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View Full Version : FXWARS CARCRASH: TIPS & TRICKS!


RobertoOrtiz
05-19-2005, 05:39 PM
Thread Suggested by Projectkmo.

Post here your ideas and tricks used for this challenge.

Know how to rig a car? Post it here.
Know how to model a car? Post it!
Know how to do complex simulations? Post it!

Looking forward to the posts, but please try to keep it
as application agnostic as possible.

-R

jigu
05-20-2005, 02:19 PM
hello guys,



i have done some simple car crash test using reactor toy car and noise and volume select modifier. it is done in max7 using turbosquid free car model.



i hope u will get idea from this max file how i did simple car crash to collapse the front of car.



(note : i amended the curve of noise modifier "strenght vlaue" on frame 0 and frame 33.plz check it out on frame 0.it's required little knowledge on curve.)



Download max Zip archive file : http://jigu.actkid.com/testcgtalk.zip (http://jigu.actkid.com/testcgtalk.zip)

cheers,

jigu.

blasphemy3_d
05-21-2005, 12:41 AM
Thanks for the file the_jigu! :)

jigu
05-21-2005, 06:37 AM
Thanks for the file the_jigu! :)

it's my pleasure.:)

Projectkmo
05-22-2005, 11:24 PM
Thanks a bunch RobertoOrtiz for the thread.....

Im Using MAYA ...just so you all know..

I posted in several places...3DBuzz, here etc... looking for some ideas...but

However...I've been doing some research....and I cant seem to find any info regarding Dynamic Tearing/Damage to Objects..

I dont mean just knocking a wall of bricks over....but say you had a Poly Cube....12x12x12....and droped a Sphere onto it.....CAN...you have the Teselation(12x12x12) Cube deform/crush in a bit on Impact from the sphere? Like two cars etc impacting one another...

I also looked into Maya Cloth and Syflex....neither apparently can be torn dynamicly....

So far my only option...and its not an easy one is to use realflow for tearing effects..

I Had, Planned on having a car lose controll go through the retaining rail on an overpass and fall into a Semi Trailer passing by below....I figured that the trailer..being a Hollow Rectangle container...would..break and tear a bit...as you may have seen in various movies...both practicly done and done with FX. But, as I stated above....I cant seem to figure out wether its even posible in maya.

Sure, I could have the car fal, hit the trailer and fall to the gorund....but im looking for some damage..heck, the car might even end up stuck in the trailer itself...

***EDIT*** while a bit out of date...I watched a friends copy of Maya Rigid Body Simulations for Visual Effects...and even in the DVD, the guy says maya isnt realy set up for these types of things...though I think he was using Maya 4.0 in the video....

I could always use keyframes and hide unhide damaged versions etc...but Id rather try it dynamicly...

anyone have any suggestions and or tips?

thanks in advance!

Back to researching some more

jigu
05-30-2005, 04:22 AM
i think this thread is not coming good.

i have seen some ppl in this challange they get fear to share tricks.
i think they think they can lose the challange if they will share the tricks on this thread.
anyway this thread suggestion is good and thanks to projectkmo for suggestion like this thread.

but thread is not going good.
Anyone agree?

samulih
05-30-2005, 10:00 AM
Hello!

Here is one trick for 3ds max users to smash their cars :) I think that I am not taking part to this competition but I still tried some techniques to smash a car..

I just used volume select with soft selection to the car, used a proxy cone as a selecting object and displaced the geometry with gradient mapped displacement modifier.. this is very easy trick and took about 5 minutes to compile...

The movement of my car and it's physics are not correct because this is just an example scene but I hope that you will get my point how I did this "smash effect"..

there is also this 1$ budget effect done with meshbomb (heheheh) you might want to try with particleflow instead or some kind of a fracture thing.. ;D

Download the scene from:
http://www.homanen.com/download/3d/crash.rar

the part of the car is part of turbo squids free bmw model, so I won't take credits from modeling it :)



And to Projectkmo:
Have you tried using Maya deformers like Lattice etc? You could for example deform your car with lattice and parent the lattice and its base (this is important) to the object that creates the deformation and vice versa.. so that when your car hits the wall the lattice parented to you wall will deform the car...

lets get back to business..

