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paulwdavidson
03-22-2005, 09:53 AM
Paul Davidson has entered the Master and Servant 2D.

Challenge Page (http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/masterandservant/view_entries.php?challenger=5827)

Latest Update: Final Image: At Your Command
http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/entries/8/5827/5827_1116370405_medium.jpg (http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/entries/8/5827/5827_1116370405_large.jpg)

Squibbit: that's it, here's the change you demanded....chuckle! No more, please. I've only slightly worked into it, there's so much detail allover that it's starting to become a labour for the eye.

That's it....thank you, and good night!

Paul :)

Squibbit
03-22-2005, 09:58 AM
ALright !! I so hope u get to finish this time !

sketchfiend
03-22-2005, 10:13 AM
Good to see you back mate, look forward to your entry. Goodluck Paul.:thumbsup: :buttrock:

kalemna
03-22-2005, 10:42 AM
welcome and goOd luck :)

paulwdavidson
03-22-2005, 11:34 AM
Thanks, and it's nice to be back. It was very interesting to watch the last one (and frustrating to not be taking part!)


I will finish this one if it kills me. I've got my colouring-in slaves at the ready, armed with a hundred crayons.

Let the challenge begin.

Good luck

Paul

duddlebug
03-22-2005, 11:37 AM
Hiya Paul!! Good luck!!

It frustrated me too... It's less fun watching from afar while everyone's being creative. Hope you can get to the end this time!! (i've got some potential hiccups... like a new baby... but i'm gonna try and get finished early!!)

paulwdavidson
03-22-2005, 12:26 PM
Congratulations to you and the missus! A new baby, ay! You'll more than likely get this finished if you have a few sleepness nights ( you've probably had enough of those already with your baby :)

element5
03-22-2005, 12:31 PM
Have fun and goodluck :)

mack72
03-22-2005, 12:54 PM
Congratulations and Good Luck (with the challenge, not the baby!)

My daughter's just turned one, so I know what you may be facing!!!

Cheers
Mack

NinjaA55N
03-22-2005, 01:23 PM
Oh, its time to learn some more i see... cant wait to lessons begin :bounce: good luck!

flyingP
03-22-2005, 05:26 PM
nice to see you back too mate :thumbsup:

paulwdavidson
03-22-2005, 05:33 PM
http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/entries/8/5827/5827_1111512820_medium.jpg (http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/entries/8/5827/5827_1111512820_large.jpg)

The ultimate slave.....the jenie.
This Victorian boy adventurer, has found his prizi in a long forgotten cave at the centre of the earth.

There is a full re-design on this, I just wanted to get a sketch in there, to encourage me.

A lot may change.....we'll see.

Cheers

Paul

NOOB!
03-22-2005, 05:35 PM
WOW!! so good

*prepares to lose*

duddlebug
03-22-2005, 05:38 PM
Great start Paul!!?

The Genie is a fab idea.... and i like the 'victorian boy adventurer' angle too... :thumbsup:

mack72
03-22-2005, 05:39 PM
Nice to see some work getting done, for a change!!

Good start, looking forward to see it progress.

Although I must warn you, the gauntlet has been thrown down!:D

Keep it up!

paulwdavidson
03-22-2005, 05:41 PM
Cheers fellas............here we go again!

DyslexicDan
03-22-2005, 05:48 PM
Oh damn. The competition is heating up.

MattDixon
03-22-2005, 05:55 PM
That looks great, Paul!

monsitj
03-22-2005, 06:03 PM
I follow your work in machineflesh ,and know that your new work will look great too , can't wait for coloring!

coldfront
03-22-2005, 06:17 PM
man, thats a nice sketch. I really want to see this one in a finished state. good luck to ya

JasonChan
03-22-2005, 06:20 PM
Off to a good start, I see :) Good to see you in the competition again. Can't wait to see what you come up with.

AlyFell
03-22-2005, 06:26 PM
Smashing composition Paul! Looking great!

Falcorr
03-22-2005, 07:13 PM
Hey Paul!

Nice to see you around this time. It already looks like a winner! Seems like your going cartoony this time also? You better finish it up during easter i know you have busy schedule so just wrap it up and enjoy the rest of the days :D

Althought many new talented faces have appeared. And some old ones are getting better :applause:

Good luck! Finish it up this time.

Squibbit
03-22-2005, 07:16 PM
yeayea looks grrreat! alright !

paulwdavidson
03-22-2005, 10:57 PM
Very kind words, indeed.............much appreciated.

This challenge isn't as obvious as it first reads. My initial sketch is the strongest concept I ran with, and will remain my concept..........but i'm going to read the brief a few more times until i'm brainwashed into picking up all of the subtle suggestions needed, to inject the feeling needed for telling the story. I want to capture as much drama as I can.

There's a lot of great ideas kicking about, and it can only get better as the challenge develops, forcing everyone to take a good look at the way they approach something like this.

I suppose that's the whole point of this challenge, at the end of it each and everyone participating will have grown as artists. Technique is one thing, great art comes from succesful problem solving.

Got to be good!?

Paul

JARhead
03-22-2005, 11:00 PM
Simply amazing

sketchfiend
03-23-2005, 12:08 AM
You never fail to deliver to goods Paul, excellent start, Keep it going.:thumbsup:

TheFirstAngel
03-23-2005, 01:37 AM
very cool start. the geni looks looks quiet nasty and the determinated scientist not like he's up for goods. Loadsa character. nice imageflow.
wish ya good luck and loadsa fun, :) let it rock!

polybuilder
03-23-2005, 02:07 AM
O! just found another great conscept, brilliant idea Paul:thumbsup: Very good start.

Tommy Lee
03-23-2005, 06:13 AM
Awesome first concept!:thumbsup:

Good luck eith this one and I hope you can finish this time...

Cheerz buddy

Tom

Tranchefeux
03-23-2005, 07:36 AM
hello Mr. Paul,

Its starts very extremely, wouaaahhh
:thumbsup:

teknotek83
03-23-2005, 07:38 AM
Very nice execution of a classic concept! Good luck!

paulwdavidson
03-23-2005, 07:39 AM
Gonna develop different poses for the Jenie..........I'll post them when I have a spare hour to knock them up..........thanks again for the comments...............I'm buzzed for this challenge.


Cheers

Paul

jamihn
03-23-2005, 07:53 AM
It's a great sketch! Maybe when you're going back through redesigns you can give the genie a sneaky smirk on his face. You never get exactly what you wish for with then damn genies. The wishes tend to have crappy consequences that come along with them.

Jezzarts
03-23-2005, 08:25 AM
Woooah nice take on the genie! So tight for a first concept... I better crank it up a notch... or twenty! - jez

Velinov
03-23-2005, 08:51 AM
Good start! I like your composition and characters. Looking furteher for the next wip.

jddog
03-23-2005, 10:19 AM
I'm impressed... I... ... don't have words, wondeful skecthes... wow
good luck, and I will follow your thred with lot of interest...

jdd

mark-jenkins
03-23-2005, 10:26 AM
This is looking good already, good luck

MrFreeman
03-23-2005, 01:44 PM
:) Good to see you back with a vengeance...

Love the sketch!!

Keep em coming :applause:

paulwdavidson
03-23-2005, 01:54 PM
http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/entries/8/5827/5827_1111586080_medium.jpg (http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/entries/8/5827/5827_1111586080_large.jpg)

Working out new ideas for the Genie. I'll take it past a few tries like this, with different expressions on it's face to test what impact it has to the scene.

Same goes for the body position in the scene.

The feel i'm going for is the boy doesn't know what he's getting himself into. It's his servant........for now!

Matteus
03-23-2005, 02:04 PM
Man, that guy is up to no good! Looks more like a demon then the general archetype genie.

You have a good point in that the master doesn't know what he's getting in to. I think that the "servant strikes back"-theme is a very interesting way to go. As I've been browsing, I see some others have considered this aswell.

Powerful! Good work, let's see the next sketch already!

paulwdavidson
03-23-2005, 02:15 PM
Interesting that you should say that, because Genie's according to Arabic legend are 'fire demons'........


Like I wrote earlier, I'll probably go right around the world trying all sorts of designs for him. I'm trying the scary angle first...........the next attempt will be an untrustworthy/ impish expression.

Proud.....smiling......laughing etc etc the right one will present itself........i'm confident of that.

You know!......'I know something you don't' sort of look. Early days yet.

Thanks for the comments........much appreciated.

Paul

mack72
03-23-2005, 02:18 PM
Really like the new version of the genie's head. Throws up all sorts of new interpretations of the whole master/slave concept.

Very cool!

ms@zx
03-23-2005, 02:25 PM
nice design for the genie mate.i like it looks evil~fine concept too:)

lanedaughtry
03-23-2005, 02:54 PM
Very cool work.

Amazing to me that more people haven't gone with a genie theme.

