PDA

View Full Version : Xbox 360 Backwards Compatible!!


LiquidMetal
05-17-2005, 03:01 AM
Live on the speech.Check it out at xbox.com

Lord3d2
05-17-2005, 03:18 AM
Xbox 360 officially will be backward compatible with the prior system's top-selling games, said Microsoft's Vice President Peter Moore. Microsoft will pick and choose only the most popular Xbox titles from its huge backlist of games and will most likely use emulator software for those limited titles.

----

Bad News really

Kwe
05-17-2005, 03:21 AM
Well....that's a relief....glad to hear I'll be able to play Halo 2 with a wireless controller.



On an off topic note.....I wish consoles came with a game and extra controller like the good ol' days of SNES and Genesis.

Dead
05-17-2005, 03:34 AM
ummm thats not what i would call backwards compatible...thats called releasing old games that run on new hardware that you have to buy?

From what you say it doesn't sound like you will be able to play the games you already own for the xbox1 on the xbox360

Unlike the way the ps3 does it were any game they released or you own will play on the PS3

novadude
05-17-2005, 04:02 AM
With the number of inputs on todays TV sets, is it going to kill you to leave your Xbox hooked up? Besides, who wants to play old games anyways?

kwshipman
05-17-2005, 04:38 AM
With the number of inputs on todays TV sets, is it going to kill you to leave your Xbox hooked up? Besides, who wants to play old games anyways?

I thought it was cool when the PS2 came out with it's backwards compatibility, but in all honesty, I only played a few old games on it. Most people still have their old NES and Genesis, so what is the problem having an xbox and xbox360?

JByron
05-17-2005, 04:40 AM
ummm thats not what i would call backwards compatible...thats called releasing old games that run on new hardware that you have to buy?

From what you say it doesn't sound like you will be able to play the games you already own for the xbox1 on the xbox360

Unlike the way the ps3 does it were any game they released or you own will play on the PS3

how does it sound like you can't play the games you already own? The point is you can only play the games they choose to develop emulators for, which are going to be the top-selling games.

L.Rawlins
05-17-2005, 04:41 AM
It's inconvenient... and inefficient. (in response to 'kwshipman'.)

PokeChop
05-17-2005, 01:33 PM
Not to mention, more cables and clutter around the ole TV. Gimme one freaking box that plays my old games. Why would anyone ever want to play "old" games? Why would anyone ever want to listen to old music? Because they enjoy it. Everyone's different.

Some of the most fun Xbox games I have are some that were released right at the beginning of the Xbox. I enjoy my old Unreal and Time Splitters games and I don't want 2 boxes when one box should be able to do it all. Adds that much more value to the 360 if MS would make it fully BW compatible. Go that extra mile on this one issue. Your Xbox'rs will appreciate it MS.

rakmaya
05-17-2005, 01:43 PM
ummm thats not what i would call backwards compatible...thats called releasing old games that run on new hardware that you have to buy?

From what you say it doesn't sound like you will be able to play the games you already own for the xbox1 on the xbox360

Unlike the way the ps3 does it were any game they released or you own will play on the PS3

Agreed. I play 6 games that I have for PS1 on PS2. More than that, I can just give/sell the old console for new one. I own, PS2/XBOX/GC/N64. I don't have place in my tv stand to put xbox360/ps3 on it. So whatever way you look at it, I can safely get rid of old consoles and put only the newest generation and play games that are worth playing again. I am sure there are at least 10 million gamers out there who wish to do that. So that is a major feature.

SpeccySteve
05-17-2005, 02:11 PM
I like complete backward compatibility myself, no messing around with emulators etc thanks.

Inevitably if the guys are round on a weekend for a drunken game-a-thon someone always wants to play Tekken3 or Tony Hawks2 despite the fact Tekken4, DoA, SC2, TH3, TH4 and THUG1&2 are on the shelf..:shrug:

I have quite enough of a spaghetti junction round the back of that telly already, one console at a time is about all I have room for.

bohmanart
05-17-2005, 11:09 PM
I like complete backward compatibility myself, no messing around with emulators etc thanks.

My thoughts exactly... If MS isn't going to go all the way then what's the point. I probably won't play but a couple of old games anyway but, if one of those games isn't on the list then I will be completely pissed off!

The whole console war going on pisses me off too. I kind of wish there was only one console or either all games made could be played on all consoles.

Yeah, Iknow that's a bit of a dream world I'm living in there :)

Hazdaz
05-17-2005, 11:44 PM
Pretty much everyone already said that they would probably only play a few old games here and there... I think that sums up the whole point of what MS is doing. Why bother. I mean backward compatibility would be nice... but not even close to a deal-breaker. And having SOME backward compatility is good enough. And who said it would cost you something???