-samulih

jigu
05-30-2005, 10:42 AM
samulih thanks for the file !! nice trickS!!:thumbsup:

jigu
05-31-2005, 06:21 AM
well as u r courious about how is is done.here is the file that shows u.how it is done.
well it seems very easy on low poly model.but if u r gonna use high poly model like car.than it is very hard to simulate car as a cloth.:twisted: i suggest that donot try cloth or any softbody simulator to simulate car crash.it will take hours of time to simulate the animation.well i found that using reactor cloth modifier and cloth collection in max, u can achive car crash animation.
but with cost of times.than i don't think my computer can do.

well so what i find is using reactor u can't deform car.deformation works good on low poly model.but when it comes to high poly models like car than it will take time to simulate deformation.

anyway good luck.
download file : http://jigu.actkid.com/newtest.max (it is max 7 version file)

anirudha
06-11-2005, 07:49 PM
hey all gr8 to see this thread for some valuable info.
for the reactor thing why don't u go for the collision simulation using
reactor and create the damage using morph targets, this can be pretty
procedural. but u can get the location and morph the model.i've not tried
this but hope it works.

anirudha
06-18-2005, 08:25 PM
i need some help regarding modelling, i've modelled the car using poly, but now i also want to show the backface of the car which is probably invisible....
is there some technique with which the backface of the surface of the car can be generated
right now i cloning the selected surfaces using extrude and then applying normal i again adjust the extruded face to get proper backfaqce. but its too time consuming and also
increases the polys.
plz i urgently need help on this issue.

blasphemy3_d
06-19-2005, 04:01 AM
activating double side material?

anirudha
06-19-2005, 09:19 PM
thanx blasphemy_3d,
but i think i've not explained my prob,
i want to model the backface of my car for interiors,
the 3 sided done't show the width too.........
so is there any faster method to get the backface up
so i don't need to model and trace it again........

saad_ahmad
06-22-2005, 07:00 PM
Heres what I got by using the cloth reactor and rigid body

http://dl4.rapidshare.de/files/2550473/14901477/Test.max

saad_ahmad
06-23-2005, 01:38 AM
Here's my render with a cylinder

I hid the cylinder

http://dl3.rapidshare.de/files/2557575/15288465/Secondcrash.avi

collingtech
07-05-2005, 11:39 PM
now, the war is over ;) , maybe someone post some tutorial here

jigu
07-06-2005, 04:44 AM
now, the war is over ;) , maybe someone post some tutorial here

i agree.:)

Lopatin
07-07-2005, 09:25 PM
i also think some of the participants should post a tutorial ! :thumbsup:

samulih - i really liked your method for smashing that car. Could you please post in a little more detail how you set up that scene. i tried recreating it but im missing something because it just doesnt work.:shrug:

michaeljr
07-10-2005, 04:42 AM
I have been ask by a few people about how I did the "crushing metal" in my roll over crash. so I am currently working on a tutorial that should work in any program that has dynamics, cloth and skin. it will be something simple, a metal box and a steel ball, but should give you simple ideas how to get a more random denting and bending of metal with sharper corners than hand modeling or plain cloth simulation.

please be patient for a few more days, I have a web page I have to update to get some money in my pockets.

Lassjus
07-11-2005, 06:11 PM
Hey michaeljr.
I'd really like to see your tutorial! I think your simulation was wonderfull!!

--Lassjus--

collingtech
07-11-2005, 09:24 PM
waiting for tutorial too ;)

Lopatin
07-11-2005, 10:54 PM
hey michaeljr, i also liked your simulation
i would really like to read a tut on how u did it.

