CGTalk - www.animationmentor.com

stewartjones

07-22-2005, 05:13 PM

Oh man, I've been lurking around on CGTalk for a long time now, and I finally got the nerve up to apply to AM a few weeks ago. I thought for sure I wouldn't get accepted after taking that test, but I just got the e-mail.

I'm in!

I can't wait to get going. Like a few others on this thread, I'd been considering using XSI, but I'd really like to work through Maya as well. Has anybody gone through the AM classes while learning the ropes with Maya as well?

I was average with Maya when I started, knew nothing of the curve editor etc. Trick is (and this has been mentioned before, by Brian and a few others) ONLY concerntrate on the animation. Forget the renderings, modeling etc!

Plus, there are Maya Basics, Intermediate, and Advanced videos at Animation Mentor, so you won't have a problem picking up the basics. I advise that you check out 3dbuzz.com just to get the Interface and stuff, helped me out a lot coming from Max. :)

Bentagon

07-22-2005, 08:31 PM

By the way. That post that Jeff deleted?

He was drunk :D

- Benjamin

andy_maxman

07-23-2005, 09:27 AM

hiyao! folks,
congrats to all who got in for the september classes...see you all in there....

btw - just wanted to start off a little discussion ( maybe its even been talked about before )

- how many of you are parallelly learning the art of rigging?
- and how important you think it is to know how to rig?
- and for those animators turned animator-cum-rigger what resources you found to be useful?

I'm sure Brian is busy devouring Kiaran's book by now... :) Hey! Brian, How is it placed at for a newbie to rigging?

my opinion on learning to rig is -
- it is going to be a big plus to your portfolio
- you can always tweak the rig if it was created by someone else and you are not all that comfortable animating that rig

and yes, i'm eagerly waiting for Kiaran's book too.....

keepAnimating and when you decide to take a break.....make a rig...; )

SheepFactory

07-23-2005, 04:16 PM

-i am learning it

-its quite important to know how to rig if you aspire to broaden your horizons or ever plan on animating your own shorts at some point.

-Also check out making of leon by the cgtoolkit guys , between the book and that you'll be pretty much covered in the rigging department. I also found Jason Schleifers dvd's top be of incredible help.

My Fault

07-23-2005, 06:02 PM

Pretty much what Ali just said :)

I think Jason's rigging DVD's are also must haves. I still have a world to learn about rigging but it is really nice to know more about the subject and like Ali mentioned if you want to do your own shorts you really should know something about rigging.

I think Kiaran's book (and the fantastic Leon DVD) are great for newbies. The Art of Rigging book is really nice as well. All of these are Maya centric but most of the ideas can be taken over to whatever app you are using.

SlipGun

07-23-2005, 06:23 PM

Has anyone written about being pushed back a term? I signed up on the 17th and I wonder what my chances are of making the fall term.

Kimotion

07-23-2005, 06:39 PM

I've never heard of anyone being pushed back. I think they accept right up to the week before the first week, which is mid September. However, it will depend upon space, so it's possible that spaces will fill up well before classes begin.

For those who haven't applied yet, make sure to apply much earlier (I suggest at least 3 weeks before the start of the class) to make buffer time for the testing and paperwork to be filled out and sent. I say mid August at the latetst for the Fall term.

andy_maxman

07-25-2005, 06:01 AM

I think Kiaran's book (and the fantastic Leon DVD) are great for newbies

Is the Leon one for newbies too? And does it require their MuscleTK plug?
I remember Kiaran suggesting someone to get the book first and then the Leon DVD.

Mojo Rizen

07-25-2005, 06:32 PM

And I’m off to the waiting game. The registration and test is complete, now it’s time to see how things shake out.

SlipGun

07-25-2005, 07:51 PM

Don't know if this has been asked before, but how are the "minimum total hours" (1005 in all) calculated?

ttesla

07-26-2005, 01:18 AM

Don't know if this has been asked before, but how are the "minimum total hours" (1005 in all) calculated?hi slip.
numbers stated in the AM catalog are just as what is said - *minimum*.
calculation is simple.
sum up:
duration of all instructional videos
+
both weekly and monthly global q&a sessions
+
q&a sessions with your mentor
+
mentor critiques for aaall of the students
and the number goes up in the sky!... it goes much more higher than that stated minimum of 118 instructional hours. if you are working full time and you're short on time, it will do. if you have plenty of time to spare on the schooling - it will do, too. ;)

AM is the place to be. trust me on this. i never saw a place where people are really eager to help each other and to pass their knowledge and experience to others.
at the end, the people is what really matters. :)
cheers.
(http://ttesla.animacija.org/blog)

Puck

07-27-2005, 10:36 AM

Hello!

I've tried to read through most of this thread, but there's probably heaps ive missed, so sorry if this has been asked before...

I'm from sydney, Australia; does anyone know how plausible it would be for me to do this course? I work a 40 hour week and I'm worried that i won't be able to be available for the live Q&A sessions (because of the time difference?, ie: if they're on in the middle of the day when I'm at work, or at 2 o'clock in the morning etc). Are any Australian's doing AM or thinking about doing it?

I've been accepted into the fall term start, but at this stage i honestly don't think I'll be able to do it... A part of me would just love to quit my job and get an easy 3 day a week job while completely concentrating on the course.....

PS: i love the enthusiasm you all have for your art.

supergrover

07-27-2005, 02:06 PM

Hi Kimasume,
I'm in the second semester and I'm amazed at just how worthwhile this training is. Already I've moved far beyond what I would have expected in such a short time. The question is - is this what you want to do? Some people are holding down full time jobs and completing their assignments in the evenings and weekends but this course is like everything else - the more you put in the more you will get from it. They try to accomodate people with the Q&A times but it's not always possible to suit everyone and you may find yourself getting up during the night for an hour - You'll soon get used to that though and it's only once a week.
I can't recommend the course highly enough! Go for it
SG

ArneK

07-27-2005, 06:42 PM

I'm from sydney, Australia; does anyone know how plausible it would be for me to do this course? I work a 40 hour week and I'm worried that i won't be able to be available for the live Q&A sessions (because of the time difference?, ie: if they're on in the middle of the day when I'm at work, or at 2 o'clock in the morning etc).

I'm starting out now in the fall semester and I'm in a similar position as you. I'm self-employed so I have maybe a little more flexibility than you might have in a regular day-job position. But I'll have to get up at between 4-6 AM (I'm in Norway) for the Q&A's due to the time difference. Getting up when it'll be almost pitch black outside won't be easy...

This is something I've wanted to do for a long time, and as current students only seem to praise the course, for me it will definately be worth it. It will be hard making a balance between deadlines at work, deadlines with the AM assignments and also squeezing in time for my wife and friends. But if you want something strong enough I guess almost everything is possible. It really all boils down to discipline I guess.

splintah

07-28-2005, 11:42 AM

i wanna do the course in spring and i am from vienna austria

so i got the same problem

i already wrote an email about that but no answer

4-6 am
man
thats like the worst time there could be
8am, 7am, 2am ok
but not 4-6am

man . . . :cry:

droidzlander

07-28-2005, 11:52 AM

Most likely 6 AM is the scheduled time for Q&A that you're gonna have. I'm from Italy and I do mine with Bill Diaz at 6 AM GMT+1 (9 PM Pacific Daytime) that is acceptable, my classmates from UK wake up at 4.30 to attend Q&A and at 3.30 for global Q&A. Other people from different countries have schedules that are even worse.
Andrea

Bentagon

07-28-2005, 12:16 PM

That's just something we'll have to live with, I guess. To me, that's not too much of a problem. I'll catch in that sleep at another moment.

- Benjamin

Mojo Rizen

07-28-2005, 09:57 PM

If there is anyone currently in the program working with Maya on a Mac what did you do for a 3 button mouse. I'm trying out the PLE version with a Microsoft with two top buttons and a scroll wheel that has a button and can't find a setting to make the button of the scroll wheel work properly.

Mojo Rizen

07-28-2005, 10:05 PM

Ok, I may have posted a little to soon. I can get it to work on my Wacom mouse. But I would still like to hear anyones choice of mouse for Maya.

Thanks

Roger Eberhart

07-29-2005, 01:51 AM

I'm using Maya on a G5 iMac. I'm using a Logitech MX510. For the Logitech, there is a control panel you can use to set up the buttons. When I first installed the software it defaulted to double-click. Just change it to middle-click and you're ready to go.

If there is anyone currently in the program working with Maya on a Mac what did you do for a 3 button mouse. I'm trying out the PLE version with a Microsoft with two top buttons and a scroll wheel that has a button and can't find a setting to make the button of the scroll wheel work properly.

ArneK

07-29-2005, 02:19 AM

If there is anyone currently in the program working with Maya on a Mac what did you do for a 3 button mouse.

I've ditched my one-button Apple mice for good (why only one button?!? It's 2005 for Christ sake!) and have replaced them with Logitech MX1000 wireless laser mice. They are wonderful and the most precise I've ever had. Beats the heck outta optical ones. And has more buttons than you'd ever wish for. Two thumbs up :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

SheepFactory

07-29-2005, 02:24 AM

i recommend using the wacom pen with maya instead of the mouse.

JSW32

07-29-2005, 03:49 AM

to all of you recent mac users. I am a mac user as well. i am starting AM in the fall, and i currently have a powerbook g4 laptop, 1 ghz with 512 MB DDR SDRAM, whatever that means. anyways, in regards to your experiences, how have you found AM using a Mac? I know AM doesnt fully support it yet, but I don't know what to do next. I was thinking of purchasing a new Mac, possibly the g5 or something, but then what about Maya? i was talking to one of the techs at the studio i work at, and he said that Maya runs better and faster on a PC then it does on a Mac. I love the Mac user interface, and hate the PC interface, but I'm just looking for the best option here. So how is it using a Mac in terms of streaming video of the lectures and Q/As, etc., how is it with Maya, also whats the deal with a good webcam? the isight? thanks guys.
-Justin

mmkelly011881

07-29-2005, 06:45 AM

I love the Mac user interface, and hate the PC interface, but I'm just looking for the best option here.

customize.org

splintah

07-29-2005, 10:57 AM

i have a powerbook aswell

maya runs fine on it

but it runs better on pcs
i do not know why

but i would never change my mac for a pc anymore
i just love the workflow and the ease of use

i have my dual 3ghz pc for rendering now

Mojo Rizen

07-29-2005, 02:04 PM

Looking in the controls the Microsoft mouse doesn’t even give a middle button option for the wheel/middle button, but it’s the default setting on the Wacom.

I’ve been meaning to use the pen tool more, so I’ll defiantly give this a try. I’m just getting my feet wet in Maya with the PLE edition as I wait to see if I get in the fall semester. The three buttons seem big for navigation in the view windows, so I would guess there are options with the pen, or keyboard options to replace the three mouse buttons.

As for the Mac mouse, I think it’s one of the coolest looking designs, but have not used mine at home or work for the last few years. The second button to pull up context menus or options, and a scroll wheel are now mandatory for myself.

I’m getting a little off topic here, thanks for the info, and if all goes well I’ll see you all in the fall semester.

anthea

07-29-2005, 11:53 PM

hi guys, ok i'm back, i had so much trouble posting... anyway

i would recomend to all new students to get a tablet and stylus, you will thank your hands later. even though i use my tablet i am still getting some major cramping in my hand from the many many hours i spend attached to my computer.

my mentor derek recomended this thing called a vertical mouse. i just ordered one and can't wait to try it, plus i've been doing hand exercises w this thing that looks like silly putty, and it is working.

http://www.ergodirect.net/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=207

for all you new students in foreign countries- it is a shame about the crazy QNA schedule for you , but at the same time the QNA's aren't mandatory, 100% of the students aren't present at every QNA, and if you have a really important question or problem it is probably better to email your mentor or better yet post on the forums which are a great resource. i would say don't worry too much about QNA's, yes they are helpful but they aren't the most important thing, and plus you will always get feedback in your video crit every week from your mentor. i like to email my mentor when submitting my assignments, this way i get a more personalized video crit focusing on the specific things/problems i mentioned in the email.

Bentagon

07-30-2005, 12:34 AM

That vertical mouse is one strange looking thing! That must be really hard to get used to, I think. Everyone uses a pen, and a mouse has been standard for so many years... don't think that this would be something for me :scream:

Still nice to learn such a mouse excisted, though ;)

- Benjamin

DigitalToon2

08-01-2005, 03:43 AM

Only 50 days left till the start of the fall session. I got my webcam today (it was on sale) and I already had the books from past classes, so I think i'm ready!

fluffybunny

08-01-2005, 03:54 AM

Only 50 days left till the start of the fall session. I got my webcam today (it was on sale) and I already had the books from past classes, so I think i'm ready!
Yikes! Don't remind me!
We're exactly halfway done with Summer session....it seems to have virtually flown by.
It's like I just started this thing and next week we're starting walks already :o
now granted, I think we'll be working on those for a while....but I'm sure there's still tons more I could learn from mister bouncy ball. I wish I wasn't working full time...oh well, it pays the bills.

eric

SkyZero

08-01-2005, 06:41 AM

With the announcement of Maya 7. Would it be wise for future AM students to purchase that version instead of version 6.5 or vice versa? Would the rigs work with version 7?

Anybody know the answers? :shrug:

SheepFactory

08-01-2005, 06:49 AM

rigs will work with any future version. Maya is always backwards compatible. you can open up a scene done in maya 1 in maya 7 and it'll be fine. It doesnt work the same the other way around though :)

SkyZero

08-01-2005, 07:07 AM

rigs will work with any future version. Maya is always backwards compatible. you can open up a scene done in maya 1 in maya 7 and it'll be fine. It doesnt work the same the other way around though :)

Thanks for the answer! Now I'll just wait for Maya 7 to hit the educational resellers which will hopefully be before the fall semester starts! :applause:

JSW32

08-01-2005, 08:50 PM

splintah

08-02-2005, 08:01 AM

well i didn't do am yet so i dont REALLY know it

but from what i know they do not use anything that isn't mac compatible
so it should work perfect on mac

its just that they do not support macs
support is lots of work
and the support guys may not know the mac that well

mikefeil

08-04-2005, 06:32 PM

SkyZero

08-04-2005, 07:13 PM

I have a question for the students already attending, how exactly are the books utilized? Are you assigned chapters to read every week, are there written assignments based on the readings, etc.?