Also to this comment:
"...no messing around with emulators etc thanks."
That makes no sense... how else are you going to run a non-native game on a newer console that runs a completely different kind of architecture... through emulation ofcourse. That is the whole point.

pgp_protector
05-17-2005, 11:47 PM
I love backwards compatibility.

I've got a PS & PS2 right now

The PS is for my daughter (5 Y.O.), and is hooked up in another room from the PS2

But there are times when I'll play a games with her on the PS2, and dont need to go & remove the PS from the other room to play the games in the family room.

SpeccySteve
05-17-2005, 11:52 PM
Also to this comment:
"...no messing around with emulators etc thanks."
That makes no sense... how else are you going to run a non-native game on a newer console that runs a completely different kind of architecture... through emulation ofcourse. That is the whole point.

It makes sense to me in that I just want to throw an old game in and have it work, I don't want MS or another party to decide what I think is worth a replay.

It either plays my old games or not and I don't want it more complicated than that ta.

Hazdaz
05-18-2005, 12:04 AM
It makes sense to me in that I just want to throw an old game in and have it work, I don't want MS or another party to decide what I think is worth a replay.

It either plays my old games or not and I don't want it more complicated than that ta.

I can get that.. but my thinking is this.... the reason you already have XB games is cuz you must already own an XB, right? So I rather MS used it's resources to make the XB360 better, than make it work with EVERY old game - 90% of them will probably never get played after the first month or so of the new console's life. Basically there is only so much time and money that can be put into making and engineering a new console and I see that 100% backward compatibility might be more trouble than it is really worth.

But alas I see that I am in the minority here, so I'll just shut up. :D

-Vormav-
05-18-2005, 12:16 AM
Eh, selective emulation? That blows... My Xbox broke down a long time ago (good ol' disc read errors!), though I still have quite a few games for it. Somehow, I'm doubting that many of my games are on MS' worthwhile games list. :shrug:

SpeccySteve
05-18-2005, 12:18 AM
I do see your point as regards "please use your resources on making the current one tarty and lovely rather than worry about 100% compatibility", but for me and many others 100% backwards comp is a really neat feature and even if I don't always feel the need myself, since the PS2 I kinda take it for granted now..

Taste is a weird subjective thing after all and as others have said, what MS thinks is a classic might not fit with my choices or that of my girlfriend, people are weird.

novadude
05-18-2005, 12:33 AM
Maybe they'll support every game that made it to the "Platinum Hits" (or whatever the best selling games were) cases. I don't have too many XBox games that I'd feel the need to replay, as the best ones will have sequels on the 360 by the time the PS3 is out. I wonder if Sony is going to try and fake MS out and get them to release Halo 3 on the wrong day?

LiquidMetal
05-18-2005, 01:02 AM
Thats kinda gay.Why cant they do complete emulation for all the xbox1 games since they all run on nivida gpus instead of selective emulation??Kinda wacky.

rakmaya
05-18-2005, 01:26 AM
creating emulation is risky. Remember that GPU is not the main problem, it is the cpu and the execution model. Since emulation could become less than safe and secure, this can place a reverse punch in the face creating negative views. That is why they said "selective" games. They are planning something on the sort of emulation, but don't want to say what exactly it is until they thmselves figure out.

novadude
05-18-2005, 01:44 AM
I was thinking since my last post that maybe when they say it will officially support the best selling games it means that those are the only games that are going to be gauranteed to work with the emulation. Other games might work, but they won't be gauranteed and no support will be given if it doesn't work.

Shogmaster
05-18-2005, 03:26 AM
Selective emulated BC-

Positives:

* Will be able to play "top" XBox games in 720p and 2X AA!!
* Tailor made emulation code and optomizations per game!
* Probably XBox360's 20GB hard drive will come packed with the emulation code for 50 top selling Xbox games.
* More game emus could be downloaded later via LIVE!

Negatives:

* Some poor code monkeys will have to write emulation code and optomizations per game, locked away in a vast MS dungeon.
* Only the ones deemed "top XBox game" by some marketing dorks in Redmond will be made BC. No Panzer Dragoon Orta in 720p for me, but some redneck in Kansas will get to play 720p Nascar 2004 dithered down to 480i in his 15 year old 19" Zenith. :(
* They might charge for ones we demand in the future.

Neil
05-18-2005, 04:54 AM
xbox was supposed to be one of the easiest systems to port from, so why are they having such a hard time doing it themselves?!

