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preludian
08-12-2004, 12:30 AM
Hi,

hhmm strangely and annoyingley I am having several stability issues with XSI4.0. For example when I open the tut file REN_e1_Frosted_vial_metal_corners_done.scn , open up a render tree in A, make a camera view in D and then delete the image1 color connection then make a quickrender area in in D (sometimes XSI crashes then) and then reassign the color connection to the Image1_layer whilst having the quickrender open and active, XSI always crashes upon rerendering the area.

Anybody else with the Foundation having stability problems??

Ziah
08-12-2004, 12:34 AM
sounds like ur card im a nnewb to xsi as well but try right clicking and turning down the refinement level in the quick render region

preludian
08-12-2004, 12:40 AM
Nahh, don't think it's the card, don't have any problems with LW, Cinema and Zbrush. It's not that XSI crashes fully and directly, it first says that it's going to crash, the scene has been saved correctly and then when I press ok it's gone (of course XSI can't recreate the file he save, that would be too nice). That's why I'd like to here from other 'new' XSI Foundation owners if they have some problems, maybe even recreate it.

titaniumdave
08-12-2004, 01:01 AM
I'm not exactly sure what you're doing when you say open the rendertree in A and camera view in D. All you are doing is removing the image1 connection to the phong shader and making a render region? If thats all you're doing I just did it and it didn't crash.

JDex
08-12-2004, 01:28 AM
What video card and driver pack? Don't rule out hardware just because other apps work... not all apps work the same, or call the same functions from the GPU.

Sil3
08-12-2004, 01:31 AM
Nahh, don't think it's the card, don't have any problems with LW, Cinema and Zbrush.
Itīs probably the card, believe it. XSI is kinda picky with Graphic Cards, although it seems to works fine on the so caled gaming cards, crashes are much more frequent in this type of cards vs a Quadro series or Wildcat series, where it runs smoothly all day long :)

I notice that diference everyday at work.

Ziah
08-12-2004, 03:27 AM
first off im a lw user and xsi programing seems to be differentl......really diffrent from its basic programing operations to more complex ones....


You have to think that ur working in a modeler and layout and compositor all that at once with xsi .........lw works these apps seperate and lastly does not use and log the same construction programing ...i.e lw doesn't work on node based history like xsi and maya


i had some probelms two....at first i don't have anythiung highend im running on a g59oooxt gold edition ...i crank up the setting to and no more probs

whats ur specs preludian?

titaniumdave
08-12-2004, 03:30 AM
Ummm what?

titaniumdave
08-12-2004, 03:43 AM
first off im a lw user and xsi programing seems to be differentl......really diffrent from its basic programing operations to more complex ones....


You have to think that ur working in a modeler and layout and compositor all that at once with xsi .........lw works these apps seperate and lastly does not use and log the same construction programing ...i.e lw doesn't work on node based history like xsi and maya

Is there a point to this?

GavinG
08-12-2004, 03:51 AM
Ziah, comparing LW to XSI workflow in this case is completley pointless. The fact that XSI is a complete package with no sub-programs or plug-ins doesn't really relate to the poor guys problem.

Its more than likely a graphics card issue, XSI deals best with nVIDIA cards. I've heard of many problems using different types. If we can't answer it here, your best bet is asking Soft what the deal is, they'll tell you.

Gav

Ziah
08-12-2004, 03:53 AM
nope know it all you tell me :wise:


he sez he has a problem with his stabilty he sed something about lw lightwave doesn't use as much system resources on my computer at least as maya or xsi.... so im just droping in some comments big boy...i don't think its the problem ..since everyone is raving now about ati and xsi..i was just speaking my opinion which may or may not have been pointless

GavinG
08-12-2004, 04:01 AM
Well...yes, in this case it was kind of pointless. His problem seems more than likely a card issue, not a LW issue. Card compatability questions pop up all the time here, you'll see that as time goes on and even more now with the amount of users coming in who are used to their non-nVIDIA cards.


