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eRP
09-29-2004, 10:25 AM
I know it's just another thread about the same problem, but can anyone with an NVidia card do some serious work ?
I've got an FX 5600 and tried every driver since 4.50. None have worked and Modo keeps crashing.
When I'm lucky it gets to the 5 min. mark. But that's when I'm lucky.
The worst is with edges. after 30 sec. Boom.

But this is to say that even I know the problem is with NVidia, it is MOdo that is suffering, and it will be Modo to keep the blame.

Luxology. You must do something before it's too late.

This way, Modo is a toy. Not a working tool.

I'm loving the software and the workflow. It just has this «problem»...

MunCHeR
09-29-2004, 11:06 AM
If you read some of the other threads it would be clear that that are in the process of doing something, no point complaining to luxology about it, I'm sure they're doing their best.

This way, Modo is a toy. Not a working tool.
get a decent graphics card, not a toy one :D

MunCH

eRP
09-29-2004, 11:33 AM
And if you read my thread you could see that I wasn't complayning. I was asking.

And this is because I think Modo is the BEST modeler there is and I want to work with it. Even with my toy video card.

Sbowling
09-29-2004, 11:54 AM
I know it's just another thread about the same problem, but can anyone with an NVidia card do some serious work ?
I've got an FX 5600 and tried every driver since 4.50. None have worked and Modo keeps crashing.
When I'm lucky it gets to the 5 min. mark. But that's when I'm lucky.
The worst is with edges. after 30 sec. Boom.

But this is to say that even I know the problem is with NVidia, it is MOdo that is suffering, and it will be Modo to keep the blame.

Luxology. You must do something before it's too late.

This way, Modo is a toy. Not a working tool.

I'm loving the software and the workflow. It just has this «problem»...
In windows go into the harware properties and disable the display driver. This will use the "built in" driver. Anyway, I've done this and I haven't had a single crash since. Things are a bit slower, but not enough for me to complain too much. I would like to see a working driver though.

Exan
09-29-2004, 12:10 PM
hey.

funny- modo works with my GeForce4 TI 4200
Haven't had any crashes.

ciao,
Lex.

Labuzz
09-29-2004, 12:11 PM
Same thing here,
Impossible to use Modo...I get crash every 30s. ( I am on Xp with a 6800 gt card ). I have already disable vertex array...

lougandidas
09-29-2004, 12:23 PM
hey.

funny- modo works with my GeForce4 TI 4200
Haven't had any crashes.

ciao,
Lex.
What driver are you using? I have crashes all the time and I have the same video card.

yog
09-29-2004, 12:23 PM
I'm using Modo with an old 64Mb Nvidia Quadro-2 and it's rock solid. Likewise on my laptop with an ATI card, no complaints.

I have tried it with an Nvidia FX 5900, and got crash city, even with vertex arrays turned off.

So basically I'm getting exactly the results Brad Peebler said I would get in his first "Modo is released" post.

Exan
09-29-2004, 12:33 PM
What driver are you using? I have crashes all the time and I have the same video card.
Using 5672.
Now I'm afraid updating it :(

Modo is a great modeller. Won't loose it.

And buying a QuadroFX... thats tooo expensive for me ...

MunCHeR
09-29-2004, 12:37 PM
OK, well my apologies I wasnt intending to have a go at you or your video card (I have a GeForce Ti 4200 also) but there are atleast 2 other threads where this issue is covered or being covered.

Luxology. You must do something before it's too late.
NVIDIA are the people you really should be "asking"

Cheers

MunCH

Balusilustalu
09-29-2004, 12:40 PM
I suppose whenever another thread pops up argueing about whether or not Pro-cards are worth the extra dosh, we can always point them to this (and the other) threads.

