to grab a 3D program that they have never used and create GOOD work without any help, tutorials, books, etc. hahaha.... You have to know your software well, it's just laziness not too (especially for the price you paid).

[Terro: I have a Wacom Intuos 2, does that have Shape Dynamics?]

- Leo

p.s. I'm actually looking for blending techniques with painter...

[kayoto]

Question - . Are you using a tablet Kayoto? Because a Tablet with Shape Dymaics turned on can make a hell lot of difference.


I used Wacom Intuos 2 but now I'm working with MUCH MORE POWER using the Wacom Cintiq (Draw over the LCD itself) since I'm Animating 100% of the Animation using it, and found it even MUCH more easier to paint and not only for drawing/Animate (it is like the intuos, but... much more powerfull if you ask me, I still have the Intuos but the Cintiq makes it all Easier and faster)

So the Hardware isn't the problem...

I did try to Draw and Paint with the PENCIL tool since I couldn't find a good Brush to paint.
the only problem I got is... it's to pixelish.. so I draw the MAIN layout, then took a random brush to paint the basic colors, then mess with smaller parts cracks etc... the problem I got is that it's looking with bad edges... and I'm not really happy with it (yeah.. I did give a try to the different Blur styles... it's not natural as just.. draw/paint it manually)


*ADDED a Quick Test of... fast Mountain.. Rock.. kind of thing (weird colors because it's a Fantasy background, not earth... anyway it doesn't really matters, the issue isn't the colors)

same ol' problem... looking for the Brush... I guess no luck... I guess I should try Painter IX... but I don't like the idea of switching a program (I got a copy of Painter IX and I never even installed it because ...Love of photoshop I believe).

[Terro]

[Terro: I have a Wacom Intuos 2, does that have Shape Dynamics?]



LOL, yes, man you guys got me beat, I'm working with a 90 dollar tablet I bought on ebay, it's not even a wacom. My wacom is too small in size, but it's all I could afford.

To answer your question, Shape Dynamics is just an option in photoshop, not in your tablet, it's a angle, size, shape, pressure control option depending on the position of your stylis.

I just asked because I wasn't sure what tools Kayoto was using, but now I see hes got much more powerfull tools at his disposal then me.

Kayoto, I'll PM you the link to a very nice vid tutorial later on today.

[kayoto]

Kayoto, I'll PM you the link to a very nice vid tutorial later on today.

Thank you so much Terro !
I'll wait for it :)

[NOOB!]

u have a CINTIQ!?!?!?!??! i wud kill for one of those to work on my animation.



damn u!!!

[Terro]

u have a CINTIQ!?!?!?!??! i wud kill for one of those to work on my animation.



I know, right! That just blew my mind.

So Kayoto you said that you needed your rocks for a background, are we working ona flash animation series? Fill us in on the project.

[NOOB!]

I know, right! That just blew my mind.

are we working ona flash animation series? Fill us in on the project.

I AM!! GGRRRR.

yeh i'm interested on what ur doin too kayoto,maybe i can borrow ur cintiq when ur not using it.

*silence*

[Terro]

How about you Nubian? Whats this animation your working on? I hope yo guys don't mind me probing, but it has always been a goal of mine to create a solid Flash nimation of my own, and I consider stuff like Ninjai solid. But ... I at this point I still suck at character animation , I'm ok at environments but when it comes to characters I'm way behind.

Anyhow, I would love to hear the stories you guys are working on.

[NOOB!]

I'm actually working on a Mortal Kombat fan film.

I have voice actors,music and everything.

currently i'm makin painted bgs,and animation is all good,hopefully i'll have it out this year.

i've always been a fan of the MK original games so its a great practice for me.

this is sum concept art,this done bout april,lots changed since then design wise

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v408/noobeene/8131dccf.jpg

and this is the scorpion design i did in early '04 when i wasn't such a good artist,but i've always loved this piece for sum reason

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v408/noobeene/f8736d91.jpg

thanks for ur interest,sorry if i hijacked the thread.unfortunately the glowy colour effects can't be acheived in flash,but i'm working on it.