That newsletter was great, read every last article on it. Very cool stuff indeed! :thumbsup:

Rabid pitbull

08-04-2005, 08:10 PM

Hey all as far as the books go, in the first term we were assigned to read some chapters in the Illusion of life. But nothing assigned since(second term). I will tell you that you will reference these books often! Many of the lessons are easier to understand when you study the examples in these books. Especially the walk assignments in the first term... hips are amazing, and complex to understand. You must have these books in my opinion!

Rabid pitbull

08-04-2005, 08:48 PM

this is my previous post. can somebody please give me a bit of a more detailed answer than was given before. i want the computer i purchase if i do purchase it to be something that i can use after the AM program is complete as well. therefore i want the best option available. somebody please help me. thanks
-Justin

There are quite a few mac users at AM. Basically certain areas of the website are not fully compatible. This is a flash/browser issue. These are minor from what i have heard, definitly not show stoppers. I am sure that you will not have any issues due to maya though. The characters are very simple and the rigs work across the board as far as I know. You will not be rendering anything all playblasting, so it is all open gl. I would recommend if you plan on buying a new machine get a nvidia card instead of ati. This will likely be more stable and reliable.

Bentagon

08-04-2005, 09:04 PM

That new newsletter is freakin AWESOME, and the video testimonials. Can fall come any quicker, schweeeeeeeeet.

I'm guessing we should all be expecting some rego stuff soon :D

Can't wait to meet you all!!I definitly agree with you! And congrats to Brian for being the Student of the Month! Let's hope the next is a "this-thread-contributor" too ;)

But what's that about video testimonials? Do you mean the column about the e-critiques? Or are there video's?

Yay for AM Online! And yay for the fall people :D!

- Benjamin

**edit**AHA! It's the new video on the site! BEAUTIFUL!

SkyZero

08-04-2005, 09:07 PM

I saw the AM demo on Maximizing Workflow at the Alias booth. Very cool stuff! :thumbsup:
I recorded the entire thing onto my memory card. Judging by what I saw there, I'm very excited to get started this fall term! :scream:

AjaBogdanoff

08-05-2005, 12:06 AM

Heh, Freddy, you should have introduced yourself to one of the 20 AM students standing around you! :D

*ahem* For those of you who subscribe to the newsletter, you may know super featured student Brian Nicolucci as "MyFault"... and he freaking rocks. :D

My Fault

08-05-2005, 12:28 AM

SkyZero

08-05-2005, 04:49 AM

Definitely should have introduced myself! I saw a bunch of people wearing those AM shirts during Siggraph. I'm a bit shy when it comes to meeting new people, but in the future I will definitely introduce myself. So if you're wearing that shirt in public, be aware that I just might introduce myself as a fellow AM student! :D

Great profile on the AM newsletter Brian! Really cool stuff! :thumbsup:

Definitely looking foward to starting class, especially with the kind of community you guys got going over there.

AjaBogdanoff

08-05-2005, 02:40 PM

So if you're wearing that shirt in public, be aware that I just might introduce myself as a fellow AM student!

Ha, and on the flipside, if you're wearing one of those shirts and you're NOT in AnimationMentor, be aware that you may at one point be mobbed by a pack of enthusiastic students. ;) :D

My Fault

08-05-2005, 03:28 PM

Ha, and on the flipside, if you're wearing one of those shirts and you're NOT in AnimationMentor, be aware that you may at one point be mobbed by a pack of enthusiastic students. ;) :D

We ran practice simulations before siggraph sort of like police training school. Cardboard cutouts would pop up and we would have to tackle the ones wearing the AM shirts and avoid the ones without. Anthea scored a perfect 100, though she did crush a few practing the BOOMtastic Bear hug.

Kimotion

08-09-2005, 06:15 AM

Hey!

To those who went to Siggraph, were there any new announcements or surprises? I guess what I'm asking is: did you learn anything new about AM or the animation industry in general?

Speak freaks!

AjaBogdanoff

08-09-2005, 01:49 PM

Oh sure, call us freaks and then expect us to share all the sweet juicy information we picked up! :D

Well, okay, I did overhear a couple of cool things at the booth and the CGW event.... like, lifetime access and job placement help for alumni! And they're offering student loans now! And there's something like 200 students joining us in the fall! :applause:

Also they're going to be replacing the student testimonials video on the main site with a 30-second loop of Brian doing the chicken dance on one of the lunch tables at Siggraph.

I think that's pretty much it. :)

andy_maxman

08-09-2005, 01:53 PM

any info on the mentor list for the fall term?

ps - Aja, your new avatar is spinning me around.....; )

AjaBogdanoff

08-09-2005, 02:08 PM

Nope, didn't hear anything about who the new mentors would be.... though they did say they had a waiting list, because so many animators want to be a part of it!

It's cool, all of the folks at the panel discussion on Monday (mentors and founders and Kevin! ;) ) were talking about how much they're getting out of being involved in AnimationMentor. They say it's really cool for them to get to go back and really think about the basics again, and to see how enthusiastic and motivated their students are. Very cool! :)

Mojo Rizen

08-09-2005, 05:30 PM

Oh sure, call us freaks and then expect us to share all the sweet juicy information we picked up! :D

And there's something like 200 students joining us in the fall! :applause:

I think that's pretty much it. :)

According to the e-mail I just received, there are now only 199 other openings being filled, I just got the green light for this fall.

zeroeffect

08-09-2005, 05:43 PM

Just got my fall acceptance as well... I'll see you there Mojo.

AjaBogdanoff

08-09-2005, 06:16 PM

Congrats Mojo, and welcome aboard! :D

kenshi

08-09-2005, 07:33 PM

wow. this thread is still alive and kicking! now in my second term at AM and after experiencing Siggraph, i am more excited than ever about the AM community, animation, and the future of the medium. meeting Glen Keane was a big highlight, as was seeing a short short clip from Rapunzel Unbraided, the feature that Keane is directing. Imagine Keane style animation flawlessly executed on a CG character. the squash, the stretch, the expression, the fluidity. i had to pick my jaw up off the floor.

any of you thinking about joining AM, DO IT! if you're serious about it, i can't think of a better way to develop as an animator. i started from having practically no experience to feeling more and more comfortable with the process. i finally UNDERSTAND how this magic happens. getting shots don't intimidate me like they used to. i know what steps i need to take to get started, and i have a community of peers to bounce ideas off of and a professional mentor (my current mentor being the one, the only Victor Navone from Pixar) giving me tons of amazing feedback.

i'll try to post more often and check out what's going on around here. feel free to drop me a line if you have any questions.

SkyZero

08-09-2005, 07:59 PM

According to the e-mail I just received, there are now only 199 other openings being filled, I just got the green light for this fall.

Congrats Mojo! See yah in the fall term! :thumbsup:

anthea

08-09-2005, 09:23 PM

congrats to all you new students who got accepted! you are in for quite a ride, and at times it does feel like a whirlwind of information

brian is right at AM we take lessons to bum rush anyone wearing an AM t shirt, i myself am quite adept at spotting them in a crowd as aja and brian found out -ooh theres a SHIRT!! (ps i'm also good at spotting famous people too right leo??)

about the books questions
we haven't had assigned chapters in the second semester so far. i think it's taken as a given that you should be trying to soak up as much animation goodness that you can find. i have aquired a mass of books and dvd's on the subject. some additional materials you might want to get are:

any videos by desmond morris-great for live action reference of people doing normal things

the face dvd

acting for animators by ed hooks and the acting in animation book wich walks through 12 animated movies

animation by shamus culhane

timing for animators

john canemakers nine old men

hirschfeld

daumir

force by mattesi

simplified drawing for planning animation by AM's own wayne gilbert

and a great idea would be to get started on watching old charlie chaplin and disney movies

this is bound to get you rip roarin and ready to go!

mikefeil

08-10-2005, 06:57 AM

we should be getting some sought of rego pack any day soon...right ? :D...starting to feel that funny feeling in my chest that you get the night before xmas.

only about another month fall peoples!! :

Sean MacNeil

08-10-2005, 08:44 AM

Oh man, Am is getting bigger and bigger! It's awesome! 200 more peeps! Schaweeeet! I must say that studying at AM is the best decision I've ever made, if you have a passion for animation you will fit right in. All you fall term AMer's are going to love it. And I can't wait to see some of the Spring AMer's stuff as they get into acting...this is soooo exciting!

Later guys,
Sean.

AnimZiggy

08-10-2005, 10:17 AM

hey guys congrats! How long did it take them to answer?

splintah

08-10-2005, 11:07 AM

200 people ! ! ! ! ! starting the same course

i hope they do not loose track of all the students

how many people started the last courses

My Fault

08-10-2005, 04:05 PM

There were around 240+ the first course, 80+ the second and now a new 200. Wow! As little as BOOM sleeps now it's going to be even less this next quarter :)

Kimotion

08-10-2005, 06:06 PM

There were around 240+ the first course, 80+ the second and now a new 200. Wow! As little as BOOM sleeps now it's going to be even less this next quarter :)

For the first batch, there are about 190 students now. So a good number have gone for various reasons, and some are boomeranging back after a break.

I gotta warn people: it is really intense. But if you have the passion, intensity is what you should seek.

SheepFactory

08-10-2005, 06:12 PM

whoa 200 new students! Its gonna be insane in there!

harmonic01

08-10-2005, 06:23 PM

Imagine the ammount of AM t-shirts at next year Siggraph? :)

Kimotion

08-10-2005, 08:24 PM

Imagine the ammount of AM t-shirts at next year Siggraph? :)

Hey Anthea...did you read this? You can make so much cash if you sell all those shirts!

kenshi

08-10-2005, 09:16 PM

for those interested, i just posted a long-ass report of my experience at Siggraph this year on my blog. happy animating!

Sean MacNeil

08-11-2005, 07:33 AM

Great report Kenshi.

Everyone should go read it! Kenshi's energy is contagious! Go on, that's it....go on...still here...why are you still here?

Peace!
Sean.

andy_maxman

08-11-2005, 02:14 PM

hey! kenshi,
great report. :thumbsup:.
have always wondered what it would be like to be there at Siggraph....and there is such a nice feel of the energy and excitement you got in there.....and your drawings are damn! intimidating.....wow! what it must have felt like to interact with the industry folks.....
liked the BB test....nice 'squetching'

if there is any inhibitions i got about AM, it has to be drawing/sketching.....i hope it all turns out well.....
cheers!

-andy

AjaBogdanoff

08-11-2005, 02:25 PM

Lol, Andy, I can't even draw stick figures particularly well, and I'm doing okay! The important thing is that you be willing to draw when you need to, and that you learn how to use drawing to "take notes" on poses and plan out your assignment ideas. So like, what angle are the shoulders to the hips, how much bend is in the arm, what leg is taking more of the body's weight, how is the head angled... stuff like that you need to learn how to observe and jot down on paper well enough that you can understand it when you look at it later. But that's a far cry from being an expert draftsman. :)

I would love to take a drawing class on the side, though, because it's a skill I'd love to have!

AnimZiggy

08-11-2005, 03:47 PM

still bit desperate, my question wasn't aswered eh eh. I just completed the I.Q. test how long did it for AM to answer if u were accepted or not after the test? :bounce:

zeroeffect

08-11-2005, 05:35 PM

still bit desperate, my question wasn't aswered eh eh. I just completed the I.Q. test how long did it for AM to answer if u were accepted or not after the test?

anim_ziggy, I'd say give it 1-2 weeks... Everyone has been wrapped up with Siggraph for the past couple of weeks so it may take a bit of time to get reoriented and caught up.

kenshi

08-11-2005, 05:46 PM

Thanks Sean and Andy_Maxman: Glad you all got something out of the Siggy report. I wanted to write more, but there's come a point where you can't final a post, you surrender it! lol

Amen Aja! beautiful draftsmanship is not the name of the game when it comes to analyzing movement. relationships between body parts is key, and exaggeration is your friend. Don't be a blind copyist. Learn to see the ESSENCE of a pose. Ask yourself, "What feeling, thought, or emotion does this pose convey?" and then take it further and figure out what parts of the body are telling that story! If it's in the spine that's doing most of the storytelling ask yourself, "Can I push it and make it even stronger?!" play around with things.

very basically, you can get away with a circle for the head (with maybe some crosshairs to suggest facial direction), curve for spine, lines with angles for arms and legs, and primitive hand/feet shapes. that's really all you need.

That's a great thing about animation! You have absolute control (well, as much as you are able to wrangle out of your mind and your rigs), and the more you equip yourself with knowledge in terms of human behavior and body mechanics and the principles of animation, the more life you will be able to breathe into your animations. (With great power comes great responsibility, right?)

You just can't let fear of failure stop you from DOING. or stop you from TRYING. would any of us have learned to walk if we quit when we fell after our first steps? or didn't even try because we were scared to fall? AM is built with a lot of face-falling built into the system, but always backed up with a lot of hand-holding, support, teaching, and encouragement immediately after. at least, that's been my experience. GO FOR IT - give it your best shot! and then learn from your (many) mistakes.

AM builds independent-thinking animators, not carbon copies.

So sketch AWAY!! just pick up a pencil and take a stab. there are millions of bad drawings you have to get out of your system before the good ones start showing up.

PATIENCE....HARD WORK....PATIENCE...

- KENSHi

(Ismini: I can't remember how long it took to find out. A few weeks maybe? I hated that test - so stressful knowing that it was an unfinishable test. Take into account that the AM folks have a lot going on right now (and there's not much you can do about the outcome anyway) - I DO know that passion and the desire to animate as described in your personal essay have a lot to do with acceptance. Best of luck and try not to worry!)