Lassjus
07-12-2005, 01:33 AM
Hehe.. Great presure on you now michael ;)

seg65
07-12-2005, 03:35 AM
michaeljr. i loved the job u did. great work man

seg65
07-12-2005, 03:39 AM
Iím trying to animate a car in 3dmax .can u recommend any good tutorial for me michaeljr.or can any one help me out.

collingtech
07-12-2005, 05:39 AM
cmon guys i want to learn about , post some kind of tut ok, lets share the info

ivanisavich
07-12-2005, 03:35 PM
My rigid body deformation tutorial is now online! Thanks for waiting! :)

http://theonlyt.com/Main/Tutorials/Dynamics1/rbdynamics.htm

Let me know if it helps you. It describes the exact process I used to deform my car during the crash.

collingtech
07-12-2005, 04:35 PM
thanks tyson , in advance

Lopatin
07-12-2005, 06:40 PM
thx for the tutorial ivan !
is it good practice to use sortof another way of combining cloth and rigid bodies? like simulating an object only as a rigid body at first but then changing it to simulate as cloth only at the few frames at the moment of impact.

once again - great tutorial http://cgtalk.com/images/smilies/thumbsup.gif

ivanisavich
07-12-2005, 07:14 PM
Hi Lopatin,

Yes...I'm sure there are several ways you could simulate the deformation, using a cloth+rigid body mix :) Maybe you should write a tutorial on a different method! :D

mustan9
07-12-2005, 07:21 PM
I have been ask by a few people about how I did the "crushing metal" in my roll over crash. so I am currently working on a tutorial that should work in any program that has dynamics, cloth and skin. it will be something simple, a metal box and a steel ball, but should give you simple ideas how to get a more random denting and bending of metal with sharper corners than hand modeling or plain cloth simulation.

Wow! Thanks so much for that. Please e-mail me if you need any help with the tutorial. I can do a version for 3D Studio Max for example, or write some text.

Lopatin
07-13-2005, 12:13 AM
heh heh
ivanisavich-
i dont think i quite skilled enough to write tutorials in 3dhttp://cgtalk.com/images/smilies/blush.gif. with the method i mentioned, i did get a pretty good result but it requires A LOT of tweaking. im still amazed at your end result.

keep it shaggy http://cgtalk.com/images/smilies/buttrock.gif

michaeljr
07-13-2005, 03:52 AM
ok I'm working on a tutorial for using cloth and dynmaics as a modeling tool.. this is a basic tutorial for the quick and easy way for metal simulation.

the next one will be more advanced, then after that I will try to post a much more advanced one, one that even I am having problems getting to work 100% of the time.
I hope to have the first one up sometime tonight.

michaeljr
07-14-2005, 11:52 AM
ok I just uploaded my 1st in a 3 part series of tutorials for my process of creating bent and twisted metal.

http://www.mjrworld.com/learnstuff/model_dynamics/model_dynamics.html

I'm tired so this is all I will say. if you have questions, comments, find wording wrong, or need help, just let me know here.

Lassjus
07-14-2005, 12:17 PM
Thank you for the tutorial. It seems like its something like what ivanisavich (member.php?u=19108) wrote as well. I'm really looking forward to the second and third part!!

--Lassjus--

michaeljr
07-14-2005, 10:10 PM
Thank you for the tutorial. It seems like its something like what ivanisavich (http://member.php/?u=19108) wrote as well. I'm really looking forward to the second and third part!!--

I just read Ivanisavich's tutorial and my processe is completely different in many ways.

he is using rigid bodies to simulate his fall while in this tutorial I did it by hand to save time, plus my next two tutorials (whenever I get the time) will expand on using more and more dynamics to simulate not only the fall but the actual crush.

jigu
07-15-2005, 04:42 AM
hey MJR first of all thanks for this excellent tutorial.but if i have to do with reactor cloth.(reactor cloth doesn;t work properly)????? well i didn;t read ur tutorial i just saw it that u use simcloth for simulation.i m gonna read it now.but how to do with reactor cloth i did try a lot....
i suppose to read ur tutorial first than i will try to do with reactor cloth.:thumbsup: gr8 tutorial.