Thanks for calling me Big Boy though, kind of flattering.

-Gavin

titaniumdave
08-12-2004, 04:03 AM
Also ziah please get a basic understanding of grammar so we know what you're talking about.

Ziah
08-12-2004, 04:05 AM
lol gav ahahah i din't mean you when i sed that .......note i sed know it all and i wasn't trying to tap anyone on the annoyance meter.....like i sed in my first post im a newb all i was doing was trouble shooting ... (weakly attempting to help)

nice troll character by the way gav very shrekish

but its kool if you wanna call ur self :love:big boi

serious tho im a dude and i have a girl :thumbsup:

CraigT
08-12-2004, 06:20 AM
I've been getting occasional crashes with the 30 day Foundation demo also. I was just moving a slider for a color property one time. I'm running a Quadro4 750XGL in a dual XEON system that I run MAYA on so it was rather unexpected. Maybe MAYA is screwing with it in the hopes I don't purchase the XSI license- it will get pretty ignored if I do. :-))))

preludian
08-12-2004, 08:58 AM
Well I have a P4 2.66 Pentium with 1 GB Ram, Windows 2000 SVP 4 and a GeForce4 Ti4200 with AGP 8x. I would never buy an ATI again...

But as I read here, XSI seems pretty stable normally, but is a bit like a diva with graphic cards. Is this the right conclusion?

titaniumdave: The A and D views are only my view setup, did you reconnect the color and whilst having the quickrender open??

I very appreciate your help guys.

titaniumdave
08-12-2004, 12:57 PM
Well I have a P4 2.66 Pentium with 1 GB Ram, Windows 2000 SVP 4 and a GeForce4 Ti4200 with AGP 8x. I would never buy an ATI again...
titaniumdave: The A and D views are only my view setup, did you reconnect the color and whilst having the quickrender open??

I didn't try that last night but I just tried it now and it didn't crash. I created the render region and then disconnected the node then reconnected again. From what people have said I believe that XSI is picky when it comes to cards. From the look of your specs, the card is the only thing really standing out because you have a better system than I do with the only difference being I have Win XP Pro and a 5600 fx.

Karma Mule
08-12-2004, 01:14 PM
I also just purchased Foundation (what a wonderful deal!), and downloaded it. I'm eagerly awaiting the DVDs, and in the meantime have begun following the documentation tutorials available in the download area. I too have had some (relatively minor so far) stability issues, but they manifest differently. In one case I tried switching layouts and the 4 view windows went blank (all gray), though all the menus and buttons around them continued responding. Another time the top menu (File, etc..) went white and didn't work. Once again, all other menus and buttons were responding normally. In both cases, a restart of the app resolved the issue. (And I have since been happily switching layouts without a problem.) Another odd(?) behavior: everytime after I start XSI it minimizes itself to the taskbar and I have to click on it to bring the window up. Is that normal behavior?

I'm running this on a P4 3.06 GHz with an ATI x800 Pro card on Windows XP, using ATI's (beta) 3.9 drivers. I know the card and drivers are very new, and assume that's part of my issue, although all other apps (including C4D which I got in April) are running quite nicely with it.

On a side note: I've been lurking on CGTalk for quite awhile, and have really appreciated the informative (and often entertaining) posts from you all here and on the C4D side of the things in helping me choose to first purchase C4D and now XSI for myself. (I wasn't really planning the XSI purchase, but couldn't resist after the price slash and a read-through of the feature set) I look forward to actively participating more.... I'll be playing with my card and driver settings and let you know if anything makes a difference.

