PDA

View Full Version : NEW!! Animation Timer


vangaans
09-10-2002, 03:43 PM
The Animation Timer is a product I have been developing and working on for some time now. I recently read a request for an Animator's Stopwatch on this forum so I thought I had better get it finished.
The Animation Timer is a desktop application for, you guessed it, timing animation.
Full info here. www.vangaans.com

Zhalktis
09-10-2002, 05:47 PM
Yep! That would be useful.

Too bad I'm flat-broke... Not a 0.01$ in my pocket. :sad:
And IMNSHO... 10$ is a bit too much for a tiny app like this one. :shrug:

oh well... Back to the good-old hand-timer and the calculator.
I can multiply seconds by FPS myself. ;)

vangaans
09-11-2002, 12:57 AM
Thanks for your feedback, I have spent a bit of time on this getting it right. Would like to cover costs, and have other products I would like to develop.

Give me feedback, what do you think is a fair price??

Thanks PaulVG

Nonproductive
09-11-2002, 03:19 AM
I have a similar application called "toontimer" that was written and distributed for free by a guy named Wesley Grandmont.

It offers pretty much the same functionality as your app. Although, you offer the keyboard setting thing which his app does not.

It's definitely a useful app for timing and of course, free is always a good price.

Personally, I have written a few little utilities for myself and can appreciate the time and effort that goes into writing even a "small" program. If you feel $10 is fair, stick with it and if people have use for the app, they will pay it. Alternately, you may only sell 1 or 2 copies. If you priced it at $5 you may sell 2 or 4 copies...it's really a crapshoot based on what value people place on the utility. No matter what price point you set, if people have a use for it - they will buy it.

Zhalktis
09-11-2002, 06:04 PM
Originally posted by vangaans
Give me feedback, what do you think is a fair price??
Well, I don't really know at which countries you're aiming.
Maybe in US 10$ is just ok. However where I live (lithuania) 10$ is quite a large sum for a single app. For example: for 10$ I could buy 3 audio CD's or 50 loafs (of bread)... :)
You can imagine how rich or stupid I'd have to be to spend 10$ for having a comp to count the frames, rather than myself. ;)

vangaans
09-12-2002, 12:21 AM
Hi insect666, I'm curious, which 3D package do you use and what does that package sell for in Lithuania?

Zhalktis
09-12-2002, 02:34 PM
I use 3DsMax4 which costs same as in US, making it impossible to get even for the design studios. :curious:

I'm just a student, so I didn't pay a cent for it... You know what I mean. :twisted:

Chewey
09-12-2002, 02:40 PM
This is amusing. We're asking a 16 year old warez user what he would pay for software.

A bit like trying to sell ice to eskimos?
(no offense to the eskimos who don't really have warez versions of ice.)

;>

vangaans
09-12-2002, 02:50 PM
Insect666 thanks for the honest reply

Chewie...LOL...it's ironic..


While your here Chewie, What's your thoughts on pricing...

If you don't mind me asking...where do you work?

moroten
09-12-2002, 02:56 PM
If your new tool is useful and - at least - slightly better than some other similar, free tool, then $10 is a very fair price for something that could save me days and weeks of work. Besides - and this should be fairly obvoius to most people - If I run into some problem with the tool or if I need some adjustments made to it, then my chances of getting it fixed is a whole lot greater if I'm a paying user than a freeloader.
C'mon people, lets keep the tools writing people some reward for their efforts! The "everything-should-be-free" culture of nowadays is just contraproductive.

Chewey
09-12-2002, 02:56 PM
I think your $10 price tag is what you'd could expect penny pinching, starving artist types to spend if they needed it and if they knew it existed.
Without marketing you can't expect much to happen.

jazzroy
09-16-2002, 12:21 PM
It's a nonsense to sell it at 10$.
Write a useful program, make it a free dload, spread the word in the forums and you'll have a t least a hundred of people dloading it, giving you feedback, giving you a great satisfaction, and finally if everything goes well making you think of a better version, maybe a PRO (not free) one.
Or write a useful program, give it a price (10$), spread the word in the forums and you'll have at least a hundred of people thinking of you as uncle scrooge, no feedback, no hands up, maybe 2-3 people who will buy it, for sure it won't make you rich and it won't give you a great satisfaction.
Think of winamp, napster, virtualDub, CDex, and so on...
What's better? an improved popolarity or 20 more bucks in your pocket?

dobermunk
09-16-2002, 03:55 PM
I found a very helpful free program a while back - KT2.exe
it sets frames/seconds while tapping the space bar.

Should be findable under flay.com

About the price - maybe you'd be good off having one minimal function tool, and one with handy extras for paying clientelle.