AnimZiggy

08-11-2005, 07:50 PM

cheers zeroeffect and kenshi! I hope to be accepted, I cant wait to get started. Ahhh yes that test was really hectic to take.

anthea

08-11-2005, 10:43 PM

lol jeff, those i heart AM shirts are really taking off. if any of my am friends want the link to where i got it i will gladly email it to you, i bought it from a website, uploaded my jpeg and it was only like $17. good deal. at the time i was so desprate for an AM tshirt that i resorted to my own methods. i also made a new one w the image of spike w the pegboard that says "mentor in training" underneath. boom seemed to like to the shirt! that totally rocked being able to show him in person!

heathenPagan

08-12-2005, 03:30 AM

Hey,
Has anyone for the Fall term recieved their enrollment stuff yet....?
Sitting here rocking back and forth waiting.....:P
Can't wait to start.

Cheers

SkyZero

08-12-2005, 04:06 AM

Haven't received mine yet either. I believe in the acceptance e-mail they stated on or about Aug. 12 so we still got a couple more days.

Another question for the existing students, would you guys recommend a wacom tablet or the like? How useful would one be? Also would a tablet work with the grease pencil script?

andy_maxman

08-12-2005, 07:42 AM

for those who are looking to have fun doing BB exercises, here is a cool rig from LichiMan (http://lichiman.aniguild.com/) (jus in case if it wasnt mentioned here earlier)

hey heath,
i just sent a mail across to am to figure out when the EA forms would be rolled out...
am waiting for them too....see you in there...:thumbsup:

Bentagon

08-12-2005, 10:55 AM

Haven't received mine eather. And they indeed said to start on the 12th. Since it's now 3 a.m. in SF, I'm guessing the first will still have to wait a few hours.

- Benjamin

splintah

08-12-2005, 12:18 PM

for those who are looking to have fun doing BB exercises, here is a cool rig from LichiMan (http://lichiman.aniguild.com/) (jus in case if it wasnt mentioned here earlier)

man you just owned your beers ! ! !

thanks a lot !

AjaBogdanoff

08-12-2005, 01:21 PM

Another question for the existing students, would you guys recommend a wacom tablet or the like? How useful would one be? Also would a tablet work with the grease pencil script?

Funny you should ask, we're just having a discussion about this on the other side of the fence.

If you plan to use the GP tool, then yeah, personally I'd recommend a Wacom, just because drawing with a mouse is so frustrating. But you don't necessarily need a big fancy one, I'm just using the little cheapo Graphire one that I had laying around the house, and I think Rebecca is also using a small 4x5 tablet. If you plan to do real drawings with your tablet, then maybe a bigger one would be worth it, but GP is just rough stick figures. Very rough, in my case! :)

SkyZero

08-12-2005, 01:39 PM

Funny you should ask, we're just having a discussion about this on the other side of the fence.

If you plan to use the GP tool, then yeah, personally I'd recommend a Wacom, just because drawing with a mouse is so frustrating. But you don't necessarily need a big fancy one, I'm just using the little cheapo Graphire one that I had laying around the house, and I think Rebecca is also using a small 4x5 tablet. If you plan to do real drawings with your tablet, then maybe a bigger one would be worth it, but GP is just rough stick figures. Very rough, in my case! :)

Very cool, thanks for the answer Aja! I don't plan to do any fancy drawings on it, just rough stick figures like yourself. I think that might be the last thing I need to pick up in preparation for starting in the fall term. :thumbsup:

AjaBogdanoff

08-12-2005, 02:23 PM

Cool! You definitely don't need to hurry, you won't need to use Grease Pencil to do the first bouncing ball exercises... though I'm betting some of you bright-eyed youngsters won't let that stop you from trying. ;)

Also, if you wait, you may be able to get a student discount from Studica on the tablet, or so I heard.

mgarward

08-12-2005, 02:33 PM

I got a 6x8 Wacom Intuos3... 6x8 is almost too big, but I would love to use it for drawings one day and not just stick figures so I thought I'd plan ahead. I'm using it for 3D work in Maya as well at greasePencil, at the moment using the Wacom for blocking and posing, and then switching to the mouse for detail stuff. It's good for my wrists, and even though I'm not great using it yet, I find it faster than a mouse in Maya. Just be sure to get one with a 2-button pen (or the "Duoswitch" or whatever Wacom calls it) so you have a "middle mouse-button" for Maya. Your mileage may vary, but that's my experience. :)

d_jnaneswar

08-12-2005, 05:06 PM

I Got my acceptance email!
y eeee haaa!!!
wooow... too excited to type anything....
seeyall in fall online....

AnimZiggy

08-12-2005, 05:12 PM

congratulations! I'm still waiting for mineeeee. arh arh! When did you apply? :scream:

DigitalToon2

08-12-2005, 05:13 PM

Quick question what is this grease pencil script for maya and how and what do you use it for.

And congrats d_jnaneswar I'll see you in the fall. :thumbsup:

d_jnaneswar

08-12-2005, 05:35 PM

Thanks anim_ziggy and digitaltoon..

I applied 2 days ago... on wednesday.. about this time.

Ya.. grease pencil sounds great, but, what is that???

And, I remember reading somewhere that a mouse is better than a pen for your wrist... any light on this??

AnimZiggy

08-12-2005, 05:50 PM

:eek: now im worried i applied earlier than u did, nothing yet awwwwwww i did take the test though.

ttesla

08-12-2005, 06:10 PM

grease pencil tool is the great thumbnail sketching tool for maya created (and constantly upgraded :)) by mr. jason schleifer. it allows you to do sketches in viewports and has many many neat features.
to get more info and to download the script, please check this thread (http://jonhandhisdog.com/forum/index.php?act=ST&f=21&t=1372) on his plog (http://www.jonhandhisdog.com).

and btw, don't worry guys. AM people are super-professional and will contact you ASAP. just have in mind that there are many applications (200+!! woohoooo!!!) that have to be processed. just spare your f5's. ;)
cheers!

mattmos

08-12-2005, 06:16 PM

This thread will literally never end will it? Always fed by new incoming students and the old hacks dispensing, ahem, wisdom. It should be given its own subforum... maybe a dedicated cgtalk server ;)

p.s. congrats to all the fall guys (fall guy... geddit...)

3FnD

08-12-2005, 07:07 PM

Congrat u la shuns to all you Fallies that have been accepted! Woo! As you must know by know, you're in for a great ride.

A WACOM isn't nec., but many of us who have tried it are glad we have it. Definitely a must for drawing anything, not only using Grease Pencil, but also Plastic Animation Paper, or any other drawing activity. Many say using it in Maya (or other 3D s/w) reduces wrist strain, too, though I haven't tried it yet (I NEED that middle-mouse button, not to mention my "back" button and scroll roller. how do you do that with the duoswitch pen?) but intend to.

I'm using an old 4x5 "ArtPadII", which is surprizingly not too small, and plan to get a 6x8 sometime soon.

From what I can tell STUDENT ID is NOT required to buy a WACOM at JourneyEd.com (unless I'm reading it wrong) and maybe the same is true at Studica. Check fine print.
and the old hacks dispensing, ahem, wisdom.
...(fall guy... geddit...)
That's funny mattmos!

Bentagon

08-12-2005, 09:32 PM

I want a cintiq :D

- Benjamin

bledsoed

08-13-2005, 01:52 AM

Finally!!! got my acceptences letter today, actually there was a mix up, i had applied july 6th, and hand't heard a word, apparently my acceptence email got lost in the mail, so i contacted AM and they where great! responded my email right away with the great news.

YAH so excited, cant wait. now we just have to wait til early next with for the registration paper work

see you all in the fall

Derek

SlipGun

08-13-2005, 02:00 AM

Now that's interesting. I was apparently accepted on the 19th of July, but didn't hear from AM either. Contacted them yesterday and found out that I was in.

Looks like at least a few acceptance letters were never sent out when intended.

SheepFactory

08-13-2005, 02:39 AM

I want a cintiq :D

- Benjamin

I'll let you know how it is next month :)

cant wait to animate with it.

My Fault

08-13-2005, 07:19 AM

I'll let you know how it is next month :)

cant wait to animate with it.

Party at Ali's house next month then :)

SheepFactory

08-13-2005, 07:45 AM

hey you already have one no? :)

AnimZiggy

08-13-2005, 12:20 PM

yay! LAst but not least, I got my acceptance letter too! C u all in a month!

Bentagon

08-13-2005, 05:00 PM

I'll let you know how it is next month :)

cant wait to animate with it.Which one are you buying? I noticed there are some really cheap 15" for sale on ebay right now, but unfortunately, my first payment for my holiday job is only due for the 31st :sad:
Would've bought it otherwise. I would LOVE to 3D animate on it. Jason's script and easy control with a pen would be so great. I hate to work with a mouse, and just can't get used to using a regular tablet.

Btw, has anyone of the fall peeps had his/her mail yet with the info for payment etc. They were supposed to start sending them yesterday, but haven't heard anything from them yet. And my dad wants to get it done as soon as possible :D

- Benjamin

SheepFactory

08-13-2005, 05:52 PM

getting the 21" one.

mainly because i want to work while standing up. CIntiq combined with this rocks workflow wise:

http://www.kinesis-ergo.com/savant_58key.htm

Bentagon

08-13-2005, 06:30 PM

How in the world are you able to afford that? That's $2700, right? And you already need to pay both AM and AAU? What's your secret :D ?

- Benjamin

kenshi

08-13-2005, 08:13 PM

i use my 6x8 exclusively in maya, and everything else. just program the front pen "button" as the middle and the rear "button" as right click and you can scroll webpages while holding the middle button down in web browsers. i've been using maya for 6 years since version 1.5 and started using the wacom soon after - haven't gone back to a mouse since.

that cintiq would be sweeter than sweet, though. i heard from the animators at the Disney booth (Mike Belzer), at siggraph that they are all going to be using Cintiqs in the near future and are way excited about it.

so with the cintiq, can you attach a regular keyboard as well? and would the kinesis savant be in addition to the regular keyboard - say, for setting up custom hotkeys in maya to animate like a madman? very intriguing.

SheepFactory

08-13-2005, 08:38 PM

yea i am getting the kinesis savant to totally eliminate the keyboard and the mouse. There is enough programmable keys on it for all your modeling , texturing and animation workflow.

"so with the cintiq, can you attach a regular keyboard as well? and would the kinesis savant be in addition to the regular keyboard - say, for setting up custom hotkeys in maya to animate like a madman? very intriguing."

but yes , you can totally do that also.

kenshi

08-13-2005, 09:05 PM

what about typing emails and such with no keyboard?

animation-angel

08-13-2005, 10:37 PM

SheepFactory

08-13-2005, 11:26 PM

what about typing emails and such with no keyboard?

fot that stuff you will need the keyboard. This is just for modeling , texturing and animating.

Your keyboard is still hooked up anyway you dont unplug it to use the savant , just plug it to a USB port and you are good to go.

Kimotion

08-14-2005, 02:06 AM

Hi Everyone,

I've been keeping my eye on AM since it was announced. I am wondering if there are any AM students in the program now who are working animators? And how do they find the experience?

I have been wrestling with the idea of taking the course for some time now, feeling that I have hit a plateau in my animation experience and by taking the course I might be able to get to the next level. But I have not really heard anything from professional animators taking the course. Any information would be very helpful. Thanks :thumbsup:

Yes, there are quite a few in here who are already professionals. From what I've seen, most of the working professionals are in the gaming industry and there are quite a few who currently work at other studios, like tv and film.

And from the professionals I've talked with, their main reason for taking AM is to improve their skills, because it's a disciplined way to reach the higher level they seek, as well as to brush up and keep pace with the evolving art. And I heard from a source (can't remember where) that there is a trend in enrollment where there are more and more professionals applying to be students. I think it's a Siggraph rumor: please correct me if I'm wrong.

And it can get very intensive if you are currently working. I am just an intern now, but I find it grueling but rewarding at the same time. This also makes you realize how important time management is.

Per-Anders

08-14-2005, 03:05 AM

deary me, you should cool it Mr Cole you're making yourself look quite the fool, don't they play guitar in Fort Collins?

animateddave

08-14-2005, 03:11 AM

What would Leo Laforge think Duane?

clockwerkz

08-14-2005, 03:11 AM

ANYWAYS..

Been extremely busy trying to balance family life/work/school, but I just want to give my congrats and good luck to those starting in the fall. 200! Woohoo! AM is going strong!!

cW

animation-angel

08-14-2005, 03:51 PM

Thanks Kimotion, your reply was very helpful. Its good to know there are others out there like me! I still have a lot to think about, but I appreciate the time you took to answer ;)

Sean MacNeil

08-15-2005, 01:20 AM

edited for uselessness of previous post:thumbsup:

coop

08-15-2005, 03:06 AM

Originally Posted by animation angel
Hi Everyone,

I've been keeping my eye on AM since it was announced. I am wondering if there are any AM students in the program now who are working animators? And how do they find the experience?

I have been wrestling with the idea of taking the course for some time now, feeling that I have hit a plateau in my animation experience and by taking the course I might be able to get to the next level. But I have not really heard anything from professional animators taking the course. Any information would be very helpful. Thanks :thumbsup:
</FONT>

Yes, there are quite a few in here who are already professionals. From what I've seen, most of the working professionals are in the gaming industry and there are quite a few who currently work at other studios, like tv and film.

And from the professionals I've talked with, their main reason for taking AM is to improve their skills, because it's a disciplined way to reach the higher level they seek, as well as to brush up and keep pace with the evolving art. And I heard from a source (can't remember where) that there is a trend in enrollment where there are more and more professionals applying to be students. I think it's a Siggraph rumor: please correct me if I'm wrong.

//////////////////////////////////////
kimotion is right...

my impressions of animation mentor were really good. i'm self taught, because when i started out, there weren't many accessible avenues for animation education, and i look for any chance i can to sharpen my skills and learn how to develop a more critical eye. AM was very useful and a great program (from the 1 class i've taken thus far)- basically there isn't a lot to animation - it's like drawing or any other art form where the tools are pretty straightforward, but how you use them is what it's all about. The exercises are basic and simple, but not simplistic- because the scope is often narrow, it forces you to really hone in on the core aspects of animation. and seeing 300 other solutions to an identical problem is illuminating as well.

as 'professional animator' - that's a tricky one- the companies i've worked at so far have required fast paced work without a lot of time for polish, and learning how to finish an animation is something many never learn, so for that alone it's invaluable.

a lot of people get irked by the 'cult' quality of AM, but it is a good online community and you actually can get thoughtful feedback on your work, which is not always easy to do.

mgarward

08-15-2005, 04:42 AM

a lot of people get irked by the 'cult' quality of AM, but it is a good online community and you actually can get thoughtful feedback on your work, which is not always easy to do.
"Cult quality"? Not a chance! Now, look at this light and repeat after me: "Animation Mentor is not a cult. Animation Mentor is the best animation school in the whole known universe. I like Kit Kats." Thank you, have a great day!

