Virtools for games development

[gout]

Yeah I've been using it on and off for the last three years, mostly for demo's and web-based stuff, I am currently using it to develop a game in my own time.

I’ve found it incredibly easy to get thing up, running and interactive, but it gets very complicated if you want to make a game with it.

[DonMeck]

In oder to be able to build complex interaction, i would consider to be able to script/programm.

[marque-pierre]

But have you tried Virtools?

[DonMeck]

Yes I am using it.
It really depends what you want do. If the stuff you need is not provided as pre-made building-block you need to have some basic programming understanding in order to use the schematic programming method. If you even want to go in it deeper, real programming/scripting is a plus.

It really depends the needs.

[marque-pierre]

Thanks for telling me. As I understood from the Virtools people, I could basically make full games without ever touching a line of code. Logic and constructing an algorithm is not all foreign to me, but as far as programming or scripting goes, all I know at this stage is HTML.

What I wanted to do was two things:

1. For my final year project at university, I wanted to create several environments/levels for trying out some colour theory/psychology research, for people to play through and test my ideas. My original plan was to use the new Hammer editor for Half Life 2, but I honestly don't dare take the chance of it being released in time for me to practise a bit with it, and prepare for my research.

2. As a future games designer, I want to thoroughly familiarize myself with a prototyping tool, like Virtools, to quickly draw up prototypes to test and demonstrate my games design ideas.

[DonMeck]

If you want to a create a simple walkthourgh scenario - this is setup within minutes. Exchanging textures or colors takes a bit more of work - as you need to combine some ready-to-use components so it fits your purpose.

If you are aming for a platform game or a shooter or so - prepare yourself to familiarize yourself deeply with the technology.

You can do a lot of thing with Virtools ... - but just like every tools it takes time to learn and master it.

[marque-pierre]

I was just around your site. Congratulations on your graduation! I see you have 2 tutorials there. Do you know of other resources for Virtools?

What I want to make is sort of like a platformer/fps. But it is really just a series of environments you walk through, where there will be triggers here and there, triggering certain events and so on. Oh, dammit:hmm: maybe I am in over my head here. I have the summer break to prepare as much as possible and then from September to beginning of March...:blush:

There will be alot of focus on the textures. What is the maximum texture size Virtools supports?

[DonMeck]

Thank you.

The official forum and mainly user2user (but also developers are there) is:
http://www.theswapmeet.com/
Check the tips and tricks sectection that has been opened recently.

You really need some time to get into it. I suggest to try really the simplest thing first: 3d world, one can go trough and trigger buttons etc for open doors or so. Every thing else declare as 'next step', 'extra if there's some time left'.

[marque-pierre]

Hmmm. Maybe I should consider using another level editor, like the UnrealED or FarCry editors... They might come at a less steep learning curve, which might buy me some crucial time.

[operativem]

My experience with tools and software for rapid-application-development, is that the amount of work required to build a complex and unique simulation really can't be worked around.

The code has to be written at least once, so even if you're using something like virtools, the inescapable fact is that you'll have to write all the code they didn't write. Do they have code for AI? If not, plan on writing it yourself or finding it somewhere. Do they have code for particles? If not, plan on writing it yourself or finding it somewhere. (You get the idea.)

Middleware (for rendering, physics etc) still requires a lot of application specific code. Someone has to program the events, the interactions, etc.

No question, software like Virtools makes the job easier, but it's really a bit more like buying workboots. If you buy boots, then obviously you don't have to make the boots yourself...but the garden isn't going to plant itself, weed itself, water itself, and harvest itself. (The punchline as it were, is that if you don't want to garden, then hire a gardener.)

[BlinkOk]

mabey have a look at http://www.axel3d.com/ it's lighter on the scripting side of things. only problem is it needs a pretty fast pc to run things 1Ghz+3D graphics card

[marque-pierre]

As I understand Virtools comes with Havok physics and a drag and drop system for AI which contains more than 350 building blocks of behaviours...

I know I need to plant the garden myself. But for this project I really need to free up as much time as possible for the more important things (not coding!)...

Hmmm. I am as confused as I ever was.

[Gibbz]

probly use soemthing like ued, u can buid ur level in max/maya then import it into ued as is :)

[gout]

Originally posted by operativem
The code has to be written at least once, so even if you're using something like virtools, the inescapable fact is that you'll have to write all the code they didn't write. Do they have code for AI? If not, plan on writing it yourself or finding it somewhere. (You get the idea.)

Exactly what operativem said!

If you want ai characters in your virtools project the building blocks will help you, but they go nowhere near doing the job for you. This is why most of the work you see are technical examples rather than games.

But, if all you want to do is be able to show environment examples with some interaction with objects etc, then it would be a very good package to use.

It does cost a lot though.

[marque-pierre]

Well. I am a full time student, and I understand they have discounted student offers...

[gout]

I suppose the only way you're really going to find out if its suitable is if you try it out. They do send out demo copies if you request one.

[DonMeck]

The base package provides you with a* solving using grids or nodal pathes.

You can do much more than walkthrough with virtools. But it speeds up the devolpment 'only' ;) but doesn't the whole work for you, creating all the interaction.

Yes, request a trial version and find it out for yourselves.

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