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View Full Version : Blending...pixelation? Why?


smoothoperator
07-09-2004, 03:09 AM
I'm painting a female form and I'm using a blender alot. Detail blender.
I seem to be getting some noise or brake-up of some kind. Like a texture.
Can this be corrected or avoided using another kind of blender? If so which?
I'd like to achieve a smooth blend. What should my setting be and what blender should I use at what settings? I'm painting with an oil brush by the way.
Pretty new to Painter so I might be doing something wrong. Could it also be tooo much blending? lol

Thanks for any help.

+smooth+

Jinbrown
07-09-2004, 07:00 PM
Hi,

Which Oils variant are you using?

What Paper is selected, and have you made any setting adjustments to the Paper?

Have you made any setting adjustments to either the Blenders' Detail Blender or the Oils variant? If so, what setting adjustments?

Can you show us a sample of what's happening?

smoothoperator
07-09-2004, 10:05 PM
well the blender im using is the default detail blender 3 attributes. Circular, stroke type: single, Method:Cover, SubCat:Soft COver.
The Oil brush is the same.
The paper is "basic paper" with nothing changed.
Heres a crop of the work. Her left shoulder area.
The first is at 100%..the second at 200%
Maybe its the paper texture, how do u create one with No texture at all?
Looking closely you can see some kind of breakup happening. I want it smooooth!
Thanks for the help.


http://www.petertoufidis.com/images/woman_shoulder100.jpg


http://www.petertoufidis.com/images/woman_shoulder200.jpg

Jinbrown
07-10-2004, 04:11 AM
smooth operator,

You still haven't said which of the approximately 40 variants it is in the Painter 8 Oils category. ;)

In the meantime, with a brush variant for which the Subcategory name includes the word "Grainy", you can adjust the Grain slider to control the amount of Paper texture picked up in the brushstrokes. Settings in the Papers palette can also be adjusted. You'd need to play with them to see what works.

As to making a smooth Paper, just make a selection on a white Canvas and capture it as a custom Paper.

Nothing much smoother than that!

Since the Detail Blender in its default state doesn't interact with Paper texture, I can only think the texture is coming either from the Oils variant or, as you said, from too much blending.

That used to happen to me with the Just Add Water variant after I'd been blending in the same area for a while. It began to clump up, kinda.

Sometimes it helps to lower the brush Opacity a little, too, make the brush Size larger, and use a gentler touch.

smoothoperator
07-10-2004, 05:06 PM
oups sorry Jindude. Its the detail oil brush 10. The default brush nothing changed. I'm convinced it's the paper. Both tools i'm using has no option for grainyness. I'll try doing it over again this time with a smooth paper and less blend strokes. I'll even try at 150 dpi instead of 72. increasing the amount of details in hopes theres less fragmentation showing.

Thanks for the help!

+smooth+

Jinbrown
07-10-2004, 08:44 PM
Hi smooth,

I don't see how it can be the Paper if the brush variants don't interact with Paper texture, but do try a blank white Paper and see if that helps.

I almost never work at 72 ppi, instead I use 300 ppi on the chance I'll want to print. Even if I don't print, the results seem to be much better on the screen.

On a copy of your image, you might try making selections of areas that have this clumpiness and applying Effects > Focus > Soften to see if that can help you smooth out the mess.

Then, using the blank white Paper I would expect that there won't be any more clumpiness unless it's from overworking with a blending variant.

I can't think of any other cause.

Good luck! :)

Nolita
07-11-2004, 10:36 AM
I have to second Jinny's advice, and add a bit more. You can turn off the impasto in this way: go to canvas, then make sure enable impasto is unchecked. The impasto seems to suck up a lot of ram as well. I'm not seeing pixellation on my screen, in fact it looks rather smooth to me.

Also, I was thinking, detail blender just means it's a smaller blender. You can make your own blenders. The soft stump, for example is very soft and smooth, sort of velvety. If you need a smaller one, just go to soft blender stump, in your blenders, make it smaller, then save the variant, as, something like soft detail blender stump, or soft blender stump 5(the number you make your size), something like that.

What you have is a very good blend, for default variants at a low resolution. In fact, you might want to watch out, because some editors, at certain sites, as well as probably for print, don't like soft and fuzzy blends.

A last quick tip, take a hard edged brush, and set it to erase in your brush creator, I think that's what it's called, different set up if you're using 8 but that's what I think it's called. Anyway, you'll be left with a hard edged eraser, which will de-fuzzy your edges, when going for super soft blends.

Another thing you can do is, turn on preserve transparency, once you have your main body layer, this prevents over blending and super fuzzy edges. Well it does once you get the hang of it.