Trash those kiddie GF cards and get something proper instead! ;) Surely software as elegant as this deserves better silicon than that. :)
I've had the chance to test Modo on a Quadro4 980 XGL Dual P4 3.06 Xeon for a few days and haven't witnessed a single crash, viewport glitch or whatever. Didn't even have to mess with drivers or settings.
It seems the majority of the people complaining about Modo crashing are GF users. The proof is in the pudding I guess...

djart
09-29-2004, 12:42 PM
ive got the same problem but its sometimes, i can do hours without any problem i got Nvidia Fx5200 <- with newest update from nvidia.com but there need to
be modo update soon and im sure there will be one its just when, we bought it and we want it to work !
without that problem its perfect modelling tool, amazing easy, very userfriendly and lots of many little things that make it even better (uvtools,macrorecord..)
:buttrock:

Exan
09-29-2004, 12:43 PM
/* Two guys were faster than me */

no. not directly.
I won't start a flame war here, but Luxology really should fix modo, to work on all non-opengl enhanced cards. Like the GeForce Series, or the Radeon.
And I dunno why 512 MB Ram is minimal recomended. Modo isn't using that much memory

nVidia has designed the GeForce Cards for simple users, not CG guys.
The Quadros were thought for that.

hmm- my english isn't the best today. Damn flu. http://www.cgtalk.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

MunCHeR
09-29-2004, 12:56 PM
from another thread:

NVidia has acknowledged the problem and has stated that they have a fix in test. __________________
QA Manager
Luxology, LLC (http://www.luxology.com/)

and we are still blaming the guys @ luxology!

MunCH

djart
09-29-2004, 12:57 PM
well yes my card is a bit old but planning to buy newer, its just that 600 coins went just to modo and allkind things all the time, dont got money to buy some 500€+ hyper duper mega graphiccards all the time :rolleyes:

eRP
09-29-2004, 01:13 PM
MunCHeR, have you tried to reach NVidia ?
At least I know the Luxology guys are here. Where are the Nvidia ones ?
Can you find a link to an email in their page ?
I didn't.

What I'm saying is that Luxology is the one who is going to loose something here ( and us) not Nvidia. They have a much wider audience...

StephanD
09-29-2004, 01:19 PM
Although I have an Ati and an Nvidia,I find myself using my old 3dlabs with 3d applications.I find it way more compatible and it doesn't cost 2000$ anymore(well not the one I own).

MunCHeR
09-29-2004, 01:33 PM
eRP, no I havent tried to contact nvidia regarding this because I havent really had a problem, nothing major atleast. And like I quoted in my last post the problem has been acknowledged by nvidia, the luxology guys are testing a driver for us all, I guess it will be out soon, what more can we do?

MunCH

Trilobyte
09-29-2004, 01:48 PM
To eRP:

Try nVidia new driver 66.70. It help me solve crushing problem.

eRP
09-29-2004, 02:31 PM
Thanks MrBig, but I have tried all their drivers. It's just a matter of minutes 'til it crashes again.

I uninstalled the Nvidia driver to work with modo. But it's a stupid solution. Anyhow, at least the crashes were over.

This is perhaps the most stupid suggestion but is it possible to turn off OpenGL in Modo?
Imagine if NVidia takes 1 or 2 month to put the new driver out.
That way we could keep our drivers to work in other applications and for the time being work in Modo in VGA.

lwbob
09-29-2004, 02:44 PM
eRP, no I havent tried to contact nvidia regarding this because I havent really had a problem, nothing major atleast.
Hey Luxology, I have had windows boot slow a few times and since Modo runs on windows I figure I'll complain to you. :)

MunCHeR
09-29-2004, 03:00 PM
haha @lwbob, goood call :D, atleast someone gets the point I was trying to make.

Leave a mesage after da beep

MunCH

eRP: did you try using detonator RIP? Its a utility available from www.guru3d.com that can delete remnant nvidia driver bits which can sometimes cause problems

Rigley
09-29-2004, 03:45 PM
I've turned my FX 5600 GeForce into a so called "softquadro".
You can find out more about it at: RivaTuner (http://forums.guru3d.com/forumdisplay.php?forumid=18)
So my cheap GeForce is basically a Quadro now (well a little-bit slower)
And modo is pretty stable this way on my machine - with vertex arrays on.

