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View Full Version : CINEMA 4D R9 announced


Srek
08-10-2004, 04:35 PM
http://www.maxon.de/index_e.html

Overhauled modelling
N-Gon support
Cloth
New and enhanced CA Tools
Sub Polygon Displacement
Many Worklow and Interface Improvements
.
.
.


Have fun
Srek

Lyr
08-10-2004, 04:41 PM
Wow, that's a very nice upgrade, good job Maxon!

retrop
08-10-2004, 05:32 PM
yay, the feature list is already down :D

retrop

Jan
08-10-2004, 05:43 PM
Wow, it looks really impressive... Are there already some Animations of the Cloth-Modifier online? Or Test renders of the Sub Polygon Displacement? Can't wait to download a demo-version :)And N-Gons...finally...i never want to see a triangle in my entire life :D :D :D

:applause: :applause: :applause:

Jan

Goon
08-10-2004, 05:50 PM
Here's a vid of the cloth: http://www.designexpress.be/Media/movies/Oink-clothilde.mov

It doesn't look that great. More like plastic wrap than cloth. Hopefully they come out with better examples.

There's also some examples of the micro-poly displacement in the c4d forum.

Jan
08-10-2004, 05:59 PM
I think, it looks already fine. But you're right, it looks a bit like rubber, but i think, it's only a parameter-thing :)

Lyr
08-10-2004, 06:01 PM
And look at how the corners bounce, not very cloth like. It's a start though.

retrop
08-10-2004, 06:16 PM
lol, "short break - we're back soon" :D i guess they didn't expect such a big request in the first two hours..

retrop

michaeli
08-10-2004, 06:37 PM
Then Maxon shows discreet and others what a real upgrade should be!

Maxon rocks!!:thumbsup:

boxorcist
08-10-2004, 06:52 PM
Upgrade looks OK - Ngons, phew!! BUT, XSI less than $500, excellent reviews before price drop. mmmm, time to think...

Byla
08-10-2004, 06:52 PM
we'll see bout the cloth thing, but way to go Maxon! Impressed indeed.

JamesMK
08-10-2004, 07:32 PM
Awesomeness - and the thread concerning this in the Cinema forum ought to be plugged stat! :D

leigh
08-10-2004, 07:34 PM
Exciting news! :)

"Overhauled modelling" - hmmm I wonder what that could be?

I've plugged this one on the front page.

Srek
08-10-2004, 07:43 PM
Exciting news! :)

"Overhauled modelling" - hmmm I wonder what that could be?

I've plugged this one on the front page.
:)
We are talking about a completely revamped modeling workflow.
Thanks for plugging
Cheers
Srek

Srek
08-10-2004, 07:46 PM
Seems we forgot to mention a number of "smaller" things from R9 on the website.
Well, here is a list of things that came to my mind.

Workflow
- No Active Tool Manager any more, it has been replaced by the AM who can be used in multiple instances if you liked the old worklfow
- Drag & Drop for most Text input fields (Selection Restrictions etc.)
- Animation in the AM by using the red dots / circles for each property
- Almost every animatable porperty can be used in the new Head Up Display
- Mouse centred Global Popup with the most common commands
- Tearable menus for fast interface adjustment
- Head Up Display for many viewport and scene informations as well as nearly every object property. Properties can be grouped and modified as well as animated in the viewport
- Wastly extended viewport options
- Multi Key shortcuts
- Optional Fin display for bones

Modelling
- Highlighting
- Tweak mode
- Auto Switch mode
- Brush Tool (Smear, Pull, Surface, Normal, Repel, Spin, Twister, Vortex and Smooth for modelling, Paint, Blur, Intensity and BLeed for Vertex weights) Several Fallof options including User defined
- Iron
- Slide
- Stitch & Sew
- Collapse
- Bevel with user defined spline
- Close Polygon Hole
- Measure & Construct
- All older tools have been completely overhauled all of them now interactive.
- Selection functions: Loop, Ring, Outline, Fill
- Easier selection conversion by using qualifiers when switching modes
- Multiple Object modelling
- Isoline Editing
- Deformed editing
- N-Gon on/off option for most tools
- Pivot point

Rendering
- Cached soft shadows
- Increased Raydepth (500 instead of 50)
- New Fresenel Option for more realistic glass
- Sub Polygon Displacement with different smoothing options (can replace HNs in some situations)
- Displacement now with Intensity, Intensity (centered), RG, RGB (local/world), 16 Bit per channel support

Character Animation
- New fast Hard-IK
- Faster and more predictable Soft IK
- IK / FK Blending
- Auto IK Lock
- Pole Vectors
- Motion Blending with ghosting
- Motion retargeting to match motions to different skeletons
- Tearable Cloth
- Cachable Cloth
- Cloth NURBS that allows to give cloths thickness
- Selected Polygons can be excluded from collision- Posemixer is now a Tag and more powerfull then ever :)
- Quaternion interpolation (three variations)

Import Export
- RPC
- Combustion, Final Cut
- NXN Alienbrain

General
- G5 Optimisation

I'm sure i missed out many details though ;)

Have fun
Srek

mustique
08-10-2004, 07:48 PM
C4D really shines with every version. I don't use C4D but remember how easy it was to get grips with while I used a demo. Hope that they'll keep on putting pressure on competition
and give other sofware vendors a run for their money.