Thanks!
Eddie

preludian
08-12-2004, 01:57 PM
Hi there,

after defragmenting my HD's and installing the newest drivers (directx9.0c and nvidia) and still having the same problem I did a small Wink presentation so you can have a better view. You need a Flash Plugin to view it and the res is 1600x1200. Size ~ 700kb

http://www.smolka1.de/temp/xsi_prob_v001.htm

titaniumdave
08-12-2004, 02:17 PM
Sorry preludian, I'm not sure whats going on. I did the exact same thing you did without it crashing. I'm thinking its your video card but don't know for sure. I think you should shoot a email to softimage including your system specs and maybe even a link to that file you just posted. They'll be able to tell you of any known issues with your card.

Karma Mule
I suspect your problem is due to the ati card. From what I've read ati seems to have issues with xsi. As for the minimize issue, right click the shortcut for xsi and make sure run: is set to maximize or normal.

preludian
08-12-2004, 02:35 PM
Thank you very for your help titaniumdave, funny that I'm able to render but the failure is only with the quickrender region. I'll email softimage....

titaniumdave
08-12-2004, 03:14 PM
No problem.

MattClary
08-12-2004, 03:48 PM
Preludian, see all that junk in the lower right of your task bar? That could be part of the problem. Try to get rid of some of the excess baggage.

preludian
08-12-2004, 03:56 PM
Not so easy MattClary, killed most of them, but nothing. I don't want to reformat I don't want to reformat I don't want to reformat I don't want to reformat I don't want to reformat I don't want to reformat...

MattClary
08-12-2004, 04:16 PM
I don't know, man. Have you considered formatting?

Sil3
08-12-2004, 04:27 PM
Try soft modding your 4200 into a quadro, it might work. Another thing is to disable all the shinny stuff from your 4200, like AA etc, put in Best Performance instead of Picture Quality.


Hope it helps

CraigT
08-12-2004, 05:15 PM
I found a repeatable cause for at least *one* of my crashes using the 30day Foundation demo. I select the "Dual-Standard and Views and Shelves" and then click on the "Schematic" button(on the panels on my secondary monitor) and immediate crash(appears to be a "Divide by 0" error). I can open the Schematic view using the Views menu and it's OK. Could someone else using Foundation on a dual monitor system please check this? Thanks. I have to admit, I love many things about XSI but it seems to be a little on the fragile side(at least on my system). OTOH, I am a beta tester for a few companies since bugs do seem to seek me out. :-) Of course this doesn't mean it's an XSI problem causing my current problems but I did change my Quadro 4 options from the MAYA preset to the XSI preset to at see if it would help things.

Craig

preludian
08-12-2004, 07:39 PM
soft moding? could you please this further...

since bugs do seem to seek me out.
Yeah they like me too, after working only one hour with LW8 I directly found several reproducable bugs ;)

CraigT
08-12-2004, 09:33 PM
Well, I guess my occasional(or consistent in the case I mentioned) crashes can't have bothered me toooo much since I just placed an order for Foundation. LOL. I moved from LW to MAYA about 18 months ago but was wishing at that time that XSI was more affordable- so bought MAYA instead- but I guess I ended up with the best of both worlds. I find XSI waaaaay more intuitive than MAYA but LW was intuitive for me too so it's probably the similarities in the straight forward way of doing things.

Craig

preludian
08-12-2004, 09:42 PM
Just wanted to mail softimage my problem, they want a ID or SID code, nothing there in my about window as they noted, and without it no email I can even send ;( a way to prevent bug reports? Any idea how I can send them my bug??

Karma Mule
08-12-2004, 11:32 PM
I suspect your problem is due to the ati card. From what I've read ati seems to have issues with xsi. As for the minimize issue, right click the shortcut for xsi and make sure run: is set to maximize or normal. titaniumdave, the setting was on 'normal', so out of curiousity I changed it to 'maximize'. Now when I start it, after the splash screen I see a big white square in the middle of my monitor, and XSI still opens up minimized. I turned off the 'overdrive' feature that let the card overclock itself as long as it didn't get too hot, and also set my OpenGL settings back to default from the customized ones I had, so let's see if that makes any difference. Luckily, the stability issues have been minor so far, so we'll see if this helps any or not.

