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View Full Version : Game Art Comp 5: Ionanism : Alex : Lunar The Silver Star


ionanism
02-23-2004, 01:59 AM
OK you don’t have to tell me that the contest is over, but when I heard the topic of it I liked the Idea so much I had to go ahead and do something even if it is over.

I will be doing this while I am waiting for my logo/web design contract to go through, so I might just stop work on this all tougher for a bit until I finish my contract job :)

So for now…

I am going to do Alex, from Lunar the Silver Star Story. I remember it to be a cool game back when I played it for the SEGA-CD. He’s not the coolest possible character out there to do (even within the game), but looking at my little portfolio of 3d character designs I seen that I was lacking anyone “normal” / friendly looking.

Reference Images:

Cover:
http://jmkcreative.free2host.net/CG_Chal/Classic/cover.jpg

Head:
http://jmkcreative.free2host.net/CG_Chal/Classic/ref_img.gif

So here is what I got (a little over a weeks work so far)The head and most of the body.

Head: I know I need to trim it down quite a bit…
http://jmkcreative.free2host.net/CG_Chal/Classic/Head_01.jpg

Body:
http://jmkcreative.free2host.net/CG_Chal/Classic/Body_01.jpg



Still not sure if I will model him with just hair or with the hat too. Or with hair and a removable hat…

Still not sure if I should model the vest thing into the shirt or model it on top of it, so it can flop around. (as of now its on top.

EVIL
02-23-2004, 02:46 PM
Ahh, glad to hear that the contest, even when its over still encourages people to model :) and its looking great to!

and some c&c would be ncie so here it goes.

your eyes are wierd, the eye lids are a bit to fat imo. (hard to explain) plus the eyebrows are way to big.

another thing you might consider is not to make the poncho like clothing as you do it now and use doublesidedrendered poly's to do it. this will decrease your polycount and you would be able to spend these poly's somewhere else.

anyway, its a good start, cant wait untill it is finished!

rob-beddall
02-23-2004, 02:56 PM
hey!!

here is what i have to say.

1. i think you are using way too many poly's for the face.
there seems to be a great bunch of them across his forehead.
you could get rid of some of those without losing much shape.

2. the legs look very very long. tho i'm not familiar with your character so i could be wrong about that.

apart from those 2 things it looks really nice.

cheers!!

ionanism
02-23-2004, 08:32 PM
Thanks,

One step ahead of you EVIL… I already go rid of the “Vest/poncho things” poly thickness. It’s now just a plane w/double sided material.

Hmmm… eyelids too think?... like from the bottom of the eye/top of eyelid, down to the cheek is too fat/tall? In the drawings it looks like they are rather thick.

I was trying to exaggerate his features a bit since he is a cartoon character, I had to keep stopping my self from making some features look realistic (like a human) and say… wait he is a cartoon character, its ok if it’s not quite proportionally correct.

Yeah… The eyebrows bug me too… Ill play with them some more. (they use to be bigger… I named that file Neanderthal :)) they still need work.


And ROB_BEDDALL… yeah the head is way… way to poly heavy, it’s probably he heaviest low poly mesh I have created so far. I AM going to optimize it quit a bit, sooner or later. I just wanted to finish modeling everything else first. Then I will trim it down allot.

Yeah… the legs could be a bit shorter.

Thanks for the C&C guys.

ionanism
02-24-2004, 12:42 AM
All right… made some modifications to the mesh, most notably would be the face’s new low poly count. (my beautiful quads are now dead)

I got it all down to 4440 poly tris I still think I will try and cut some more off because I want to do some opacity mapping for parts of the hair belt, tie, and the fluffy wrist and boot things.

I haven’t decided if I will make his hat or not, when you play him in the game he has no hat… so… I don’t know if I will do it or not… it might look nice though, but I would need more poly tris top work with.

Head:
http://jmkcreative.free2host.net/CG_Chal/Classic/Head_02.jpg

Body:
http://jmkcreative.free2host.net/CG_Chal/Classic/Body_02.jpg

ionanism
02-25-2004, 11:30 PM
Ok… I got 90% of my UVW unwrapping done yesterday, finished it off today and gave him a hat. I still have 130 tris to work with when it comes to doing and opacity mapping for hair and fluffy things.

So now I can start process of texture mapping…my favorite part… (no sarcasm) I hope I can do the original design justice with my texturing… a bad texture can make a good model look bad.

edit :: removed images to lighten load on my server.

Ebola0001
02-26-2004, 09:24 AM
hahaha... its Pinocchio(see refrence)... atleast the puppet vesrion of him... that face looks umm "off" but i don't know why

See im telling you its old woody snoz himself!!! (http://www.woodrell.com/joe/co4.jpg)

anyway nice looking but the face seems too round.

pseudoBug
02-26-2004, 11:15 AM
I'd say that the reason the face looks different is because you're modeling it with too much realism. The eyes, nose and mouth have aproximately the right proportions, but the anime cartoonyness isn't there. the nose needs no nostrils, and the eyelids would be practicly nonexistant. Lips would be a bit different as well.

