Environment: Roman Sci-Fi Government Building (Art Test)

[ehulser]

Thats a pretty sweet concept drawing you have there. What type of building is it supposed to be though? Simply adding arches and columns doesnt speak to me about Roman architecture though, as its a pretty commonly used form. Depending on the purpose of the building (you mentioned a generator, and this looks particularly industrial, so I am assuming its a futuristic power plant of sorts) I'd say use some more unique qualities in the Roman architecture that you can bring out. A lot of religion went into their work (if im not horribly mistaken - which i could be). Time period being either of the Roman Catholics (more pointed archways and large cathedral like buildings) or more Roman Mythology which you could play up the use of temples and statues in your architecture. Its hard to comment on the model itself, since its still so early, but its definitely a good start. Good times, good luck with the test..

[EvoG]

I hate to be one of 'those' people :D , but this is for your own good : Does Mythic want you showing concepts publically?

Otherwise, do you have a question or just sharing? I think the concept is awesome, and you're given LOTS of room to make it look amazing so take advantage.


Cheers!


EDIT: You know, being reactive sometimes ( and conscious of the dozens I've NDA's I've had to sign ), I neglected to assume that this is probably a misc. object and by the date, rather harmless to show off. Nevermind. :thumbsup:

[marc001]

I hate to be one of 'those' people :D , but this is for your own good : Does Mythic want you showing concepts publically?

Otherwise, do you have a question or just sharing? I think the concept is awesome, and you're given LOTS of room to make it look amazing so take advantage.


Cheers!


EDIT: You know, being reactive sometimes ( and conscious of the dozens I've NDA's I've had to sign ), I neglected to assume that this is probably a misc. object and by the date, rather harmless to show off. Nevermind. :thumbsup:
EvoG,
Everything should be ok, since I asked for permission, and got the green light for posting this WIP.

[Sozialcyke]

I love the concept drawing, but there's only one thing that I can notice. If you are going for a specifically Roman style, there should be arches and domes in the structure. What you have now is a more Greek style. Just a minor thing, since I think you are going more for a "mythical" feel to it.

[marc001]

Things changed:

1. Added arches to first floor.
2. Added corner triangle.
3. Added half pillars to second floor.
4. Added fillets to second floor.

ehulser:
The building is meant to be a Sci-Fi Government Building. So maybe it could be a court house, police station, or city hall. You have a point about the time period, since Roman architecture is different depending on the period of Roman mythology or Roman Catholic. For the time being I will keep the design similar to the concept.

Sozialcyke:
I've noticed the arches, and domes when searching for Roman architecture reference images, but I have to stick with the concept.


http://www.cyborgkatana.com/images/arttestmythic02.jpg

[marc001]

Things changed:
1. Added roof.
2. Added towers
3. Added foundation.
4. Added stairs.
5. Roughed in generator.

Curently the scene is ~2000 polygons. After I'm done detailing the generator, I will unwrap the model and texture it.

http://www.cyborgkatana.com/images/arttestmythic03.jpg

[KevinKraeer]

Awesome architecture, man. Nice idea.

Looking forward to seeing this textured.

[dtrimble]

Nice work so far. You are missing the natural ellements from the drawing though, the trees and the waterfall, you may want to sacrafice some other detail to put that into it.

[Tumerboy]

[quote]1. Do not have to worry about the terrain the objects sit on or the trees and bushes.[/quote

[marc001]

Things changed:
1. Detailed generator.
2. Fixed diagonal pipe.
3. Welded main parts together.
4. Optimized meshes.

kgkraeer:
Thanks, I was planing on texturing things today, but only got around to detailing the generator, and a few optimizations.

dtrimble and Tumerboy:
Believe it or not everything here is still under the budget of 6000 polys. Currently it's ~2300 polys. As much as I would like to add the nature stuff (trees, and waterfall), it's in the requirments to leave it out. I imagine the trees to be seperate static meshes, if you are familiar with level editors like Unreal Ed. So things like trees and nature may be part of a seperate library.