^Abe^

08-15-2005, 05:14 AM

Here another device that would probably make a good keyboard substitute. >> Nostromo SpeedPad n52 (http://catalog.belkin.com/IWCatProductPage.process?Merchant_Id=&Section_Id=200345&pcount=&Product_Id=162783&Section.Section_Path=%2F%2FRoot%2FNostromo%2E%2E%2EingTools%2F)

Kimotion

08-15-2005, 09:07 AM

"Cult quality"? Not a chance! Now, look at this light and repeat after me: "Animation Mentor is not a cult. Animation Mentor is the best animation school in the whole known universe. I like Kit Kats." Thank you, have a great day!

For 5 1/2 years I was a born again Christian. I consider THAT a cult. That experience sucked and sapped all creativity because all forms of expression was to glorify God, the Christian God that never made sense to me. Why did I join? It was because of a girl.

Once I snapped out of it by actually honoring and acknowledging my natural human instincts, I was no longer afraid to be creative without fear of upsetting God. Nothing feels more liberating than letting go of fears of offending a man-made deity through creativity.

And animation (like any other art) is impossible when your creative urges are stunted. Being in an artistic community is as far away from being a cult as possible.

Coop said that some people view AM as having "cult-quality." He didn't say it is a cult. I've heard "cult" being used by jealous students at a rival art school who recently came back from SIGGRAPH, complaining about those AM shirts that were everywhere. A cult is when a group of people come together, willingly shutting out the rest of reality and immersing into a doctrine or a figurehead that will apparently make one forget the pains of their former lives.

AM can be cult-quality if your entire life surrounds around the school on your monitor. If you spend all day on the AM forum and talking only with AM students, you made your own cult just by sitting in front of your computer. Some may call it "passion." But if you are really passionate, you will get out of your chair, observe and sketch what you see. I highly doubt that most students here are cultish because most have such diverse jobs, diverse lives in diverse places.

It has been stressed at AM that one of the most important parts of animation is having a life (not in front of the computer!): only then you can actually observe the world, observe human behavior and situations that become fodder for your animation. You cannot get material for animated stories unless you also know people in other fields, other lifestyles, for they are material for your art. You cannot animate if you are not inspired. And one can only be inspired if he or she lives and partakes in the constantly churning creative energy of life.

OK, that last sentence was so cliche. I need to lie down.

stewartjones

08-15-2005, 11:56 AM

Hey guys, great to see this thread still going!

Good luck, and welcome to all the guys starting in fall, there is no doubt this is THE school for animation! :thumbsup:

d_jnaneswar

08-15-2005, 12:47 PM

did anyone that accepted get their enrollment package email yet? I didnot get it yet. The acceptence email said that I would get one on or around 12th august. already 15th.. I CANT WAIT!!!

edit -- someone mentioned gesture drawing... did every one check out the stuff on animationmeat.com and animationpodcast.com?? if u didnt, go rush...

Bentagon

08-15-2005, 12:49 PM

Yep, same thing here.

- Benjamin

AnimZiggy

08-15-2005, 02:00 PM

they said 15th to my acceptance form, so guys it's today!

andy_maxman

08-15-2005, 02:59 PM

main reason for taking AM is to improve their skills, because it's a disciplined way to reach the higher level they seek, as well as to brush up and keep pace with the evolving art.

thanks coop,
what you said has been very re-assuring.....

hi to Adam...

waiting to join the ppppaaaarrrrtttyyyyyyyy folks.....................:thumbsup::bounce::buttrock:

mikefeil

08-16-2005, 01:48 AM

a keith lango vts and enrollment sweetness on the same day.....aww :love:

cant wait to see all you guys in there....rippin it up :D

SkyZero

08-16-2005, 03:59 AM

When you get your enrollment packet, let the rest of us fall termers know so we can be on the look out for it! :thumbsup:

Sean MacNeil

08-16-2005, 04:51 AM

Hey Skyzero, looking forward to seeing your stuff in the fall. From what I can remember, the enrollment packet came about 3-4 weeks before the classes started in June, so I would look for it around the end of this month as I believe day 1 is on the September 19! You're gonna have a blast!

Sean MacNeil

08-16-2005, 04:55 AM

Hey Mike, how are the Keith Lango vts? If anyone else is a subscriber, maybe you could tell us what you've covered so far.

Sean MacNeil

08-16-2005, 04:59 AM

:applause:

Hooray, I just noticed that vivaldo's posts got deleted!

kaveh_michael

08-16-2005, 06:32 AM

Something about AM that I've been wanting to say here, I'm not a student there but Animation Mentor in my opinion is one of the best ways to learn animation, from talking to people who are studying there, it seems that it's definitly worth every penny. (like you didn't know that already!)

...But, I have a critique too, it seems to me, and it's only my very own personal opinion, that AM is moving too fast through the first semester, judging from students blogs and their stuff, and I've tried to look at them all, it seems to me that there's a gap, some of the students have improved and advanced to the second semester while some others are still struggling with the basic principles like timing, spacing and weight, while they have to do pantomime and emotion stuff. So, to make this a constructive crit and not just a rant, for those of you who are starting, make sure you put the time and energy in there to REALLY learn the basics, trust me, one week and one assignment is barely enough to even scratch the surface of timing or spacing, I suggest you do excercises on your own in addition to what AM gives you, try to complete them assignments ahead of time so you can push past them.

And to Animation Mentor guys, IF they ever read this post, I think it would be a good idea to reevaluate studetns works currently in second semester and encourage those who seem a bit behind to work more, maybe arrange a few special sessions for them and get them up so everbody would be on the same wave moving forward.

and to clarify, I'm not any super ninja animator, just a fellow learner along the path who wanted to share his thoughts. If they sound nonsense to you, they probably are :)

-Kaveh

Kimotion

08-16-2005, 07:47 AM

Kevah, I'm really glad you said something and ALWAYS feel free to express what's on your mind. That goes for everyone. Animation is all about critiquing, so I think the school and its students will greatly appreciate any feedback or perspectives.

I do feel there's a gap. But some people learn slow at first and just leap up really fast all of the sudden. Some people are good and fast at first, but plateau sooner then they expect (I'm the second group cus I came in with some animation training prior, even though I learned it the wrong way--yes there IS a wrong way to learn animation!). Others are...well...just damn good.

Also, you have professional animators, as well as students who are completely new. The variance of skill level is expected. I had a conversation with another AM student yesterday that it's mostly -- if not all -- about competing with yourself. Because in the end, it's just you and your demo reel.

mockingbird

08-16-2005, 08:21 AM

aghh still waiting for a reply!! took the test on sunday now im glued to my email and this thread,
congrats to those in the fall term
now back to the waiting game:)

3FnD

08-16-2005, 08:28 AM

...make sure you put the time and energy in there to REALLY learn the basics, trust me, one week and one assignment is barely enough to even scratch the surface of timing or spacing As Kimo said, one reason for such varying levels is the variety of experience levels we all came into AM at. Some had been using Maya for years. Also, many ppl have full time jobs, families or both. So there is quite a bit of variation in how much time each of us is able to devote to AM. Ideally, an AM student would be able to put in close to 40 hours a week...it really is that intense.

Originally AM considered offering a slower pace, 2 wks per assignment rather than 1. I knew my time would be limited and would have preferred that option, so would some of the other students I've talked to who have full-time jobs. But for now only the 1wk pace is available.

You only get out of AM as much as you put in, but unfortunately, how much you put in is limited to the time you are able to squish out of all the other areas of your life. You can only make so much time out of nothing. Everything still has to fit somehow. And despite the intensity of the coursework, AM tends toward a philosophy of balance, which Kimo also mentioned. Without decent balance you could easily get burned out or seriously stressed.

sternio

08-16-2005, 08:45 AM

judging from students blogs and their stuff, and I've tried to look at them all, it seems to me that there's a gap, some of the students have improved and advanced to the second semester while some others are still struggling with the basic principles like timing, spacing and weight, while they have to do pantomime and emotion stuff. So, to make this a constructive crit and not just a rant, for those of you who are starting, make sure you put the time and energy in there to REALLY learn the basics, trust me, one week and one assignment is barely enough to even scratch the surface of timing or spacing, I suggest you do excercises on your own in addition to what AM gives you, try to complete them assignments ahead of time so you can push past them.
-Kaveh

Kaveh, I think a bunch of the students at AM are also trying to do some extra homework on the side to try to improve.

It's great to hear that you are checking out the AM student blogs. If you find that the timing or spacing is off on a particular example it would be so helpful to post a message to that student in the comments section of the post. It's easy to get caught up in the particular focus of any given assignment and forget about some of the more essential elements that were learned earlier on, but sometimes all it takes is a quick reminder and the animator can give those areas the attention they deserve.

It doesn't matter where you are learning animation, feedback is always helpful, and if you went around to a few blogs and added your insights I am sure most people would return the favor if you needed feedback on a piece you were working on. I know I would.

stewartjones

08-16-2005, 10:04 AM

Kaveh, I think a bunch of the students at AM are also trying to do some extra homework on the side to try to improve.

It's great to hear that you are checking out the AM student blogs. If you find that the timing or spacing is off on a particular example it would be so helpful to post a message to that student in the comments section of the post. It's easy to get caught up in the particular focus of any given assignment and forget about some of the more essential elements that were learned earlier on, but sometimes all it takes is a quick reminder and the animator can give those areas the attention they deserve.

It doesn't matter where you are learning animation, feedback is always helpful, and if you went around to a few blogs and added your insights I am sure most people would return the favor if you needed feedback on a piece you were working on. I know I would.

Super agree with this.

All of the students at AM want critiques, so anything you can say will help us out a lot.

Not long now for you fall guys... There's gonna be so many people in the school, it's totally awesome! :thumbsup:

kaveh_michael

08-16-2005, 11:38 AM

I had a conversation with another AM student yesterday that it's mostly -- if not all -- about competing with yourself. Because in the end, it's just you and your demo reel.

That's true Jeff, it's not fair comparing one student to another becasue of all the other factors that are involved as you mentioned like the variety of skills and the amount of time one can put in to practice and maintaining a balanced life. So I may have been going a bit off road there but personaly, when learning something, I prefer to stay on one subject and REALLY learn it in my bones and then move to the next, and it takes me a while, maybe I'm too slow but I feel it pays off in the long run to put in the extra time and effort to practice the principles.

For instance, one assigment that I really wanted to see for students to do, would have been to make a HEAVY vanila walk with the ballie character versus a LIGHT vanila walk, it would build upon the skills leanred from the bouncing ball and yet teach you some more. You know how Brad Bird and company really insisted on getting believable weight in the incredibles. It's one of those things that needs a lot of work and practice to get right.

Kaveh, I think a bunch of the students at AM are also trying to do some extra homework on the side to try to improve.

It's great to hear that you are checking out the AM student blogs. If you find that the timing or spacing is off on a particular example it would be so helpful to post a message to that student in the comments section of the post. It's easy to get caught up in the particular focus of any given assignment and forget about some of the more essential elements that were learned earlier on, but sometimes all it takes is a quick reminder and the animator can give those areas the attention they deserve.

It doesn't matter where you are learning animation, feedback is always helpful, and if you went around to a few blogs and added your insights I am sure most people would return the favor if you needed feedback on a piece you were working on. I know I would.

It's great that they're doing extra work, something that I've experienced in my own learning quest was that, you should never be satisfied with your work, even if your mentor tells you it's great, becasue the moment you are satisfied with something is when you stop improving, you know? and that's one problem I see with some of the students, they are not trying to push past what AM course requires for them. I'm sure the AM guys have designed an awesome course for you to learn from but why not try and go beyond that? so for instance, the emotion test tells you to do four changes from relaxed to alert to engaged to disgust, fine, do that, but also do another with sad to curious to surprised to happy!

It's along Steve Job's way of thinking to always stay hungry.

-Kaveh

Mike, I left a note for you on your blog, hope you find it helpful :)

SkyZero

08-16-2005, 01:48 PM

Kaveh - extra personal assignments is something I didn't think about, but it sounds like a very good idea and something I will plan to incorporate during my time at AM and beyond! :thumbsup:

Thanks for the suggestion! :D

mgarward

08-16-2005, 01:56 PM

It's great that they're doing extra work, something that I've experienced in my own learning quest was that, you should never be satisfied with your work, even if your mentor tells you it's great, becasue the moment you are satisfied with something is when you stop improving, you know?
I couldn't agree more. I am probably unsatisfied with most of my work, but my problem is I don't have time to go back and fix them. last week I tried to do as much as possible to leave some time this week so I could go back and refine an earlier assignment (my walk-with-anticipation, which has mushy timing issues). BUT... I don't know if I will be satisfied enough with my current assignment this week that I will end up with time to go back. :D (I curse the perfectionist in me! I always knew he was there but now he's screaming at me louder than ever before and I can't seem to d enough to make him shut up.)

and that's one problem I see with some of the students, they are not trying to push past what AM course requires for them. I'm sure the AM guys have designed an awesome course for you to learn from but why not try and go beyond that? so for instance, the emotion test tells you to do four changes from relaxed to alert to engaged to disgust, fine, do that, but also do another with sad to curious to surprised to happy!
So far the course design has asked for different things, not quite in the "now do a heavy walk. now do a light walk." way, but in making us be creative, and then whatever direction we've chosen, we have to get it right. The heavy push... if someone had done a light push, the mentor might still go with that but ensure that the animation showed a CONSISTENT weight. That sort of thing.