[Terro]

Don't worry about hijacking Kayotos thread, lol it's in the wrong section anyways, plus I'll hook him up with that tutorial, so he should be satisfied. Getting back to your film, I see that you said you did Scorpion last year when you weren't that good. I Have to be honest and say that I really love the way you portrayed him. Even more then the recent concepts of Sub-zero and Sonya. I really dig the way u used the shaddow. The large amount of black really brings him out, although it would be a pain to animate him like that in flash. It looks Great!!

Whats Frame Rate are you using for the anime? It's just something I always had a problem with. My animation always end up too slow or too fast.

[NOOB!]

yeh i'm actually gunna do the whole think with dark shadows,i'm really inspired by spawn animated series and more recently world record from the animatrix series.
yeh and that scorpion design is still the best i have ,i can't match it,and what is breakin me is i did that yeeeears ago arrrrghhh.*ok early last year*

frame rate i'm workin at now is 24fps,but i've also been practicing at 30fps,i started out at 12,so it was pretty hard to get used to the 20's.

my advice to u is work ur way up slowly,once u get to 24,u'd be shocked out how u even worked below it before.

and hey its not ANIME! hehe,thats the one thing i didn't like and scorps design,its too anime inspired.but i'm still gunna keep it.

what are u workin on?

[kayoto]

I know, right! That just blew my mind.

So Kayoto you said that you needed your rocks for a background, are we working ona flash animation series? Fill us in on the project.


LOL !!!
OK OK OK... You guys are cool !
I didn't know it will interest you.. but no problem here we go:

I'm working on a Pilot (1st official episode) of an Anime style series, that will be up to 3 minutes (still working on the timing with the Storyboard, so nothing is final) and we hope that one of the "BIG FISHES" will buy a full season, so we can get our small Digital Paperless animation studio to get out into the world.

The Anime is very VERY ...weird, it may be hard to explain, and only after see to understand because the script is totaly weird, rules of a fantasy that you won't see as obviuos compare to what we all know in "OUR WORLD" ...so the Pilot will explain the basics of this weird place and characters and what is it all about, it will be hard to put all those in one episode but the very basic stuff will be there.

Now... I thought at first that I should draw the background very quick using the technique and style like in "Smurai Jack" <-- if you notice.... nothing special, nothing much to see, but it seems that everybody focus the ANIMATION and not the background.
I decided that I can take it into another level then just "Quick Backgrounds" ...that's why I needed (and still do) your help with this issue, If I won't figure it out soon I will start paint in "real world" but I really would love to USE the power of the Cintiq and not only for ANIMATION as I did so far.

Sooooo.... Enough flood you with the Story of Krazy Kartoons... any questions ? I'll be happy to answer whatever I can...


Here are some VERY ROUGH stuff, not clean, not blend-shaded, no backgrounds (what you see is only simple layouts temporary so I can animate without wait for the background to be ready) so this stuff you will see are realy BAD and I don't like them... but those rough characters are exercize done before the Cintiq arrive...

http://img2.tapuz.co.il/forums/51539490.jpg


Another screenshot (as you can see... not clean, very rough... Ignore the quality)
http://img1.tapuz.co.il/forums/46724499.jpg

and another Rough screenshot from short part experiment...
http://kayoto.netfirms.com/pics/final---5a___800x640__KK+SUB.jpg

I can always go for the "simple style" - Maybe Cartoon Network get used to those simple styles I'm not really sure when I say simple I mean something ...like this:
http://img1.tapuz.co.il/forums/35904306.jpg

But... it's not very Challenging for the BIG-FISHES around there... (who cares, I follow my heart anyway hehe... too bad it's not pay $$$ hehe...)


This next screenshot is from a practice project that I never finished, here's Murosaki the evil monster walks forward mad... as usuall.. not shaded, and nothing is final... just rough and rush:
http://kayoto.netfirms.com/pics/VAC-001.jpg

from the same animation above... here is Nozomi (the mean girl.. hehe)
http://kayoto.netfirms.com/pics/VAC-002.jpg


ALL THE SCREENSHOT are taken from animation sequences, they are not from the CURRENT Pilot Project, what you just saw I've done for fun (practice) before the Cintiq arrived and before I got started to get into it more seriously with the current Pilot !

