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valentine
08-17-2004, 11:39 AM
hi :)

i purchased foundation last week on wednesday... ive read somewehre, that avid starts shipping the foundationpackage on monday august 16th. when i look at my shippingstatus it says that my order is "pending, license sent".

i just cant wait to get this package and start watching those dvds etc - so is there anyone who has received his/her package, yet ? btw, i am living in germany - i dunno how far this impacts the shippingtime ;)

would be great to see some comments about your experiences with the shippingtime of softimage, especially outside of canada/us !


another thing: i started to get into xsi-character-modeling... in cinema 4d there is a mirroring-object which allows me to only model one side of the character while the other side of the model updates automatically. the points in the middle of the mesh are welded together...

i tried to do the same using xsi's symmetry map, but had no luck with it... then i did some searches on cgtalk and xsibase and found a workaround (cloning original mesh, scale it negative on the x-axis, merge the original and the clone). that works but isnt by far as good as cinemas inbuild mirroring-object. i tweaked it a bit (made the clone and the merged mesh unselectable, hidden the clone and displayed the original mesh only in wireframemode while the merged mesh is in shaded view) but i think this is very intricate and i still cant achieve the flexibility and usability of cinemas mirror-object...

ive read several threads regarding to this subject and on almost every thread the users said: "there will be such an option coming with 4.0" ! so - now there is 4.0 - is there an symmetry-modeling-tool, too ?

wmendez said: "There is also a Symmetrize polygon option which preserves your uv's and allows you to keep making adjustments to the orginal half of the model while the other half updates with the changes.", but when i use this option and update my mesh, the other side does not update :(


so, how is the situation now - are there any additions regarding this in 4.0 ?



thx in advance & best regards
jannis

p.s. as always, please excuse my poor english ;)

chikega
08-17-2004, 12:00 PM
I haven't received mine yet either - but, I did download the XSI 4.0 demo and used the key that Softimage sent by email. I downloaded the documentation as well ... so, that should keep me busy until the DVD's arrive. :)

R10k
08-17-2004, 12:20 PM
Check the Virtual Mirror at www.mindthink.de. I have no idea if it works how you want it to (I haven't checked- I'm still trying to learn how to use the demo :).

preludian
08-17-2004, 01:21 PM
waiting too, but the html tuts are great IMO

valentine
08-17-2004, 01:27 PM
Check the Virtual Mirror at www.mindthink.de (http://www.mindthink.de). I have no idea if it works how you want it to (I haven't checked- I'm still trying to learn how to use the demo :).
first: thx for the link :)

i installed it and it works, but its exactly the same that i described above without having to setup this workaround manually... so if you work in shaded mode (which i usually do !) the original geometrie overlaps the virtually generated... choas :(

i think a symetricmodeling option like in c4d, lw or max is a musthave-option :/ so - nothing happened in 4.0 regarding this ?


@preludian: verdammt - ich will das paket endlich haben, um richtig einsteigen zu koennen. c4d ist schon sehr unterschiedlich zu xsi... naja, viel spass beim warten ;)


best regards
jannis

ChristianFischer
08-17-2004, 01:45 PM
i think a symetricmodeling option like in c4d, lw or max is a musthave-option :/ so - nothing happened in 4.0 regarding this ? i'm also waiting for a symmetry mode like in lw ... no need to have a centerline while modeling .. :love:

preludian
08-17-2004, 02:01 PM
the best mirror tool I know of is the one from Zbrush2, perfect! But seems that XSI lacks a decent mirror syn tool at all. Well, maybe when more LW and Cinema users use XSI Softimage will react, hopefully sooner than the XSI 5.0 release :D .

Ich hatte nicht gelesen, dass die erst ab dem 16. ausliefern, mist verdammt.