I plan on unwrapping things next, and texture mapping. The budget for texture maps is 10 maps of 512*512, so I might have to squeeze multiple items together in the textures.


http://www.cyborgkatana.com/images/arttestmythic04.jpg

[Boxsmiley]

Hey Marc, i have a question about the 10 textures. It ties in with one of my questions about game development. Will you have to seperate the model everytime you want to add a differnt color map, or will you simple use multi-textures? I ask becasue i was under the impression that game engines sometimes don't support mulit-textures? If that is so, then in some instances seperating the mesh would be the only way to apply multiple color maps? Anyways i don't want this question to Hi-jack your thread, so maybe just a quick response is all i ask if you don't mind. By the way your model looks great! I can't believe it is only 2300! Can't wait to see it textured. Thanks in advance.

[Johny]

Mythic entrtainment ? isnt that where poopinmymouth is now ?

anyways , i like the model alot , thou the stairs could be fake textured, just my 2 cents, like in Zelda the ocarina of time for N64, it will spar ya loads of polies :)

anyways , good luck with it ;)

[marc001]

Things changed:
1. Some unwrapping.
2. Textured floor of foundation.

There a few layers of dirt in the textures. There's the shading from baking the lighting, water damage, a layer of custom dirt brushes (brown color), a stone texture, more handpainted dirt in the crevices, and moss.

For the moss I used a tiled grass texture, with a layer mask to constriain it to the gaps in between the tiles and another mask to break it up even further.

Will you have to seperate the model everytime you want to add a differnt color map, or will you simple use multi-textures?I just seperate the model into parts that are easier to texture. For example a floor or wall, can be mapped planer, and a character's arm or leg can be mapped with a cylinder. It's easier simplifying things before texturing them. After attaching seperately mapped objects they automatically become multi-subobject materials.

I ask becasue i was under the impression that game engines sometimes don't support mulit-textures? Depends on the exporter in question. Shockwave 3D for example allows multi-subobject materials, and so does Unreal.

Mythic entrtainment ? isnt that where poopinmymouth is now ? I checked the resume on his website, and it turns out he does work at Mythic.

the stairs could be fake textured, just my 2 cents, like in Zelda the ocarina of time for N64, it will spar ya loads of polies I thought about doing that earlier, but I had to try it with modeled stairs first. I had the poly counter up at the time, and after modeling the stairs, it hardly made a dent in the polygon budget.

http://www.cyborgkatana.com/images/arttestmythic07.jpg

Close up detail.
http://www.cyborgkatana.com/images/arttestmythic05.jpg

[the rookie]

Love the picture reference man, concept drawing too, and the model is really clean, you hit the nail on the head, keep up the good work, but I really love the picture reference, I know this may be off the subject, but where did you get the picture and how old is the structure and when did that particular structure get built, I never seen that one before and it seems society just built around it....amazing that building must have alot of history

[MK2]

@rookie do you talk about that roman building?

just copy the word "Pantheon" and "Rome" into google for more Information.

-> Built: 120-126 AD under Emperor Hadrian

[marc001]

Things changed:
1. Textured first level.

I've used 2 texture maps of 512*512 , leaving 8 maps left. The map used for the floor has some texture space left on it. For the pillars, and over hangs I'm using a brushed steel finish with recessed fasteners. For the recessed section I'm using a Roman wall sculpture color corrected to fit. In the arches I've placed windows. And more moss texture in the crevices of the building. Again there's more water damage, and custom dirt brush on top.

Love the picture reference man, concept drawing too, and the model is really clean, you hit the nail on the head, keep up the good work, but I really love the picture reference, I know this may be off the subject, but where did you get the picture The concept came with the art test.

and how old is the structure and when did that particular structure get built, I never seen that one before and it seems society just built around it....amazing that building must have alot of historyThe core parts of the buidling are ancient Roman, 120-126 AD. The outer parts, like the thick collumns, are built sometime in the distant future.


http://www.cyborgkatana.com/images/arttestmythic08.jpg

[kleinluka]

I like the mossy bits. nice touch... What are those....round... things that look like bullet holes though?