PaQ
09-29-2004, 04:02 PM
atleast someone gets the point I was trying to make
Very funny ^^ but the right comparaison should be more "hey guys I have installed Modo and windows don't boot anymore !!!

Solutions like "just remove your drivers" are very funny too :D (even if it works)

More over is it wrote somewhere on the luxology web site that GForce owners will have serious trouble to make modo run on their system ?? Even with quadro $erie$ there are still stability problems.

I don't expect to have super highend performance with game gfx card, but at least I should be able to make it run more than 5 minutes.

So let people complains, they have put 600$ on something they even can't use ^^ (hopefully it's not my case). As far as I know they didn't give this money to nvidia right >?? At least if luxology refund people for this reason, but after reading the "no retrun" policy, I don't think they will (but maybe I'm wrong)

(I also think it's a good reason to not releasing a modo demo for the moment, but that's because I see the devil everywhere :D)

nilsbor
09-29-2004, 04:06 PM
@Rigley

I've also got the 5600 turned to quadro, and Modo is crashing.

Which drivers are you using?

eRP
09-29-2004, 04:17 PM
Thanks Rigley, that looks promising. For now the Forum is closed for a few hours.:sad:

Hope it works.

MunCHeR
09-29-2004, 04:23 PM
@ PaQ: good point dude, I forgot about that little message:



NOTE: There is a known issue with NVIDIA consumer level graphics cards and the current NVIDIA drivers. NVIDIA is working with us to address the issue and we anticipate an updated driver that will correct the issue very soon. Currently consumer level NVIDIA cards may prove to be unstable when running modo. Stability can be improved by disabling Vertex Arrays from the Preferences viewport in modo. While this can improve stability, it will also cause a noticeable decrease in mesh editing performance. We apologize for any inconvenience this may cause in the short term. We would also like to thank NVIDIA for their proactive approach to solving the issue for Luxology and our customers.


Hope future purchasers take note:thumbsup:

MunCH

AmbiDextrose
09-29-2004, 04:24 PM
It's quite obvious no one on this thread knows proper product escallation procedures.

It IS Luxology's problem. It is their product having problems with the video driver. They should OWN following up and getting on Nvidia's @$$ to roll out a new driver as soon as possible and not leave it up to Nvidia because it IS affecting the stability of their product. And Modo (and their customers) is Luxology's responsibility. Also, they should probably update their customers regarding the current situation with NVidia and not just rely on some notice on their website. Otherwise, that is enough for myself (and probably a lot of other people out there) not to support this product because this IS lack of after sales support.

This is also a good case why Lux should have provided a demo in the first place.

yog
09-29-2004, 04:32 PM
I suppose whenever another thread pops up argueing about whether or not Pro-cards are worth the extra dosh, we can always point them to this (and the other) threads.

Trash those kiddie GF cards and get something proper instead! ...
It's becoming a neccesity. I picked up my Quadro ($50) because LW8 wouldn't run on my Geforce 4200 Ti or my GF4 FX 5900. Add in the fact that both XSI and Maya have approved hardware lists for GC's (ironically XSI-4 ran just fine on my GF-4200 when LW8 wouldn't), and it means that that you are much better off getting a proffessional card.
And it needent cost an arm and a leg. Sure the top end Quadro's will cost you a second motgage, but a perfectly servicable one, 64 or 128Mb, will cost you a fraction of the price of a high end gamer card.

yog
09-29-2004, 04:46 PM
It's quite obvious no one on this thread knows proper product escallation procedures.