No crits/suggestions yet. I'm curious to see where this one goes.

-L

Garma
03-23-2005, 02:59 PM
Great! Love the dude with the glasses, his pose just works great!

OKMER
03-23-2005, 03:11 PM
Yap,nice sketches and great start!!Indeed the genie thing is really nice!!Like the boy,anyway(I'll be back,ha,ha)
Good luck!!!

NOOB!
03-23-2005, 03:23 PM
excellent work!

justsantiago
03-23-2005, 03:59 PM
This one looks great, the line in the drawing is very well defined but it still gets texture, love it so far

JasonChan
03-23-2005, 04:11 PM
It's looking great! Are you planning on lighting him as a solid or making him self-illuminated?

paulwdavidson
03-23-2005, 04:35 PM
Bit of both. There will be light coming from him, but he'll be quite transparent in places, as he's just materialized from his prison. Since in the original drawing i'm giving the impression of a cave, it would be nice to see all sorts of colours bouncing around in some sort of magic event.

The other options i'm playing around in my head are having him at the tip of a mountain at the peak of the world, lots of clouds etc (probably not, i want it to be quite dark with a strong one point light source)

I'm tempted to make this setting inside a volcano, as Genie's are fire demons..........lava looks stunning as well.

We'll see.

Paul

ralphmanning
03-23-2005, 05:46 PM
I will be watching. Good luck.

mybutterflyiris
03-23-2005, 06:11 PM
Really nice concept sketches... I'll keep an eye on you :) And good luck

Squibbit
03-23-2005, 06:28 PM
rockin, dude , ROCKIN :buttrock:

carry on!

Louieville
03-23-2005, 06:45 PM
I like how this one's coming along. The layout is simple, but very nice. I also get a really strong 'Atlantis' vibe...cool stuff!

jamihn
03-23-2005, 08:35 PM
That evil grin is absolutely perfect. The hell would anyone want to wish something from that face? Creepy genie. Creepy evil wish-granting fire-demon spirit! AH!

paulwdavidson
03-23-2005, 08:47 PM
I've made a few thumbnails of different faces, and the evil look works best for what I'm trying to achieve.

The design of the face will take a few turns here and there until i'm happy.....but the cheeky looking and open mouthed berserker look i tried seemed a little too obvious for my tastes. I want the look to give a feeling of insecurity to the fool who let him out, to do their bidding. Greed has a nasty habit of turning and biting you on the backside.............or worse.

But our power hungry boy is delving a bit too deep to satisfy his desires.

Should have went to university and got a better education.

What do they say......"don't play with fire, you might get burnt"

Some servants can't be mastered!

More soon

Paul

choptider
03-23-2005, 09:25 PM
still good drawing.
and fast, good inspiration.

NinjaA55N
03-24-2005, 12:41 AM
I'll just lay back and watch the show :D Great images Paul, as always. How long do u spend for a face like that?

TheFirstAngel
03-24-2005, 02:29 AM
Great show! *sits there sips on his havanna-coke and ejoys the ride* saweeeat.
keep on rocking!

sketchfiend
03-24-2005, 02:33 AM
awesome last post dude, love the look of the genie, although evil looking he still seems very likeable. You should post up the thumbnails youve done would be interesting to see.

whiterat
03-24-2005, 03:00 AM
well. ...more I wander for this contest more I see that I do not have any chances. ....excellent work in the concept and in the execution. .....waiting to see more images


Miguel Pizzo
my contest thread: http://www.cgtalk.com/showthread.php?t=222467

Climax
03-24-2005, 03:08 AM
• I love the concept Paul! seeing forward to see how u bring life to it! good Luck!:thumbsup:

beelow
03-24-2005, 03:28 AM
The competition is starting to heat up. You guys are starting to hype me up.:bounce:

Good start!:)

janhath
03-24-2005, 03:29 AM
Cool work.Reminds me alot of the movie legend.he looks alot like darkness,the main evil creature.Real cool sketch.:thumbsup:

pixemo
03-24-2005, 03:59 AM
Amazing drawings. Well, I guess you're done! You could just submit that second one the way it is... good luck, have fun!

Dreamshark
03-24-2005, 05:16 AM
Very nice sketch, well done on those horns. His left ear ring doesn't look like it's stitting right though. Good Luck.

Kalomus
03-24-2005, 06:48 AM
So far, out of everyone i like your idea of genie the best.
As for the genie design, i like the twist of horns and everything, but i like your first look of the genie better. especially the chin part.

Claireabella
03-24-2005, 07:34 AM
Hi Paul. Good luck with this challenge. Am looking forward to seeing your WIP. I see there are a few more Brits entering than in the Grand Space Opera. :thumbsup: Claireabella

Jezzarts
03-24-2005, 07:40 AM
Thats one evil looking genie! I like it... the way the guy in your composition is posed reminds me of M.J.Fox in the original 'back to the future' poster. That smokes going to be fun to paint:)

paulwdavidson
03-24-2005, 07:46 AM
Thanks again to everyone. The first sketch i posted was done in about an hour, and the test face, half the time...............you can probably tell it looks a little stiff (half an hour is too long on a sketch like that when you're working on a concept. You consider technique too much when you should be playing around more with form, and the general idea!)


That's not the final head by any standards.

I'll be posting full figure Genie tests next. The boy and his sub where pretty much nailed in the first attempt........it'll alter slightly, but it's doing what i want the way it is.

Thanks again

smudgefoster
03-24-2005, 09:31 AM
Excellent work as always mr Davidson,like the pose on the young chap.The whole image has a nice feel to it,look forward to seeing your intricate pencils,best of luck .........smudger

paulwdavidson
03-24-2005, 09:47 AM
Hello there Smudger, nice to hear from you. As you can see, I've thrown down the gauntlet one more time..........I will finish this one!


Should have something up over the weekend...........

.........you entering?

Luke Mrozek
03-24-2005, 10:10 AM
Will be looking here for Your creation - good luck !!

sumawut
03-24-2005, 10:51 AM
very :bounce: good design. good luck.:buttrock:

Levan
03-24-2005, 12:09 PM
wow, your work is my favorite. good luck! :)

mack72
03-24-2005, 12:35 PM
Where is the next set of sketches?! Bring forth the next stages! This is still one of my favourites, looking forward to see where you take the genie/d'jinn next!

Good work!

Tariq12
03-24-2005, 01:17 PM
WOW ! Very nice sketch. great composition too. Can't wait to see what you do with this.
Best of luck with the challenge.
T.

My Master & Servant :
http://www.cgtalk.com/showthread.php?threadid=222506

anilduran
03-24-2005, 02:56 PM
hi
i liked the concept and the character of the gin, i'd never seen before like this...hi hi
good lucks man...

paulwdavidson
03-24-2005, 03:54 PM
http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/entries/8/5827/5827_1111679678_medium.jpg (http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/entries/8/5827/5827_1111679678_large.jpg)

Trying out new Genie's.

No attempt to introduce colour yet, as i'm playing around with the composition.

Cheers

Paul

Squibbit
03-24-2005, 04:02 PM
guess i liked the first genie more , maybe only because it's torso was
visibly fading into mist , now u only guess it... i dunno, heh

edit : understood the white mist better at second glance so i dunno
what i was talkin about haha

mack72
03-24-2005, 04:19 PM
Love the new pose! Much more sinister/twisted! I'm definately liking where this one is going! Keep pushing it!

paulwdavidson
03-24-2005, 04:21 PM
http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/entries/8/5827/5827_1111681267_medium.jpg (http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/entries/8/5827/5827_1111681267_large.jpg)

To be honest, I'm trying to nail the look of the Genie at the moment. I considered what you wrote about the smoke, and it gave me an idea that could tie the whole composition up nicely.

Just playing about of course, but this example really adds some movement into it. Almost explaining the boys sudden jolt backwards. Genies (i suppose) like to make a dramatic entrance.

I'll carry on exploring the possible routes i can take this............thanks for the inspiration.

Paul

BaronImpossible
03-24-2005, 04:35 PM
Looking good so far, but the two main elements look really separated, almost like a collage. I know there's no colour yet but is there enough room between genie and guy to make it clear that the genie is emerging from the lamp and not just... there? Can't wait to see your colouring BTW, especially after viewing your Kraken piece (apologies if I got the name wrong, you know which one I mean)

paulwdavidson
03-24-2005, 04:50 PM
Collage is correct. After my initial sketch of the concept, I then draw various poses (genie in this case) and scan them in to lay over the original sketch. It looks a little odd but it's an excellent way to scale and shift your composition to fit. All problems are worked out in this way, when i'm happy, i print it out and then transfer it to 'bristol board' for my final tight drawing.

It works for me, probably a better way to do this, but i've used this working habit for a while now.

