eyeballz

[dobermunk]

Okay, one step closer. Could make uvs.
Very neat.

[ThomasHelzle]

Hi David,

from your text I am unsure if you already have used AoN:Wood with success or if it was a question. You can do some freaky things with it so you should be okay with that route. Could you clarify that?

The second one looks rather scary :)

Cheers,

[dobermunk]

I'm sure I can get great Iris effects with it, the question is how to lay it out in a radial projection? Have I missed that option?
I want the grainy filaments to go out from the center .

[ThomasHelzle]

Ah, okay. No - that isn't possible by default. you will have to be a bit more creative. You can for instance use the direction output of the wood on a gradient with fine color bands and mix that with a noise where you use the direction as S and distance as T input. I haven't tried it yet - look if you get it working, otherwise I will try it here.

Good luck!

Cheers,

[chikega]

I've only played with Taron's Eyeballs a little - he told me to stop and that I was scratching his sclera. :) Looks like you're getting a handle on it though. Amazing amount of depth and refraction built into that shader.

[dobermunk]

Very cool stuff. Hope to post some presets at zoogono soon: like goat and realistic. Others like zombie and deseased just come as extras while trying to funz this thing ;-)

Thomas: "output of the wood on a gradient with fine color bands and mix that with a noise where you use the direction as S and distance as T input"
C'mon, you know who you're speaking with here! I'm taking baby steps here. Baby.

What sort of node would "mix" be? I've gotten displacement by plugging the wood shader into a procedural and that into the dolleye shader, but I don't think that's what you're talking about.

[ThomasHelzle]

Hahahah - ok, it may have been a bit fast... I always have that problem... LOL

http://www.screendream.de/stuff/Iris_Texture_01.jpg

Forget about the gradient and the mix for now and lets look at the basic structure.
The AoN:Wood shader delivers Radius and Direction information as values from 0-1 (!Radius goes above 1 if the object is larger! :) )
Now for a radial noise (or whatever - you can use this technique with every shader who has S/T or U/V inputs) you use those two outputs as quasi-UV coordinates. Internally messiah handles this as ST so keep in mind that these are just random letters without any meaning to real humans.
I can't repeat often enough that "UV coordinates" are just gradients from 0-1 in whatever direction you choose, so you can feed in there whatever fits you.
Now I just inserted Radius and Direction into the s and t inputs of my AoN:Noise shader. In the shaders interface I did the following:

http://www.screendream.de/stuff/Iris_Example_02.gif

The important things are activating the ST - coordinates input with the button at the bottom and then rotating pitch 90 degrees so the axis points towards the viewer (normally, the wood axis points upwards, like in the woods :) ) and finally play with the "X Size" and "Y Size" (Deactivate "One Size for all Axes" for that) and choose Color A and Color B to your taste or feed the value output in a gradient or ........... :) Ahem... you get the picture...

Does this work for you?

Cheers!

[dobermunk]

Sorry to do this to you but - still not there :-(

Hands-on: I followed your steps and everything works fine except the "rotate90degrees". As the image shows, unrotated, the effect is exactly as you describe, but rotated it just looks wrong. After playing with this a while I realized that Its getting a circular pattern to the 90 degree side, so I thought I might resolve it by switching the s and t inpuits. But, no luck.
I also tried -90 and other settings. How did you get yours rotated?

Theory: The wood procedural generates a pattern of 0 to 1 grey values. This defines radius and direction of the noise shader. Assuming the radius is in rads (for the o to 1 value) how does this translate to your star pattern? Or is this wrong?

[ThomasHelzle]

Ah - shit - you rotate the wood, not the noise, sorry for that - too fast again LOL

Regarding the Theory: You made it a bit too complicated :) Plug the Radius and the Direction outputs into a color input of your base material to directly see what comes out - simple Gradients.
Since we use it for S/T mapping, we don't deal with any rotation stuff (so radians are no concern) but directly with values from 0-1.
If you look at the classical UV-Editor view in LW you have V going in X direction and U in Y direction, both basically from 0 to 1. Now imagine the Radius going in one of those directions and Direction in the other (with noise it doesn't matter anyway).

Maybe try replacing the noise with a checkerboard to get a better feeling for it:

http://www.screendream.de/stuff/Iris_Example_03.gif

With this knowledge, you can do superfreaky mapping with almost everything :)

Cheers!

[SergO]

I think I managed to do what you want by accidentally typing unintendent numbers into AoN Noise size parameters :D

Texture Map is set to Spherical Z projection and feeding S & T into AoN_Noise

Aon_Noise Size:
X 0.01
Y 1.0
Z 0.1

Then another AoN_Noise plugs into the main noise's offset to disturb the texture.

works marvelously here :)

Cheers

Serg

[ThomasHelzle]

Yes, spherical projection is another way of doing it. But this is much to mainstream for me LOL

No, seriously, I think that to grok the simplicity of UV/ST mapping theory helps a lot with messiah and makes you completely independent of the classical mapping stuff if needed...

Cheers!

[dobermunk]

Well, I'm learning that's the main thing.
Here's the eye with the distorted wood applied to the iris:
The bump has to (it seems) plug into the color of the dolleyes shader.
Any ideas How I can get the brilliance of color back in there?