It IS Luxology's problem. It is their product having problems with the video driver. They should OWN following up and getting on Nvidia's @$$ to roll out a new driver as soon as possible and not leave it up to Nvidia because it IS affecting the stability of their product. And Modo (and their customers) is Luxology's responsibility. Also, they should probably update their customers regarding the current situation with NVidia and not just rely on some notice on their website. Otherwise, that is enough for myself (and probably a lot of other people out there) not to support this product because this IS lack of after sales support.

This is also a good case why Lux should have provided a demo in the first place.
Luxology did "own" up to the problem, I believe it was on the very first post where they announced Modo was released, BEFORE anyone had a chance to order it. They even had the notice on their order page.

What makes you think they aren't "on Nvidia's @$$" ? Do you really think they are just sitting in their office drinking coffee and dreaming of the day that Nvidia fix their bug ?

Updating their customers ? I take it then you missed the few posts where Brad mentions the state of play, including the beta driver they recieved from Nvidia that didn't fix the bug, and the latest beta driver they had recieved last Friday and were testing out ?

So to sum up, you didn't notice the warning, even though it was mentioned here by one of the founders of the company AND posted on their order page, you haven't seen any progress updates from the company, despite the fact that most other people have seen at least a few, and YOUR p***ed off ?:rolleyes:

bradpeebler
09-29-2004, 04:49 PM
Hey guys,

I want to reiterate that we ARE working closely and actively with NVIDIA to solve this problem. We have daily communication with NVIDIA and they have been VERY responsive. NVIDIA has a specific process for releasing drivers and that process is in place so that they can effectively manage quality control. I have confidence that NVIDIA is working as quickly as their process allows. I know it is painful to wait. believe me it is as painful for us as it is for all of you.

I am bound by NDA with NVIDIA so I can not discuss specific details of the drivers, but I can tell you all that NVIDIA is doing a great job working with us.

Thanks for your patience on this issue.

BP

tjnyc
09-29-2004, 05:11 PM
Brad,

Thanks for reiterating the situation to use again.

I agree with Yog.

The guys from Luxology have been great about informing the users about the situation and listening to the many demands and rants that have come their way, a few that have come from me BTW http://www.cgtalk.com/images/icons/icon12.gif.



Cheers,

leonard-davi
09-29-2004, 05:18 PM
thanks brad ... the way it's wait .... i agree with stupid solution of ERP ..... no use drivers .. very slow but usual ... let's wait ... hugs

JulesB
09-29-2004, 10:29 PM
Hi,

Can I have a link please to get this Forceware driver - the latest I can find for my FX1100 is 61.76, the latest regular Quadro driver.

Thanks.

Julian.

AmbiDextrose
09-29-2004, 11:11 PM
We have daily communication with NVIDIA and they have been VERY responsive. NVIDIA has a specific process for releasing drivers and that process is in place so that they can effectively manage quality control. I have confidence that NVIDIA is working as quickly as their process allows. I know it is painful to wait. believe me it is as painful for us as it is for all of you. This should probably be posted on the Luxology website as well (probably re-worded somewhat). It is more emphatic than the current announcement. Also, there should probably be a link from the Luxology site into this forum. If there is, it's not very prominent or obvious. Is it sent only (via e-mail) to those that have ordered modo? Shouldn't announcements like this be open to anyone who is interested in the product? If these are the official Luxology Modo forums, shouldn't there be a stickied Announcements thread instead of having to reiterate announcements like this all over the place? There needs to be better information disemination.

This is actually good marketing- it shows that Luxology is actually on the ball and is driving NVidia to come up with the fix. It shows that they will fight for their customers (unlike some other software company that will remain nameless :)).

In the meantime, maybe Luxology can provide a link to known working drivers? That's another value-add on top of their product. See, in the world of vendors, those that go the extra step in favor of their customers usually earn a lot of returning business.

leonard-davi
09-29-2004, 11:44 PM
hey guys try this detonator 40.41 here works ! no crash more (i hope )i use pne gforce 4 mx 4400 ... hugs

Rigley
09-30-2004, 05:18 AM
I use 44.03, and it seems to work well, but "officially" the latest version that works well with softquadro and FX5600 is 42.51. I hope it helps.

