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Leonard
05-24-2005, 02:44 AM
http://leonard.cgcommunity.com/Master-and-Servant.jpg

The final entries are now in for CG Challenge XVII - Master and Servant! Judging is slated to begin shortly, with the final results to be posted in early June. Over 450 artists have met the requirements for the Challenge. With so many high quality entries this time, we don't expect judging to be an easy task!

The public is invited to view the entries for the Master and Servant Challenge here (http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/masterandservant/entries.php).

Please note that there is no public voting for the Master and Servant Challenge. Judging will be performed internally.

The Master and Servant Challenge is proudly sponsored by: Boxx Technologies, NVIDIA, ATI, Wacom, ART VPS, The Gnomon Workshop, Alias, Discreet, Softimage, Maxon, Luxology, Corel, Turbo Squid, E-on Software and Ballistic Publishing

CGChallenge XVII – Master and Servant
http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/masterandservant/


Master and Servant Final Entries
>> View them here << (http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/masterandservant/entries.php)


--

Also, the book for the previous CG Challenge - Grand Space Opera, is now available from the CGProShop (http://www.cgproshop.com/product/000099/). CGS members enjoy a discount on all our books.



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Geta-Ve
05-24-2005, 03:23 AM
Why is judging internal?

Leonard
05-24-2005, 03:30 AM
Why is judging internal?

Primarily because too many Challengers complained when it was external (for numerous reasons). We also found some people trying to sway the external votes by creating bogus CGTalk accounts and voting for themselves. The best way to avoid all those problems was to just bring it all internal.

Geta-Ve
05-24-2005, 03:34 AM
Oh I see.. That is unfortunate, I was looking forward to doing my part in the challenge, seeing as I wasn't able to complete mine.

So since the voting is internal now will there be an in depth reason why such and such picture was picked? Sort of like a review of the winning entries, and how they were marked?

Leonard
05-24-2005, 03:50 AM
Oh I see.. That is unfortunate, I was looking forward to doing my part in the challenge, seeing as I wasn't able to complete mine.

So since the voting is internal now will there be an in depth reason why such and such picture was picked? Sort of like a review of the winning entries, and how they were marked?

That will depend on the judges and how much time they have to dedicate to this.

Thanks,

Leonard

Ego
05-24-2005, 04:31 AM
I don't envy those judges. Most be a hell of a job choosing the best of the best from these amazing entries!

PhilOsirus
05-24-2005, 06:37 AM
Oh I see.. That is unfortunate, I was looking forward to doing my part in the challenge, seeing as I wasn't able to complete mine.

So since the voting is internal now will there be an in depth reason why such and such picture was picked? Sort of like a review of the winning entries, and how they were marked?

I don't know but judging from the names of the judges is enough for me. It's better than polls where most people only look at the first few pages of entries. If they choose a winner it's because he followed the rules and his artwork matched the idea behind the challenge.

Psotek
05-24-2005, 06:59 AM
Im glad its internal now. It was becoming a popularity contest when the public could vote.

Swoop
05-24-2005, 07:43 AM
Hard job to pick a favorite for the judges ;) Anywyas some nice entries there.. like them all :D

paperclip
05-24-2005, 07:54 AM
I think the internal judging is a great idea- now we can be completely sure that the winners aren't a result of biased judging.
I'm surprised- there are 288 final 2D entries, but only 180 final 3D entries! When I first came to CGTalk, it was much more 3d-oriented, so this is a real change.
Wonder why.

By the way- having looked through the final entries, I've noticed a few that I haven't before- amazing ones too. How did I miss them!? :sad:

dragondragon
05-24-2005, 08:05 AM
Hello Leonard, great concept you all have here. I agree with Bartosz. Great to see that the contest will be judged according to the rules laid out to us early on and not by how many people go to a certain post. Kudos for selecting judges this time. :bounce: :thumbsup:

eddieellis
05-24-2005, 08:35 AM
I think that its great too, as this comp will be judged on concept, not just technical ability (which gives students like me, more of a chance for a bit of exposure)..

NOOB!
05-24-2005, 08:51 AM
seemz cool to me,as sumone mention before the public vote was like a popularity contest,anywho all the entries look great,i almost cudn't find mine,i got scared....ahem ..then i found it.

MrBraun
05-24-2005, 09:30 AM
Good luck to all !! ;)

alexfalchi
05-24-2005, 09:47 AM
I think that its great too, as this comp will be judged on concept, not just technical ability (which gives students like me, more of a chance for a bit of exposure)..

Ho yes I think so...very big opportunity for all guys !

Alex.

Geta-Ve
05-24-2005, 10:29 AM
I dunno, I was just bummed out because last challenge the voting gave me a good reason to go through every single entry (yes I really did) And it was my surprise that I found some really really great ones too. Alot that I voted for won too, which was nice to see :)

But thinking about it now, it probably is better that it is internal judging seeing as there is more to look for in the entries this time around. As most entries have to have a deeper meaning to them (or thats how I preceived it anyways)

Anyways, congrats to everyone that participated :)

coCoKNIght
05-24-2005, 11:31 AM
forget voting! when does the next challenge start? :D

Enayla
05-24-2005, 11:34 AM
Wow, nice. Lots of entries in there that I had, somehow, not seen while the Challenge was still in the works. I'm also happy to see that my entry did make it through in spite of me not getting a confirmation letter :love:

DrFx
05-24-2005, 11:35 AM
Internal voting is a good thing, imho! Nobody has the bandwidth and will power to go through every entry (except geta-Ve!). Can we expect four challenges in a year? I was hoping to get into one!

Katea
05-24-2005, 12:32 PM
forget voting! when does the next challenge start? :D

Oh, I hope it starts soon... I'm new here, feeling a little bit confused. ;) But I'm hoping to take part in a new challenge and therefore also learn some more about how CGnetworks contests work :)))

DaddyMack
05-24-2005, 01:15 PM
Wow!! So many absolutely stunning entries... Especially you 2d guys, some of your work is just insane... Good luck to you all with the judging, and may the force be with the judges, they've certainly got their work cut out for them... I think internal really suits this particular challenge well too;)

NOOB!
05-24-2005, 01:31 PM
I'm surprised- there are 288 final 2D entries, but only 180 final 3D entries! When I first came to CGTalk, it was much more 3d-oriented, so this is a real change.
Wonder why.



because 2D OWNS ALL!!

*realises this a hardcore 3d forum*

*runs the f**k away*

ffourier
05-24-2005, 02:20 PM
dude so many amazin job in one place... it is incredible !

AirbORn
05-24-2005, 02:21 PM
I rather there to be internal judging. I always found the community voting phase a little bias.

ChrisThatGuy
05-24-2005, 02:25 PM
forget voting! when does the next challenge start? :D

Ah, my thoughts exactly.

Actually, I'm relieved that the judging is internal, but maybe next challenge there could be both internal judging, which determines the winners, but also some kind of voting for a favorites poll, which has no effect on the actual contest but would just be neat to see the results of.

paperclip
05-24-2005, 02:39 PM
We don't need a favorites poll, just look at which threads get most views/replies. These are clearly the favorites.
Apart from people whose threads are almost solely reserved for chatting about other things...
Can't wait for the next challenge either...I'm going to enter them all from now on...such a good way to develop & learn.

dmonk
05-24-2005, 02:48 PM
My entry isn't there. I submitted my final successfully well ahead of time. Could leo or someone send me a PM. I'm pretty sure I followed all of the rules.

csDevil
05-24-2005, 03:37 PM
I'm glad 2D has more entries. Shows that people is not that tool-oriented, but art-oriented.

And the internal judge is the best thing about the challange. It is not partial, every single entry is reviewe and, so, it is much more fair

applauses for CGTalk team and for all artists on the challange
:applause: :applause: :applause:

Aradiael
05-24-2005, 03:44 PM
uh, eehr... tons of images I didn't ever seen when the challenge was running:eek:
and most of all really brilliant! I wouldn't want to be one of the judges...