The course is theoretically designed to only take 10-12 hours of work per week, including lecture & Q&A time. I'm probably spending at least close to double that, and as Kenny said, you could easily spend 40 hours a week. or more. :) Since I feel like my time is more limited (with job and family), I am trying to do something new with each assignment. We've had at least 2 personality walks, for example, so I've tried to make sure I'm choosing a different personality each time. But if you have the time, doing more work outside the assignments is definitely reccommended. :)

And as Mike said... any time you want to critique my pieces at my blog I would welcome it. :) Same goes for... well, everyone.:D Biggest lesson from AM so far, apart from planning: feedback is invaluable.

AjaBogdanoff

08-16-2005, 02:44 PM

I'm sure the AM guys have designed an awesome course for you to learn from but why not try and go beyond that?

:D

Hey Kaveh! Man, why aren't you in AM with us? I remember your bouncing ball exercises from the pre-AM forum, they were amazing! I'd love to see what you'd be doing with Stewie now. :)

And believe me, most of us would LOVE to be able to really take these assignments and go above and beyond. Last semester there were optional overachievers assignments available, and most people tore them up! It was awesome! But now, with Stewie, there are so many things to focus on that most of us are lucky to have something to turn in on time. There's no end to how long you can spend trying to polish off one of these things! I'm at the point where I don't even want to take it out of blocking, because I still see so many problems even at this stage... :rolleyes:

But yeah, the main limiting factor for whether or not we go "above and beyond" definitely isn't our enthusiasm or motivation, it's the number of hours in the day. When you work 40 hours a week and have a family that expects to spend some non-hunched-over-the-computer time with you during the evening and weekend, you just have to accept that you're not going to be able to do as much with your homework as you'd like. :)

And hey, every week we're learning and improving, so what more could you want? :thumbsup:

My Fault

08-16-2005, 05:05 PM

Great post Kaveh. I know many of us were really hoping you would be a student. Your passion and observational skills are very inspiring.

It has been nice this semester that our assignments cover multiple weeks. Really gives us time to go over and over it and try to plus the assignment. Personally I have been bummed that I didn't have the time I had in the first semester but I knew that with the summer comes many vacations and that I am not alone in this particular quandry. That was one of the best things about meeting up with the gang at SIGGRAPH, seeing that we are all in similar boats and that we all support one another. Amazing bunch of folks.

The level of work this semester has been blowing my mind. People are really focusing on upping their skills and it shows. Yeah it has been tough and we have all had those weeks were we aren't sure of ourselves but since the overall vibe of the school is so supportive, we push through and get better. Can't wait to see what everyone does in the final few months on our shorts.

And as far as I know there will be an evaluation of some kind of students works to see where their skill levels are at and what they might need to work on. The gang at AM are seriously interested in seeing everyone improve. It's not a diploma machine to them, they really do give a crap about all the students.

jschleifer

08-16-2005, 05:32 PM

I think that's my fav thing about the school.. after talking with bobby & carlos (I haven't talked to shawn about it, but I'm sure he's got the same sentiments) they're really mostly interested in creating a supportive environment.. it's not about slamming people when they're down.

It's all about saying things like "yeah, you had a tough week.. we ALL have tough weeks! don't worry about it! Just dust yourself off, get back in there, and give it a go."

Animation is fun, but it's HARD.. there's no shame in having a tough time with it! Some people get it instantly.. other's it takes years.. some concepts you grab right away, others will ellude you for decades.

And I don't know about you guys, but I only learn in supportive environments.. as soon as someone says "you suck" or "wow.. why don't you try something else" I go "pfft" and shut down. Don't get me wrong.. I LOVE criticism.. I love it when someone tells me what's wrong with a shot.. but do it in a supportive way.

That's what I like about the school.. it's tough, but fair. Supportive, honest, and enthusiastic.

word.

agreenster

08-16-2005, 05:45 PM

Man, I havent been to this thread in a while and it is STILL going strong!! You guys are awesome.

Hey when is the cutoff date to signup for the fall term? We found out recently that Shaba is going to cover any continuing education expenses (well, to a point...you know) and of COURSE I first thought of AM.

Maybe I'll change my name to AMgreenster.

Keep rockin you guys

mgarward

08-16-2005, 06:02 PM

Hey when is the cutoff date to signup for the fall term? We found out recently that Shaba is going to cover any continuing education expenses (well, to a point...you know) and of COURSE I first thought of AM.
I believe you can still apply. If in doubt, call the office or send them an email, I'm sure they'd be happy to let you know.

mockingbird

08-16-2005, 06:18 PM

hi agreenster, i had the same question to AM and they replied with this:

We will continue taking application in for the fall 2005 term until September 9, 2005.
Obviously the sooner the better but we will accept them until that date.

I applied last week and took the online test last sunday, so i dont yet know if im accepted or not!!

DigitalToon2

08-16-2005, 06:27 PM

Wow, I really do love this thread, everyones posts are great and very informative. The more I read about AM the more excited I get! I can't wait till september 19th and to be in an enviroment again where everyone shares the same passion and energy for the same thing.

I found in usa today about how some of the larger studios are sending employees into classrooms at some of the larger colleges to either teach or critique students' work, depending on the needs of the school and modifiying the curriculum. However, I would still rather go to AM. It was kind of an interesting artcle so check it out at:
http://www.usatoday.com/tech/news/2005-08-10-dreamworks-technology_x.htm

Kimotion

08-16-2005, 06:43 PM

They've actually been grilling us on the K.I.S.S. principle. One problem was that so many were doing too much at this state and this leads to poorer quality work when it comes to the 12 principles that they are trying to drill into us as deep as possible. When someone does an complicated story within a week, and when the assignment calls for "overlap," it's just too easy to forget the main area you need to work and and get caught up in the gag, or trying to make others laugh. In the end, the student misses the point of the assignment, wasted time and some money.

I went to a school prior to AM (AAU's regular char. animation track) and this was their method:

course 1. Story and Emotion (Generi eating, get on and off a bench)
course 2. Dialogue (10 second clip of dialogue from a movie, actually I loved this class)
course 3. The principles (instructor had no idea how to interpret the syllabus but most of the students asked him to teach the principles because at this stage no one learned it with an instuctor, despite the fact that half were graduating).

In my case, I learned it backwards and probably learned more and have saved a lot more money if I had just learned it on my own. At AM, I am actually trying to unlearn the bad habits and trust me, it hasn't been easy. I know how it is to create this seemingly awesome story in 2 weeks, think it's great because I got an A, only to have it ripped apart by students of other schools in the Internet forums...and they were right. I lacked the knowledge principles. I would love to go beyond, but my needs at this stage are different. I want to focus on the foundations, nail them down before I try anything "storylike" again.

But this is my own personal situation. I noticed that I have greatly improved (and I am the type who rarely admits that I've improved) but of course, I'm not nearly where I want to be at this point.

kaveh_michael

08-16-2005, 07:11 PM

Hey Kaveh! Man, why aren't you in AM with us? I remember your bouncing ball exercises from the pre-AM forum, they were amazing! I'd love to see what you'd be doing with Stewie now. :)

Hey Aja!

Yes, I would have loved to join AM but unfortunately due to some problems I couldn't, but what's really amazing is that I've been learning a lot by just looking at students assignments on their blog and reading about their journey, your blog has been really informative!

I curse the perfectionist in me! I always knew he was there but now he's screaming at me louder than ever before and I can't seem to d enough to make him shut up.

Matt, by all means, let the perfectionist in you to get out! he's the one who keeps telling you to go back and redo the timing or spacing and he's gonna make you learn the most. Regarding the lack of time, I work part time in a boring job myself, so I totaly understand that. Something that I've been doing for some time now and I got the idea by reading Booby Beck's cooment in a Cg Char post, he said something like "animation happens in your mind, not on paper or in the computer" So, you could be practicing animation even when you're not by your computer. You just have to train your mind to work like a flipbook and then draw those poses mentaly and flip them! you'll be amazed at how much you can do this way and by the time you hit the planning stage, you have everything worked out.

anthea

08-16-2005, 07:15 PM

Hi Kevah,

Thank you for your candid and respectable posts. As someone looking in from the outside I can see that you are only getting little snippets of the animations WIP on people's blogs. This might not be the best way to judge if the program is working. I myself feel like none of the projects I've done yet are finished or "reel worthy". They are all works in progress, so take them with a grain of salt. We do have 1 more year of AM to go before we will be graduated so I think we are on the right track.

The point that Kimotion pointed out is crucial. I myself, along with many others only started animating 5 months ago when AM started. We are right along side people who have been WORKING IN ANIMATION JOBS ALREADY FOR 3-5 years. Now you can imagine how hard it is to compete with a level like that as a newbie animator, believe me when I say I'm trying my darn best. My dream is to be a feature animator, so I'm giving it all I got, and being along side developed talent only helps push me further.

It is true that students can fall by the wasteside, to use that term. But just based on the huge amount of students it makes sense that there will be many different levels of skills developing and changing throughout the program. This not only has to do with the skill set and experience they have coming into AM but the time they have to devote to it. I myself think of AM as a full time job, spending betw 40-70 hours per week on AM duties (not just animating, planning, sketching, getting reference, reading books, watching animated movies). I made the decision after the 7th week of the first semester to quit my full time job at Psyop since I wasn't able to concentrate and learn, having no time for my AM homework. I think it helped me to learn, by devoting myself and cancelling out other distractions, cause in the end they disctractions to my untimate goal of learning animation.

Others may not have this option, they have jobs and kids to support. But a lot of these amazing students are doing great (like Mat G woohoo). So there isn't a formula to know why a student is or is not doing well. I believe that there is no fault with the program. A student should know they are not doing well and take the steps necessary to improve. AM can't hold your hand through your homework, that's your responsibility in the end. They do have a policy of grade c or higher to graduate to the next level. With the amount of feedback we get on a weekly basis a student should be able to pull up their grades with patience and practice.

As Jason said, one of the greatest parts of AM is the supportive community. We have an amazing critiquing system, and a very helpful forum devoted to the persuit of animation. Not every student uses these resources that are available. That is not AM's fault.

Kaveh, that is great that you are able to take a look at some of the blogs, it isn't the last word on AM as a complete program, but definetely gives you some insight to our daily lives and current WIP. Like Mike Stern said, constructive criticism is always welcome. I would appreciate it as well.

http://antheakerou.blogspot.com/
(please keep in mind I have only started animating 5 months ago, I am not one of the dozens of professionals AM has as students, but this being said I am still learning and prgressing more quickly than I ever imagined)

agreenster

08-16-2005, 07:25 PM

I myself think of AM as a full time job, spending betw 40-70 hours per week on AM duties (not just animating, planning, sketching, getting reference, reading books, watching animated movies). I made the decision after the 7th week of the first semester to quit my full time job at Psyop since I wasn't able to concentrate and learn, having no time for my AM homework.

WOAH! :o

Do we need to send donations?

Kimotion

08-16-2005, 07:28 PM

I myself, along with many others only started animating 5 months ago when AM started. We are right along side people who have been WORKING IN ANIMATION JOBS ALREADY FOR 3-5 years. Now you can imagine how hard it is to compete with a level like that as a newbie animator, believe me when I say I'm trying my darn best. My dream is to be a feature animator, so I'm giving it all I got, and being along side developed talent only helps push me further.

Anthea, for someone who just started 5 months ago, you've come a LOOONG way. With every week that goes by, it's "wow! She is really milking her e-crits!" I really mean that.

As for the professionals who are at AM: looking at their work only motivates me MORE! Sometimes I do get discouraged at myself because I keep thinking "Will I ever reach that level? And if THEY feel they need to improve by taking this class, what does that say about ME!? Oh boohoohoooo..."

But as with anything, if you want to improve, you need to have people around you who are better than you. And you will always find people you can learn from. This is one of the major benefits of AM in addition to the critiques. I've learned almost as much from them as with the e-crits. And since it's online, these people are instantly accessible. You just need to get over your shyness.

anthea

08-16-2005, 07:32 PM

WOAH! :o

Do we need to send donations?

lol, I am doing just fine, it is hard for the most part getting through, but I am living off animation fumes right now! hopefully the hard work and sacrifice will be worth it in the end. Pretty much no social life either, mostly only interaction with other students. No weekends since assignments are due Sundays, so Fri and Sat are crunch time. And no vacations, I cancelled a few vacations which made my family pretty upset, but I couldn't be away from the computer so I had to do it.

Jeff- I do feel that getting to compare your work to more seasoned students is a great feature of the school. There is so much great animation to aspire to.

mgarward

08-16-2005, 07:46 PM

lol, I am doing just fine, it is hard for the most part getting through, but I am living off animation fumes right now! hopefully the hard work and sacrifice will be worth it in the end. Pretty much no social life either, mostly only interaction with other students. No weekends since assignments are due Sundays, so Fri and Sat are crunch time. And no vacations, I cancelled a few vacations which made my family pretty upset, but I couldn't be away from the computer so I had to do it.
This also cuts down on the transportation costs. And the bread and water don't cost too much. That is, on the rare occasions she has time to eat. :)

Don't forget to get outside sometimes! Hehe!

agreenster

08-16-2005, 07:47 PM

AjaBogdanoff

08-16-2005, 07:51 PM

LOL, I can say from experience that we don't need to worry about Anthea, she's doing just fine for herself. Spotting movie stars a mile a minute! And WOW are her animation skills taking off! :thumbsup:

This thread is just amazing... I'm going to have to print it out some time and bind it for posterity. So full of great advice and enthusiasm! :bounce:

mgarward

08-16-2005, 07:56 PM

This thread is just amazing... I'm going to have to print it out some time and bind it for posterity. So full of great advice and enthusiasm! :bounce:
Advice to incoming students: print out this thread, and use it when filming reference for your Heavy Push assignment.

anthea

08-16-2005, 08:00 PM

Wow. I appreciate your enthusiasm, but be careful. Its funny, Bobby once told me (before AM, back when he was a lowly Pixar animator, haha) to never forget to live. Only in living can you draw from experiences to be a better artist, and a better person. And dont get burnt out. And always have a backup plan. (The don't quit your day job has some merit to it, so you're a brave soul) ;) And dont watch too many animated movies to stay fresh and original--seriously. You dont always know it, but you subconsciously copy and repeat a lot of the stuff you see, and if all you watch are animated films, your work will have the been-there-done-that vibe. Want to really improve your skills? Take in some broadway!