[Por@szek]

This looking excellent. Nice concept of reamking old building to more futuristic. I hope You will make all background in the same style, should be very mouthless :thumbsup: .I'll be watching on this thread.
Take care

[marc001]

Things changed:

1. Textured second floor.
2. Textured roof.

The difference between the second floor, roof, and the first floor is the Roman style collumns, and the roof tiles. There seems to a lot of red paint on ancient Roman ruins from what I've seen in photos. So far I've spent 4, 512*512 maps (floor, first floor, second floor, and roof) so I'm left with 6 maps.

I like the mossy bits. nice touch... What are those....round... things that look like bullet holes though?I have a book of Roman ruins with before and after pictures. There's plenty of plants, and grass growing on them. It just made sense to add the moss. The round things are large recessed fasteners. In this latest version I reduced the opacity to 80% to make it blend better with the surface.

This looking excellent. Nice concept of reamking old building to more futuristic. I hope You will make all background in the same style, should be very mouthless :thumbsup: .I'll be watching on this thread.
Take careIt's in the requirments to leave it out. I have more polygons to spend in the budget, but not enough in the texture budget. So I can't do a background for this one.


http://www.cyborgkatana.com/images/arttestmythic09.jpg

[Frank Dodd]

Excellent concept image and the model is very faithful to it too! The texture work is also technically very good but the scale of the textures make the building appear like a small villa where the concept image looks like some collosal Roman government building. To faithfully produce a representation of the concept I think the textures need to be reworked however the building works very well as it stands at the moment.

Great piece of work.

[sKullzao]

Man great job!!!

Im new on 3d and amazed what ppl can do with only 4 512x512 maps.

I love the concept, having a clean one, like that makes everything much easier.

thumbs up:thumbsup: :buttrock:

[RO]

The textures are nice for a toonish feel. To me the concept feels a lot more serious and dominating. What I see with the concept is polished concrete with steel and tech. I just do not see the feel your giving it.

[FreakyDude]

sorry dude, but to me it doesn't look like a roman building at all. Futuristic or not. The texture makes it look some some beefed up warehouse storehouse from the early 1900. The texture that separates the roof from the bulk makes it seem as is you have a very heavy roof resting on a very thin glass wall. That does not seem realistic. The big concrete texture with "bullet holes" makes the lower part look like an industrial complex. There's overall to much glass in it. Roman buildings originally had small windows, because of the way they build things(no true skeletal setup) and because of the climate there. On the second floor, there's lines going through the concrete where the arc is. Roman buildings would not have an arc "cut out" of something, they would have something build around the arc. The red outline doesn't match the sides with the green moss? off the roof either.

You said this is some kind of official building? Roman architecture has lots of ornaments, you know gods or people standing up with speres an shields and stuff. If you have some more polygons to spare, make some ornaments. Put some statues at the corners/top of the stairs
on top of the first bullethole concrete layer. Or even better, make the concrete wall an ornament wall. You could do this with texture or geometry.
I do like the textured pillars in the center piece. except the pillars would probably have been made from the same material so the color is a bit off.
If I seem to be the only one bringing it down, well sorry, but I suppose you placed it here for constructive critisism instead of OMG IN******* credible and such. You've got the skills and the building, just not the feel off the actual roman thing.
Just my 2 cents

[marc001]

Things changed:
1. Foundation textured
2. Towers textured
3. Added space ship panels to metal textures
4. Windows for 1st, 2nd, and 3rd floor are now 8' tall
5. Reduced recessed fasteners to 50% in size.

the scale of the textures make the building appear like a small villa where the concept image looks like some collosal Roman government building. I checked the windows against a 6' tall box, and corrected the scale to 8', so the windows should be correct in scale. Also the recessed fasteners are 50% smaller, but now they blend in with the space ship panels.

Im new on 3d and amazed what ppl can do with only 4 512x512 maps.

I love the concept, having a clean one, like that makes everything much easier.
There's actually plenty of tiled geometry and textures. As for the concept, I prefer something with more information like color, lighting, shading, etc. I seem to be paying the price for guessing at the way the architecture should look in terms of modeling and texturing.

