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Bayaron
02-11-2005, 06:12 PM
Nice plugin from AVT

http://www.lightwave3d.ru/index.php?showtopic=5423

http://www.lightwave3d.ru/uploads/post-4-1102068865.jpg

http://www.kreinin.com/lol/test_01.jpg
http://www.kreinin.com/lol/test_02.jpg

http://www.lightwave3d.ru/uploads/post-4-1102070261.jpg

NanoGator
02-11-2005, 07:44 PM
Is that micro poly displacement...?

duke
02-12-2005, 08:54 AM
Where do you get the plugin?

dies-irae
02-12-2005, 10:06 AM
very nice!
will try it out as soon as i get to work. Does it work with lw7.5 too?

duke: open the link, go to last page (page 4), click "download"

duke
02-12-2005, 11:22 AM
1 distant light
50% ambient
1 awesome water heightmap sequence
5 seconds a frame on a 2.26ghz, 1gig ram
and a little post processing in AE (levels, sparkles)

http://www.dukecg.net/3dBump_Test_A.avi [xvid]

Gareee
02-12-2005, 03:17 PM
Is this a layout plug, or modeler?

Can the displaced objects be saved?
looks killer!

cresshead
02-12-2005, 09:13 PM
this looks ace!

any chance of a english setup tip guide?

simagic3d
02-12-2005, 09:36 PM
Is this a layout plug, or modeler?

Layout PIXEL FILTER with a bridge to surface params via the shader.

Can the displaced objects be saved?

I assume not since the geometry isn't being micro-subdivided. It's just a very good visual hack. Pixel filters work on an already rendered image and this plug simply takes info from the shader via the special buffers entry and distorts the image to match what the object might look like if it were indeed actually micro-sub'd and the geometry actually displaced. A very ingenious hack at that!

any chance of a english setup tip guide?

Looks rather straight forward... apply the two pixel filters, part 1 and 2, add the shader to any/all object surfaces to be "micro-displaced," ramp up the bump channel to 300%, set the Color Filter as desired for actual bump height where 1% = 1cm, and finally, enter "1" in the first Special Buffers slot.

A rough translation apparently indicates that the "3D Bumps" don't cast shadows on others objects or itself, thus lending to the conclusion that the geometry isn't being micro-subD'd and that it's just a very good visual hack.

Panikos
02-12-2005, 09:56 PM
Only SingleThread rendering renders fine, (most probably for the time being)

As far as shadows, as simagic already wrote, LW generates shadows only from ordinary geometry. Similarly Sasquatch is invisible to LW.

To have shadows generated by this tool, more work is needed by the developer.

However, this is a pleasant surprise.

NanoGator
02-12-2005, 10:17 PM
Hmm.. well I've played with it for a bit, and yes it IS a visual hack. It's not exactly what we want, but it's still useful. I think it'd be WONDEFUL for rocks. One problem with polygonal rocks right now is that the edges are so smooth, they give their polygonalness away even though they're bump mapped. Trees and other rough edged objects would probably benefit, too.

In short: I'm sad that this isn't micro-poly displacement, but I'm happy because it's still useful. :)

duke
02-13-2005, 12:32 AM
http://www.dukecg.net/3dBump_archiTest_A.jpg

Practically the same render time.

Tesselator
02-13-2005, 08:05 AM
Hmm.. well I've played with it for a bit, and yes it IS a visual hack. It's not exactly what we want, but it's still useful. I think it'd be WONDEFUL for rocks. One problem with polygonal rocks right now is that the edges are so smooth, they give their polygonalness away even though they're bump mapped. Trees and other rough edged objects would probably benefit, too.