NUKE-CG
08-10-2004, 07:49 PM
Hahaha in the features page: Modeling with N-Gons - has a picture of characters made in C4D with balaclavas on with ransom-like text demanding n-gon support, talk about stupidity on Maxon's part, 9 releases to get n-gons.. bow your heads in shame.

decembermoon
08-10-2004, 07:50 PM
so , how much for a new purchase ?

leigh
08-10-2004, 07:53 PM
NUKE-CG, if you can't say anything intelligent, then don't say anything at all.

JamesMK
08-10-2004, 07:54 PM
Hahaha in the features page: Modeling with N-Gons - has a picture of characters made in C4D with balaclavas on with ransom-like text demanding n-gon support,
That image was a bit of an in-joke among the users. If you don't get it - you don't get it ;)

skillet
08-10-2004, 08:01 PM
cinema is really comming along. nice upgrade !

did they mention anything about BodyPaint ? did they have demos with maya 6 ? Just want to know when it will be ok to uninstall maya 5

now that they have micro-poly displacement you think ?............... BP -> Z brush like
or am i dreaming ?

thnx

AW

Srek
08-10-2004, 08:02 PM
Hahaha in the features page: Modeling with N-Gons - has a picture of characters made in C4D with balaclavas on with ransom-like text demanding n-gon support, talk about stupidity on Maxon's part, 9 releases to get n-gons.. bow your heads in shame.
The image and text are a small thank you to those CG-Talk users that kept pushing us.
http://www.cgtalk.com/showthread.php?t=84547&page=5&pp=15
Personaly i don't think it's stupid to say thanks to those who support and help you.

Cheers
Srek

Goon
08-10-2004, 08:10 PM
So do the modules need to be upgraded with each release or do you simply upgrade the base package? Because there don't seem to be any new features for some of the modules.

segart
08-10-2004, 08:13 PM
I think it's very funny:) Not only the image, but also the text in the Maxon site.

I hope it'll be aviable soon in Latinamerica.

Congratulations!

Srek
08-10-2004, 08:20 PM
So do the modules need to be upgraded with each release or do you simply upgrade the base package? Because there don't seem to be any new features for some of the modules. Due to changes in the core the modules will need updates too. The upgrade price is adjusted to that of course.
Cheers
Srek

Crewler
08-10-2004, 08:55 PM
realy nice update. :bounce:

brammelo
08-10-2004, 10:05 PM
Here's a vid of the cloth: http://www.designexpress.be/Media/movies/Oink-clothilde.mov

It doesn't look that great. More like plastic wrap than cloth. Hopefully they come out with better examples.

I know it looks like plastic cloth. It was a test, with the standard - rather rubbery - settings. As I prepared that page before maxon's page was online, I needed something quick-and-dirty. So don't judge Clothilde by that movie - Maxon had nothing to do with that.

Ric535
08-10-2004, 10:19 PM
video examples

http://129.125.101.174/c4dportal/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1992

Shilts
08-10-2004, 10:43 PM
I have to say... the new modeling tools look absolutely awesome! Micropoly displacement as well? Wow.

Stunning release. May have to get both XSI fundamentals and C4D R9 core for home use now.

dfaris
08-10-2004, 10:55 PM
Posted in wrong thread.

Jedt-C4D
08-10-2004, 11:10 PM
many application that comparable with C4D is cheaper...such like LW.:sad:

dont get me wrong, i love it but if compare to Studio Bundle + S&T is not cheap..<even Maya complete is cheaper haha>:cry:

how do you guys think? Do you think the price is ok? Dont tell me about buy separate module only necessary, I just compare the full package + some plugins & features set.
:hmm:
Any new Advanced Render Module? Caustics with spectrum color or any speedy Radiosity/Area Shadow?

flingster
08-11-2004, 12:51 AM
S&T is in a league all of its own for a start...bargain at double the price imho. studio bundle will give most things a run for there money.

anyways looks like a fantastic release...good to see maxon taking care of there users in a big big way and a phenomenal amount of workflow increases which we've been begging for awhile..and as srek points out a complete modelling re-work...with this release there is something for everyone...good to see.
looking forward to it hitting my desk sometime soon.
just gotta get my hands on sub poly displacement...the website doesn't even cover half of the cool stuff..
http://www.maxon.net/pages/products/c4d/cinema4d_e.html

judge for yourself my advice and give the demo awhirl once its out.
:shrug:

imashination
08-11-2004, 12:56 AM
many application that comparable with C4D is cheaper...such like LW.:sad:

dont get me wrong, i love it but if compare to Studio Bundle + S&T is not cheap..<even Maya complete is cheaper haha>:cry:


LW isnt comparable to the studio bundle though. compare lw to the basic standalone version of c4d.

