please stop updating zbrush in too easy/powerfull

[jbo]

why not just stop purchasing upgrades?

[sriramatrix]

LOL...is this like some sort of AD for ZB2 ?!?!

There is no such thing as "too easy to use software"....it all depends on the person using the software.....I agree that ZB makes life easier....and thats supposed to be the PURPOSE of that great software....

Remember that a software can never think for itself:) So even if an app which can "generate" a character...no one would buy it:wise:
What would you prefer a)A model that is the outcome of your creativity or b)a "generated" model

[pablo83]

not creativity vs "generated" but who will spent many years of learning modelling vs 2 months of zbrushing in future? do will classic modelling techniques die?

[barbapapa]

well kid...thats life

[lovisx]

doing good work with zbrush is still something that requires talent and practice. Don't think because you sketched a couple of wrinkles and muscles and its super detailed, that you have a work of art on your hands.

[niCer]

Pablo, your thread is in a wrong Forum! Zbruschcentral were the right one *g*
But i think, they dont mind your Thrad anyway...

[pablo83]

sure however my tread is ironic don't take too seriously.

[Lyr]

will classic modelling techniques die?

Hopefully yes.

[barbapapa]

hell yea Lyr im with you. Pixologic, keep improving!

[CB_3D]

Hopefully yes.

Nah,converge.

[pablo83]

mmmh in max 7 in edit poly you can see the terrifing paint modifier.
In the future how will we see a topology brush in all 3d apps perhaps in conjunction with the magic button resolve all my topology problems all 5 sided polys and make animable my model?

[APLevitz]

In the future how will we see a topology brush in all 3d apps perhaps in conjunction with the magic button resolve all my topology problems all 5 sided polys and make animable my model?You'll have to skin your model to a character rig first, which might mean some sort of intermediate mesh between your design version and the final output, but yes, the magical topology button is inevitable. I can write up a design spec for it now, and with the right team of programmers, have it for you within a year. But that's some idiot on the street talking. For an established company to actually deliver something stable, I predict seven years, so you've got some time to get over the shock of this.

What everyone's saying is that these classic skills you speak of have nothing to do with modeling -- they're the technical workarounds which used to be a necessary part of the process, but the goal is to create art. No audience will ever see your wireframe, will ever appreciate it for it's elegant majesty. Nor should they -- showing how the magic's done dispels the illusion.

If you imbue life into your characters, you'll be successful. If you don't, you'll have a harder time. Creating a beautiful wireframe is satisfying, and it's currently a necessary part of making your work functional, but that's all it is.

We're moving away from the dark ages, and that's a good thing. Embrace the renaissance.

[greyface]

You'll have to skin your model to a character rig first, which might mean some sort of intermediate mesh between your design version and the final output, but yes, the magical topology button is inevitable. I can write up a design spec for it now, and with the right team of programmers, have it for you within a year. But that's some idiot on the street talking. For an established company to actually deliver something stable, I predict seven years, so you've got some time to get over the shock of this.

What everyone's saying is that these classic skills you speak of have nothing to do with modeling -- they're the technical workarounds which used to be a necessary part of the process, but the goal is to create art. No audience will ever see your wireframe, will ever appreciate it for it's elegant majesty. Nor should they -- showing how the magic's done dispels the illusion.

If you imbue life into your characters, you'll be successful. If you don't, you'll have a harder time. Creating a beautiful wireframe is satisfying, and it's currently a necessary part of making your work functional, but that's all it is.

We're moving away from the dark ages, and that's a good thing. Embrace the renaissance.

You speak truth!

