90 page report=>"Quality of Life in the Game Industry: Challenges and Best Practices"

[keithlango]

Family friendly practices
A conscious effort to minimize overtime
Better communication between management and developers
Better contracts between individuals, studios and publishers
Better planning and budgeting
Better human resource management



That's an amusing list. Heh.

Riiiiiight. :curious:



-k

[googlo]

huh? What's wrong with that list? If you read the 90 pages you would know what they are talking about, it's a real problem. Part of their study involved WHY people think it's acceptable to have unnacceptable business practices in this kind of field..

[keithlango]

I'm with you on this. Don't get me wrong. Nothing's wrong with the list. It's a great list. Wonderful list. I only wish it could be true. I just seriously doubt anybody will do anything with it. There currently exists no short term tangible and measurable financial incentive to keep family people happy in this biz. This report is like telling teenagers that smoking pot and drinking isn't good for them. So what? It's fun, all the cool kids are doing it, I'm young and who are you to tell me what to do you old fart? Modern businesses are essentially immature persons. Immature in the sense that they have no comprehension or appreciation of long term rewards, ramifications or responsibilities as they seek short term return on investment (instant gratification) either to boost stock price or pay off highly leveraged debtloads. Why expect them to behave with maturity? Pure capitalism is sociopathic.

As a fella who's much closer to 40 than 25 and has had a family his entire CG career I've lived the problems for the last 10 yrs. How many people on this board have kids that will be starting college in 3 years? I do. And I can count on my fingers all the Cg artists I know who have kids that old. And I know a lot of Cg artists. The entire business, in games as well as film, is a family unfriendly system. I've seen it all, and until there's a measurable short term financial stick to make the system change, I'm highly skeptical that anything will change.

But hey, at least somebody is talking about it. That in and of itself is a bit of a shocker. I honestly hope it does change. But I'm just a bit too grizzled to think that hoping in change is the same as seeing change. So until I see the system change I'll fight my own battles for my family and keep a very leery eye on the beast on the other side of the cage from me.

-k

[fxgogo]

I know what you are saying Keith, I also find it hard not to get cynical about things like this. It is a sad state of affairs that there is this system in place. And with loads of work being shipped to places around the world it is only going to squeeze the businesses and employees even more. I think a big crash in the market would wake everybody up, and I think that would be the only way things could change the way we want them to.

[rudipooimf]

Like every other field, it will be the companies that actually make changes, make their employees happy in some fashion, and work to find ways past these problem areas that will excel. The rest will keep struggling with 80 hour work weeks, unhappy people, and sub standard garbage games i would wipe my arse with. I met alot of the guys from Epic Games (Unreal Tournament Developers for the un-initianted "Google it") and they seem to do it right. Plenty of fun and their employees are absolutely passionate about their product and the things they do. A lesson to be learned there for sure.

-Pix
www.pixelfader.com
www.stillframestudios.com

[Claymation]

hell most jobs are like that. THey call it a salary. So you work 40 or 100 hrs a week you make your "salary"

Sad to see there is no joy in the game industry either.

makes me wonder how to make a living in the cg field.

[Nocturn]

I don't understand why a game development team doesnt also market the games they make, distribute them. Have an online shop where people buy cd's and you send them. Simplistic yeah, but generally speaking.

I would feel much more motivated working so many hours a week on a game which perhaps I didnt find too interesting in the first place, if I knew I would be getting more than just a monthly pay.

Working 80 hours a week like a schmuck and not even be paid for overtime, just for the "joy", the "privilege" of working in this biz? The hell with that.....

Work to live, don't live to work.........

[MartinGFoster]

god, I'm glad I don't work in games anymore. I did some work for them in the early 90's.

Since then, every time I've talked to game companies about working for them, the pay and work conditions have been completely unacceptable.

I'm not sure how they get away without paying overtime but I think it's exploitation. Probably nobody has challenged it yet with the labor board. The CG film/Visual Effects industry used to be like that but now almost everybody pays OT.

[pogonip]

Nobody wants to lose there job in the game industry ... many employers make it clear that " you are very replaceable and there is a long waiting line for your job " ...movies are a bit diffrent cause it takes so much technical skill ..games are getting better though as the graphics and programing become harder the more specialized persons they need the harder it is to find good people and thus they must treat there employees better :beer:

[Kion]

I work in the game industry, and while some of that list is true, it all depends on where you work just like any other job, Where i work poeple have families , kids, are very passionate about making games, and leave at a good hour. except for crunch time but that is not everyday.

[dragonfollower]

I'm currently working in games (first job in this field) and it's kind of scary because I can see some of these problems at the place I'm working.