Does lw have the best toon and diagram shader included? Studio does.

Does lw have a full texture painting app included? studio does

lw doesnt even come marginally near studio, thats why its cheap.

f3rry
08-11-2004, 01:14 AM
This is the hightlight of my day....


Yummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

BESTrin
08-11-2004, 01:47 AM
Wow. This is so great. Maxon rocks, c4d rocks. thanks so much guys for this update. Anyword on the price for an upgrade from xl 8.5. Also any new features for advanced render gi and area shadows. Just curious because thats something i was realy looking forwrd to. Im sure there are alot of shading and rendering features that havent even been shown yet. This is so great. I cant wait. the cloth was not even big on my list but its realy got me excited now. I saw the dressing meg on c4d portal and was like wow. a few more things though. Is the new format backwards compatible or able to have some backwrds functionality. will we have to pay for module upgrades. Is cloth sim part of dynamics or just an awsome new feature. Is there anything about bone colisions (ragdoll) physics of bones. any nurbs upgrades not that i think that any were realy that high up on the list. Ngons is great, though not all that shocking. Realy great job guys. thanks again.



many application that comparable with C4D is cheaper...such like LW.:sad:

dont get me wrong, i love it but if compare to Studio Bundle + S&T is not cheap..<even Maya complete is cheaper haha>:cry:

i would hardly call lightwave a comparable app anymore. Not sure about modeling but its renderer though very good is also very slow and becoming obsolete. Cinema is fast evolving and constantly being upgraded. It has the fastest best renderer atleast for most things and is not lacking in any area. Also getting the studio bundle is not the best way to compare it to other apps. Out of the box (with AR) cinema stacks realy good. Say im an architect. Do i want to pay for maya when its only decent rendering solution is mental ray (soon vray though sure wish c4d could have a bridge) and pay all taht for Caracter animation and softbody dynamics. Why not go the c4d roughte and get what you need and dont pay for what you dont. I think C4d is the best app out there and that its quickly becoming more and mor popular as people realize it. Somehow theres a mentality that its not as good as 3dsmax because it has a smaller user base. Heck theres not even a tut section at 3dTotal and whenever someone lists 3d apps of the top of there head they think, 3ds max, maya, softimage, lightwave, and then maybe c4d. Well ive only used the 3ds max and maya demos but everyone i hear who switches to c4d seems realy happy. Cinema may be more if you want the whole studio bundel but if you dont need everything right away its among the cheapest and im sure it will keep its pricing very competative for years to come. I dont mean to start a flame war so im sorry if i ofended every one its just irritating the whole mentality maya was used on lotr so its the best and max is the one that everyones using ill get that. C4d is one of those crappy poser apps for the same price. Not that thats waht you said but its just kinda what those who dont bother to look around see. Maybe c4d is more expensive than maya but to tell you the truth i think its better. Lightwave is great and has one of the highest quality renderers im constantly amazzed byt the results. 3dsmax obviously has something going for it. Alot of its features are realy impressive. Maya is great all around package with realy cool ways to build it into any workflow and script in what ever you need to do not to mention great softbody and fluid dynamics. Softimage is great to and with its new picing scheme resistance is damn near futile. And of couse there are tons of great smaller apps and more specialized or of the wall apps that make great aditions to any pipeline. But dont underestimate the power of cinema 4d. Thats all.

Cyborgguineapig
08-11-2004, 02:47 AM
Wee I'm excited but I haven't even gotten 8.5 yet:sad:

ndat
08-11-2004, 03:55 AM
I loves you guys, but yeah my wallets clean empty right now lol :). The demo will be fun though haha :D.

Flog
08-11-2004, 04:07 AM
Only thing bad about cinema 4d is the weak tutorials online. Nothing really substantial, and not very many books on it outside of going online and buying one.

I'm a Barnes and Nobles browser, can't browse book online.

I hope there is more support and better tutorials because the price is right and it does everything I need to!!!

To bad there is not classes for this

Byla
08-11-2004, 05:47 AM
Hahaha in the features page: Modeling with N-Gons - has a picture of characters made in C4D with balaclavas on with ransom-like text demanding n-gon support, talk about stupidity on Maxon's part, 9 releases to get n-gons.. bow your heads in shame.
Man what a stupid kiwi. Shame on you.