Not sure if you were going for the anime cartoon feel or not.

Good job otherwise.

Shazzam!

ionanism
02-26-2004, 11:11 PM
Ebola0001:
Ha ha ha… yeah he kinda does look like that Pinocchio picture…hm…don’t know what I can do about it though. Well…This sort of cutesy character is not the type of character I usually choose to model (Devils with 6 arms, Gas Mask Spider Woman, and Giant Robots), which is exactly why I am doing him... to do something different.


pseudoBug:
The look I was going for was almost real but cartoony, but not a cartoon. Which is why I gave him nostrils, small ones, rather than the usual triangle that anime drawings usually have and eyelids, I thought it would look better that way… doesn’t mean I am right or it does…http://www.cgtalk.com/images/icons/icon12.gif).

I made some changes:
I got rid of the bottom eyelids, and it looks fine if not better (gives me more poly tris :)), but w/o the top ones he looks bug-eyed (kept them).

In addition to what was mentioned, the face might look even more off (from the drawings) because the character always has a smirk on his face… a weird smile (with no lips), and my model is “straight faced” w/o a smile (and lips). The drawings are a bit inconstant, the front has no lips and the side view of him shows him with lips... so I gave him some lips. I figured I would animate that smile in later once I rig him.

I think he needs more tweaking so…I’ll post more changes later. (Working backwards is bad… but I amhttp://www.cgtalk.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

ionanism
02-27-2004, 03:26 AM
Ok… I did some little tweaks… that are probably not really that noticeable to anyone… but…I removed bottom eyelid, narrowed the cheeks a bit, and did some other things… I also went out and got some better reference images (never underestimate the power of the proper reference materials… something I don’t really have for this)…I think he looks a bit better now… but I am making it so of course I do... I don’t know what else to do to it… so…back to my UVs :)

I don’t think it will really start to look allot like him until I get the hair all mapped in (opacity mapping) a big part of his look is the bangs in his face. I hope that will help…

Tweak:http://jmkcreative.free2host.net/CG_Chal/Classic/Tweak_01.jpg

pseudoBug
02-27-2004, 05:01 AM
I think this is a big improvement, He's starting to look more like the character. Although now his eyes almost bulge out too much. You might try to correct that by either flattening his eyes, or flattening his face around his eyes a bit, an pulling it further out.

Keep going, this is looking better.

*edit* I looked again, and now I dunno about what I said about the eyes. Hmmm.

ionanism
02-28-2004, 08:52 AM
My client finally approved my contract, agreement and estimate…which is good, but my work on this character will, slow down a bit, which is bad, because I was having fun making him...

I had just re-laid out my UVs, did some reactor cloth simulation test for the poncho, I just got the Opacity mapping for fluff part of the boots under control, and ready for Texturing... and was ready to move on to the hair. But now I must shift focus to my contact job…

I WILL get this character done sooner or later… I won’t let it sit here and rot away incomplete (I put here on cg talk for extra incentive to finish him) so I WILL finish what I started...

I will keep working on him when I can...

Beta Fluff:
http://jmkcreative.free2host.net/CG_Chal/Classic/Fluff_01.jpg

pseudoBug
02-28-2004, 09:37 AM
Glad to hear you got the contract. Making money is always a good thing. I do webdesign and logo's myself. I need to get on it and scare up some business here pretty soon too.

Nice fluff there, but will that work ingame?

ionanism
02-28-2004, 10:33 PM
Thanks pseudoBug... it seems that the hardest part of doing graphic design work is actually finding people to pay you to do the work. I am doing a logo and web site design… so …Good luck to you finding some work also.

Yeah it will work in game…it’s just 15 or so 2 tri planes (a square plane 1 poly) with a texture map for the fur and opacity map applied to make parts of it transparent, so it should work just fine. Its an effective way of doing hair for games.

dcp
02-29-2004, 12:29 AM
Very nice, though the hat, in my opinion, needs to be smaller. It makes the kid look like he has an afro under there. At least with the right image on your last image post.

JaMo
02-29-2004, 02:19 AM
"2. the legs look very very long. tho i'm not familiar with your character so i could be wrong about that."

i think the main probelm is the pants arent baggy enough. your refrence seems to have super baggy pants while the model seems to have reg/tight pants. i would drop the crotch a bit and make it come to more of a seam. make the legs abit baggy and i would think that should fix the to long problem.

looks great so far.

ionanism
02-29-2004, 05:09 AM
dcp
Yeah… I don’t like his hair at all there… I am in the process of reworking it using opacity maps so hopefully it will look better when I get done with that.

JaMo
It’s funny that you mentioned that about the legs, because I though they looked a bit long too, so I started to mess with them, but just put it back because I though it look fine before I changed it… but since you mention it too, I think I will make them shorter again.

Originally posted by JaMo
i'm not familiar with your character."

Originally posted by ROB_BEDDALL
i'm not familiar with your character."