Sorry about my Bad English.....

[NOOB!]

whoa nice kayoto looks like u've got it all planned,how did u afford a cintiq?

what frame rate are u working at?

[kayoto]

whoa nice kayoto looks like u've got it all planned,how did u afford a cintiq?

what frame rate are u working at?

Man your Concept art is AMAZING !!! I love it, and can't wait to see it (if you will put some trailer or something to look whenever you'll finish it) !!!

I'm using 25 fps becuase I'm producing the Pilot for PAL (it's easier to convert to NTSC later)
I didn't mention, the all project is sponsered by... ourseleves (me and my friend witch is the script writer and storyboarding) I afford the Cintiq using the evil orgnization code name: THE BANK... yeah, a loan that I'm still working very hard to pay for it ! ...And it's not easy, But it makes the "Krazy Kartoons" (name of our studio) productions much faster, and even that I hate work on pressure and deadlines... it's the only thing that make things work.

BTW - What do you use as your Main Animation tools ? (Wacom Intuos ? what software, is it flash ? what about compositing ?)

...This thread start to get more and more interesting (even that it's not in the right place anymore... Wooops hehe

[NOOB!]

yeh i'm making all the animation in flash,backgrounds in photoshop imported into flash,wacom intuos 2,i hope to add effects when i buy adobe after affects and composite it all in there with the sound,but as i don't own the rights to the characters i can't really do much with it,but i will post on several forums to get recognition and feedback,and then i can work on my own thing.

i hope to finish by novemeber,and i'll try to orgnaise a trailer,but i need to speak to my sound editor about that.

glad u like my concept art.

ever thought about puttin ur stuff on dvd instead of video?

i hope ur studio does well,i'm gunna make my own small studio late next year and organsie my company.its too early for me to be thinking about that right now.

and i wish i cud get a loan for a cintiq lol.when do u plan to have ur film out? how far are u into production?

[kayoto]

ever thought about puttin ur stuff on dvd instead of video?

i hope ur studio does well,i'm gunna make my own small studio late next year and organsie my company.its too early for me to be thinking about that right now.

and i wish i cud get a loan for a cintiq lol.when do u plan to have ur film out? how far are u into production?

Well, I actualy would like to put it on DVD later but it won't change the Frame Rate, only the resolution,may change if I will go for it, the main reason I chose PAL 25 fps, is because it's the best to convert into most other versions later on without ruin the quality / fps.

The only thing that actually stop me now is that... (here we come again) coloring background issue, I saw your WIP thread and ....Man you're work is AMAZING !!!
I must get the idea of gettin' the correct brushes (I'll wait for Terro's Video Tutorial to help me SEE how it's done - MUCH THANKS Terro !) and I will get back to the backgrounds issue.

There is not exactly deadline now because of many other reasons, I'm starting the Actor Vocals and Original SoundTrack for it so it will make everything slower, since I do it all (The Krazy Kartoons small studio is already a Professional Studio for Audio with Acoustic Booth High quality equipment and all, so all the production is... InHouse, from scratch to Final, the only thing that we'll make out is the convert into Alpha/Beta versions for broadcast and stuff like that but it's not really importent.

So did you already start animate, or some tests ? I wonder what do you use for the OUTLINES in flash, is it the pencil tool with Hair-thickness ? or something else... just wondering, anything about your workflow within flash will be interesting to read so feel free to tell about your pipeline with your project sound really cool !

[Terro]

Ok, here I go.

I'm currently writing a sci-fi religion action comedy currently tittled : Guardians of Destiny

These are some of the character background

"
Heres a little back drop information on Cyrix, one of the main supporting characters in my story.