Chewey
09-16-2002, 04:40 PM
Originally posted by jazzroy
It's a nonsense to sell it at 10$.
Write a useful program, make it a free dload, spread the word in the forums and you'll have a t least a hundred of people dloading it, giving you feedback, giving you a great satisfaction, and finally if everything goes well making you think of a better version, maybe a PRO (not free) one.
Or write a useful program, give it a price (10$), spread the word in the forums and you'll have at least a hundred of people thinking of you as uncle scrooge, no feedback, no hands up, maybe 2-3 people who will buy it, for sure it won't make you rich and it won't give you a great satisfaction.
Think of winamp, napster, virtualDub, CDex, and so on...
What's better? an improved popolarity or 20 more bucks in your pocket?

What a niggardly post! This has to be just troll bait plain and simple. But just in case it's not...

Pay the $10 because he deserves compensation for his labor. Or perhaps you wouldn't might cleaning my toilets for free just as long as we give you "props" for doing it? How about you clean 100 toilets and just think of the satisfaction and "improved popolarity" you'll get for helping
keep the toilets clean. While you're at it my lawns need cutting also. And when you get done with that my car could use a wax job. I could introduce you to my neighbors. They'd just love to put your generous butt to work for free.

"improved popolarity" ?

Can you spell "cheap mofo"?

GRMac13
09-16-2002, 07:50 PM
Niggardly indeed!

vangaans
09-17-2002, 02:28 AM
Hi Guys

Thanks for the feedback dobermunk, much appreciated.

and thanks for your support Chewey and GRMac13


As for being niggardly or popular, well what do I say...

I don't know how much software costs in other countries, but in Australia Lightwave cost me $4500, Director cost me $2300 The Adobe suite sells for around the $4500 mark and the list goes on.

When I can get all these apps for free (legally) then I can afford to give my stuff away for free.

Until then, My family and I still need to eat.


Paul Van Gaans

derelict
09-17-2002, 02:57 AM
there is one other solution my friend and it has been practice since the dawn of the internet. Make it TIME SENSITIVE. Meaning put a lock machanism in it that will lock further usage right after the allocated time.

So, it would be free for download, but they can use it for like a week b 4 the program locks itself. If they think it is useful, they'll pay for it.

It will also help the customer to make a choice if they really need it or not. IF they really it em they'll have to pay em.

In the long run, at the lease you'll know if your program is a waste of your time or you have a sure winner.:)

Just my two cents

DSedov
09-17-2002, 09:25 AM
Just a though. Add drop-frame to NTSC which is 29.97 I believe.

Also excact transfer rate for film is 23.98 I might be wrong by 0.01.

At least thats what cinalta runs on to get a transfer to film.

jazzroy
09-17-2002, 01:09 PM
I don't know why somebody thinks everything in an offensive way.
Am I wrong because I write exactly what I would do?
I don't care about toilets and lawns not of my own, and such post don't need reply.
I was posting for vangaans question, just telling him what would be my behaviour.
A few buyers won't make you feed your family, a cute utility cannot be valued IMMEDIATLY in an economical way: maybe you'll cover your spent time, but you won't earn a significative amount of money.
This is not niggardly, it's just realistic.
I work too, and I have to eat too: I know when something is a business for me, or it's a no-profit hobby, or it's a long range investment.
My opinion is that the utility now cannot be a business (Chewey read carefully before howling), but could be a long range investment. If you want to earn money you have to sell a big number of copies, and you sell a lot of them only when your program is very popular.
To make it popular you have to give the first releases for free.
Invest.

Chewey, your answer would be appropriate also for Splutterfish with Brazil? Think of it! PLEASE.


derelict, a timer is a good idea

vangaans, this is just my opinion.

In case you wonder, by now my work is limited to static rendering.

Chewey
09-17-2002, 02:47 PM
jazzroy said, "To make it popular you have to give the first releases for free."

Kinda like the way illegal MP3 and warez users go out and purchase the legit versions? Yeah, right!!

Appreciation and "props" aint adequate compensation for his efforts or what some of us refer to as life energy. A small amount of return is better than no amount of return. While the amount of money may be insignificant or chump change to you and might not "feed his family" he may be able to pay one of his monthly utility or other bills which, for some people, might be good enough reason to try selling the item.

Where did you get the idea that he plans to turn this into a full time, big money making enterprise?
I doubt that he expects this to be a "long range investment" as you said. Just in case you haven't noticed, plugin and utility creators are not rolling in the dough especially now with the current economy. However you can bet your sweet butt that they haven't considered throwing in the towel and giving it away for free.

