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View Full Version : FXWars! Catapult! (Trebuchet) : BloodRabbit


BloodRabbit
07-16-2004, 08:30 PM
I started to learn Reactor in max6 3 days ago (because of this contest) so go easy on me.

Most of my crations didnt even work, but here is the one that worked best.
I found out that it shoots longer if it stands on working wheels.
and the ball is released whit a "point to point" constraint that breaks at a given force.

The Anim. of it
http://privat.bluezone.no/vassbotn/br/katapult3.avi


http://privat.bluezone.no/vassbotn/br/katapult4.jpg

BloodRabbit
07-17-2004, 02:57 AM
I have a few problems whit Reactor the more objects that are in the scene (whit weight and such) less acurat (spelling) ractor gets. I cant even get the ball to do the same thing 2 times in a row. My 2. problem is connecting ropes to another object, if i had the answear to this i could make a complete scene whitout cheating (keys and/or constrains that break at a given force). So any help to get ropes to work would be great.

BloodRabbit
07-18-2004, 01:00 AM
I had a brainstorm last night (I was bored) and came up whit this. The idee was that this will take over where bowling left, a thing in an entertainmentpark or something to use on the moon (sorry it just has that look). Ok I admit it I had a few beers.

http://privat.bluezone.no/vassbotn/br/katapult5.jpg

Flipped_Normal
07-18-2004, 04:02 AM
Woah, thats quite different. Are those things on the front mounted shocks, or just a counterbalance, or what?

I have to say I like it quite a lot. Stylistically, it is quite different than the mideval ones, while keeping the physics the same. Adding to that that you were the one to figure out about keeping real wheels (which is being adopted by lots of people now), I would say that you have a very good shot at this thing.

I think the weight needs to be bigger though.

BloodRabbit
07-18-2004, 06:54 AM
Yeah they are dampers. If u see in my first 1 i had to put ramps infront and behind it so it wouldnt run away, because any action has an equal reaction. The 2nd thing is that they alow me to put any weight on the catapult whitout making it run crazy.
Ill demostrait the damper (Im making it shoot low to hit a target close to it):
http://privat.bluezone.no/vassbotn/br/katapult4.avi

Im making it a divx because i cant seem to get the mov files down in size.

Flipped_Normal
07-18-2004, 08:23 AM
Divx is fine for me. I can play mostly any codecs (wmv can have problems...stupid microsoft ;)).

BTW, you look like you need more friction on your wheels with respect to the ground. Your back wheels overspin as it stops going forwards.

I love the design! This one is great :thumbsup:

westiemad
07-18-2004, 11:00 AM
that is a cool design, i went for the old style, but didn't think of revamping the concept, nice work.

studio
07-18-2004, 12:03 PM
Hi BloodRabbit :

I really like the second design , but the movement seems unrealistic now . The pendelum just stops suddenly at bottom dead center . Perhaps there is an explanation for this . Also , the whole rig seems to leap laterally (forward) at too much a constant rate , without accel-decelleration , like your first catapult shows , very nicely , and very realistically .

The use of wheels was shown in the actual 1 hour video in theNova link the Mod directed us to on the home page of this challenge . The wheels were shown in that Nova program to increase effeciency by a substantial amount . You obviously concur .

Anyway , nice job ! I think your mass/weight settings may be different on your second treb , than on your first . I'm sure just a bit more tweaking and you'll have it . Pretty good for a person just getting started with simulations on Max , I would say .

Studio

BloodRabbit
07-19-2004, 05:11 AM
Flipped_Normal: Yeah i saw the wheel thing, but it didnt bother me it wasnt my final design just a test rig. (see below why.)

westiemad: I figured everyone would go for the old look so I didnt want to be "everyone" else.

studio: The reason for the pendelum stoping there is because i fine tuned the dampers so it would. The leaping problem was because as i said its a test rig so the weight of it was 600 tonns.
Im sorry if it seemed like I took the wheel idee for my own. I came up whit it by myself, but it had to be a reason that they where there on real thing (except for mobilety).

Thank you all for posting in my tread, it helps me work on this thing.

And now the reason for so many trails and errors.
the picture below is my idee of a modern trebuchet (its not finished), most of the design features ive stolen from big crans. If your wondering about size the wheels are about 3 meters (9 foot i think)high. The suspention links are working (ive tryed em) so it can go over ca 1 meter bumps and i can make it go forward on its own power. I did not make it able to steer, that would only make it harder to get a consistant shoot.
And thank you again
http://privat.bluezone.no/vassbotn/br/katapult6.jpg

studio
07-19-2004, 05:32 AM
Hi BloodRabbit :

Great to see you are not satisfied , even yet , and are morphing forward ! Very good for you . I did really like your original anim , and still think this is the way a Treb should move , if it's on wheels . Just between you and me <grin> , all Treb's should be on wheels , simply because it looks way better , I think .

