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flicked101
01-21-2005, 05:40 AM
I am a pretty good Fcp user, but i am in need of a win editing system so i was wondering if you could give me any suggestions. I am mainly looking at Premire Pro, or Vegas+DVD, I want the feel to resemble FCP as much as possible. Also i want to konw about the DVD options with these two programs

Naisa Evoli
01-22-2005, 04:21 PM
my favorit editing software is Avid. Not sure i fyou have the funds, but i love my avid setup.

MystikGotan
01-22-2005, 06:02 PM
Premiere Pro is a good one, but once you get AVID, you'll never go back. AVID has got a lovely user interface and after about 2 months of editing sometimes on Avid Xpress Pro I know most of its functions. When you've experimented for just a couple of hours, you will know a lot, because AVID is sooooo easy to use. Once you go Avid you never go back.

Xpress Pro = 1700 $. But you might want to check out Avid DV Free on their websites (don't know about its funtions, but should be okay). Or go with Avid Xpress.

Gotan

marchermann
01-23-2005, 07:04 PM
You can download a fully functional trial version of Sony Vegas. This is how I got to use and like the software. It is very good to get thinks done quickly and its sound editing tools are better than most.

I also like and use Liquid Edition from Pinnacle. Don't be scared by the unusual interface. It's a very powerful editing software and just like Avid Xpress the low cost variant of a broadcast editing suite.

Marc

Alexandro
01-31-2005, 11:20 PM
My vote for Vegas.
I'm using Vegas more than 2 years for all projects I've had. It's most complete software for video/audio editing and in the same time so easy to use and faster from the competition. I've tried PPro and Avid but there's nothing in these packages which could bring me into them. Now in Vegas you have most powerfull primary and seconday colour corrector which I've seen only on daVinci.

At least try it.

videodrome
02-01-2005, 01:11 AM
I like Premiere because i also use After Effects alot, and Premiere allows you to export the entire project into AE for final tweaking/transitions ect without having to render it out of premiere. Of course you can do all the transitions/effects in Premiere (like most NLE's its got tonnes of useless video tranistions/wipes.ect), i just like the fact that AE and premiere export/import well together. Premiere comes with a built-in dvd mpeg2 encoder. its not everyones cup of tea, but ive been using it for 5 years and have no complaints.

Alexandro
02-01-2005, 09:54 AM
Videodrome, I agree with you about Premiere / After Effects work, but you should try Vegas and see why I did forgot that way of work. I have used Premiere from 1994 (Premiere 4.0 it was) because no other editing software was for Windows platform. After that I've used speed razor and premiere to edit on Matrox Digisuite and after I have found Vegas that is so much fast I just forgot on other softwares (even with hardware support). Vegas is running faster than everything else I've seen for windows. That's what I'm talking about. Try Premiere Pro and Vegas side by side and you will see.

Cheers

MadSkillzMan
02-17-2005, 04:42 AM
i started on Ulead Media Studio Pro, which comes with a whole DVD suite, which isa plus.

But i switched to premeire because its pc/mac, has plugin support..

i was thinking of trying avid or vegas

Hugh
02-21-2005, 11:00 PM
I started many, many years ago on Ulead Media Studio Pro (I recently went back to it, and was not impressed at all....)


A brief stint on Premiere, but that was in the pre-5.2 days, when it was ridiculously buggy....

Now a firm believer in Avid - I use Avid Xpress Pro most of the time, and have used Media Composer at a couple of places where I've worked - Avid skills are completely transferable between any Avid system, ranging from Free DV up to Film Composer... It's so customizable that you can always get it to work in the way you want it to.

MadSkillzMan
02-22-2005, 02:08 AM
i wanted to try avid, i could NEVER get the video imported. Either if it was on my HDD it had some alpha issue, or if i tried to transfer from miniDV it had some audio buffer issue...so i just kinda gave up quickly lol. i cant remember which app that was, i haven found anyone to explain it to me.

Ideally id need to be able to edit in avid, export clips, throw them in AEFX/Combustion/3dsmax, then back into avid.

Hugh
02-22-2005, 07:35 AM
i wanted to try avid, i could NEVER get the video imported. Either if it was on my HDD it had some alpha issue, or if i tried to transfer from miniDV it had some audio buffer issue...so i just kinda gave up quickly lol. i cant remember which app that was, i haven found anyone to explain it to me.

Sounds like your firewire connection was having problems in the second instance, and in the first, no idea...

Ideally id need to be able to edit in avid, export clips, throw them in AEFX/Combustion/3dsmax, then back into avid.

That's pretty much exactly my work-flow (except Maya/Shake in the middle) - I export the clips I want as TIFF sequences, work on them, render them out as TIFF sequences, and then import them back into Avid (select the first frame and make sure "Autodetect Sequences" is turned on)

marchermann
02-22-2005, 08:37 AM
I went to an Avid demonstration last week to quickly learn the basics like trimming, moving and splitting clips. While the media management and options looked very interesting, I found it a bit tiresome that I always had to switch modes depending on what I wanted to do with a clip. There was a mode for selecting and moving clips, one for trimming, two different types for deleting clips, and an effects mode to change the length of dissolves, but that happened in a different window.

Did I overlook something or is this jut the way Avid is structured?