Byla
08-11-2004, 05:57 AM
flog, there are classes for cinema, at least in europe.

skillet
08-11-2004, 06:11 AM
ya ya thats all great

still nobody has answered my question about bodypaint.

is it that hard to just recompile what you got for maya ver 6 while your playing around with the new one.
common guys. this is not the support you would expect.

you guys need some lessons from Joe Alter. one person complains on his board, he has got a fix in a couple of days or less.

NUKE-CG
08-11-2004, 06:37 AM
Uh, can you guys get off my ass, I was obviously joking.. maybe Maxon will include a sense of humour plugin for you guys too. :rolleyes:

Byla
08-11-2004, 06:49 AM
man kiwi humor. that is hard to get. :)

Srek
08-11-2004, 07:03 AM
Is the new format backwards compatible or able to have some backwrds functionality. will we have to pay for module upgrades. Is cloth sim part of dynamics or just an awsome new feature. Is there anything about bone colisions (ragdoll) physics of bones. any nurbs upgrades not that i think that any were realy that high up on the list.
Hi,
R9 fileformat is backward compatible to 8.5, you will only lose the new features when going back. If you have n-gons they will be shown as tris and quads in R8. Clothing is part of the MOCCA module.
A real NURBS modeller was high on the whishlist of many users, but to make it realy usefull we would have to surpasse at least Rhino which is no easy task at all. Anything less makes no real sense. IMHO hard core NURBS users are better off with Rhino or even Catia then with anything we might be able to include in CINEMA.
Ragdoll physics would be nice, but are currently not available.
Cheers
Srek

Srek
08-11-2004, 07:04 AM
ya ya thats all great

still nobody has answered my question about bodypaint.

is it that hard to just recompile what you got for maya ver 6 while your playing around with the new one.
common guys. this is not the support you would expect.

you guys need some lessons from Joe Alter. one person complains on his board, he has got a fix in a couple of days or less.
Maya 6 exchange plugin is still in the works. It had to take a back seat during R9 development.
Cheers
Srek

Stone
08-11-2004, 07:09 AM
so when is the next amiga version comming out? you guys seem to have been slacking off on that despite it being your roots! ;) how about a version for amigaos4?

/stone

Caravaggio
08-11-2004, 07:41 AM
I'm sorry if these are answered already, I'm a little excited, but I just had to ask few things. Been out of the loop of things for so long that I'm still using v7.

1. So Forward kinematics are in?
2. When it says compatible back to 8.5, does that mean few things in scene files from v7 will be lost?
3. Sub poly displacement is the same thing as micro poly?
4. "Displacement now with Intensity, Intensity (centered), RG, RGB (local/world), 16 Bit per channel support" <- same thing as normal mapping?
5. In one of the videos the renderer seemed to start at both the top and the middle, what's that about?
6. How are n-gons handled when displaying polys in the texture mapper? I guess it just shows the entire circumfrance?


Jeez those movs on the site are cool, especially the tweak mode of the selector.

Per-Anders
08-11-2004, 08:02 AM
I'm sorry if these are answered already, I'm a little excited, but I just had to ask few things. Been out of the loop of things for so long that I'm still using v7.

1. So Forward kinematics are in?
2. When it says compatible back to 8.5, does that mean few things in scene files from v7 will be lost?
3. Sub poly displacement is the same thing as micro poly?
4. "Displacement now with Intensity, Intensity (centered), RG, RGB (local/world), 16 Bit per channel support" <- same thing as normal mapping?
5. In one of the videos the renderer seemed to start at both the top and the middle, what's that about?
6. How are n-gons handled when displaying polys in the texture mapper? I guess it just shows the entire circumfrance?


Jeez those movs on the site are cool, especially the tweak mode of the selector. 1) there is fk/ik blending (and switch) in mocca yes
2) cinema can load files from way back versions, what this means is if you save a file in r9 you can open it in 8.5 (previously due to massive changes in the materials/animation system the file format changes slightly so that while it could load in older files it couldn't save them in a way that older versions of cinema could read them).
3) yes
4) no
5) that's multithreaded rendering, been in there since at least v7 afaik hasn't it? anyhow, it's just each cpu thread is rendering, so if you have n processors or a processor with ht you get as many render threads starting as processors/virtual processors available. you can of course also manually set this to higher values or indeed lower if you wish.
6) haven't spent much time in bp recently so couldn't tell you.