I'll be trying a few more genie's over the weekend...........by the middle of next week, I'll have my final line art, ready for colouring.

Thanks and good luck

Paul

NOOB!
03-24-2005, 04:58 PM
can't wait to see what u do with that smoke effect.

Wussie
03-24-2005, 05:02 PM
looking so sweet paul :D:D can't wait till next wip :D

omengeorge
03-24-2005, 06:01 PM
I gree with the smoke..though I think something should be done to makethe flows more apparent.. and your technique is something that I use too sometimes, and I agree that it works well for composition. Hmm..love your depiction of the guy by the way,
love,
Vinesh

paulwdavidson
03-24-2005, 07:05 PM
The smoke issue will become apparent and clearer as I get to that part. The only concern I have with that at the moment, is where it'll aid me in me balancing the composition. I'll show you what I intend to do with it in my next post..............just been playing around with it up until now.


I'm very close to nailing the whole thing. Final line drawing is just around the corner. A few pencil WIPS to come first, though.

See you soon.......

Paul

JasonChan
03-24-2005, 07:10 PM
Looking pretty good. But right now I'm having trouble placing the genie in space... I can't tell if he's huge and looking down at the guy from a little behind him, or if he's human sized and just shot out toward us and is large due to perspective. I don't know, it kind of feels funny right now.

omengeorge
03-24-2005, 07:12 PM
as you say, looking forward to the next wip

love,
Vinesh

paulwdavidson
03-24-2005, 07:20 PM
Good point Jason.......better i find out now, if there's any confusion in the image. There's a couple of ways around that sort of thing............I'll keep that in mind when I'm drawing the next one.


Good shout.

Cheers

Paul

paulwdavidson
03-24-2005, 07:29 PM
ps just thinking and looking at the original sketch.the smoke went straight up from the lamp, grounding the eye to the location of the boys right arm. No confusion there, the later drawing had the smoke swirling around the shot, not knowing where the genie was.


I get it

cgnime
03-24-2005, 07:35 PM
:eek: nice work. I like your style.

W-I-L
03-24-2005, 07:45 PM
love the idea mate... it's genie-us!!! sorry

The last couple of genie sketches are looking a bit hip-hop in there pose. Maybe that was what u were going for? anyway your sketches are excellent.

Raenz
03-24-2005, 07:57 PM
I really like what you have so far. You have a great sketch style, can't wait to see the color version.

monsitj
03-24-2005, 08:18 PM
good work ! i agree with the other about ginie, I think the bottom part need more detail intregate to image , but i think you have it in your head ,

element5
03-24-2005, 11:28 PM
I love the sketches and the style, I do like the first Gene head better than the recent one (which is very good too) :)

Nigel-Q
03-25-2005, 01:47 AM
hey this is looking cool.
the only suggestion i have at this point is that it seems like you should show just a little bit of the genie/demon's body beyond the folded arms. the transitions seems just a bit harsh.

paulwdavidson
03-25-2005, 05:35 PM
http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/entries/8/5827/5827_1111772100_medium.jpg (http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/entries/8/5827/5827_1111772100_large.jpg)

I'm getting close to being happy with the direction of the overall design and layout. I've given the Genie the look that one expects, but with a sinister undertone, by the tilt in his head, waying up the mortal who is brave enough to try and take him as a servant.

There's still a lot of tweaking with the design, but once I get a composition I'm happier with, I can re-design certain elements to compliment the scene.

A few more drawings and i'll develop the palette i have in my mind.

Cheers everyone for the great comments so far, it's really helped me reach this stage, and force me to be more challenging with myself when i'm problem solving.

Paul

duddlebug
03-25-2005, 05:40 PM
ooOooh... that Genie's getting better... The folded arms and stiff neck work really well. Is the 'explorer' gonna be in the same posiution? the new Genie gives the impression that he's look forwards towards the little guy... and thet the little guy should be turned more and looking back and up towards the Genie... know what i mean?

The rough background looks promising too...

Fab.

paulwdavidson
03-25-2005, 05:52 PM
Now that i've got an overall look and feel to the composition that i'm happy with, I'll now go and tweak all the elements so that it'll marry nicely ie the boy's head tilted up more to make eye contact. His face won't be fully up, but his eyes will etc etc

Now that i've reached this stage, i'll also have a play with the boy's industrial looking submarine.........that drawing was straight of the cuff, and i left it alone because it seved it's purpose (basically, i was happy enough with it, for it to remain his final sub) but i will (like i have done with the genie) play about with it's design.

It's much easier when you can see the wood and the trees!

Cheers

Paul

flyingP
03-25-2005, 06:05 PM
now that is coming along very nicely, love the genie

CoreyArtE
03-25-2005, 06:12 PM
MAN! Everyone is so good, I gotta work much harder ! I love the first concept sketch by the way. The one where the genie is bowing down.

paulwdavidson
03-25-2005, 07:42 PM
I'll be trying a version with the bow again (drawn up to the last post's level) to see if it competes with the arms folded pose............both actions would work for what i'm attempting. In the end the winning pose will be the one that serves the composition the best.


I'll draw it up over the next day or two. Then i'll make a decision as to what my final comp will be.........then i'll go to town on the drawing!

Paul

AirbORn
03-25-2005, 07:46 PM
WOw! Great concepts! I really like the sci-fi spin on the Genie theme. Can't wait to see you start painting this thing :) I'll check back often.

BaronImpossible
03-25-2005, 07:47 PM
I'm sure this is a result of the layout not being finished, but the guy's not looking at the genie and the genie's not looking at him. Looking good :)

BDPatton
03-25-2005, 08:03 PM
I think you are onto something with the "arrogant" pose the genie has taken, since most djinn are really malevolent beings who trap unsuspecting people to make wishes, then trick them into the "careful what you wish for" with that "twist" no one sees coming.

I would suggest maybe adding to the power of the genie by having him follow the backgroung perspective and have him tower over your main character and looking UP at him? Right now he looks as if he's coming out of the bottle at a 30-45 degree angle.

Maybe if you change the background to match the genie's perspective, possibly pushing the perspective a little more, that would fix it. But again, that could just be me.

Best of Luck!

paulwdavidson
03-25-2005, 09:16 PM
Very good observations.........I'm aware of it........it's my intention to bring this all together in the next stage. What i tend to do is have a composition/ layout in my minds eye and draw the individual elements seperatelly. I scan them in and then play around with the scale and placement until i'm happy with the feel and balance. At this stage it looks odd because it affects perspective and characters eye lines, throwing it all out, and rightly so you notice these things (and also point out stuff i might have missed........which is great) but sometimes by practising this, i discover new ways to look at the scene by flipping characters and doing wholesale changes with scale etc


I'll be bringing it together soon..........that part happens when i'm happy with the parts of the whole.

I appreciate all the things you notice............and the suggestions on how to get around them.

Thanks

Paul

dinodog-jr
03-26-2005, 07:10 AM
Yeah..A view slightly closer to Bird View will be spectacular & Ideal perspective! It can possibly present the Genie is Huge size & Powerful+Strong evil.

I really can't image How good u design the Genie into such Unique Style....WICKED & Egonistic Genie...hehe..

I like the very 1st compositing..Genie feels proud of himself to be a Slave of His master..This is a happiness connection.

I like ur mechineflesh artwork ....Sure expect alot of high-details coloring in this piece!

BDPatton
03-27-2005, 01:16 PM
Yep, I understand about trying to get the right angle and composition. I always seem to start out with a "straight" on shot and have to work to move and massage the P.O.V. so all of my pieces don't look the same.

Although I use more forced perspective in my comic book work, I am trying to learn the power and subtley of spot illustration, which is a whole other beastie, so I can appreciate the approach you are taking.

I think isolating the individual elements and being able to move them around is a splendid idea and may have to try incorporating that into my future projects.

Squibbit
03-27-2005, 01:26 PM
dunno if u mentioned it anywhere , but by any chance is the time
traveler in the pic a self portrait ? :D

paulwdavidson
03-27-2005, 02:26 PM
Chuckle!..........funny enough, when you mentioned that, i was just finishing off the revision of the boy for my next post in a couple of hours (a more realistic version) and would you believe it..........the new one does look a little like me (ish) when i was younger.


Squibbit...cheers.

Of course, anyone reading this that knows me would trll me i'm having a laugh........my nose is much bigger than that :)

BaronImpossible
03-27-2005, 02:33 PM
And I thought your "Kraken" pic was a self-portrait :D

Keep checking back here for the next stage - have you cleared space for your Boxx yet? ;)

paulwdavidson
03-27-2005, 02:55 PM
I'll try to write this very quietely............the Kraken is the girlfriend!


Only joking..............just in case she reads this :)

Tranchefeux
03-27-2005, 03:15 PM
Hi,
Good evolution, the design of engineering is good no matter what a
little diabolic but why not, I am a little month fan of the
direction of the decorations that you with taken; I thought of some
things a little more exotic, but the continuation will surely make me
changed opinion good luck.

