Starting a modelling process.

[gnarlycranium]

What I've been doing for my latest project (Thread here: http://www.cgtalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=17097 ) is to start with a box, Convert to Poly, and then delete all but the top polygon. Then I Divide all around the outside edge and stretch it out to match the outline of what I'm making, Cut across it to give it structure, Chamfer the outside edge a little bit, and then Extrude the whole thing, making the last extrusion really small to match that first Chamfer I made, to keep the corners neat. It seems to be working... but I have no teachers but the user manuals and this forum, so I really have NO idea what I'm doing. :argh: I'm seriously interested in hearing answers to this question too!!! The beginning is so important to know how to set up right, or the whole thing goes to heck.

[visualboo]

Download every timelapse video you can find. Those really are great ways to learn.

I'm not sure if ambient-whisper has his online anymore. When he get's back online I'll ask and post here again. I have some other links but I will have to dig for those.

I'll post the links here as soon as I get them.

[dvornik]

Videos are great. Make you think out of the box, rather than "apply the Editable Mesh modifier".

Ambient Whisper, Martin Kroll that is (working in Mirai):
http://news.cgland.com/index.html?code=view&no=1551&category_1st=3&category_2nd=700000&start=0

Some meshtools videos for max:
http://www.s21net.com/meshtools/docu.html

Neox (wherever he is) had a good thread with his Meshtools videos here:
http://www.cgtalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=14809

And classic Bay Raitt videos
http://cube.phlatt.net/home/spiraloid/movies/movies.html#

In case you think you need to watch videos slo-mo try these:

http://www.irfanview.com/
http://www.neokarate.net/provideo/index.htm

[GRMac13]

What I've been doing lately (for more complex models, such as heads) is to start with either a patch grid or splines with a surface modifier. Once I've created a nice shape with the spline tools, I usually reduce my steps to 1, and then collapse to an editable poly. Usually I end up with a pretty workable low-poly base shape and then use standard poly/mesh editing tools. I find that this is much better than starting with a box because your shape is already defined, and just in need of some detailing and refinement. Of course there are probably hundreds of different ways to start a model, your best bet is to experiment and try and find a technique that suits you as well as the project at hand.

edit: Those vids are great too. Thanx dvornik.

[gnarlycranium]

That's what I ended up doing too-- the spline cage-to-poly thing. I don't know anything about patch grids. The method I described in my first post up above is what I'm using for a very geometric object. When I first started out I was trying to make human faces, and the notion of working with mesh editing just seemed bizarre to me, since I'm so used to drawing. So I used splines, and after I spent about two months trying to figure out why my models always ended up screwed up and half inside out (god it'd be nice to have a teacher, that would've been cleared up in five minutes) I had sortof a decent thing going, but at a certain point the spline cage really becomes a pain in the butt to work with. It IS a good way to start though. Up in the tutorial section that's sticky on this forum, there's a link where they use that as the start of a very professional-looking model of a car. http://www.3dm-mc.com/tutorials/car/ The main trouble, as I see it, is figuring out when to change your model from one kind of object to another, and when to start adding small detail.

[mridgers]

The videos are great. Thanks. I will also give the spline outlining a shot, although I find splines hard to manipulate in 3D space.

As for colapsing down from the splines, is there any benefit of an Editable Mesh over an Editable Poly? I know that in 3dsmax5, Discreet have more tools to the Poly, and quads have flat shading compared to Editable Meshes which shaded the triangles forming a quad seperatly.

[gnarlycranium]

The only thing I ever use Edit Mesh for is when I need to extrude edges. Other than that, I never bother with it. It's true that the command set for Polys is pretty limited, but you can download plugins that help a lot. Edit Mesh has a tendency to develop duplicate edges and faces that are all tangled up, and you constantly have to worry about where the Hidden edges are and what they're doing. It's a pain in the butt. From what I've seen, most people around here seem to prefer Poly. In any case, I like to convert back and forth between the two every so often as I go along, depending on what commands I need.

[visualboo]

dang, I go to sleep to find all this the next morning.... can't a brotha get some slack!! :D j/k

Thanks dvornik

[GRMac13]

Gnarly: I know how you feel about manipulating bezier curves in 3D space. It's not easy, in fact it's damn hard. Ususally I will adjust the splines as best as I can in the 2D views (front and side), and then add the surface. If there's pinching and the like, that's when I have to actually go in and adjust the beziers in 3D. However, I don,'t spend too much time doing this. I'm nmot comfortable enough with spline-based modelling to use it to complete and entire model. I usually convert to poly once the basic shape has been defined.

As for Editable Mesh vs. Editable Poly. I for one NEVER use Editable Meshes. I don''t even see why discreet kept the function. In my experience Editable Poly is a MUCH cleaner way of working with alot more tools than EM has. But, that's just my opinion, maybe some folks prefer EM over EP. :shrug:

[gnarlycranium]

It wasn't me who said Beziers are too hard to manipulate in 3D... but um actually, they ARE. I like them, but darnit, they're a pain in the butt! If MAX had some kind of snap-to-handle function, that'd be one thing... but it doesn't, so there's no way to move them in any -controlled- way. I try to stay away from controls like that in general... I want to be able to SEE what's controlling my mesh, all at once, so I don't bother screwing around with weights, meshsmooth edge creases, and all that, it's just one more level to dig through and worry about.

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