Invid
09-30-2004, 06:14 AM
I use an eVGA 6800GT 256MB with the 61.77 drivers off eVGA's site and I haven't had a crash yet, knock on wood. I haven't tried every operation yet but it seems stable for me at the moment.

Trilobyte
09-30-2004, 08:15 AM
To JulesB: http://download.guru3d.com/detonator/

Amphiblien
10-08-2004, 05:17 AM
I use an eVGA 6800GT 256MB with the 61.77 drivers off eVGA's site and I haven't had a crash yet, knock on wood. I haven't tried every operation yet but it seems stable for me at the moment.

Have you tried Messiah? I have the same card and have messy displays in Messiah. I hope it isn't the same for Modo...Actually, what I hope for is a @^$@%&!@#$ driver that will run Messiah properly..or an update from PMG?

Ross DD
10-08-2004, 09:24 AM
Hi,

(sorry for my bad english language...)

i have a simple NV ge-force4 mx and modo works well with "41.50" driver version: there's not crashing or something like that...
in WinXP SP2 (my OS...) NV driver is installed within and it's a successive version (sorry but i don't remember it...) and modo crash with disabling all "suspect" functions also...
Changing with a previous driver (version "41.50" is downloadable to NV web-site...) modo works well with all video-card functions activated (antialising, anisotrophy, etc...) and "vertex array" on;
sorry but i don't know if it's the same with next other NV video-card like Quadro and FX....
hope is useful...
(sorry for some inexact things but i'm a 3D-newbie...)

JulesB
10-08-2004, 10:44 AM
Brad,

It's been around ten days since you last asked us all to be patient, and telling us how Lux and Nvidia are working together to fix this problem. Any more news? I am being patient, by the way - this is a polite request for more info and regular updates on the issue. It's very hard to tell what's a Nvidia card issue, and what is purely a Modo problem. I've been experimenting with UV and weight maps and the Math Tool, but anything I do crashes within minutes, and I've tried several drivers this past fortnight - right now it's the 66.81, running with my FX1100.

You really must publish a list of known issues and drivers that almost work, and specifically what cards are in question. Simply saying "Nvidia consumer grade cards" is not enough - there are people reporting issues with the FX3000 even; it's a subjective point but the FX3000 is not, in my books, a "consumer grade card". The dealer I bought my FX1100 from said their warehouse had even phoned to double check that's what had been ordered, as they sell so few of them. Again, that hardly qualifies as "consumer grade".

There have been plenty enough rants and frustrations over this, but I think deservedly so. Your problem with Nvidia cards and drivers is just that: YOUR problem - in releasing Modo when you did, you have made it OUR problem. And sure, it'll get fixed and completely cured (won't it???), and we all got a discount for buying early, which is good, but even for that price, I expect it to work pretty well out of the box and not be quite as broken as it appears right now.

Please don't have us all waiting too much longer.

Julian.

MallenLane
10-08-2004, 03:48 PM
Jules you need to check what dll the crashes are occuring in. As of 66.81 I no longer have crashes in the video driver. I do however still have crashes sometimes (not often) in Modo itself, which I don't think are related to the videocard at all.

Wireframes
10-08-2004, 04:26 PM
I have a QUADRO 980 XGL with drivers 61.76. (ASUS PCDL - Bi Xeon 3Ghz)
It works very very well for me.

JulesB
10-08-2004, 04:26 PM
Jules you need to check what dll the crashes are occuring in. As of 66.81 I no longer have crashes in the video driver. I do however still have crashes sometimes (not often) in Modo itself, which I don't think are related to the videocard at all.
Well, the greatest rash of crashes has been working with UV and weight maps, and the Math Tool - hard to tell, as I think I mentioned, what's video card related and what's simply Modo. However, I guess those crashes are more likely Modo. Quad window updates are still stuttery, compared to the smooth realtime feedback of LW Modeler and Maya's, but I can live with that - makes Modo look a little rough next to the competition, but no big deal.