Aight, shutting up now

That is so true About the necessity of taking in life. Of course I do get out once in a while to breath the air and go to the beach. Those moments are priceless for inspiration also those quieter moments observing people can be a great resource daily. And Siggraph week was an amazing boost of inspiration, I barely got any hw done that week, that was sort of like a vaction to me. I just went to the Getty Center Museum here in LA this weekend and there were some great Strand photographs. You are totally right about not only watching animated movies, sorry I should have clarified that part, I don't only watch animated movies, I love all kinds of movies if they are good. It is imprtant to take inspritation for a lot of different avenues in life and art. That is a rule I live by.

Bentagon

08-16-2005, 09:53 PM

Amen, anthea.

And agreenster: I do accept donations ;)
Hope to see you as a fellow classmate in fall!

- Benjamin

PS: I am aware of the fact that saying "Amen" is terribly cheesy.

clockwerkz

08-16-2005, 10:51 PM

Here's my two cents into this whole business of experience, and how much time one should devote, and so forth. Personally, I'd love to devote a lot more time to learning animation. Unfortunately, I'm like MattG over there.. work, married and with a baby. An particularly attention hungry 8 month old. Hehehehe. So every week I have my plate full with stuff. Sometimes I stress and I think "man, I only had x amount of time," or I fret about sleeping, but then I realize that some nights I'm absolutely exhausted. But the truth of the matter is that this time last year, AM wasn't around yet. The talk of it was, and the excitment, but the classes weren't going on. And I was clueless about animation. I had only about a year of experience, and that wasn't a full year either. So basically, although I always want to put more work into it, I know I'll get there. Just because it's no "swallow this pill and become a ninja animation" pill, or anything. It's funny, I think somewhere someone mentioned that when we see just an awesome shot in animation, usually it's the same formula. An UNBELIEVABLE amount of time went into it. So while we progress in the classes, it's always important to make sure we are improving.. no matter how small or tiny an improvement, as long as you're not stuck in the same rut and you keep learning, you're doing ok. It won't happen overnight.. Some of my fellow AMers have heard my phrase before:
It's not revolution, it's evolution. :-)
And it's not an excuse to slack either, saying "bah..I'll sweat this stuff tomorrow." Nope.. my other philosophy is to work on animation every day, one way or another. If you haven't thought about it, put something down on paper, or fiddled with Maya on any particular day, then your day is wasted. But that's my own philosophy. As many will note, I haven't been able to post much on here any more, because like I said, I don't want to take any time from my family, so every little minute I can squeeze from the day I try and put into animation. By that same token, I still take my wife out to dinner with the baby, and stll make time for them. Because much like what Agreenster was saying, you gotta live life to be a better animator. :-)

Ok I'm done! Time to animate!

Carlos

baenca00

08-16-2005, 11:25 PM

LOL, I can say from experience that we don't need to worry about Anthea, she's doing just fine for herself. Spotting movie stars a mile a minute! And WOW are her animation skills taking off! :thumbsup:

Couldn't agree more with Aja. I got a chance to meet Anthea, Rebecca, Aja, Brian, and many more students....and they know how to support each other, how to help each other out, how to enjoy life and when to have fun. Without a doubt.

We are trying to make students be aware that animation, while it's not an easy medium (it requires a lot of practice, patience and motivation in front of the computer or the drawing board), it's also an artform that feeds itself from life....from observation, from studying. We're trying hard to show this in as many areas of the school as we can.

...you can learn animation even from Whale watching...

Carlos.

AjaBogdanoff

08-16-2005, 11:49 PM

...you can learn animation even from Whale watching...

...especially if you have an "in" with the whales.... :D

anthea

08-17-2005, 12:04 AM

Couldn't agree more with Aja. I got a chance to meet Anthea, Rebecca, Aja, Brian, and many more students....and they know how to support each other, how to help each other out, how to enjoy life and when to have fun. Without a doubt.

We are trying to make students be aware that animation, while it's not an easy medium (it requires a lot of practice, patience and motivation in front of the computer or the drawing board), it's also an artform that feeds itself from life....from observation, from studying. We're trying hard to show this in as many areas of the school as we can.

Carlos.

Carlos is right, no one is saying animation is easy to learn. It takes complete dedication and focus with as little distraction as possible and a new way of observing the life around you. For me the path to animation has been filled with obstacles, when the AM door finally opened it's like my insides just went crazy and something clicked. I became more and more obsessed with learning animation every day, to an all consuming frezy that culminated in siggraph where we were bursting to share our experiences so far. Just being able to chat w my AM friends like Aja, Brian, and Carlos about our experiences was such a motivating experience. I know that animation is hard hard work, that is why I choose to dedicate as much time to it as possible. But AM has changed the way I live, not only have I got a more clear picture in my head of what my future could be like someday, but they have changed the way we all see things in our daily lives. Being able to just watch and study people and finding that so enjoyable is surely a gift. And the study of people, their motivations for actions is an education that will never end. To be able to be a student for life is a dream that takes hard work to realize. So don't worry about me, while I am spending all my time on animation, drawing, etc, I am enjoying every second.

AjaBogdanoff

08-17-2005, 12:13 AM

I was thinking about this thread as I went downstairs yet again to wrestle one of my shoes away from the dog... Maybe it sounds like it's impossible for some of us AM students to ever have enough time to get out and observe life, since we're already so busy... and forgive me if this is obvious, but observation and experiencing life are things you can do no matter where you are or what else you're supposed to be doing.

I spend 8 hours a day in an office, yeah, but I happen to be working on compiling shots of the Earth from space for background textures, which seem more and more beautiful the more I look through them. Suddenly I'm finding myself stopping in parking lots to just stare at the sky and admire familiar cloud formations. And when I get home and it's my turn to walk the dog, she always has some new and crazy move to watch. Or I'll see one of the neighbors getting jerked along the street by their new puppy. Or I'll watch the cashiers in the coffee shop in the morning, and try to figure out why some of them look confident and others nervous, or how you can tell from their body language that some customers are in a hurry.

If anything, observation is one of the few things I always have plenty of time for these days. :)

clockwerkz

08-17-2005, 12:32 AM

Along the lines of observing people.. I'm thinking of pulling a Homer Simpson and putting on a giant 5 gallon hat with a camera hooked up inside, like the time he did to spy on Apu. There are such great moments and little nuances that people do that i would just love to record them. When I watch the AM videos, I often wonder if these guys just set up a camera somewhere and just left it to video everyone that walked by. There are some really, really cool reference footage clips in the weekly vids!

Carlos

DigitalToon2

08-17-2005, 12:58 AM

I just got the email for registration! :thumbsup:

heathenPagan

08-17-2005, 01:16 AM

I just got the email for registration! :thumbsup:

DANG!
Still waiting on mine........my F5 finger is getting sore......:scream:

agreenster

08-17-2005, 01:31 AM

Suddenly I'm finding myself stopping in parking lots to just stare at the sky and admire familiar cloud formations. And when I get home and it's my turn to walk the dog, she always has some new and crazy move to watch. Or I'll see one of the neighbors getting jerked along the street by their new puppy.

Bah!! Tell the truth! You're only looking out the window daydreaming because you'd rather be animating! ;)

My wife and I just got a pomeranian. Kimotion has already threatened to eat her.

bledsoed

08-17-2005, 01:45 AM

just recieved my registration information as well at 4:24pm pmt, make sure you have ennough paper, you need to print 2 copies

SkyZero

08-17-2005, 02:05 AM

Just got mine at 4:25 PM today! :thumbsup:

sternio

08-17-2005, 02:11 AM

Mike, I left a note for you on your blog, hope you find it helpful :)

Thx man, I will totally incorporate what you wrote. I just realized that I know your work from Doodlesquad, great stuff.

AjaBogdanoff

08-17-2005, 02:19 AM

Bah!! Tell the truth! You're only looking out the window daydreaming because you'd rather be animating!

Win....dow?

Nah, just kidding, when I sit at one of the workstations I can see a little bit of sky outside. ;)

Congrats all you Fall folks! We're already bracing for your enthusiastic arrival! :applause:

mikefeil

08-17-2005, 03:23 AM

any minute now.....anyyyyyy minute

WillRyan

08-17-2005, 04:27 AM

It's finally here. With all the stuff we need to print out, I'm gonna eat some dinner, then get to filling out the info!

SkyZero

08-17-2005, 04:49 AM

What luck, I go to print out the enrollment packet and find out I only have 15 pages of paper left (just enough to print one copy)! :argh:

I'm gonna have to go make a copy at work tomorrow, fill it out there, and send it on its way. :thumbsup:

How long does one wait from submitting the enrollment packet to getting your ID? As soon as you get your ID are you able to log in for orientation and are you told who your mentor is then?

Very excited, very much looking foward to meeting all of you people in AM! :thumbsup:

mikefeil

08-17-2005, 11:09 AM

i havent got anything yet...should i be scared? has anyone else not got anything yet? I signed up a long time ago to AM (when this thread first opened) maybe something happend...

:shrug:

AjaBogdanoff

08-17-2005, 01:45 PM

Hey Mike! This thread first opened almost 8 months before they started accepting registration, so if that's when you registered, maybe you should be worrying! ;)

Otherwise, though, I'd give it another day before I officially started to worry... If you page back far enough in this thread, you'll see me doing my best not to panic when everyone but me got accepted on a Friday, and I didn't hear until the following Monday. :p

It's funny to look back and see the encouraging PMs I got from "strangers" that weekend, who have since become some of my best AM buddies. :)

AjaBogdanoff

08-17-2005, 01:57 PM

How long does one wait from submitting the enrollment packet to getting your ID? As soon as you get your ID are you able to log in for orientation and are you told who your mentor is then?

It's probably changed from when we signed up, but the ID just let us register an account, not actually log in. And our mentor assignments came all at once in a mass email over the course of a day or two, pretty close to when classes started. I wouldn't expect to find out the mentor assignments until the week leading up to September 19th, personally. They proabably have to wait until everyone's payment is in and squared away before they can seriously divvy it up.

So... patience! :)

Bentagon

08-17-2005, 04:37 PM

GEEK OUT! :D

:bounce::bounce: I can't believe that after a year of anticipation, it's finally coming! Only one month left to go... T-minus 33 days, and counting...

- Benjamin

swadepgh

08-17-2005, 05:26 PM

Bentagon I am excited for you!

You will love being in AM and those of us already there will welcome your enthusiasm to the mix. :)

It will be nice to get another new class of animation obsessed students, especially with you in it, since you have been there anticipating this whole thing right from the first ever announcement. :) You kept the rest of us going when we were anticipating the same thing.

3FnD

08-17-2005, 11:26 PM

Suddenly I'm finding myself stopping in parking lots to just stare at the sky and admire familiar cloud formations.I've always watched the clouds...I love clouds!!

But now that I'm a mentee, I curious about the cloud's mood and motivation, is it happy or sad, or heavy or light! Hahaha!

Once you have really become the kind of animation student we are all dedicating ourselves to be, I would say observation is one task that it virtually impossible to not do! Unless you eyes are closed, you are observing something! And now we watch the world with different eyes than before, paying far closer attention to the tiniest details, loving it, learning it, living for the art and fun of it all! OK maybe that was sappy...but it's true.

Congratulations Benjamin, and others that just got notice! It was only a short time ago you were hoping us Spring 05-ers would not abandon this thread! Now it's only a matter of weeks and you will join us, too!

Bentagon

08-18-2005, 01:23 AM

Thanks guys! :)

- Benjamin

mikefeil

08-18-2005, 02:12 AM

dang..just woke up...ran to my computer, as if it was christmas day, and nothing :(. I think I might email now

andy_maxman

08-18-2005, 06:11 AM

now i have got reason to :bounce:....hooray! and see you all in Fall.....:bounce:

StapleGun

08-18-2005, 07:13 AM

coop

08-18-2005, 07:50 AM

hey staplegun-
it's not that realistic to expect people to get hired after 1 semester of school!

that being said, we hired that whiz kid Kimotion for the summer. The student body is a mixed group of professionals, students, and those of us just getting by on our looks. Many are working as animators and not actively looking, and those just starting out aren't learning bad habits and are patiently working on their skills.

I understand the 'hyperhappy' comment - i think the impression one gets of the school from reading the forums can seem insincere in its ebullience, but just take that as the end product of a bunch of really enthusiastic people who are just fired up about learning.

Sean MacNeil

08-18-2005, 08:23 AM

just take that as the end product of a bunch of really enthusiastic people who are just fired up about learning.

Nicely said coop.

Personally, I am only in the first semester so I definitely still have alot to learn, and I'm not ready to look for a job quite yet. Although, I will venture a guess and say that some of the class 2 students might have a chance at getting hired, judging by the quality of the last couple of assignments they've done. I know they are not learning acting yet, but at this point, you can tell that many of them have a very good understanding of the basics which might be enough to fit into a junior position or intern postion nicely.

mgarward

08-18-2005, 12:12 PM

Hi Staplegun!

The full AnimationMentor course is 18 months long, the last 6 months of which are the creation of a short film and building a demo reel. The school only started in March though, so week 9 of the second semester is the furthest any of us are at the moment. I think most of us who are new to animation, don't think we're good enough to put together a competitive reel, and we're waiting until after the last 2 semesters. I may only be speaking for myself, though. :)

AKS

08-18-2005, 01:47 PM

wow, it's so great to see people like Bentagon & andy_maxman who have been SO excited for SO long finally getting ready to start. :) I had trouble waiting the weeks between my application & start of term, can't imagine waiting months & months. Anyways, just wanted to welcome all you guys & gals coming in to this next term. I think you are really going to enjoy it. Watching everyone grow over the last few months has been amazing in and of itself. It's going to be great to have another 200 around to see grow with the program.

See you in the virtual halls!

:thumbsup:

AnimZiggy

08-18-2005, 02:12 PM

Hey Alison, I think we met briefly on a XSIBase meeting, :)

AKS

08-18-2005, 04:05 PM

Hey ziggy, glad to hear your going to be joining the AM crew!!