The texture that separates the roof from the bulk makes it seem as is you have a very heavy roof resting on a very thin glass wall. That does not seem realistic. I agree, but it's in the concept design.

The big concrete texture with "bullet holes" makes the lower part look like an industrial complex. The pillar was not reading as metal in earlier versions. I added space ship panels, and reduced the "bullet holes to 50% in size.

There's overall to much glass in it. Roman buildings originally had small windows, because of the way they build things(no true skeletal setup) and because of the climate there.Agreed, but the glass windows are part of the concept design.

On the second floor, there's lines going through the concrete where the arc is. Roman buildings would not have an arc "cut out" of something, they would have something build around the arc. Added space ship paneling to the rounded arch corners. This surface also did not read as metal in earlier versions.

The red outline doesn't match the sides with the green moss? off the roof either.
It's a cheat. I had trouble getting both edges to line up.

You said this is some kind of official building? Roman architecture has lots of ornaments, you know gods or people standing up with speres an shields and stuff. If you have some more polygons to spare, make some ornaments. Put some statues at the corners/top of the stairs on top of the first bullethole concrete layer. It's not in the concept nor is there a texture space left for it.

Or even better, make the concrete wall an ornament wall. You could do this with texture or geometry.There's actually engraved sculpture in the darker walls.

I do like the textured pillars in the center piece. except the pillars would probably have been made from the same material so the color is a bit off.Done for contrast, and were not the same material to begin with.

http://www.cyborgkatana.com/images/arttestmythic10.jpg

[Miroku]

Hi. I think you're off to a nice start but I have a few criticisms

The large arched insets on the first floor of the building dont really read as windows in the concept art. I'd suggest going along with some of the previously mentioned ideas here and put in some ornamental texture work. This will show that you can paint some detailed artwork into your textures rather than just simulate natural materials.

The windows up on the loft section are too small relative to the long stretch of windows on the section beneath them. On the concept art there is a uniform size to both of those floors' windows.

This one is more of a personal preference but the spaceship tile texture is a bit dated. I would scrap it and make a tiling texture of some heavy looking metal sheets with rivets and dirt smears and stuff like that. Give them a nice shine to them so that they will contrast the stone material of the main building more. Right now the spaceship tile texture is too tonally similar to the concrete. If you add more variation in these textures the piece will look more exciting I think.

The texture on the smaller side of the roof, with the red outline is a problem. It doesnt fit with the other side of the building. My suggestion for getting around this while maximizing your limited texture space is the following: UV map it diagonally so that you can use the same texture thats on the long side of the building. Mirror it in the middle. It may be noticeable, but the way it is right now looks like you couldnt handle getting a uniform look around that section of the building. Or, simply get rid of that red outline. It doesnt fit.

I would take some liberty with the concept if you can. Remove some of the windows from the strip of glass that runs around the whle upper building. Like a previous poster said, it looks like the roof is too heavy for all that glass.

Hope that helps, and good luck with Mythic!

[FreakyDude]

It's not in the concept nor is there a texture space left for it.

There's actually engraved sculpture in the darker walls.

sorry, forgot there was concept art to follow, and that entails certain limitations.
I missed the engraved sculpture, maybe i should've looked better.
I think it's a fancy building nonetheless, well modeled, texturing going good too. Just not my idea of futuristic roman style.

[Schwinnz]

I would add keystones to your archs. Looks really good so far.

http://www.crystalinks.com/romanarch1.gif

[marc001]

Things changed:

1. Stairs textured.
2. Generator textured.

I rendered this view from the same angle as the camera in the concept drawing.

http://www.cyborgkatana.com/images/arttestmythic11.jpg

The large arched insets on the first floor of the building dont really read as windows in the concept art. I'd suggest going along with some of the previously mentioned ideas here and put in some ornamental texture work. This will show that you can paint some detailed artwork into your textures rather than just simulate natural materials.
I just realized that there needs to be doors to get into the buidling, and making it a wall sculpture will not work. I'll add some sliding doors here.