Srek
08-11-2004, 08:12 AM
5) that's multithreaded rendering, been in there since at least v7 afaik hasn't it?
Make that R5 ;)

Papashango
08-11-2004, 10:44 AM
Yay! Gotta upgrade as soon as I got the funds :) - perhaps not too interesting, but I'd like to know if you can choose the kind of polys a "NURBs" object works with?
And when will pricing details be made public?

swampthing
08-11-2004, 01:08 PM
As someone else said, it looks cool but lack of learning resources is my biggest reason for not really giving C4D more than a cursory look. This new version looks impressive as well, but if you have to struggle through it then it doesn't really matter. The lack of quality tutorials and books is really hurting c4d if you ask me, the ones that are out there just aren't useful, i mean "how to make a sphere" and "how to make an abstract blob" just really aren't very helpful. I think maxon should take a cue from all the other major apps that did a major tutorial push and got their library of them built up.

Looks like a truely impressive release though, i know everytime a new version of c4d is released i'm amazed at how much is added compared to most other apps. Even C4d's .5 releases are impressive.

Ejecta
08-11-2004, 01:28 PM
As someone else said, it looks cool but lack of learning resources is my biggest reason for not really giving C4D more than a cursory look. This new version looks impressive as well, but if you have to struggle through it then it doesn't really matter. The lack of quality tutorials and books is really hurting c4d if you ask me, the ones that are out there just aren't useful, i mean "how to make a sphere" and "how to make an abstract blob" just really aren't very helpful. I think maxon should take a cue from all the other major apps that did a major tutorial push and got their library of them built up.

Looks like a truely impressive release though, i know everytime a new version of c4d is released i'm amazed at how much is added compared to most other apps. Even C4d's .5 releases are impressive.
This has been the biggest reason for me not getting into C4D. I think it looks awsome too and I liked the demo to certain degree but I cant find enough learning material for me to feel comfortable that I wont be stumbling around. The manual that I used when I downloaded the demo was very nice and better than alot of manuals out there but I need more advanced info.

flingster
08-11-2004, 01:29 PM
As someone else said, it looks cool but lack of learning resources is my biggest reason for not really giving C4D more than a cursory look. This new version looks impressive as well, but if you have to struggle through it then it doesn't really matter. The lack of quality tutorials and books is really hurting c4d if you ask me, the ones that are out there just aren't useful, i mean "how to make a sphere" and "how to make an abstract blob" just really aren't very helpful. I think maxon should take a cue from all the other major apps that did a major tutorial push and got their library of them built up.

Looks like a truely impressive release though, i know everytime a new version of c4d is released i'm amazed at how much is added compared to most other apps. Even C4d's .5 releases are impressive.
a couple of things to note though...first off the learning curve is not as steep as something like maya...so the need for suplementary learning is decreased in a sense...i would certainly like to see more training by maxon...they are working on this recently an independant and maxon released two different sets of training cd's so there is movement. also with the introduction of ngons a lot of the tuts on the net are now applicable and can be used...not ideal but certainly helpful. lastly this software app is making such big bounds in release to release it makes it harder to write material as some of it is likely to be out of date pretty soon. One note on the actual manuals is they are very good when used in conjunction with the tutorials...and they have also started including vtms on stuff like sketch and toon and bodypaint 2 which helps in a small way.
I do agree with you though...would like to see maxon being more aggressive in this area.

anti-shock
08-11-2004, 04:15 PM
This is great news, I can't wait to upgrade! :thumbsup:

Caravaggio
08-11-2004, 06:37 PM
That's true, one of the reasons I liked c4d after trying several programs way back when is that there really wasn't a huge need for tutorials. Now it looks like there will be a lot of new commands in this new version, but Maxon seems to have made it pretty friendly with icons to remember and self-explanitory titles.

5) that's multithreaded rendering, been in there since at least v7 afaik hasn't it? anyhow, it's just each cpu thread is rendering, so if you have n processors or a processor with ht you get as many render threads starting as processors/virtual processors available. you can of course also manually set this to higher values or indeed lower if you wish.
Ah, well that's my 4 year old processor for you.

Thanks.

AmbientLight
08-11-2004, 06:46 PM
Just downloaded demo. After looking what has been going on with C4D last 2 years, I'm almost ready to buy it. When will R9 be available to purchase? :)

flingster
08-11-2004, 07:01 PM
Just downloaded demo. After looking what has been going on with C4D last 2 years, I'm almost ready to buy it. When will R9 be available to purchase? :)
sept 04...afaik..don't quote me

kraal
08-11-2004, 07:18 PM
i am an x cinema user ..... not because i dont like cinema to be exact it was my first pro 3d package but certain things and clients caused me to switch to maya ( a lot of learning materials on doing special stuff and other dynamics and stuff) i was just wondering if i can get an honest comparasion to maya unlimited 6 ..... i loved everthing about using cinema 4d 8 and would love to presewnt to the powers that be a reason to switch or atleast buy me a copy
thanks
kraal

Byla
08-11-2004, 07:23 PM
Oh man, not another comparison....