Shatack2
03-27-2005, 03:27 PM
good look, i like concept so much, but i am curious about the lights what u will put in picture, i am anxious about your work...

paulwdavidson
03-27-2005, 03:49 PM
http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/entries/8/5827/5827_1111938551_medium.jpg (http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/entries/8/5827/5827_1111938551_large.jpg)

Here's the revised boy (not much done to his vehicle, i was pleased with it from day one) You can't see the genie, but he's looking straight at him. There still might be changes to come, but overall, the final image will be very close to what you see here.

I've used a more traditional genie lamp, because this one is more ornate.
I've also added a periscope, to add balance to the left hand side of the composition.

The next post will be the revised genie (in the same way i've produced this boy) and also the new background.

I'll probaly place them all together in the shot, and call that my 'line art' milestone.

Thanks for all the great comments that have helped me realise something that i'm going to enjoy taking to completion.

Good luck

Paul

Squibbit
03-27-2005, 03:52 PM
no crits, your b/w work is always excellent :thumbsup:

M477
03-27-2005, 03:53 PM
Well I certainly hope you do get to finish this, I'm sure you will! It looks awsome, can't really comment - just good luck

:thumbsup:

Falcorr
03-27-2005, 04:21 PM
Excellent work Paul!

But im slightly confused about the head size. Looks like your going in for that cartoony caricature head style?

I really like the details on the metal pod. Did you use any reference on that one? Or are you just that good with mechanical stuff? :thumbsup:

MDN67
03-27-2005, 04:29 PM
Hey, your concept is excellent and the draw is extremly good with many détail, the style is extra. Your last skretch is a,... skretch;:eek: Ohh god, the line art will be fantastik, good work, i wait the suite.:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

SideAche
03-27-2005, 04:37 PM
Outstanding work Paul,

I agree with Falcor though. The head on the boy seems a bit large and moves it slightly towards a more cartoony look. When that awesome genie is introduced, it might not match up. That is a nit-pick I know. You drawings never fail to impress. Can't wait to see it at the finish line. :thumbsup:

paulwdavidson
03-27-2005, 05:27 PM
http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/entries/8/5827/5827_1111944465_medium.jpg (http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/entries/8/5827/5827_1111944465_large.jpg)

Good observation....well spotted. Sometimes i miss little things like that when you're so into scribbling away.



It is too big.....i'll correct that for the final comp. The proportions of a boys head mesure into the body much less than an adult(example shows for the age of the boy i'm using....it's roughly 6 times), and also the flying hat and goggles add extra dimension also. But it could do with reducing slightly. It only needs to be rescaled a small proportion, at the moment it's about 5 and a bit heads.

That would have been a shame to overlook something like that.........................so many things to consider while your'e concentrating on the overall piece.

Thanks for that, i appreciate it.

Cheers

Paul

NOOB!
03-27-2005, 05:38 PM
whoa make that slight correction and that concept will be off the chain

can't wait.

paulwdavidson
03-27-2005, 05:40 PM
Falcor quote: I really like the details on the metal pod. Did you use any reference on that one? Or are you just that good with mechanical stuff? :thumbsup:Today 03:53 PM

ps regarding reference for the pod, Falcor.........straight out of my head, mate. I'll refer to industrail machines etc when i come to painting it, to recreate the look and feel of how light bounces off etc

I don't know about being that good! It's just that I've been working on a personal project for a while (comic book) that has a lot of industrial elements to it, so i suppose all of that imagery over the years is locked into my minds library, allowing me to play around with that sort of stuff. To me, Victorian technology is the most interesting (visually) ...disproportionate details versus function. In my opinion as an illustrator, it's a much better source than modern technology that is geared towards minimalism, and sleakness. Saying that I refer to modern engines as well...........etc

Enough waffling!

Thanks again

Paul

artjunkie
03-27-2005, 05:41 PM
great concept and awesome sketches. it's great to see you working out various elements of the pose and composition. good to know artists as talented as yourself still need to go through the trials of redesign and redrawing to get things just right.

looking forward to seeing more!

Cheers,

R-K
03-27-2005, 06:17 PM
wow, some really nice sketches here.. watching this thread

omengeorge
03-27-2005, 07:38 PM
MMMM your new pose really hits the button square.. it looks so much more..complete somehow..love it... this is becoming a major peice now'

love
Vinesh

BlackDidThis
03-27-2005, 10:48 PM
I get your point about the proportions of the head.. and agree on it.. but the general posture of the figure looks more like a (slightly cartoonish) girl dressed in a gentlemens outfit. Not as 'Boy'ish as a pen as yours would suggest.
What I am talking about is sort of like the boy in 'The Return of the Mummy'. Where as the outfit was not exactly meant for a boy. like the cloth looks thicker.. the shoes look bigger.. and even the tailoring even wrongly done (Maybe more from the fact that you always tailor a childs outfit to be a little bit bigger for them to be able to grow into).
Or like if the goggles wer also a little bit bigger like Skywalker in the pod races...

Just small touches to make it more Potter'ish.. (Gosh I just noticed how I have only gone through movies!! :eek: )

The SKETCHES (And if you call THESE sketches!!!) are fantastic. I am really worrying alot about the final outcome :sad:

Great work!:thumbsup:

Black

paulwdavidson
03-28-2005, 12:02 AM
I understand what you're writing..........i'll bear it in mind for my next stage.


Cheers

Paul

paulwdavidson
03-28-2005, 06:01 PM
http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/entries/8/5827/5827_1112032892_medium.jpg (http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/entries/8/5827/5827_1112032892_large.jpg)

This is the latest Genie render I've been working on. It'll probably change slightly at the painting stage...........but this is pretty much my design that i'm going with.

I'm throwing all of my drawings together now, to create my composition for the 'lineart' milestone.

Then it's painting..........should be fun!!

Cheers

Paul

Squibbit
03-28-2005, 06:03 PM
Dddooood !!! !

W-I-L
03-28-2005, 06:12 PM
very impressive line work... if colour is as good as line and idea then ..well... could be a winner.


will be watching.

W-I-L
03-28-2005, 06:13 PM
to sum that all up in the words of squibbit


Dddooood !! !

MDN67
03-28-2005, 06:20 PM
The devil is marvelous, my eyes doing:eek:, very great work

fooxoo
03-28-2005, 06:25 PM
A very cool idea, and nice sketches. I like it.

teknotek83
03-28-2005, 06:33 PM
That's one of the best designed genies I've ever seen. :bowdown:Great stuff!

paulwdavidson
03-28-2005, 07:04 PM
http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/entries/8/5827/5827_1112036656_medium.jpg (http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/entries/8/5827/5827_1112036656_large.jpg)

Okay, this is my 'line art' milestone'

I've pretty much got everything in there that i want. I'm happy with the general feel of the drama. The expressions are what i was trying to get across.

I've coloured my line work for certain elements so you can pick them out. Sometimes it's hard to see the form without colour.

I'm going to stay away from it for a couple of days to get a fresh perspective.......there's usually something to correct.

But for now, it's coming along nicely (in my opinion)

Thanks again, to everyone for the comments.

Much appreciated

Paul

Cerebr4l
03-28-2005, 07:08 PM
Daaaaaaaaaaamn! Very nice. :thumbsup:

BaronImpossible
03-28-2005, 07:09 PM
Was this the same genie that came from the lamp you evidently rubbed, and granted your wish to be an exceptional artist?

That is f#*cking impressive.

paulwdavidson
03-28-2005, 07:21 PM
Thanks for the compliments......i'm speechless.....cheers!

I've neglected the girlfriend for a good few hours over the weekend......so I've promised to build some wardrobes, so i'll do that over the next couple of nights when i get in from work.

I'll probably start mucking around with some colour on Wednesday......see you all then.

Not drawing will give me time to have a look around and make some comments on other artists work.

Until then

Paul

omengeorge
03-28-2005, 07:39 PM
Oh man!!! this is looking so impressive, love the small details you've added in, and the new angle of the boy's face..and just about everything else..it rocks.

love,
Vinesh

Adamos
03-28-2005, 10:08 PM
Excuse me, but this is brilliant work here!

q: did you do that genie with pencil? cause it sure looks like it, but the gradient grey layer bhind it makes me think it can't be scanned and ...oh just pls answer

thanks

won't wish you luck, cause you won't be needing it!

good vibes to you friend!

Adamos
03-28-2005, 10:10 PM
oh my question is important because if you drew your stuff with a wacom, then I'll have to rethink my life here ... :)

CodeNothing
03-28-2005, 10:36 PM
Nice! i realy like the style! The only thing that bothers me is that these are obviously seperate elliments put together. If you could unify them so they looked like 1 image a little better It would help a lot.

awsome piece, looking forward to it. :)

paulwdavidson
03-28-2005, 10:42 PM
It's pencil, my friend. In my opinion, the computer just cant recreate that lovely mark!....................not yet anyway. ( i'm sure someone will argue that )


I suppose a lot of the modern artists grew up, and where trained with the computer, so it's maybe a dying art...........just kidding!