The windows up on the loft section are too small relative to the long stretch of windows on the section beneath them. On the concept art there is a uniform size to both of those floors' windows. I built the model with the concept art in the background, and had trouble getting the perspective to match correctly. It looked fine in the model at first, but needed fixing after I've tried the texturing. I will fix the window sizes to match the lower ones.

This one is more of a personal preference but the spaceship tile texture is a bit dated. I would scrap it and make a tiling texture of some heavy looking metal sheets with rivets and dirt smears and stuff like that. Give them a nice shine to them so that they will contrast the stone material of the main building more. Right now the spaceship tile texture is too tonally similar to the concrete. If you add more variation in these textures the piece will look more exciting I think.
I realized the sharp highlights and shading make something look metal. The textures for the generator look more metalic than the other metal objects. I think the panels could use some seperation, maybe a pillow emboss layer effect to give them seperation.

The texture on the smaller side of the roof, with the red outline is a problem. It doesnt fit with the other side of the building. My suggestion for getting around this while maximizing your limited texture space is the following: UV map it diagonally so that you can use the same texture thats on the long side of the building. Mirror it in the middle. It may be noticeable, but the way it is right now looks like you couldnt handle getting a uniform look around that section of the building. Or, simply get rid of that red outline. It doesnt fit.
If I remove the trim, the surface looks empty. I'll try camera mapping a new texture on top, and baking it into the origional texture. The texture sheets have many items on them so if rotated it diagonally other pieces in the texture will show instead.


I would add keystones to your archs. Looks really good so far.
I'll add the border stones to the arches on the first floor.

[marc001]

Just a heads up. I interviewed at Mythic Entertainment in Fairfax Virginia yesterday, and got the World Artist job.

I did three more things that I haven't posted, in addition to this art test. 3 512x512 map tiles of the floor, wall, and roof.

Thanks to everyone in this thread for the comments and critiques.

[Frank Dodd]

Congratulations on the excellent work you have done on this model, a faithful recreation of the model, that has a lot of style of its own separate from the concept drawings.

[marc001]

Bad news guys. The lead artist of the Imperator Team decided yesterday not to hire me. The last time I talked to him he wanted to move me over to Fairfax, Virginia, and wanted to negotiate salary. He said he hired someone else who was "a better fit" whatever that means.

[LeeSalo]

I've hears that one befor dude. keep practicing and keep on keeping on. no seriously, thats shity, best of luck in the future

[RO]

Bad news guys. The lead artist of the Imperator Team decided yesterday not to hire me. The last time I talked to him he wanted to move me over to Fairfax, Virginia, and wanted to negotiate salary. He said he hired someone else who was "a better fit" whatever that means.

I hate that "a better fit" deal that has happened to me before. They always take the easy way and never go into why. If I ever end up being in a position were I am hiring people I will explain why. Also having said he hired someone else when he sorta already said he would hire you is lame.

[marc001]

I've hears that one befor dude. keep practicing and keep on keeping on. no seriously, thats shity, best of luck in the future.

According to their art lead, I have a strong art test, and that my art isn't my weakness. I'm confused about being "a better fit". I just went to the interview, and behaved like my usual self. During my visit at Mythic, everyone there seemed fairly happy about my visit there.


I hate that "a better fit" deal that has happened to me before. They always take the easy way and never go into why. If I ever end up being in a position were I am hiring people I will explain why. Also having said he hired someone else when he sorta already said he would hire you is lame.

I checked your art test. It sounds like you've experience something similar. Have you had any success in getting work with art tests?

[AlecMoody]

I think better fit just means that they had someone of a simliar skill level that already knew one of the people at the company.

[Lee3dee]

The building looks great, but don't worry about the job, just think you have an art test to add to your portfolio :D I did an art test for a company and they said that I had strong artistic abilities but I needed more experience and they went with a better fit :(. No worries, because I found work later on using the art test that I created :D

[RO]

According to their art lead, I have a strong art test, and that my art isn't my weakness. I'm confused about being "a better fit". I just went to the interview, and behaved like my usual self. During my visit at Mythic, everyone there seemed fairly happy about my visit there.


I checked your art test. It sounds like you've experience something similar. Have you had any success in getting work with art tests?