BTW guys, WHERE IS IVANISAVICH TUTORIAL??:rolleyes:

michaeljr
07-15-2005, 04:52 AM
yes, you can use Reactors cloth. I included as a d/l SimCloth3 for MAX as it's difficult sometimes to find.

but the real reason I used SimCloth more than Cloth was that it SEPERATES the dynamics. if you have Cloth and Rigid bodies going, and you want to change your Cloth or Rigid body seperately, if you forget to turn something on or off you could screw up some other dynamic setup in your scene on accident.

plus sometimes Cloth didn't like a certain piece of geometry and sometimes SimCloth didn't like another piece.

also SimCloth is a bit simpleler to use for the Noob :) it's one modifier with everything right in there, no having Reactor helpers all over.

but both will work fine in the end.

BloodHo
07-15-2005, 08:50 AM
Thanks a lot Michael! That tutorial is great and helpful. Really quick way to do simple crashes and deformations. Great job :thumbsup:

Also great job you too ivanisavich and thanks :)

Lassjus
07-15-2005, 12:49 PM
OK michael, but anyway, I'm really looking forward to your next steps. Crashing cars is the only thing I have been doing in max the past 2-3 days. It's funny to do, and it may give you exelent outcome. Nice tut!

The other tutorial is on page 2.

--Lassjus--

ivanisavich
07-15-2005, 03:24 PM
Hey the_jigu,

I already posted my tutorial....but if you missed it, you can find the link to it in the tutorials section of my site :)

http://www.theonlyt.com/Main/Tutorials/tutorials.htm

*if you're getting a "link not found" error....gimme a second because I've gotta unthrottle my site ;)...went over my bandwidth amount again LOL

jigu
07-15-2005, 04:27 PM
hey thanks ivan gr8 tutorial!! BTW i need ur crits on my sea water simulation!!:)

Error500
07-18-2005, 09:08 AM
Look files in site http://www.konstb.nm.ru

Lassjus
07-18-2005, 02:38 PM
Hi. Michael, just wondering if you could tell us when part 2 and 3 will be out. I'd be very happy to know. :)

--Lassjus--

michaeljr
07-18-2005, 06:12 PM
well I have some paid work to take care of a computer upgrade to do also. hmm, maybe in the next few weeks I can take a day off the next FX Challenge and do the 2nd part.

part 2 will use a understructure of rigid bodies to control the metal bending, giving you a bit more of a realistic result. I'll start writting up some layout stuff soon so I will keep it fresh in my head and not forget...

Lassjus
07-18-2005, 06:36 PM
Hi.

Michael: ok! I'll be waiting for you ;) 1st part is really good. I have made some tests, and Im starting to get a grip on it.

Error500
This looks very good. How did you make the explosion at the end. Hehe, I can tell you are inspired by matrix. Could you post some animations?

--Lassjus--

michaeljr
07-19-2005, 02:35 AM
ya, it's not to hard is it?? the better you know the tools, the easier it is to put them to use

I've been using MAX a long, long time, well before it was MAX and I'm still finding new things or settings to mess with..

jenga
09-01-2005, 06:23 PM
hello there guys!


well i have been hunting for a good tut and so far the only ones i've found are the ones in here which i thanks u guys for :D but, yeah here comes the but part, saddly these tutorials are far from being complete or if they are then there has to be some other way of making car crash scenes. i got this friend of mine that works at the mill and he showed me a few things his done which i must say were damn nice but this .avi file in particular got my complete attention http://media.putfile.com/crashtest21 and i endup asking myself what does it take to achive this? well he said he used maxscript to achive this with pflow i mean it has to be possible since i was told the're are no limitations in programming in other words there is always a way. i got frustrated and since then i've been learning html, javascript and actionscript
in order to gain some understanding of the top basic layer of programming and i still feel lost
so if anyone can achive this with out the need of scripting please guide me to the light so i am lost in the dark and the rats are taking bites off my skin.

