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View Full Version : FireGL 1 & Geforce 4 Ti cards on Maya 4


jazzthief
02-12-2002, 06:35 AM
Currently I got a FireGL 1 card running on Maya 4 in W2K the performance is abit sluggish lately compared to NT. Not to mention a bug with an error window stating the 'graphics adapter fan is blocked' every 5-10 minutes. ATI claims theres a bios update that rids this obnoxious window. But it doesn't work! Did anyone encountered this bug in their FireGL 1?

I'm slowly leaning towards a new Geforce 4 Ti4400 as a replacement. Does anyone know if this card is compatible to run Maya 4. Fully aware that AW doesn't recommend the Geforce 2,3 but how many of you renegades had luck with it.

Leonard
02-12-2002, 06:54 AM
Just bear in mind that Nvidia has not certified the GeForce 4 range for any professional 3D application. That is not to say that it isn't compatible...but Nvidia won't be offering any support if something doesn't work.

The upcoming Quadro 4 will be certified for pro 3D apps.

Best regards,

Leo

Svingha
02-12-2002, 09:59 PM
is it possible to use the softquadro patch at the new nvidia gf4 cards and what happens to the gf3 cards, because the gf3 cards are more expensive.

Leonard
02-12-2002, 10:06 PM
Depends....if someone writes a hack - yes. But your card still isn't certified and you won't get any support if something doesn't work.

L.

Svingha
02-13-2002, 01:41 AM
ok, so the existing softquadro patch wouldn't work with the new nvidia cards, because it works with the "old" gf2 & gf3 or ?
do you know which price the quadro 4 will have? what are the differences between gf4 and quardro 4 ?

Leonard
02-13-2002, 02:57 AM
Not sure. It hasn't been officially announced yet. Nvidia mentioned it briefly at the GeForce4 launch but no word yet.

Best

Leo

efishta
02-18-2002, 09:33 PM
ok the softquadro scripts have not been made yet because the author of the scripts has postponed work on them due to NVIDIA's antiprotection on the driver which doesn't allow its geforce cards to work as quadro cards.

i'm sure in due time this will be done however, but if you don't want to wait, either get a geforce 3 and patch the drivers or modify a geforce4 through hardware modification.

Leonard
02-18-2002, 10:36 PM
The Quadro 4 is a physically different chip from the GeForce 4. This is unlike previous Quadros where the chips are all the same. There already is a Quadro hack for the GeForce 4 (switching over one of the ID resistors) - which brings up the driver panel for the Quadro 4, but does not enable any of the features or speed simply because the chips are physically different this time round.

A review on CGC is coming real soon.

Leo

Erdener
02-20-2002, 06:21 AM
Hi,

Chips are still the same..

It`s true that id hack enables driver panel for the Quadro 4, but not just that..

Because of the unifed driver architechture same driver set contains booth different openlg codes for gf4 & quadro4..

So, after id hack direver uses quadro4`s opengl renderer which is totaly different from gf4`s opengl renderer..It`s not optimized for best speed like gf4, it focuses to correct display of polygons and textures and also has some opengl extensions enabled which are not available for gf4`s opengl renderer..

That`s why nvidia decided to protect drivers..Untill now most of the quadro hackers using software patch..But if you are willing to tamper with card @ hardware level & lose your warranty, you may still get the exact performace of offical quadro4`s..


Erdener..

Leonard
02-20-2002, 06:35 AM
Originally posted by Erdener
Hi,

Chips are still the same..


I would like to know where you heard that the chips are the same. I met and spoke with Nvidia engineers at the headquarters in Santa Clara who are adamant that the chips are physically different and even with a hardware hack (which was indeed done by some sites already), the benchmarks between a hacked GeForce 4 and a Quadro 4 show a huge speed difference.

Please provide some evidence of your claims.

Best regards,

Leo

Erdener
02-20-2002, 08:21 AM
Hi again,

I don`t have that `hard` evidence yet and my conculusions based on logic, with the knowledge of following information..

I have two friends, working at nationwide distrubitors of elsa & asus here in Turkey..

From the first one, I`ve heard that chips are `still` the same as before, again the info comes from an employee of elsa..