Ask Cman in the our CGTalk Lightwave forum about the "value" of the appreciation and the thrill of the popularity he receives for his free lscript work. I bet he'd like some money PLUS the adulation as they aren't mutually exclusive.

So jazzroy, anytime you want to come over and cut the lawns I have a whole lot of appreciation (and neighbors) waiting for you over here. You might even be able to turn it into a "long range investment". Don't forget, "To make it popular you have to give the first releases for free" so we'll expect you to make a few return trips before we start handing out the appreciation.

;>

jazzroy
09-17-2002, 07:26 PM
I have no intention to make an endless discussion, so this is my last post on this subject.

Chewey this time think a bit more about the exact things I write.

It's better for you to surf some more on the web to discover how much freeware means community, growth and so on. Not only warez. BTW, the web was born as a non-profit community.

You say appreciation and feedback aren't adequate to feed what you mystically call life energy, so 50$ can do it? Don't make me laugh.

Where the hell did I write "a full time, big money making enterprise"????
For example, planting a seed and collecting fruits three years later is a wise long range invesment, not a full time big money making investment.

It's funny how you call freeware as "throwing in the towel and giving it away", seems you have immediate possession as your primary objective in life.

You say I'm wrong in thinking of freeware because he has to earn money, and after you say I'm wrong in thinking of a reasonable amount of money because.. because he just wants to pay some bills with it. Hard to belive, but this is only one mind accusing me with opposite reasons.

At least, I'll come with all the Splutterfish crew to cut your lawns because they are all stupid like me and like thousands of people who think that promoting your own work is really a good idea.
How many stupids int he world! Think of promotions like "first month free!" or "First 100 users free!", or "Beta version free!", or "Non commercial version free!" they are all mad! They work and then they give it away! Mad! All of them.
No.
They sell products because there's always someone stupid who thinks they are mad and belives to be smart.
That's all.

Chewey
09-17-2002, 09:05 PM
jazzboy, Looks like you need to go back and read your own posts. Read mine again also and you'll see I didn't use the "stupid" word that you've seen fit to adorn your miffed response with.

Comparing the activities of Splutterfish to that of this animation timer utility is pretty weak and limp. Looks like you're really into the "one size/approach" fits all. Did you know there are other ways to promote a product without resorting to the "freebie" approach?

Why do I get the distinct impression that you're too young to even know what it's like to pay a bill, let alone feed a family? Money is a good thing! $50 for many people isn't the chump change that you seem to think it is.

My lawn is waiting for you and so is a big bag of appreciation and props. The "community" (sounds a bit like the Napster mindset here, I think I see a trend) as you call it, will love you for it. Since money doesn't motivate you perhaps a plate of cookies and milk will make your day? ;>

I'd still suggest pricing the utility at $10 a pop. There are probably enough "adult" working pros out there willing to purchase the tool to make a few extra bucks for your efforts.
Kids will always want it for free.

;>

GRMac13
09-17-2002, 10:05 PM
Hey jazzboy, wouldn't it be cool if we could go watch a movie at the theater, free of charge? Then if we like it, we'll pay to see it a second time. :surprised

By the way, products like Brazil are not given out for "free." They let you DL an unfinished version of the product that most times has restrictions on it such as "not for commercial use." The reason companies such as Splutterfish release "beta" versions is to test customer reactions and to see what bugs come up when their customers use the product. It's alot easier (and cheaper) to release a public beta for testing than to hire an army of testers. Once they have the app finalized there are no more feebies, and rightfully so. In the case of this timer utility, there really isnt much code to test, and any debugging can be done by one person. If that person wants to be compensated for his effort, more power to him. If you really want this utility for nothing why don't you just write it yourself instead of depending on someone else to pour thier sweat into it for your benefit.

I'm sure the time vangaans spent on this tool is worth more than a simple "YEA DUDE YOU ROCK!!! :bounce: :buttrock: :bounce: :buttrock:"

Chewey
09-18-2002, 12:20 AM
lol!

vangaans
09-18-2002, 12:50 AM
LOL... you guys have just made my day... I needed a good laugh

thanks heaps


Paul Van Gaans

jazzroy
09-18-2002, 01:15 PM
"Why do I get the distinct impression that you're too young to even know what it's like to pay a bill, let alone feed a family?"

Luckily I manage to feed my family and I like my work, although here in Italy there's a lot of people 30 years old like me who do not have a job.

I hope Van Gaans earns both satisfaction and money with this utility, that's why we are all posting now.

Chewey
09-18-2002, 03:08 PM
I suppose this means I have to cut the lawn myself?

;>

CGTalk Moderation
01-13-2006, 05:00 PM
This thread has been automatically closed as it remained inactive for 12 months. If you wish to continue the discussion, please create a new thread in the appropriate forum.