Less gfx-intensive SubDs?

[iC4]

allready tryed to delete the history?

[stunndman]

reduce the number of undo steps in your preferences (e.g. 20-50)

if you have done all your modelling on the polygon proxy only you can export the poly cage (without any subdivision nodes) and import it to a clean scene and convert it to a fresh subdivision surface

[OrestesMantra]

Okay,thanks alot!

[OrestesMantra]

Still lags....

its weird because if I go to Standard mode, i can move vertexs around smoothly.Its only when I go to Proxy mode.


Even when I had the actual subds so its just the poly cage, it still lags.Argh!

[stunndman]

Originally posted by OrestesMantra
Still lags....


you rebuilt the subdiv from a naked cage? still lags? maybe post a picture so we can see how complex it actually is

[OrestesMantra]

Yeah...I deleted the smooth SubDs, exported the cage, opened new scene, turned cage into Subds, switched to Proxy mode, still really laggy.Is that what you meant?I dont think the character is that heavy, so I dont know.You guys be the judge:

[stunndman]

hmmm, looks fine to me - did you convert it as standard or proxy mode? - i'm not sure if this will make a big difference - i tend to use the proxy mode

[OrestesMantra]

Im not sure what you mean, but when its in standard mode, I can move around vertices no prob, but its only when im in Proxy mode, that it lags real bad.

[stunndman]

Originally posted by OrestesMantra
Im not sure what you mean, but when its in standard mode, I can move around vertices no prob, but its only when im in Proxy mode, that it lags real bad.

assuming that you have a fresh scene and have imported the nekid poly cage (check for sure that the it's really stripped of any connections to subdivison nodes ) - turn off your history - convert with Modify->Convert->Polygons to Subdiv (open the properties)

the property window has an option "Subdivision Surface Mode" - i tend to use Proxy Object


not sure if this is of any help - i haven't worked with subds for a while

good luck

[Mikkel Jans]

The same thing happens to me. Thats why i don't use SubD's.
But try to delete the BlindData Nodesthat is connected to your subd model.
It works 90% of the time but it sometimes seems to come back later.
Hope Alias would fix this bug.

[OrestesMantra]

Blind data nodes?What are those?

[Sibben]

What's the difference between standard and proxy?

The manual say's nuthin and some experimenting and checking the hypergraph just made me confused...:surprised

[OrestesMantra]

Proxy is the same as ConnectPolyShape.A polygon mesh surrounding a smooth mesh. Standard is just well...."Normal"? Im not thoroughly learned in the technical mumbo-jumbo so its hard for me to explain:hmm:


p.s. This lag is pissing me off.It is now impossible to work on my character.

[underdog]

You'll find the blind data nodes if you look in the hypergraph. Be careful deleting these may help speed things up, but will likely also destroy any hiearchy edits.

[OrestesMantra]

Thanks,ill give it a shot

[Sibben]

Originally posted by OrestesMantra
Proxy is the same as ConnectPolyShape.A polygon mesh surrounding a smooth mesh.

No, it's NOT. CPS is a PolySmooth attached to a control cage, having no higher resolution than the number of smooth operations you choose. Proxy is still an approximate (ideal) surface, i.e. a kind of NURBS subset - the way subdivs works in Maya (thank God!). In other words: no matter how close you get with the camera at render time it will be smooth and round - which is not the case with CPS.

It does not matter what you choose in the convert-dialog, you will still get a Subdiv-surf, only thing that happens with Proxy is that it gives you some extra nodes and slower interaction (mainly a polyToSubdiv and then as soon as you switch mode a bunch of blindData-nodes).

Am I missing something here?

[wmaher2]

Does it do it in wireframe? I am gueesing yes...... I never use sub'ds there just not my preference...From what I know I find emm weak....but saying that I cant really judge considering how much I actually know them......Is there a tesselation setting somewere u are over looking the only thing that would lag is a large geom process.......I am sure maya built in setting to control it........I would fish around for u but I am drunk and its friday night so....sorry...I know I wasnt much help....but I am just giving u my Two cents

[iC4]

I personally can't work with mayas subidv.......it's much slower than working with poly smooth

if I convert my model into subidv, and try to rotate it it takes seconds.......a smoothed model makes no problem

[OrestesMantra]

Okay, I deleted those weird little Blind Data Nodes in the hypergraph and I get *much* better response!Thanks alot:beer:

[Sibben]

Tesselation can be controlled from the Attribute Editor much like with NURBS - just a bit simpler but they definately differ from polysmooths. Unfortunately you don't have the possibility, as with NURBS, to see tesselation in the viewport though.

[wrend]

well, you might tesselate to polly to get an idea of how it will tesselate.

[anthonymcgrath]

I also have the same lag time that the dude with the weird eyeball avatar suffers from and I'm on a 2.2ghz processor with gforce4 and a gig o ram!
deleting the blind data isn't something I've tried. doubtless it will involve actually selecting the mesh and expanding the up and downstream connections in the hypergraph on the selected object?

[Munson]

just a wild stab in the dark but could it be because your using Maya4.0EarlyAccess? instead of some sort of final release of Maya?

maybe they improved the subdivs for the final release?

[anthonymcgrath]

thats a nice thought Munson but I'm on the latest release of unlimited. We've got three seats in our office. still, maybe worth harassing support about mind! :love:

[Sibben]

Originally posted by anthonymcgrath
still, maybe worth harassing support about mind! :love:

...or get rid of those blind data nodes first. ;)

[OrestesMantra]

Yeah, messing around with deleting crap in the hypergraph worked for me, but I dont think I should have to do that *Grumbles at Maya*

[Waboflex]

You know, complaints about Maya's subd's being slow is something that comes up again and again, I just want to point out it's not because they're badly implemented (though they have some quirks), it's just that there are certain ways of using them that work better than others.

For what it's worth, I've been using them all the time at work and here's what I find is the best way for me:

- I've got 2 shelf buttons set up, one to convert Poly -> Subd and the other to go Subd -> Poly (using vertices, level 0). Now basically if you want to move a vertex, edge or face you do this in Standard mode. NEVER edit components in Polygon mode because you'll wait forever for viewport updates if the model's reasonably complex. Editing in Standard mode is way, way faster than CPS with big meshes (in my experience), and it's the way you're meant to work with Maya's subd's.

- When you need to change the topology, e.g., extruding or splitting faces, convert it back to poly's first. Not only is this faster than doing the same to the subd version in Polygon mode, but it also deletes history when you convert. So you never build up those blind data nodes which slow things down.

Effectively it's like using Lighwave's subd's, and it's been a quick, efficient and problem-free method for me, and you get the real benefit of resolution-independant render smoothness. The only real downside is that converting to poly's will kill any detail at level 2 and beyond, so you can't really do it this way if you use hierarchy detail. But then again not many people do.

Oh and BTW, rendering them is slow with the default tessellation of 4, try setting it to 2 and they speed up a lot. I've never needed a higher level than that.

If anybody finds this useful, they can buy me a virtual beer :beer:

Wabo.

[anthonymcgrath]

:beer:

waboflex, that is some seriously useful information. I must say, I usually edit components in standard mode, but then I'd switch back to proxy mode using the subd menu. Never really crossed my mind to kill the history and blind data buildup using the standard convert menu! nice one geezer.
Cgbottoms up! :airguitar

[anthonymcgrath]

hey, I notice yer up north dude? I'm based in the toon! small world!

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