Stormy151
05-18-2005, 06:14 AM
It seems to me that selectively porting certain games via emulation would be more difficult than just creating an Xbox emulator that played all the games.

If they're planning on adding features, such as resolutions and AA, it's a different story I guess.

rakmaya
05-18-2005, 12:07 PM
xbox was supposed to be one of the easiest systems to port from, so why are they having such a hard time doing it themselves?!

xbox is an x86 system. So it is easy to port from. But xbox360 is not that easy to port to.

Blazer
05-18-2005, 02:01 PM
You may say that now about ps2 compatibility and not wanting to play old games, but when the PS2 was released having the back catalog of 1000 games already available (especially RPGs that are more sotry driven) was a big plus in driving sales.

It won't be hard getting top used ps2 games for nothing when the ps3 is released, and many of those games will still be just as fun.

Neil
05-18-2005, 03:34 PM
here is why backwards compatibility is important to me.
A) less clutter (as already stated)

B) I don't buy new release games anymore (hardly ever) I almost always buy them a few months after they come out and drop in price or are used already. Since it's taking longer for games to drop in price, I have to wait longer, and you know A LOT of xbox 1 titles will drop as soon as xbox 2 titles come out.

C) Games are coming out faster than I can play them. There are a bunch of xbox1 titles that I know are good but I have yet to play them. Same goes for GC and PS2. I got to play the rest of the ps1 titles i liked on ps2 because of the ease.

D) There will be a few titles at launch (for all new consols) then it will stagnate, then start ramping up again. During these down times, i will continue to buy the current gen games. If i can't play them without setting back up an old system, as a consumer I will have little motivation.

novadude
05-18-2005, 04:20 PM
here is why backwards compatibility is important to me.
A) less clutter (as already stated)

B) I don't buy new release games anymore (hardly ever) I almost always buy them a few months after they come out and drop in price or are used already. Since it's taking longer for games to drop in price, I have to wait longer, and you know A LOT of xbox 1 titles will drop as soon as xbox 2 titles come out.

C) Games are coming out faster than I can play them. There are a bunch of xbox1 titles that I know are good but I have yet to play them. Same goes for GC and PS2. I got to play the rest of the ps1 titles i liked on ps2 because of the ease.

D) There will be a few titles at launch (for all new consols) then it will stagnate, then start ramping up again. During these down times, i will continue to buy the current gen games. If i can't play them without setting back up an old system, as a consumer I will have little motivation.

Why buy the new console then if you want to play old XBOX games and not pay for XBOX 360 games? By the time you've finished playing all of your "new" XBOX games, the 360 will drop in price.

bohmanart
05-18-2005, 04:53 PM
I was wondering if anyone knew why MS went with Ati for the 360. If they would have stayed with nVidia would it have been easier to make the XBOX 360 completly backwards compatible? Does this even have anything to do with it. Tell you the truth I wish they would have stayed with nVidia just because I have never had a problem with one of there cards. After a year of having the Ati card that is currently in my pc... it is starting to fail, causing my screen to tint in color. That in itself will probably make me not buy a 360.

novadude
05-18-2005, 05:10 PM
MS and NVIDIA had some contract problems, which you can google if you really care about it. ATI makes the best gaming cards though, so the change is for the better anyways.

About your video problems, it sounds more like a failing CRT than a GPU. GPU problems usually resort in discolered artifacts on screen, not color shifts.

bohmanart
05-18-2005, 05:22 PM
MS and NVIDIA had some contract problems, which you can google if you really care about it. ATI makes the best gaming cards though, so the change is for the better anyways.

About your video problems, it sounds more like a failing CRT than a GPU. GPU problems usually resort in discolered artifacts on screen, not color shifts.

I thought Ati made a better gaming card, that is why I switched and I could tell a big difference. I resolved my problem with the color shifts by swithching to the DVI connection and it no long shifted in color (that was a couple of months ago). This is why I thought my card might be failing. I sould mention that the other day it did it again (first time on the DVI connection). So, I'm a little puzzled on what is causing the problem.

Since this thread is dedicated to the xbox backward compatibility issue:
REPOSTED IN HARDWARE AND TECH THREAD http://www.cgtalk.com/showthread.php?t=241415
aplologies to everyone and the admin

morimitsu
05-18-2005, 05:23 PM
looking at the both specs of xbox 360 and ps 3 and watching the traillers...

I think it's not this time ms will knock out sony...

ps 3 is 2 times faster than xbox and still have the best japanese game developers with them.

when I saw the MTV xbox I thought ms would win this time, but after watching all the great games from sp 3... plus ps 3 will have blue ray for 'free'...

but ms will at least be in second place, ahead of nintendo, I think.