In this digital world, it makes more sense to do so.....................less paper/ more trees.

I'm old school who's making the transition into the digital world, trying to find a technique that I can live with............getting there slowly. To present my drawings, i usually drop a maltiply gradient over the top of my pencils (then rub sections out) to pick out some form, until i colour. I went overboard in the Machineflesh challenge with the pencil, and produced a very tight render. I suppose it suited the technique i was using for that one (i used the pencil as a multiply, and painted underneath)

This time my pencil will serve simply to be painted over.

My friend draws with a tablet, but i can't get into it. He is fantastic..........i suppose it's practice?!

Cheers

Paul

choptider
03-28-2005, 10:44 PM
good re-design!!
you change for a kid, the difference is more impressive.
will you take a 3 points perspective , to put more power in the genie?

paulwdavidson
03-28-2005, 10:49 PM
CodeNothing quote:

Nice! i realy like the style! The only thing that bothers me is that these are obviously seperate elliments put together. If you could unify them so they looked like 1 image a little better It would help a lot.

At the moment, what you're looking at, is the skeleton of the piece. The seperate elements feel to it, is because i've adjusted the hue slightly on each for me to look at it objectively. I can critisize the design better that way. The drawing itself will be fully painted over.


I hope that makes sense. Strange working habit - i know!

Cheers

paul

walrus
03-28-2005, 10:49 PM
Paul - It's coming along really nicely. I like how the composition is falling together. So I see the hole and the shovel, I would imagine that he just dug up the lamp then? Should there be dirt around from the hole he's just dug? It seems awful clean around there! And there's only one hole: Looks like he knew exactly where to dig. Does he have equipment to help him out, maybe something like a metal detector lying on the ground? Or maybe a treasure map on the ground with a big black 'X' on it. (Okay, so that's more out of a pirate story, but once you're mixing Victorian tech with 1001 Nights Genies, what's one more genre thrown in there for good measure? :) ) Anyhow, looking good, best of luck with it!

-mike

paulwdavidson
03-28-2005, 10:53 PM
Choptider: I've put the horizon line around the face of the boy, so you get a sense that you have to look up towards the genie as well. I haven't pushed this too much though.....i've used a voyaristic point of view for this one.

I kept it simple.

Cheers

Paul

lotaH
03-28-2005, 11:00 PM
Hey!!

Is very good, I only found the very uniform hole. Lacks earth outside, that that was removed from within...

Great work!!

[] ' s

Adamos
03-28-2005, 11:01 PM
It's pencil, my friend. In my opinion, the computer just cant recreate that lovely mark!....................not yet anyway. ( i'm sure someone will argue that )


I suppose a lot of the modern artists grew up, and where trained with the computer, so it's maybe a dying art...........just kidding!

In this digital world, it makes more sense to do so.....................less paper/ more trees.

I'm old school who's making the transition into the digital world, trying to find a technique that I can live with............getting there slowly. To present my drawings, i usually drop a maltiply gradient over the top of my pencils (then rub sections out) to pick out some form, until i colour. I went overboard in the Machineflesh challenge with the pencil, and produced a very tight render. I suppose it suited the technique i was using for that one (i used the pencil as a multiply, and painted underneath)

This time my pencil will serve simply to be painted over.

My friend draws with a tablet, but i can't get into it. He is fantastic..........i suppose it's practice?!

Cheers

Paul


thanks for the really great answer!

You're not the only one "struggling" with the analog to digital sketching problem. You simply can't handle a tablet as you can handle a sheet of paper. To me sketching on a wacom is still a whole lot of sweat. But practice is the cliché I'll be believing in!

take care!

Ad.

Mordalles
03-28-2005, 11:06 PM
youre lineart is looking really great!

peterpop88
03-28-2005, 11:13 PM
Mint sketching my friend, Although I liked the sketch where the genie 'spun' out of the lamp, you had circles of smoke. Perhaps you don't need to do it to that degree but some kind of dynamic action would lift the image.

my 2c worth. And if your not going to work on your image until Wednesday and just want to critique others check out mine and slam it as much as you want... always interested to hear what a pro has to say.

My master /servant attempt... (http://www.cgtalk.com/showthread.php?postid=2095106#post2095106)

LouisBrowne
03-28-2005, 11:13 PM
Ace concept, though it looks as if the genie is looking at the camera/mirror, striking a pose! I think his attention should be on the boy, like in your earlier concepts.

OKMER
03-28-2005, 11:25 PM
This is huge!!!Although I find that for the moment the characters are a little bit too much in the center.
And the genie,his right shoulder(for us),the one the most near to us seems there are missing some muscles in it.Now it's all flat(don't konow if flat is the right word,but what i want to say is one big muscle unites,although you got 3(3 and a 1/2)principal muscles in the shoulder.
Sorry if my english suck's:D
anyway this is great ART!!!

ChristianHammer
03-28-2005, 11:28 PM
looking really good. Love this concept! The Djinn, Jini whatever it is called is awesome. Love the smug look on the explorers face, it is priceless. Can't wait to see the color tests...

grf
03-29-2005, 03:55 AM
Hey some nice line art there! They don't seem to be interacting/meshing properly. It seems like your genie is infront of AND behind the digger guy. Actually from the digger's perspective right now, he wouldn't even be able to see the genie's head, just his muscle-bound forearms. It kind of looks like he's looking up inside the genie's torso--maybe he's taking a gander at the genie's guts where they haven't completely materialized yet...? No, but seriously, I think the position of the genie before with his arm extended made more sense as far as perspective and scale issues are concerned.

Anyway, excellent drawing! :thumbsup:

Aethyrprime
03-29-2005, 04:39 AM
Very nice indeed. Good work. Keep it up.

CreativeKid84
03-29-2005, 04:56 AM
looks great good line work love it

AlyFell
03-29-2005, 07:20 AM
Loving your pencilwork Paul! And the attention to detail; getting everything spot on before colour is applied! :)

NinjaA55N
03-29-2005, 07:44 AM
Hi there! I was a way for a while but didnt miss a single sketch from u.. it really turned out very well. The concept and drawing itself is perfect as always (didnt expect less from u) but what bothers me a bit is a composition. I dont know if anyone mentioned it before (coz honestly I dont have time to get through all posts) but pic itself leans too much to the left I think. It could be becouse of the genies pose and boys as well. I think that for that kind of pose, they r too close to each other (one under another). If u could correct ur pencil drawing easely, I suggest to flip the genie horizontally and turn his head back to the boy. Thats how the direction of "moving" will make a stronger stability on the pic. Its just an opinion :) Other than that, marvelous ofcourse!

paulwdavidson
03-29-2005, 08:29 AM
Thanks for all of the comments. With a fresh look at it this morning, i'll be having a slight re-shuffle to correct some of the issues i've noticed............and that you guys have noticed.


It'll not be hard to do, now that i've set up what i have.

The next post should sort all of that out...........as far as anatomy etc is concerned, that'll be worked on in the painting stage (allowing for some improvising) I didn't want to bore myself by rendering every little detail in pencil, only to go over it again at the colouring stage.

On-going development..........it'll just keep getting tighter and tighter as i correct it on it's journey......................it'll get there.

Cheers

Paul

ps it's hard to tell at the moment (because i blocked in some white in the genie's eyes, but he'll be looking down at the boy....because i'll be painting eyelids.

I'll be creating more space inbetween the boy and the genie.

There'll be no hole or spade.....i'm introducing an alter that the lamp was on.

A foreground element will be added to push the genie back a bit, to give a greater illusion of his position (maybe compounded with a more dynamic smoke effect from the lamp.

etc etc.........i'll be nit picking the image until all of these issues are resolved.

I do this for every bit of illustration i've ever produced...............wouldn't it be great to nail it first time..........maybe that can be one of my wishes!

P

mack72
03-29-2005, 08:29 AM
Wow! Nice composition! This is gonna be a fantastic piece once its finished. I can't wait to see which way you're going to take in the colouring stage.

Very cool. Lets see the next stage!!!

mannix8
03-29-2005, 09:02 AM
your are very good in doing line art

Tommy Lee
03-29-2005, 09:36 AM
Fantastic... I have nothing to crit....:thumbsup: I'll just sit back and enjoy the show!

Jezzarts
03-29-2005, 11:49 AM
This just keeps getting better and better! ... is there no end?!