In short: I'm sad that this isn't micro-poly displacement, but I'm happy because it's still useful. :)
My same sentiments exactly. BTW, TuffLittleUnit (The Vodka People) has MPD
(micro-poly displacements) working in LW right now. Donno when the release is
schedualed for tho. TLU is full of a bunch of perfectionists Gerrr.. Imagine that!
Programmers that wanna make sure it works 100% in every situation BEFORE they
release something... HAH! :p

In the meantime I'm playig with AVT's plug here and digging it!
:scream:

NanoGator
02-13-2005, 08:11 AM
My same sentiments exactly. BTW, TuffLittleUnit (The Vodka People) has MPD
(micro-poly displacements) working in LW right now. Donno when the release is
schedualed for tho. TLU is full of a bunch of perfectionists Gerrr.. Imagine that!
Programmers that wanna make sure it works 100% in every situation BEFORE they
release something... HAH! :p

In the meantime I'm playig with AVT's plug here and digging it!
:scream:

Heheh. I have a new-found appreciation for programming perfectionists. You wouldn't believe all the "Make sure nothing bad happens!" code I've written in the last couple of months. ;)

Thanks for the heads up on the MCP. We're dying for it here!

visualcerberus
02-13-2005, 08:38 AM
This is a really cool plugin, and there can be done many things whith it
But it has its limitations, because it is not a real displacement. See the divx, to get out what I'm talking about.
http://geocities.com/visualcerberus/vids/microbump.avi

byby all

CB_3D
02-13-2005, 09:05 AM
Ok,for rocks,stone borders and some other stuff this would be perfect. For now it produces too many errors (smearing in the wrong places etc) and it isnīt saved with the scene. But yeah, even without the shadows i would use it in a lot of situations once itīs production ready.

Panikos
02-13-2005, 09:47 AM
CB_3D

Render using only 1 thread.

NanoGator
02-13-2005, 09:51 AM
CB_3D

Render using only 1 thread.

Even with one thread, extremes are still artifacty. To be expected of course, but yeah thre are a few. :)

CB_3D
02-13-2005, 09:53 AM
Yeah,cool.That did the trick,thx.

But itīs still not saved with the scene. Bum(p)mer

NanoGator
02-13-2005, 09:56 AM
Yeah,cool.That did the trick,thx.

But itīs still not saved with the scene. Bum(p)mer


Oops, sorry. Replied to wrong comment. :)

CB_3D
02-13-2005, 10:16 AM
could anyone confirm that itīs not saved to the scene? just want to be sure i am not doing anything wrong. i am more than tempted to use it in an architectural job i have right now with many surfaces and animations...

duke
02-13-2005, 10:19 AM
Not saved to scene or object :(

Bayaron
02-13-2005, 11:30 AM
Not saved to scene or object :(

Yes it is a LW8 bug...
And I know that AVT works above the new "volumetric" version of plug...

devi8
02-13-2005, 12:09 PM
This plugin looks amazing, but I'm having no luck getting it to work:/ I've applied all the settings as listed in the thread ( both pixel filters, the shader, a bump map, then set the colour filter to 'depth' required), but it just renders as a standard bump mapped object.
I suspect its something to do with the .dll included with the plugin. Where does it have to be placed? I've got a copy in the lightwave programs directory and one with the plugin.:(

great work though. Looks a lot like the parallax mapping thats been talked about for realtime.

:EDIT: all working now. I missed special buffer. Looks great:D

Thanks for any help.
Devi

Padmus
02-13-2005, 12:39 PM
man this plugin is utter brilliance

PaZ
02-13-2005, 12:51 PM
A question: does it work with 7.5c ?

I'm trying it, i've copied DLL into Programs dir but i get only crashes at F9.

thanks,

Paolo Zambrini

ztreem
02-13-2005, 02:05 PM
WOW! Great Plugin! Will do until LW supports true displacement. :bounce:

lasco
02-13-2005, 02:20 PM
Arrrhhh !
My parents told me I did not work enough
my russian speaking at school, now I almost forgot everything
:(

policarpo
02-13-2005, 03:35 PM
My same sentiments exactly. BTW, TuffLittleUnit (The Vodka People) has MPD
(micro-poly displacements) working in LW right now. Donno when the release is
schedualed for tho. TLU is full of a bunch of perfectionists Gerrr.. Imagine that!
Programmers that wanna make sure it works 100% in every situation BEFORE they
release something... HAH! :p

In the meantime I'm playig with AVT's plug here and digging it!
:scream:

TLU are cool. Do you know if their tools are also available on the Mac? The site only seems to offer Windows Centric Tools.