Leonard
05-24-2005, 03:57 PM
My entry isn't there. I submitted my final successfully well ahead of time. Could leo or someone send me a PM. I'm pretty sure I followed all of the rules.

DMonk -- please PM Robert Mibus (username "Mibus") as soon as you get this message. Thanks, Leonard

dmonk
05-24-2005, 04:07 PM
DMonk -- please PM Robert Mibus (username "Mibus") as soon as you get this message. Thanks, Leonard


Thanks Leo, will do.

jamihn
05-24-2005, 04:43 PM
I must say, looking through the final entries and seeing what people came up with is a real treat. I also agree that the voting is best internally. Boy, I'd love to be a fly on the wall for those conversations.

Man, there certainly a good number of entries with women in various stages of undress. ChickGirlTalk or something like that.:D

MrPositive
05-24-2005, 04:48 PM
Ok I dont know if I'm the first to do this but I went through all the 3D entries in the contest. It's nice that the voting is internal but putting my two cents in is the fun of cgtalk. First off I dont think I've ever seen more trolls, orcs, and demons in one place before hahahaha. Ok there were certainly alot of great entries and everybody should be commended for their work whether it was there first 3D image or thousandth. Saying that there were two that stick out as breathtaking to me and no I dont know either of the two artists. First is by Adel Adili (Leda) which at first I thought was placed in the wrong category because frankly I thought it was a painting which is so very rare to achieve in 3D. I just love the composition and flawless modeling of the characters. It simply reminds me of paintings I saw in the Lourve. My second place would go to Olivier Ponsonnet (reiv) which demonstrates a simply amazing environment and character. If you were ever looking for a Tim Burtonesque rendering this is it. After that there are a conucopia of amazing renderings. Including in no order of importance to me:
Alexander Hedstrom
Damir G.Martin
Diego Velasco-De Armas
Dustin Solomon
gehry welty
Guillermo
Krishnamurti M. Costa
Laurent Pierlot
ludek hroch
Mark Endre Seljan
Matt Bortolino
Monsit Jangariyawong
Norman Rosenstech
Philipp Zaufel
Pär Tingström
Qian Jin
roberto giron
Zubuyer Kaolin

Edit: I showed two of my colleagues who are both considered master painters the Leda render and they couldnt believe it was 3D. It's both there new favorite 3D still ever. It makes me happy because it proves that you can get a painterly look from 3D packages especially with the new GI softwares.

Nazirull
05-24-2005, 05:06 PM
Great call to take this thing internal..but let we hear wut the judges say. :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

fer3d
05-24-2005, 05:22 PM
I learned a lot in this challenge.

Thank you.

fer

eparts
05-24-2005, 07:11 PM
so many winnerpictures! :buttrock:

zman
05-24-2005, 07:15 PM
As allready said, i think its a wise decition to make the voting internal.
i guess most people wouldnt bother going through all the entries before making up their minds.
plus, the judges are truely respectable artists and i dont think anyone would think its wrong to let them decide.

oh, and i also cant wait to see what's the next topic :bounce:

JTD
05-24-2005, 08:10 PM
Isn’t it obvious why there were less 3D submissions? 3D requires much more time and frankly I thought the amount of time given for this contest only hurt the 3D artists.

Geez, I only had to color a pencil drawing and I was done. But a 3D artist has to define the concept, usually through a pencil drawing or some such much like me, but then it gets intense...they have to create the geometry by using various tools and techniques (can you already start to see how much more involved this is than drawing line art?), texture every single piece of geometry in the shot separately, in most cases they have to rig the geometry to get the correct pose, light the shot (which is more complicated that just drawing a 2D highlight on the 2D character’s shoulder), render the damn thing which may require more processing power than 2D apps ever dreamed of, and then they actually have to take the rendering into post effect software, perhaps the very same photoshop that you and I used in the 2D challenge and create special effects only to arrive at same milestone that the 2D artists arrived at shortly after their pencil drawing.

It really breaks down like this:

2D
pencil drawing
photoshop
final


3D
pencil drawing
build geometry (integrated process that requires the artist to work on the backside of geometry which is never shown to the viewer anyway)
texture every single piece
Rig the geometry (nuff said about this subject)
light the shot (more than white paint on a shoulder)
render (can take days to render)
photoshop
final


In conclusion, I’m sorry for the thread hijack but there’s got to be more time given to the 3D artists or it will only blatantly favor the 2D submissions. Congratulations to all of the artists, 2D and 3D, who’ve managed to stick it out until the end. Great job, see you at the next challenge.

CoreyArtE
05-24-2005, 08:46 PM
hey, I dont see my entry in the final's...Is there soemthing wrong?

Empath
05-24-2005, 09:40 PM
Isn’t it obvious why there were less 3D submissions? 3D requires much more time and frankly I thought the amount of time given for this contest only hurt the 3D artists.

Geez, I only had to color a pencil drawing and I was done. But a 3D artist has to define the concept, usually through a pencil drawing or some such much like me, but then it gets intense...they have to create the geometry by using various tools and techniques (can you already start to see how much more involved this is than drawing line art?), texture every single piece of geometry in the shot separately, in most cases they have to rig the geometry to get the correct pose, light the shot (which is more complicated that just drawing a 2D highlight on the 2D character’s shoulder), render the damn thing which may require more processing power than 2D apps ever dreamed of, and then they actually have to take the rendering into post effect software, perhaps the very same photoshop that you and I used in the 2D challenge and create special effects only to arrive at same milestone that the 2D artists arrived at shortly after their pencil drawing.

It really breaks down like this:

2D
pencil drawing
photoshop
final


3D
pencil drawing
build geometry (integrated process that requires the artist to work on the backside of geometry which is never shown to the viewer anyway)
texture every single piece
Rig the geometry (nuff said about this subject)
light the shot (more than white paint on a shoulder)
render (can take days to render)
photoshop
final


In conclusion, I’m sorry for the thread hijack but there’s got to be more time given to the 3D artists or it will only blatantly favor the 2D submissions. Congratulations to all of the artists, 2D and 3D, who’ve managed to stick it out until the end. Great job, see you at the next challenge.

Good points, 2D is generally a one person project, but fully realized 3D is generally the result of lots of people with their own specialties in the pipeline. Anyone who actually has only one area of expertise (a large number of people in 3D), would not be capable of completing something on their own. I for one would love to attempt one of these challenges, though I would lose miserably and most assuredly be a laughingstock, but what I've been focusing on learning is the modeling aspect of 3D, there's no way I could manage all of the other necessary tasks as well.

jmBoekestein
05-24-2005, 09:44 PM
Well, I'm telling you. You're buying into a myth. I didn't have anybody to tell me that it's impossible or too much workwhen I was teaching myself. Just look on it as some sttuff that's on the road ahead. I ws dying to get into everythin from the start though, and am now quite readily charging to learn 2d as well.


But I fully agree that it was very little time, I had little time to myself anyway, allthough the term :rolleyes: lazy comes to mind in my case I could have finished with some scabby picture.

zman
05-24-2005, 10:01 PM
JTD, you'r right.
on the other hand, compare the prizes for the 3d contest to the prizes for the 2d contest :D

paperclip
05-24-2005, 10:07 PM
I must say, looking through the final entries and seeing what people came up with is a real treat. I also agree that the voting is best internally. Boy, I'd love to be a fly on the wall for those conversations.