The artist is in your brain, software is designed to transfer imagination into the real world! I don't know where this is leading but it's going to be fun ;)

[pablo83]

since the first triangle was rendered a lot of people study trying to follow evolving technologyes asleep sitting at their pc for trastlate ideas in shapes and colours.
i'm yung but remember when my father's c64 shows its coloured pixels and the time that his amiga taked for render a simple cube ,the first cg character in a film,my first flat shaded game in a bar(a sega racing game scud racer?!?).Now after few years we have in our houses the power to make everything we want in 3d.i love zbrush because before software wants that we became technician but with this software i have seen a true inversion of tendence not more software for tecnician but tools for artists.
classical techniques has not die i can use also the create polygon from vertexes of my 3d application if i want and we will see the hated /loved triangle again and again a little for nostalgy and a little because is the render primitive of actual gpu.
i want to die at the age of 150y only to see how 3d will evolve.logically i want to see all updates of zbrush and also fast i think to die before 150y i must finish to smoke else i can't will see zbrush 10.5 when it will programmed

[csutcliffe]

why is it so important to hold on to traditional skills? The way I see it is that give a great artist better tools and he / she will create better art.

[APLevitz]

Why traditional skills:
When the traditional painter or sculptor no longer requires an architect on their team to produce CG, being competitive in CG means your work stands up against theirs. Technicians have to become artists -- merely connecting the dots isn't enough.


That's probably not what you were saying.

Why is it so important to hang on to outdated technologies?
It's not, for the average person. But there will always be specialized needs, and people with those skills will become invaluable.

Plus, you can't expect the automated solutions to improve without a lot of people really understanding and believing in the old way. Innovation come seemingly out of nowhere, but iterative improvements require an understanding of the technologies they're built upon. Beyond just the developer, an informed consumer base is also needed to create demand for those improvements. (Why raise a bar no one cares about?)

*shrug*

[csutcliffe]

The point I should have made was there will no doubt always be a place for the traditional artist but we shouldn't be afraid of progress. Sometimes people seem to think that in order to create something wonderful the creator has to have sweated blood and tears - whilst I think that will add to somethings appeal it doesn't mean it will be great.

One thing that seems to keep popping up is that Zbrush is a magic wand that can turn average art into great art - I've seen lots of zbrush art that's incredible detailed and projection mastered to oblivion but it still looks average to me. On the other hand look at the work that Meats Meier does at the moment - I'll bet even he would have trouble replicating some of the work he does today without zbrush. Like I said a great artist, like the aforementioned Meats Meier, given better tools will create better art.

[lovisx]

depends what type of art it is.

For example expressive art. All you need is a bucket of paint and a wall.

Impressionistic art, is not so much the tool you use, but the eye you have for colors and atmosphere.

and so on and so forth.

[hindus]

simple - if u dont like it - dont use it :D we have a lot of fun with working in zbrush.

[eliment]

Zbrush is next stape of design... and modeling... i think Zbrush gonna to be one of the best software in the market hope, soon Zbrush team gonna make plug ins for animation to:)))

[ThomasMahler]

I can't hear it anymore, all this "ZBrush is cheating, ZBrush makes everything too easy" crap - Well, then go ahead, use it and show us what you got. If it would really be "too easy", it'd be a godsend. If it'd let us create mind-blowing stuff in a matter of seconds, I'd be the happiest man alife.

But the fact is: It's not magic at all. We're still pushing and pulling verts around, it's just more comfortable and a different approach of doing so. It feels a lot more like traditional sculpting, but I tell ya: If you don't have the needed knowledge, your results will be shit. Really. I've already talked to quite some people who told me that ZBrush is "cheating", that it'd "kill" traditional skills - After looking at the ZBrush work they produced everything was clear again.

ZBrush is still FAR from being the perfect solution for digital sculpting, it's for sure a huge leap forward, but there are still the same issues that digital sculptors have to deal with - Edgecraft is no thing of the past. Topology is no thing of the past. Everything stays the same, we can just hope that tools will become a lot more comfortable and more fun to work with. At this point, we're still, more often than not, fighting against the software - And as long as that applies, technology may not stop. In an ideal world, our only problems would be "what" we're doing, in this world our main problem is actually still "how" we're doing it.

[Micro26]

I think all softs are tools for artist to express themselfs. If someone picks pencils instead of pens or max instead of zbrush its just a matter of choice.

[pablo83]

i don't critique zbrush this thread is only for read other opinions about if someone read all my messages in this tread is clear that i love it.zbrush is easy and this is a good thing.Is easy to traslate in pixel what you have in mind but this is not cheating it don't traslate a poor idea in art.

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