sorry for my english. :shrug:

michaeljr
09-01-2005, 06:43 PM
sorry jenga, I really don't think there is a 1,2,3 process for doing something like this. it's so complicated to do it's just one of those things you just jump in and do. I know that there are some tutorials on dynamics and wheels, I wrote one for the process of doing dentable metals. there is just soooo much to it, especially if you want photoreal. I'm still in the process of working on my incomplete entry. I have many particle dynamics to calculate, then texture and render is a whole nother issue. compositing and such to add that extra little detail.

the best thing to do is to break down what you want to do... search out tutorials on those things. for a car wreck, look for tutorials on car modeling, then car dynamics, then a texturing, then particle or dynamics, etc. etc. they don't have to be specifically about cars, they could be texturing a set and use that to help you learn how to texture a car.

it's a lot of cross referencing... but it can be done with a little time and patiences.

ivanisavich
09-01-2005, 07:36 PM
Haha! That's funny because that clip is mine (it was created during the challenge and has been posted in my car crash thread AND on my webiste)....and not only do I not work at the mill...but I also didn't use maxscript to achieve that animation!

Nice friend you got there.

Anyways...the methods used to make that clip are both described on my website. You can find a tutorial on how to create fractured explosions, and how to simulate rigid body dynamics.

jenga
09-01-2005, 08:15 PM
ok ivan i just noticed that man sorry i didn't know it was urs. i can give u his email address if u want him to pay for taking credit over ur work this is his site www.miguelsalek.com (http://www.miguelsalek.com).

nice work btw very well done ur the man!

ivanisavich
09-02-2005, 12:22 AM
No worries man...I don't get too paranoid about stuff like that :)...just thought I should mention who actually made it, and do nothing more about it.

BloodHo
09-02-2005, 08:29 AM
Hey michaeljr, any info when or if you're gonna do other parts of your fantastic tutorial? :)

jenga
09-02-2005, 01:12 PM
ivanisavich cool man i had a chat with the guy seems like his english isn't that good and he tried to explain that he could do it by scripting so i might of misunderstood him my english ain't that good either so i am sorry for any problems i have cause.

anyways ivan i would like to ask which constraints did u use for the tires?

for some reason my computer freezes when i do ur tutorial i find it weird since i am doing exactly the samething. i got a dual xeon 2.4, 2gb ramboost and an nvidia quadro4 900xgl

and everytime i hit the creat animation btn it stops and gives me some kind of code on maxscript window i am using a default teapot and the reactor plane same as u

ivanisavich
09-02-2005, 03:40 PM
ivanisavich cool man i had a chat with the guy seems like his english isn't that good and he tried to explain that he could do it by scripting so i might of misunderstood him my english ain't that good either so i am sorry for any problems i have cause.


Well then I'm glad I didn't go and flame the poor chap ;)

As for the tires....they're held onto the car using a fracture constraint. Once the deformations are calculated the fracture constraint is added in the rigid-body pass of the simulation.

As for reactor crashing...sorry man I can't help ya there :(

robsen
04-29-2006, 10:03 AM
Hi,

i found this post first now, and all links to the tutorial are down. Can help me plz someone and send me please the turtorial? Big thanks for help!

michaeljr
04-29-2006, 03:07 PM
if you are looking for my basic tutorial it's here

http://www.mjrworld.com/

robsen
04-29-2006, 07:50 PM
hi michaeljr,

thanks for your help i hope i learn this ;)! i have see your car crash mov on site and this looks very great!!! can you help me please a little bit to find good tutorials or other resource to learn animation (car animation)?

RobertoOrtiz
05-09-2006, 03:14 PM
FYI:

TWO WEEKS To Go (MAY 22th): FXWARS THE RACE! (http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?t=355539)

-R

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