Cyrix - Cyrix is a tall blond male that looks to be in his twenties. His real age is unknown due to the fact that Cyrix keeps his date of birth under wraps and never celebrates his birthday. His appearance and carefree attitude would never bring anyone to the assumption that Cyrix is one of the 3 wealthiest entities in the universe. While most wealthy humans are fortunate enough to purchase a mansion or even an island, Cyrix can afford to purchase entire planets or even planetary systems. How much he can afford has never been determined because his credit seems to be involved in everything from toothbrushes to Interstellar Wormholes. There isn't an agency big enough to perform an audit of this magnitude at the current moment. Cyrix may be a free spirit but he's also followed by his stubborn reputation of doing everything by the law and the rules of superstition. It is said that he once bulldozed one of his many mansion because someone shook his hand in its door way. It's also said that he once gave every single perons on his home world planet Julius 4, a million credits, just to spite off the local government, eventually causing the economy to crash and a birth of the current free society. Some look at his actions as outrageous while others admire the dedication to his beliefs.

Julius 4 (planet) flourishes with tropical vegetation and ocean life. Compared to it's neighboring planets, Julius ranks as the smallest in the sector. It's small mass size is balanced out by it's high velocity rotation, making it a perfect place to raise future pilots. The planet was named in honor of it's discoverer and first king , Julius M. Cairnes. Today's youth rarely questions the importance of the planets full name. Julius 4 used to be Julius 3 and before that Julius 2. The number that follows the planets name signifies the amount of times it has been completely destroyed by rogue asteroids. The last impact occurred 1630 lunar years ago and annihilated the entire tera population.

"


I'm slowely writing while I improve my art skills.

I'll look up my old flash animations and try to post them here later on today.

[NOOB!]

i started out with the penicl tool,but its annoying and all the line is the same size,so i switched to the brush tool with my wacom so i cud get thicker lines where ever i need.

yeh i have start animatin,roughing in the scenes,but as of now nothin is complete.

i never colour anything until i have completed the inks,otherwise ur just asking for trouble.

if ur looking to make it in america,the frame rate over there is 30fps,so just watch out for that.

really glad u like my WIP,after i finish that i'll be working allota more on animation.

do u have any previews?

[NOOB!]

terro interesting concept,man cool to see sum people interest in the 2d side here,looking foward to more development and art from ur project.

[kayoto]

Terro - I just red your description and when I got to the place when you explain about planet Julius 4 it was kind of remind me something in the script we're working at (not the details, but the thing about "AREA" with RULES and creatures... etc.. can't say much about it, you'll see when it will be out, or a trailer :D

So Terro - is it going to be a STORY or it's a Script that you will Animate, I didn't actually understand but it sound really cool, at first read I tought it reminds me "Sliders" or something like "StarGate" but it's hard to say from general details, I would like to read more about the process of your writing, or maybe you will post some concept art of it ? anything will be very cool if you like (I even belive it deserve it's own thread as WIP maybe ? not sure)

[kayoto]

i started out with the penicl tool,but its annoying and all the line is the same size,so i switched to the brush tool with my wacom so i cud get thicker lines where ever i need.

yeh i have start animatin,roughing in the scenes,but as of now nothin is complete.

i never colour anything until i have completed the inks,otherwise ur just asking for trouble.

if ur looking to make it in america,the frame rate over there is 30fps,so just watch out for that.

really glad u like my WIP,after i finish that i'll be working allota more on animation.

do u have any previews?

Well nothing that I can show... I'm sure that when I'll finaly solve that Background Issue (that currnt stuck in my head... till I get it right and keep up with the flow) then I'll maybe show some stuff in progress (not sure.. not sure..) ...or just wait for the trailer and show some screenshots from the WIP as you said, good to see more people interested in 2D animation.

So basicly you're now using only the Brush tool ? Don't you get an ... " ED EDD & EDDY " kind of "Dancing Outline" ??? ...that's why I'm afraid to use it, when I use the brush is for old tests (for more static parts) but specialy for the rough animation on a Guide Layer then over it with the pencil tool... tellin' the truth I HATE the pencil tool for animation (it's cool for illustarte and stuff or Cut-Out Animation style... but not for Frame by Frame (my personal opinion) ...if the Brush tool could save a STABLE thickness all the way (like the pencil tool) I would be very happy... but.. still messing around with it.
I only hope is the next GENERATION of flash for more Animator Friendly... but for now.. gotta use the current tools.