It's always awesome getting more locals (Londoners) into the program. :) We try to do a few meetups during the term for UK/Europe people, at least one at the start and the end so keep your eye on the Student Gathering Board once you get access to the AM forums.

AnimZiggy

08-18-2005, 04:09 PM

will do! :D

mattmos

08-18-2005, 04:39 PM

Hey Ismini! Glad to hear you got in! See told ya you had nothing to worry about :p

anthea

08-18-2005, 06:30 PM

There's just so much positivity in this group! It's truly inspiring and I've yet to see any dissent or complaints.

Hate be throw poop into this squeeky clean forum, but has anyone actually got an animation job through this school? Please let us know because that is THE MAIN THING that people really care about. Your gatherings at siggraph was nice and all but is anyone actually an animator working? I'm not referring to the professionals taking this school but rather the "newbies."

I've yet to see any demo reels on the cgtalk banner from animation mentor. I apologize in advance for my attitude. I am extremely skeptical at a school that has so many hyperhappy students.

Hi staplegun,

Thanks for your inquiry. Truth be told, the AM students are happy because this is the first time any of us feel like we are actually learning and getting our money's worth from a school. I myself have been through other programs and have never before had the support and expert assistance that AM gives you. I attendend NYU for Masters in 3D and in no way had a smile on my face at the end of that $60,000, when I was unable to get a job for 2 years. I feel that even in the first semester of AM, those of us that worked hard all learned way more than we ever imagined. So if you ask why I'm super happy, it's because AM has given me a shot at making my dreams come true of becoming a feature animator one day.

With all that hope and enthusiasm being said, we are only into the 5th month, and for me I have never animated before. I don't know any other students in the same boat as me who were newbies before AM that are looking for jobs at the moment. Most of the students looking for jobs and making reels have previous work experience and animations under their belt. I think the rest of us are just concentrating on the current lessons and will do so until graduation, 1 year from now. I myself will not be looking until then. Of course AM cannot guarentee you a job! This isn't a magic potion, they can only show you the path you need to take and teach you how you can get the skills you will need, the rest is up to you, it requires total focus and long hours at your computer. It is not a guarentee that every student will have this level of dedication, it is like that at every school.

I have already seen amazing work from AM students that totally blows my mind, and not just from the professional students. You get out of AM what you put in, and for those students that are putting their heart and soul into their assignments, they are getting back the joy of learning character animation.

sinbad

08-19-2005, 12:40 AM

Hey guys, almost the end of term, wow!

Staplegun: Give us a chance dude! I'm not even thinking about putting together a reel for at least the next 6 months. All I can say is I've been on the course for only 9 weeks and my animation has improved by about 30-40%. I spot basic errors much more quickly in other people's work, and normally know how to fix it (its not always apparant in your own which is why you need fresh eyes). Its because we crit eachothers stuff to death, and have ours critiqued to the same level. Because you can watch each and every crit for every student from every mentor, after a while you start to pick things up and learn from other people's mistakes.

A warning to newcomers though.. We are a community but you are still physically alone on this course. You will spend a great deal of your time on your own in front of your computer, and as with all things in life, the honeymoon period will end. Then you must get used to the slog and the long lonely hours, for it is you alone who must draw upon your stamina to see the course through, to fight with the machine and software in front of you, be bothered to get up at 4:30 am for a Q&A, and to be ready for the relentless pace of each new assignment as each week rapidly turns around. You will learn that you have to stay inspired, which is why we always seem to be happy and enthused here. You dont see the frustration or swearing of a student at 3am when the graph editor wont do what its told.

mikefeil

08-19-2005, 04:07 AM

I'm getting really worried. I still havent recieved my rego pack yet (anyone else in the same boat?) and I also emailed AM, no reply from them either and that was like 24 hours ago.

Rye

08-19-2005, 04:35 AM

Anyone know when we'll be able to apply for the spring semester of 2006? :) :bounce:

rsluman

08-19-2005, 05:44 AM

I'm getting really worried. I still havent recieved my rego pack yet (anyone else in the same boat?) and I also emailed AM, no reply from them either and that was like 24 hours ago.

I haven't got my registration packet either. I think I will email them tonight and try to find out what's up.

:bounce: 32 days! :bounce:

AmyScott-Murray

08-19-2005, 03:43 PM

mgarward

08-19-2005, 03:50 PM

I'm sorry if this question has already been asked, I didn't know which search terms to use.
Can some of you guys already doing AM please tell me how much of your time every week it takes up? Do you have jobs or other college courses going at the same time? I'm starting at uni in a month or so, but I always feel I should make extra effort to set myself apart from all the other graduates who just do 'enough to pass', and I feel like AM would be an excellent way to do this if I can find the time (and the money!)

The time required is technically about 10-12 hours per week, according to the catalog, and that includes lecture time, Q&A, e-critique, and assignment work. But I think most people at AM would agree that 10-12 hours is a MINIMUM. If you want to make use of the forums, critique other students' work, view other peoples' e-critiques, watch the lecture more than once, and do a great assignment each week, you could easily spend all your free time at AM or animating. I have a job and a family, and I think I'm spending time that ISN'T free animating. Or thinking about animating. Or reading the AM or CGTalk forums... *whistles innocently*

That's just my view, though. I am constantly wishing I had more time to spend animating or cruising the campus for e-critiques or to offer feedback. What will your Uni workload be, and what will you be studying?

I should add... the phrase you'll hear a lot is "you get out of it what you put into it", and it's very true in this case. :)

AmyScott-Murray

08-19-2005, 04:20 PM

Thanks for your reply mgarward.

I had anticipated that most people would spend more time on it than the minimum suggested :)

I will be studying Animation & Digital Media, so a lot of the course content will overlap, I expect, which could help me fit both in. I'm not sure yet about how much time I'll actually need to spend in uni.

I'm already used to spending every free moment in front of the computer, and so are my family - I'm lucky they're so understanding (boyfriend and small daughter).

"I should add... the phrase you'll hear a lot is "you get out of it what you put into it", and it's very true in this case."

completely true... wether you're in AM, 'normal' college, or teaching yourself at home :)

I'm thinking depending on my timetable it might be possible time-wise. The biggest problem then will be the money...

My other question is.. does everybody do each class in sequence? or can you do one then drop out for a bit while you save up for the next one?

Thanks!

andy_maxman

08-19-2005, 04:20 PM

but I always feel I should make extra effort to set myself apart from all the other graduates who just do 'enough to pass',

that is the key and surely a huge motivational factor....

and as for me....got a crazy job.....demanding endless amount of time.....
a lovley wife and kid (who is my avatar)....
exercising which i am yet to start.....( curious about how many of you folks exercise ?)
now i am gonna jump into AM and my prayers are going up real hard.....

so from my POV.....i think 2-3 hours a day for AM would be ideal.....and then stretch a bit more in the weekends....

all the best mate....

-andy

SheepFactory

08-19-2005, 05:30 PM

Good luck andy , since you are coming in from basic foundations its doable but I wouldnt recommend it with body mechanics or any of the other advanced classes.

I'll be taking the next semester off since its my last semester at school and i am also working 2 days a week animating + taking 4 classes. If I add AM to that i think i'll just die. The best scenario would be if you can take 6 months off from whatever you are doing and just focus on AM. This semester felt like i am trying to catch up instead of being able to experiment and learn due to time constraints.

Bentagon

08-19-2005, 11:20 PM

Hey guys,

I'm currently in the process of letting my father build an animation disc for me :D. It's going awesomely well, but there's one slight thing I was wondering about: where we should place the pegbars.

Through the information I found here (http://www.animationpost.co.uk/novice_notes/field-sizes.htm), I calculated (I'll spare you guys the details) that for a 16 field animation disc the centre of my glass drawing plate should be located 7.19" above the bottom round peg, and 7.19" below the top round peg (disc based on this (http://www.chromacolour.com/images/disk16fd_L.jpeg)). Since I don't want to buy a €40 field chart just for this, I was wondering whether anyone of you mentees would be so kind to ask a mentor who has one (I presume at least Dave Burgess, Randy Haycock and Jason Ryan would have one laying around) if these are the correct measurements, and if not, what they should be.

Please?

Pretty please?

Thanks a lot :)

- Benjamin

kenshi

08-20-2005, 12:34 AM

andy: re exercise

when i first started AM, it consumed all of my time and energy - sleep, eating, exercising all went by the wayside. then, i realized that the more my health suffered, the worse i was doing in school. so then the pendulum swung the other way and i spent more time on myself.

now, i've struck a happy medium where i'm learning to balance all the aspects of my life to get the best out of everything. i started a workout program 2 months ago where i lift 5 days a week for less than an hour a session, and i have so much more energy and strength to carry me through those long hours in front of the computer (i also use maya fulltime at work, but not for animation).

something else i do, which i find immensely helpful, is attend a hip-hop dance class offered at my gym. it is different from aerobics, because like animation, you have to observe carefully and re-create specific movements, but you do it with your own body. it's real world practice and has helped me be more body aware and able to break down mechanics much better than i would sitting on a couch eating potato chips staring at someone else do it on a tv screen. but even here, get a BALANCE - observation and getting off your a** and acting it out.

sometime soon, i hope to do like anthea and others and either quit my fulltime job or move to part-time, because this is where it's AT! time is precious, precious and animation needs a lot of it to really flourish properly.

rsluman

08-20-2005, 01:26 AM

Woo Hoo! Finally got my registration packet!

:bounce: 1 Month Away :bounce:

d_jnaneswar

08-20-2005, 01:57 AM

I got my reg pack and I printed it out 2 copies and all.. now, I am filling it ...
AM, Here I come....
And Congrats to all fallies..

mikefeil

08-20-2005, 05:26 AM

Still waiting :(

mockingbird

08-20-2005, 05:32 AM

YEAH ! got my aceptance email this morning!
any other AM people in London or uk?
cya all in 1 month!

pmiles

08-20-2005, 05:08 PM

Well I applied on July 31st, was accepted on August 3rd, and my enrollment packet arrived on August 16th. I call it the old "Siggraph Sneak" ;)

I will have to say this much, because it's not said all that often and I really think it should be... school is school. It is a place of learning. You go there to learn, not to get a job. The quickest way to disappointment or failure is to think too far ahead... don't worry about getting a job while you are in school, you have plenty of time for that later... concentrate on your studies. It's like buying a car solely for it's projected resale value rather than for what it was designed for, transportation.

You will find that if you take the freight train approach to animation, you will miss the most important aspects of animation... it is something that takes time to learn and do well... that is what AM is trying to get across to people... that one or two classes in animation are woefully inadequate... in fact, I'd be willing to wager that every one of the AM mentors would say even 18 months of intense study is just a starting point. Worry about what happens after school when you are done... for now, just concentrate on your studies and be happy :)

pmiles

08-21-2005, 01:31 AM

Wow, I was reading through all the posts and I almost fell over when I read how much you all stressed over the essay portion. I don't think I even wrote 100 words in mine... I couldn't see but the last 4 lines that I typed, so I'm sure it made absolutely no coherent sense.

I think the essay is merely a test to see if you can write in english... if you can write in english, one can safely assume that you can read english... I think it's more of a test of your understanding of the english language than anything else... a form of ESL test if you will.

So for all you future applicants... don't stress out too much over the application process.

Bentagon

08-21-2005, 01:38 AM

The thing is, back then, we had NO idea how many people would apply, how strict they'd be on application, and so forth. People now can be quite relaxed indeed, since most (if not all?) did get in. But don't get too relaxed! You should get into this program because you're excited about it! And make it show in your essay! They won't not take you because you had too many words, if it was just too show how much you really want to do this.

- Benjamin

PS: now let's just *bump* this question :D :Hey guys,

I'm currently in the process of letting my father build an animation disc for me :D. It's going awesomely well, but there's one slight thing I was wondering about: where we should place the pegbars.

Through the information I found here (http://www.animationpost.co.uk/novice_notes/field-sizes.htm), I calculated (I'll spare you guys the details) that for a 16 field animation disc the centre of my glass drawing plate should be located 7.19" above the bottom round peg, and 7.19" below the top round peg (disc based on this (http://www.chromacolour.com/images/disk16fd_L.jpeg)). Since I don't want to buy a €40 field chart just for this, I was wondering whether anyone of you mentees would be so kind to ask a mentor who has one (I presume at least Dave Burgess, Randy Haycock and Jason Ryan would have one laying around) if these are the correct measurements, and if not, what they should be.

Please?

Pretty please?

Thanks a lot :)

- Benjamin

kenshi

08-21-2005, 01:38 AM

My Fault

08-21-2005, 02:46 AM

Totally what Kenshi said. Don't skimp on the essay portion, it is important. They really want to see the passion you have for animation and Bobby mentioned on a few occasions that it helped separate those who got in and those who did not.

coop

08-21-2005, 02:58 AM

The essay part is important, but don't forget to give yourself a cool nickname - i'm still working on one. maybe by the end of next semester i'll have it narrowed down.

aijoe

08-21-2005, 03:58 AM

are you talking about the essay where you talk about why you want to learn at AnimationMentor.com? if so, i think it's a LOT more than an ESL test. Bobby mentioned to me that the essay was kind of a determing factor - they want to see how passionate you are about animation. the ones that didn't get accepted didn't have that "fire". so use that opportunity to share what about animation gets you going. make it personal.

Oh, no. I just applied a few days ago and for my essay, I kept it short. Basically I said I wanted to improved on my animation skill and meet like minded people. You have no idea how hard it is to keep my "animation geekyness" in check when I wrote the essay. I didn't wants to come off as being an annoyance. I was going to put this down in my essay but decided not to at the last minute. But now, after reading some of the posts, this is the story I would like to have written down on my essay. *Warning: content contains geekyness* :)

When I was kid, my family, we don't own a television. I would get up at 5:30am every Saturday morning and walk over to my friend house to watched cartoon with him. Starting at 6:00am with the Hanna-Barbera's production of "The Gary Coleman Show" and finishing off at 11:00am with a power hour double bills of "Spiderman and his Amazing Friends" and "The Incredible Hulk" :)

3FnD

08-21-2005, 06:10 AM

It's very important to try to get some exercise! You can easily get very unhealthy with all the time and stress of managing your life whilst trying to get you AM assignments done! I didn't have a regular exercise routine before AM and I've been trying to get more in the habbit lately...my situation makes it difficult to put together any kind of regular schedule for anything...including sleep. You definitely want to consider fitting in some type of exercise into your schedule while doing this course. Like Kenshi said, it helps with the energy to get through long, sometimes tedious computer sessions.

