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tredeger
09-03-2004, 07:49 PM
Can someone with XSI Essentials or Advanced provide any detail as to the advanced character rigs & guides that are excluded from Foundations? I am mightily impressed with the basic guides and supplied rigs and would like to know what is actually missing. I have some ideas about where I would extend my functionality using the character dev kit, but I'd like to focus my efforts in areas that haven't already been addressed in the advanced rigs. And if I am going to reinvent this wheel, I'd like as much detail as possible as to what has been done by the geniuses at Soft.

Also, as a more general question: what, if anything, do you guys think is missing from the basic rigs in terms of generally needed functionality?
Thanks and

cheers,
Jazz

titaniumdave
09-03-2004, 09:05 PM
I haven't really tried out the prebuilt rigs yet so I can't tell you much. I think a good idea would be to download xsi for hl2 which is the free version of xsi advanced and has all of the missing guides from foundation. You could try it out and then figure out the difference that way.

SheepFactory
09-03-2004, 10:00 PM
No they dont. The advanced rigs in v4 are very different than v3.5 so it wont be a accurate comparison.

You'll have to wait for xsi 4 experience to come out or arrange a demo with a reseller.

j3st3r
09-03-2004, 11:20 PM
No they dont. The advanced rigs in v4 are very different than v3.5 so it wont be a accurate comparison.

You'll have to wait for xsi 4 experience to come out or arrange a demo with a reseller.

I`m not sure whether they are included in Foundation, but you may download a free 30 days TRIAL of XSI Foundation to test it.

If you want my opinion, these rigs are very useful for everyday use. I think if you need something special, you may use them as a basis

SheepFactory
09-03-2004, 11:49 PM
No they are not included in foundation. You can see it from the comparison chart at the softimage website.

Chinny
09-04-2004, 02:18 AM
The difference is the Standard rigs in Foundation are the same as the ones in XSI v3.5
for both Biped and Quadruped. you can manipulate the guides to fit the proportions of our charcacter then generate a rig.

in version 4, more options were added to the rigs together with a new biped dog-leg guide. The Quadruped Guide was also updated. In v.4.0 all of these are really components, that can be joined together using the character SDK. It relly is for more TD types, where the ones in Foundation will be easily made by anyone.

I hope that helps

Chinny

j3st3r
09-04-2004, 07:09 AM
Hello Chinny,

May I ask you, that this character DK is a pack of script commands, or something "visual"?
I mean, that our company will migrate to XSI soon, from Maya. And we like to manage multilevel characters for games. Eg. each LOD level of the character will contain different skeleton-hierarchy. How does this guide manage adding cloth-bones, or additional limbs (multi-armed characters, for example). Etc.

Thanks

tredeger
09-04-2004, 01:03 PM
Thanks everyone. Further investigation has led me to realize that the advanced rigs and guides are in fact the ones covered by the documentation and discussed in depth in the Animation training DVD. I had thought, by their coverage that they were in fact part of foundation. It isn't terribly upsetting that they are absent, in so far as it is possible to closely replicate the end result of these rigs in foundation through manual construction. This obviously entails a fair bit more work and lacks the flexibility of creation from the guides, requiring a TD's understanding of making skeletons (covered well enough in the docs), but I am rather disappointed that the underlying thinking is missing from the docs, making this replication much more difficult than if theory was more thoroughly paired with a good technical explanation for those missing the advanced features.

What I mean to say is that while I know I bought the lowest price version, I would like adequate documentation as to how to achieve the desired workarounds through additional effort. The coverage of the rigging topics is fantastic if you have essentials or advanced, but was clearly created without foundation users in mind. M.Isner is clearly a genius of rigging and his theories and thinking are apparent in the docs, but the end result ends up being a difficult to replicate black box in foundation. NOT because it is impossible, but because there is, so far as I am aware, no appropriate reference point from which to start in foundation.
I realize that the advanced guides and rigs use the CDK, but there is no good documentation for *constructing your own guides* and programming scripts utilizing the same CDK components. The best way to learn how to do this would be to look at the scrpts of the CDK as they come in advanced, but without them, where do I start? I would actually want to extend and customize through scripting even if I had advanced, so I think there is a general lack of documentation in this regard, irrespective of the version. Can someone from Soft let me know what I should do in order to begin leveraging the power that comes even with Foundation vis a vis rigging (not just through manual creation of rigs but through scripting at the CDK level)?

T4D
09-04-2004, 02:01 PM
I disagree i rig in Lightwave and i know how that work
i have made a custom rig in XSI not as full on as the one in the Primitive button but pretty cool today

But the ones made by the character tools as the same as the ones in the Primitive button you can pull that apart to see how it works and transfer those settings to your rig
Or you can change bone length before before you envelope the bonesto fit your model

they show you in the DVD's how the setup most of the stuff in the rigs these are not on the rigging section but in the animation section of the DVD adding relationship and expressions
the DVD's as excellent


the Character button would be nice but like the texture layer editor you have to miss something as the prices we paid I'm upgrading as soon as i get the next job :D

but really the rigging it XSI has blown me away so well done with so many options :eek:
the character tools would be great but it's not really needed
the Default bone IK WIth FK already setup has blown me away :buttrock:

Sil3
09-04-2004, 02:14 PM
...but really the rigging it XSI has blown me away so well done with so many options :eek:
Thatīs why it is designated as a Character Animation package :)

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