T Bomb
05-18-2005, 05:32 PM
... plus ps 3 will have blue ray for 'free'...


To bad all the companies developing it gave up and went back to the drawing board. The new format was gonna be either blue ray or HD-DVD or somthing like that, and the companies decided to just come up w/ one format instead.


Besides, if MS showed cut scenes instead of ingame shots aswell everyone would still be saying they are neck and neck. :D

Shogmaster
05-19-2005, 04:39 AM
looking at the both specs of xbox 360 and ps 3 and watching the traillers...

I think it's not this time ms will knock out sony...

ps 3 is 2 times faster than xbox and still have the best japanese game developers with them.

when I saw the MTV xbox I thought ms would win this time, but after watching all the great games from sp 3... plus ps 3 will have blue ray for 'free'...

but ms will at least be in second place, ahead of nintendo, I think.

After my first day at E3, I can't disagree more.

First of all, PS3 is definitely not 2X faster than or more powerful than XBox (things are never that simple). In some ways (raw fill rate, maximum triangle rate, more CPU resources available for AI and Physics), PS3 has the edge. In other ways (Wider bandwidth bewteen CPU and GPU, More flexible unified RAM memory sturcture, alot more flexible shader pipelines, faster loading times due to caching to a standarized HD, standarized 2X AA @ 1280x720 due to EDRAM module that does not tap into the GPU cycles, and "free" transparency FXs due to use of EDRAM) XB360 has the edge. Both of these machines are incredible, and they are spitting distance within each other in power. Do not pay attention to the underwelming versions of the demos for the XBox 360 dumbed down run playable for Mac based Alpha dev kits. The Beta dev kits with final CPU and GPU aren't even available until June. Top tier games (and even low tier games) for both consoles will be indistinguishable from each other when the final hardwares ship.

One thing is clear though: It will be alot costlier for Sony to make PS3 available @ $300 than XB360 is for MS, due to blu-ray and XDR RAM. And since Sony is already deep into eating around $150 for each PSP sold, I'm not sure Sony's new head honcho (Stringer, who is a money man and not a tech guy like Kutaragi) is will to let Kutaragi eat $200 per PS3 on top of that. Already Japanese newspapers have articles stating that the PS3 will be the most expensive console launched in Japan's history at nearly $500 come March.

Even with the $100 drop in price that usually acompanies JP to US console transition for Sony, that's still $400 when MS will be selling XBox 360 for $300.

Those with 1080p or 720p HDTVs will probably consider the $400~500 a bargain since Blu-ray player is part of the package, but considering that 720p and higher HDTV penetration in the market is even less than Mac market share, that's not how to get to 10 million units sold before the other guy.

And BTW, where's Sony's online strategy and a normal controller?!? That controller's gotta go.

morimitsu
05-19-2005, 11:12 AM
xbox was know to be more powerfull than ps2... but it had the lack of great games to compete with it. so, the hardware was one of the biggest reasons why people should buy it.

I d'like to see great tech demos from xbox.
Better yet, I d'like to see the list of great upcoming games from xbox to compete with ps3.

500 dollars is not that much here in Japan. Sega Saturn was sold for 45.000 yens, about 400 dollars and ps 1 was sold for 39.000 and I remmember there it was impossible to buy it in the begginning. You had to wait months to get it.

But the biggest problem xbox has to win the japanese market is to convince the best games creators to make better games ONLY for xbox and not for ps3.

Maybe ms should buy them. If ms has the greatest studios creating the best games ONLY for xbox, then you don't need to worry about tech specs.
Gamers don't care if it's difficult to program in ps3. They just want the best games. And if the ps3 has the best hardware, well , better yet.

AJ
05-19-2005, 11:36 AM
The Xbox 360 will not be backwards compatible

They're going to re-compile & re-release their top titles...

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/content_page.php?aid=8996

That - is crap

bohmanart
05-19-2005, 04:13 PM
The Xbox 360 will not be backwards compatible

They're going to re-compile & re-release their top titles...

That - is crapI second that! This really sucks if it is true. How can Microsoft be so stupid marketing wise.

PhilOsirus
05-19-2005, 04:41 PM
I think we should wait to get some clear facts on it. If it has to be recompiled, can't the hardware do it somehow?

CGTalk Moderation
05-19-2005, 04:41 PM
This thread has been automatically closed as it remained inactive for 12 months. If you wish to continue the discussion, please create a new thread in the appropriate forum.