Great that you discovered this on your own (about wheels) ! I mentioned it only to mention that people were not actually copying you , but may have seen this documentary I mentioned , and decided to wisely go with that method . Great that you are on the same wavelegth as the masters and the re-creators ! (edit:said mentioned 3 times)

The 600 ton damping thing is probably an award winning feature in and of itself . I do congradulate you on achieving that ! That may be the most amazing thing to come out of this challenge , and I do hope is not overlooked , because I really do think that is amazing that you manged to contain that much force so effectively !!! Good for you !!!

I have a favorite sim right now (check all threads to see which one <grin>) , but I do have a feeling you will "break the mold" in the end . I am behind you 100% and do very much hope you find the time to continue to grow your Treb the way you have been doing so !

Top points for evolution , for sure !!! Great stuff and keep it coming ...

Studio

(EDIT: said "great" 90 times too)

BloodRabbit
07-19-2004, 01:30 PM
Ive modelled a bit more.

Stats
weight: 1052,7 tonns
lenght: 150 meters
hight: 75 meters
wheels: 16
counter weight: 500 tonns


http://privat.bluezone.no/vassbotn/br/katapult9.jpg

http://privat.bluezone.no/vassbotn/br/katapult8.jpg

FiendishVegan
07-20-2004, 05:19 AM
Wow BloodRabbit, very cool!:thumbsup:

Great futuristic spin on an ancient weapon. Very creative.

How do you load a projectile on that thing?? It could probably just cruise around, pick up whatever it came upon and hurl it a few miles. Sweet.

BloodRabbit
07-21-2004, 08:09 PM
I had some problems whit the original design, i couldnt get it to trow thing as far as Id hope.
So I looked into how they did it in the old days and found my angels to be all wrong and the
height to be to low, therefor I rewamped it. Now it can trow 10 tonns about 5 km
(5000 meters) and 5 tonns 7-8 km, Im happy now. As you can see in the picture im still missing some cables for the counter weight and for the release of the ball (or whatever itll be when im finished).
http://privat.bluezone.no/vassbotn/br/katapult10.jpg

http://privat.bluezone.no/vassbotn/br/katapult11.jpg

FiendishVegan: The loading method will be to drop down the counterweight and let the arm come down. And thanks for having a look.
BR

Projectkmo
07-21-2004, 11:09 PM
This reminds me of all those crazy weapons that have been tried...or attempted over the years...anyone remember the Big GUN that Sadam was making....or the Train cannon's of Hitler etc... I'm sure there are other examples too... and I dont mean at all that this is bad etc...it just reminds me of them...like something a desperate dictator might come up with lol

Very cool model! I look forward to a movie demonstration...and I start the bidding at 5 million dollars!

BloodRabbit
07-22-2004, 08:12 AM
Projectkmo: Its a compliment to be put in the same category as crazy dictators (irony). And you win the bid for the blueprint, where do you want it (the blueprint) deliverd?
And I only take cash.

Anyway here is my update, Ive started (soon finished) to model the 2nd atomicbomb ever used in a war "Fat Man" it hit hiroshima (im not trying to offend anyone by using this bomb as a projectile), but my bomb wont carry any explosives. It will only be used as a 10 or 5 tonn demolisionball. it will get some extra atachments for the release mechanism.
http://privat.bluezone.no/vassbotn/br/fatman.jpg

Fasty
07-28-2004, 10:23 AM
Really cool, I love the concept. Can't wait to see it in motion!

BloodRabbit
07-31-2004, 06:48 PM
Ive been away for awhile now and can see that Derby has really been working on his and we where finally able to see Westiemads fire ball. Anyway ive rendered out my treb in action (extra long so you can see my problem). I have some problems controlling the counterweight, but i have a few ideas. There is abit of modelling and dynamic setups left on the treb. I havent desided what my treb is gone knock down yet. I dont expect to win this one, but it kickstarted my reactor learning. The red things in the anim is only my measuring rods.

Anim:
http://privat.bluezone.no/vassbotn/br/kattest.avi


BR

westiemad
07-31-2004, 07:11 PM
whats wrong with the counter weight? its the inherant motion from the frame movement that might give it and odd look, but its natural.

(p.s. feedback on the fireball etc would be handy to me)

Damm
08-10-2004, 05:32 PM
hmm don't know what you mean but there's something i see (it might be the same thing that you're saying) and it's because the counterweight is droped straight down it will stop and put in momentum byt the swingarm as in the animation. You can solve this by either fasten the counterweight as Derby has or make it as a part of the swing arm..

i'm not an expert =) but that's what i'd do


Edit: hmm i saw that you've already tried onf of the techniques.

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