To be honest the only way I have gotten work is knowing somebody in a company already. Art tests so far have been kind of useless for me. Not saying it is useless work to say the least because that NYC piece is a great portfolio piece anyhow and it is something I wanted to do but never had the real drive to start a smallish project like that.



The company I did this art test for is a new company. I have not heard back from them and atm. Since I am still in College and moving to SVA soon I am not available to take in studio jobs. So this company told me they would contact me if they needed level designers as contract employees off studio. I was told around 3 months or so from that whole project thing. Well it has passed. I am not worried because school is still my main worry and I know that it is tough for companies to have contract workers off site.



But yep all the jobs so far which has only been two if you do not count my old mods as jobs… Were because I had some kind of contact inside.



One thing... never ever sign a contract/doc stating that your art test can be used by the company only and such.

And yeah AlecMoody nailed it right in the head ;)

[Wintermute]

I hate that excuse, but sometimes it means exactly that

It's not always skill, education and talent that people look for when hiring someone. Your personality can have an effect as well.

My boss told me a while after hiring me (7-8 months later) that he hired me based on my skill, talent, (portfolio) and that he "had a feeling that I was the right guy for the job" when interviewing me.

I'm pretty sure there were other designers who applied with more experience than I. (graphic design jobs in the pacific northwest are few and far between) He had to defend his decision to hire me despite my lack of professional experience.

an animator at Ubisoft may or may not be a good fit at Bungie, and vice versa. You just need to interview people and know what you're looking for.

At the very least, you can probably get a decent recommendation on your art test, and you have a nice new piece for your portfolio. You'll get your job, keep at it and don't give up. You will eventually be the "better fit" somewhere (damn near everyone happily ignored me for about 2 years after school)

Good luck!
cheers! :beer:

[DevilHacker]

Hey marc,
I personally think that your work is very good… and I would not worry about the job too much, as it’s not your work that needs improvement…

What makes me think it’s not your work? Well, I guess before you go fired, Mythic Entertainment liked your work so much that they sent it to the press, with other pictures/sketches of work for the “Roman Futuristic Online Game” called “IMPERATOR” your sketches (Unfortunately not the finished model) were picked up by “IGN”, “Gamespy”, and many other Game Networks…

Did Mythic Entertainment see the finished model, or just the sketch?

I hope that this brightens your day. And I wish you luck on all future projects!
Click here (http://media.pc.ign.com/media/483/483577/imgs_1.html) to see your sketch on IGN! :thumbsup:
-Good Job; and Good Luck, DevilHacker

[Kevin Albers]

The test was to make a model based on the sketch that an artist at Mythic did. They didn't steal a concept sketch from him and put it into their promotional materials...

And of course, Mythic didn't fire him. They didn't hire him, so they couldn't have fired him.

[poboyross]

Well my fellow "reject" (I use it in joking terms only :D ) don't beat yourself up too much in the coming days or weeks. I'm oh so familiar with similar terms to "better fit". I was guaranteed a job in LA at a studio that shall remain nameless if I could guarantee I would be there in a week. I accepted, and the owner (who recruited me) told me he would get back with me in two days after he worked out some other issues. I packed up my ENTIRE HOUSE and two days later he called me at 10pm (call was supposed to be by lunch) to tell me he had given the job to some kid who was already in the area and he was "sorry". I got a whole speech about how America is this great place of opportunity....blah blah blah....he made his own way coming into this country...blah blah blah. Point is after that needlessly long story is that it's happened to quite a few of us and I for one have felt your pain and agree with everyone else....KEEP GOING! Sometimes it really sucks because you finished this thing that you poured 2 weeks of your life into and now they possibly have this piece of work for free to use and then give the job to their best bud...hey, it happens all the time. Maybe you should look at it as they weren't a fit for you. I don't know anything about that company, but if what you said is fundamentally true about getting promised a job then screwed...you might not want to work for them anyhow. Your game modeling is far better than mine....again......KEEP GOING!

[francisvega]

IMPRESIVE!! the uv mapping is so clean :). can you post some uv layouts? :)

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