The most recent pose for the Genie is definately the best... the
expression on the boy is also much better.

chee-yang
03-29-2005, 12:05 PM
superb details~
I especially love the expressions

tuck
03-29-2005, 01:32 PM
I very happy . Because I saw good job.

meykurt
03-29-2005, 01:55 PM
good concept..
good luck..

Agent-Orange
03-29-2005, 05:23 PM
I will be keeping an eye on this thread.


The attention to detail is outstanding, but I am not sure if I understand your story behind it.

Everything else has already been said.

paulwdavidson
03-29-2005, 06:23 PM
Agent-Orange: here's a few things i've wrote along the way.....sort of outlines what is going on.

The design has a few things to correct as yet.........in development......post more soon.

The ultimate slave.....the Genie.
This Victorian boy adventurer, has found his prize in a long forgotten cave at the centre of the earth.
The feel i'm going for is the boy doesn't know what he's getting himself into. It's his servant........for now!
I want the look to give a feeling of insecurity to the fool who let him out, to do their bidding. Greed has a nasty habit of turning and biting you on the backside.............or worse.

But our power hungry boy is delving a bit too deep to satisfy his desires.

Should have went to university and got a better education.

What do they say......"don't play with fire, you might get burnt"

Some servants can't be mastered!

Chers

Paul

paulwdavidson
03-29-2005, 10:50 PM
http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/entries/8/5827/5827_1112136612_medium.jpg (http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/entries/8/5827/5827_1112136612_large.jpg)

Subtle update. Messing around witht he proportions in the composition. Smoke...........altar etc

Just seeing what generates a better image for myself.

Cheers

Paul

andreasrocha
03-29-2005, 10:52 PM
Mindblowing technique! One tiny suggestion: The "genie's" right horn looks shorter than his left, even with foreshortening.

Congratulations!

ChristianHammer
03-29-2005, 11:09 PM
This just keeps getting better. The Djinn looks great, I agree that the right horn looks alot shorter than the left...

Mythmaker
03-29-2005, 11:49 PM
Blimey! Some of these threads are huge already!

Just thought I'd make yours a bit longer ;)

Some really nice sketching skills you've got there - keep up the excellent work.

rickycox
03-30-2005, 01:26 AM
Excellent work Paul, this should be a good one to watch. Hey you should think of doing a training video, I'd like to see your drawing technique,

Besdt
of luck.

paulwdavidson
03-30-2005, 08:24 AM
Thanks for the replies and observations. The horn needs some work....i'll either add on a little drawing, or i'll deal with it at the painting stage.


All of these little things people have noticed have really contributed to the design getting tighter and tighter, forcing me to look at it even harder. An example would be my latest post, where i've created a lot more space for the characters by enlarging and shifting around the canvas. Before it was looking a little cramped (especially when you compare them now)

And hopefully I've solved the issue regarding the relation in space from the boy to the Genie, with the aid of the smoke travelling behing the boy's pod, and behind the foregroung cave details, pushing him back slightly. I think the illusion of that works. I wanted to achieve this in a subtle way without resorting to putting a stalagmite in front of him to push him back.....................that would have been very heavy handed.
You won't notice it fully until i start painting, but i've also started to suggest the genie's eyelids enforcing the looking down expression

Riki: trust me, you wouldn't want to see me draw, it would bore you to death, mate :)

Thanks again

Paul

kinnas
03-30-2005, 08:32 AM
it's a long thread so maybe someone has already pointed it out, but I was thinking. Her pose shows shock and surprise, yet her face has this evil grin about it which sorta conflicts for me, takes away from the unity of the image.

rickycox
03-30-2005, 08:56 AM
Riki: trust me, you wouldn't want to see me draw, it would bore you to death

LOL, I use to be good a drawing when I was a kid, but these days I barely have enough patience to sign my own name :)

paulwdavidson
03-30-2005, 08:57 AM
Kinnas: It's less shock and surprise (because the boy was expecting it, as he's been searching for the lamp) It's more like he's bracing himself......no matter how crazy and power hungry the boy is, it would be unnatural to not have some reaction to the might of a Genie bursting out of his lamp, that I imagine he's been cooked up in for thousands of years.

Just different tastes for how he should be acting.

Cheers

Paul

PeterPuppet
03-30-2005, 09:13 AM
I would make the part of the smoke traveling behind the pot a little shorter, but that wouldnīt really solve your spacing problem because the reason for your Genie look like in front of the guy (closer to the viewer) is the rendering. The genie is just right under the light casting through the whole at the top of the cave, but as you put a secont lightsource directly in front of your dudeguy which isnīt there and has no source, the viewer automatically links that to the genie which makes him apear like that, like he was the source and really closer to the viewer than the dude and this is destroying the whole relation between the two characters, because the guy looks like watching the belly of the genie and the genie watching the ground in front of him. But thatīs easy to fix during coloring process.

Oh yeah the horn: I love it, Iīd keep it like that. Being much shorter is imo no problem at all becasue as the two arenīt symmetric on his head anyway, itīs just great and gives him more caracter. I mean he is thousands and thousands years old and living in a tiny little bottle. Why not let one of his horns deform a little bit by the time?

All in all, I LOVE this, dude! I love it very very much! Keep it up!:thumbsup:

Squibbit
03-30-2005, 09:30 AM
this is .... DDoooooood !... I love the sandstone cave feel and
that the genie doesn't seem that much a servant (yea though
he could be bluffing too) AND that the way the kid looks, excited,
a bit scared maybe , but sensing the power he has unleashed..

:bounce:

paulwdavidson
03-30-2005, 09:52 AM
Cheers Squibbit, that's the concept in a nutshell. The master servant doesn't have to be illustrated in your face. Everyone knows what to expect from a genie. They are the servant of whomever releases them (initially!) I'm attempting to hint to the viewer that this is going to backfire....while the boy is blissfully unaware and doesn't know what he's getting into, blinkered by his own desire for power and to be this Genie's master.


Like I wrote in an earlier post.......some servants simply can't be mastered!

Bit more design work, and I should be close to marrying everything......head angles, body positions etc

The light i've used so far is to hi-light the design, to clearly see it. The light source experiments will come in at the colourings wips.

Cheers

Paul

jddog
03-30-2005, 11:10 AM
I'm really impressed and I love your skills... wonderful details :applause:
I continue to follow :wip:
jdd

Jezzarts
03-30-2005, 11:44 AM
where does all the dirt go!? ; ) looking good paul. I like the spiraling smoke. Maybe it could start very thin and expand from there? It kind of looks very even. What am I saying... this is awsome!

Tranchefeux
03-30-2005, 11:55 AM
Hi,
Much now I likes page-setting, I believe that you hold the good
direction, you will make a great image, to follow. :thumbsup:

marcheen
03-30-2005, 12:25 PM
excellent sketches! i also checked your machineflesh entry, it's amazing how you master the details with pecils!! now i can't wait to see this in colours

nebezial
03-30-2005, 12:27 PM
Excellent work man, i love the genie, it looks sooo zbrushable:thumbsup:
i especially like the three wishes gesture with the fingers.:buttrock:

MoonVisionStudio
03-30-2005, 01:17 PM
Your pencils kick ass.

W-I-L
03-30-2005, 01:25 PM
can not wait to see colour.

RBancone
03-30-2005, 09:17 PM
THIS NEW ONE IS REALLY BETTER!

EXPECIALLY THE MASTER..Very good!!

paulwdavidson
03-31-2005, 08:15 AM
Thanks again. I'm struggling with my colour tests at the moment. Originally, the

paulwdavidson
03-31-2005, 08:18 AM
Thanks again. I'm struggling with my colour tests at the moment. Originally, the Genie was going to have a red feel to him, but he looked like the devil...........i'm playing around with yellows, purples and blues. he suits a couple of these colours, but it's threw a spanner in the works, because I thought I knew what i was doing with it........damn!

I'll post a quick colour WIP tomorrow to see if you guys can shed some light on my problem..................help!

Paul

flyingP
03-31-2005, 08:27 AM
but it's threw a spanner in the works, because I thought I knew what i was doing with it........damn!


wahaha don't you hate it when that happens :D ....um yellow sounds kinda cool though :thumbsup:

Squibbit
03-31-2005, 08:45 AM
or the blue from the right side of your avatar, Paul,
or green , as in this pic "Night Parade" by Fred Fields,
on a similar subject

Night Parade (http://members.lycos.nl/arkanas/fields/fred_fields002%5B1%5D.jpg)

(that's another excellent pic, worth the look , promise :thumbsup:)

paulwdavidson
03-31-2005, 08:54 AM
I really appreciate your help.........hopefully you can keep an eye out when i post my colour tests tomorrow...........I value your opinions.


Thanks

Paul

Dominus
03-31-2005, 10:30 AM
very nice drawing! i like the ideea, can`t wait to see the color! ;)

artjunkie
03-31-2005, 11:22 AM
Amazing work thus far,my friend... as usual.