R10k
08-17-2004, 02:10 PM
Heh, even Truespace has a solid mirror modeling tool. Good thing I like all of the other modeling tools in XSI...

francescaluce
08-17-2004, 02:25 PM
if you make an instance... weld your vertices with the other side.. you really work only on half model... it's solid.. and actually the way I use to model my meshes.. and instead to wait for the messiah.. you could also make a button by copy 'n paste that actions..





ciao
francesca

KurtLawson
08-17-2004, 02:44 PM
got an email yesterday says shipping shortly.
I got my dvd's in advance and I been checking those out. some of the topics can cook your head. but there totally righteous.

also i have to say that the softimage store was really great to purchase from. " being that i bought the dvd's before the 495 foundation was announced" they totally hooked me up and let me buy the foundation for the remainder of the cost, and better than that they did it painlessly and with feedback of when the got stuff done. I'm very very happy with my purchase and how they did business. just so this doesn't turn into a blow fest, i'm not as happy that the format of the dvd's is flash controlled. i bought a big tv and i want to sit back have a drink and watch about geometry approximation settings for displacement mapping. not have to sit at my computer.

oh well


francesca how was vacation?


kurt :thumbsup:

francescaluce
08-17-2004, 02:55 PM
francesca how was vacation?
too short.. :scream:




ciao
francesca

valentine
08-17-2004, 03:05 PM
i got a great reply to the symmetry-question on xsibase.com - heres a quote:

Hi I'm a fairly new XSI user too, but I get the symmetry working. Try this out
1) make a new polygon sphere
2) go to polygon selection mode
3) mark left half of the sphere in top view
4) press delete
The boundry edges should now turn cyan
5) select: modify->poly mesh->symmetrize polygons
6) select: property->symmetry map (default is YZ plane) so no need to change anything
7) in the transform section select the sym button (You can right click on it to ensure that is in YZ plane as well)
http://www.xsibase.com/forum/YaBBImages/cool.gif press m to go to the move point tool
9) move one off the point around and the mirrored point should move as well

Hope I the above description works for you...

Regards
Morten this works so damn good - have fun, using it ;)

@ kurt: thanks :) you are right - ive been in contact with the softimage support team and some resellers, and they are really helpful and customer oriented !

best regards
jannis

valentine
08-17-2004, 03:30 PM
i got a great reply to the symmetry-question on xsibase.com - heres a quote:

this works so damn good - have fun, using it ;)

@ kurt: thanks :) you are right - ive been in contact with the softimage support team and some resellers, and they are really helpful and customer oriented !

best regards
jannis

damned - its not exactly what i need :/
indeed it works while moving the vertices but when i add new edges/polys/vertices to the geometry the other side does not update...

any other options/ideas ?

regards
jannis

comanche
08-17-2004, 04:07 PM
francesca's suggestion works pretty well: create an instance of your model. Scale it to -1 on one axis. Switch to hidden line removal.

cheers,
Andreas

Gwot
08-17-2004, 04:11 PM
Delete half your object, clone it, scale the clone -1 on the x axis, or whatever axis you want to mirror across. Now you can edit the original and the clone will update accordingly. You can only edit the original object, and there's no welded seam so moving verts on the seams will open them up. XSI could definitely use a proper mirror or symmetry modeling function but for now this is acceptable. It's an acceptable way to work but could be better.

TheLostVertex
08-17-2004, 04:35 PM
Yeah, symmetry modeling isnt xsi's strong suit. I mostly dont even bother making an instance of one half, i just model one half, and ever once in a while I duplicate, merger the halves, then delete half the object if it is getting messy around the seems. re aligns everything well enough, but takes up a minute of your time. O well, heres hoping Avid buys pixologic :bounce:

-Steven

preludian
08-17-2004, 06:16 PM
As long as one hasn't have to add detail, but merely push points with 'm' than manipulating components symmetrically is great. If one has to add geom. than I think I would prefer doing it the The Lost Vertex way. Even in LW one has to delete one half and mirror it sometimes.

PS: Hi Andreas, bist du jetzt auch im XSI Boot :) was ist mit LW, ganz weg diesmal ;) ?

SevenString
08-17-2004, 06:17 PM
regarding shipping: I noticed that the wording on the XSI site says that they will BEGIN shipping the WEEK OF August 16th.

