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funkyrayuk
11-24-2004, 12:43 PM
i'm trying to improve my skills so I thought I'd start this thread on a new character I'm working on and hopefully with your crits, opinions and tips I can make this my best one yet.

so here goes....

I'm making an sas soldier complete with gas mask, beretta, mp5 and ammo.
Poly target is gonna be in the region of 5000-7000 polys, I haven't decided yet. Does anyone know what's the typical poly count for game systems today? I know it can vary a lot but i gather it's around my poly target.
2 texture maps, 1 for the body and 1 for the weapons.

here's the concepts:

http://img110.exs.cx/img110/9687/sas_concept.jpg

http://img10.exs.cx/img10/3284/sas_concept_blueprints.jpg

funkyrayuk
11-24-2004, 12:50 PM
and here's my progress so far....


http://img122.exs.cx/img122/3312/sas_progress01.jpg
3600 polys

Jimmy_Dublo
11-24-2004, 01:33 PM
Coming along well so far. However, his legs are WAY too short.

funkyrayuk
11-24-2004, 01:58 PM
yeh i noticed, that seems to be a big problem with me. i've corrected it now and done a bit more.

http://img95.exs.cx/img95/9113/sas_progress02.jpg

DeathTrip
11-24-2004, 06:32 PM
They still look short compared to the upper body. Look at this ref pic...

http://www.onnovanbraam.com/blueprint.php?nr=3342


and have way too many polys on the arms.


keep at it :thumbsup:

funkyrayuk
11-25-2004, 12:15 AM
i'll lengthen the legs a bit more.
with the arms, i had them high poly cos i was trying to get a wrinkled sleeves effect going but i suppose i don't need quite so many to achieve that, the texture map can give that effect anyway!

TimAppleby
11-25-2004, 12:21 AM
yes I agree, proportions overall are a big issue.
You had the right idea to use reference images to help you flesh out the model however since the proportions of the character on the reference images are flawed they have been inherited by your mesh.
I'd recomend studying human anatomny strongly (if you have intentions of working with 3d, which most peopl ewho post on these type of forums do), gather lots of references pictures from Google and good websites and constantly check them for reference as you are working on your mesh.
Its a good idea to sketch you concept ideas on top of photos if you are unsure of proportions, to ensure you are on track with things. However I am sure if you search you will find a vast number of pics of Sas troops, enabling you to not only model their equipment/kit but also texture it authentically.
Also you might want to start thinking about sense of mass - if you look at the profile ref pic you sketched the character is leaning backwards - so his center of mass is off balance, try to keep the characters weight distributed evenly

Hope this stuff helps.
The average console character polycount is around 3k - 5k.

funkyrayuk
11-25-2004, 05:39 PM
i've been working on the weapons today, here they are....



http://img84.exs.cx/img84/8198/weapons1.jpg

funkyrayuk
11-25-2004, 06:14 PM
thanks for the tips tim, i've corrected his posture so the centre of mass is correct and tweaked the legs a bit more, i'm much happier with the results, thanks again.
here's an update.. weighing in at 5374 at present (with weapons), i'm gonna aim for a poly count of 6000. just the holster, some clips of ammo for the handgun left to model. i'll try and finish them off tonite.

http://img77.exs.cx/img77/8419/sas_progress03.jpg

funkyrayuk
11-26-2004, 11:37 AM
here's the orthographics... he's now 5902 polys. i've finished modelling, i'll make a start on uv mapping.

http://img39.exs.cx/img39/6268/sas_progress04.jpg

funkyrayuk
11-30-2004, 11:06 PM
i've started texturing the mask, i would say that this is my weakest area so any tips and c&c would be really helpful.
let me know what you think

http://img68.exs.cx/img68/8854/sas_progress05.jpg

BiTMAP
12-02-2004, 04:29 AM
ah... a neat stylistic look to everything... kinda almost "worms armageddon" ... but not as far. should work out grand.

funkyrayuk
12-03-2004, 01:49 PM
a quick update!

http://img110.exs.cx/img110/584/sas_progress06.jpg
hey I just noticed I've gone past 100 posts, woo hoo! :bounce:

NeptuneImaging
12-03-2004, 05:43 PM
Are you going to use real time lighting to light him? If you are, I would do away with painting the specular on the gas mask and use specular mapping...

BTW, cool character...

funkyrayuk
12-03-2004, 08:18 PM
i haven't done a specular map yet haloanimator it's just the diffuse. When you say real time lighting, what do you mean, does it mean in game lighting? i have some big gaps in my 3d terminology because i've self taught myself.

thanks halo, here's another update

http://img47.exs.cx/img47/6921/sas_progress07.jpg

TIMTHESORCERER
12-04-2004, 08:04 PM
the mp5 is just plain wrong, redoo it with good blueprints

nononowhatisyourname!?
12-04-2004, 09:45 PM
actually the mp5 isnt totally wrong. That is the mp5k.

I could tell what it was when i looked at it.

aeres
12-05-2004, 04:13 AM
The waist is rather thin compared to his broad shoulders. Also the elbow could some more polys or it might not deform well.

Nice texturing work by the way :) coming along nicely.

funkyrayuk
12-06-2004, 01:23 AM
yeah, it's an mp5k-pdw

aeres: i'll do a test rig to check the deformation of the elbow

I won't be able to do much work over the next couple of days cos I'm going to London for the CGI festival, anyone else going?

