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flingster
08-30-2004, 01:55 PM
Hello,

I would appreciate some critique on this piece. I've done a final render and would appreciate some feedback...around lighting/texturing/render/composition whatever really..open to all suggestions..its one of those images i've been really stuck with and struggled with completing.

It was done in Cinema 4d (i've not posted a wire as its not really necessary on this piece)

do you like...do you no like...why?
what parts can be improved etc..(ooh and i know DOF can probably be improved..but i want to retain some of the background floater details and colour unfortunately)

http://www.flingster.com/cgtalk/spin.jpg

MulaG
09-12-2004, 11:32 PM
Hello,

I would appreciate some critique on this piece. I've done a final render and would appreciate some feedback...around lighting/texturing/render/composition whatever really..open to all suggestions..its one of those images i've been really stuck with and struggled with completing.

It was done in Cinema 4d (i've not posted a wire as its not really necessary on this piece)

do you like...do you no like...why?
what parts can be improved etc..(ooh and i know DOF can probably be improved..but i want to retain some of the background floater details and colour unfortunately)

I like this! You've managed to achieve an underwater effect without the ripples, I think this is due to the surrounding material and the camera angle. I also think it's clever the way that you've used a limited amount of colour - greeny yellow as a colour is not very appealing but you've spun that round and it's made your scene interesting and gives it some depth. :thumbsup:

Your work is very unusual and unique not to mention that you make excellent use of the Di-Cloner :)

What shader did you use on the foreground object?

The one thing that may come to question are the two sprites on the right hand side of the scene - the prawn like objects - they look a little flat. Maybe it's because they are in between objects where you can see the depth (More angles of the structure). I'm not an expert by far but just shedding light on my thoughts! Alll in all great work!:)

flingster
09-13-2004, 12:25 AM
hey mulag thanks for taking time out to comment was beginning to wonder if anyone even had any thoughts on it at all was looking to absorb any comments/crits and open to any comments really..at least i might get some ideas or even feeling on whether people loved it or hated it would be good to hear something..so thanks alot for some thoughts.

the limited colour palette was very deliberate..in a sense i was trying to define scene colours with lighting...also trying to convey a kinda alien world..which is open for interpretation..either spacey or more likely underwater...in the wip thread despite the volumetric nature of some of the lighting i did get some comments to improve the depth..i tried to do it be limiting the dof so i could keep some of the background details but also adding the shrimps and another arm thing. hopefully its there or getting there.:shrug:
i didn't want to do the typical dof very blur as its to overdone...but maybe mine is a little to subtle. the shrimps as you call them on the right you might be on the mark there..dunno i always thought the ones on the left were to fat! heh heh.

dicloner was used on the tongue part to instance the seed pod things that its spinning out.

the shader was over done renderwise...but basically and a little complicated to get to work sucessfully with the lighting setup
colour channel: backlight, SSS, parralax (fresnel, fusion of fbm and cranal)
diffusion: re furry (using same noise fusion almost acting like bump but certainly enhances bump)
luminance: chanlum as i couldn't get furry or dirt to play ball)
environment: fresnel (kinda helped lighten the chanlum dusting)
bump: fusion noise again
alpha: my furry setup (reduced my volume but plays well with backlighting also)
specular: quite wide but flat and coloured
phong: 30%falloff
i used backlighting to highlight main object and help with the SSS on the main object.

was trying for subtle, but didn't want bland and uninteresting...heh heh.

thanks again for feedback..:thumbsup:

MulaG
09-13-2004, 08:51 PM
hey mulag thanks for taking time out to comment was beginning to wonder if anyone even had any thoughts on it at all was looking to absorb any comments/crits and open to any comments really..at least i might get some ideas or even feeling on whether people loved it or hated it would be good to hear something..so thanks alot for some thoughts......
thanks again for feedback..:thumbsup:
No problemo! Like I said your work is pretty unique and it's quite refreshing to see something different. With that sort of image it's tempting to make some of the materials transparent - and you've managed to stray away from that.

dicloner was used on the tongue part to instance the seed pod things that its spinning out. LOL - you just couldn't resist:applause:

I'm still learning the ropes but it slipped my mind that you could add fresnel to an environment object. So are all your objects 'in space' not enclosed within say a sphere for example?