I think what you have so far, you should be very proud of. It's quite nice actually, and will be even nicer once you decide on more colors and how defined you want things, etc.:D

BTW Jin's not a dude, she's a dudette:D

smoothoperator
07-12-2004, 02:58 AM
I'm really starting to like this forum as a newbie here. :)
Thanks for all the help and input. I really appreciate it.
I've actually started to produce this piece in PS :argh: BUT I havn't given up on Painter. I'll try your tips nolita and sorry about the dude thing Jin. Didnt know. :hmm: I'll post a final pict when I think its ready. Heck ill probably post a version for both applications.
Cheers

+smooth+

Nolita
07-12-2004, 06:22 AM
Welcome to the forums:D

I'm sure there's no need for apologies. Jinny's just too cool to let being called a dude get her down. I just thought I'd tell you for future reference. You're doing really well. I like that you aren't giving up on Painter. So many Photoshop, and Paintshop Pro, devotees, are so amazed when they hear someone uses Painter. Either they think Photoshop is all you need, or that their app of choice is easier to use. There's a bizarre misconception of a learning curve with Painter. I find that the opposite is true.

If you started out using real paint or analog media, then Painter(imho) is just so much easier to use. I think it has to do with Painter being designed and created for the specific purpose of digital painting. I think folks who have been painting in Photoshop for some time forget that Photoshop was created for digital editing of photos, and some clever people with mouses decided to use it as a painting tool.

I could never get a brushstroke to look like a brushstroke, in other apps, the paint would never interact with the other strokes like, well, paint.

I tell people Painter is the closest you can get to using real paint inside of a computer. They then say to me that I'm wrong, and that they've never seen watercolors in real life behave as they do in Painter, or that It's not the same. Well I'm not saying it's the same, just as close as you can get.

Oh, since you love Painter, and if you don't you will, by the time I'm through with you ;) check out, http://www.ambientdesign.com/artrage.html. It's amazing. The paint really smears around and does some neat stuff. Apparently it's created by the same people who made the mixing pallete for Painter 8. It's like one big page, that acts like the mixing pallete, that's what they say, I just love it and think it's really cool.



Another cool thing, gleaned from Robert Chang's(Lunatique's) site is to, oh heck, I'll just link you to his site, there's a ton of Painter tricks, and a goody-bag download of brushes there. You can download his tricks as html or pdf, so that you have this nifty, tips and tricks refference right on your harddrive.http://www.ethereality.info (http://www.ethereality.info/)

I just love his site, he's one of my unwitting mentors. There are so many, but I mention his name and site so much, I'm convinced he thinks I'm cyberstalking him. He's a master of the evocative. And for smooth blends, I don't think you can do better than to visit his, and Linda Bergkvist's sitehttp://www.furiae.com (http://www.furiae.com/), also known as the artist enayla, she too produces amazingly smooth blends and skintones. She has a nose tutorial on her site. I can't follow it, it's not written to my way of thinking, but others have found it to be very valuable. It's located in the galleries section.

Another important tip, is to click the links in Jinny's posts. She's the grande dame of Painter. She teaches courses in it(ooh when I find the money and she finds the time, I'm so taking one of her classes), and runs and maintains sites devoted to it. The links in her posts will lead you to lots of good tips, and also, to some amazing brushes, free to download and use. You will see her name so much in these forums, and for good reason, she knows what she's talking about. Also she has an amazing gift, for taking the dense info, and links included in manuals and help sections of programs, and translating them into plain and easy to understand English. You will fall in love with her. Not necessarily the amorous or erotic kind of love(that's between you two;))j/k, no I mean, I love her, like a mom, even told her so. She's our Painter mom:D here with answers and support. Real support, not the fake kind you get from giant conglomorations, but real support.

Okay, I'm gushing now, gone all fangirl. It's not a pretty sight, I know. Almost as ugly as having to step over the big puddles of drool I leave in the Wacom, and software sections of computer stores.:)

Hope to keep seeing you here, you have real talent, and seem to really enjoy the process.

Good Luck:D

Lunatique
07-13-2004, 03:30 AM
I'm convinced he thinks I'm cyberstalking him.

Okay, I'm gushing now, gone all fangirl. It's not a pretty sight, I know. Almost as ugly as having to step over the big puddles of drool I leave in the Wacom, and software sections of computer stores.:)

Good Luck:D
Didn't have the slightest clue. :D I also had no idea you're a girl!

Nolita
07-13-2004, 05:46 AM
It is true though, Luna. When looking for smooth, I head to yours, Linda B.'s, or Anry's galleries. When looking for "Painterly", don't know why they call it painterly, it's all painting. I see it as more impressionistic in feel. Anyway, then I head for Socar Myles' site, or, oh heck there's a bunch more, mostly analog.

Then there's that site in your list of links, I can never remember the name, but can get there no problem, where they have high resolution pics of classic pre-20th century art. Impressionist, Classicism. They have it all. It's the best, for when I start getting too big for my britches, and thinking I'm really good. Puts me in my place, and reminds me I have a long way to go.

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