Tronno
12-06-2004, 02:53 AM
I agree with Tim - the MP5K is definetly off. Check this pic (http://www.army.lt/guns/gallery/H26.jpg). Look for some better references. Even if you want to stay really low-poly, you can do better than what you have now.

Crits on the soldier: like Appleby said, his his gear doesn't really look authentic and his proportions are off. To begin with, his waist is too narrow at the bottom of the flak jacket. His shoulders are too wide, and so are his hips. Check a couple of anatomy references, move a vew vertices around and these issues will be gone.

About the gear: the fold around the knees looks pinched and unnatural. Check this pic (http://www.specwargear.com/RAID%20pant/DSCN0369.JPG) for a better idea of what army pants should look like. The boots look cartoonish - use this (http://www.outinstyle.com/Merchant2/graphics/00000001/4157.jpg) as reference. The helmet is too small, and you've also got a strange, angular bulge at the top of the forehead there (helmet reference (http://www.alpineco.com/a_bh1.jpg)). Your hip holster and ammo pouches look unrealistic - Blackhawk Industries (http://www.blackhawkindustries.com/product_detail.asp?product_id=2550&d=) can be a good reference for this sort of equipment.

Also, just in case my post seems full of cruel, pointless nitpicks and random reference image links, I just want to say that when left alone these things really add up and can make any model feel "wrong". This deserves to be said again: don't model from memory, use lots of references instead.

Anyway, I hope that helped. :shrug:

funkyrayuk
12-08-2004, 02:42 PM
ok, i've made quite a lot of small alterations to the body and I agree that they look better, especially the boots. here's an update

http://img76.exs.cx/img76/4886/sasprogress093mt.jpg
now with the mp5, I don't know what you mean by it looking wrong, here's a link to the reference i've been using, http://rds.yahoo.com/S=96062883/K=mp5+pdw/v=2/SID=e/l=IVR/SIG=123olp7e4/*-http%3A//www.jungletoy.com/jtinfosite/electric/MP5PDW/MP5PDW.htm and
http://noxnoctis.tripod.com/gunpic/smgs/MP5KA4-PDW.jpg
the only thing i can see is the front of the gun needs more detail so i've changed that and tweaked it a bit more, it's got 100 extra polys now but i can afford that.

http://img51.exs.cx/img51/9462/sas_progress08.jpg

funkyrayuk
12-09-2004, 06:03 PM
does anyone know of a good gun texturing tutorial, i haven't textured a gun before.

funkyrayuk
12-10-2004, 01:13 PM
c&c??:hmm:


http://img85.exs.cx/img85/5289/sas_progress10.jpg

funkyrayuk
12-13-2004, 05:23 PM
anyone got any comments or crits?

RampanT
12-13-2004, 07:38 PM
Tronno made a lot of good suggestions, and I'm not sure you've really worked on what he was pointing out. If you have, then I'd probably say not enough.

Here's what i see wrong with the model:
The proportions are wrong. They were wrong on the first post, this was highlighted, and they are still wrong. The legs are still too short imo. It's not as bad as it was, but i think it's still off. The helmet/head may also be slightly too big. Get some reference images of the human anatomy, and make sure the proportions get fixed. I had a look at your site, and all your models have a similar problem.

The mesh structure is not too bad. But i wouldn't be trying to describe the folds in the fabric with the mesh, the way you are doing on the forearm. You could remove 2 of those edge loops and paint folds on the texture.

The texture is almost monochromatic. It looks like its entirely done in greyscale, with the exception of the helmet, which looks greyscale with a blue overlay, making it look totally out of place. Even though the camo outfit is essentially made up of grey variants, you still have to inject elements of colour into it, to bring it to life. Otherwise it just looks very bland.

The painting of the folds on the trousers just doesn't look right. It's almost working in places, but doesn't quite make it. The long highlight down the front of the shin needs to be broken up. Try maybe doing smaller folds, thinking about how the fabric would react to the underlying body. Where it would fold, where it would pinch, where it would sag etc. The best way to do this is by looking at multiple reference images of the legs in different poses/positions, seeing how the fabric reacts, and painting a balanced interpretation of that which will look good no matter what the pose of your model.

The boots need much more work. Tronno posted an excellent boot reference image. But your paint job needs much more than what you've altered.

My knowledge on the design of firearms is fairly limited, so i don't know how close your interpretation of that is.

Overall, its not that bad. But it could do with a lot more work i think. This could definately go from being a decent model, to a really good one with a bit tweaking and re-doing.

Hope this helps you out. Good luck with it, i'm sure you can crank it up.

funkyrayuk
12-14-2004, 02:41 PM
thanks for taking the time to write all that rampant.
i'll try and make all those changes, unfortunately my painting skill is practically non existent but hopefully with some more practice it'll improve.

funkyrayuk
12-20-2004, 05:59 PM
UPDATE! changed the texture on the boot, lengthened his legs, altered the colours slightly and removed the unsightly fold on the trousers, whatdoyathink?http://img56.exs.cx/img56/8002/sas_progress11.jpg

EVIL
12-20-2004, 10:41 PM
Textures look good, modeling is your weakest area. I strongly suggest taking a look into human anatomy and proportions, and use refrence sheets when modeling.

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