Keep up the good work:)

flingster
09-13-2004, 09:49 PM
No problemo! Like I said your work is pretty unique and it's quite refreshing to see something different. With that sort of image it's tempting to make some of the materials transparent - and you've managed to stray away from that.

LOL - you just couldn't resist:applause:

I'm still learning the ropes but it slipped my mind that you could add fresnel to an environment object. So are all your objects 'in space' not enclosed within say a sphere for example?

Keep up the good work:)
can never resist using ditools gotta confess.

in this case i'm using a sky object (hdri) , environment object (noise+pelham shader), but i do have a default scene with a sphere in it for environment reflections etc..just not used in this case.
fresnel is funky..use it in environment, reflection, transparency etc..but also try reducing harshness for subtle..or even reversing the nodes...in combination with other materials also can be useful..
there is two great lightwave pdf files on here explaning fresnel and anisotrophy...well worth a read.
http://www.the-worms-of-art.com/tutorials/lightwavetutes_221.html

hope this helps...you may well be beyond em..but i post them anyways as reference.

MrLearner
09-14-2004, 12:45 PM
Cool piece I like it! It's got a nice atmosphere to it.

One thing bothers me though, the "knots" on the "petals" on the main thingy. I think they look like they are cloned, for me it disrupts the sence of it all being organic...

flingster
09-14-2004, 01:39 PM
Cool piece I like it! It's got a nice atmosphere to it.

One thing bothers me though, the "knots" on the "petals" on the main thingy. I think they look like they are cloned, for me it disrupts the sence of it all being organic...
they are essentially instances of the larger central object...now thats a really good point..hadn't thought about that...the central object was bothering me slightly was wondering whether to do more work on it..maybe cilli like hairs on the edges curling inwards might disrupt that a little. Can i just ask is it that you would like to see different forms/shapes on these knots or just not have them at all?..i like the way the surface and light works in these areas this uniformity also helps to convey a sense of structure to something that should be organic in the viewers mind...maybe its just a case of mixing it up a little shape wise....as the central object is pretty uniform i thought they kinda go with this uniformity...but you make a really good point and something to definitely think about..thanks for this...good crit.
cheers

LowJacK
09-14-2004, 10:20 PM
I really like your piece. It is very unique.

There are two things that I believe would make it better:

1. The spine like object that wraps around the image, on the right side of the image, it should be your foremost foreground object. It should be infront of the rose-like thing slightly, not behind it.
2. On the Rose-like object, you have mini versions of it on the petals. In the top petal the mini version seems to intersect with the larger geometry. This is probably due to lighting so I suggest swinging your key or fill light around slightly to try to break-up that area some what.
3. The lens flare or volume effect that you have in the top left corner of the image should continue through the rest of the piece. It seems isolated to that area. It that is to be your light source, you should have a heavier rim light effecting all objects in the scene.
4. As you noted, the depth pass could use some adjustments. Adding some more of the tiny, independent brine shrimp looking things in the BG (with low saturation levels) should help with depth.

respect!

flingster
09-15-2004, 01:56 AM
wow yeah...big it on...fantastic crits...
1) definitely...i did try it..looked a bit strange..but think it will help with depth a little also so will have another go at that.
2) i can't tell you how much messing about with this i have had with this type of thing...not sure how to resolve it..either it catch all areas and it looks blown out...i get one side and the other side is to dark...it then start messing up with my backlight and translucency effect...oooh jeez...this is painful to fix..but i'll have another bash because your right damn it!
3)volume light..no lens flare..i don't want to wash out the subtle blue area...but i'm up for trying that...it may cause problems as there is environment...then volumetric lights...and everything start getting blown out then...definitely explore this idea though cos if i can get it working will work really sweet would imagine.
4) nice idea...me runs off to make a plan.

thanks for the crits really constructive stuff guys definitely what i was looking for on this image..first time i've posted on here...and its an unusual image to post..at least not norm...but i was stuck with it for a long time...making the odd change from feedback in a wip thread...but have never felt really happy with it which is unusual for me...usually i'm content i have to stop work on something..but this damn image has eaten me up...just keeps bugging me and was at a bit of a loss for ideas...been staring at it for to long thought i'd come back to it...but glad you passed me some stuff to work on and think about..very much appreciated..cheers

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