I guess I need to use it more with 'regular' modelling and see what happens, stop messing about with those maps for awhile. Crashing alot more than I feel comfortable with though, as in the apparently simplest thing will bring it down, a click, or a window resize, maybe not very often, but often enough, if you see what I mean!

How do I check what dlls the crashes are happening in?

Julian.

Sbowling
10-10-2004, 04:16 AM
I have not had a single crash since switching to the beta drivers from Guru3D. I'm very surprised at how stable Modo is once the OpenGL issue was resolved. Excellent work Luxology!

Paul-Angelo
10-10-2004, 04:30 PM
I have the same thing to report. The new beta drivers from guru3d kick @$$! They seemed to have solved a major viewport problem I was having. Whenever I switched to quad view it made modo very unstable and would crash a lot. Now I haven't had it crash on me yet. :beer:

Ionex
10-10-2004, 09:59 PM
Very helpful thread.


The 66.81 forceware drivers have solved my problem with my geForce FX 5700 Ultra. Modo is now running perfect.


1 Warning: for Maya users, you lose your high quality display with this driver.

phamarus
10-11-2004, 04:40 PM
Hmm..to bad...modo seems to be a very nice modeler...but crashes all the time on a
quadra fx 1100 series card and 2gig ram memory and windows xp..

roger
10-11-2004, 04:53 PM
Hmm..to bad...modo seems to be a very nice modeler...but crashes all the time on a
quadra fx 1100 series card and 2gig ram memory and windows xp.. I have a quadra fx 1100 series card and 1gig ram and windows 2000 and I'm using the 66.81 forceware drivers and I'm having NO crashes. :)

jamination
10-11-2004, 05:34 PM
i have issues with the bevel being very jerky and hard to control. i tried several drivers including the ones posted on this thread. would this be a driver issue or something altogether
different?

phil harbath
jamination

Para
10-11-2004, 05:57 PM
i have issues with the bevel being very jerky and hard to control. i tried several drivers including the ones posted on this thread. would this be a driver issue or something altogether
different?

phil harbath
jamination

Could also be habit. The mouse axis for bevel tool are reversed (when compared to LW) and it does have some sort of threshold value to help creating a clean, straight bevel.

Rigley
10-11-2004, 06:18 PM
I also don't like how the bevel tool works. It would be cool to disable that "snapping" to nice values, and to modify the axes to get closer to LW style.

Griffon
10-11-2004, 06:36 PM
I also don't like how the bevel tool works. It would be cool to disable that "snapping" to nice values, and to modify the axes to get closer to LW style.

System->prefs->Accuracy->Cooridinate Rounding

Rigley
10-11-2004, 06:38 PM
Thanks Griffon, but i have already turned it to "none". It seems it doesn't affect the bevel.

Griffon
10-11-2004, 06:47 PM
Ok, I'll take a look. It does turn off the "nice" values if you use the handles.

Rigley
10-11-2004, 06:52 PM
O I see, with the handles its OK :) i just don't use handles most of the time.

BluEgo
10-21-2004, 08:27 PM
Emh, my main pc is a notebook with GeForce Fx Go5700.
I'd like to try and shop modo, anyone knows if there will be a problem with my videocard and if there is a good driver for it? On nvida website there is no driver support for Go series :sad:

juanjgon
10-22-2004, 08:20 AM
Emh, my main pc is a notebook with GeForce Fx Go5700.
I'd like to try and shop modo, anyone knows if there will be a problem with my videocard and if there is a good driver for it? On nvida website there is no driver support for Go series :sad:

Nvidia drivers has support to all Go chips, but they are disabled in .inf files. You can try this links, where you can dowload drivers with correct .inf for mobile chips.

http://www.station-drivers.com/page/nvidia%20geforce%20go.htm
http://www.omegadrivers.net/

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