My interpretation is that this doesn't mean that they have shipped shipped everyone's orders on Monday (yesterday), but that they will START shipping orders SOMETIME this week.

They're probably very busy with the mad rush on XSI caused by the price drop. ;)

Signal2Noise
08-17-2004, 06:19 PM
regarding shipping: I noticed that the wording on the XSI site says that they will BEGIN shipping the WEEK OF August 16th.

My interpretation is that this doesn't mean that they have shipped shipped everyone's orders on Monday (yesterday), but that they will START shipping orders SOMETIME this week.

They're probably very busy with the mad rush on XSI caused by the price drop. ;)
True. And even if Avid started shipping on the 16th does anyone really expect their package to arrive already???

comanche
08-17-2004, 08:34 PM
As long as one hasn't have to add detail, but merely push points with 'm' than manipulating components symmetrically is great. If one has to add geom. than I think I would prefer doing it the The Lost Vertex way. Even in LW one has to delete one half and mirror it sometimes.

PS: Hi Andreas, bist du jetzt auch im XSI Boot :) was ist mit LW, ganz weg diesmal ;) ?
Right, even in LW the symmetry does not work with all the modelling tools. I can live with the symmetry "workaround" in XSI. It's modelling power is really great - from what I've seen so far.

Yes, I couldn't resist to purchase XSI Foundation. It's a steal. LW will be sold this month. No looking back, just straight forward to XSI :-)))))

preludian
08-17-2004, 09:41 PM
No looking back, just straight forward to XSI :-))))).. and to Cinema I presume ;) Well, I'll sell one license of Cinema, keep one LW for me ( even with all their effort NT didn't kill all my trust in LW's future :D ) but XSI is soooo powerfull, it has the modern architecture of Cinema and the direct working method of LW, only its stabelness is more like AM, pushed up the subd while in quickrender, crash..., they should do something about it...

Signal2Noise
08-18-2004, 12:54 AM
True. And even if Avid started shipping on the 16th does anyone really expect their package to arrive already???
Well. I'll be a monkey's uncle! I spoke too soon. I got home from work today and my XSI parcel was sitting on the kitchen counter for me! My wife said UPS showed up at about 11 a.m. today with it. Just checked my email now and there was an Order Confirmation/Shipping email from Soft...time-stamped 4:06 pm! ;)

WOOT! Time to play!

TheLostVertex
08-18-2004, 02:58 AM
Well. I'll be a monkey's uncle! I spoke too soon. I got home from work today and my XSI parcel was sitting on the kitchen counter for me! My wife said UPS showed up at about 11 a.m. today with it. Just checked my email now and there was an Order Confirmation/Shipping email from Soft...time-stamped 4:06 pm! ;)

WOOT! Time to play!

I dont have a wife to sign for my packages :D

SheepFactory
08-18-2004, 03:23 AM
.. and to Cinema I presume ;) Well, I'll sell one license of Cinema, keep one LW for me ( even with all their effort NT didn't kill all my trust in LW's future :D ) but XSI is soooo powerfull, it has the modern architecture of Cinema and the direct working method of LW, only its stabelness is more like AM, pushed up the subd while in quickrender, crash..., they should do something about it...

thats not XSI fault but the shitty memory management of windows. Turn off autoupdate in render region and update with RMB instead , your crashes will go away.

JDex
08-18-2004, 03:30 AM
Or get more memory. Actually I've been running 4.0 on my memory lacking laptop and haven't had nearly as many crashes. Looks like XSI and MR have taken some steps to reduce the memory management issues that Windows creates.

preludian
08-18-2004, 12:42 PM
Thanks for your Tip Sheep Factory, I'll try it, because it's really only the quickrender that crashes sometimes.
JDex: I have 1Gig of Ram, that should be enough IMO. BTW how do you work on your laptop, I mean what res do have, mine is 1024x768 only, and the right menu is cut. Any tips??