Marc

Hugh
02-22-2005, 11:08 AM
I wrote a nice long reply to this, and then managed to miss CTRL-T (new tab) and hit CTRL-R (refresh) instead and lost it...

Ah well - here's the gist of what I said:


Avid has a fantastic keyboard shortcuts system, which can really speed up your workflow - the whole 'switching modes' thing gets really easy and quick once it's second nature to hit a key on the keyboard...

The keyboard shortcuts system as a whole is great - you've got so much flexibility to set things up the way you want them. Personally, I found I was doing enough editing to warrant getting a proper Avid keyboard - coloured with icons to say what each shortcut does (plus some printed bits of paper with icons on for the ones I'd customized myself...)

If you want to see what the current setup looks like, go Settings->Keyboard (in the main floating window - the one with the bins in... I can't remember what it's called off-hand) - if you press SHIFT down you can see what the controls are with that modifier on...

To modify these settings, keep the keyboard window open and also load the Command Pallet (Tools->Command Pallet) - with this, you can drag things to keys on the keyboard (or any of the buttons in the GUI) to customize it for you...

MadSkillzMan
02-22-2005, 09:27 PM
i just remember there being some picky thing about the alpha channel, was it there is no alpha in avid or there is?

My firewire for the most part is fine, except i cant get print to tape to work for me, i have no idea why (in premiere and ulead) it can control it and capture otherwise no problem.

Hugh
02-22-2005, 09:39 PM
There are no alpha channels in Avid - if you want to do some kind of overlay, you need the image, plus a seperate matte image....

You add the matte image on the video layer above the footage you want it over. You then add a Matte Key effect to this. If you double click on it, you get three sub-tracks appearing above it - the matte is already on the top one - you add the actual image to the one below. It's a little confusing at first, but once you're used to it, it's easy enough...


And if you're interested in seeing the default keyboard shortcuts layout, here:

(the ones I've done myself are obvious - F2, F5, F8, and I've overlaid their on F9-F12)

http://www.brokenpipefilms.com/hugh/images/avid_keyboard.jpg

MadSkillzMan
02-22-2005, 09:51 PM
:eek: wow

jez that alpha is confusing. why is it that way? does it give some extra functonalaty to it or something? Most of my projects are green screen heavy

Hugh
02-22-2005, 09:55 PM
You really shouldn't be doing your compositing in Avid.....

Avid is for editing - that is where its strengths lie.... Any compositing that you're doing really should be done in a specific compositing package (Shake, Digital Fusion, Combustion, After Effects)

Then again, there may be (not entirely sure, actually) a chroma key effect which you can apply directly to a clip and key from - the method I gave above is for something that's had it's alpha generated outside of Avid...

MadSkillzMan
02-22-2005, 10:04 PM
well for the most part i do my compositioning in AEFX and combustion, premiere's keyer is crap.

Is just wondered if using avid in the middle would require extra conversions likeyou described just to get in and out of aefx

i dont doubt its a great program, but i needa get this job done quick, so ill be stuck w. premiere :( so afterwards, ill make myself learn avid

Hugh
02-22-2005, 10:19 PM
Well, whatever you use, you'll have to export it to stills after capturing, and re-import is back, so that's not going to slow it down....

And I'd expect you to do the compositing in Combustion/AFX, end up with a finished image sequence, and import it back as a clip - you've then got a straight clip, and there's no need to worry about alphas, or anything like that - it's just another video clip as far as Avid is concerned...

Xevious
02-24-2005, 09:03 PM
You can count me in with the Video Vegas crowd. I found it much more stable than Adobe Premiere (Even with my old computer).

Yossarian!
02-28-2005, 10:57 PM
As a standalone editor Vegas rocks real hard. It's very fast, stable and whilst the layout is a little unorthodox compared to other NLE's its quite intuitive. And the feature set is as good as anything out there. I haven't used it in a broadcast environment, but in the near future we're getting Vegas on one machine, so I'll find out how it holds up.

But since you're using AE a lot I'd really recommend Premiere Pro 1.5. The two integrate beautifully, provided you're running AE 6.5. There's no exporting of files, hence no double handling and more hard drive space. You just load the timeline in AE and voila, all cuts and transitions recognised. It's a beautiful concept and one I hope more companies exploit. And Premiere's pretty good too.

scrimski
03-02-2005, 11:03 AM
It#s quite hard to say what video-editing is best for windows. It depends a lot on the videoformat you are editing. Avid is the most used program for broadcast-material I guess, so it would be my choice for Beta/Digi-Beta-stuff, for DV/miniDV I would prefer liquid.edition, it's just the fastest I ever worked with.
Compositing I would do in After Effects for TV or Video stuff, for 2k and more I would use combustion it's a powerfull tool, best for keying imho, for editing in bigger formats discreets edit.

MadSkillzMan
03-02-2005, 08:00 PM
But since you're using AE a lot I'd really recommend Premiere Pro 1.5. The two integrate beautifully, provided you're running AE 6.5. There's no exporting of files, hence no double handling and more hard drive space. You just load the timeline in AE and voila, all cuts and transitions recognised. It's a beautiful concept and one I hope more companies exploit. And Premiere's pretty good too.


that isnt backwards compatable is it? IE i can work on something in AE, save it, go back to premeire?

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