Man, there certainly a good number of entries with women in various stages of undress. ChickGirlTalk or something like that.:D

Mine has men in various stages of undress. :twisted: :D

jerry123
05-24-2005, 11:25 PM
omg,i just love the guy whith the bike and the puppy...yess...fear my doggy...excellent.
i have noticed thogh ,that,like the last challange too,the 2d quality of work was far better
and expressive than the 3d.
most 3d works suffer from bad composition,most dont work as a complete"pice of art"
whith only 2-3 amazing "winner"images in the whole 3d challange
the 2d ones ,on the other hand,are great.
i think it somewhat prooves sometimes cg ppl"suffer"from lack of art backround,and it
really shows comparing to the 2d ppl,its something i think maybe 3d oriented ppl should
work on.

however,i feel quite bad mentioning that(and i suppose it was quite expected when
given a challange called "master and servant"),but,hell...some of those images are really
offensive,its,like,one step befor porn...i meen,i dont know if there are or even should be
rulls against offensive images...its a very tough question of where to put the limit.
but,man...those...
http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/masterandservant/entry.php?challenger=5793
http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/masterandservant/entry.php?challenger=7283http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/masterandservant/entry.php?challenger=7283
http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/masterandservant/entry.php?challenger=7600
http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/masterandservant/entry.php?challenger=5790http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/masterandservant/entry.php?challenger=5790

well...there is a difference between pinup art,and porn like sleazy images,whith no offence
to the artists,but i find those really offensive.
i dont know how to explain the difference either,its something very suttle
emmmm..manara=lovely pinup art....
but those,come on man,really...

sorry if i happen to piss someone off,just my opinion.

jerry123
05-24-2005, 11:28 PM
ooops,must have copy pasted twice,sorry

angel
05-25-2005, 12:08 AM
jerry, I'll say this with no intention to piss you off or anything like that but freedom is a wonderful thing; if you are offended then don't look at those images. no one is forcing you to click on any image. I am sure if a line is obviously crossed the mods would have steped in.


Enayla
05-25-2005, 12:26 AM
Oh my goodness, I'm sorry, I have to speak up for Aly Fell's image, which I happen to love and I can't imagine how someone could possibly see something 'porny' in that image. It's humurous and wonderfully sensual without crossing even the slightest bit of lines. It's definitely one of my favourite pieces in the entire challenge, and no, I'm not a hormonal guy who can only see with whatever other body part pointing forward other than my eyes: I'm a woman, and I just happen to think that piece is a work of art.

Phew, having said that, SNoWs is right. There is no need to look at the pieces that seem offensive to you.

walrus
05-25-2005, 12:56 AM
No comment on all of them but Poshspice's ladies have more clothes on them than some of the people I see walking down the street in the summer time 'round here. Suggestive? By all means, but I'd hardly call them pornographic... But while I respectfully diagree, I am in no way shooting you down for having that opinion. I by all means defend your right to consider them so.

I'm really happy that there's been this move to internal judging. It turns this into a legitimate contest.

JTD, you do have some interesting points about how it takes a lot longer to do 3D than 2D. So much, I guess, for me proposing that they make the contests even shorter next time around, to really weed out folks! :twisted: But while I fully agree that it takes a lot more effort to do a solid 3D piece, jerry also has a good point too: it does take longer to model and rig and texture and render, but it shouldn't be longer to come up with a decent, artistic composition. And don't underestimate how long it takes to come up with a really good 2D work: There's a reason why several hundred people in the 2D category didn't finsh theirs either! :)

paperclip - you (and others) were wondering why so many entries popped up in the finals that you'd never seen before. Check out the date of the entries: Often, when I've seen an entry that "takes me by surprise" like that, I later notice that they uploaded everything, from rough concept to finishied withing the span of a couple days near the end... Or even within a couple minutes! I really don't understand the point - they're missing out on all of the great fdeedback that this place has to offer - but I suppose it's technically legal, provided they can prove the didn't do the work all beforehand and really did original art just for this contest.

That's all the brain dump on this topic for now... :)

-mike

Enayla
05-25-2005, 01:21 AM
Michael, I don't think there are any rules against uploading everything the last minute and never participating in the critiques, etc... however:

Submit work in progress images, obtain feedback and give feedback to other challengers in the WIP challenge. (Note: Failure to do so may result in penalties during final judging. Community interaction is a must!)

Which, I think, is a very good thing :)

Rook
05-25-2005, 01:33 AM
At least I'm happy someone took notice of my entry. Poor Jerry123, your life must be awfully tame if you consider those images pornographic.

I looked up Manara, and I'm a little confused. The following links are to some of his art. (The faint of heart like Jerry123 might not want to click on these)
Manara Art 1 (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/images/1561632066/ref=dp_primary-product-display_0/104-2862393-8208763?%5Fencoding=UTF8&n=283155&s=books)
Manara Art 2 (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/images/1561631701/ref=dp_primary-product-display_0/104-2862393-8208763?%5Fencoding=UTF8&n=283155&s=books)

Maybe I am oblivious to the subtle nature of his artwork. Please explain how his images are pinup art and the 3d cgtalk entries are porn?

KolbyJukes
05-25-2005, 05:17 AM
@ ROOK - What a PERV! for shame!

some people are really sensitive about nudity/erotica eh?

Rook's entry is really no more vulgar then the Betty Paige pinups of the 50s....pretty soft, harmless playful stuff.
http://thebettiepage.com/images/bettie_page_spank01.jpg

don't click that link if you're overly sensitive.

-K.

AIR
05-25-2005, 08:06 AM
Hi people'z.
I went trough this forum bit and it was interesing to see opinions on 3D and 2D comparison.
In the begining of the challenge I was thinking of starting 2D image.Why I didnt.There is few reasons,major one is I wanted to see as soon as possible how good am I in undertaking biger projects in time limit,and how can I interpret given theme,in 3D.
I have lot of expirience in 2D.Have tryed almost all tehnique's and ended up with airbrush.
I have 3,5-4 years in A I R brushing.Recently I bought pen tablet.
It turned up more fun and easier than real airbrush art.
to conclude.I'm almost glad not choosing 2D,cos what I saw there.The competition and
quality of work is for me if not 2 times higher than it is in 3D.
So in the end 3D and 2D has somekind proportion in it,there is certain paralel between.
I cant make the final thought as clear it is in my head,language barrier.
3D is harder to execute,thus making fewer people finishin it.2D easier execution with lots of people finishin it.You end up with 3D and 2D quite same.Only it's up to us wheter we want more conpetition,or we want swet our soul out to achieve acceptable 3D entry.
Hope u guys understud my attempts......
I enjoyed this challenge,and as someone said earlier,when does next one begin.
And yeah,how many challenges there is in one year,here at CG,2 or more?
SEEYA'z :) :)

notavailable
05-25-2005, 08:21 AM
I think the internal judging is a great idea- now we can be completely sure that the winners aren't a result of biased judging.
I'm surprised- there are 288 final 2D entries, but only 180 final 3D entries! When I first came to CGTalk, it was much more 3d-oriented, so this is a real change.
Wonder why.

By the way- having looked through the final entries, I've noticed a few that I haven't before- amazing ones too. How did I miss them!? :sad:

hmm
i think this is due to the fact that the challenge was at the same time with the e3 expo in LA. lot's of 3d artists were bogged down by various work related stuff. poster,
cinematics, demos

also the fact that to create a highly detailed and good looking 3d image (and by 3d i mean created with the help of ae 3d app)takes so much more time, only beacuse u have to make most stuff to be 60-70% functional in the 3d enviroment (100% isn't necessary cos u can retouch, but still modelling the whole characters, unwrapping, texturing, shader, rigging... that takes to much time for just a still image). lighting and stuff is very complex in 3d and u need continuous re-renders, in photoshop u can just ctrl-z and restroke

what i'm leading to is that 3d is actually overkill for just a still. 2d artists have made realistic looking skin and humans for ages... and even if u do get very fine results with 3d u would still re-touch in photoshop, just cos u cant wait another half hour (in lot's of cases even more, but less to) just to make an extra hair or tone down a highlight...

anyways i'm talking crap, there are lots of great images out there... and although i didnt even start mine (due to the 1st reason i mentioned) i'm sure i'm going to make it next time

Leonard
05-25-2005, 08:27 AM
180 3D entries is really good. I'm very happy with that number of finalist images.