You should go to cinema forum to discuss that.

Per-Anders
08-11-2004, 07:28 PM
i am an x cinema user ..... not because i dont like cinema to be exact it was my first pro 3d package but certain things and clients caused me to switch to maya ( a lot of learning materials on doing special stuff and other dynamics and stuff) i was just wondering if i can get an honest comparasion to maya unlimited 6 ..... i loved everthing about using cinema 4d 8 and would love to presewnt to the powers that be a reason to switch or atleast buy me a copy
thanks
kraal
the demo is now avaialble for download, it's best if you just download, see for yourself and make your own arguments for your bosses.

pgp_protector
08-11-2004, 08:11 PM
The demo for download ?

Is that an 8 / 8.5 or V9 Demo ?

AmbientLight
08-11-2004, 08:17 PM
sept 04...afaik..don't quote me
w00t! Better start putting pennies aside :)

Playing with the demo right now... The number of improvements and new features is just well.. mind blowing.

wuensch
08-11-2004, 08:19 PM
work through the form for Demo Rev 8-- then you land at a screen where you can choose the demo, R9 is there already--
Olli

guypapyrus
08-11-2004, 08:43 PM
Holy cow, take a break from 3D for a month, and a new release comes out!

Hmmm... n-gons, tweak mode... I wonder if all the new features might make it unnecessary to import from Wings3D (considering that I really like modeling in Wings, but you can only go so far with it). At the very least, I'm sure transferring models between the two programs will be more seamless (safe assumption?).

Great news, in any event.

Paige Fury
08-11-2004, 08:55 PM
As someone else said, it looks cool but lack of learning resources is my biggest reason for not really giving C4D more than a cursory look. This new version looks .
Same here. I am learning another package because of its abundance of learning materials/books. C4D looks good, but the lack of training materials is a minus.

AmbientLight
08-11-2004, 09:52 PM
Same not here. I don't care about learning resources as long as there's a good documentation. RTFM :)

brammelo
08-11-2004, 09:57 PM
dont get me wrong, i love it but if compare to Studio Bundle + S&T is not cheap..even Maya complete is cheaper haha
Maya Complete is the entry level version. Maya Unlimited is the full blown one and costs around 7.350 without VAT. If you want to compare full packages, you should've picked that one. But when you do (compare the top configurations), you'll soon discover that it's apples and oranges.

kraal
08-11-2004, 10:27 PM
thanks the demo will prob do fine .... not really into the comparassion threads was just womdering if the was a comparason spec sheet like electronics have

Cartesius
08-11-2004, 11:12 PM
The demo for download ?

Is that an 8 / 8.5 or V9 Demo ?
It's the demo of R9 MAXON used at SIGGRAPH when they made the announcement. Consider it a "sneak preview" demo as it will be replaced with a bugfixed one pretty soon.

/Anders

flingster
08-11-2004, 11:14 PM
thanks the demo will prob do fine .... not really into the comparassion threads was just womdering if the was a comparason spec sheet like electronics have
not seen one around...i'm not a fan of comparison threads either as they have a habit of getting out of hand.

guypapyrus
08-11-2004, 11:19 PM
Same here. I am learning another package because of its abundance of learning materials/books. C4D looks good, but the lack of training materials is a minus.When I started attempting 3D, I worked hard using Maya PLE. I was attracted, in part, by the wealth of instructional materials.

Eventually, I adopted C4D (in conjunction with Wings3D), partly because it was relatively easy to grasp, in spite of the dearth of instructional materials. In my experience, the best instructional materials for learning 3D are on public forums like this.

Of course I don't mean to imply that one size fits all; just wanted to highlight a contrary view.

flazza
08-12-2004, 12:38 PM
It's the demo of R9 MAXON used at SIGGRAPH when they made the announcement. Consider it a "sneak preview" demo as it will be replaced with a bugfixed one pretty soon.

/Anders
That is good to know, twice the demo locked up on me.

I wouldn't like to think that the complete full version would do similar.

I am saving up all of my pennies now, I wil have to tighten my spending over the next few months....... DAMN YOU MAXON! :D

rjsmal
08-12-2004, 12:45 PM
cinema 4d rules damn i tryed the demo of r9 it's thight faster and easyer so big up to maxon :)

peace

Whore
08-12-2004, 05:05 PM
OMG OHHH MYYY GOOD!

Is that nice one! Damn it... Damn... very nice one Maxon very n1

The Renderings are very fast. The HUD and the Environment are very nice, too.

wow THUMBS UP MAXON!

