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AlexYaremchuk
08-27-2004, 09:44 AM
It is a small video which can be found here:

http://light-powered.pristavki.com/index2.php?subEngine=displayTopics.php&table=cg_mov

Again i'm asking for honest critique.

P.S. ...and I hope Marvel can forgive me. (^_^)

YerEvilTwin
08-27-2004, 12:31 PM
I believe it to be not good. Here's why:

1. too much strait ahead animation, there is no pauses to grasp the action that is happening. Thus; i don't believe his acting.

2. Too floaty, you don't have not convinced me that there is any weight in that world.

3. The "beat" of the animation is monotone, there isn't any slows and fast action. All movment floats right ioto the next.

Mr-Wizard
08-27-2004, 03:05 PM
Hmmmmmm,

Spiderman eh?

Your experimenting with some interesting camera angles (which is good), but there seems to be some fundermental issues:

Ok, this is spiderman right? This is the superhero who can 'go anywhere' and defy gravity , so to speak? Would he really land on top of a building and nearly fall off? Personally, I don't think he would.

Something else I've noticed...

I've watch the animation a few times and spiderman appears to do a little 'dance' shortly aftering landing. He lands, does abit of 'riverdance' and then backflips before doing his 'stuff'. Basically, spiderman is quite a precise character, he lands, he looks, he keeps going, thats how it should be.

The final shot is great with spiderman almost reaching out towards the camera, but the rest needs to change IMHO.

Here's an idea:

Spiderman lands on the building, but, in his very spiderman 'crouch' style i.e. not standing. The camera zooms in on his eyes and catch's a reflection of whatever he's chasing. Followed by a few shots of spiderman firing webs from each hand as he's swinging between builldings etc... try and get some motion blur in there as well to get that sense of speed.

Don't forget, your competing with the big boys on this one, the film studies, the comics, check out their camera angles and the sort of stuff they had spiderman doing.

Good luck!

AlexYaremchuk
08-28-2004, 03:14 AM
Thanks for all your comments, they are helpful.

To YerEvilTwin:

Yes, maybe I still have problems with making motion reasonable. My character here needs more characterization that would make him more appealing.

To Mr-Wizard:

The basic idea was just to show him jumping off a roof. Then I thought that it might be interesting to make that balancing animation. It is like "Man, I forgot I'm Spider-man. What the heck am I afraiding of?". That makes him angry and he jumps off with anger. ... But it didn't work. I failed to show him angry. It's not easy 'cause Spider is silent and has no mimics. Sure there lots of ideas that could be realized this is just on of 'em.

Yorgo12345
08-28-2004, 05:55 AM
ok, I'll be brutally honest

Things that are GOOD:
Poses (actually great)
anticipation/recoil

Things that are BAD:
motion flow (floaty copmputer generated looking stuff)

Things that are AWEFULL:
Timing
Balance
weightshifts

Dude, you need to go back and tweek keys around each major pose. Spend at least an hour at each pose untill it flows into and outof that pose in a more human (or superhero) way.

keep up the good work!

AlexYaremchuk
08-29-2004, 03:50 AM
The way one pose flows to another is my one of my bigest concerns. I do several extremes(completely keyed) and then start setting inbetweens but I don't if it is the right approach for 3d animation. Those books I've read don't teach the way to manage keys on timeline (which must always be editable). May be you can advise a book?

neonoodle
08-30-2004, 12:44 AM
Hey Alex... this is my general workflow for 3D animation:
step 1) blocking out the poses, you put in the main poses and general timing
step 2) Adjust the timing till it's pretty much right
step 3) start adding inbetweens and adjusting the timing if need be.
step 4) add inbetweens to the inbetweens and start smoothing out the curves and motion

You've got really good poses going on in your animation, but that's only step 1. As yorgo said, go back and adjust the transitions and timing in between the poses. It's an iterative process. Just keep breaking it down into smaller and smaller chunks until you're happy with it.

After reading the first 2 replies, I thought the animation was gonna be the worst thing ever, but it wasn't that bad. It has potential, so keep at it.