It's ridiculous to assume (or wish) that 3D and 2D will have equal numbers of entries. The 2D industry is in orders of magnitude larger than 3D. I'm surprised that the difference is as small as it is.

My 2 cents

Leonard

Tremoside
05-25-2005, 10:13 AM
Nudity/"porn": we are humans...we have instincts and nudity was (and will) always a part of fine art. If you see a surgeon while work do say why the patient is nude or why he/she touches the patient? As Michelangelo made some illegal sections...did he wrong? We're adults...sexualty is a part of our life...as an industrial designer (student) i have to say many of objects are designed with gentle sexual symbols...you can check...and these are direct...people like sexuality. Rounded forms or phallic symbols are often used in designs...coz their hidden message. It's real life's practice...

2D/3D: Art is art, no matter if you do it in 2D or 3D. Of course 3D is more tehcnical oriented, but coz of this you have more tool to realize your own idea.

About time for finishing: Deadline was sure. If someone has problems to keep the deadline it's a good way to practice. This challenge is a great field to learn art and learn it as it goes in real life...

About prizes: I don't know how it goes in your country, but if i work i earn around 4 euros for an hour (and it's a good money here)...a course in max costs around 1200 euros at Budapest, Hungary... Just count...it's impossible to pay for a student...with CGTalk challenges i already made two "courses". this is the point i think...great feedback..great people and the greatest is i can meet artists from Mexico till Hong Kong...for free! That's the real prize for us: the help of the community...and be a part of it!

Peddy
05-25-2005, 10:56 AM
we have moderators and judges for a reason. I say let them do what they were put in place to do.

paperclip
05-25-2005, 11:06 AM
180 3D entries is really good. I'm very happy with that number of finalist images.

It's ridiculous to assume (or wish) that 3D and 2D will have equal numbers of entries. The 2D industry is in orders of magnitude larger than 3D. I'm surprised that the difference is as small as it is.

My 2 cents

Leonard

Ha, yes I understand what you mean and coupled with the reply someone posted a page or so ago about how much longer it takes to set up the 3d entries, the difference is completely understandable.
I guess I didn't really think through before posting. I commented while thinking of something Kirt said a while ago-- that he had to say 'Leonard, what about the 2D entries?'
The funny part is that the 2d is getting much more attention than the 3d and that wasn't the case before-- that was mainly what I was pointing out, the shift in attention from 3d to 2d.

I'm still curious as to when we'll find out the results...because I know a few people who are gasping to find out.

coCoKNIght
05-25-2005, 11:18 AM
forget the results! WHEN DOES THE NEXT CHALLENGE START?! :)

blakbird
05-25-2005, 12:24 PM
Discussing internal judging is a matter of trust i think.
Regarding all the "variables" here we have a conclusion like that:

Public voting : the most democratic one but suffers badly from three factors.

1 - Bad habited cheaters. Trying to connect from different computers and different usernames etc. to give themselves more and more vote. Infact thats ridiculous if we consider there are nearly thousands of voters and their 3-5 more vote would not make a great difference. However there are also some real hackers and could generate 50-100 vote and that might have a difference.. anyway. We know there are some people directly fit into this class.

2 - Although we vote publicly (in previous ones) do anyone have a clue to see (other than the admin.s) how many votes goes to whom with a counter? I havent seen any such indicators. So its only a minds relief to know and say "oh! there is a public voting system and its democratic. Really?

3 - It is hard to explain people's voting motivators. Sometimes they give votes only because of :
- challenger is from same country
- challenger from same city
- challenger is a beatiful girl
- challenger uses a beatiful girl picture under his name
- thousands of people visited challenger's page
- challenger visited his/her thread
- hundreds of messages (posts) in his thread
- challenger gave a promise to vote him/her
- challenger begged for the vote
etc. etc.

AIR
05-25-2005, 01:06 PM
kuzgunoglu,Man,your thread made me laugh,dont wremember something made me laugh this much over reading threads here at CG.
The part where you put facts....
3 - It is hard to explain people's voting motivators. Sometimes they give votes only because of : - challenger is from same country - challenger from same city - challenger is a beatiful girl - challenger uses a beatiful girl picture under his name - thousands of people visited challenger's page - challenger visited his/her thread - hundreds of messages (posts) in his thread - challenger gave a promise to vote him/her - challenger begged for the vote etc. etc.
Lot of humor in it.
But seriously now.U made more than good point with it.
And I could not agree more than I doo with this idea of voting.As all the people'z mentioned before,so there is no need in repeting myself,or anybody else.
RESPECT kuzgunoglu. :thumbsup:

Tremoside pal.U to made best example to explain jerry certain things and facts.

I think this challenge was fantastic.Learned lot of things,and will learn more,from single challenge i upgraded my skills to certain level twice as faster then I'd be in normal circumstances.Anyway,dont mind me,I'm just another geek. :)

OOO,yeah,got a question.
Who is responsible in deciding what is the challenge going to be about?

DimitrisLiatsos
05-25-2005, 01:27 PM
At least I'm happy someone took notice of my entry. ....


What do u mean...i am watching silently since day ONE and i ABSOLUTELY love this piece....
it's erotic ...sensual, playfull and i think it needs some guts to visualize a theme like this... and at the same time strong theme....:bounce:


And what is all this about porn in cg ?....i hope we are all here adult people...from when the human body in any pose ...naked or dressed can be quoted as porn?.....when it is used to create an image that expresses body and emotions action...?



I am sorry for my language but i am watching this conversation so long and i think that some things have taken wrong path....my humble opinion.

Rook....:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:


...i go in silent mode again.

Hordak
05-25-2005, 01:30 PM
well...there is a difference between pinup art,and porn like sleazy images,whith no offence
to the artists,but i find those really offensive.
i dont know how to explain the difference either,its something very suttle
emmmm..manara=lovely pinup art....
but those,come on man,really... LOL... U come on, man really

pseudonympending
05-25-2005, 01:43 PM
however,i feel quite bad mentioning that(and i suppose it was quite expected when
given a challange called "master and servant"),but,hell...some of those images are really
offensive,its,like,one step befor porn...i meen,i dont know if there are or even should be
rulls against offensive images...its a very tough question of where to put the limit.
but,man...those...
http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/masterandservant/entry.php?challenger=5793
http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/masterandservant/entry.php?challenger=7283http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/masterandservant/entry.php?challenger=7283
http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/masterandservant/entry.php?challenger=7600
http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/masterandservant/entry.php?challenger=5790http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/masterandservant/entry.php?challenger=5790

well...there is a difference between pinup art,and porn like sleazy images,whith no offence
to the artists,but i find those really offensive.
i dont know how to explain the difference either,its something very suttle
emmmm..manara=lovely pinup art....
but those,come on man,really...

sorry if i happen to piss someone off,just my opinion.


Wahyhey, I outraged someone with my art - bullseye! :)

To passify the more prudish amongst us, if you look through my thread you'll see that such an erotic image was not my original intention. A lot of it was down to the time frame that she never got dressed. You'll notice though that I have gone to some lengths to ensure that her modesty is (just about) kept in tact. Even in my WIP I would always use a pole, hand or similar to occlude those ultra offensive nipples...

Seriously though Jerry 123, it was not my intention to offend you or anyone else with this. Nor was it a ruse to woo the judges with a display of as much naked flesh as possible - if that was my plan i'd have had three women snogging each other in paddling pool of custard... But hey, that's another image and one I doubt you'll be commisioning me for :)

No offense was taken and none is meant with this jocular response, it's art and we are all, of course, entitled to our opinions, I was pleased to hear yours.

Cheers,
Dave

fer3d
05-25-2005, 02:18 PM
Can I change the topic for a sec?

This was so far a great learning experience. To make it even better, it would be nice for the judges to write a very short (or long if their time allows) explanation about why they came to their final decisions. Was it a question of composition? Color? Expression? Originality? All of the above? None of the above? This could enrich our "challenge" experience so much...

What do you think?

fer

Hordak
05-25-2005, 02:39 PM
Can I change the topic for a sec?