THX 4 that

talos72
08-13-2004, 06:10 AM
When upgrading to R9, It seems there will be no price break for those who have R8.5. I don't understand why we were charged $150 to upgrade from R8.1 to R8.5, only to have to pay the same amount as those who never upgraded to R8.5. I would really like to know.

I don't mind paying for upgrades, but these charges for incremental updates seems peculiar, only to find out that we will be paying as much for a future upgrade as someone with an earlier version.

Last year, I was impressed enough with the SIG demos to plunk down cash for the upgrade. But in the past year, these odd extra charges have been appearing: first I upgraded from R7 to R8, only to find out that in order to run Bodypaint in the new version I need a $50 update cd (not for a new version, but an update). Then comes an incremental update to version 8.5 which cost another $150.

Again, why no price break for those who paid the extra $150 for the incremental upgrade.

wuensch
08-13-2004, 09:24 AM
I understand your feelings but it is a common phenomenon with updates..
(I upgraded from Freehand 5.5 to FH 10 for the same price as an upgrader from 9.0 if I remember right).
its just the way it is.
Olli

flingster
08-13-2004, 11:42 AM
When upgrading to R9, It seems there will be no price break for those who have R8.5. I don't understand why we were charged $150 to upgrade from R8.1 to R8.5, only to have to pay the same amount as those who never upgraded to R8.5. I would really like to know.

I don't mind paying for upgrades, but these charges for incremental updates seems peculiar, only to find out that we will be paying as much for a future upgrade as someone with an earlier version.

Last year, I was impressed enough with the SIG demos to plunk down cash for the upgrade. But in the past year, these odd extra charges have been appearing: first I upgraded from R7 to R8, only to find out that in order to run Bodypaint in the new version I need a $50 update cd (not for a new version, but an update). Then comes an incremental update to version 8.5 which cost another $150.

Again, why no price break for those who paid the extra $150 for the incremental upgrade.
well i know how you feel...this is currently being discussed on the cinema4d forum in a couple of threads and on c4dtreff with some strongly felt feelings being posted..but rather than clutter up this thread with more discussion about it..i think its worth posting in those threads to be fair.:thumbsup:

BESTrin
08-17-2004, 03:45 PM
yay. the demos out. About normal mapping and displacement upgrade. NO there totally diferent. Displacement is seen in the silouette and its a great upgrade. The two render lines are because of hyperthreading or multithreading. Got my new pc a week or so ago and that was one of the first pleasent suprizes. Great stuff and i cant wait to try he demo. Backwards compatibility is hugely apreciated.

ThirdEye
08-20-2004, 10:02 AM
Some other features nobody's mentioned (if i'm not wrong) which i like a lot (keep in mind i'm on vacation and i don't have R9 installed on this pc, so there's a ton of stuff i forgot about this):

- everything is now controllable on a per view basis: the display filter is now a per view thingy, meaning that you can decide to show/hide some categories (splines, nurbs, particles) locally or globally, i love setting my layout to 2 identical camera vertical views for modeling, i display the low poly cage with a shaded wireframe on the 1st one, and the subdivided hi poly result in the 2nd one: i model in the 1st view and see the result in the 2nd. You can even set the object axis size on a per view basis if you want, everything can be local or global. Do you want the miniaxis you get in the corner of the views to be displayed with a 100% size in the persp and not displayed in the front view or 27% sized in another view? You can do so. Do you want it to follow the world orientation in a camera view and the object orientation in another persp view? You can do so. Do you want to display 4 different kind of world grids in the 4 views of the editor? You can do so. Do you want to change their size independently? You can do so. Do you want the highlighting (a la Wings) of the objects/components to be active only in the persp view? You can do so. You can even change the rotation axis on a per view basis if you want (for example the traditional lollipop rotation axis in persp and the new spherical rotation axis in the other views). The possibilities are endless. Same thing about the HUD and it's properties (colour, background colour, opacity...). Everything can be set to local or global.

- interactivity of modeling tools: everything is interactive and has a preview or a highlight. For example let's suppose you have a hole in your mesh and you wanna fill it. The fill hole tool does that interactively and has a highlighted preview for that. Same about the Welding tools, the loops/rings tools and everything else really. Everything is interactive and has a highlighted preview.

- new display modes: the display modes are rather different from other apps'. Let's make an example comparing the traditional way and the way C4D handle this. Usually you have a list of display options (textured, shaded, wireframe..), in C4D r9 you have 3 lists in the same menu: the 1st one for shading (constant, hidden lines removal, quick, gouraud...), the 2nd one for the wires (wireframe, isoparms..) the 3rd for all the rest (textures, xray, backface culling..). The beauty of this system is you can decide to combine those 3 categories the way you prefer: you can have a constant shading with isoparms and textures. Or gouraud shading with wires but without textures and with X-Ray. And so on...

flingster
08-20-2004, 11:47 AM
i like the idea of being able to have two independant views with differing of shadedwire and sub-div...very nice...and of course interactive modelling tools is very cool..