Looking forward to your colouring WIPs (rubs hands in anticipation)

Cheers

my 2D entry:
http://www.cgtalk.com/showthread.php?threadid=222438

redfrog
03-31-2005, 11:23 AM
Paul Davidson has entered the Master and Servant 2D.

Challenge Page (http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/masterandservant/view_entries.php?challenger=5827)

Latest Update: Line Art: At Your Command
http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/entries/8/5827/5827_1112136612_medium.jpg (http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/entries/8/5827/5827_1112136612_large.jpg)

Subtle update. Messing around witht he proportions in the composition. Smoke...........altar etc

Just seeing what generates a better image for myself.

Cheers

Paul

Fantastic illustration style,...really impressive linework. Can't wait to see it in colour.

duddlebug
03-31-2005, 11:37 AM
This drawing's getting better and better, Paul. I love the style of the piece and the linework... it's just lovely.

ALthough i think the kid and his craft could be just a little further forward, towards the camera...

You've probably already said and i've missed it... but what's your process gonna be on this piece..? Are you gonna do a detailed, shaded drawing? (like your machineflesh?) Or work straight into this on your PC..?

Zephyri
03-31-2005, 12:02 PM
At the risk of overloading you with all this praise you've had so far, I'm going to add some more. Your pencil work is the finest I have seen in a very long time, to say you only spent an hour on that first concept sketch, and less on each variation after that. I'm just gobsmacked and turned a virulent shade of emerald by the decisive quality of your line. The concept has been done before, but you've put such a different spin on it with the victorian technologies and the asian genie. I'm dying to see how this shapes up in colour, but as an almost finished concept, I really like the lines in the picture, the rocks really help to make the genie seem more important, while still leading your eye down to the young boy. The story comes through straight away, which is great, and you're left wondering what will hapen next, especially with that curious expression on the genie's face. Its somewhere between arrogant and wistful, he looks almost disappointed in his new master, while the boy's gleeful mischievous rapture is a great counterpoint.

The only teeny tiny thing I'm not sure on, and this might be because I can't see it all that clearly on this smaller file, is it looks like the boy isn't looking at the genie, but rather at the rocks behind him, through that final loop of smoke before the physical body of the genie appears. Other than that teeny point, keep it up... I'm itching to see how this pans out.

One small question, how big do you work in your pencil sketches?

paulwdavidson
03-31-2005, 12:04 PM
You're right to mention bringing the boy forward.........i'm defianately going to do that...........tweaks and tweaks and tweaks...........nearly there.

I'm painting on the PC straight over the linework, so that's the reason I haven't gone to town on the pencil work this time. Fully painted mayhem!

Good call on the positioning.......cheers.

I'm also doing a molten lava stylee Genie.........I'm testing it out over the next couple of days.................might work........might not.........we'll see.

Thanks everyone

Paul

paulwdavidson
03-31-2005, 12:17 PM
Cheers Zepyhri, that's very nice of you to say so........I'll be doing my final correction with characters looking in the right place etc when i start painting (slight twists of the head, and compositional shifts, like what Duddlebug suggested etc)


Usually when i draw detailed pencil (I don't know if you say my final linework for Machineflesh?) I render it with a 2B and 7H on A3 Bristol board. But with these drawings (which are just detailed guides for the painting stage) I work on them at aroung the A5 size on tracing paper.

Thanks again for the interest.

Paul

NOOB!
03-31-2005, 12:52 PM
wow very impressive linework!

TMArtist
03-31-2005, 05:41 PM
Nice work. I look forward to seeing more or your work.

Regards,
TMArtist

smudgefoster
04-01-2005, 07:57 AM
Hi Mr Davidson, I love your work it is really coming on well,checking back regualrly to see how you are progressing,I Know it may be a load of haslle but the composition feels a little compressed If you no what I mean you could give yourself another third on the top of the picture and move the genie up giving you some nice space to drift that light up in the centre of the picture,whispin that smoke up and giving you a loverly bit of space between the boy and the genie,very sort of michelangelo acenscion feel,even if you didnt do that an inch of either side would really focus you into that panel.top notch work though you need to get them 2bs going though the pencils really make it.......excellent work.....mastah........smudger

SEL
04-01-2005, 08:13 AM
Hey Paul,

Glad to see you in another one of these challenges. I really do like your pencil work and how you add personality to your form. Just wanted to drop by here and say Good luck with the piece and hope you finish by the end! Keep up the great work!

SEL

AlyFell
04-01-2005, 08:23 AM
Paul, really looking forward to when you put a girl or a cute fluffy animal in this pic! Hehe! I'm so anticipating seeing the colour go down on this! It almost seems sacrelidge with such fantastic pencil work...

paulwdavidson
04-01-2005, 09:04 AM
http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/entries/8/5827/5827_1112346261_medium.jpg (http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/entries/8/5827/5827_1112346261_large.jpg)

One last little post before i go to colour. There\\\'s been a couple of comments regarding the space this is playing in. Just to get some opinions , I\\\'ve created a bit more of an area in the cave. I know there\\\'s other issues regarding the angles of faces etc (i\\\'ll fix those at the painting stage) I\\\'m interested in peoples thoughts on this compared to my last post.

Closer in (last post) ?
More out (this post) ?

I know it\\\'s quite subtle, but it can make the difference sometimes.

Just in case someone mentions it, i really don\\\'t think it needs to come out any more than this.........you might start to disengage.....................unless there\\\'s a good argument for it!

I\\\'m all ears

Cheers

Paul

SEL
04-01-2005, 09:22 AM
Hi Paul,

with the latest stage youve lost a lot of the detail that makes your stuff so great. The scene is way too dark now and the boy and his machine seem to disapear. I would go with your last post, and instead of making everything black, just create a multiply layer and flood it with the color your overal scene is going to be then start working in your lights and darks. I see your piece actually glow around the machine part. You should make him your center of interest and the genie number two where the viewer looks at the boy and machine and follows it up to the genie, then have the backdrop fit into that criteria, detailed and well lit but not as vibrant as your main subjects. (FLAT). I would also create a secondary light sorce somewhere, maybe a light from above peaking throw cracks and crevices on the top surface hitting below, or a beam of light hitting the post where the lanp use to be? but something to help give a sense of global illumintion. Obviously you havent started color so I figured I would throw in my two cents before you do as I see this becoming really great! Ill check back soon..

P.S. water reflections on the walls would be fantastic too! Later!
SEL

lonewolf304
04-01-2005, 09:29 AM
Opinion:

You can do it eitherway. Different impact though.

If you want the final output to be a misty dark environment where only a subtle
light source will be present then I go for the most recent post. But I think you
must engage in a detailed lighting on specifically every object there is on the piece.

And If you're thinking a view from a different portion of the cave then I believe
this is the right one wherein the illumination will concentrate entirely on the little
space occuppied by these two objects.

Also, just an opinion, the milestone before this piece will give more visual impact.
Colors from various elements will ultimately make the piece "catchy."
And Its a more common approach if you think of Genies just popped out
from the lamp. And form the expression of the boy, I have reason to believe that
the genie had just appeared...so good illumination, yet not too bright, lighting will
be a good take on this piece.

In conclusion, I'll go for the milestone before this one.

(Did i get your question right?)

Can't wait for the colors... :D

Cheers!

paulwdavidson
04-01-2005, 09:42 AM
The lighting will be created from the burst of molten lava (visual effect of this, at least) from which the genie is made up of. You'll be able to see my lighting ideas in my next post..........my main concern at the moment is how close we should be to them (from a camera point of view)

If it looks too cramped, or is it OK?

Yeah, lonewolf, your answer was well recieved.........cheers

Paul

Arc80
04-01-2005, 09:57 AM
Hi Paul,

Just comparing two of your drawings. I say the new one is better. My question is, how big is the geenie compare to the human character? Because i'm not feeling the impact of the size relationship between them. If you are set on how the geenie (am i spelling this word correctly, hehe) looks, i would shrink the dude a little bit or extend your page upward and increase the size of your geenie. Right now, they seem to be equal in size and taking up the same space, compositionally. If you cut your page in half (horizontally), you'll see that it.

Anyway, i like the drawing of the both the geenie and the boy. Good touch on the props that he is carrying. It really feels like he went on an excavation or treasure hunting. Really cool design dude.

GoodLuck,
Archie

paulwdavidson
04-01-2005, 12:43 PM
http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/entries/8/5827/5827_1112359388_medium.jpg (http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/entries/8/5827/5827_1112359388_large.jpg)

Sorry about posting a seemingly unchanged image, but as subtle as it is, the others weren't right until this post. So this should be logged as 'final linework'

For all the minor changes during painting, and taking on board any further comments and observations from others this is the last post for linework...........everything after this will be colour!