This was so far a great learning experience. To make it even better, it would be nice for the judges to write a very short (or long if their time allows) explanation about why they came to their final decisions. Was it a question of composition? Color? Expression? Originality? All of the above? None of the above? This could enrich our "challenge" experience so much...

What do you think?

fer

I agree, it is always nice to know why

DaddyMack
05-25-2005, 03:28 PM
A I R said... I have 3,5-4 years in A I R brushing.Recently I bought pen tablet.

Wow dude! I trained myself years ago in both dual and single action airbrushing... (they still lay within reach of my computer desk) It was always rewarding fun, I even made some money out of it... I gotta say tho... I love my wacom:love:No masking, and an eraser on the back... poor old dusty airbrush box...

Tremoside said... 'About prizes: I don't know how it goes in your country, but if i work i earn around 4 euros for an hour (and it's a good money here)...a course in max costs around 1200 euros at Budapest, Hungary... Just count...it's impossible to pay for a student...with CGTalk challenges i already made two "courses". this is the point i think...great feedback..great people and the greatest is i can meet artists from Mexico till Hong Kong...for free! That's the real prize for us: the help of the community...and be a part of it!'

Ouch!... 1 year education in 3d costs a deposit for a house here... The challenge taught me massive amounts too my friend, and my benefit from the community is immeasurable!

Re the whole nudity issue, I really enjoyed watching the 3d ones evolve, Rooks entry especially tickled me a little... A truly sensuous piece... but I gotta say that 'Bad Kitty!' by Aly Fell (2d) is nothing short of amazing, a stunning take on the theme, and definitely one for my collection of fine works by other artists... I really struggle to see the 'offensive' nature of either of these two entries... Maybe me still just sumdumguy:shrug:...

Good luck to all you challengers out there!

May the force be with you

DimitrisLiatsos
05-25-2005, 03:41 PM
Silent mode off

agree.....Aly Fell 's work in the 2D challenge is one of the best and forever in my hard drive :bounce:


....silent mode on

walrus
05-25-2005, 05:06 PM
Good, now that we have that settled....

ChrisThatGuy (http://www.cgtalk.com/member.php?u=54717), you asked earlier about wanting to see what would have won the popularity vote even if it didn't count for anything? There's an easy way to do that right now. Go into the 2D or 3D forums and they default to sorting by date and time of last post. But you have toehr sorting options: If you sort by "Replies" or "Views," you can easily see which threads received the most replies and the most visits. Would it surprise you to learn that Enayla's thread has been viewed as many times as the next 5 entries combined? :thumbsup: Anyhow, just a handy little feature I discovered recently, hope it helps...

-mike

MrPositive
05-25-2005, 05:24 PM
Yes 3D usually takes much longer than 2D but you knew the rules and deadline. If you have poor time management skills or have not made the inherent software transparent enough to be fast then.........sorry. If you do not believe something amazing can be done in 3D in a short time then check this out ( http://www.cgtalk.com/showthread.php?t=232881 )................this was accomplished in one day! So it's about learning the software more fully to bring your vision to life in a more timely manner.

dmonk
05-25-2005, 05:33 PM
Yes 3D takes usually much longer than 2D but you knew the rules and deadline. If you have poor time management skills or have not made the inherent software transparent enough to be fast then.........sorry. If you do not believe something amazing can be done in 3D in a short time then check this out ( http://www.cgtalk.com/showthread.php?t=232881 )................1 freakin day!! So it's about learning the software more fully to bring your vision to life in a more timely manner.

[Silent Mode OFF]

Are you saying that 3d software has reached the equivalent fluidity and maturity as age old traditional drawing and painting techniques?

[Silent Mode On]

MrPositive
05-25-2005, 05:35 PM
Don't recall saying that at all. Are you talking to me? I never compared the two except for time??? And to answer your question..........no..........but it sure has improved and will continue to do so.

emiliew
05-25-2005, 06:34 PM
Dmonk I think you misconstrued what he was saying. Yes art is very lacking in 3D images but possibly even more so is the lack of true in depth software skills that is the bigger problem. Where I work we have to create realistic 3D stills in one day or less. We dont get weeks to complete our presentations, therefore, we have to know the package almost completely inside and out or for at least what we want to get accomplished.

dmonk
05-25-2005, 06:48 PM
Emilie and Mr. Postive:

I didn't mean anything by it, so I hope you did take my statement as an attack.

Some of the better 3d entries really involve a lot of work one person with a full time job and other obligations could not possibly complete in one day. Many of the entries where side projects that artists found time to do in their spare time. I don't care how well you know your applications when your creating complex painted textures and customs shaders and modeling and texturing an entire scene for your project by yourself.

It takes time, plain and simple. I'm the first to give credit where credit is due, the 2d entries are absolutely fantastic, but 3d is in absolute infancy compared to the history and breath of knowledge available to traditonal 2d images. It is also not so simple to create sfx in 3d and post as it would be in 2d.

A realistic project, I believe could be complete in a day with the right team of people or individual, but couldn't you do a much better job with a month?

If the tone of m previous post was taken the wrong way, I sincerely apologize.

Cheers!

MrPositive
05-25-2005, 07:00 PM
Hey I completely agree with everything you said. It just appeared to me that people were getting in a hissy over the time constraints for the 3D portion of the contest.

walrus
05-25-2005, 07:22 PM
What does it matter whether 3D takes longer than 2D?
All of the 3D entries had the same amount of time as each other,
and none of them are being compared to the 2D entries, as it's an entirely seperate category.
So in the end, it's all fair.

You could say that some people had more free time in their lives to work on their entries,
but that's the same for any contest like this, and impossible to eliminate.

The great thing about this contest is that you still can learn a ton even not finishing your entry, just by having a thread for people to comment on.

-mike

Bulldog
05-25-2005, 07:37 PM
awesome entries this time around! congrats to all the participants!

dmonk
05-25-2005, 08:02 PM
What does it matter whether 3D takes longer than 2D?
All of the 3D entries had the same amount of time as each other,
and none of them are being compared to the 2D entries, as it's an entirely seperate category.
So in the end, it's all fair.

You could say that some people had more free time in their lives to work on their entries,
but that's the same for any contest like this, and impossible to eliminate.

The great thing about this contest is that you still can learn a ton even not finishing your entry, just by having a thread for people to comment on.

-mike

Agreed. I wasn't complaining, maybe I just misinterpreted people wrong. the 3d entrie aren't competing with the 2d entries so who cares?

Psotek
05-25-2005, 08:09 PM
Guys honestly, if he thinks the images are offensive then let him think so. Not everyone is ok with this kind of stuff. All he did was express his opinion.

jerry123
05-25-2005, 08:44 PM
oh...well...i wasnt expecting that...
enayla-yea,well actually aly fells pice isnt that bad,i shouldnt have posted it there

rook-thats the strange thing...i cant explain it,and those are pretty subtle for manara too
you should see the inside of those books...maybe its the tendancy of 3d nude models
to look like blowup dolls sometimes,could be it.

tremoside-yea..but that wasnt the point,the point was that theres a fine line between
something that is sexy and something that is offensive,and i have no idea where to
put that line other than my prespective of it

swamps-see, you got a free publicity there,so at least ive done something positive

and overall,yea i do lead a horrably dull life(:,i did find those offensive thogh,but i find it
very strange that i see so differently than others.its amazing how ppl can vary on
prespective,based on personal experiance.
and i did have bad things happen to me to shape that funny prespective,ha...i just realised
it,when i saw ppl actually see me wrong.

but hell,i find myself being offended by couples kissing in a park lately....i give them dirty
looks...so i guss me finding those images offensive and cheap probably doese not follow
pure logic,just caught myself on it...sorry.

not going to apologize thogh,im not for the 3d blowup doll look...but thats just personal
taste.or is it my imagination again.

but i must admitt,i sometime catch myself accidentally post stuff like that,and by far this
is the most tolerant forum i have ever run into,you ppl are really nice about it...in most
uncivilized forums they will usually shoot me down,humiliate me on the way,and laugh at
me too by now.its really nice here(:

Mordalles
05-25-2005, 09:13 PM
some awesome entries. thx for the challenge, for a newbie like me it was a great learning exp, especially since i didnt have any exp before with painting backgrounds, lighting and rendering and composition.