JDex
08-18-2004, 12:57 PM
JDex: I have 1Gig of Ram, that should be enough IMO. BTW how do you work on your laptop, I mean what res do have, mine is 1024x768 only, and the right menu is cut. Any tips??
1G should be good as long as your not digging too deep into the memory hogging render options or having massive textures. One thing that may help is making sure your paging file in windows is on a separate harddrive from your system/si files... and make sure it gets pretty large. I have mine fixed at 3 times the amount of ram on my two slower systems (laptop and old workstation) and 1.5 times on my newer workstation (which has 4G).

My laptop has a 1440x900 res... a bit of the interface is cut off, but you can access everything missing (at my res) through the menu bar.

preludian
08-18-2004, 01:15 PM
4 G ram?? Gulp :eek: care to share :) ?

My laptop has a 1440x900 res...
nice, really nice... but ok, if everything is accessible through the main menu bar I should be able to do small things on mine too, not that I like working on laptops very much, I try do work on my main comp as often as I can...

ColinCohen
08-18-2004, 02:31 PM
Actually I've been running 4.0 on my memory lacking laptop and haven't had nearly as many crashes.
I'm curious how you use XSI on a laptop when so many functions are mapped to the MMB. Do you use an external mouse? Do you remap all those commands?

ub52
08-18-2004, 03:51 PM
I'm curious how you use XSI on a laptop when so many functions are mapped to the MMB. Do you use an external mouse? Do you remap all those commands?


I've been running LW and now XSI on my Dell laptop for at least a year now. I rarely use my desktop any more, which by the way is a much slower machine. That is not the main reason though. I can do anything on my laptop that I could do on my desktop and it is just much more convenient. It goes wherever I go. I have a wireless network both at home and at work for connectivety, so I'm not anchored to a desk. I always use an external mouse so that isn't a problem. As far as limited res, the newer laptops are available with much larger screens. I run mine at 1920x1200. I also have 2Gig's of ram and a built in DVD burner, and it didn't cost any more more than I would have spent for a comparable desktop workstation. What more do I need.

-ub52

flingster
08-18-2004, 04:10 PM
just trying the demo out...can someone tell me how i set the dpi or ppi on a render output...
i can find resolution eg 1200 x 600 or whatever and pixel ratio...but can't seem to find a dpi setting probably not going about it the right way but anybody point me in the right direction...
say 300dpi x 2367 x 3551 (20cm x 30cm print at 300dpi)....also what the max resolution...it seems to indicate it can really go up high...eg cinemas is a max of 16000x16000 for print.
any info on this would be cool thanks.
:shrug:

TonyEdwards
08-18-2004, 05:31 PM
just trying the demo out...can someone tell me how i set the dpi or ppi on a render output...
i can find resolution eg 1200 x 600 or whatever and pixel ratio...but can't seem to find a dpi setting probably not going about it the right way but anybody point me in the right direction...
say 300dpi x 2367 x 3551 (20cm x 30cm print at 300dpi)....also what the max resolution...it seems to indicate it can really go up high...eg cinemas is a max of 16000x16000 for print.
any info on this would be cool thanks.
:shrug:
I think what you're looking for is under Render - Render/ Options. Look for the tab labeled "Format" and you will be able to change the Resolution settings there. If you like I can post a screenshot.

Hope that helps.


[Edit] D'oh. Next time I'll read the whole thing. Sorry I don't know about the dpi or max res.

flingster
08-18-2004, 05:42 PM
I think what you're looking for is under Render - Render/ Options. Look for the tab labeled "Format" and you will be able to change the Resolution settings there. If you like I can post a screenshot.

Hope that helps.


[Edit] D'oh. Next time I'll read the whole thing. Sorry I don't know about the dpi or max res.
thanks for trying anyways...i'll have another look on that pallette but didn't think it was there only the res..not the dpi..but it might be related to the file type settings somewhere...so i'll keep looking for it..thanks though.:shrug:

ThE_JacO
08-18-2004, 06:25 PM
dpi only make sense in the print world, as all they change is the resolution/print size ratio and nothing else.
there's no dpi settings in XSI (video and film don't need them), but since to go to print you will need to do some grading in Photoshop and at the very least check of illegal colors, just set them when you save the photoshop output.