[NOOB!]

i often zoom in and out to get the smoothest lines,i also use the smooth feature in flash,i forget where it is.

but jeez,u have a cintiq whats wrong with u?!?! lol u shud have full control and not get the ed edd eddyness.takes a lil time to get used too.

i might wanna use ref for bgs,when i say ref, i don't mean copy,i mean use certain parts to make ur image.

example: this is a rough layout for a bg in my movie,look how i used the ref.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v408/noobeene/bg1copy.jpg

ref:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v408/noobeene/Albert_mountain_steps.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v408/noobeene/MVC-176S.jpg

[kayoto]

but jeez,u have a cintiq whats wrong with u?!?! lol u shud have full control and not get the ed edd eddyness.takes a lil time to get used too.




Sorry to tell you... but you're wrong, I supposed you've never worked with a Wacom Cintiq before. anyway, the only thing that the Cintiq Gives you is the Almost Perfect - " Eye to Hand " angel so you act like you draw in your paper, while in regualr tablets you're looking at the screen while draw on the board, the reason I said you're wrong is: that even with Cintiq it's not making the FLASH PENCIL tool act more " FREE " as you might thing, the SOFTWARE is the most importent thing when it comes to work with any Wacom I know, If I use the DRAW tools in Adobe Illustrator... MAN ! I can do magic ! easily and faster ! ...with Toon Boom Studio ! amazing !!! ...but when I get into Flash... it seems very Hard and time consuming just to habdle the way the tools work... I already got used to how it react long time ago.. but I compare it to other VECTOR programs and Flash is lame when it comes to draw... that's the truth ! and in Digital Animation, is very important to feel comfortable with the tools you work with to produce the outlines you like :)

I'm still working with Flash and actually find myself draw outline using the brush in 400% zoom, so I feel much more "FREE" ...unlike drawing with the pencil witch looks great but HARDER to control... yes... EVEN WITH A CINTIQ ! hehehe...

[NOOB!]

allota the dudes i know that work with cintiqs in flash say they have allot more control,so i'm only saying that coming from them.

but we all have our own comfort zones

for me flash is perfect when it comes to drawing,just gotta know how.

[kayoto]

allota the dudes i know that work with cintiqs in flash say they have allot more control,so i'm only saying that coming from them.

but we all have our own comfort zones

for me flash is perfect when it comes to drawing,just gotta know how.

Well... It's hard for me to agree on this, since before I got the cintiq more then 3 Animators I know told me: " Whatever you do, don't buy Cintiq for FLASH it won't make much differents as you might think ! " ...And you know what, They were right, IT IS DIFFERENT but not as I thought... flash DRAWING tools are lame, I could feel the REAL diffrents on the other programs but in flash it wasn't THAT BIG... the only fun is the BRUSH but... I think you should do some tests to know what I mean:

when I said: " Ed Edd & Eddy " outline style... I didn't ment that exactly, but as you already know when you use the brush tool you will notice that parts of your character (for example focus the arm or leg... and see that in some parts the BRUSH OUTLINE change a bit... and if you did the same with the Pencil Tool it will be VERY COMMERCIAL looks.

I notice it because I've done some tests, and when I got to the Cleanup part using the Brush it was very HARD to keep the brush thickness as I liked... well... I guess it's a matter of taste afterall ;)

[NOOB!]

yeh well i mainly wud like a cintiq for bg work and character animation,eventually the whole smoothin ink cleanup thing won't be a problem cos i'll have sumone to do that for me.

right now i'm happy with the intuos 2.

and my voice actors are fantastic,and its such a great experience.

so if u have any updates,u cud start another thread for us 2d guys,dunno which forum,

good luck!!

[kayoto]

Thanks !
Good luck in your project too my friend !
It would be great to see WIP of it, screenshots and anything related !

[NOOB!]

sure thing,let this thread die though,its already in the wrong forum and gone terribly off-topic,we can just make another one in the wip animations forum,be the first 2d guys to do so.