Cheers.

Excepti0n
02-13-2005, 04:22 PM
If it isnt working, check if you set the first special buffer thing to 1.

IVe placed some render tests in the Lightwave newsgroup. dont seem to be able to upload to this forum.

Did anyone figure out how to use the bump channel instead of the color channel to make the displacement?

ztreem
02-13-2005, 06:44 PM
Did anyone figure out how to use the bump channel instead of the color channel to make the displacement?

Do you mean that you use the color channel in the surface editor instead of bump channel?

Panikos
02-13-2005, 08:27 PM
And I know that AVT works above the new "volumetric" version of plug...

Bayaron

Thanks for developing this great tool. It has a lot of potential uses.
Volumetric ??? That would be a leap.
It will make the objects visible to shadows, reflections, refractions, radiosity.
Cant wait :bounce:

Bayaron
02-13-2005, 09:47 PM
Thank AVT (Andrew Terekhov), not me.

i did not develop this tool he did

c-g
02-13-2005, 09:51 PM
Pixel filters work on an already rendered image and this plug simply takes info from the shader via the special buffers entry and distorts the image to match what the object might look like if it were indeed actually micro-sub'd and the geometry actually displaced. A very ingenious hack at that!

Pixel filters have almost if not all the normal rendering funtions. It can raytrace or even replace the LW renderer. It would just be slower thant the native render engine.

axylfyre
02-13-2005, 11:24 PM
i would love to use this with mine but it keeps crashing..is it just an 8 one?

Panikos
02-14-2005, 12:02 AM
Thank AVT (Andrew Terekhov), not me.

i did not develop this tool he did

Hmmm
In case he doesnt speak/read/write english, or he doesnt visit the forums,
please send him user's comments.

Thank you

movie3d
02-14-2005, 05:25 AM
i cant find where is plugin of displancement of bump.. too many forum.. make me confuss.. pls give me website or hyperlink where is it

thank
movie3d

movie3d
02-14-2005, 05:26 AM
i cant find where is plugin of displancement of bump.. too many forum.. make me confuss.. pls give me website or hyperlink where is it

thank
movie3d

Tesselator
02-14-2005, 05:38 AM
TLU are cool. Do you know if their tools are also available on the Mac? The site only seems to offer Windows Centric Tools.

Cheers.

Ya they do Mac. Tho I think there are like, no requests from Mac users.

They're redesigning thier WebPage right now - gearring up for this and
a few other treats. When that's up you'll likely see the Mac links.
Contact them for more specific info and availability tho.

CB_3D
02-14-2005, 09:07 AM
http://www.kreinin.com/lol/AVT_3dBump.zip

Exper
02-14-2005, 09:36 AM
Masterpiece! :cool: :drool: :applause:

moc-ko
02-14-2005, 11:53 AM
Yes,
I agree this is a great plugin..
but I can't try it ....
look at the pic...
I got this error info.....
and the result is just a normal bump.....
http://www.geocities.com/emotion_3d_hk/lw/3d_bump01.jpg


ps..I followed all the steps...

moc-ko
02-14-2005, 11:58 AM
This plugin great,
But when I try it,
I got a error info...
look at the pic which I posted...

P.S..I followed all the steps...
http://www.geocities.com/emotion_3d_hk/lw/3d_bump01.jpg

lightwolf
02-14-2005, 12:22 PM
Not saved to scene or object :(

Yes it is a LW8 bug...

Actually, this is a feature of 8.2, not a bug ;)
(Plugins with no load and save handlers don't get saved by LW).

Cheers,
Mike

moc-ko
02-14-2005, 01:34 PM
hey....
this is a great plugin.....
It seems to be great to instead the normal displacement map...
but I got this error info....

did someone help me....?
look at the pic...
http://www.geocities.com/emotion_3d_hk/lw/3d_bump01.jpg


P.S. I have followed all steps.....
Did I need to mention about the .dll?

Bayaron
02-14-2005, 02:03 PM
Antialiasing OFF

Exper
02-14-2005, 03:19 PM
moc_ko... just made some little test.