Doesn’t anyone remember this game? It was on the SEGA CD, It’s a RPG, they re-released in on the Playstation a while back (never play the re-release) I can’t be the only one to have played it when it first came out… it was a damn good RPG game. (At least I remember it to have been)
http://jmkcreative.free2host.net/CG_Chal/Classic/Alex_Pixel.gif http://jmkcreative.free2host.net/CG_Chal/Classic/GameScreen.jpg

Edit :: I added the images

Beastie
03-02-2004, 03:22 AM
Lunar kicked ass. I didnt personally own a sega CD but I used to play it with a friend till we beat it. Damn that was a long time ago lol. Nice character choice!

ionanism
03-02-2004, 06:06 AM
Hey Beastie… it’s nice to know someone else thought this game (Lunar) was great… I new I couldn’t be the only one who liked it allot, or even remembered it… well anyway…

I made him shorter… maybe too short… but he lines up perfectly with a picture I found of him from the front.

Let me know what you think… I don’t know if his pants look baggy enough…I only have a limited number of polies to use so I can’t really make it look super baggy. .

I can still make adjustments to him… I am messing with his hair (as you can see from the pic), so his proportions are still flexible… I am going to re-layout my UVs too. (Working backwards is bad, def..def… defiantly bad, very bad.)


I made these adjustments right after reading the suggestion, I just got around to posting the changes now :)
Shorter:
http://jmkcreative.free2host.net/CG_Chal/Classic/Shorter_01.jpg

ionanism
03-05-2004, 02:44 AM
Here is what I have done for the hair… it clocks in at 613 tris… a little high, putting me over the 4500 limit by 25 tris. But I think I can easily chisel him down a bit and get him under the 4500 limit. Optimizing the hair it self and the body of the mesh…it should be easy.

The texture is just there FPO (for position only) while modeling the hair. I will make a better texture for the hair with some transparency when it comes time to texture him.

Hair mesh:
http://jmkcreative.free2host.net/CG_Chal/Classic/Hair_01.jpg

Any thoughts or suggestions?

pseudoBug
03-05-2004, 04:10 PM
Hair looks pretty good to me, Ion. I'm no expert on polygonal hair though. :P

One thought on the figure, though. It looks kinda like he's got a wide hip/female anime thing goin on in his torso. Maybe bring the inside of his legs together a bit. Maybe the outsides too? I dunno. That's just kinda how it comes across to me. I like the way the face looks now with the hair though.

ionanism
03-08-2004, 07:48 AM
Here is what I have done to the hair so far… right now I am in the process of adding a bit “Volume” to the hair by pushing some vertices around.

Hair Texture:
http://jmkcreative.free2host.net/CG_Chal/Classic/Hair_02.jpg

The pic is a bit fuzzy (highly compressed) But… I’ll more than likely post some better shots of the textures when I am further along with them.

Any comments or suggestions?

ionanism
03-10-2004, 06:29 AM
Ok… I spent some time tweaking the hair.
I totally reshaped it added more volume to it, removed all poly penetration and removed some useless clumps of hair so it has less poly tris and it looks better… can’t complain about that… doing more with less and it will work better in an actual game engine because there is no poly penetration for it (game engin) to decide which face is in front.

I also did some triangle stripping over the entire mesh so it will run better in a game engine.

Hair:
http://jmkcreative.free2host.net/CG_Chal/Classic/Hair5up.jpg

ionanism
03-20-2004, 04:52 AM
Ok got back around to doing some more texturing on this guy… all I got so far (in addition to the hair) is the face texture… so here it is:

Face:
http://jmkcreative.free2host.net/CG_Chal/Classic/Face_Skin.jpg


I resized the eyes, I made them smaller… otherwise he looked rather creepy… he had the psycho hollow eyes of a killer… Now they look a bit better.

Also, the eye texture is not a final texture… I just made it in just about a minute, so I will probably make a better one.

Any comments or suggestion are welcome.

ionanism
03-29-2004, 08:28 AM
Ok… I am done with this guy… got him textured, rigged skun and posed…

Now off to work on making the Texture sheets showing everything: the textures, wires and poses.

edit :: I removed the image.

m_luscombe
03-29-2004, 11:53 AM
I hate to point it out at this stage, but he really needs some visible eyelids. He has a very doll-like look right now. Like Chucky.

I think it's because of the overwide, glassy eyes.

ionanism
03-29-2004, 08:36 PM
No problem…He has eyelids… all I need to do is close them a bit… I guess I was just going for a bit of a cartoony look with the wide eyes. All of the reference photos have of him don’t show him with any eyelids, but those are all anime drawings, I made him a bit more real, so I should treat the eyes in a bit more real way also.

Thanks for pointing that out to me… I see what I can do about it… don’t know if I will make anymore updates to this thread other than showing my finished character sheet… well… maybe a better render of this guy in some good lighting … But I will fix the problem regardless.

ionanism
03-31-2004, 02:00 AM
Here is the Character sheet
http://jmkcreative.free2host.net/CG_Chal/Classic/Character-Sheet_Web.jpg

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