_Edge loops/head modelling..Again

[LucentDreams]

Hey Phobos,I will be working on a new head tutorials in November, but you could have a look at my old one, it is the closest you'll get to intersectin splines, I still prefer box modeling, which can be done in any map, I don't think the ol' spline method is good unless trying to be a physically accurate to a photo as possible, but even then I think Boxmodeling does a great jobin the right hands. The key with all modelingn is block out the main shape and then work in your details, thats why starting with a cube is so great, in like five steps or so you can have the human heads basic shape :)

1: create editable cube
2:Subdivide 1 ( using hypernurb setting of in the subdivide dialog, NOT HYPERNURB OBJECT)
3:select the points one one lower side n the shape of a "V" pull them down on the "Y" axis
4:Select the center point of the bottom four polygons and use Ardn'ts edge bevel plugin to creat a diamond shape
5: select the newly created polygons and extrude then down the "Y" axis for the neck.

There you go the most basic Human form in Five (sorta squeezed into 5) steps :)

[phobos]

First mistake that I have done when trying to use box modelling was that I was using a hyper nurbs oject. Hyper nurbs subdivision is hygely superior for what we are trying.
Can you provide some snapshots with your 5 step method to understand exactly what you are doing?It seems good.
Can I see your model?What are you doing with edge loops?Create them after you get the basic mesh?
Sorry for the so many questions but it's because I want to know the correct way to model.
I think the biggest mistake with my way is that I was starting with so many points.I was building first the eye.I was done with the eye modelling then went to the other parts.So think about 12 point a row multipled by 6 or 7 rows for the cheek and you will see that I was having so many points.I just couldn't control them.
I should try and get the basic form first and then do the subdivisins.But what scares me is that I don't really know how to do good subdivisions.I use arndt's knife tools which is great.But if I do a sknifing of not the whole row of polygons I get a polygon with one triangle which I don't know how to get rid of.
And the funny part is that my first model was much better....
Here are the results.

http://users.otenet.gr/~jim08088/newmodel.jpg

http://users.otenet.gr/~jim08088/newmodelwire.jpg

And this is my first "finished" model

http://users.otenet.gr/~jim08088/improvedheadfront.jpg

[LucentDreams]

Okay I am waaaay to nice for my own health and goodness, waaay too nice, Right hereright now I unfortunately have to say for my own sanity and film's sake I must avoid the forums for at least the next week :/ sorry guys, but I love to help and its hurtin me.

Anyways, I forgot to post the links to my headmodeling tutorial, do note I don't model like this anymore, but it was very effective, and with the new stitch and sew plugins that came out after it I must say its would be pretty easy and a lot faster than when I wrote the tut.

the C4D file (http://www.cgi.third-era.com/~kaiskai/patchfacefile.zip)
the tutorial (http://www.cgi.third-era.com/~kaiskai/patchfacetut.zip)

and heres is a visual tut I just whipped out for the five sorta steps basic head, I use this a lot when modeling characters.
http://www.cgi.third-era.com/~kaiskai/thehead.jpg

[phobos]

Thank you very much kaiskai !!!!!!
Your 5step pic is INCREDIBLY helpful !!!!
I get the basic form in so little time and then start to concentrate on the real deal. Thank you very much.You are great.
Sorry for asking so many questions but I want to learn as best as I can
Thanks again

[phobos]

I did the basic head form and then I tried to do 1 horizontal knife cut for the eye and one vertical for the nose.But I get a lot of triangles on the bottom of the head.
I think that if you tell me this one more thing i'll be able to proceed on my own.Just where to do the cuts.
Ha! I know you are not obligated to answer my question but if you do I would be grateful!!!! :bounce:

That's what I did to avoid the traingles at the bottom.Is it o.k?
http://users.otenet.gr/~jim08088/untri.jpg

[ThirdEye]

n-gons would be the answer, but we haven't 'em so try using cutter plug-in instead of standard knife, it's really useful :thumbsup:

[Grey]

Thirdeye, Knife plugin?

I'm frantically looking thru plugincafe but don't see it...

[Erik Heyninck]

http://www.vonkoenigsmarck.de/Seiten/StartE.html
click on C4D-PlugIns and at the bottom of the page you will find Cutter.
(the other plug-ins are extremely useful too!)

[LucentDreams]

hmm, first of all, I am adding this little head image to the tips and tricks thread. as for the tris, don't worry about them yet, leave the tri's in for a while, you'll find later on you'll have to add detail somewhere else and this may coinside as to how to get rid of the tri's, also don't let your quads get too distorted as that is almost as bad sometimes worse than having tri's.

Basically when I am modeling, I leave newly formed tri's if I can and then optimise them near then end, when I know where I can add extra geometry. if possible try to hav cuts go all the way around so no tri's are made, remember this is a method of adding when you need to, but often people become to scared to add more geometry, look at Martin or aby's lowres meshes, the heads and hands tend to have quite a lot of poly's, don't bee too scared to add extra geometry, its all about preserving the shape when you add the geometry though.

[LucentDreams]

just thought I'd add that to start adding geometry for the eyes and mouth I would use extrude inner rather than cutting, this way your already creating basic edge loops.

Oh and don't get me wrong its not that I don't want you guys askin questions, I am just saying that i need to get away fromthe forums for a bit as I need to get some stuff done, nearing deadline and all with so much to do.

Hope this image helps a bit
http://www.cgi.third-era.com/~kaiskai/thehead2.jpg

[phobos]

Yes kaiskai your new pic helps a lot.I'm thinking that I should do the same thing (extrude inner) with the eyes .
The nose I really can't think of anything else than a knife cut.
I'll make a few trys and see if I can come up with something good but with this method I'm walking blindfolded.I've never done it and just don't know how to face it.Oh well I guess I should try now and see what comes up.
Thanks again

[matty2x4]

this guy has some nice tutorials


http://www.evil-plan.com/HT.html

[Grey]

Kai, is this tutorial a Work In Progress or were you just aiming to get the basic structure set up?

I'm just wondering if it will be continuing :D

[LucentDreams]

well I don't really have the time to work on a tutorial at this moment, can't really think about that till september 4th at the earliest but more around sept 11th or 18th, mainly because this film is keeping meon the edge of insanity. By the 4th everything should be animated clean and scanned in, but the 11th everything should be painted and all camera moves done. then there is editing which should end around the 18th. after that I do another film in one month using flash, and I work on the audio for this film so you can see things are pretty busy. don't worry I have a bunch of tutorials planned when I begin teaching again, but my main concern is whether it is too soon to focus them on R8 or not, mainly because any tutorial for 7 can beapplied to R8 but there are better ways to do things in R8, and I seriously have troubles going back to 7.303 now, so innefficient and modal such :)

Maybe I will start a thread later on about what tutorials you guys would like me to focus on and what version I should focus most tutorials on, or I could try doing some for both versions but that could drive me insane.

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