JDex
08-18-2004, 08:33 PM
I'm curious how you use XSI on a laptop when so many functions are mapped to the MMB. Do you use an external mouse? Do you remap all those commands?
External mouse.

MitchVFX
08-18-2004, 09:13 PM
Art and an internal laptop mouse don't mix. Heck, these days you can drag a wireless mouse on your leg and it will work. But, it's probably better to use a table top :D

SevenString
08-18-2004, 09:16 PM
hmm... a p4 notebook with a crapload of ram and a 17 inch screen is sounding really attractive now.


I can just picture sitting in my local coffee shop for hours, XSI-ing away!

SheepFactory
08-18-2004, 09:27 PM
hmm... a p4 notebook with a crapload of ram and a 17 inch screen is sounding really attractive now.


I can just picture sitting in my local coffee shop for hours, XSI-ing away!

I really want to do that too :)

JDex
08-18-2004, 09:34 PM
Actually it's not all it's cracked up to be. As soon as someone catches a glimpse of your screen and that bizarre unfamiliar interface... you'll be mobbed with

"What is that?"
"What does that do?"
"So the computer makes animations?"
"Oh, you make the animations, must be easy since the software does all the work?"
"The software doesn't do all the work, so what's the point?"
"That look's easy, can you burn me a copy?"
"$10000, why not download it from kazaa?"
"Render a gollum!"
"You can't render a gollum?"
"That software sucks!"

I only really use it on my laptop at work (not a cg job), and when my main workstation is acting up (like now).

flingster
08-18-2004, 09:36 PM
dpi only make sense in the print world, as all they change is the resolution/print size ratio and nothing else.
there's no dpi settings in XSI (video and film don't need them), but since to go to print you will need to do some grading in Photoshop and at the very least check of illegal colors, just set them when you save the photoshop output.
is there a limit then on resolution if its suited to film? eg something like cinema4d's at 16000x16000.:shrug:

SevenString
08-18-2004, 09:37 PM
ha! good point!

maybe i'll sit in a corner, with a note taped to the back of the screen: "do not disturb"

flingster
08-18-2004, 09:41 PM
Actually it's not all it's cracked up to be. As soon as someone catches a glimpse of your screen and that bizarre unfamiliar interface... you'll be mobbed with

"What is that?"
"What does that do?"
"So the computer makes animations?"
"Oh, you make the animations, must be easy since the software does all the work?"
"The software doesn't do all the work, so what's the point?"
"That look's easy, can you burn me a copy?"
"$10000, why not download it from kazaa?"
"Render a gollum!"
"You can't render a gollum?"
"That software sucks!"

I only really use it on my laptop at work (not a cg job), and when my main workstation is acting up (like now).
LOL....these comments are so true...there is no wonder people don't take digital art seriously people just aren't informed about this stuff...they think you can just knock up a gollum and then do 50,000 prints of it...so it can't be worth anything...ooh and can i have it in pink! would they tell ask someone working on oils to do the same!

SevenString
08-18-2004, 09:50 PM
it's like the story of the dentist at a party... as soon as people find out that she's a dentist, it's like:


"Oh really? Could you take a quick look at my wisdom teeth? I'm having some pain here."

"Hey, call my office and make a freaking appointment like everyone else!"


And let the CG artist work, please.

Signal2Noise
08-18-2004, 10:00 PM
Actually it's not all it's cracked up to be. As soon as someone catches a glimpse of your screen and that bizarre unfamiliar interface... you'll be mobbed with

"What is that?"
"What does that do?"
"So the computer makes animations?"
"Oh, you make the animations, must be easy since the software does all the work?"
"The software doesn't do all the work, so what's the point?"
"That look's easy, can you burn me a copy?"
"$10000, why not download it from kazaa?"
"Render a gollum!"
"You can't render a gollum?"
"That software sucks!"

I only really use it on my laptop at work (not a cg job), and when my main workstation is acting up (like now).
ROFL! This scenario would make an awesome animated short. Hmmm...;)

JDex
08-18-2004, 10:15 PM
ROFL! This scenario would make an awesome animated short. Hmmm...;)
Go for it!