JamesMK
08-20-2004, 12:01 PM
Overall it's amazingly familiar, yet sporting enough improvements to make it feel almost like an entirely new application. An incredibly solid upgrade, and I have yet to find something acting weird... given the history of Cinema, you'd be hard pressed to find a single bug anyway - so, maybe I'm biased, but even objectively speaking, the Maxon coders have really outdone themselves this time.

ThirdEye
08-21-2004, 09:46 AM
James: the nicest thing is they keep adding a ton of stuff with every release, can't wait for r10 now :D

flingster
08-21-2004, 01:58 PM
James: the nicest thing is they keep adding a ton of stuff with every release, can't wait for r10 now :D
the other thing is they had the balls to go for the modelling re-write which was worrying, so they will benefit big time in the future from this as they have no doubt planned for further additions to come which would be interesting to see what they come up with just on the modelling side...

BESTrin
08-21-2004, 02:48 PM
Yeah this upgrade is great and its cool to hear about the new features that thirdeye mentioned. Two things im suprized i havent heard about either cause there not there or because there not big enough to mention. One would be (im not quite sure on the name) but symetry where you can modify either side and have it affect the other. Not where you model one side and mirror it oiver. This seems like a simple enough thing to code and pretty useful but no word of it yet. also another one high on my wishlist was pausable and resumable renders. I live in fl and we get about one power outage a day. Not long but long enough that i lose whatever im rendering. I just think that pausable renders and auto resumable renders would be very usefull. Has anyone heard anything about either of these features. Thanks. Wow this modeling upgrade is huge. The brush tool was not even in my wishlist because i thought it way to huge of an addition. Its so cool. Wtg Maxon. Also any update to mesh optimization and poly redution features? Anyway great stuff. Awsome.

JamesMK
08-21-2004, 07:42 PM
can't wait for r10 now
He he... If Homer had written the legend of Sisyphus today, it would have been a coder rolling that stone up the hill...

they had the balls to go for the modelling re-write which was worrying
Indeed, it was the last thing anybody would have expected at this time :eek:

---pausable and resumable renders. I live in fl and we get about one power outage a day. Not long but long enough that i lose whatever im rendering. I just think that pausable renders and auto resumable renders would be very usefull
Honestly, if you render an animation to separate image files (which you should), it's not too much of a problem since you'll never lose more than one frame anyway... But then again, it could be a really slooooow still too... wouldn't help anyway, since you wouldn't know in advance when to pause the render :D unless it's a previously announced outage of course... Just get a UPS already!

flingster
08-21-2004, 09:04 PM
i would like to be able to pause/stop and resume a render...would be very useful on large images towards the 10000pixel mark me thinks..or for those scenes that as stills take an absolute age to render...also like bucket rendering for this reason also rather than tiled camera scenario which is a workaround:shrug:

JamesMK
08-21-2004, 10:16 PM
i would like to be able to pause/stop and resume a render...would be very useful on large images towards the 10000pixel mark me thinks..
Good point though.

But in the context of power outages, it's a whole different ballgame... Still an interesting concept. :thumbsup:

flingster
08-22-2004, 12:08 AM
ooh yeah sure...cos if you had a power age on a big image you'd still be stuffed.

but i'd like the ability for different reasons...anybody who has done big big renders will sypathise with my plight i recon...everything becomes painful..render time, memory management in terms of scene sizes and file write out...its just ugly unless you start doing tiled camera then you have stitching and post effect problems...there are no doubt big practicalities in stopping/pausing a render and restarting but a bake and make function or something might help for dealing with big stills...or split size and re-stitch to big file afterwards would be nice also dunno i think there are plenty of helpful little functions the devs could help out on just in managing this sorts of scenes not everything is motion graphics work..i'm sure the archvis guys would love something like this also....much like bucket rendering needs to be given some consideration i think at least...dunno slightly off topic sorry guys.
:thumbsup:

BESTrin
08-22-2004, 07:42 PM
yeah. Obviously i didnt mean for animations as i always render imnage sequences. I was talkin about large stills. And as to power outages, Yeah i should get a ups, but it would be cool if ever five 15 minutes or so cinema would save its progress and a llitle not on where it was in the render so that if there was an interuption, ie. a power outage, then it would just resume from the last save and keep rendering. Similar to automaticly resuming download services. Also if renders were pause and resumable this could be done manualy. This way if nything happened you wouldnt have to start over. The biggest thing is being able to pause renders though. Either to render something else real fast or to free up some cpu time and memory for something else.

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