The second one has an asus`s card as a sample for them..He did some tests for me (without modding of course) and results pretty close to the ones on the nvidia`s site..which possibly could be in the margin of error because of different opengl renderers..

btw, do you honestly think that Nvidia engineers could tell you the truth about that? (yes thay are same, so don`t buy a quadro for double price..) And why should they have to protect new range of drivers? *that part became a speculation..sorry for that..:rolleyes:

I will do some tests soon, about in a week or two..using the sample mentioned above..Then I will have some proof...

Until then, let`s all hope that your information is wrong.. ;)

Best Regards

Erdener

Leonard
02-20-2002, 10:38 AM
As a publication dedicated to providing accurate information, we are naturally wary of claims of this kind. However, we are open to claims that are backed up by benchmark data. We will be doing our own tests in a Quadro 4 review coming soon.

The issue here is that it is indeed easy to hack the GeForce 4 to bring up the Quadro panel. But whether it is able to match the performance is the basis of our investigation.

Please also note page 2 of Anandtech's report on the Quadro 4:
http://www.anandtech.com/showdoc.html?i=1585&p=2

"One fact about the Quadro4 that NVIDIA is very proud of is that for the first time since the Quadro was introduced, it is actually a physically different piece of a silicon from its desktop counterpart. In the past, the features that set the Quadro apart from the GeForce were present on both GPUs; they were simply disabled on the GeForce GPU. The most widely known feature that was disabled on the GeForce line of GPUs was support for hardware anti-aliased lines, thus making the original GeForce perform even worse than a TNT2 with AA lines enabled."

Best

Leo

Erdener
02-21-2002, 12:14 PM
Hi Leonard,

Thanks for the info, but one more quoting comes from the Anandtech's report,

"Without cards to test we weren't able to gauge the usefulness of any of these exclusive features but we will take a look at them in the future once review samples are made available."

So, looks like best thing should be wait to test actual cards..

Btw, i have checked latest drivers (27.42) opengl code.. There is no entry yet for any nv25GL parts. I hope next leaked drivers set to be include new opengl code for them,so i can check the calls in it to see the way it works..

Ok, here is the actual reason of this post..

http://www.spec.org/gpc/opc.data/summary.html

You will find Viewperf Results for latest cards...Looks like nVIDIA Quadro4 900XGL rules them all...;)

Here is the quick list for AWadvs Mean;

nVIDIA Quadro4 900XGL.....320.90
nVIDIA Quadro4 750XGL.....308.72
ATI FireGL 8800...................103.59
ATI Fire GL2.........................122.33
3Dlabs Wildcat III 6110.......264.27

All based on either dual or single intel 2.2 cpu`s..

One intresting fact is ATI FireGL 8800 is the latest top of the line workstation offering from ati whic is based on R250 core..( gaming cards still at R200 so far)...

Hope this helps...

Erdener
02-21-2002, 12:33 PM
Hi again,

One more update from Viewperf Results...

Graphics Accelerator nVIDIA Quadro4 900XGL
OpenGL Renderer Quadro4 900XGL/AGP/SSE2
Driver Version 6.13.10.2750

Looks like we need 27.50 to be able check opengl code..

Erdener

Leonard
02-21-2002, 10:16 PM
Originally posted by Erdener

You will find Viewperf Results for latest cards...Looks like nVIDIA Quadro4 900XGL rules them all...;)

Here is the quick list for AWadvs Mean;

nVIDIA Quadro4 900XGL.....320.90
nVIDIA Quadro4 750XGL.....308.72
ATI FireGL 8800...................103.59
ATI Fire GL2.........................122.33
3Dlabs Wildcat III 6110.......264.27


Well...3D Labs are going to have an interesting time selling the Wildcat III's!

BTW: I saw these results at last week's briefing at Nvidia. ;)

Leo

MadMax
03-09-2002, 01:12 AM
LINK (http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/story.html?id=1013385350)


According to this, your information is incorrect.


A quote:

Nevertheless, it is already possible to get a Quadro4 today. The method I am going to tell you about is based on the fact that Quadro4 solutions, just like in case of all the other Quadros, will be built using the same GeForce4 chips. The differences between Quadro4 and GeForce4 will be only in the driver support. That is why all you need to do to install the Quadro4 drivers for your GeForce4 graphics card is to change the chip ID.


So the question becomes are they lying then??

I can see why nVidia would be decptive on this issue. We've seen it again and again in this industry, much like when Microsoft claimed there was a huge difference between NT and NT server, when in fact the only difference were a couple of registry changes and 700.00 difference in price.

Personally I think this article is likely a credible report on the subject, knowing how big business tends to operate..........

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