-Eddie

MattClary
08-13-2004, 01:07 PM
Any idea how I can send them my bug??
A bug is something everyone would see. What you have is a malfunction, probably caused by a software conflict.

Ziah
08-13-2004, 01:46 PM
Now im have the same as the starter of this thread
Its a simple scene with a small sphere. The mesh is at the default settings ( lowest)

I'd like to say that the problem is deriving from the render region tool. Unlike the starter of this thread the problem is not occuring for me so soon. Its occuring when im updating textures too rapidly

My questions are

how does the quick render region tool work basically ? Does it use ram similar to fprime in lw??

Is this a tool thats suppose to be used sparingly ( that is to say between toggling my textures should i wait for the render region to finshed before i adjust any of my color sliders)

Im running of 3.2 cpu, 1 gb ram and a geforce 5900xt ultra gold card (me thinks)

CraigT
08-13-2004, 05:16 PM
Just an update on my crashes when using the schematic view tab in one of the dual preset layouts- I fixed it by deleting the XSI Preferences. Well, it looks like XSI is like most other apps. around in that deleting Preferences is the first place to start when something is amiss. :-) I always kept a backup up of LW's config files and learned to do the same with other similar apps. once things are set up and working OK.

Craig

preludian
08-13-2004, 06:47 PM
MattClary, I think reproducable stability problems can also be a bug. I booted a virgin XP partition 1280x1024 and very clean, same crash! Full Rendering ok. I installed XSI on my Laptop with a GeForce4 440, no problem, but a blue screen when I choose directx9 render. Me think XSI is a little buggy or at least very picky concerning more or less standard configurations.

But the question is, have I no possibility to contact softimage to send them a report?? Do they sell the Foundation version for 499$ like a car, buyed like you saw it? That would let me feel like a second choice customer, pretty bad and let alone. Normally every company with support services have at least a free 90 day period where you can ask for support. I payed 545 Euros for XSI which is alot of money still and the least I can expect is that softimage doesn't hide behind their service contract curtain.

preludian
08-14-2004, 10:36 PM
Ahhhhhhhahhahahahahhhhahhhhhahhhhahhhhhhhh:scream: I found it I found it I found it I found it I found it.....XSI quickrender is now stable ouahahahahahah, after having turned my GeForce4 TI4200 into a Quadro, after recopying an old backup of my partition to the start, after having installed XP SVP2 after tearing all extra PCI cards out of my system after having nearly killed myself, thrown my Computer away, after endless sleepless nights IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII HAVE FOUND THE BUGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG!!!! It must be a bug, ouahahahahaha I'm driving insane, shining is here to come...ahahahhahahahahha

You'll never guess why, NEVER and nobody tell me to RTFM on page x89eu3918 the 3j873 sentence where it states in cyrilic fontsize 2 px in ligh gray NOT I repeat NOT to use a '$' in a path, I repeat NOT TO USE A '$' IN A PATH!!!.

It's an old trick, which always worked fine, to keep important files or directories up in the listing. By simply deleting the '$' ( not the quotes, just the dollar sign!) everything rendered finowfine.

Didn't try which characters are nonos too, hopefully not the underscore (_), but maybe my journey to hell and back may help others too before they get insane and throw XSI away.

Bye now...:thumbsup:

BTW I don't work under XP, but I didn't want to kill my working partition under Win2k, I wasn't so insane :)

Obizzz
08-14-2004, 11:01 PM
glad to hear you solved it!

3DDave
08-15-2004, 07:35 PM
I would have to agree that perhaps the render tree is not as stabil as the rest of the program. I have been using large 24MB textures and have crashed numerous times when working in the render tree.

JDex
08-16-2004, 12:41 AM
This morning I was testing with my SuperRez Earth Texture (687M) and had no stability issues... of course I had better performance with a .map file.

3DDave
08-16-2004, 03:41 AM
That's good to hear, I am sure its just a matter of learning the program.

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