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BAROBA
01-18-2004, 07:48 PM
Hey guys and girls

I was setting this rig
Very basic rig
IK on both legs and arms
But this time I tried something new ( and the only difference between this rig and my old rigs that don't have the same problem)
-First change, I make my skelegons on a different layer and parented to layer to the object on layer1. And I did use 'bones from layer2'.
-The other change is a extra bone under the ankle.This was done to overlap some distance between ankle and foot.

The problem : The toes, just float around when I move the IK target, and only when I manipulate the toe it jumps back to its normal position.

I loaded the scene already on another computer, and the same thing happens.
Does anyone know what is going on?

http://users.pandora.be/crimecity/images/Bonesweird.jpg

TIA

BAROBA
01-19-2004, 12:13 PM
So nobody has ever seen anything like this???
It is completely driving me crazy....

angel
01-19-2004, 12:37 PM
does it happen to the other foot too?

Remi
01-19-2004, 02:50 PM
You need to parent your toe bone to your foot bone in the scene editor in layout....at least that's what it looks like to me....either that or your weights are off:)....hope that helps:)

BAROBA
01-19-2004, 03:40 PM
It happens to both feet
They are parented to the footbone
No weightmaps used on any bone or any part of the body.

I have restarted the rig again and the same problem is there again.....
I am really sick and tired of this problem, and I got much better things to do with my time then this ......

I also deleted the toe-bones and replaced them by childbones , made in Layout. But those bones didn't do anything, they just were there ,active, but the body didn't react if they moved or rotated.

This is not my day for sure .....

Remi
01-19-2004, 03:47 PM
Hmmm...after drawing the childbones in layout make sure they have a weight given to them....make sure you don't have any ik on them like match goal orientation....stuff like that...if that doesn't work...you might consider making the rig available for download or send it to me and I can see what's wrong:)

BAROBA
01-19-2004, 05:19 PM
Remi I don't understand the reason for added weightmaps to just those Toe-bones. Because that would mean I have to add weightmaps to all other bones too. Too much work....
A similar rig worked with weightsmaps, but this just doesn't wont to work right.

I have uploaded the LWS.
The second layer which contained the object is replaced by a null.

toe-troubled rig (http://users.pandora.be/crimecity/Hostedfiles/troublerigBAROBA.lws)

Robsi
01-19-2004, 06:34 PM
Hi,

I dont know whats wrong with your Toe bones, but just delete your Toe bones, select your heel bone, add a new child bone, record rest position and everything works fine.
Btw you have very bad Pivot Rotations on your ankle and heel bones.

good luck, Robert

BAROBA
01-19-2004, 06:41 PM
Originally posted by Robsi
Hi,

I dont know whats wrong with your Toe bones, but just delete your Toe bones, select your heel bone, add a new child bone, record rest position and everything works fine.
Btw you have very bad Pivot Rotations on your ankle and heel bones.

good luck, Robert
Hi Robert


I did do what you said; deleted them, added new childbones, did record rotation ( did make them active too ) and they didn't have any influence on the mesh . I have no idea why....
I know of the pivots being banked alot, fixed that in the new rig ( that also has floating toes )

If you got another idea what it could be , tell me :)
Or download the file I posted and try to figure it out

Robsi
01-19-2004, 06:55 PM
Hi,

I have downloaded your file and with the new toe bones they work as they should, no floating around anymore.

Without the mesh its difficult to say why they don't have any influence.

Robert

BAROBA
01-19-2004, 07:10 PM
http://users.pandora.be/crimecity/Hostedfiles/legs.lwo
Replace the Null called object with legs.lwo
Here it doesn't do a thing ....

Robsi
01-19-2004, 08:36 PM
You have to replace the object with Layer2 not with the character-Null, because thats the object where the bones belong to, and the deformiong is fine.

Robert

Remi
01-19-2004, 08:59 PM
Not to sound harsh...but it sounds to me like you're getting lazy with your rigging....it's an artform in itself and deserves as much time and dedication as modeling and animating.

First, Why not have your skelegons/bones in the same layer as the model?

Second, have you set up any weight maps?

I hope this didn't sound harsh...wasn't intended:)

BAROBA
01-19-2004, 09:12 PM
This rig was a quick setup
To test the basic functionality of it
Normally my spline runs the other way around
But that doesn't work with all movements that a spline can have
So I turned it around, to see if that worked , it did.
And I did a small walkcycletest, to see how it behave in a animation, and that is how I noticed the error.

I normally have the skelegons/bones on the same layer, but the teacher at the class I am following convinced me that it was better to seperate the bones from the model. Just in case you needed to change a thing afterwards, and also you can add a new character to it faster if needed.

I normally don't set up weightmaps, unless there are some issues with the mesh. The rig is very simple and is only used to test animations with it. The rig is only used for walkcycles,runs , jumps and stuff.
The class I am following doesn't require any more complicated rigs.
And I am still learning to rig...
No offence taken :)

Robsi , thanks for the help :)

Thanks to all for taking the time to reply and look at the rig
:thumbsup:

Remi
01-19-2004, 09:32 PM
Hmmmm...changing things to the model and changing which model uses the bones isn't easier when setting the rig up in a different layer....it's the same.....regardless....any changes you make to the skelegons in modeler have to be applied in layout and changing the model doesn't effect the bones you've already converted to bones and to switch the model...it's a matter of copying the rig and pasting it into the new model....I don't know why your teacher told you that...it wouldn't matter really:shrug:

Oh...and use weightmaps!!!....:D

Here's all you need for something simple:

Body
Neck
Head
Arms Biceps
Arms Forearms
Hands
Leg R
Leg L
and some finger weights....if you want.

Not too hard to setup and probably like 10 min of your time

LFGabel
01-20-2004, 12:20 AM
Like Remi said, you don't have to use weight maps for every bone. And sometimes, you can get away with even less weight maps than what Remi suggested. Quick falloff and joint compression can do wonders.

[edit]
My bad, Remi. Was playing catchup and read through the post too quickly :)

Remi
01-20-2004, 01:57 AM
You should've quoted the rest of my post:D

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