I get a writing credit. :D

Hazmat
08-19-2004, 04:53 AM
Hi folks,

I just wanted to confirm that 3D on a laptop isn't as bad as you'd think... I do all of my graphics work (now including XSI) on my (now don't laugh) eMachines M6805. When I'm at home, I use a dual monitor set up (but not with XSI yet) by adding a 17" monitor to the mix. The other 60% of the time, I'm using it at my girlfriend's, at work (on my lunch), or while traveling. If you really need portability, it can't be beat...

If you want people to leave you alone while you work, just talk to yourself while you work... People seem to shy away... :D

Oh BTW, my screen resolution is 1280 x 800, and I don't seem to have any trouble, but I may be too new with XSI to detect it...

crgowo
08-21-2004, 05:40 AM
didnt get a chance to read all the threads so dont know if this had been stated ... seems the thread has been highjacked :) but i found this on another forum.

"Yep all you have to do is creat your object, With the object selected->get->property->symmerty Map. From there you can adjust the axis and such. Now before you do and modeling there is a SYM button on the transform panal. Just click it and go."

JDex
08-21-2004, 05:53 AM
didnt get a chance to read all the threads so dont know if this had been stated ... seems the thread has been highjacked :)
Hijacked?

Yes several times... but it's a funny thread anyway.

BTW... I think I'm going to make a short on that scenario. It'll be fun :D

valentine
08-21-2004, 02:07 PM
didnt get a chance to read all the threads so dont know if this had been stated ... seems the thread has been highjacked :) but i found this on another forum.

"Yep all you have to do is creat your object, With the object selected->get->property->symmerty Map. From there you can adjust the axis and such. Now before you do and modeling there is a SYM button on the transform panal. Just click it and go." thx for your reply crgowo ! i got a description about this technique on xsibase.com... i was so happy with it till i realized that this only works while translating vertices/polys/edges but not when addnig new geometry to the mesh :/

anyway - i hope avid includes this essentiell feature to the next release. another thing that should be implemented is a "extrude along normals" function and clone points (not just polys) ! :)

thx again & best regards
jannis

heres a quote from the first page:

i got a great reply to the symmetry-question on xsibase.com - heres a quote:

Hi I'm a fairly new XSI user too, but I get the symmetry working. Try this out
1) make a new polygon sphere
2) go to polygon selection mode
3) mark left half of the sphere in top view
4) press delete
The boundry edges should now turn cyan
5) select: modify->poly mesh->symmetrize polygons
6) select: property->symmetry map (default is YZ plane) so no need to change anything
7) in the transform section select the sym button (You can right click on it to ensure that is in YZ plane as well)
http://www.xsibase.com/forum/YaBBImages/cool.gif press m to go to the move point tool
9) move one off the point around and the mirrored point should move as well

Hope I the above description works for you...

Regards
Morten


this works so damn good - have fun, using it ;)

TheLostVertex
08-21-2004, 04:00 PM
anyway - i hope avid includes this essentiell feature to the next release. another thing that should be implemented is a "extrude along normals" function and clone points (not just polys) ! :)
[/size][/size]
What do you need to clone points for? You can allways try ctr+d, it will add points around the selected one in the way beveling it would, but without changing the geometry.

Hijacked?

Yes several times... but it's a funny thread anyway.

BTW... I think I'm going to make a short on that scenario. It'll be fun :D

OH PLEASE!!!!! That would be so awsome, but you have to make sure its a starbucks, it just wouldnt be the same if it wasnt. hehe

JDex
08-21-2004, 08:43 PM
OH PLEASE!!!!! That would be so awsome, but you have to make sure its a starbucks, it just wouldnt be the same if it wasnt. hehe
I have initiated it as a collaborative project at the Pixel Corps and am begining pre-production as we speak. I have a couple of people onboard and will likely have more in time as things move along. Expect an update in a few months time... now I am off


*scurrys down the stairs to the pre-production cave*

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