So are the visual effects/feature film/broadcasting markets any better in this regard? I'm looking into better alternatives for my cg skills because I really don't see myself doing this for a career.

-Brian

[MartinGFoster]

Originally posted by dragonfollower
So are the visual effects/feature film/broadcasting markets any better in this regard? -Brian

The bigger film places give pretty good pay, benefits, and proper OT pay/rates but there's a lot of freelance work. For example, often 60% or more of the crew is freelance and the rest are fulltime staff positions. So that can be the down side. I was freelance at Sony for 1 year, then freelance at R&H, but recently I was offered and accepted a staff job at R&H :)

The smaller/medium sized places are often doing the same kind of exploitation as the game companies and the projects are often shorter.

So for security and better conditions, go for the larger companies and long-term projects.

[dragonfollower]

Good to know. Thanks!

-Brian

[CourtJester]

Originally posted by MartinGFoster
The bigger film places give pretty good pay, benefits, and proper OT pay/rates but there's a lot of freelance work. For example, often 60% or more of the crew is freelance and the rest are fulltime staff positions. So that can be the down side. I was freelance at Sony for 1 year, then freelance at R&H, but recently I was offered and accepted a staff job at R&H :)

As I understand it, the reason why there's so much freelance is because people were rebelling against the OT demands of staff positions and going freelance to regain a lever (billing the extra time) against bad management practices. In other words, the free market adapted. So pure capitalism isn't so sociopathic after all... once you jettison the fiction that individuals are powerless in it.

I agree that much of it is a function of the particular company. My four years in games were spent at a very family-friendly place -- at least, until it was taken over by a major publisher, then it went downhill from there.

The games industry does tend to attract its own peculiar demographic, who don't see themselves as suited to work in any other kind of environment (read: "normal", a la Office Space) and don't tend to be family folks (read: nerds). There is a game company in my building, and I can pick out their staff from the crowd every time. Even with all the crap going on, I don't doubt that the vast majority of those in games prefer it heavily to any "normal" (read: Office Space) job, and the companies probably know that gives them an extra lever.

[googlo]

Do you think people are afraid to talk about this?

[MartinGFoster]

Originally posted by googlo
Do you think people are afraid to talk about this?

I can't really say if people are afraid because I'm not in that industry but I doubt it. I mean you can be pretty anonymous here, if you choose.

I don't feel afraid to criticize film industry work, if I think something needs to be said and I'm not using a "handle" or posting anonymously.

[googlo]

No, I mean generally. People in the business might be afraid to talk about necessary changes or improvements for fear of losing their job or garnering ill will towards them from people above them or elsewhere in the industry.

[halo]

the problem with the games industry is that its often the last resort for working and being paid and there seems to be a significant proportion of people who are willing to do anything to keep that position and certain companies exploit that.

I know one manager that was given 2 weeks off mandatory by his doctor for physical and mental exhaustion.

I know one programmer whose wife told him it was the job or her and the kids.

I know one mutli site british studio that worked for 5 months on 80+ hour weeks, then tried to get more out of people, sacked most who wouldnt do it, didnt give anyone bonuses for completion, and when some of them went down the pub after this marathon after completion for the afternoon they sacked them all and told the rest that they needed to jump onto another project and do extra hours because that was in trouble. No extra time was compensated for in time off or pay. The game that was in trouble is still in production and is already nearly 2 years behind. These same studios uses warez on a massive scale, despite having run ins with the authorities. They also give % to people to find willing people to who think low wages are good and are desperate to work in CG art...basically green students with little hope of working elsewhere. They pay them badly, burn them out and let them leave. Even if they make you redundant they advterise against the employment law for the same position immediately, and they are constantly advertising. Despite being funded by big multinational top player publishers, these practices are evry day.

Im not saying that there isnt any talent in games or that games isnt an industry to aspire to work in and that all studios are bad, but there are some bad big and well know studios who are full of borderline artists, old staff and exploitative management that really just deserve to go to the wall, but for one reason or another they cling on with their fingernails thrashing every last ounce out of their badly constructed idea and staff, either slipping or getting dropped or just producing another stiff that just about breaks even or keeps the minimum payments going on their finance.

Think carefully about working for a company that always seems to have positions available.

The publishers have some responsibility as well, their financial influence and control is a factor.

The games industry is riddled top to bottom with unprofessionalism...the trick is avoiding it.

[orion 77]

about ruddy time this came out in the open. i have a few friends who have been crapped on from a great height by games companies. cant mention names (unless you ask enough times)

[Tan]

Ya the bigger the studio the better the conditions are. But there aren't that many big studios out there.

I know a guy who loves working at EA, he says it's the best place to work, ...but not everyone has connections like him. Anyways, I'm being extra nice to him:D

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