Increase the Segment Memory Limit (in Camera panel); I see you're working with 1 Segment but maybe it's not enough due Special buffer usage or plugin bug (I don't know).

I tested a simple 512x384 image using a 5MB Segment Memory... do you guess? The same error message magically appers! ;)

Panikos
02-14-2005, 05:11 PM
Exper, its not a Seqment memory issue.

This plugin prefers MotionBlur to be normal, not dithered. I guess neither fields work.
But I am sure that the developer can find a workaround to inform the PixelFilter about the AA pass.

Some other PixelFilters like SKA, or Evalsions XDOF, Spectrum-LensFlare require two plugins to count the AA pass change.

Exper
02-14-2005, 05:49 PM
You're right!

Both Dithered Motion Blur and Field Rendering stop the plugin...
but...
I made another couple of tests about Segment and I found that if you have 2 or 3 segments the the plugin completely stops providing the error message... 4 or more segments don't provide any error message but the plugin still doesn't work.

Conclusion: 1 Segment is the only usable one!

Excepti0n
02-14-2005, 06:17 PM
AA off or use Classic AA (at least, AA works in 8.0.1, dunno if classic will work win 8.2).
Perhaps you have 2 or more threads?

Exper
02-14-2005, 06:28 PM
PLD AA and Reconstruction Filter works ok on LW 8.2 (... me at least).

Now... moc_ko's specific problem seems the Multithreading one... but... who knows! :D

movie3d
02-16-2005, 02:19 AM
thank you give me website of avt plugin but i am very overwhelm.. how do you get that.. can i need more clear tutoral how to step to step on that??? pls

thank
movie3d

antwik-2
02-17-2005, 09:30 AM
I got no idea how to use this plugin, should i map anything on to the bump channel after i added the pixel filters and shader?

Would be great with a little tutorial for us newbies, I reallly want to try this out.

movie3d
02-22-2005, 11:17 PM
hey thank antwik-2 tell anyone about need more tutorial me too i am very overwhelm about plugin how to get it bump on this...
pls help me
movie3d

devi8
02-23-2005, 05:06 PM
These are my steps, which usually get it going.

1: Obviously have an object with a bump map applied. For me I had best results when all bump texture layers were 100% opacity, but this might not be neccesary.

2: In surface settings/basic tab/- make bump 300%

3: In surface settings/ advanced tab/- special buffers, in the top two feilds put '1'

4: In surface settings/ shaders/ add shader/- add the AVT_3d+ shader.

5: In surface settings/ advanced tab/- set a colour filter value.This is the distance that the plug will displace the surface. I beleive this translates 1% to 1cm (again could be wrong). So depending on your scene scale, set this to something that'll show up.

6: In layout/ Window(top left)/ image processing/ add pixel filters/- add AVT+_render '1' and AVT+_render '2'

7: render :)


That should get you going.

duke
07-14-2005, 03:42 AM
Sorry about the thread resurrection, but does anyone know if there have been any updates to this plugin?

SplittingPixels
07-14-2005, 01:52 PM
The plugin is hosted here :
http://www.kreinin.com/lol/

... and since the timestamp on the current AVT_3DBump.zip archive still reads as Feb 11th 2005, it does't seem so. :( Too bad that development stopped — it was rather promising.

vbk!!!
07-14-2005, 02:05 PM
hmm
bad news
i just tried it and it's a great plug. the kind of tool lightave need desesperatly.
I tried it with the TB shader tree, another great free plug. yeahh Lambert shader, Blinn, good translucency, surface radiosity, occlusion ( i didn't try the two lasts yet) !

I don't if someone mentionned it before but AVTBump don't with dithered motion blur ( this plug don't like any exotic buffer). Normal motion blur only :)

T4D
07-15-2005, 12:51 PM
These are my steps, which usually get it going.

1: Obviously have an object with a bump map applied. For me I had best results when all bump texture layers were 100% opacity, but this might not be neccesary.

