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View Full Version : Apple wins an Emmy


Array
08-20-2002, 05:26 PM
http://news.com.com/2100-1040-954457.html?tag=fd_top

I should probably keep my mouth closed, but why arent companies like Alias|Wavefront, Newtek, Discreet, Avid, and Softimage winning awards like these? Those are the real innovators....not some money grubbing CEO.

flipnap
08-20-2002, 08:31 PM
someones fishing around here............

beaker
08-20-2002, 09:22 PM
>>Those are the real innovators....not some money grubbing CEO.

Final Cut Pro is a pretty damn cool editor. Alot of studios here in LA are moving to FCP. Instead of buying new 60k avid media composer seats they are replacing them with FCP seats. Also each new version just blows away the older version. Avid is the perfect example of what happends when you have little or no competition. They just sit on technology and barely innovate. It took Apple comming around for them to finally see the light. Avid's products are actually getting better now rather than standing still because of Apple.

Too bad they haven't had much effect on Adobe, because Premiere still sucks ass.(havent tried out 6.5 yet)

Array
08-20-2002, 10:46 PM
Beaker: I stand corrected :beer:

Flipnap: Fishing for what? :)

Cman
08-21-2002, 01:13 AM
I think Premiere still sucks ass. If you're thinking of buying it, I'd stongly suggest you take a serious look at Vegas Video 3 (http://www.sonicfoundry.com/PRODUCTS/NewShowProduct.asp?PID=612).
As for FCP, didn't Apple buy FCP from another company and slap their logo on it?
That's like giving Apple an award for technical achievement for Shake or Rayz...

I agree Avid was stagnant until FCP showed up, but the few times I've used FCP I've not noticed anything groundbreaking. Other than it being so inexpensive and the color correction. :)

Chris
08-21-2002, 01:32 AM
I think Apple bought FCP originally from Macromedia? I love FCP, its a fantastic editing proggie - Vegas Video 3 on PC is fantastic too, both are great value for money! :)

beaker
08-21-2002, 01:54 AM
>>As for FCP, didn't Apple buy FCP from another company and slap their logo on it?

Not really but sorta. Macromedia was developing it for about a year and a half and then decided they didn't want it anymore so they sold it to Apple. Apple developed it for another 3 years before it was released. Apple = 6 years dev, Macromedia =1.5. The head of the FCP team is a guy named Randy Ubillos. He had left Adobe(one of the programmers for premiere) to develop FCP at Macromedia and then moved to Apple when they bought it up. He is still head of the FCP team at Apple.

>>but the few times I've used FCP I've not noticed anything groundbreaking. Other than it being so inexpensive and the color correction.

The big thing is the price. You get alot of tools that were previously only avaliable in products in the 60k range(media composer, 80k DS). Alot of the realtime fx added in 3.0 were previously only available with a special hardware add on card for premiere or avid xpress for an additional 3k+ otherwise you had to render everything to see it. As you said the very nice color corection tools, again only avaliable in media composer or DS. Media Manager, Waveform, Vectorscope, EDL, OMF, again, not in this price range before (not even the 10-15k Avid Xpress had many of these).

Now of course Avid Xpress DV 3.5 just added alot of these realtime fx and color corrector derived from DS. They wouldn't have done it otherwise if FCP wasn't around.

Afterfx like tools and fx added into the editor is very nice too and being able to use all afterfx plugins. Scripting abilities in an editor for automating common tasks(only 3d apps and compositing apps like shake and rayz had previously had.) A very smart UI on top of all this.

Cman
08-21-2002, 04:08 AM
Originally posted by beaker
>>As for FCP, didn't Apple buy FCP from another company and slap their logo on it?

Not really but sorta. Macromedia was developing it for about a year and a half and then decided they didn't want it anymore so they sold it to Apple. Apple developed it for another 3 years before it was released. Apple = 6 years dev, Macromedia =1.5. The head of the FCP team is a guy named Randy Ubillos. He had left Adobe(one of the programmers for premiere) to develop FCP at Macromedia and then moved to Apple when they bought it up. He is still head of the FCP team at Apple.


Ahhh...well I'm completely wrong in my opinion. I did not know they had it for so long. Kudos to Apple. :)


The big thing is the price. You get alot of tools that were previously only avaliable in products in the 60k range(media composer, 80k DS). Alot of the realtime fx added in 3.0 were previously only available with a special hardware add on card for premiere or avid xpress for an additional 3k+ otherwise you had to render everything to see it. As you said the very nice color corection tools, again only avaliable in media composer or DS. Media Manager, Waveform, Vectorscope, EDL, OMF, again, not in this price range before (not even the 10-15k Avid Xpress had many of these).

Now of course Avid Xpress DV 3.5 just added alot of these realtime fx and color corrector derived from DS. They wouldn't have done it otherwise if FCP wasn't around.


Yeah. I actually laughed out loud when I first heard about Avid putting CC in DV. Now they gotta put it in MediaComposer, a much more expensive system that doesn't even have it. LOL



Afterfx like tools and fx added into the editor is very nice too and being able to use all afterfx plugins. Scripting abilities in an editor for automating common tasks(only 3d apps and compositing apps like shake and rayz had previously had.) A very smart UI on top of all this.

AFX plugins are available to FCP! I guess I need to dig a little deeper into that program. Scripting! Uh oh. I'm glad I posted here to learn this great info. I don't think the guy whose FCP I used even knows about this stuff. At least he never told me about it.
Thanks for the knowledge!!

studiomiguel
08-21-2002, 05:05 AM
Apple innovates... that's why they get emmys.

Whether they do it from scratch or not is the nature of free enterprise. I happen to really like Apple and what they have done for the graphics community.

I don't really care who does this stuff as long as SOMEONE does it. The Avid example was a good one.

paccollective
08-21-2002, 08:43 PM
<Final Cut Pro is a pretty damn cool editor. Alot of studios here in LA are moving to FCP. Instead of buying new 60k avid media composer seats they are replacing them with FCP seats.

This is also true for New York, I would venture to say it is one of the fastest up and coming apps in the video and film industry. Everyone seems to be using it either to supplement seats (as mentioned above) or for new independent studios (NYC has a lot of them) as the primary editor.

-bb

beaker
08-21-2002, 10:45 PM
Another funny thing people at the fcp users group told us they are doing is buying a new FCP station which runs around 10-20k depending on if its uncompressed or not. Then just renting out their media composer station. Since avid is still an industry standard name, they can still rent it out for $200-250 an hour. I know alot of people that still rent out old 10 year old avid media composers that are running on pre-powerpc boxes or first gen powerpc boxes.

In the long run I wonder which actually makes you more money. Even when a 60k avid has paid for itself 20x many are still being used 10 years later. Or a FCP station that you can easily afford to update every 2 years because it was 1/4th the cost.

FloydBishop
08-22-2002, 05:37 AM
Apple came out with Final Cut Pro in response to Avid announcing a few years back that they weren't going to support the Mac platform. I'm not sure when exactly this all went down, I think it was around June of '98? I just remember being at my old job at Lucent Technologies and hearing the AV guy bitching about it. They had a ton of money sunk into the set-up they had.

I don't really know what ever happened with it all, as I am not an editor, but I believe they did switch over to Final Cut Pro. (Then the bottom fell out of Lucent Technologies' Microelectronics Group)

Avid's dumping of the Mac, or the rumor that they were going to, was what prompted Apple to get going with Final Cut Pro.

The moral of the story: don't tempt people to do a better job than you by being lazy or resting on your past accomplishments, because they just might beat you at your own game.:shame:

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