[Terro]

I agree , lets shut this thread down, I've made a specific 2D group thread under the WIP/Animation section. follow this link http://www.cgtalk.com/showthread.php?p=2439547#post2439547

[kayoto]

Why Kill that thread if I'm about to get BACK TO THE REAL SUBJECT...hehe
(BTW - For 2D Animation get into Terro's new thread, it's exactly for us 2D Animators !)

So.. back to the Real subject:
After messing around with Photoshop trying to make first view of the Fantasy Desert (named JOTA) Originaly the picture is Huge (also scrollable for the first scene).
The picture is pretty clean so far.. I will add more rocks and stuff later (I'm working with the storyboard now, so it's very clean just to test ME & PHOTOSHOP for backgrounds)

Anyway, I think that I'm starting to get the idea... but still got a problem.
if you look good on the ScreenShot there is a CLOSE Purple Rock kind of object I created.
and It will saved as Different channel (for Camera movemnt animated later... )
the problem I got is the edges... after trying Blur it (most of the Blur ways) it's not really what I'm looking for, I want it like this (no blur) but I can't use those Edges like this.. they are so ...I have no idea how to explain, but I need the edges of this object CLEAN, I started to work manually with the earaser but still.. it's not what I'm looking for... so... how do you clean such thing ? what is the thchnique to do it ...I would leave it like that if I wouldn't animate it later but I will (also it's only one object, I will add more Purple rocks make in the same way.. so I need to know before I will continue)

http://kayoto.netfirms.com/pics/Test-1aa.jpg

I Believe I will get the idea of painting with Photoshop... it's a matter of tweak and Right Brushes...

http://kayoto.netfirms.com/Test-2aa.jpg



BTW - Any recommanded free host to upload WIP screenshots ? (my netfirms acount is very limited, Tripod closed my acount, anything recommanded please ?)

thanks !

[Terro]

Morning Kayoto,

I can't se you hosted pics :( I don't know much about fre hosts so I can;t help you there. Just get a web site going. You can get good deal for about 5 bucks a month now.

Let me ask you another question, what resolution are you working at? And what is the final resolution you need?

[kayoto]

Morning Kayoto,

I can't se you hosted pics :( I don't know much about fre hosts so I can;t help you there. Just get a web site going. You can get good deal for about 5 bucks a month now.

Let me ask you another question, what resolution are you working at? And what is the final resolution you need?

hmm... actually I'm using on pretty big resolution so I won't loose quality (sometimes I use it because I pan around with the camera when animating) so this specific background original size is: 2000x1200 150dpi (I know, 72 Dpi is good enough for Screen/TV but I like working on 150 - 300 Dpi) ANYWAY... I didn't post this crazy size of course, only a simple screenshot (a part of a rock I draw) to show what I mean.

I have no idea why it's not working try the direct links tell me if it works:
http://kayoto.zap3x.com/Test-1aa.jpg
[/url]

and
http://kayoto.zap3x.com/Test-2aa.jpg[url="http://kayoto.netfirms.com/Test-2aa.jpg"] (http://kayoto.netfirms.com/pics/Test-1aa.jpg)


Anyway... I hope to get the result you got when you created the cliff and the panda and the tree in your paint Terro (very smooth edges, connected with the whole picture.. how ?)
not that I will understand without SEE an example.. but I can try.

[Terro]

The shity cliff I did ws done at 2000 X 1200 , I resized it to half its size for the final render. What you see is 1000 X 600. Resizing down makes a lot of difference as well.

[kayoto]

The shity cliff I did ws done at 2000 X 1200 , I resized it to half its size for the final render. What you see is 1000 X 600. Resizing down makes a lot of difference as well.

That's not a resolution issue, If I only could show you the fast paint I did so you can see in some parts the edges are.. ok.. (still need a work) and in othe places (most of the object, Stone/Rock) I need to fix the edges...

Hope that this time the Screenshots are working (edit last message, check it out)

Thanks !

[CGTalk Moderation]

This thread has been automatically closed as it remained inactive for 12 months. If you wish to continue the discussion, please create a new thread in the appropriate forum.