Hordak
05-26-2005, 12:00 AM
oh...well...i wasnt expecting that...
enayla-yea,well actually aly fells pice isnt that bad,i shouldnt have posted it there

rook-thats the strange thing...i cant explain it,and those are pretty subtle for manara too
you should see the inside of those books...maybe its the tendancy of 3d nude models
to look like blowup dolls sometimes,could be it.

tremoside-yea..but that wasnt the point,the point was that theres a fine line between
something that is sexy and something that is offensive,and i have no idea where to
put that line other than my prespective of it

swamps-see, you got a free publicity there,so at least ive done something positive

and overall,yea i do lead a horrably dull life(:,i did find those offensive thogh,but i find it
very strange that i see so differently than others.its amazing how ppl can vary on
prespective,based on personal experiance.
and i did have bad things happen to me to shape that funny prespective,ha...i just realised
it,when i saw ppl actually see me wrong.

but hell,i find myself being offended by couples kissing in a park lately....i give them dirty
looks...so i guss me finding those images offensive and cheap probably doese not follow
pure logic,just caught myself on it...sorry.

not going to apologize thogh,im not for the 3d blowup doll look...but thats just personal
taste.or is it my imagination again.

but i must admitt,i sometime catch myself accidentally post stuff like that,and by far this
is the most tolerant forum i have ever run into,you ppl are really nice about it...in most
uncivilized forums they will usually shoot me down,humiliate me on the way,and laugh at
me too by now.its really nice here(:

That's the way to take it =)
things there is no doubt alot of art that offends people, something u like might offend me and sometimes there's the debate about wether it's art or just provokative crap..
I stand firm, when I say "like it or not... it's art. So I'll accept it."
cheers m8:)

kerembeyit
05-26-2005, 02:52 AM
Hi There,

I have a problem with my entry.

http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/masterandservant/entry.php?challenger=6781

I've got a notification mail which says my Tiff image was successfully submited, But when I click the image for a larger view, all I see is cgtalk logo:( I guess something is wrong, but I didn't do anything wrong, so can you please solve this problem? Or explain to me what's wrong with my entry, and tell me what to do. I can re-submit my tiff if necessary.

I hope it's a minor error:)

Cheers

KB

Mibus
05-26-2005, 03:10 AM
Fixed :thumbsup:

blakbird
05-26-2005, 09:31 AM
Congratulations for Liverpool FC fans. It was an awesome match. We all enjoyed it watching.

AJ
05-26-2005, 10:20 AM
And the award for most random contribution in a thread goes to...

Congratulations for Liverpool FC fans. It was an awesome match. We all enjoyed it watching.

:D

blakbird
05-26-2005, 10:42 AM
From now on I have an award too.
Totoro gave it.

Thanks, glad that.

6foot5
05-26-2005, 10:53 AM
just like to add to the chorus of congratulations to all the entrants , those that managed to complete their entries and to those that didnt. many fine pieces didnt make it in time which is a shame but they all added to the collective experience and i hope they all manage get finished eventually.

just thought id add that i found the whole challenge run in a commendable and fair way, so congrats and thanks to cgtalk for providing a stage to promote our works and to Mibus, who must be run off his feet dealing with all those uploads.


...oh and thanks kuzgunoglu , 'Get in! the 'pool!' european champions 2005.

dogbite
05-26-2005, 01:58 PM
id like to congratulate everyone who submited their final images and wish them good luck.
{it doesnt matter that deep inside i want to win.}
:)

and about the 3d to 2d, i feel the flow of work in the 3d is much more fluid cause you can work on so many things while your procesing the image.
while in 2d you cant do anything if you dont have the image sketched out.
in 3d you can create charachtars and backgrounds,you can rig while the model isnt even complete.
you can decide on camera angles and such.
in 2d you got one angle, one shot. and in 3d you can varry the shot after you finished it.

eddieellis
05-26-2005, 02:17 PM
Silent mode off

agree.....Aly Fell 's work in the 2D challenge is one of the best and forever in my hard drive :bounce:


....silent mode on

Ditto my good friend...

eddieellis
05-26-2005, 02:24 PM
What does it matter whether 3D takes longer than 2D?
All of the 3D entries had the same amount of time as each other,
and none of them are being compared to the 2D entries, as it's an entirely seperate category.
So in the end, it's all fair

3D images take longer beacuse of 2 things,

1) We have to do a dam 2d concept sketch in the first place
2) its not a flat image so we have to draw at every angle... now how long would it take to do a 2d picture at every angle you can think of ?

my 2 cent

but at the end of the day, like you said who really cares ?

As long as we all create some fine Art and challenge ourselves in the process :shrug:

ilusiondigital
05-26-2005, 04:10 PM
I´m glad with this, my first challenge and my first post in this wonderfull forum, i´m surprised because i found a lot´s of friends (really winners for me), and tons of fantastic stuuf (2d and 3d). I learn a lot in this master and servant (technical and personal). My hd is full of images of this challenge. An honor for me entry in this contest.

I think the internal voting is the best.

Congratulations for all the artist and the wonderful pieces created.

2d and 3d is not important only the important is the feelings they put in the images.

I repeat, i´m so happy now (i feel like a winner for those reasons)

Sorry for my poor english :P

blakbird
05-26-2005, 04:37 PM
I agree with eddieellis.

3D artists have to make solid items over the canvas and takes more time to do it. I submitted a 3D work here in the challenge.

However we have to mention another angle of view. We, 3D artists, have this heavier work's fruits as freedom of playing with the composition. We can move our characthers freely and render again. We can rotate our characthers and render again. We can change any texture in seconds and render again.

Now what shall we say? Is 3D harder than 2D? Certainly yes, but if a 2D artist is not happy with any point or area of his work, he/she must paint and paint and paint again as if it was not there before. That is the poor and painful side of the 2D paint.

So we must give them 2D painter's rights right to themselves. Their task is not easy as well.

-----
PS: Thanks Damir (AIR). In the rush I forget to send a :thumbsup: to you, hope you forgive that.

paperclip
05-26-2005, 07:30 PM
I think it's enough to say that both 2d and 3d come with their own merits and downsides. They are each judged distinctly and by people who are aware of the merits and failings of each 'd'.
This shouldn't even have to be discussed.
I'm looking forward to the next challenge as well-- how often may we expect them?

JMcWilliams
05-26-2005, 08:25 PM
3D harder than 2D? depends on what you want to do. But generalising that 2D is easier is just nonsense. There are some things that are easier to do in 2D, some things are easier to do in 3D.
Lets not get into a silly competition between the two. I'll probably enter the 3D challenge next time, if I enter at all.... but I think 2 months is no problem at all. You don't need to model every concievable angle, as long as you plan what you are going to do. you know... work up the areas that are important. Don't model & texture what you don't have to. If it's not going to be seen... who cares? ;)

Tremoside
05-26-2005, 08:48 PM
Ohhh...what's going on here? I think it's not about these topics...we're just damn excited about the results...let be honest...it was a fun, congrats for everyone from A to Z! But i feel some twisting in my stomach just as all the participants...i think you're also excited. This thread has the ultra number of views...why..? :scream: Coz after two months of hard work we're just starving for the results and we want to know what we did wrong or right...It's a normal reaction...i think. So wait...wait and wait patiently and time will come!:)

DaddyMack
05-26-2005, 09:05 PM
Ohhh...what's going on here? I think it's not about these topics...we're just damn excited about the results...let be honest...it was a fun, congrats for everyone from A to Z! But i feel some twisting in my stomach just as all the participants...i think you're also excited. This thread has the ultra number of views...why..? :scream: Coz after two months of hard work we're just starving for the results and we want to know what we did wrong or right...It's a normal reaction...i think. So wait...wait and wait patiently and time will come!:)

Hahaaah lol Tremo:bounce:
Too true!

eddieellis
05-26-2005, 09:14 PM
I hate this waiting lark, i wish there was a mini challenge to take up the time before the results.

pre result challenge anybody ?