AlexYaremchuk
08-31-2004, 04:06 AM
Thanks for cheering me up, neonoodle. It maybe surprising but my animation workflow is generally the same but I still need a better understanding of weight so I can put inbetweens wisely.
I thought that probably there is another method of keyframing. For example in Maya you have several sub-characters which maybe are not forming poses simultaneously.
And again that anticipations and follow throughs. Is that better to merge them into the main
timeline or somehow put them on upper layer? That's what puzzles me.

neonoodle
08-31-2004, 12:22 PM
No, you dont put them into another layer or anything... But you should move the keys around in the timeline so everything doesnt hit the pose at the same time. For example, if Spidey jumps, have the feet land first, then the body coming down, then the arms hitting their pose last. But only start doing that after you have the timing right, or else adjusting the poses will be a hassle.

The FreakyOne
08-31-2004, 08:14 PM
dont remember the last time spider man balanced on his toes, probably tried to make him look like it was agile but didnt work, lose it :)

AlexYaremchuk
09-01-2004, 03:49 AM
ok, one layer, got it.
Then another vital question. How often do I need to adjust curves manualy? Is it better to alter animation by adding poses or by changing smooth curves in Curve Editor.
(I rarely deal with curves, it distracts me from animation, but may be I should.)

AjaBogdanoff
09-01-2004, 07:11 PM
Definitely needs more weight.

Yorgo12345
09-01-2004, 10:38 PM
Hey Alex,

I think you would benefit from reading this article, and giving this style a real try. I might not advise it to someone else, but given your particular style, I think it would be a great balance.

http://www.keithlango.com/popThru/popThru.html

Keep at it, I can tell that you "get it" as far as what it takes to animate, but you haven't yet learned to see your own work objectively in the moment.

keep up the good work!

skyfinch
09-01-2004, 10:56 PM
(I rarely deal with curves, it distracts me from animation, but may be I should.)

Wow, that's like saying a painter doesn't deal with paints.....well, sort of.

After laying down the main poses, an animation scene can be done completely with just curve editing alone. It's best that you learn to work with curves. You'll become faster, and better.

ace4016
09-02-2004, 12:42 AM
If you were going for the "I forgot I am Spider-Man" thing you need voice with the better animation. Everyone that knows spider-man knows he talks a lot to himself, A LOT.

Even though he was suppose to be scared for a little bit and tip toe backwards I would think that he wouldnt stay on his tippy-toes standing upstraight when he stopped. And what really seemed funny was that bounce that happened when he landed. I would think when he landed and got scared he would land like normal because of instinct and then as he was stand up do that balance thing. He's suppose to have sticky feet, dont thik that will let you bounce like that. I am not an animation expert so thats just my two pennies.

AlexYaremchuk
09-03-2004, 05:09 AM
Thanks for all your comments and links. I will try to pay more attention to curves though

curve editing process in Character Studio is very awkward for me.

>>>you haven't yet learned to see your own work objectively in the moment.

I work on it. I think I can judge animation but my little experience doesn't let me reach the

needed quality in my own works just yet.


>>>Even though he was suppose to be scared for a little bit and tip toe backwards I would think

that he wouldnt stay on his tippy-toes standing upstraight when he stopped.

I took it from my behavior. I walk on toes, I stand on 'em, eat on 'em, sleep on 'em.

(^_^)
Firsy of all that standing pose on toes I think is more comfortable (when legs a spread and

bent). Secondly you are trying to find to much sense in this short animation test.

Abhimation
09-03-2004, 10:38 AM
Hey...
You should work on Settling him down after an action like 1) In the start when he just lands 2) in he end when he keeps his feet on the wall... 2) Let him hold for few frames when he anticipates, it needs some energy to store before doing fast actions. 3) try working on some delay to the wrist n a bit to the fingers.
4) Unfortunately we dont get to work on curves diretly in Character Studio, you need to work on TCB values to smooth out curves. It can be a bit frustratin in the start.. but ya.. it gives good results too...
btw.. nice poses..

AlexYaremchuk
09-08-2004, 05:42 AM
Yeah, CS is surely not perfect.

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