This is mostly going to be a very warm (redish) piece.
The changes I've decided on (this post) are bringing the boy much more into the foregroung (cheers duddlebug) and suggesting some light to compound the illusion of the Genie being farther back.

Everything seems right to me, hopefully when I get some colour on, you guys can start to see what i had in mind for this illustration.
The Genie will be made up of black solidified lava, with veins and certain details : joints, eyes, creases etc showing the cracks where you can see the bright glow of the molten lava inside.
I hope I can make it work..........we'll see.

Thanks

Paul

Zephyri
04-01-2005, 02:24 PM
Liking the lighting so far, looks like it should be wonderfully dramatic when its finishd, almost gives the impression of being underground. Will there be any light source in it from the sub? Or anything the boy would have used to see the lamp first off?

duddlebug
04-01-2005, 02:28 PM
This is the best yet compositionally... i reckon... And, as you say, it shouldn't be too difficult to make minor compositional changes as you add colour. Great linework... i'd have to agree with Poshspice that it's almost a shame to work over it!!

The black lava genie sounds fantatsic... and with your attention to detail, i'm dying to see it coloured!!!

Good luck, Paul...

Silveraxe
04-01-2005, 02:45 PM
ooohhh!! this is awesome! :D

I love the gennie (not sure if thats the correct spelling XD ). I love how his skin folds at his belly.

The girl's pose is great too, but her head looks a tad big. But i love the whole composition ;D

bonestudio
04-01-2005, 03:09 PM
great great great piece :) The composition is very well thinked.

I like the movement of the boy, it's better with him more on the foreground.

The face of the genie is awesome :) I think his hands are a bit small though

Can't wait to see some colors :)

Kraull
04-01-2005, 03:39 PM
Hi Paul

I don't think I have some really helpful comments to say. Your line art just kick ass and the idea of a geni in a modern universe is really interesting. Great work so far! :)

paulwdavidson
04-01-2005, 03:46 PM
http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/entries/8/5827/5827_1112370390_medium.jpg (http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/entries/8/5827/5827_1112370390_large.jpg)

Just a really quick indication of what I was thinking for the Genie, with the charred molten rock, with the molten lava seeping out of cracks and details in his face and body.

I'll start it properly over the weekend, it's just I've been talking about it so much (for yours and my benefit) I wanted to spend a couple of minutes on a small jpeg to show the idea.

I'll post a proper one on Sunday

Cheers

Paul

W-I-L
04-01-2005, 03:49 PM
thats the way to do it!

Squibbit
04-01-2005, 05:51 PM
sweeeeEeeEet!

btw , got the machineflesh book today ... the kraken
looks even better and all that detail....so cool :thumbsup:

tilite
04-01-2005, 06:12 PM
have u seen this guys... this guy is doing a genie!!!

that is awesome... all the best to u i love this concept and ive bearly seen it, lol.

shame i dont have time to read threw but im surely going to be back.

excellent to see this entry...... im a lil excited

:thumbsup: :bounce: :thumbsup: :buttrock: :thumbsup: :applause: :thumbsup:

Arctis
04-01-2005, 10:28 PM
Hi Paul,
your project looks great, but maybe some points could be improved, I think.
First, the boy's legs are too short, and his arms too long, and it seems (to me) that he doesn't look at the genie (head turned too much on the left). The posture is interesting, though.
About the comp, it could be more smashing if the genie was bigger and closer to us : it would strengthen the diagonal between the two characters and add some dynamism.
Good luck, and keep it up ! ;)

paulwdavidson
04-01-2005, 11:13 PM
Well noticed...........I was working on those details as I as I noticed your post.

Cheers

Paul

flyingP
04-02-2005, 02:05 PM
you really are a clever bastard with a pencil :D :bounce:
don't really have much to crit at least nothing that I would say couldn't be put fairly down to style or personal taste.

Just a thought though and this is more based on feeling atm, I would perhaps lighten up the top left corners shadow just a bit, to balance out the composition, or do it with colour, just have the slight feeling it's tipping a bit to the right atm.....it may also give it a bit more depth :shrug:

am7
04-02-2005, 02:44 PM
Awesome concept! One of my favorite!

paulwdavidson
04-02-2005, 02:54 PM
Cheers, that's what i'll do. I'm eager to get some colour on it, to give you an idea of how the light will work in there. It won't be that dark, and the inner cave will be illuminated from a little blue light on the sub, but also the bust of lava effect from the lamp, and the simmering glow of the lava exposed through the genie's body. A lot of orange light will be catching on the rockface in a lot of areas.


I know the last post doesn't show this, but i was (for my benefit) testing (to the extreme!) what affect it would have if the Genie was the only light source.....purely to serve the composition.
Hopefully it wont be too long before you begin to see this (I'm about to start painting it, right now.................I've got a cold sweat :)

Paul

NinjaA55N
04-02-2005, 03:02 PM
Bravo! Very original idea of a colored version. A lava cracks in his skin. Sounds perfect and with the new dark atmosphere u made the composition works perfect I think. I asume that around the genie will be some sort of glow to substract him from the background... Fire glow maybe? Waiting for more! dont keep us waiting too long :)

Arc80
04-03-2005, 11:21 AM
What's up Paul,

I see you're starting on the colour. can't wait to see it dude.

cheers,
Archie
My master & servant entry (http://www.cgtalk.com/showthread.php?t=224331)

BaronImpossible
04-03-2005, 11:35 AM
I knew the big guy would be blue! :) Can't wait for the painting proper to start. But there's one thing that bugged me before and I forgot to say. I don't know whether you agree, but his horns don't appear to be symmetrical. His left horn appears more towards the centre of his forehead than his right, even accounting for perspective and the angle of his head. Anyway, minor point, this is shaping up to be quite something.

paulwdavidson
04-03-2005, 06:18 PM
http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/entries/8/5827/5827_1112548707_medium.jpg (http://www.cgnetworks.com/challenge/entries/8/5827/5827_1112548707_large.jpg)

As promised, I'm posting something on Sunday. I was hoping to do more........but the weather's been nice, and in the UK you have to grab it with both hands.

It's still early, and i've only been working on it for a couple of hours, but you can see what I intend to do with it.

I'm getting new ideas for this as i'm going along, so there's lots of room for improvisation. Lots of fun!

I'd like to carry on until i'm finished.....but can't.....so i'm off to the pub.

Cheers

Paul

NOOB!
04-03-2005, 06:25 PM
lovely,the face is emerging nicely.

and yeh sun was great today,but i spent most the day in the gym getting ready for summer.

BloodTaster
04-03-2005, 08:01 PM
Paul,
Another awesome job!! Just folowing your thread, fantastic. Great details!:thumbsup:

Goro
04-03-2005, 08:36 PM
fantastic!

Zephyri
04-03-2005, 09:30 PM
Ha, you must be down south... we've had weather miserable as sin. But seeing this brightened my day considerably. Wow. The colour choices are just perfect, and the effect you're going for has been expertly pulled off. I love the way the light is seeping from the folds in his brow, but also looks like lava does when it flows down a mountain. Brilliant.

Art2
04-03-2005, 09:33 PM
Uhm... wow!

tilite
04-04-2005, 03:32 AM
this is a great piece, but what i most love about ur work are ur priorities are right.

NOTHING COMES BEFORE THE PUB AND THE BOYS:buttrock:

keep it up great work, that lava looks wicked... such a great idea

lonewolf304
04-04-2005, 03:51 AM
wonderful!

will he be having some mini-cracks on his skin...like a
a real lava exposed to air?

cheers!

JakubFromOz
04-04-2005, 04:32 AM
man your skillz are elite :D really like the coloring u doing on ur demon now, nice choice of colors i can imagine him really glowing wit dose pinks

MechaHateChimp
04-04-2005, 06:41 AM
Paul, beautiful work.... your sketches are outstanding.

tAstyBITs
04-04-2005, 08:19 AM
Very Cool work...

eclipson
04-04-2005, 09:10 AM
cool sketch, love ur drawing styles man, nice painting on the genie, :thumbsup:

paulwdavidson
04-04-2005, 09:13 AM
Thanks guys........very nice compliments.....much appreciated.


Lonewolf304: i've already started to do that around his frown. It will become more so as you go down the body.

Thanks

Paul

jddog
04-04-2005, 09:26 AM
that come really intersting out... no crits for now... I just follow with interest next colors steps :wip:
jdd

duddlebug
04-04-2005, 09:36 AM
Wow... nice detailing on the genie's face. I really like the hot red lava glow coming through his skin from beneath.

No crits.......

For now...... :p

mack72
04-04-2005, 09:40 AM
Very, very tasty! This competition is really starting to 'heat' up! (sorry!) I am definately liking the texturing going on with the genies' face.

Need to see more details!

Excellent, as usual!

Cheers
Mack

AlyFell
04-04-2005, 09:40 AM
Looking good Paul! Enjoying this! :)