Maipiu
05-26-2005, 10:24 PM
Hello to the Jury....i have searched in the final entrys my Work...but i cant find it.
Why???Is it sooooo bad?
I cant understand this....please check this please.....i can garanty you that i have upload the final image on ftp!!!
And sure,i see the other work ,and my work isn`t so bad.....my thougt ist why i have make all this work for this competition...when it is not in the final Entry?

Sorry my bad English.....Thanks for cheking this.....PLEASEhttp://www.cgtalk.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

Sandro Falcone

yeray
05-26-2005, 10:46 PM
hello, excuse me but don't I find my name in the Entries, because?
ship the final image for FTP :(

mi entry; http://www.cgtalk.com/showthread.php?p=2063890#post2063890

AlyFell
05-26-2005, 11:01 PM
If your pic isn't there, I think you send a message to Mibus. He seems to be 'the man!' Or use the CGTalk Support Forum at the bottom of the main page. :)

yeray
05-26-2005, 11:09 PM
Poshspice thank you :)

keko
05-26-2005, 11:22 PM
Hi!
I have a problem with my final image. It shows up only half picture. I don't why? I already checked my thumbnail after upload final image. it looks ok .Did I do some things wrong?
my image
http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/masterandservant/entry.php?challenger=6379

JMcWilliams
05-27-2005, 12:15 AM
Hi!
I have a problem with my final image. It shows up only half picture. I don't why? I already checked my thumbnail after upload final image. it looks ok .Did I do some things wrong?
my image
http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/masterandservant/entry.php?challenger=6379

Looks like something nasty happened during the transfer... Or perhaps during conversion. You'll probably have to re-submit it. Contact the master Mibus :D

paperclip
05-27-2005, 02:54 AM
Ha, I wouldn't mind a pre-challenge results challenge-- the theme can be ...

'Waiting for the challenge results!'

How's that for original? You can start today...:) :scream:

AIR
05-27-2005, 07:28 AM
pre-challenge results challenge.
If I understud'z it,we should like,say our opinion who goes home rewarded and who ends up with wet pants.
Like all of you guy'z I was thinking about it too.
Here's my list....Wont make it in some order,like litteraly.just which names I see in top 10,10-th is a comunity award.so this is just list of peoples who I see in top 10 3D entry,not a genuine list.And hope that other great entrants wont hold it against me.
There is lot of subjectivenes here aswell :) .Cos theese people,some more some less for past two months became my everyday companions.
ANTROPUS,TREMOSIDE,LEMOG,OVERCONTRAST,VIRTUOSO,GIANLUCA,DIMITRIS,MONSITJ,REIV,ME :D :argh:
But,as the rules said,technicall exelence would be secondary criteria,This whole list of myne could drop into cold waters.There is alot of guys I saw here have great ideas and interpretation of the theme,soo.May God help us all together :)
Again,I hope I didnt missinterpret the prejudging challenge. :argh:
Seeya guy'z

aliasali
05-27-2005, 07:40 AM
yeah,and for me this challenge was really great..i saw so many great works .and great artists...i belive that the reason that we are here,is to show our personal and individual worlds,worlds other than this world,wich we are living in,i believe that i my self am living in my own world,..u see that,there are some people whoo has a high level of creativity,and this creativity is the most powerful and meaningful in arts...we are here to kinda express what we are,and how we think,forexample we say,wohaa! look at this,what a great and creative person he is,! look at the world that he is living in...isnt it? i think this is the most joyful and exciting thing in these challeneges....
anyway,nice job everyone,and good luck! :thumbsup:
Ali...

eddieellis
05-27-2005, 07:46 AM
pre-challenge results challenge.
If I understud'z it,we should like,say our opinion who goes home rewarded and who ends up with wet pants.
Like all of you guy'z I was thinking about it too.
Here's my list....Wont make it in some order,like litteraly.just which names I see in top 10,10-th is a comunity award.so this is just list of peoples who I see in top 10 3D entry,not a genuine list.And hope that other great entrants wont hold it against me.
There is lot of subjectivenes here aswell :) .Cos theese people,some more some less for past two months became my everyday companions.
ANTROPUS,TREMOSIDE,LEMOG,OVERCONTRAST,VIRTUOSO,GIANLUCA,DIMITRIS,MONSITJ,REIV,ME :D :argh:
But,as the rules said,technicall exelence would be secondary criteria,This whole list of myne could drop into cold waters.There is alot of guys I saw here have great ideas and interpretation of the theme,soo.May God help us all together :)
Again,I hope I didnt missinterpret the prejudging challenge. :argh:
Seeya guy'z

Thats why its not public vote, as people would just be voting for their mates and which images they think are tachnically superia. Not the ones which inturpretated the brief best and stuck within it confines.

AndyH
05-27-2005, 07:51 AM
Congrats to all who finished - some great pieces there, but a disturbingly large amount of fantasy content - excessive boobs and monsters!

Looking forward to seeing the results - i have high hopes for a few people here.

Any idea when the next comp is gonna be announced? Im kicking myself for missing out on this one - it was a great theme, and i had an original idea that i couldve done. At the very least, i couldve made a 'tribute' image using my office girl and office nerd characters! Bah!

Ill be keepin my eye on this thread - i take it the winners and/or the next comp theme will be announced here?

V_Shane
05-27-2005, 08:09 AM
Entries all good! Very nice work on most. i had to bail on mine as my workload was just too overbearing, its hard to make those kind of descisions, but I even had to cut loose a few paying projects as well to make time balance out. Its one of those freelance things, one month your not busy, the next month your overloaded from short sighted Art Directors and have to double time. ach I really hope I have more time next time, but with moving 3 states away this summer I doubt it. Goodluck to everyone!

redfrog
05-27-2005, 08:15 AM
I have to say as a first time challenge entrant i though the whol concept was fantastic. What a wonderful forum for sharing thoughts and ideas with your peers, and to get to see so many talented artists' works in one site is awesome.
Best of luck to everyone who entered... i certainly wouldn't like the judges job.
Can't wait for the next challenge!

AIR
05-27-2005, 08:35 AM
I agree eddieellis,internal judging is for the best,but U brought up prechallenge results idea,so I find that amusing.
This is nothing of serious nature.
As far as I'm concerned,atleest half of guys on the list,including me too,could not even wind up in honourable mentions,everything is opened.And think that some 25 % guys in 3D have they'r chance wining something.But we will see it.
As I said,you had great idea to kill time before real deal.No offence or somethin' ;)

I'd actually like to hear other guys,and theyr predictions,But as YODA had said once or few times "I SENCE LOT FEAR IN YOU,FEAR LEEDS "......
and so on :) :D piece everyone.

paperclip
05-27-2005, 08:39 AM
Congrats to all who finished - some great pieces there, but a disturbingly large amount of fantasy content - excessive boobs and monsters!

Unfortunately, I agree.



Ill be keepin my eye on this thread - i take it the winners and/or the next comp theme will be announced here?



Unlikely. I'm sure they'll plug it on the front page & start up a new thread.
I think we'll probably hear the results within the next week or two.