2: In surface settings/basic tab/- make bump 300%

3: In surface settings/ advanced tab/- special buffers, in the top two feilds put '1'

4: In surface settings/ shaders/ add shader/- add the AVT_3d+ shader.

5: In surface settings/ advanced tab/- set a colour filter value.This is the distance that the plug will displace the surface. I beleive this translates 1% to 1cm (again could be wrong). So depending on your scene scale, set this to something that'll show up.

6: In layout/ Window(top left)/ image processing/ add pixel filters/- add AVT+_render '1' and AVT+_render '2'

7: render :)


That should get you going.


well I'm missing something simple
Followed all of that I didn't get it going on My system ?

the dll is already in my win system32
it's in the plugin dir and in the LW programs dir ?

can someone attach a working scene & object to test ?

SplittingPixels
07-15-2005, 01:10 PM
Not possible to save a demo scene... The plugin is still very beta, and it doesn't actually to save itself or its settings. Also, LW has never saved the special buffer flags in a surface either, and those are necessary for it to work. ;)

That's why there are no AVT_3DBump demo scenes anywhere... You have to set it up manually each time.

T4D
07-15-2005, 01:26 PM
well that's life :shrug:

Hope Newtek do a version for LW 8.5
if this guy can do it, Newtek should be able to do it better

evenflcw
07-15-2005, 03:01 PM
T4D, if you're trying to get it to work in 8.3, give up! Most likely NT broke the special buffers in 8.3 (they don't work with any filter), and these are obviously essential for this plugin to run properly. Try 8.2 instead!

I followed devi8's steps in 8.2 and it works fine. In 8.3 it does nothing.

EDIT: Ahem, forgot to pay my respects. Very cool plugin!:applause:
I wonder what it could do to improve the look of some short fur. I'm thinking the minor displacements should give a more interesting silhouette and improve the overall look.

rozak831
07-15-2005, 07:28 PM
I tried it and it seems to work for me in 8.3

T4D
07-16-2005, 12:57 AM
T4D, if you're trying to get it to work in 8.3, give up! Most likely NT broke the special buffers in 8.3 (they don't work with any filter), and these are obviously essential for this plugin to run properly. Try 8.2 instead!

I followed devi8's steps in 8.2 and it works fine. In 8.3 it does nothing.
.

Cool I've been LWing for too many years to now feel like a newbie,LW 8.2 that makes scents

THo rozak831 please be wrong i want to feel big again :D

revengeofmonty
02-03-2006, 12:03 PM
Thoroughly exciting but odd to the nth degree. Can't get it to work in the latest Lightwave and it crashes my v7.5........:shrug:

Which is an f'ing shame cos it looks so good.

richcz3
02-03-2006, 05:06 PM
I have yet to try it but this almost looks and behaves like "Relief Mapping".
Spinquad Discussion (http://www.spinquad.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10683&highlight=relief+mapping)

IMAGE 1 (http://www.students.tut.fi/%7Ecollinn/reliefandaa.jpg)

IMAGE 2 (http://www.students.tut.fi/%7Ecollinn/normalvsrelief2.jpg)

Technical LINK (http://www.inf.ufrgs.br/%7Eoliveira/RTM.html)

ericsmith
02-03-2006, 07:59 PM
The big difference is that relief mapping just affects the surface, like bump mapping, where this one actually renders as a pixel filter, so it can render outside of the surface of the geometry. It's a little like sasquatch from that point of view, actually.

Eric

revengeofmonty
02-05-2006, 06:22 AM
Okay, I'm hoping all you wonderful people here can participate in a little troubleshooting.

From what I can figure out through my tinkering, it may be the models and/or images themselves that cause the issues we're having when trying to use the plugin.

These images are of a plain rectangle polygon textured with the coriolis procedural in colour, diffuse, spec and bump, rendered with and without the plugin. (I haven't attached the model cos I'm sure you can replicate it). As you can see, it works!

Now, when I try the same with the enclosed sword model, it does not work. I'm guessing it has something to do with the UV map....but I wouldn't even know where to start with pointing out how or why. (Note: For my tests, I didn't use the .lws file enclosed, I just loaded the model straight into Layout)

So.....any thoughts?

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