I'vb eincluded the material (zipped because it wouldn't upload otherwise).

[SergO]

Oh... cant use radiosity with eyeshader... the shader has is it's own illumination shader, and its immune to radiosity... since the output is Radiance the shading darkens whatever you plug it into, you can have radiosity or you can have the eye shader, never both. :(

Serg

[Taron333]

Yoh....(ashamed)...my bad! Coming up in a few days, no worries! I was planning to have the eyeshader have it's own complete illumination not only including radiosity but a very sophisticated internal scattering for highly realistic results....just that I didn't finish it all, yet. I will add the normal radiosity to it right now. In case you want to get results right now even without the update, just add a basic shader to the eyeballs and add the radiosity output on top of the shading! Works great!....well...you should make a seperate merge module in this case and multiply the final radiance of the DollEyes with the radosity output of the Basicshader and then add that result to your radiance input of your master node, where you usually hook the DollEyes to!

But no worries...it'll be there in a flash! :)

Taron

[SergO]

Cool Taron! and great tip, totaly forgot about the radiosity output of basic shader :)

btw, since were on the subject... ;) dunno about the new Basic Shader, but currently its radiosity isnt sensitive to the GI Intensity control in render settings, it has no effect on it at all.

is it possible to put an output that would make it easy to add the lens bulge (conjunctiva?) as displacement? Maybe that would need a rework of your lens refraction algorithm to compensate, dunno :)

thanks

Serg

[dobermunk]

It would be cool if you could more easily apply textures to the itis and the eye-whites.
Right now, I'm stuck at getting cool detail at the expense of the brilliant color. THe dollshader is so cool, but everything seems to feed into the color.
I would intuitely look for an iris color, bumb, eyewhite color bump, specular etc.

David

[Taron333]

The color input at the DollEyes themselves is actually only for the Iris. The DollEyes also output a mask, if you use that mask as an alpha so to say by feeding it into the opacity of any other shader, including for instance the BasicShader, you can then put the results of that shader and the DollEyes together at the radiance of the main node.

Again, similar to the way I described before with the radiosity, this way you can add translucency or anything else from the basicShader to the eyes. If you now make a color texture to go into the basicShader, it will work just fine.

My tip goes, observe the outputs of any node and even try around with it a little. It's very entertaining. Once you've really unterstood what they do, or vaguely enough to think of something concret, go ahead and try something specific. If an output really doesn't give you what you need or you feel like it was mislabeled, please, let us know. Shadernumbers are growing and with each shader the amount of output names are growing, hahaha, and it may just happen that one slips logic by accident....good new is only, this one probably wouldn't be very important, because I really try a lot of things and put it to real use right away. So it's rather unlikely that one slips me....(pardon)

[Taron333]

Man...it's been a long time since the first DollEyes, so I just remembered how I had it layed out...excuse me for that! You will not need a separate input for the sclera colors...the material colors are the sclera, that way I saved a bit of effort for myself and the users...

Look at this shaderflow...the color for the sclera just goes directly into material color, but the bump map gets the DollEyes mask multiplied to cancel it out over the iris!

BTW, I added radiosity to it directly and optimized the implementation of reflections.
You're looking at DollEyesV1.2...

http://www.projectmessiah.com/x2/images/DollEyes_flow.jpg

[SergO]

Cool!

How do you apply a bump map to the iris itself, without affecting the lens? It would be really helpfull for giving the iris a more realistic fiber look.

Thanks!

Serg

[dobermunk]

Here's a quick play session - "AlienGuppy"
the procedural noise for the iris is appied to the dolleyes' depth factor.

SergO - check the material I posted earlier. Not as refined as it could be, but with the new Dolleyes, the color/bump works better. All I did was add to Taron's original settings. I also took time to accept there not being an "iris color / iris bump" option, but I'm starting to see how this works.

[Taron333]

But there is!?! What are you talking about?! Only that it's a little wicked. The color input at the DollEyes itself not only gives color to the iris but also bump at the same time....it sorta makes sense when you play with it a little bit....you can modify the bump by adjusting the alpha of the colorpicker......which also blends between the input color and the picked color....eh....eh....I know, it's a little wicked...hmmm.....but works really well actually.

Make sure you scale the texture for the color input correctly, I have that section a little sloppy, because it's all virtual space. Sounds wicked, but I define the spacial dimension on a hybrit between a center based and normal based definition...sounds like total bullshit, hahaha, but it's sort of what it is. That way it is possible to have such eyes independent from geometry itself...kind of....you won't need a ball to get an eye. I think I will need to really prepare some more demo scenes....it will come!

[dobermunk]

> But there is!?! What are you talking about?!<

Hehe... that's what I meant. I'm starting to dig it, just that when you come from LW and have a layer for this and a direct panel for the channels "bump / color / sp[ec" etc, it takes a bit of time to understand the options here.
But its very powerful!
And please - more samples!!!

(not to distract you from the displacement revolution ;-)

[ThomasHelzle]

So repeat after me: "An example each day takes all trouble away" LOL

Taron, just stuff us with sample scenes until we can't talk anymore. :bounce:

Cheers!

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