AIR
05-27-2005, 09:00 AM
A sugestion to CG.
I want to comment something I had opportunity to see more then once here at CG.
I think that it would be great if CG crew could give voting in 3D and 2D galleries change.
By change I mean,It should be visible to comunity who casts votes.Every vote casted for certain image should have somekind signature of person who voted.
This way all those jerks who go arround and ruin rating for good images without reason would be exposed to comunity.
So,when comunity cruisefyes few of those ass....'s nobody would think about underrating any image without thinking it trough and giving good
reason why.I dont understand how can one Lemog have 3 stars with his great entry, Antropus with his psycho girl too,and there is more of them...
Cos all of them one moment had like 4,5 stars,and next minute 3,3 or worse.

eddieellis
05-27-2005, 09:10 AM
I agree eddieellis,internal judging is for the best,but U brought up prechallenge results idea,so I find that amusing.


i know im just alittle sore that i haven't had mention yet in peoples list :cry:

The Pre-challenge idea is sound though (it could be a public vote) and would finish a couple days after the results. Then we need a pre-challenge challenge while we wait for the next one... The list could go on and on..

aliasali
05-27-2005, 10:56 AM
hey guys,does anybody know when the admins are announcing the winners?:deal:

paperclip
05-27-2005, 11:03 AM
To be honest, I think the pre-challenge 'results' are rather silly. I'd rather see what the judges pick than biased judging based on other peoples' friendships and a select few excellent entries. This is no attack on the people here-- I'm sure I would support my friends here more than people I don't know. For this reason the public judging is nearly useless.


As for the results-- I don't know. I'm guessing we'll have them within 2 weeks though.

TerianSilva
05-27-2005, 01:50 PM
Wooozoo, I love the one done by Matt Bortolino! It rocks!

Aradiael
05-27-2005, 03:40 PM
Congrats to all who finished - some great pieces there, but a disturbingly large amount of fantasy content - excessive boobs and monsters!


Did anyone say fantasy, boobs and monsters? I have tons of them in my entry!:twisted: :scream: :scream: :scream:


I don't know if I'm more trepidant to know who will be the winners or what will be the subject of the next challenge....:banghead:

DaddyMack
05-27-2005, 03:54 PM
I'll throw in my list
No order, just criteria busters...
Eddie Ellis, A I R , 'mb, pigwater, Reiv, Tremoside, Authentic, Handlebar, Mobra... It's all really a matter of taste tho...
These entries all do it for me because of their adherence to the brief, and each of the artists 'left of centre' treatment of the theme...It helps that each image has a technical strength as well of course...

And going throught he thread I found so many notable entries that didn't hit the finish line... Better luck next time...

I'll be back in again for sure.. Looking forward to another run with all you mental folk!

Opps.. sorry, forgot to mention, these are all 3d entries...the entire 2d thread makes me :cry:

yeray
05-27-2005, 03:54 PM
Mibus doesn't tell me nothing :(

DaddyMack
05-27-2005, 04:00 PM
Mibus doesn't tell me nothing :(

It's 1 am here in Oz mate, he's probably catching some sleep...

yeray
05-27-2005, 04:05 PM
forgive me, I am impatient and restless

eddieellis
05-27-2005, 07:12 PM
I'll throw in my list
No order, just criteria busters...
Eddie Ellis, A I R , 'mb, pigwater, Reiv, Tremoside, Authentic, Handlebar, Mobra... It's all really a matter of taste tho...


Lol... thanks dude !, feel much happier now :thumbsup:

DaddyMack
05-27-2005, 10:02 PM
Lol... thanks dude !, feel much happier now :thumbsup:
funny...
Hah... 'taint charity mate;) Your piece was always gonna be one of the tops IMHO... I think we just all wish you hadn't made it look so easy to all of us who really had to struggle to pull something good out... Congratulations on a fine piece Eddie.. I think you're one to watch in the future.. Good luck to all of you Challengers and thanks once again for a mental journey

monkeybeach
05-28-2005, 02:00 AM
quality-wise i'm just blown away by all the awesome stuff in the challenge, there are so many beautiful entries (especially in the 2d section) but really, if i see one more picture where it's "unclear who the real master is" or "either one could be in charge" (and so on) i'll scream. it's funny that we all try so hard to not do the chick and snake-thing and be original, that like half of us wind up with exactly the same super original "outside the box" piece as everyone else.. i vote for more chicks and snakes please. (note. not necessarily actual chicks or snakes, but pictures that aren't afraid of being a little silly)

eddieellis
05-28-2005, 10:07 AM
funny...
Hah... 'taint charity mate;) Your piece was always gonna be one of the tops IMHO... I think we just all wish you hadn't made it look so easy to all of us who really had to struggle to pull something good out... Congratulations on a fine piece Eddie.. I think you're one to watch in the future.. Good luck to all of you Challengers and thanks once again for a mental journey

Arh thanks mate, the biggest advantage i had was time, i don't have a job to work around (being a Student) which gave me all the hours i needed. hense why everybody mentioned how quick i was.

But to be honest i had allot of good feedback and sugguestions on how to improve my image from you and a few others, and without that feedback it would have never have come out as well as it did. but i guess that why we are all here, to learn that is.

Thanks again dude, and im all reved up for the next one and am looking forward to working with you all again.

There are so many great entries but i wouldn't expect anything else from the No 1 CG forum on the Net.

CGTalk Rocks, and as soon as i get my first paycheck i will become a perminent member :buttrock:

beelow
05-28-2005, 12:05 PM
I did not make the challenge in time although I had finished but thats ok, I will join the next challenge, and whats this thing bout' porn in artwork!? Man that's some bullcrap! If there is nudity in a piece of artwork, there is clearly why that person has put nudity in an image. I liked Ally's entry. I do not think that it was pornographic it was humorous more than anything. I will join enter the 3d next time around. I just did not have the time I work and go to school and also a Workshop at my school. Also, I am trying to work on a solid demo reel to get hired somewhere anywhere, I want to do 3d animation!:scream: LOL!:D Ya'll will be seeing me around forever and I ain't goin' nowhere...I am goin' to bring tha hood to cgtalk...beelow just keepin it gangsta for all tha pimps and da playaz...hollaz...see ya next contest...fasho!:D

yeray
05-30-2005, 01:01 AM
I still continue without knowing anything about the Administrator Mibus :( and I want to know if I have been disqualified

keko
05-30-2005, 09:38 AM
Hi!
I have a problem with my final image. It shows up only half picture. I don't why? I already checked my thumbnail after upload final image. it looks ok .Did I do some things wrong?
my image
http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/masterandservant/entry.php?challenger=6379

Thank you very much Mibus and JMcWilliams :)

nebezial
05-30-2005, 10:29 AM
man im glad the challenge is over.. Any more of that and id go nuts, lol now about that whole 2d 3d thingie, yeah 3d is a long proces to do, but seriously, try this one for a size, imagine making a 2d realistic work without references and relying on nothing but ur own calculating abilities to make it all work all u 3d people have but one thing in the end u see u can change ur work at a whim, merely reposition ur characters and lights and presto, let ur final renders or brazils or v rays or whatever do the rest+ there is the thing of post effects and compositing, sue u can unwrap ur models and lay down those textures properly but u can also heat and do a lot of work in the compositing, all im saying here is dont underestimate the hardships of 2d u see it is easy to do a sloppy work in both cattegories but to do something properly it takes a hell of a hard work

alex.h.
05-30-2005, 07:03 PM
A big thanks to all the great people her on cg talk for a great challenge and for all your great posts on my and all the outher peoples treads.
I hope you all feel great that you have pushed and helpt me and all outhers to get to the final image. So to all off you (THANKS,THANKS) for a great challenge.
ps,,Sorry for you ho dident finish,but you did a great jobb and its all about being happy and to have a great spirit, so :thumbsup: to all off you.
see you all and have a great evening. :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

yeray
05-31-2005, 02:58 AM
thank you Mibus, to solve it :D I am happy :D

k4k
06-02-2005, 04:58 AM
Anyone know when are the results to come???? :scream:

blakbird
06-02-2005, 06:07 AM
This week or next week according to the Leonard Teo's information.

K'Ghal
06-17-2005, 06:00 PM
This week or next week according to the Leonard Teo's information.

ehhh.... so which week was that exactly? :shrug:

(sorry, but curiosity is taking over) :curious:

:)

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