And as for the essay, like the guys said, try to put some heart and passion into it. I don't think it's so important that your writing skill or even your English be perfect...however, as time goes on if the popularity of the school increases eventually it may become harder to get in. That's only my opinion, though, maybe not.

cubiman

08-21-2005, 03:41 PM

Thank you all for coming,

First I would like to say that we cannot put the whole film online, because our school (Which the movie partly belongs to) asks for exclusivity for some festival or tv diffusion, but we really want people to see it entirely (9 mn).So we will do our best, it's a shame to see it in 3 parts, I agree...It's not the case for love2love, which is a video clip we did independently of the shool, so we can show it, no problem

Concerning the cost, we were three srudents, 3 PC s, and that's all (except the price of the school which is quite expensive, about 6000 euros!), it's a one year work, from pre-production to sound-design.

Sorry for the pop-ups but you guess that we can't control this, but we will do our best with our web supplier to solve this problem!

thank you and If you have any question you can contact us at 90degrees@free.fr

pmiles

08-21-2005, 05:54 PM

I think the first crop who entered the school... the guinea pigs so to speak... were dealt with an entirely different set of rules than what is in place now. You can tell this by reading the initial work ups of what the school was going to be like. Clearly a lot of things have changed since they initially started the school, logistics-wise and whatnot. Even when I applied, the online site said one thing (FAQs), the downloaded catalog said another, and the enrollment form said still another. The last form is the definitive one since it is in fact your contract with the school.

Passion cannot be read in words alone. One can talk the talk, but can they walk the walk? The real test for passion is in the work that you do. That can only be measured after you get into the school. Would you want to deny someone access merely because they were not skilled with the written word? I can see them having to limit the number of students for logistics reasons, but to accept one student over another merely for what is written on a piece of paper... that would be a shame. I think Bobby stated it pretty clearly... applicants are accepted on a first come first serve basis... first in line to the ticket counter gets a ticket... everyone else has to wait their turn.

I think the school will continue to change as the numbers increase. Based on word of mouth alone, I would suspect that the numbers will only continue to increase... especially once the disposition of the first graduates are known.

I especially enjoy the fact that our international bretheren are able to participate in AM as well... brings a whole new flavor and perspective on animation into the virtual classroom.

Welcome all!

Bentagon

08-21-2005, 06:54 PM

Nitefyre

08-21-2005, 07:01 PM

to accept one student over another merely for what is written on a piece of paper... that would be a shame.

Umm you do know this already happened in the first quarter right like Brian said? Some students did not get in based on their essay. The second quarter didn't have enough students to fill up the whole class I think so everyone was accepted there. Third quarter will be interesting to see how full the class is and how many were turned away until next quarter. Dont hold back on your essay, write about that passion!

pmiles

08-21-2005, 10:56 PM

Bentagon

08-21-2005, 11:54 PM

Actually, before actual application started, they asked some people (including myself), of whom they knew were excited about AM Online, to send in their application letter earlier, so they could set a certain standard. So if only 10 would get in, and 100 applied, but the 6th had an essay that didn't qaulify to the standards they'd set, the 11th would get in. So the essay matters, and it's still first-come-first-serve.

- Benjamin

pmiles

08-22-2005, 12:54 AM

Since we have no idea what those standards are... one can't say with absolute certainty what constitutes an acceptable essay versus an unacceptable one.

I just know that I did not make any statements to the affect that it has been my life long dream to become a character animator, I merely stated that I was unable to find a good program in character animation elsewhere. Really... no syrup in my essay anywhere... dry reading... dull... boring.... a few words... that's it. Worked for me.

My Fault

08-22-2005, 01:51 AM

Wow Pam, why are you arguing so much about this? We weren't saying that we knew the acceptable standards of what gets in for an essay, we are saying that the essay is much more important then you think. Kenshi said the essay was important because that is what Bobby said directly to him. I am saying the essay is important because that is what Bobby said to me when he was standing 1 foot away from me (and jumping around like Bobby is wont to do LOL). We aren't guessing what we think like you are but are stating things that the main man, BOOM, said himself.
They do in fact read all the essays just as they do read every single survey that we have filled out since the school started. This stuff is important to them and does infact help separate who gets in and who doesn't.
Sorry to come off harsh but I don't want people thinking your conjecture is fact. It isn't as simple as first come first serve. They don't have you write an essay for shits and giggles. This is one of the reasons it takes awhile for them to get back to you. They don't just cash your check and your in... though I hear cookies are one of many quality bribes. :)
That being said, congrats for getting in, you are gonna have a blast!

ttesla

08-22-2005, 02:05 AM

regarding standards for essays, i do believe that more of the importance *could be* essays of already enrolled level a and b students that got certain attention at the time and after reviewing latter progress of those people, AM could set certain standards (if any). or perhaps they can pick several students whose progress is unbelievably huge and than check back their enrollment essays.

anyhow, i cannot understand nor i believe that any essay can be used as a reference for others :shrug: and that AM actually does that comparison.
all of us have our own *unique* life stories, reasons for loving animation and a very *unique* level of passion for doing it. that said, it's almost impossible to make any comparison. either an essay is honest/good/promising/appealing or is not, imho of course. :)

most important thing when writing essay is to be honest and to give your best to explain what is your driving force to be an animator, as well as why do you think that AM is school of your choice (the answer on this would be: because all already enrolled students are AMAZED with the program itself and the people around! :thumbsup: )

congratulations to all fall-comers! you'll have a great time at AM! can't wait to welcome you there! :applause:

My Fault

08-22-2005, 02:22 AM

Wow, so there will be over 500 students come the fall. How the heck are we going to find the time to do our assignments and tar and feather all those new students! :buttrock:

SheepFactory

08-22-2005, 02:37 AM

500 new students or 500 all together?

My Fault

08-22-2005, 02:48 AM

Woops, 500+ all together. Curious to see who some of the new mentors will be to help take on all us rabble. :D

SheepFactory

08-22-2005, 03:01 AM

ok i was like wow! :)

Cant believe i am gonna miss next semester :(

My Fault

08-22-2005, 03:11 AM

ok i was like wow! :)

Cant believe i am gonna miss next semester :(

That is a serious bummer Ali, will be glad when you are back. On the plus side you can always sneak up behind Jeff when he is watching his Q&A, but no dancing! :scream:

Sean MacNeil

08-22-2005, 03:35 AM

You aren't coming back next term Ali? How come? That sucks. Actually, that's not too bad, we'll be in class 3 together, provided you come back right away!

As far as the essay goes, you would be foolish to blow it off. It says alot about a person's willingness to put effort into something that matters, in my opinion. And the amount of effort put in is the difference between good animation and bad animation in alot of cases. If you skimp on it, you could end up paying the price because it sends the message that you don't find it necessary and well, that's not a good thing.

SheepFactory

08-22-2005, 04:16 AM

Yea Sean ,

I am finishing up with school and also working. cant handle the AM workload in addition to those. Will be back come december though , hope we will be in the same class! :)

Sean MacNeil

08-22-2005, 04:52 AM

Finishing up with school Ali? I thought AM was school! What else are you taking and where?

SheepFactory

08-22-2005, 05:02 AM

My final semester at academy of art.

aijoe

08-22-2005, 05:40 AM

For argument's sake, let's say the school can only take 10 people. 100 people apply. The first ten to complete their applications (and qualify) get in... they aren't going to survey all 100 applications to find out who the best 10 applicants are from the lot... it goes against what they say on their website... first come, first serve application process. Now, lets say the last slot available had 10 people who got their applications done at the same time, then you would have to choose from those 10, which one would get in. At that point in time, they would look at what qualities differentiate one from another, they would not include the other 90 or so applicants that have not yet got in among that 10 that they are comparing.

I'm not saying don't write a good essay, I'm just saying that one need not write a pulitzer prize winning entry to assure oneself a place in the school. If what you wrote on the essay was all that important to AM, they would not accept anyone into the school until the last day in which to apply... because they would need to compare all the applicants essays before they made their decision as to who to accept into the program.

The difference between now and the first group is that no one was allowed to apply for the first session until a specified date and everyone applied at the same time... now you can apply at any time for upcoming sessions... a whole two sessions in advance of your start date.

Ok, thanks "pmiles" I felt a little better now. I've been following this tread on and off for a while and from reading the correspondents here and IMHO the vive I got from the mentors are that they are helpful and cool bunch of guys and gals. If they do turn some applications down, ( I don't want to speak for the mentors) but they must have a good reason. I don't think they sits in their high chair and say "this one does not deserved to be my student". Maybe they think that it is in the best interests of the students that they do not get in right now. Because $2000US is a lot of money and the students may not be ready yet and it would be a waste of their time and money. From reading the post I found that the mentors wants the best for the students and if I was turn down (I hoped not) but if I do then I'll ask where I went wrong and I will use this as a learning experience and apply again in the next semester. But everyone right though that an essay should express passions for animation. I wished I spent more time emphasizing that. But in the mean time I'll just have to live vicariously off of you guys. OK, i'm signing off now before someone yells "group hug!"

Cheers,

DigitalToon2

08-22-2005, 05:59 AM

I'm going to add my 2 cents about the essay. The essay is about giving AM a look into who you are. It's not as if they are asking to see a portfolio and without the essay what do they really know about you besides your name, address, and place(s) you went to school. The essay gives AM a window into who you are and your motivation for pursuing a career in animation, and if you don’t care about the essay and do a poor job why should they think that you would treat your assignments any differently.

I like what pmiles said about how school is school. You go there to learn not to get a job. I already have a degree, but my animation education was a little bit of everything, I’m not saying that was bad because I know a lot more than I did before when I came right out of high school, but now I’m looking to focus on an area and become the best I can be at it. I’m done now…those were my 2 cents!

andy_maxman

08-22-2005, 06:24 AM

i just keep wondering about how they are gonna keep a tab on quality check on such a number.....500+....?
and this number is only set to grow every semester....

i'm sure there must have been some serious thoughts put into this situation already....

mmmfff......feeling better already after typing this out......;)

mikefeil

08-22-2005, 07:19 AM

Sean MacNeil

08-22-2005, 08:14 AM

i just keep wondering about how they are gonna keep a tab on quality check on such a number.....500+....?
and this number is only set to grow every semester....

I think that's why more mentors come in with each new class, to keep the individual attention at a high level. This ensures that each mentor only has between 10-15 students to focus on per term. This ensures quality and that no students get neglected as they go through each class. There are also alot of campus mentors that go through the workspaces and give you feedback throughout the week. This is really helpful as it gives you a professional animator's feedback during the week without having to wait to hear from your class mentor. It gives each student that much more attention because it's like having two mentors. Plus, I've heard that the website is going into version 2 with the start of the fall term, this will maintain that high level of quality for the community in general.

Something tells me that with a former Pixar animator at the helm, quality will never be an issue no matter how big AM gets! I don't know what Bobby's requirements are for choosing mentors, but wow, the list is overflowing with quality animators. Go Boom!

Hey Mike, it took awhile for me to get my registration pack too, so you don't need to worry. They haven't forgot about you.

heathenPagan

08-22-2005, 08:57 AM

I still haven't got my rego pack for the fall, I have emailed them and everything. I'll give it one more day and I think I might give them a call. Has anyone else still not recieved there's, or is it just me :sad:

Hey Mike,

I got mine a coupla days ago, (I'm in Melbourne) so they've definitely made it over to Oz.
I'm sure there's no problems, they prob'ly just take a while to send out 200 or so enrollment packs......that said, I'd probably be emailing or calling too....

See you online sooon...:scream:
Heath

3FnD

08-22-2005, 09:25 AM

That is a serious bummer Ali, will be glad when you are back. On the plus side you can always sneak up behind Jeff when he is watching his Q&A, but no dancing! :scream:Wait, you're saying Ali also does those dances when he's in the background? wow! 2 for the price of 1!! Yeah, bummer Ali, you gotta skip out for now. But you gotta do what you have to, and that's better than going thru AM all halfassed and frustrated you're not putting in what you would like to.

Brian- are you saying I missed out on the tar and feathering of the Summies? If so, RATS! if not, hey, pluck some more chickens, the Fallies are comin'!:)

heathenPagan

08-22-2005, 09:30 AM

Wait, you're saying Ali also does those dances when he's in the background? wow! 2 for the price of 1!! Yeah, bummer Ali, you gotta skip out for now. But you gotta do what you have to, and that's better than going thru AM all halfassed and frustrated you're not putting in what you would like to.

Brian- are you saying I missed out on the tar and feathering of the Summies? If so, RATS! if not, hey, pluck some more chickens, the Fallies are comin'!:)

I'm always keen for a good tar 'n' featherin'! Sign me up, I'll be there in fall.....

mikefeil

08-22-2005, 11:04 AM

looking forward to meet you heath I'm sure we will be in the same class, don't know of many other aussies right now either who are going into the fall term.

GothTropic411

08-22-2005, 03:05 PM

Jason, I bought your book! :bounce: It's so cool that you're on here, it's like a celebrity watch. Heh. Speaking of the subject at hand, I tried out that site, but with Flash and a 48.8kbps connection(dialup), it wasn't able to come in. :( But I'll wait, I don't think I'm ready for animation anyway.

pmiles

08-22-2005, 05:07 PM

Thought I'd respond to all about my recent posts... I was not arguing per se, just giving a different opinion... some would call it a debate. I don't see the point in having a heart attack over ones application... there are plenty of other things in life far more deserving of that.

This is what makes the written word so deadly... you can't know how someone is going to receive them. To all, I was not looking to argue... so please don't read my words that way.

Peace?

Mikefeil... if you do send them an email, use the address they used to send you your acceptance notice with. That would be a direct line into the school. Their online web contact form uses a somewhat indirect approach. I've gotten prompt replies to all my messages that way. And I hope to see you aboard this Fall... we need more Aussies in animation :)